Discrimination against atheists in public schools [Archive] - Glock Talk

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nmk
07-17-2012, 14:00
http://freethoughtblogs.com/wwjtd/2012/07/16/want-to-know-what-the-high-school-secular-landscape-looks-like/

I'm interested to see what the school's lawyers suggest.

I thought we were supposed to be worried about the rabid lefties running the school system. :dunno:

High-Gear
07-17-2012, 15:39
In the school where my wife teaches, another teacher spoke up at a meeting and said, "This is a Christian School, and if a student goes here they should expect that we do things like pray. If they don't like it they should find somewhere else to go."

My wife had to remind him it was a public school, she had students from a christian, muslim, and a buddhist family that year, and there were staff members who were members of several religions, and no religion, and if he did not like it HE should find somewhere else to be! He was not back for e next school year.

High-Gear
07-17-2012, 15:59
Here is a revent video.

In God We Teach - YouTube

Cavalry Doc
07-17-2012, 16:47
In the school where my wife teaches, another teacher spoke up at a meeting and said, "This is a Christian School, and if a student goes here they should expect that we do things like pray. If they don't like it they should find somewhere else to go."

My wife had to remind him it was a public school, she had students frim a christian, muslim, and a buddhist family at year, and there were staff members who were members of several religions, and no religion, and if he did not like it HE should find somewhere else to be! He was not back for e next school year.


Good for her!


Seriously.

High-Gear
07-17-2012, 17:03
Good for her!


Seriously.

Thanks Doc, she is a very strong willed person. (its a red head thing I think :supergrin:)

Sorry for typos, dang Ipad.

nmk
07-17-2012, 19:01
Here is a revent video.

In God We Teach - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmRajX5fuSE&feature=youtube_gdata_player)

I'm only ten minutes in, but that's scary.

ETA: Just finished. It got worse.

PettyOfficer
07-17-2012, 20:20
Wow, a reasonable discussion without any hostilities. Where am I? Did I follow a link to a different forum?

Oh wait, still GT, just early in the thread, all the homophobes and wing nuts are still in the BoyScouts thread.

HI, My name is Ryan, and I'm a free thinker. (can we get a GT support group going... Heheheheh)

nmk
07-17-2012, 20:24
Wow, a reasonable discussion without any hostilities. Where am I? Did I follow a link to a different forum?

Oh wait, still GT, just early in the thread, all the homophobes and wing nuts are still in the BoyScouts thread.

HI, My name is Ryan, and I'm a free thinker. (can we get a GT support group going... Heheheheh)

No. You will soon be told that free-thinking is a religion.

:wavey:

Bren
07-17-2012, 20:58
When I was in public elementary school, we had bible stories every day and they'd take us to half day assemblies to hear a local preacher (Brother Rule - a pseudonym, I'd guess) preach, and play hymns on the piano for everybody to sing along. Daily prayers before lunch, etc.

I suspect it's why I'm so ready to take issue with these nuts today.

nmk
07-17-2012, 21:14
When I was in public elementary school, we had bible stories every day and they'd take us to half day assemblies to hear a local preacher (Brother Rule - a pseudonym, I'd guess) preach, and play hymns on the piano for everybody to sing along. Daily prayers before lunch, etc.

I suspect it's why I'm so ready to take issue with these nuts today.

I think you're older than me and probably wiser than me so I value your opinion here. I was raised in private (Catholic) schools in KY and even I think this stuff is outrageous. I was never subjected to what you were. And these are public schools!

PettyOfficer
07-17-2012, 21:20
I went to Roman Catholic schools through 9th grade and could not lie and write papers for the mandatory religion classes anymore. It was my choice to go to that highschool and my choice to leave and goto a public HS. My parents are religious and pray for me, but they respect me and don't force their point, and I return that respect.

I respect others choices of religion, and only object when others beliefs are being forced upon me or my family (my Facebook timeline background image is a sign that starts with: Religion is like a *****...). I would have no problem sending my kids to a parochial school as long as they learn about free will and freedom of choice from me and my wife. I am okay with my children taking religion classes to learn about faith systems and would support them if they chose to follow and believe.

I believe my religious education taught me enough about other belief systems that I am able to respect them as well. However, many of the more fundamentalist denominations don't teach respect for other faiths the way I was taught, and I would not allow my children to attend an education program founded on such ignorance.

I honestly believe my parochial education was vastly superior to my friends' public education. The life choices of my friends from both systems have proven the end result is worth it (with a few notable exceptions).

Perhaps I'm more agnostic and guess that I support that Coexist bumper sticker more than anything.

yellowhand
07-17-2012, 22:06
I was going to stop even reading anything in this section because of all the hooping and hollering, reading this thread is a true blessing.
Calm, polite, and pleasant discussion of different viewpoints.
Have any opinion you want, just don't force it upon me.
Or a big dose of live and let live.
Nice.

PettyOfficer
07-17-2012, 22:18
I was going to stop even reading anything in this section because of all the hooping and hollering, reading this thread is a true blessing.
Calm, polite, and pleasant discussion of different viewpoints.
Have any opinion you want, just don't force it upon me.
Or a big dose of live and let live.
Nice.

Shalom!

PettyOfficer
07-17-2012, 22:21
I am going to risk a warning on this photo, however as I see it, it is not directly insulting to any specific group, does not encourage hate, and is free speech.
226587

yellowhand
07-17-2012, 23:07
I am going to risk a warning on this photo, however as I see it, it is not directly insulting to any specific group, does not encourage hate, and is free speech.
226587

My Rabbi will love this:rofl:

High-Gear
07-18-2012, 05:45
Unlike cavdoc I have not had a teacher express any atheistic views in school. Quite the opposite actually.

I had a teacher like the one in the video. She would tell us about satan visiting her at her house, and how satan appeared in the passenger seat of her car and bulled the wheel to cause it to veer into a ditch, but how god moved the trees to keep her from hitting them.

In high school I said "Jesus Christ!" when I was aggravated about something, and was sent to the princible for taking the lords name in vain. I argued that I could not be held to the teacher's religious standard and did not violate the school policy. I was threatened with expulsion. The principle then spent the next 3 hours witnessing to me before allowing me to leave the office.

nmk
07-18-2012, 10:06
I am going to risk a warning on this photo, however as I see it, it is not directly insulting to any specific group, does not encourage hate, and is free speech.
226587

You don't get free speech on a privately owned forum. :tongueout:

I'm hoping for an update today.

Bren
07-18-2012, 14:08
I think you're older than me and probably wiser than me so I value your opinion here. I was raised in private (Catholic) schools in KY and even I think this stuff is outrageous. I was never subjected to what you were. And these are public schools!

Yep. Mine was in the Powell County public schools in the 70's.

RyanBDawg
07-18-2012, 14:15
There is a reason why the poorest and least educated segments of society are also the most religiously zealous.


Sent from my iPhone 4s

High-Gear
07-18-2012, 17:46
There is a reason why the poorest and least educated segments of society are also the most religiously zealous.


Sent from my iPhone 4s

I think the correlation is actually tied to IQ and religiousity, not education level.

<a href="http://s42.photobucket.com/albums/e334/SirPwn4lot/?action=view&amp;current=stae.png" target="_blank"><img src="http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e334/SirPwn4lot/stae.png" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>

While in a perfect world there would be a direct correlation with IQ and education level, we have many, many average or even below average people attending college.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/21/Educational_Ranking_by_Religious_Group_-_2001.png

India's Hindus blow the curve.

PettyOfficer
07-18-2012, 18:39
Edited...

Syclone538
07-23-2012, 20:52
Update...

...
The outcome is…different than what we expected. The part of his letter bragging about the faculty at the school conspiring against the burgeoning secular club was not true. So the school itself is not breaking the law (at least, not in the way described to us by one of its teachers).
...

http://freethoughtblogs.com/wwjtd/2012/07/23/letter-update-delay/

Kingarthurhk
07-24-2012, 18:26
There is a reason why the poorest and least educated segments of society are also the most religiously zealous.


Sent from my iPhone 4s

What an interesting and unsubtantiated stereotype.

Cavalry Doc
07-24-2012, 18:32
There is a reason why the poorest and least educated segments of society are also the most religiously zealous.


Sent from my iPhone 4s

What an interesting and unsubtantiated stereotype.

I'm sure BDawg has a cite to a poll or something, that he'll be linking to any moment now........
:popcorn:

High-Gear
07-24-2012, 18:48
Data reportedly from a gallup poll, and put into a graphic form. Relationship of poverty and religiousity world wide.
http://whyevolutionistrue.wordpress.com/2010/09/04/a-correlation-between-poverty-and-religiosity/

Relationship of IQ and religiousity.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289608000238

Kingarthurhk
07-24-2012, 18:59
Teacher suspended for lies to student Should be fired! - YouTube

Boy, 5, records teacher berating him in class - YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=FO857j0qCQo&NR=1

Teacher Beats up her student - YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=l8noSif5wjo&NR=1


Save Mr. Tim Latham, Lawrence High School History and Government Teacher - YouTube

Your public schools at work...

High-Gear
07-24-2012, 19:17
Hey kingarthurhk,
your post was completely off topic, and aimed at berating teachers rather than furthering the discussion.

So let me ask you...

What do you do for a living?

I want to see if there is an example of anyone nationwide who happens to have the same job as you do being a jerk or doing something wrong. If I can, I get to run down all (fill in the blank) because of the actuons of a few.

Oh, you don't like being held to that standard? Then why does that standard always get applied to public servants? Let me fill you in on something. There are cops who are jerks and crooks, I hate those guys and so do 99% of the other cops! However I dont judge all cops because if the actions of a few. Stop judging teachers over the actions of a few.

Cavalry Doc
07-24-2012, 19:34
Hey kingarthurhk,
your post was completely off topic, and aimed at berating teachers rather than furthering the discussion.

So let me ask you...

What do you do for a living?

I want to see if there is an example of anyone nationwide who happens to have the same job as you do being a jerk or doing something wrong. If I can, I get to run down all (fill in the blank) because of the actuons of a few.

Oh, you don't like being held to that standard? Then why does that standard always get applied to public servants? Let me fill you in on something. There are cops who are jerks and crooks, I hate those guys and so do 99% of the other cops! However I dont judge all cops because if the actions of a few. Stop judging teachers over the actions of a few.

:shocked:

Hey, HG, maybe you want to watch that last video till the end, and reconsider.........

just sayin'


http://kansasmeadowlark.com/blog/2009/06/18/tim-latham-to-keep-his-teaching-job/

High-Gear
07-24-2012, 19:46
:shocked:

Hey, HG, maybe you want to watch that last video till the end, and reconsider.........

just sayin'


http://kansasmeadowlark.com/blog/2009/06/18/tim-latham-to-keep-his-teaching-job/

He posts 5 videos of supposedly bad teachers, and one of kids supporting a teacher, then follows it up with, "Your public schools at work..."

I think he was looking for 6 bad videos and mistakenly found a positive one...just sayin.

If I'm wrong, please King, explain what your point was and I'll retract my post with an apology. However I think I'm spot on and am waiting to hear what King does for a living.

Kingarthurhk
07-24-2012, 21:31
Hey kingarthurhk,
your post was completely off topic, and aimed at berating teachers rather than furthering the discussion.

So let me ask you...

What do you do for a living?

I want to see if there is an example of anyone nationwide who happens to have the same job as you do being a jerk or doing something wrong. If I can, I get to run down all (fill in the blank) because of the actuons of a few.

Oh, you don't like being held to that standard? Then why does that standard always get applied to public servants? Let me fill you in on something. There are cops who are jerks and crooks, I hate those guys and so do 99% of the other cops! However I dont judge all cops because if the actions of a few. Stop judging teachers over the actions of a few.

Wait a minute, we had videos of teachers advocating religous educations, and that was okay. Teachers doing other objectionable things is not okay? Really?

My point to that was, there are lots of teachers doing dumb things from either side of things. The general gist of the problem is they are all teaching from their personal perspective, and by-in-large anymore that is Atheism despite the one or two rare examples of "intolerant Christian" teachers. A depiction, that you were somehow conformtable with.

The rest of it, not so much? As you beat your chest in your post-double standard much?:upeyes:

High-Gear
07-24-2012, 22:14
Wait a minute, we had videos of teachers advocating religous educations, and that was okay. Teachers doing other objectionable things is not okay? Really?

My point to that was, there are lots of teachers doing dumb things from either side of things. The general gist of the problem is they are all teaching from their personal perspective, and by-in-large anymore that is Atheism despite the one or two rare examples of "intolerant Christian" teachers. A depiction, that you were somehow conformtable with.

The rest of it, not so much? As you beat your chest in your post-double standard much?:upeyes:

So the other side of pushing religious beliefs is abusing children? The "atheist perspective" is beating a child? You seem to think if a teacher is not evangelizing for christ, they are "teaching from an atheist perspective". This is not true.

How do I have a double standard? You could not find a video of a teacher, teaching there was no god so you post this off topic material to bash public teachers, instead of posting something relevant. Good job.

Syclone538
07-24-2012, 23:01
Teaching religion to children...

~45 to ~50 minutes in.

Atheism and Anarchy: Stefan Molyneux, Adam Kokesh and Ernest Hancock - YouTube