Guys, I need help with this custom 1911 before I dump it for a loss. [Archive] - Glock Talk

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12131
06-28-2012, 04:31
I have this Colt Combat Commander that has been customized by Bob Cogan of Accurate Plating and Weaponry, that I got from a trade last year. This is the partial list of work done on the gun:

Caspian beavertail
Lower and flare ejection port
Greider trigger, 4 lbs trigger job
Convert to series 70 Colt model
Throat barrel and polish feed ramp
Replace extractor with series 70 extractor and tune
Replace springs with Wilson Combat springs
Install EGW hammer strut and firing pin
Tighten lock up of barrel and tighten slide to frame fit
Smooth all sharp edges
Hard chrome refinishing job
-----------------------------------------------------

It's a beautiful gun, feels great, has fantastic trigger and "laser" accuracy.
Here's the problem. I have taken it shooting 3 times (100, 54, and 50 rounds), using only factory ammo (Blazer brass 230Gr FMJ, PMC Bronze 230Gr FMJ, Hornady +P 200Gr TAP FPD, Federal +P 185Gr Hydrashok, Hornady +P 230Gr XTP, S&B 230Gr FMJ), with new or nearly new Wilson 7- and 8-round mags, and Colt 7- and 8-round mags.
9 times out of 10, the last round will not go completely into chamber. It will only go 50 - 75% in. I had to retract the slide slightly and gave it a wack to fully sit the round.
The gun is cleaned spotless and well lubed for each range trip.

First owner said he had 150 rounds of various ammo through it without an issue.

I've shot the above ammo using these mags through my full-size stock Colt XSE, and never had a single hiccup. So, I don't think it's the mags or ammo that are the problem.

Give me some ideas, before I say screw it and sell it for a loss. Thanks, guys.:wavey:

Update in post #43.

glock2740
06-28-2012, 05:07
Pics?

faawrenchbndr
06-28-2012, 06:14
You don't have a gun problem, you have a magazine problem.
Some guns do not like some magazines. Commanders can be
a bit more mag sensitive than Government models.

12131
06-28-2012, 06:54
Pics.
Don't have the actual pic of the jam itself, but I'm trying to simulate it here using the snap cap.
http://s7.photobucket.com/albums/y281/qavsiv/ERG/1911//ccccc01.jpg
http://s7.photobucket.com/albums/y281/qavsiv/ERG/1911//ccccc02.jpg
http://s7.photobucket.com/albums/y281/qavsiv/ERG/1911//ccccc03.jpg
http://s7.photobucket.com/albums/y281/qavsiv/ERG/1911//ccccc04.jpg

Baba Louie
06-28-2012, 07:20
Have you contacted Cogan and asked him or discussed situation? He may (or may not) have a solution. I agree the magazine(s) is/are the culprit. Might be spring, might be follower, maybe lips (probably not)...(?)

I'd ask the builder first. He might even have a buyer standing around waiting... (don't know Bob Cogan from Adam or even if he's still alive/active)

Really nice looking weapon. Really nice. Hope you get the situation resolved.

Travclem
06-28-2012, 07:24
Try different magazines.

faawrenchbndr
06-28-2012, 07:58
Could be recoil spring, but that failure is normally magazine related.
How many rounds fired since it came back from Cogan?

12131
06-28-2012, 08:02
150 by the first owner, 204 by me. The Cogan work was done by the 1st owner.

glock2740
06-28-2012, 08:20
Nice gun. Is the finish a polished hardchrome? Hardchrome is tough to photograph. Sounds like a mag issue to me as well.

faawrenchbndr
06-28-2012, 08:25
150 by the first owner, 204 by me. The Cogan work was done by the 1st owner.

Try a Tripp or a McCormick mag. Call Cogan before you dump it.
Darn good pistol, he will make it right if it is not a mag.

Three-Five-Seven
06-28-2012, 09:56
Yup, a Tripp magazine ought to fix that right up. The Tripp follower holds the last round higher than "traditional" magazines and provides a positive feed for the last round.

fnfalman
06-28-2012, 09:57
See if you can borrow different mags from people you know or from the gun shop where you bought it from.

Batesmotel
06-28-2012, 10:17
Take two mags that have given you problems. Load one full and the other with just one round.

Look at them from the side. You might notice a difference in the angle that the top round sits in relation to the mag body.

That is your problem. The gun feeds OK with all but the last round because of the angle of the follower compared to the angle of the lips.

MD357
06-28-2012, 11:35
Since it happens with mutiple mags I'm leaning towards extractor tension. Maybe it's just a bit too tight? The mag spring tension is at it's weakest with the last round so maybe it won't overcome being just a bit too tight? Just a thought. Rather at the very least the tension should at least be checked to eliminate a variable. Then try some wolf springs power springs after that?

No matter what it sounds like an easy fix, so I wouldn't dump it.

R0CKETMAN
06-28-2012, 12:26
Mag issue which can be exacerbated by wet gun/interior of mag. Just for a test you can disassemble mag and clean. You can also slightly press in on feed lips.

Sounds like the last round is leaving mag prematurely.

Edit: badass pistol

knedrgr
06-28-2012, 13:29
1) extractor just a little too tight.

2) loose firing pin stop and extractor fitment, causing it to clock in the slide.

3) slightly too right of a chamber, and it needs to be ream for correct measurement. The barrel heated up and expanded, during the mag dump, and the last round is a little too tight to fit.

fnfalman
06-28-2012, 14:43
1) extractor just a little too tight.

2) loose firing pin stop and extractor fitment, causing it to clock in the slide.

3) slightly too right of a chamber, and it needs to be ream for correct measurement. The barrel heated up and expanded, during the mag dump, and the last round is a little too tight to fit.

If one of these issues were to be the case then it's most disappointing to see on a custom pistol.

R0CKETMAN
06-28-2012, 15:19
1) extractor just a little too tight.

2) loose firing pin stop and extractor fitment, causing it to clock in the slide.

3) slightly too right of a chamber, and it needs to be ream for correct measurement. The barrel heated up and expanded, during the mag dump, and the last round is a little too tight to fit.

If any of these were the issue it would not be last round only

Glockdude1
06-28-2012, 16:02
Try different magazines.

:agree:

Mayhem like Me
06-28-2012, 16:10
:agree:

And shoot about 400 more rounds its not broken in yet...is it tight..

My first Baer did that for about 500 rounds ethnic it was 100 percent.

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oldsoldier
06-28-2012, 16:15
Contact him and explain the problem. http://apwcogan.com/

RetailNinja
06-28-2012, 16:24
I'd blame it on that arched MSH. Dump that thing and install a flat one.

Then sell me the gun.

pck50
06-28-2012, 18:35
OK you have two choices either change the barrel or otherwise dump it.

Troubled Gecko
06-28-2012, 18:58
Weak mag springs is my vote. When was the last time you replaced mag springs?

Usually the last rnd not feeding is a red flag for mag springs due to not having enough tension behined the last remaining rnds. Failure to lock the slide open after last rnd fired could also be an issue for a weak mag spring.

Springs are cheap and they won't go to waste, I'd rather buy em than lose a nice gun over a simple/inexspensive fix. WWW.gunsprings.com (http://www.gunsprings.com) Wolff makes great springs, buy the +5% power and your issues will be bye bye.

Good luck.

12131
06-28-2012, 20:24
Thanks for all your ideas. I will systematically try them one at a time, starting with the easiest and most obvious (mags). Will give an update down the road.:wavey:

dakrat
06-28-2012, 21:41
Tripp Research sells magazine rebuild kits that has stronger spring if you don't want to buy new mags. I believe Chip McCormicks Powermags have stronger spring compared to Wilson's 47D. I am not sure if the Colt magazine you mentioned have a dimple on the follower. as the slide velocity increases from the shorter slide action, the last round in the magazine can shift forward and fudge the chambering. a dimpled follower can help with that. Colt and Checkmate makes them

ArmoryDoc
06-28-2012, 23:03
Weak mag springs is my vote. When was the last time you replaced mag springs?

Usually the last rnd not feeding is a red flag for mag springs due to not having enough tension behined the last remaining rnds. Failure to lock the slide open after last rnd fired could also be an issue for a weak mag spring.

Springs are cheap and they won't go to waste, I'd rather buy em than lose a nice gun over a simple/inexspensive fix. WWW.gunsprings.com (http://www.gunsprings.com) Wolff makes great springs, buy the +5% power and your issues will be bye bye.

Good luck.

This is it. All rounds feed ok except the last ? Weak mag spring. Change it out with a +5% Wolff.

MD357
06-29-2012, 07:58
If any of these were the issue it would not be last round only

Not necessarily true.

To those that are thinking it's the mags, did you see he used 4 different mags already? It would be weird for all of them to go weak at the same time. Especially since he's used them with no problems in other 1911s?

PlasticGuy
06-29-2012, 08:25
I'd give the builder a chance to fix it. They have a good reputation. They don't want a finicky pistol out there with their name on it.

I would normally guess magazine issues also, but maybe not in this case. Usually mag problems are with the first couple rounds in the magazine, rather than the last couple. Also, you say it is doing the same thing with different mags from different manufacturers. That indicates a pistol problem.

COLDSTEEL165
06-30-2012, 02:52
I agree with the other guy's call up Virgil Tripp & order a couple of his great magazines, And a couple of his spring Kits for your existing mags & install them into them. As this will turn in your bad mags into mags equal to the Tripp Mags his Cobra 1911 mags are outstanding & worth every cent of their cost. " WORKED FOR ME 100%"

R0CKETMAN
06-30-2012, 04:24
Not necessarily true.

To those that are thinking it's the mags, did you see he used 4 different mags already? It would be weird for all of them to go weak at the same time. Especially since he's used them with no problems in other 1911s?

I've experienced the issue first hand recently. I do know that weaker springs / slightly spread feed lips can be exacerbated by lube. So my overly wet gun affected several mags. Each pistol is different. One may "feed" better than others. Those same problem mags worked fine in a different pistol.

Last round only:wavey:

okie
06-30-2012, 05:18
I'm so sorry you're having these problems my friend, I hope you can get them figured out:nailbiting:

Amsdorf
06-30-2012, 12:28
Sir, my .02.

Exhaust every possible suggestion you are receiving here.

Anytime you have a 1911 that is now that St. Moses invented, you risk problems.

I would put money on an extractor problem or a mag problem.

Respectfully, offered, and as always, FWIW YMMV.

southernshooter
06-30-2012, 18:27
Sir, my .02.

Exhaust every possible suggestion you are receiving here.

Anytime you have a 1911 that is now that St. Moses invented, you risk problems.

I would put money on an extractor problem or a mag problem.

Respectfully, offered, and as always, FWIW YMMV.
--------------------------------------------------------

Always thought that was kind of true, but only for compact 1911's

glock2740
06-30-2012, 19:03
Sir, my .02.

Just more proof that you get what you pay for. :rofl:

ca survivor
07-02-2012, 07:04
run it wet for now and see.

mobilecommand
07-02-2012, 19:06
Worse comes to worse i will take that POS off your hands... :-)

MD357
07-02-2012, 23:10
I've experienced the issue first hand recently. I do know that weaker springs / slightly spread feed lips can be exacerbated by lube. So my overly wet gun affected several mags. Each pistol is different. One may "feed" better than others. Those same problem mags worked fine in a different pistol.

Last round only:wavey:

Problem with your theory is that he states they are new or nearly new. :wavey:

countrygun
07-02-2012, 23:47
I would have love it if I had seen this thread earlier so I could have asked, kind of, one question,

When this happens is the The round fully put of the mag and, more importantly, is the "rim" of the round "under the extractor"? that is to say has the round properly risen up the breech face and slid under the extractor hook.

R0CKETMAN
07-03-2012, 04:54
Problem with your theory is that he states they are new or nearly new. :wavey:

I've ordered CMC power mags and replacement springs from Brownells. Pulled the "new" mag springs from the mags and laid them next to the replacement spring. Obvious set was discovered so it can happen.


At least I'm attempting to provide thoughts and help vs busting Rocketman's nuts as the only input in this thread:whistling:.:upeyes:





.

Arc Angel
07-03-2012, 05:31
As I remember it: Austin Behlert, Art Leckie, and Bob Cogan, all, used to use 20 to 22# recoil springs in their 1911 builds. I'd suggest you make certain that the recoil spring you're using isn't heavier than 18#'s. I'm NOT suspicious of the magazines; you've already tried too many for the problem to lie there. I don't, though, like a lot of the ammunition you've been using while verifying this pistol. You should stay with expensive, brand new, self-defense quality ammo until the gun comes on line. (I've, also, thought about the feed ramp; but, on a last round jam, it ain't going to be a factor.) Good luck; and, yes, it's a sweet looking pistol.

ADDED: Check the barrel. Are there any dull grayish spots in the chamber? If you know how to use a Dremel Tool (and, that's a big, 'if') you might want to polish the chamber walls. I, also, think talking to Bob Cogan is a good idea. I remember Bob as being conscientious and honest. To my mind, tossing the gun isn't the answer.

MD357
07-03-2012, 11:30
I've ordered CMC power mags and replacement springs from Brownells. Pulled the "new" mag springs from the mags and laid them next to the replacement spring. Obvious set was discovered so it can happen.


Not exactly sure what you're trying say here. All I'm saying is that it's weird he got FOUR DIFFERENT bum mags if what you are saying is true, rather highly unlikely.





At least I'm attempting to provide thoughts and help vs busting Rocketman's nuts as the only input in this thread:whistling:.:upeyes:

.


Not busting your "nuts"..... in fact I provided some input before you did. (see post #14) Read all the replies my friend. I just disagreed with what you said in reply to another post. Don't like it? Sorry, just going on my experiences and the likelihood of variables here.

12131
07-06-2012, 20:12
Update
Brought 3 brand new Tripp Research 8 rd Cobra mags. Shot another 100 rounds today (50 PMC and 50 Blazer Brass). Zero malfunction.
Tried again in 3 Wilson mags. The same malfunction as mentioned above. Like clock work.
I think we (you guys) have solved the problem. Thanks again for lending me your collective brain.:wavey:

fnfalman
07-06-2012, 23:36
Problem solved.

Some guns simply don't like certain mags.

MSgt Dotson
07-07-2012, 00:54
Extractor can cause last round problems, as the round is held at a slightly different angle due to the last cartridge having no cartridges underneath it for support....

This would be an inexpensive fix, albeit the replacement will not be hard chromed, and, not match the rest of the pistol, but, stainless would make it not as noticeable.

Besides...every pistol needs a spare extractor!