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DonGlock26
08-07-2012, 10:59
Ennahdha Founder Attacked at “Tolerance in Islam” Conference


http://www.tunisia-live.net/2012/08/06/islamist-leader-attacked-at-tolerance-in-islam-conference/

Apparently, they still can't play nice with each other. At least, no one brought a bomb vest to the party.


_

Geko45
08-07-2012, 18:09
Religion has that effect on people.

snowbird
08-15-2012, 08:07
Religion has that effect on people.

Not quite.

As of today, Islam has launched 19,436 deadly attacks, just since 9/11. More of these deadly attacks keep happening daily.

Meanwhile, other religions haven't launched any such 'religion'-inspired, hate-and-kill-all-unbelievers, take-over-the-world type attacks.

Nice try at the false moral-equivalence argument.

Kingarthurhk
08-15-2012, 16:51
Not quite.

As of today, Islam has launched 19,436 deadly attacks, just since 9/11. More of these deadly attacks keep happening daily.

Meanwhile, other religions haven't launched any such 'religion'-inspired, hate-and-kill-all-unbelievers, take-over-the-world type attacks.

Nice try at the false moral-equivalence argument.

You really aren't a student of history if you honestly believe that.

Geko45
08-16-2012, 08:13
You really aren't a student of history if you honestly believe that.

King, thank you for acknowledging that. Yes, every major religion has taken its turn at persecuting others at some point in time. Islam is simply the current example of a pattern that occurs repeatedly throughout history.

snowbird
08-16-2012, 17:08
...every major religion has taken its turn at persecuting others at some point in time. Islam is simply the current example of a pattern that occurs repeatedly throughout history.

No other 'religion' has murdered 280 million innocent people. Godless Communism comes in at a distant second place, with 100 million innocents murdered in the 20th century.

No other 'religion' was started by a murderous, thieving pedophile.

The Koran says "slay the infidel", and obviously many Muslims take that seriously. Today's total of deadly Muslim attacks just since 9/11 has reached 19,455. Why does the same total for each of the other religions today stand at zero, if 'all religions persecute others'?

The Koran says a woman's testimony is worth only half that of a man. It allows men to marry up to 4 wives and have sex with slave girls. It says a son's inheritance should be twice that of a daughter. It tells husbands to beat disobedient wives. Please cite comparable misogyny in the Bible (hint: it isn't there). Stockholm police say there is an average of 5 rapes a day there now. This is done by Muslim immigrants. Rapes of children under 15 accounted for the largest increase in rape stats. In Denmark too, most rapists are Muslim.

In Norway, a Muslim rapist told his victim that in Islam, women have no rights. He got that right.

One Swede opined, "We Swedes are really gullible" (they are also really leftist, but that's redundant) "...up until the 60s, the world, through Swedish eyes, was a beautiful place" (yes, remember those idyllic ABBA songs?) But, he continued, "being this naive is like a small child walking naked into a world pedophile convention". Another man who got it right.

The fact is, Islam is the original Nazi ideology. It was essentially copied by Hitler (a Socialist, another leftist). We urgently need to stop listening to the left. We need to stop Islamic immigration while we still can, while we still have some freedom. Do it for our children.

LASTRESORT20
08-16-2012, 17:13
`Well said snowbird!
~ "The fact is, Islam is the original Nazi ideology. It was essentially copied by Hitler (a Socialist, another leftist). We urgently need to stop listening to the left. We need to stop Islamic immigration while we still can, while we still have some freedom. Do it for our children." ~

Kingarthurhk
08-16-2012, 17:47
King, thank you for acknowledging that. Yes, every major religion has taken its turn at persecuting others at some point in time. Islam is simply the current example of a pattern that occurs repeatedly throughout history.

True, I think you would be hard pressed to find a major world religion that hasn't, when it has colluded with the state, not committed some sort of attrocity. That is why there should be a clear speration between church and state.

Animal Mother
08-16-2012, 18:59
No other 'religion' has murdered 280 million innocent people. Godless Communism comes in at a distant second place, with 100 million innocents murdered in the 20th century.

No other 'religion' was started by a murderous, thieving pedophile.

The Koran says "slay the infidel", and obviously many Muslims take that seriously. Today's total of deadly Muslim attacks just since 9/11 has reached 19,455. Why does the same total for each of the other religions today stand at zero, if 'all religions persecute others'?

The Koran says a woman's testimony is worth only half that of a man. It allows men to marry up to 4 wives and have sex with slave girls. It says a son's inheritance should be twice that of a daughter. It tells husbands to beat disobedient wives. Please cite comparable misogyny in the Bible (hint: it isn't there). Stockholm police say there is an average of 5 rapes a day there now. This is done by Muslim immigrants. Rapes of children under 15 accounted for the largest increase in rape stats. In Denmark too, most rapists are Muslim.

In Norway, a Muslim rapist told his victim that in Islam, women have no rights. He got that right.

One Swede opined, "We Swedes are really gullible" (they are also really leftist, but that's redundant) "...up until the 60s, the world, through Swedish eyes, was a beautiful place" (yes, remember those idyllic ABBA songs?) But, he continued, "being this naive is like a small child walking naked into a world pedophile convention". Another man who got it right.

The fact is, Islam is the original Nazi ideology. It was essentially copied by Hitler (a Socialist, another leftist). We urgently need to stop listening to the left. We need to stop Islamic immigration while we still can, while we still have some freedom. Do it for our children.As you have made abundantly clear so many times, you have no idea what facts are in either the abstract or specific. You simply twist, or when necessary invent, the "facts" you think will bolster your position.

Geko45
08-16-2012, 19:11
No other 'religion' has murdered 280 million innocent people. Godless Communism comes in at a distant second place, with 100 million innocents murdered in the 20th century.

To be fair, you have to compare the number of those killed to the total population of the planet at the time. So, obviously, no one has matched Islam in terms of absolute numbers, but is that still true when expressed in terms of percentage of total people alive at that time?

Kingarthurhk
08-17-2012, 04:52
To be fair, you have to compare the number of those killed to the total population of the planet at the time. So, obviously, no one has matched Islam in terms of absolute numbers, but is that still true when expressed in terms of percentage of total people alive at that time?

The greatest evils men do, is when they collude religion and state. The reason Islam has been radicalized is because they have mixed the state and religion. I can't think of an Islamic state that does not have "religious police" or is not repressive or violent. There are plenty of peace loving Islamic people in the United States, happy to be away from opression to worship in peace. Then there are those who are affected by state religion abroad, or sent on behest of those state religions. Those are dangerous folks.

The core of the issue is the collusion of state and religion. It should never happen.

snowbird
08-17-2012, 08:36
To be fair, you have to compare the number of those killed to the total population of the planet at the time. So, obviously, no one has matched Islam in terms of absolute numbers, but is that still true when expressed in terms of percentage of total people alive at that time?

Stalin once cynically said that while the murder of one person was tragic, the murder of millions was just a statistic. Anyway, let's just say that both Islam and Godless Communism have murdered millions of innocents and are vile. Fair enough?

Geko45
08-17-2012, 08:45
Stalin once cynically said that while the murder of one person was tragic, the murder of millions was just a statistic. Anyway, let's just say that both Islam and Godless Communism have murdered millions of innocents and are vile. Fair enough?

Fair enough.

(and just for the record, I'm a godless capitalist)

Geko45
08-17-2012, 08:46
The core of the issue is the collusion of state and religion. It should never happen.

I agree wholeheartedly.

snowbird
08-17-2012, 08:54
As you have made abundantly clear so many times, you have no idea what facts are in either the abstract or specific. You simply twist, or when necessary invent, the "facts" you think will bolster your position.

Tell us, oh 'wise' one, is the following fact "abstract" or "specific"?

On Aug., 14, 2012, at Damaturu, Nigeria, Boko Haram Muslims slew 9 people.

The only thing "twisted" is your perverse support of this kind of evil. It is noted that you say nothing against Islamic pedophilia, FGM, polygamy, hatred for any who are different, genocide, etc. But you often "twist, or when necessary invent, the "facts" you think will bolster your position". For example, you claim America deliberately committed genocide against the native Indians, and you frequently cite Old Testament passages as "proof" that Christianity is as bad as Islam, ignoring that today's terrorism, murder and mayhem is almost exclusively Muslim and Christian-rein (free of Christians).:upeyes:

snowbird
08-17-2012, 09:10
The greatest evils men do, is when they collude religion and state. The reason Islam has been radicalized is because they have mixed the state and religion. I can't think of an Islamic state that does not have "religious police" or is not repressive or violent. There are plenty of peace loving Islamic people in the United States, happy to be away from opression to worship in peace. Then there are those who are affected by state religion abroad, or sent on behest of those state religions. Those are dangerous folks.

The core of the issue is the collusion of state and religion. It should never happen.

I agree with you and Norske about having a reasonable amount of separation of church and state. The trouble here and now is, our leftist establishment sees nothing wrong with banning Christmas carols and Nativity scenes from village squares, while allowing creeping sharia to take over our courts and culture.

Islam was radical from the very beginning, when it was started by an evil pedophile lunatic with a penchant for robbery, rape, and beheading.

As for peaceful Muslims, how can we tell them from the Koran-approved kind? A Russian I car-pooled with years ago, before 9/11, said, quite rightly, "A Muslim is a very dangerous person". He cited Muslim populations in central Asia who had lived peaceably with Russians for centuries, but then, with no warning, started taking the Koran seriously once again, and murdering non-Muslims. Let's err on the side of caution, and stop all Muslim immigration until such time as they have stamped out the bloodthirsty streak in Islam, permanently, by themselves over in their homelands. There is nothing "bigoted" about that; rather, it is about common sense and our survival, which leftists oppose for some reason.

Animal Mother
08-17-2012, 17:11
Tell us, oh 'wise' one, is the following fact "abstract" or "specific"?

On Aug., 14, 2012, at Damaturu, Nigeria, Boko Haram Muslims slew 9 people.

The only thing "twisted" is your perverse support of this kind of evil. It is noted that you say nothing against Islamic pedophilia, FGM, polygamy, hatred for any who are different, genocide, etc. But you often "twist, or when necessary invent, the "facts" you think will bolster your position". For example, you claim America deliberately committed genocide against the native Indians, and you frequently cite Old Testament passages as "proof" that Christianity is as bad as Islam, ignoring that today's terrorism, murder and mayhem is almost exclusively Muslim and Christian-rein (free of Christians).:upeyes: No, what's twisted is your trying to claim anyone who opposes your bigotry and unreasoning hatred must support terrorists and terrorism. The complete failing of this kind of attack has been pointed out to you many times before, yet you continue in this kind of behavior which simply reinforces the fact that neither truth nor accuracy matter to you in the least.

Kingarthurhk
08-17-2012, 17:18
I agree with you and Norske about having a reasonable amount of separation of church and state. The trouble here and now is, our leftist establishment sees nothing wrong with banning Christmas carols and Nativity scenes from village squares, while allowing creeping sharia to take over our courts and culture.

Islam was radical from the very beginning, when it was started by an evil pedophile lunatic with a penchant for robbery, rape, and beheading.

As for peaceful Muslims, how can we tell them from the Koran-approved kind? A Russian I car-pooled with years ago, before 9/11, said, quite rightly, "A Muslim is a very dangerous person". He cited Muslim populations in central Asia who had lived peaceably with Russians for centuries, but then, with no warning, started taking the Koran seriously once again, and murdering non-Muslims. Let's err on the side of caution, and stop all Muslim immigration until such time as they have stamped out the bloodthirsty streak in Islam, permanently, by themselves over in their homelands. There is nothing "bigoted" about that; rather, it is about common sense and our survival, which leftists oppose for some reason.

Saying that there is no peaceful Muslims based on the Koran is ludicrous. The Saracen of old let Christians live in peace in their domain as Dhimi, or "People of the Book". The Berbers comming up from Africa are a diffent story, they were radical and violent. The red fez the shriners wear is ironic, as the Berbers wore white fez's until they made them red with blood of their enemy.

So, there has always been factions in Islam, Sunis and Shiites, for example.

To say their are no peaceful Muslims is like saying there are no peaceful Catholics. Nothing in the doctrine has ever repudiated the persecution of "heretics". But, do I think all Catholics, based on the official doctrine are out to burn me at the stake? Hardly. There are lots of good peaceful Catholic people.

So, to blanket the entire people of a religion based on doctrine or the actions of others doesn't work with me.

Otherwise, I would not have any Catholic friends, I do. In High School I had a kurdish Muslim friend, who immigrated. I also had a Bhudist friend. I also had Agnostic friends.

I really don't care about a person's religious choice, but the content of their character.

snowbird
08-18-2012, 09:56
No, what's twisted is your trying to claim anyone who opposes your bigotry and unreasoning hatred must support terrorists and terrorism. The complete failing of this kind of attack has been pointed out to you many times before, yet you continue in this kind of behavior which simply reinforces the fact that neither truth nor accuracy matter to you in the least.

No, what's twisted is your claim, that noticing that today's total of deadly Muslim attacks, just since 9/11, which has now reached 19,464, is "bigoted":upeyes:. "Unreasoning hatred" is what your Koran preaches; it is what gave us 9/11. Why do you support that? Oh, that's right -it's because you hate America and Christianity so much.

Your Koran also preaches takiyya, or lying. But that doesn't bother you at all because "neither truth nor accuracy matter to you in the least".

But you sure do grovel and lick Muslim sandals in a very adept manner. Must be all the years of practice.

Animal Mother
08-18-2012, 10:10
No, what's twisted is your claim, that noticing that today's total of deadly Muslim attacks, just since 9/11, which has now reached 19,464, is "bigoted":upeyes:. Where did I say that? Oh right, you're just demonstrating your willingness to invent positions for those pointing out your bigotry.
"Unreasoning hatred" is what your Koran preaches; it is what gave us 9/11. Why do you support that? Oh, that's right -it's because you hate America and Christianity so much.
Where have I ever said I support either unreasoning hatred, such as the kind you demonstrate, or the Qur'an? Please, share the post. Undoubtedly this will be yet another in the long line of challenges you avoid or hide from.
Your Koran also preaches takiyya, or lying. But that doesn't bother you at all because "neither truth nor accuracy matter to you in the least". Again, you misrepresent and lie while accusing others of the same behavior. You may be wrong, but at least you're consistent.
But you sure do grovel and lick Muslim sandals in a very adept manner. Must be all the years of practice. I'll challenge you again to demonstrate anywhere I've done anything of this sort, just for the pleasure I receive from watching you flee and hide.

steveksux
08-18-2012, 10:21
Your Koran also preaches takiyya, or lying.
So that makes Snowbird a good Muslim. :rofl::rofl::rofl:

I'm sure he'll be pleased to hear that!

Randy

Geko45
08-18-2012, 10:22
Your Koran also preaches takiyya, or lying. But that doesn't bother you at all because "neither truth nor accuracy matter to you in the least".

Umm, his koran? I'm pretty sure AM isn't muslim.

And for the record, I am familiar with "al takia" or "the tactic" and why it pretty much makes traditional negotiations with islamic countries useless, but I doubt it has any bearing on the current conversation.

snowbird
08-18-2012, 10:45
Umm, his koran? I'm pretty sure AM isn't muslim.

Maybe. But he certainly runs interference for Islam all the time. Can you show any evidence that he isn't a Muslim?

Geko45
08-18-2012, 11:03
Maybe. But he certainly runs interference for Islam all the time. Can you show any evidence that he isn't a Muslim?

Ok.

Animal Mother, are you a muslim?

snowbird
08-18-2012, 11:20
To say their are no peaceful Muslims is like saying there are no peaceful Catholics.

Ummm...no.

YOU say that I said that there are no peaceful Muslims, but that is incorrect. I never said that.

There are some peaceful Muslims just like there were some peaceful Nazis. I recall reading about one Nazi doctor who helped some sick people in India, IIRC. But one guy's good deeds doesn't negate the overall evil of the philosophy with which he is associated. Hitler's Holocaust of Jewish people mirrored Islam's genocide of Armenian Christians. Hitler is dead and Nazis no longer seriously threaten whole populations, but that's certainly not true of Islam. Look what's happening to Christians in Muslim countries right now, as we speak. Can we agree, it's not peaceful? Rape and murder never are.

Catholics are Christians, the same as Protestants and Eastern Orthodox. Jesus said "love one another", not "keep trying to start more wars with one another". Why do you go against Christ's teaching this way? Satan loves that kind of thing. I could understand if you were an America-hating, leftist Christophobic atheist such as Animal Mother or steveksux, but you're a Christian, brother. Forsake the Devil and all of his works and all his ways.

It's nice that you had a Muslim friend. I pray that he will consider your faith and turn towards salvation.

But be cautious.

Nine years ago in Houston, Ariel Sellouk, a Jewish man, thought Mohammed Ali Alayed was his friend. When Ali phoned and suggested they go to a bar, he agreed. But then Ali slashed Ariel's throat, the way the Koran commands Muslims to do. After the murder, Ali went to a mosque. He was very devout about his Islam.

Here's a question for you (and Animal Mother, steveksux, and any other dhimmis): which parts of the Islamic doctrine do 'moderate', peace-loving, 'patriotic' Muslims reject or object to, or claim have been misinterpreted by 'extremists' and 'radicals'?

steveksux
08-18-2012, 14:36
Here's a question for you (and Animal Mother, steveksux, and any other dhimmis): which parts of the Islamic doctrine do 'moderate', peace-loving, 'patriotic' Muslims reject or object to, or claim have been misinterpreted by 'extremists' and 'radicals'?Killing infidels. Duh. Not too bright are you? That wasnt' hard to figure out if you ask me. :dunno:

Got a whole bunch of them living in Dearborn Mi for generations now. Peacefully. Got a whole bunch of them serving in the US military. Got one in Ft Hood that went crazy.

So throw them all out of the country because of that guy, right?

What EXACTLY do YOU propose we do with all those American Citizens who follow Islam?

Randy

snowbird
08-18-2012, 19:15
Got a whole bunch of them living in Dearborn Mi for generations now. Peacefully. Got a whole bunch of them serving in the US military. Got one in Ft Hood that went crazy.



Several of the ones serving in the US military have killed or tried to kill their fellow non-Muslim servicemen.

And Nidal Hasan was far from being the only violent Muslim in the US. Here are just a few of the many others:

-July 18, 1973 NOI Muslims in Washington DC shot and killed 7 members of a family in cold blood. A defendant was also later murdered in prison on orders of Elijah Muhammed

-Feb 26, 1993 NYC Muslims detonated a truck bomb under the WTC, killing 6 and injuring over 1,000 in an effort to collapse the towers

-Sept 11, 2001 Muslims killed nearly 3,000 innocent American civilians in NYC, Washington DC, and Shanksville, PA

-Oct 3, 2002 Muslim snipers killed 12 innocent American civilians in AL,LA, VA, and MD

-Feb 13, 2007 A Muslim in Salt Lake City shot and killed 5 innocent American civilians who were buying Valentine cards in a mall

-Feb 12, 2009 In Buffalo, NY, the founder of a Muslim TV station who had whined about Americans allegedly stereotyping Muslims as violent, beheaded his wife for seeking a divorce

-April 14, 2010 In Illinois, a Muslim shot and killed 5 family members to "take them back to Allah"

Your Dearborn bunch haven't been all that peaceful either. This year they were throwing bottles at Christians -it can be seen on video at youtube. You're not very truthful. But as the saying goes, 'Dogs bark, ducks quack, and leftists lie'. You must feel kinship with Islamic takiyya artists.

Animal Mother
08-18-2012, 20:54
Umm, his koran? I'm pretty sure AM isn't muslim. Amazing how you managed to figure that out. It's almost as if it were obvious and snowbird was intentionally misrepresenting my position so he could villify the strawman he constructed.
And for the record, I am familiar with "al takia" or "the tactic" and why it pretty much makes traditional negotiations with islamic countries useless, but I doubt it has any bearing on the current conversation.Could you expand on this familiarity? The only basis for taqiyya I find in Islamic tradition involves concealing one's faith when it could present a danger. snowbird expands this to a general endorsement of lying, but as always fails to cite any justification other than his own demented thoughts or what he's been told by those who agree with his hate.

Animal Mother
08-18-2012, 20:55
Animal Mother, are you a muslim? Of course not, but that's the only bullet snowbird has in his gun, so he has to keep firing it no matter how off the mark it might be.

Animal Mother
08-18-2012, 21:04
Several of the ones serving in the US military have killed or tried to kill their fellow non-Muslim servicemen. So have a number of non-Muslim servicemen, what conclusion should we draw from that?

And Nidal Hasan was far from being the only violent Muslim in the US. Here are just a few of the many others:

-July 18, 1973 NOI Muslims in Washington DC shot and killed 7 members of a family in cold blood. A defendant was also later murdered in prison on orders of Elijah Muhammed

-Feb 26, 1993 NYC Muslims detonated a truck bomb under the WTC, killing 6 and injuring over 1,000 in an effort to collapse the towers

-Sept 11, 2001 Muslims killed nearly 3,000 innocent American civilians in NYC, Washington DC, and Shanksville, PA

-Oct 3, 2002 Muslim snipers killed 12 innocent American civilians in AL,LA, VA, and MD

-Feb 13, 2007 A Muslim in Salt Lake City shot and killed 5 innocent American civilians who were buying Valentine cards in a mall

-Feb 12, 2009 In Buffalo, NY, the founder of a Muslim TV station who had whined about Americans allegedly stereotyping Muslims as violent, beheaded his wife for seeking a divorce

-April 14, 2010 In Illinois, a Muslim shot and killed 5 family members to "take them back to Allah"

Your Dearborn bunch haven't been all that peaceful either. This year they were throwing bottles at Christians -it can be seen on video at youtube. You're not very truthful. But as the saying goes, 'Dogs bark, ducks quack, and leftists lie'. You must feel kinship with Islamic takiyya artists.It appears you believe that if a Muslim commits a crime, it's because they're a Muslim. Are you at least consistent in coming to the same conclusion about all criminals? Let me answer for you, since we all know how you hate direct questions. No, you're not. If you can pin an action on a Muslim, you conclude it's because of Islam. However in all other situations, you're more than willing to make excuses and offer justifications to preserve your bigotry.

What's sad is that you still don't seem to recognize how utterly transparent you are to anyone with the ability to apply reason. You love calling yourself a patriot and trying to connect Muslims to Nazis, but what you fail to recognize is that Himmler and Goebbels considered themselves patriots and advocated exactly the same kind of campaign of hate and lies that you continue to employ.

IhRedrider
08-19-2012, 06:31
To be fair, you have to compare the number of those killed to the total population of the planet at the time. So, obviously, no one has matched Islam in terms of absolute numbers, but is that still true when expressed in terms of percentage of total people alive at that time?


"Fair"? You can't possible be serious. Because with this logic it is better to kill 5 people in a room of 100 than to kill 1 person in a room of 1.

snowbird
08-19-2012, 09:47
snowbird('s)... own demented thoughts or ... his hate.

Ad homs, character assassination, and name-calling.

That's all lying leftists have to rebut solid facts and logical arguments (see the long list of Muslim atrocities in Post #27). The sad thing is, solid facts and logical arguments fall on deaf leftist ears.

Libs and facts
-oil and water.

Geko45
08-19-2012, 10:07
Ad homs, character assassination, and name-calling.

You're gonna have to stop using terms like "dhimmis" if you want to be able to raise that flag and not sound like a hypocrite.

Geko45
08-19-2012, 10:11
"Fair"? You can't possible be serious. Because with this logic it is better to kill 5 people in a room of 100 than to kill 1 person in a room of 1.

Ummm, no... Seriously? Do you really expect us to believe you have such poor reading comprehension? I didn't mean fair in the sense that killing more or less makes any difference in moral terms, but rather to make fair (equivalent) comparison on the adverse effects on society from two very dangerous doctrines/belief systems (i.e. stalinism versus radical islam).

snowbird
08-19-2012, 10:20
... if a Muslim commits a crime...

Nothing 'iffy' about it.

As of today, Muslims have committed 19,473 crimes (deadly attacks) just since 9/11. These aren't ordinary crimes, where a lustful lout commits rape, or a greedy, lazy creep commits robbery, or someone with anger issues commits murder. Those kinds of crime can happen among any religious group or any non-religious group. But for devout Muslims, these jihad crimes are perfectly okay, because according to their Islamic ethics, Islam conquering the world by whatever means is the way their Allah wants it.

A Muslim warlord in Mali has shown far more understanding of this geopolitical concept than our university-educated, dhimmi Animal Mother. Omar Ould Hamaha, commander of a Muslim military outfit called 'Defenders of the Faith', said, "When we have finished conquering France, we will come to the USA, we will come to London and conquer the whole world".

This is the core of Islamic doctrine: Muslims want every inch of earth to be an Islamic state. The 'tiny minority' of violent extremists, such as Omar, are openly saying what the vast majority of 'peaceful' fifth-columnists are secretly thinking. Unfortunately, most of the West's 'elite' leaders these days far too closely resemble Animal Mother, and therein lies our great danger. These feckless dhimmis and traitors will put out the welcome mat for the Omars, and they will, as AM demonstrates so often, call any plucky counterjihadists standing up for freedom, "bigots".:upeyes:

Geko45
08-19-2012, 10:20
Could you expand on this familiarity? The only basis for taqiyya I find in Islamic tradition involves concealing one's faith when it could present a danger. snowbird expands this to a general endorsement of lying, but as always fails to cite any justification other than his own demented thoughts or what he's been told by those who agree with his hate.

Well, I guess I should qualify that statement with "radical" islamic countries. You have the general idea correct, what it is supposed to be is an allowance for a muslim to conceal or even lie about their faith in order to avoid persecution. For instance, they are in a foreign country and they are arrested and told "renounce islam or die". They can renounce it and not be condemnded in the eyes of allah.

Radical islam distorts the concept (in a similar manner that it distorts pretty much all major islamic tenets) to a point where just about any untruth may be told to infidels in order to further islam (and of course, the liar is the one that gets to decide what they think is best for islam).

Look at Iran for a good example and how we have been playing this game with their nuclear program. One moment they say they want to cooperate, the next moment the feign offense and withdraw from talks. Duck and dodge ad naseum in order to by time to complete their program. That would be justified under "al takia" (taqiya, taqiyah, tuqyah??? :dunno:).

Geko45
08-19-2012, 10:25
This is the core of Islamic doctrine: Muslims want every inch of earth to be an Islamic state.

Yeah, but christianity has the great commission and that has been intepreted as justification for both peaceful and violent means at various points in history.

The only real difference is that islam is currently going through one of its more violent periods and christianity is not, but those may flip flop again in the future.

snowbird
08-19-2012, 10:42
More on the West's dismal leadership in these latter days: Obama got elected only 8 years after 9/11, hasn't proved that he is Constitutionally qualified to be in our White House (in fact, he's spent millions concealing his most of his records), has run up our already high national debt to ruinous levels, ignored our Constitution, treats Israel the way the Koran says to treat Jewish people (like feces), same with white Christians who favor keeping the Second Amendment, and has come out of the closet in favor of special treatment for 'gays'. Come November, let's have some R&R (hint: president and vice-president).:)

The Bible predicts that anti-Christians will get to the point where they have nearly absolute power on the entire earth, but they won't reach the gates of Heaven. When Jesus comes at the head of His army, the great deceiver will be thrown into the deepest pit, along with all of his followers. But 'no man knows when the Son of Man will return'. Nationally, we have to chose between chaos (disintegration, judgement) or revival (turning back to Christ, discipline).

Meanwhile, there is some good news today: 6 Muslim jihadists were killed August 17 while fighting the Philippines military in Cotabato. Fight the power.

snowbird
08-19-2012, 11:00
Yeah, but christianity has the great commission, and that has been intepreted as justification for both peaceful and violent means at various points in history.

The only real difference, is that islam is currently going through one of its more violent periods and christianity is not, but those may flip flop again in the future.

Nonsense.

The Great Commission is to go out and PREACH the gospel (WORDS), not to offer people the choice of 'convert or die' (the SWORD), which is Islam's way. The Bible says, if people reject the gospel, just shake the dust of that town off your shoes and move on. No violence. Christians may only resort to violence as last-resort self-defense -that's why Jesus okayed buying a sword or two.

SOME Christians, fallible humans that they were, did resort to unjust violence, but they did so AGAINST Christ's teachings. In Islam, Mohammed and Allah commanded the unjust violence (jihad); it's the only sure way to get into Islamic paradise and collect your 72 virgins. Since you appear to be apologizing for Islam, tell us, does a Muslim woman get 72 gigoloes? If not, why not? Immoral? Isn't fornicating with 72 virgins immoral too? Not to mention the highly immoral act of killing people for not converting to your religion or philosophy (think Marxism).

Bottom line: you are putting forth the false 'moral equivalence' argument, saying Christianity 'is just as bad as' Islam, which is nonsense.

Kingarthurhk
08-19-2012, 12:35
You're gonna have to stop using terms like "dhimmis" if you want to be able to raise that flag and not sound like a hypocrite.

That is a proper term, though no one is using it correctly. It simply means "People of the Book," namely, Christians.

This has nothing to do at all with sympathizers or Atheism.

Geko45
08-19-2012, 13:05
That is a proper term, though no one is using it correctly. It simply means "People of the Book," namely, Christians.

This has nothing to do at all with sympathizers or Atheism.

I am aware of its actual meaning, but I would submit that he is using it to mean sympathizers with islam not atheism.

Geko45
08-19-2012, 13:44
Bottom line: you are putting forth the false 'moral equivalence' argument, saying Christianity 'is just as bad as' Islam, which is nonsense.

Pretty sure I admitted that islam was going through a violent period in our present time. My point was that most organized religions have had a similar phase at some point in their past and will likely again if given enough time. Which is why the entire concept of religion (and more generally believing you know what is best for others) is a very dangerous one. Your problem is that, while obviously familiar with historical events, you've failed to learned the relevant lessons it has to offer.

Kingarthurhk
08-19-2012, 18:02
I am aware of its actual meaning, but I would submit that he is using it to mean sympathizers with islam not atheism.

I suspect in the context of these forums he is at least implying both. As he assumes that all Atheists sympathize with Islam, and all liberals sympathize with Islam and is using the term very much incorrectly.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 18:46
Ad homs, character assassination, and name-calling. Was I the one who wrote, "You sir, are a liar and a traitor." and then completely failed to back the accusation when challenged? No. That was you.
That's all lying leftists have to rebut solid facts and logical arguments (see the long list of Muslim atrocities in Post #27). The sad thing is, solid facts and logical arguments fall on deaf leftist ears. Again, you make accusations which you will utterly fail to support, because that's the only tactic available to you. You claim to have facts, but fail to address the fact that one person with a certain characteristic doing something wrong doesn't indict everyone with that same characteristic. In fact, you explicitly reject such groupings, except in the case of Islam. That's the very definition of bigotry.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 21:10
Well, I guess I should qualify that statement with "radical" islamic countries. You have the general idea correct, what it is supposed to be is an allowance for a muslim to conceal or even lie about their faith in order to avoid persecution. For instance, they are in a foreign country and they are arrested and told "renounce islam or die". They can renounce it and not be condemnded in the eyes of allah.

Radical islam distorts the concept (in a similar manner that it distorts pretty much all major islamic tenets) to a point where just about any untruth may be told to infidels in order to further islam (and of course, the liar is the one that gets to decide what they think is best for islam).

Look at Iran for a good example and how we have been playing this game with their nuclear program. One moment they say they want to cooperate, the next moment the feign offense and withdraw from talks. Duck and dodge ad naseum in order to by time to complete their program. That would be justified under "al takia" (taqiya, taqiyah, tuqyah??? :dunno:).
Has Iran actually justified their actions with reference to Taqiyya? I have seen the accusation made, but only by people like snowbird, not with any kind of reference to statements by actual Iranian diplomats or government officials.

cowboywannabe
08-19-2012, 21:23
rationalize it all you want, but the fact is since man has become "civilized"; muslims are the only religeous people whom have murdered people in mass in the name of their faith.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 21:27
Nothing 'iffy' about it.

As of today, Muslims have committed 19,473 crimes (deadly attacks) just since 9/11. 19,473 over eleven years out of a population of 1.6 Billion. What's the percentage on that?
These aren't ordinary crimes, where a lustful lout commits rape, or a greedy, lazy creep commits robbery, or someone with anger issues commits murder. Those kinds of crime can happen among any religious group or any non-religious group. But for devout Muslims, these jihad crimes are perfectly okay, because according to their Islamic ethics, Islam conquering the world by whatever means is the way their Allah wants it. You have documentation for this for all 19,473 instances on your list? The kind of religion based violence you're claiming never happens with any other faith?
A Muslim warlord in Mali has shown far more understanding of this geopolitical concept than our university-educated, dhimmi Animal Mother. Omar Ould Hamaha, commander of a Muslim military outfit called 'Defenders of the Faith', said, "When we have finished conquering France, we will come to the USA, we will come to London and conquer the whole world". One guy, who has no legal standing either within or outside Islam to make proclomations says something and you accept it as general Islamic doctrine? Do you do this with all such statements? Does Ann Coulter's "We should invade their countries, kill their leaders and convert them to Christianity." mean that Islamic leaders can cite self-defense in their attacks on US interests?
This is the core of Islamic doctrine: Muslims want every inch of earth to be an Islamic state. Which makes them different from Christianity how exactly?
The 'tiny minority' of violent extremists, such as Omar, are openly saying what the vast majority of 'peaceful' fifth-columnists are secretly thinking. You know this because you're psychic or because all Muslims find you so trustworthy they confide in you?

Or perhaps this is just the fruit of your paranoid fantasies.
Unfortunately, most of the West's 'elite' leaders these days far too closely resemble Animal Mother, You mean they also believe we shouldn't act on what some guy on the internet says all Muslims are thinking but should judge them by their actions?
and therein lies our great danger. These feckless dhimmis and traitors will put out the welcome mat for the Omars, and they will, as AM demonstrates so often, call any plucky counterjihadists standing up for freedom, "bigots".:upeyes:Mali is part of the West now? I know you fantasize about yourself being a counterjihadist, we get that. Sadly, as has been so frequently demonstrated, your fantasies bear little or no relation to reality.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 21:28
rationalize it all you want, but the fact is since man has become "civilized"; muslims are the only religeous people whom have murdered people in mass in the name of their faith.
When do you set the date of this supposed "civilization"? Unless it's within the last decade, you're demonstrably wrong.

Geko45
08-19-2012, 21:28
Has Iran actually justified their actions with reference to Taqiyya? I have seen the accusation made, but only by people like snowbird, not with any kind of reference to statements by actual Iranian diplomats or government officials.

Well, that's kinda silly. That would never happen. If someone were telling you a lie would you expect them to disclose that they were lying up front? Likewise, an Iranian diplomat would never acknowledge they were employing al taqiyya. It would defeat the purpose.

The important thing to take away from my statements is that this sort of thing is a distortation of islam in much the same way that westboro baptist church distorts christianity. Still, it is a very real problem and another reason why religion is dangerous. It is used to justify so many unethical behaviors.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 21:30
More on the West's dismal leadership in these latter days: Obama got elected only 8 years after 9/11, hasn't proved that he is Constitutionally qualified to be in our White House (in fact, he's spent millions concealing his most of his records), has run up our already high national debt to ruinous levels, ignored our Constitution, treats Israel the way the Koran says to treat Jewish people (like feces), same with white Christians who favor keeping the Second Amendment, and has come out of the closet in favor of special treatment for 'gays'. Come November, let's have some R&R (hint: president and vice-president).:) Stuff like this doesn't help you in your argument against being characterized as demented. The only conspiracy theories you skipped were black helicopters and chemtrails.

The Bible predicts that anti-Christians will get to the point where they have nearly absolute power on the entire earth, but they won't reach the gates of Heaven. When Jesus comes at the head of His army, the great deceiver will be thrown into the deepest pit, along with all of his followers. But 'no man knows when the Son of Man will return'. Nationally, we have to chose between chaos (disintegration, judgement) or revival (turning back to Christ, discipline).
If Jesus is on your side and the events are all pre-ordained, why do you waste so much time whining about it? I've never understood this particular aspect, if you think you already know not only the outcome but the course of events leading up to that outcome, why try to argue against letting events proceed to the conclusion you presumably desire?

cowboywannabe
08-19-2012, 21:36
When do you set the date of this supposed "civilization"? Unless it's within the last decade, you're demonstrably wrong.

lets just use the 1900 year as a mark (the last 112 years). what religeon has openly murdered more people in the name of their religeon?

not muslims killing people for other reasons or catholics killing for political reasons, or communist whom claim no religeon, but the murdering done because they say their "God" tells them to....i think muslims got that wrapped up.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 21:38
Well, that's kinda silly. That would never happen. If someone were telling you a lie would you expect them to disclose that they were lying up front? Likewise, an Iranian diplomat would never acknowledge they were employing al taqiyya. It would defeat the purpose. But a large part of diplomacy is lying. Will Rogers said something along the lines of diplomacy being the art of saying nice doggie until you can find a rock. What differentiates Iran lying about their nuclear program from Israel or Pakistan or North Korea from lying about theirs? How do the actions of Iran constitute taqiyya instead of simple diplomatic deception as practiced by every nation?

The important thing to take away from my statements is that this sort of thing is a distortation of islam in much the same way that westboro baptist church distorts christianity. Still, it is a very real problem and another reason why religion is dangerous. It is used to justify so many unethical behaviors. I don't disagree in the least, but that isn't the position that our dear buddy snowy takes, he doesn't preset the terrorists as a distortion of Islam but as the "real" Islam and thus justifies his ranting hate.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 21:47
lets just use the 1900 year as a mark (the last 112 years). what religeon has openly murdered more people in the name of their religeon? You've changed the question now to more people, before the claim was that only Islam had killed in the name of religion.
not muslims killing people for other reasons or catholics killing for political reasons, or communist whom claim no religeon, but the murdering done because they say their "God" tells them to....i think muslims got that wrapped up. Please cite some specific examples then. Take the 9/11 attacks as an example. What was the justification put forth by the terrorists for their action? They cited Islam certainly, and called attacks a duty of Muslims, but their goals were primarily political, not religious. They launched the attacks not to spread Islam, but supposedly to remove US influence from Muslim lands.

Geko45
08-19-2012, 21:49
What differentiates Iran lying about their nuclear program from Israel or Pakistan or North Korea from lying about theirs?

The book they use to justify their lies, of course.

I don't disagree in the least, but that isn't the position that our dear buddy snowy takes, he doesn't preset the terrorists as a distortion of Islam but as the "real" Islam and thus justifies his ranting hate.

And that is where snowy and I diverge, but I will concede that islam in its present day form is more violent than most other religions. However, given enough time that pendulum will swing back.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 22:10
The book they use to justify their lies, of course. But you've already said they haven't admitted they're lying, so how do we know how those lies would be justified?
And that is where snowy and I diverge, but I will concede that islam in its present day form is more violent than most other religions. However, given enough time that pendulum will swing back. My objection here is perhaps only semantic in nature, but the problem isn't that Islam is violent, it's that some Islamic adherents use their religion to justify the violence they commit. However, from what I've read and seen over the last decade, it's far more often those opposed to Islam who point to the religion as the justification for violent actions and attempt to assign that position to all Muslims.

Geko45
08-19-2012, 22:31
But you've already said they haven't admitted they're lying, so how do we know how those lies would be justified?

Definitely semantics, but what else would they use other than a major tenet of their worldview? I file this under the "obvious" heading. I guess it really hasn't concerned me enough to give it more thought.

My objection here is perhaps only semantic in nature, but the problem isn't that Islam is violent, it's that some Islamic adherents use their religion to justify the violence they commit.

Yes, I think we are in agreement on this.

Animal Mother
08-19-2012, 22:47
Definitely semantics, but what else would they use other than a major tenet of their worldview? I file this under the "obvious" heading. I guess it really hasn't concerned me enough to give it more thought. They'd use the same justification that every diplomat ever has used, that their goal isn't necessarily to tell the truth, it's to do what's best for their nation. My point is that I haven't ever seen an example of takiyya being invoked as a generalized justification for lying by any kind of Muslim religious or political authority. Those claims seem to solely be the practice of folks like snowbird so they can maintain their worldview where Islam plays the role of boogeyman.

Geko45
08-20-2012, 07:01
They'd use the same justification that every diplomat ever has used, that their goal isn't necessarily to tell the truth, it's to do what's best for their nation.

Exactly, islam just has a special nifty name for the practice. You're right though, every major society does this to some degree. The fact that islam has at least codified it actually makes them a bit less hypocritical about it.

snowbird
08-20-2012, 08:33
you make accusations which you will utterly fail to support... You ... the very definition of bigotry.

Blah, blah, blah...'you're a bigot and I'm tolerant'. See any hypocrisy in that statement? Leftists, in fact, don't practice the tolerance that they preach.

For example, the leftist MainStreamMedia. They're highly intolerant of conservative views. They routinely slant their 'news' coverage in this way. It's called political correctness. Another site has thoughtfully outlined some apparent rules of PC:

Christians are generally considered "white", while Muslims are, of course, "brown". So in biased leftist MSM reports,

-WHITE ON WHITE mob violence may be looked at objectively, unless, of course, left-wing or right-wing political views are an issue, in which case, MSM subversively goes with their (deceitfully undeclared, nay, denied) leftist bias

-WHITE ON BROWN mob violence would instantly become headline news, above the fold and at the top of the hour, and remain there for weeks or months. Day after day, front-page analyses would hammer home the racist motives of the perps and the innocence of the victims

-BROWN ON WHITE mob violence must be buried at all costs, according to political correctness. If it simply must be reported, then the race of the perp will be occluded whenever practical. If the facts cannot be avoided, they will be spun to include circumstances that mitigate the racial or religious element, e.g. it was somehow the fault of the white/Christian/Jewish victims through their own racist, inconsiderate, corrupt, or thoughtless behavior

-BROWN ON BROWN mob violence is not really news for the politically correct, including the MSM. Such news would be dropped and forgotten in a day or so.

A recent example? Well, a politically correct outfit, the SPLC (Southern Poverty Law Center), a quarter-billion dollar leftist attack machine funded by George Soros, labeled the conservative Family Research Council a "hate group". So then a gay rights activist shot it up last week. Very Marxist, very Nazi; first you label your opposition "hateful" and "bigoted", to demonize them, to dehumanize them, then you, or an associate, shoots them.

Animal Mother, very politically correct, trusts Muslims to be peaceful. But our troops who have been in Afghanistan recently, don't, and for good reason. Muslims who are supposed to be our friends keep killing our people -7 attacks in 2 weeks now. AM, would you care to tell these soldiers, or the grieving families of jihad-slain soldiers, how it is "bigoted" to not trust Muslims?

Animal Mother
08-20-2012, 10:12
Blah, blah, blah...'you're a bigot and I'm tolerant'. See any hypocrisy in that statement? No, considering its accuracy. I can be tolernat of others and still manage to identify bigotry when I see it.
Leftists, in fact, don't practice the tolerance that they preach. Once again you labor under a delusion.

first you label your opposition "hateful" and "bigoted", to demonize them, to dehumanize them, then you, or an associate, shoots them.Isn't this exactly what you do with Muslims?

Animal Mother, very politically correct, trusts Muslims to be peaceful. But our troops who have been in Afghanistan recently, don't, and for good reason. Muslims who are supposed to be our friends keep killing our people -7 attacks in 2 weeks now. AM, would you care to tell these soldiers, or the grieving families of jihad-slain soldiers, how it is "bigoted" to not trust Muslims? How do you still not get that just citing incidents that happen to reinforce your desired beliefs don't prove those beliefs are accurate. The exact same tactics you use were the staple of the KKK and other racist groups attacking African Americans, which is where I'm guessing you learned the behavior, but it wasn't valid then and it isn't valid now. Muslims who commit crimes should be punished. Muslims who engage in terrorism should be hunted down and stopped. Muslims who just happen to be Muslim should enjoy the same human rights as everyone else and Muslims who are citizens of the United States should share the same protections under the laws that all other citizens possess.

Animal Mother
08-20-2012, 10:22
Exactly, islam just has a special nifty name for the practice. You're right though, every major society does this to some degree. The fact that islam has at least codified it actually makes them a bit less hypocritical about it. That's the point I'm trying to make though, from my understanding it isn't a license to lie without reservation. It's like the practice among Jews in medieval Spain of "converting" to Christianity and continuing to practice Judaism in secret. That's a kind of lying, but it isn't a blanket endorsement of lying in all situations.

snowbird
08-21-2012, 08:14
Muslims who commit crimes should be punished. Muslims who engage in terrorism should be hunted down and stopped. Muslims who just happen to be Muslim should enjoy the same human rights as everyone else and Muslims who are citizens of the United States should share the same protections under the laws that all other citizens possess.

I'm with you on the first 2 sentences.

To proactively prevent more Muslim crimes and terrorism from happening in America, we need to stop Muslim immigration. Continuing to let more of them in guarantees more crime, more violence, more bloodshed of our children. Muslims have no Constitutional right to immigrate here. Letting them come here and wage jihad on our children is treasonous and insane. Why are you?

Your 3rd sentence is a red herring because the fact is, Muslims in Western lands DO have "the same human rights as everyone else". The problem is, they want to impose sharia which takes away everyones' human rights with the possible exception of Muslim males. That is highly unjust. That is tyranny. Sharia is the antithesis of US freedom. Tolerating the intolerant doesn't end well. You keep ignoring real history, the history of Islamic conquests and massacres. You ignore current events; the massacres of Christians in Nigeria, in the Philippines, in Pakistan, in Indonesia, in the Balkans, heck, even in the USA -remember 9/11?

Mohammed was a prophet of war. The Koran is a book of war. Islam is a religion of war. Islam is also a religion of intolerance. Islam is a religion of oppression of women. Islam endorses lying, theft, rape, slave-holding, and murder. Why do you want more of all of this in America?

More Islam = Less Freedom.

Why do you hate freedom?

Animal Mother
08-21-2012, 08:46
I'm with you on the first 2 sentences.

To proactively prevent more Muslim crimes and terrorism from happening in America, we need to stop Muslim immigration. Continuing to let more of them in guarantees more crime, more violence, more bloodshed of our children. Muslims have no Constitutional right to immigrate here. Letting them come here and wage jihad on our children is treasonous and insane. Why are you?

Your 3rd sentence is a red herring because the fact is, Muslims in Western lands DO have "the same human rights as everyone else". The problem is, they want to impose sharia which takes away everyones' human rights with the possible exception of Muslim males. That is highly unjust. That is tyranny. Sharia is the antithesis of US freedom. Tolerating the intolerant doesn't end well. You keep ignoring real history, the history of Islamic conquests and massacres. You ignore current events; the massacres of Christians in Nigeria, in the Philippines, in Pakistan, in Indonesia, in the Balkans, heck, even in the USA -remember 9/11?

Mohammed was a prophet of war. The Koran is a book of war. Islam is a religion of war. Islam is also a religion of intolerance. Islam is a religion of oppression of women. Islam endorses lying, theft, rape, slave-holding, and murder. Why do you want more of all of this in America?

More Islam = Less Freedom.

Why do you hate freedom?

Your ability to believe two completely contradictory things at the same time is worthy of Minitrue. You claim to want to defend freedom but will happily deny it to anyone different from you. You repeat stereotypical arguments so hackneyed that I'm continually on the edge of concluding it must all be just a massive ongoing satire, but then I worry that you actually sincerely believe it.

snowbird
08-21-2012, 14:20
You claim to want to defend freedom but will happily deny it to anyone different from you.

Goebbels would be proud of your socialist obfuscation and deception.

What I really said is... now listen closely... tolerating intolerance doesn't end well. Stopping intolerant Muslim immigration and hence preempting massive amounts of bloody, tyrannical Muslim crime, jihad terrorism, and genocide, does NOT constitute "denying freedom to anyone different from you".

Repeat after me, Muslims have NO Constitutional right to immigrate to the USA and impose their sharia here. They can keep their jihad and sharia in their own benighted territories, until your much ballyhooed "vast majority of peaceful Muslims" can bring the "tiny minority of extremists" to heel.

Of course, I don't really think such factual material and logic will penetrate your shields of hardened hatred of America and of all that's good or decent. I expect you'll just disgorge more Christophobic, anti-freedom ad homs.:upeyes:

Schabesbert
08-21-2012, 15:13
That is a proper term, though no one is using it correctly. It simply means "People of the Book," namely, Christians.

Who told you that?

That is NOT the meaning of the word.

DHIMMI (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dhimmi#French)
Etymology
From French dhimmi, from Arabic ذمي‎ (dhimmi, “a dhimmi”), from ذمة‎ (dhimma, “protection, custody”), from ذم‎ (dhamma, “to blame”)

1.A protected and specially taxed status of certain non-Muslim subjects of a state governed in accordance with sharia law, under dhimma, a form of social contract.

Kingarthurhk
08-21-2012, 17:26
Who told you that?

That is NOT the meaning of the word.

DHIMMI (http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/dhimmi#French)
Etymology
From French dhimmi, from Arabic ذمي‎ (dhimmi, “a dhimmi”), from ذمة‎ (dhimma, “protection, custody”), from ذم‎ (dhamma, “to blame”)

1.A protected and specially taxed status of certain non-Muslim subjects of a state governed in accordance with sharia law, under dhimma, a form of social contract.


A history book. Feel free to pick up one sometime. You might be amazed. Back durring the kingdoms of Aragon and Castille in Moorish occupied Spain, this was a term the Saracens used to describe the Non-Muslims, e.g.,Chirstians, living in their controlled territory.

I know you are taught to view them all as heretics, but try to look at it objectively.

Animal Mother
08-21-2012, 19:09
Goebbels would be proud of your socialist obfuscation and deception.It's sad enough that you're so consistently wrong but you could at least be original.


What I really said is... now listen closely... tolerating intolerance doesn't end well. Stopping intolerant Muslim immigration and hence preempting massive amounts of bloody, tyrannical Muslim crime, jihad terrorism, and genocide, does NOT constitute "denying freedom to anyone different from you".

Repeat after me, Muslims have NO Constitutional right to immigrate to the USA and impose their sharia here. They can keep their jihad and sharia in their own benighted territories, until your much ballyhooed "vast majority of peaceful Muslims" can bring the "tiny minority of extremists" to heel.

Of course, I don't really think such factual material and logic will penetrate your shields of hardened hatred of America and of all that's good or decent. I expect you'll just disgorge more Christophobic, anti-freedom ad homs.:upeyes:
Defend your claim that all Muslim immigrants desire or intend to impose sharia or jihad. I suspect, as is your standard practice, you'll simply spew out other accusations and baseless claims, but why don't you give it a shot?

Schabesbert
08-22-2012, 07:23
A history book. Feel free to pick up one sometime. You might be amazed. Back durring the kingdoms of Aragon and Castille in Moorish occupied Spain, this was a term the Saracens used to describe the Non-Muslims, e.g.,Chirstians, living in their controlled territory.
You've got yet another problem with logic.

You equate all Non-Muslims to Chirstians[sic].

Of course, those without befuddled minds know this isn't the case.

snowbird
08-22-2012, 09:51
Defend your claim that all Muslim immigrants desire or intend to impose sharia or jihad.

First, you're putting words in my mouth (imagine my shock at a leftist lying -okay, now sarcasm off). I didn't claim that ALL Muslim immigrants desire sharia and jihad. Some of them came here to get away from that.

But where are the street demonstrations by these people AGAINST the likes of Anjem Choudary?

He is a UK Muslim who holds frequent street demonstrations calling FOR sharia law to be imposed on the UK, all of Europe, and America. He said, "I am 100% certain that the sharia will be implemented in America and in Britain one day". He is unapologetic about what that means, "If people are afraid of having their hands cut, don't steal. If you don't want to be stoned to death, don't commit adultery."

(Why are libs supporting this? It's against some of their favorite pastimes:))

Anyway, Choudary's ideas have inspired some Western Muslims to spawn groups such as, "Sharia4UK", "Sharia4Holland", "Sharia4Belgium", and, "we have the 'Sharia4America' project". Another pro-sharia group of Western Muslims is the Hizb Ut-Tahrir America, in the Chicago area.

Choudary admits that Western Muslims are (mostly -we DO get occasional Sudden Jihad Syndrome attacks all too often) not fighting infidels in the West just now, but doesn't rule out offensive jihad in the future. "If we have enough authority and we have enough power, then we are obliged as Muslims to take the authority away from those who have it and implement sharia".

In other words, if we keep letting them immigrate here, as Animal Mother wants, then subversion and civil war is guaranteed for ours and our children's future. Leftist dhimmis, including Animal Mother, the Demokkkrats and their illegal president, are a clear and present danger to our nation.

Kingarthurhk
08-22-2012, 17:10
You've got yet another problem with logic.

You equate all Non-Muslims to Chirstians[sic].

Of course, those without befuddled minds know this isn't the case.

I will repeat this once again:

Durring the fractured era of Spain durring the kingdoms of Aragon and Castille there was a Moorish occupation of Saracens. It is why there are a lot of Arabic words in Spanish, and some derivations as well. Incidentally to that, Christians who lived in Saracen controlled territory were referred to as "Dhimis" or "People of the Book".

Again, all you see is blah, blah, blah, heretic, heretic, heretic.

However, history is richer than that.

Schabesbert
08-22-2012, 17:52
I will repeat this once again:
You can repeat it as many times as you'd like; it still doesn't make it true.

I know you were trained to believe that repetition makes something true, but that training is what propaganda is about, not truth.

Durring the fractured era of Spain durring the kingdoms of Aragon and Castille there was a Moorish occupation of Saracens. It is why there are a lot of Arabic words in Spanish, and some derivations as well. Incidentally to that, Christians who lived in Saracen controlled territory were referred to as "Dhimis" or "People of the Book".
Interesting assertion, though devoid of factual information.
Plese note that I provided an actual reference in post 65 above. Doesn't mean what you assert it to mean.

Childish rant from the king to follow (showing again that he's frustrated on being called for his utter ignorance):
Again, all you see is blah, blah, blah, heretic, heretic, heretic.

However, history is richer than that.

Animal Mother
08-22-2012, 21:30
First, you're putting words in my mouth (imagine my shock at a leftist lying -okay, now sarcasm off). I didn't claim that ALL Muslim immigrants desire sharia and jihad. Some of them came here to get away from that. You mean, you didn't write, I advocate self-defense for free Americans, including stopping all Muslim immigration or
Do American Muslims share those same rights you claim to defend?
No.

They certainly look like your posts.
But where are the street demonstrations by these people AGAINST the likes of Anjem Choudary?

He is a UK Muslim who holds frequent street demonstrations calling FOR sharia law to be imposed on the UK, all of Europe, and America. He said, "I am 100% certain that the sharia will be implemented in America and in Britain one day". He is unapologetic about what that means, "If people are afraid of having their hands cut, don't steal. If you don't want to be stoned to death, don't commit adultery." Laws based on religion are bad. See? Something we agree on. Do you protest as vocally when American political candidates make the false claim that our Constitution is based on the Bible? If so I must have missed those posts.
In other words, if we keep letting them immigrate here, as Animal Mother wants, then subversion and civil war is guaranteed for ours and our children's future. Leftist dhimmis, including Animal Mother, the Demokkkrats and their illegal president, are a clear and present danger to our nation. Because of your fears of something that is not only unlikely to ever happen but completely at odds with the Constitution and whole body of US law, we should discard that same Constitution's protections and start discriminating against people based solely on their religion? It's disturbing that you don't see the inherent contradictory nature of your position. Do you also believe that we've always been at war with Eastasia?

snowbird
08-24-2012, 05:29
...at odds with the Constitution and whole body of US law, we should discard that same Constitution's protections and start discriminating against people based solely on their religion?

I favor stopping Muslim immigration until they demonstrate, back in the foreign lands where they constitute the majority of the population, that they reject sharia with its grotesquely inhuman cruelty against non-Muslims and females.

Can you show where our Constitution and "whole body of US law" commands that we must allow non-assimilating, foreign, anti-freedom people to immigrate here?

Animal Mother
08-24-2012, 06:00
I favor stopping Muslim immigration until they demonstrate, back in the foreign lands where they constitute the majority of the population, that they reject sharia with its grotesquely inhuman cruelty against non-Muslims and females. How does that address your willingness to deny rights to American citizens who happen to be Muslim?
Can you show where our Constitution and "whole body of US law" commands that we must allow non-assimilating, foreign, anti-freedom people to immigrate here? You've already admitted that doesn't describe all Muslims, and it doesn't describe the vast majority of Muslims any more than it does ethnic groups of any other description. But maybe you want to go farther and deny immigration to the Irish because of the Troubles or to Africans because of the Rwandan genocide and the ongoing violence that ravages that continent. The people of Uganda haven't put down the LRA, so they must (by your reasoning) support its actions and goals, so they're out too. The Chinese haven't overthrown their Communist government and we know how you feel about Communism, so it's safe to assume you'd exclude them too. Just to be clear, who should be allowed to immigrate to the US in your perfect world?

snowbird
08-24-2012, 06:18
...it doesn't describe the vast majority of Muslims...

...then how come today's total of deadly Muslim attacks, just since 9/11, has now soared to 19,488?

P.S. I notice that you were unable to show that part of the Constitution requested, proving that your argument is, let's just say, "buffalo bagels".

Animal Mother
08-24-2012, 08:43
...then how come today's total of deadly Muslim attacks, just since 9/11, has now soared to 19,488? 19,488 over a period of ten years among a population of 1.6 Billion. Are you unclear on the meaning of "majority"?
P.S. I notice that you were unable to show that part of the Constitution requested, proving that your argument is, let's just say, "buffalo bagels".So if I fail to answer an incredibly biased question, my argument is invalid? What does that portend for all the direct questions you've failed to address over the years? To answer your question (you should try it some time you might like it) they don't say any such thing, but then no one is advocating allowing anti-freedom proponents to immigrate either, which truly does render your "point" moot.

snowbird
08-24-2012, 09:21
19,488 over a period of ten years among a population of 1.6 Billion. Are you unclear on the meaning of "majority"?


Are you unclear on the meaning of "clear and present danger"? It stems from the meaning of the Koranic, "slay the infidel".

Your 'progressive' theory of letting Muslims immigrate en masse has been tried and found wanting. In leftist Europe, in the city of Hamburg, at least one serious incident involving rape or other violence occurred EVERY SINGLE DAY last year in the schools of Hamburg.

For example, a 15-year-old student tried to intervene in a dispute between 2 classmates. For his trouble, he got stabbed in the back with a pair of scissors. The backstabber's name was...wait for it...Abdoul. Not a German name.

Thirty years ago, before the effects of insane leftist immigration policies set in, this type of thing didn't happen. Why do you shill for it to happen here too (that's what your constant counterjihadist-bashing with smears of "bigot", amounts to)?

Kingarthurhk
08-24-2012, 18:43
Are you unclear on the meaning of "clear and present danger"? It stems from the meaning of the Koranic, "slay the infidel".

Your 'progressive' theory of letting Muslims immigrate en masse has been tried and found wanting. In leftist Europe, in the city of Hamburg, at least one serious incident involving rape or other violence occurred EVERY SINGLE DAY last year in the schools of Hamburg.

For example, a 15-year-old student tried to intervene in a dispute between 2 classmates. For his trouble, he got stabbed in the back with a pair of scissors. The backstabber's name was...wait for it...Abdoul. Not a German name.


Paula? Perhaps she was upset about being off American Idol?

http://coedmagazine.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/crazy-woman.jpg

:supergrin:

Animal Mother
08-24-2012, 21:10
Are you unclear on the meaning of "clear and present danger"? It stems from the meaning of the Koranic, "slay the infidel". Still not answering direct questions? Shocking. Just shocking.
Your 'progressive' theory of letting Muslims immigrate en masse has been tried and found wanting. In leftist Europe, in the city of Hamburg, at least one serious incident involving rape or other violence occurred EVERY SINGLE DAY last year in the schools of Hamburg. And that's different from the schools of say Philadelphia how exactly?
For example, a 15-year-old student tried to intervene in a dispute between 2 classmates. For his trouble, he got stabbed in the back with a pair of scissors. The backstabber's name was...wait for it...Abdoul. Not a German name. Are you claiming that all violence in German schools is the result of people named Abdoul?
Thirty years ago, before the effects of insane leftist immigration policies set in, this type of thing didn't happen. Why do you shill for it to happen here too (that's what your constant counterjihadist-bashing with smears of "bigot", amounts to)?Be honest, the Germany you dream of died 67 years ago.

snowbird
08-25-2012, 06:56
You obviously need some tutoring in Social Studies. And you're in luck, because here it is, gratis.

First, Philadelphia isn't in Germany. Consult any globe of the world made in the last 300 years.

Second, get some remedial Reading Comprehension. Then you will understand that the passage disclosed that Abdoul only did that day's backstabbing. The violence of hundreds of other days was done, no doubt, by the likes of Mohammed, Ahmed, Rashid, Farook, etc.

Third, quibbling about exactly how long the West has been suffering under leftist 'elites' insane social engineering, whether it be 30 years or 67 years, isn't the point. The point is, we're going downhill at an ever-accelerating rate, like a truck of dynamite with no brakes careening down a twisting mountain road, thanks to 'progressive' mismanagement.

I'm old enough to remember boyhood in the 1950s. Although maybe the germs of leftist disease had already been sown, the results back then were not yet apparent. The 50s were happy halycon days compared to today.

We urgently need to repent and change direction. That can't come too soon.

Animal Mother
08-25-2012, 07:44
You obviously need some tutoring in Social Studies. And you're in luck, because here it is, gratis. Oh, goody.
First, Philadelphia isn't in Germany. Consult any globe of the world made in the last 300 years. Nothing slips by you, does it? Are you under the impression that Philadelphia was in Germany 300 years ago.
Second, get some remedial Reading Comprehension. Still stealing my lines.
Then you will understand that the passage disclosed that Abdoul only did that day's backstabbing. The violence of hundreds of other days was done, no doubt, by the likes of Mohammed, Ahmed, Rashid, Farook, etc. And you have evidence of this? No? Shocking.
Third, quibbling about exactly how long the West has been suffering under leftist 'elites' insane social engineering, whether it be 30 years or 67 years, isn't the point. The point is, we're going downhill at an ever-accelerating rate, like a truck of dynamite with no brakes careening down a twisting mountain road, thanks to 'progressive' mismanagement. Then you admit you see the time since the fall of the Nazi regime as a period of "going downhill" for Germany. Got it. Thanks for the social studies lesson.
I'm old enough to remember boyhood in the 1950s. Back when you, Pa and the gang would put on your robes and burn a cross or two?
Although maybe the germs of leftist disease had already been sown, the results back then were not yet apparent. The 50s were happy halycon days compared to today. Shall we ask some African Americans about that?
We urgently need to repent and change direction. That can't come too soon. The crux of your "social studies" lesson is that you pine for the good old days when hating different people just for being different was a good thing. Got it.

snowbird
08-26-2012, 17:37
The crux of your "social studies" lesson is that you pine for the good old days when hating different people just for being different was a good thing.

Well, Muslims who murder members of my alma mater, the US Army, certainly are, I'll grant you, "different from" me.

In recent weeks there have been an increasing number of supposedly friendly Muslims, in Afghan Army or Police Uniform, who treacherously shoot Americans in the back. This behavior of theirs is endorsed by their religion. Should I hate them for that? No. Christians are to hate the sin (and I do hate Islam), but love the sinner. So I pray that they will see the light and convert.

Should I take dhimmis' word for it that Islam is all about peace and love, and that anyone thinking otherwise must be a "bigot"? Should I forget all about keeping a wary eye on them because if I don't, some lefty will call me 'Islamophobic'?

Back in the good old 1950s there were a couple of groups whose holy books (Koran and Das Kapital) called for the hated of others for being different. Members of these groups were (and still are) called Muslims and communists, respectively. Back then though, there were millions fewer of the Muslims in our country, and there were never incidents such as Fort Hood. And the communists felt less emboldened back then too -they wouldn't have tried to "Occupy Wall Street" in the 1950s. The haters didn't have as much power.

So, yeah, I still say the 1950s were better.

Kingarthurhk
08-26-2012, 18:00
Well, Muslims who murder members of my alma mater, the US Army, certainly are, I'll grant you, "different from" me.

You graduated from the Army? I had no idea they had a University. At any rate, I can you use the same argument you are using. Mexican Nationals are by-in-large Catholics. Mexican Nationals have murdered Border Patrol Agents. Therefore, all Catholics murder Law Enforcement.

I hope you can see the flaw in that statement, and then perhaps the flaw in your own argument as well.

Animal Mother
08-26-2012, 21:30
Well, Muslims who murder members of my alma mater, the US Army, certainly are, I'll grant you, "different from" me. Are non-Muslims who murder members of your "alma mater" not different from you?
In recent weeks there have been an increasing number of supposedly friendly Muslims, in Afghan Army or Police Uniform, who treacherously shoot Americans in the back. This behavior of theirs is endorsed by their religion. No, it isn't.
Should I hate them for that? No. Christians are to hate the sin (and I do hate Islam), but love the sinner. So I pray that they will see the light and convert. So the person taking the actual action is all good in your book, but the religion (which you constantly misrepresent) is bad. Interesting.
Should I take dhimmis' word for it that Islam is all about peace and love, and that anyone thinking otherwise must be a "bigot"? Should I forget all about keeping a wary eye on them because if I don't, some lefty will call me 'Islamophobic'? Should you try to stop lumping everyone into a single group and then hating them? It would certainly be nice, but I don't think anyone expects it from you.
Back in the good old 1950s there were a couple of groups whose holy books (Koran and Das Kapital) called for the hated of others for being different. Members of these groups were (and still are) called Muslims and communists, respectively. Back then though, there were millions fewer of the Muslims in our country, and there were never incidents such as Fort Hood. And the communists felt less emboldened back then too -they wouldn't have tried to "Occupy Wall Street" in the 1950s. The haters didn't have as much power.

So, yeah, I still say the 1950s were better.I'm sure you do, and if it hadn't been for liberals like Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King jr., and the Little Rock Nine, you could still be living in that paradise. How dare they think they had rights too.

Animal Mother
08-26-2012, 21:31
You graduated from the Army? I had no idea they had a University. The National War College. There's West Point also, of course, but both those institutions teach critical thinking so it's unlikely snowbird attended either.

snowbird
08-27-2012, 08:39
stop lumping everyone into a single group and then hating them

This message definitely needs to get out. But to whom?

Another Muslim Afghan soldier "ally" just murdered 2 more US troops. That makes 12 this month. I guess Ostrich would upbraid them, if he could, for not respecting Islam enough, or for being "bigots" maybe:upeyes:. (Please cite where Christians do this).

The Muslim Taliban just beheaded 17 (15 men and 2 women) for attending a mixed-sex party with music and dancing. Ostrich seems to agree with Islam that attending parties with girls, music and dancing is verboten, but beheading attendees is okay, because "Christians do it too all the time":upeyes: (Please cite where Christians have done this).

In Muslim Iran, hundreds of girls under the age of 10 are married, but Ostrich says it's "hateful" to notice this.:upeyes: (Please tell about all those Christian girls under 10 who are married).

And in Sderot, Israel, Muslims fired rockets into town, trying to kill more civilian Jews for Allah. I know, I know, 'just because a Muslim has a rocket pointed at Israel, has an imam reading the Koran into his ear saying "slay the infidel", and is holding a Bick lighter near the fuse, doesn't mean he's actually going to fire it'. Suspecting that he might is "lumping everyone into a single group and then hating them".:upeyes: (You know the drill, Ostrich; cite where Christians are firing rockets into crowds of civilians in their homes).



One of the big differences that the Ostriches of today fail to look at between the Bible and the Koran is that the Koran allows for no abrogation or enlightenment from its original text. So Muslim believers are locked into crazy old hateful Mohammed's murderous malevolence.

snowbird
08-27-2012, 09:04
You graduated from the Army?

Yes, they have this thing called Basic Training.

There was Fire Watch duty in the quiet sleeping barracks right from the first nights in the Reception Center. In the stillness, I kept hearing this occasional beautiful sound, but it took awhile before I could recognize it. It was the sound of distant ocean surf crashing on a beach, which found its way through the pines into our windows.

It also involved running in combat boots, toting an M-14, out to the rifle range by the sea. And there were lectures, covering subjects such as battlefield First Aid, with us sitting in bleachers among hills with sere brown grass.

Graduation, for me at least, was a fine, memorable event. That day, with the band playing, the American flags, families and friends in the bleachers around the parade ground watching...is a dearer memory than the receipt, years later, courtesy of the GI Bill, of that BA Degree.

Animal Mother
08-27-2012, 10:17
This message definitely needs to get out. But to whom? To you. Was I somehow unclear about that?
One of the big differences that the Ostriches of today fail to look at between the Bible and the Koran is that the Koran allows for no abrogation or enlightenment from its original text. So Muslim believers are locked into crazy old hateful Mohammed's murderous malevolence.Are you saying that parts of the Bible incompatible with the modern world should be discarded?

snowbird
08-27-2012, 12:05
Are you saying that parts of the Bible incompatible with the modern world should be discarded?

Evidently you're still failing your remedial Reading Comprehension classes.

No, I didn't say what you said.

Now when can we expect all of those citations requested to back up your endless claims of moral equivalence between Christianity and Islam? You DO have reams of evidence concerning Christians shooting people in the back for Jesus, Christians beheading boys and girls for partying together, hundreds of Christian men being married to little girls under age 10, and Christians firing rockets into civilian homes in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, DON'T you?

Surely your silence isn't an admission that you have no such evidence (because there is none), is it? In other words, you've been lying all along, in support of the West's age-old mortal enemy, Islamic imperialism?

Say it ain't so!

Animal Mother
08-30-2012, 03:23
Evidently you're still failing your remedial Reading Comprehension classes.

No, I didn't say what you said. To use your words, does the Bible allow for "abrogation or enlightenment from its original text"?
Now when can we expect all of those citations requested to back up your endless claims of moral equivalence between Christianity and Islam? Where have I made such a claim? On the other hand, when I have claimed parallels, I've provided the relevant Biblical verses, which you've then discarded as no longer relevant.
You DO have reams of evidence concerning Christians shooting people in the back for Jesus, Christians beheading boys and girls for partying together, hundreds of Christian men being married to little girls under age 10, and Christians firing rockets into civilian homes in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, DON'T you? Serbia. 1990s. You're welcome. Now then, could you quote the surah that orders any of these things? No? So much for that argument.
Surely your silence isn't an admission that you have no such evidence (because there is none), is it? In other words, you've been lying all along, in support of the West's age-old mortal enemy, Islamic imperialism? You mean that every time you fail to answer a direct question, it's an admission that you don't have the evidence to support your claims? Very interesting.

snowbird
08-30-2012, 06:58
Serbia. 1990s.

When and where did Serb Christians ever behead boys and girls for partying together?

Can you name even ONE Serbian Christian man who is married to little girl under 10?

Pardon my skepticism, but I don't believe Serbian Christians ever fired rockets into civilian homes in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost.

Not do I believe Serbian Christians shot anybody in the back for Jesus.

Sorry, but I'm going to have to call 'buffalo bagels' on your Christophobic nonsense.

Animal Mother
08-30-2012, 11:14
Sorry, but I'm going to have to call 'buffalo bagels' on your Christophobic nonsense. You failed to produce any orders from the Qur'an to commit any of these acts, thus I'm forced to conclude you are fully aware that the actions have nothing to do with Islam.

snowbird
08-31-2012, 07:32
You failed to produce any orders from the Qur'an to commit any of these acts, thus ... the actions have nothing to do with Islam.

Thousands of ongoing Muslim atrocities every day trip up, and put the lie to your fallacious "logic", I'm afraid. But we've come to expect such mountebank mirages from Muslim misrepresenters and communist counterfeiters.

Animal Mother
08-31-2012, 08:38
Thousands of ongoing Muslim atrocities every day trip up, and put the lie to your fallacious "logic", I'm afraid. But we've come to expect such mountebank mirages from Muslim misrepresenters and communist counterfeiters.
Still no references from the Qur'an. Still attempting to substitute lies and prevarication for facts. I just wish it was still surprising.

snowbird
08-31-2012, 09:38
Still attempting to substitute lies and prevarication for facts.

Yes, this the Left's SOP (standard operating procedure), as you demonstrate daily.

An example (not on the Muslim topic of this thread, but illustrative of the left's dishonesty):

A U. of Texas at Austin study found that 'gay' family children are more troubled (unemployed, less healthy, more depressed, more likely to cheat on a spouse or partner, smoke more pot, have trouble with the law...) than children from traditional mom-and-dad households.

Of course, liberal fascists immediately claimed "scientific misconduct", but the school Research Integrity Office found otherwise. "None of the allegations...was substantiated".

Case closed.

Animal Mother
08-31-2012, 18:33
Yes, this the Left's SOP (standard operating procedure), as you demonstrate daily. Then it should be a simple matter for you to post examples of my falsehoods. Yet when challenged you consistently fail to do so, what can we conclude from that?


An example (not on the Muslim topic of this thread, but illustrative of the left's dishonesty):

A U. of Texas at Austin study found that 'gay' family children are more troubled (unemployed, less healthy, more depressed, more likely to cheat on a spouse or partner, smoke more pot, have trouble with the law...) than children from traditional mom-and-dad households.

Of course, liberal fascists immediately claimed "scientific misconduct", but the school Research Integrity Office found otherwise. "None of the allegations...was substantiated".

Case closed. Yes, it is. You've provided yet another example of going off on a tangent rather than defending your completely baseless claims.

Kingarthurhk
08-31-2012, 18:58
Yes, they have this thing called Basic Training.

There was Fire Watch duty in the quiet sleeping barracks right from the first nights in the Reception Center. In the stillness, I kept hearing this occasional beautiful sound, but it took awhile before I could recognize it. It was the sound of distant ocean surf crashing on a beach, which found its way through the pines into our windows.

It also involved running in combat boots, toting an M-14, out to the rifle range by the sea. And there were lectures, covering subjects such as battlefield First Aid, with us sitting in bleachers among hills with sere brown grass.

Graduation, for me at least, was a fine, memorable event. That day, with the band playing, the American flags, families and friends in the bleachers around the parade ground watching...is a dearer memory than the receipt, years later, courtesy of the GI Bill, of that BA Degree.

Alma Mater implies at least a college degree gained from an institution of higher learning. It would be better to say you graduated from basic training. The same way I graduated from 4 different LEO acadamies. However, my Alma Mater is not either of those things. My Alma Mater is NMSU. I also graduated Summa Cum Laude btw. That was the basis of endless jokes in post grad.

snowbird
09-01-2012, 08:03
Then it should be a simple matter for you to post examples of my falsehoods... your completely baseless claims.

Typical leftist Alinsky deceptive obfuscation and Clintonesque semantic nonsense (define what 'is' is:upeyes:) permeate all of your posts, both in defense of Islam, and in attack against Christianity and traditional America.

You often repeat that 'the Constitution protects Islam'. And Islam keeps murdering us. Today's total of deadly Muslim attacks has reached 19,534.

Today, on a US-run military base in Afghanistan, Muslims just killed 12 more with suicide bombs. Someone observed, "Rasool Obama and the Generals obviously are not apologizing hard enough...weak apologies are seen as arrogance and disrespect...especially when no check is attached..."

Muslims in Afghanistan also just got done beheading another child. Was it Taliban Muslims warning what happens to those who work with the government? Or was it the 6-year-old girl's Muslim family, peeved over some 'honor' issue? (Did some of her hair peek out of her hijab? Did she burn her 82-year-old husband's dinner? Whatever, Animal Mother prevaricates that our Constitution requires that we just get used to this kind of stuff happening here too, soon:upeyes:)

In Narathiwat, Thailand, Muslim bombers just tore the legs off of 2 plantation workers. It is "bigoted" to even dream of trying to stop this from coming to America too, according to Animal Mother.:upeyes:

Animal Mother
09-01-2012, 17:07
Typical leftist Alinsky deceptive obfuscation and Clintonesque semantic nonsense (define what 'is' is:upeyes:) permeate all of your posts, both in defense of Islam, and in attack against Christianity and traditional America. How exactly have I attacked traditional America?
You often repeat that 'the Constitution protects Islam'. Because it does.
And Islam keeps murdering us. That's as absurd as saying "guns keep murdering us", but maybe you believe that also.

snowbird
09-02-2012, 07:59
How exactly have I attacked traditional America?

Well, one of many ways, has been your repeated claims that I misuse the word takiyya. Listening to a traitor like you, folks might think Muslims can be trusted to always be loyal Americans, which, of course, is your deceptive intention.

In the Pakistani blasphemy case involving the 11-year-old Christian girl, it turns out that a Muslim CLERIC (aren't clerics supposed to be holier? more righteous?) framed this girl by planting pages of the Koran among the papers she burned.

And where did your Muslim cleric get these Koran pages? Did he desecrate a Koran by tearing out pages? If a book is god and bad treatment of it equals blasphemy, then shouldn't your Muslim cleric be executed for pre-meditated blasphemy? Or will he get excused because he was temporarily taken over by a jinn, just like Mohammed was when he wrote the 'satanic verses' calling for the worship of idols?

All this is takiyya at its best. And Animal Mother keeps explosively defecating dhimmitude diarrhea at its 'best', trying to take down freedom and Christianity.

But you're on the losing side -read Revelations.

Kingarthurhk
09-02-2012, 08:06
Good Morning, Snowbird. Fiesty as ever I see.:wavey:

snowbird
09-02-2012, 09:48
Good Morning, Snowbird. Fiesty as ever I see.:wavey:

Sorry, I took this oath to uphold the Constitution.

Martel Sobieskey has a good article, "Why Mosques Should Be Shut Down", at www.rightsidenews.com

He points out that Islamic oil money (inimical foreign governments) has funded most of the 2000 mosques jeering at us now in our own homeland. Islam is at perpetual war against non-Muslims. Those who side with it are traitors.

Kingarthurhk
09-02-2012, 09:52
Sorry, I took this oath to uphold the Constitution.

Martel Sobieskey has a good article, "Why Mosques Should Be Shut Down", at www.rightsidenews.com (http://www.rightsidenews.com)

He points out that Islamic oil money (inimical foreign governments) has funded most of the 2000 mosques jeering at us now in our own homeland. Islam is at perpetual war against non-Muslims. Those who side with it are traitors.

So, did I. What does that have to do with denying other people their rights, or being fiesty?:supergrin:

Animal Mother
09-02-2012, 11:09
Well, one of many ways, has been your repeated claims that I misuse the word takiyya. I only make that claim because it's true.
Listening to a traitor like you, folks might think Muslims can be trusted to always be loyal Americans, which, of course, is your deceptive intention. Where did I ever say any group can ever always be trusted? Just go ahead and link to the post.
In the Pakistani blasphemy case involving the 11-year-old Christian girl, it turns out that a Muslim CLERIC (aren't clerics supposed to be holier? more righteous?) framed this girl by planting pages of the Koran among the papers she burned.

And where did your Muslim cleric get these Koran pages? Did he desecrate a Koran by tearing out pages? If a book is god and bad treatment of it equals blasphemy, then shouldn't your Muslim cleric be executed for pre-meditated blasphemy? Or will he get excused because he was temporarily taken over by a jinn, just like Mohammed was when he wrote the 'satanic verses' calling for the worship of idols? When did he become my cleric? Who discovered these acts by the cleric? Christian warriors acting on the word of God?
All this is takiyya at its best. No, it isn't. There's another example of you misusing the word.
And Animal Mother keeps explosively defecating dhimmitude diarrhea at its 'best', trying to take down freedom and Christianity.Again, I'll ask you where I've done this, just go ahead and link to the post.
But you're on the losing side -read Revelations. Now you've turned it into a battle of who has the better magic book? That's not irrational at all.

Animal Mother
09-02-2012, 11:10
Sorry, I took this oath to uphold the Constitution. Then why are breaking that oath?
Martel Sobieskey has a good article, "Why Mosques Should Be Shut Down", at www.rightsidenews.com

He points out that Islamic oil money (inimical foreign governments) has funded most of the 2000 mosques jeering at us now in our own homeland. Islam is at perpetual war against non-Muslims. Those who side with it are traitors.
Shut down mosques? Without any actual evidence of wrong doing? That's a violation of the First Amendment. So much for defending the Constitution. Now you're a liar and a hypocrite. Truly a shining example.

snowbird
09-03-2012, 08:10
...denying other people their rights...

Exactly which rights are you and Animal Mother talking about?

The right to emulate the "excellent" example of the 'prophet' Mohammed back in his caravan-raiding days?

In NYC, Tywanda (a Muslim woman, supposedly loyal and honest) picked the pocket of Dina, a Jewish woman who was shopping. The bank called Dina and said a $211 charge had been made on her debit card. Feisty Dina ran over to the store and caught Tywanda redhanded. Store security detained Tywanda until police could arrest her. While they were waiting for the cops, Tywanda displayed her attitude about her "Muslim rights", "I am Muslim, you are Jewish. You are all greedy, why don't you just let it go?"

Of course, communists think likewise, so maybe that's why Animal Mother and Kingarthurhk love Islam so much; earning one's own money is "greedy", but stealing it from infidels/capitalists is perfectly okay and 'Constitutional'.:upeyes:

steveksux
09-03-2012, 08:17
Of course, communists think likewise, so maybe that's why Animal Mother and Kingarthurhk love Islam so much; earning one's own money is "greedy", but stealing it from infidels/capitalists is perfectly okay and 'Constitutional'.:upeyes:For someone who's so quick to cry and whine about ad homs, you sure like to make up lies about people and put false words in their mouths.

A truly sad, sick, sorry excuse for an argument. Let alone a human being.

Randy

snowbird
09-03-2012, 08:42
Shut down mosques? Without any actual evidence of wrong doing? That's a violation of the First Amendment.

Let's see, today is the 8th anniversary of mosque-approved mass rape and murder of schoolchildren (Beslan) by Muslims who are supposedly loyal, but Animal Mother and Kingarthurhk say that's 'Constitutional' for Muslims.:upeyes:

NATO has suspended training Afghan recruits because so many of these Muslims (supposedly loyal) have been shooting Coalition soldiers in the back, with mosque-approval, which AM and KA claim is 'Constitutional'.

Another Muslim (supposedly loyal), acting in accordance with mosque SOP, just killed himself and 2 others, injuring 19, by driving his car bomb into a US consulate vehicle in Pakistan. "Constitutional", bleat AM and KA.:upeyes:

In Israel, Eyal Lerner did 2 Muslims (supposedly loyal and honest) a favor and hired them to renovate his family's apartment. With mosque approval, they burglarized the place, and poisoned the food and drink in hopes of killing some Jews, so that the Lerner family had 4 very ill people when police arrived. AM and KA say that not only is this repaying of good with evil okay, that this hate crime is okay, but it is downright "Constitutional".:upeyes:

Six US Senators disagree with your take on our Constitution however; they've called for freeing that 11-year-old Christian girl with Down's Syndrome who faces the death penalty behind the Sharia Curtain for alleged "blasphemy", which AM and KA say are within the "rights" of supposedly loyal Muslims.:upeyes:

In India, at least 16 Muslims, supposedly loyal, plotted to attack nuclear power plants around the country in a mosque-approved scheme to cause massive death and chaos. If this happened in the US, AM and KA would no doubt claim their "Constitutional rights" were violated when they were arrested.:upeyes:

Today's total of deadly Muslim (supposedly loyal) attacks has now reached 19,543 (but this is within their 'Constitutional rights', claim AM and KA.:upeyes:

The fact is, trusting Muslims to be loyal and honest is foolish -look at the Armenian Genocide, look at how they're shooting us in the back right now in Afghanistan. The fact is, Muslims have no Constitutional "rights" to murder thousands of non-Muslim Americans, the way they did on 9/11, and are plotting to do again, with full approval of their mosques.

The fact is, Islam is a loaded gun pointed at the head of every non-Muslim on the planet.

snowbird
09-03-2012, 08:45
For someone who's so quick to cry and whine about ad homs, you sure like to make up lies about people and put false words in their mouths.

A truly sad, sick, sorry excuse for an argument. Let alone a human being.

Randy

I presented a ton of hard facts, all you have is name-calling.

steveksux
09-03-2012, 09:00
I presented a ton of hard facts, all you have is name-calling.

Liar.

Of course, communists think likewise, so maybe that's why Animal Mother and Kingarthurhk love Islam so much; earning one's own money is "greedy", but stealing it from infidels/capitalists is perfectly okay and 'Constitutional'.

And not even a good liar.

Randy

Animal Mother
09-03-2012, 09:09
Let's see, today is the 8th anniversary of mosque-approved mass rape and murder of schoolchildren (Beslan) by Muslims who are supposedly loyal, but Animal Mother and Kingarthurhk say that's 'Constitutional' for Muslims.:upeyes: Where did I say any such thing? Do you have no other argument that outright lying?
NATO has suspended training Afghan recruits because so many of these Muslims (supposedly loyal) have been shooting Coalition soldiers in the back, with mosque-approval, which AM and KA claim is 'Constitutional'.Mosques in the US have supported shooting US soldiers in the back? When? Where? Or is this yet another snowbird lie?
The fact is, Islam is a loaded gun pointed at the head of every non-Muslim on the planet.Apparently, all you have is crazed ranting and lies. You aren't even a good troll.

Animal Mother
09-03-2012, 09:14
I presented a ton of hard facts, all you have is name-calling.Really? Then prove this isn't yet another lie. Show evidence that even one of the accusations you've made against myself or Kingarthurhk are true.
Not another regurgitation of events you find on jihadwatch, not more wild eyed conspiracy theories. Present some "hard facts" or slink off into the pit from which you came.

steveksux
09-03-2012, 11:08
Really? Then prove this isn't yet another lie. Show evidence that even one of the accusations you've made against myself or Kingarthurhk are true.
Not another regurgitation of events you find on jihadwatch, not more wild eyed conspiracy theories. Present some "hard facts" or slink off into the pit from which you came.
Hard to tell given the history of ridiculous claims, but claiming Kingarthurhk "loves Islam" certainly ranks among the more outrageous lies Snowbull likes to sling around.

Randy

snowbird
09-03-2012, 12:09
Contrary to what dhimmis claim, destroying the country from within (as stealth sharia does) is NOT a Constitutional right.

snowbird
09-03-2012, 12:13
Mosques in the US have supported shooting US soldiers in the back? When? Where? Or is this yet another snowbird lie?


"Behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Koran" (Koran 8:12)

Islam is a political-religious system based on violence towards non-Muslims. Any who deny this are either very ignorant of the nature of Islam, or bald-faced liars.

Animal Mother
09-03-2012, 20:52
Contrary to what dhimmis claim, destroying the country from within (as stealth sharia does) is NOT a Constitutional right.
Who has said it was? Where, specifically?

Animal Mother
09-03-2012, 20:54
"Behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Koran" (Koran 8:12)WTF is that? That's like quoting "Bible 3:12". What translation of the Qur'an is that? What's the context?

snowbird
09-04-2012, 09:49
WTF is that? That's like quoting "Bible 3:12". What translation of the Qur'an is that? What's the context?

The Bible, if you've never read it, has multiple books. The Koran does not. So you are incorrect in saying, "That's like quoting 'Bible 3:12'". Of course, you are also incorrect on so many other things too, but space doesn't allow for elaboration on that right here.

Muslims believe that the Koran is Allah's word, and perfect. The vast majority do not believe in any other translations of it. Anybody trying to scholastically examine the Koran, as has long since been done countless times with the Bible, takes their life in their hands. Just ask Salmon Rushdie.

You keep blathering about 'Muslims' Constitutional rights' while pretending that their sharia, stealthy or otherwise, doesn't threaten our freedom and even our very lives.

Nonie Darwish, a Christian convert from Islam is far more authoritative on this topic than you or any other dhimmi. She said, "This (Islam) is not a religion. It has nothing to do with religion. Religion is a relationship with God. Islam is a relationship with the State. Islam is a one-party totalitarian system. It's a one-party State that will not allow you to speak. And it will kill anybody who challenges or questions."

Islam is a cult of death that promotes suicide bombers and "killing the infidel where you find him". The Koran says, "A Muslim must not enslave another Muslim, but is free to do so with a non-Muslim".

Our Constitution, in case you've never read it, does not allow the tyranny put forth in Islamic sharia; in fact, it directly opposes it.

Animal Mother
09-04-2012, 11:36
The Bible, if you've never read it, has multiple books. The Koran does not. Yes, it does. Clearly you've never read it. Trying learning for yourself and stop trusting things you read online just because they reinforce your prejudices.
So you are incorrect in saying, "That's like quoting 'Bible 3:12'". Of course, you are also incorrect on so many other things too, but space doesn't allow for elaboration on that right here. Even if that were true, and it's not, at least I don't continually repeat falsehoods even after being informed that they're false.
Muslims believe that the Koran is Allah's word, and perfect. The vast majority do not believe in any other translations of it. Anybody trying to scholastically examine the Koran, as has long since been done countless times with the Bible, takes their life in their hands. Just ask Salmon Rushdie. Seriously, how do you pack so much falsehood into so few words? There are entire schools of Muslim theology focused only on "scholastically examine[sic] the Koran".
You keep blathering about 'Muslims' Constitutional rights' while pretending that their sharia, stealthy or otherwise, doesn't threaten our freedom and even our very lives. Two completely separate topics.
Our Constitution, in case you've never read it, does not allow the tyranny put forth in Islamic sharia; in fact, it directly opposes it.Of course it doesn't, just like it does not allow Christian or Jewish religious courts to rule on secular legal matters, because that would require endorsing a religion. On the other hand, I've never claimed the Constitution said any such thing, so excellent job of refuting yet another argument no one is making. If only you could find the time to answer the actual questions you have been repeatedly asked.

BTW, you still have yet to provide evidence from my posts for even a single accusation you've made against me in this thread. Are you tacitly admitting that you were knowingly lying from the beginning? Don't both answering, because the answer is already clear.

Animal Mother
09-04-2012, 11:39
Contrary to what dhimmis claim, destroying the country from within (as stealth sharia does) is NOT a Constitutional right.


Who has said it was? Where, specifically?
You also failed to answer this question, an oversight I'm sure you'll no doubt now correct, being an honest person and all.

snowbird
09-04-2012, 13:14
(1) Yes, it does (AM is saying that the Koran IS divided into multiple books)...
(2) I've never claimed the Constitution said any such thing (allowing the tyranny of Islamic sharia)...
(3) If only you could find the time to answer the actual questions you have been repeatedly asked.


First, the Koran is divided into surahs. Surah is translated as "chapter". So, when will you be apologizing for your ignorant error, and the mean-spirited insolence that you added onto it?

Second, you said that the Constitution disallows us to stop Islamic immigration, despite the fact that more Muslims equal less freedom, more jihad bloodshed of innocents, and more sharia tyranny. You've been repeatedly told the truth, but keep pigheadedly clinging to your dishonest anti-American bigotry. Why?

Third, speaking of 'actual questions you have been repeatedly asked', but failed to answer, when will you:

-cite where Christians... you know, the ones you keep saying are just as bad as Muslims... have been shooting people in the back, the way supposedly loyal Muslims are doing these days with our troops in Afghanistan?

-cite where Christians have beheaded 17 young people for having a mixed-boys-girls party with music and dancing, the way Taliban supposedly tolerant Muslims just did?

-cite where hundreds of Christian girls under age 10 are married, the way hundreds of girls ( in a supposedly healthy-for-children, non-pedophile Muslim society) under age 10 are in Iran?

-cite where Christians are firing rockets into civilian homes to murder innocent people, the way Palestinian supposedly peaceful Muslims are in Israel?

I'm sure you'll provide satisfactory answers to these questions, being an honest atheist and all. Or maybe you won't, thereby tacitly admitting that you were knowingly lying from the beginning?

Animal Mother
09-04-2012, 13:44
First, the Koran is divided into surahs. Surah is translated as "chapter". So, when will you be apologizing for your ignorant error, and the mean-spirited insolence that you added onto it?Each Surah has it's own title, just like each "book" in the Bible. But, nonetheless, I'm willing to admit I made a technical error and will acknowledge as much. If only you have the strength to do the same when you made mistakes, or repeated things you knew to be false. Sadly, you don't.
Second, you said that the Constitution disallows us to stop Islamic immigration, despite the fact that more Muslims equal less freedom, more jihad bloodshed of innocents, and more sharia tyranny. You've been repeatedly told the truth, but keep pigheadedly clinging to your dishonest anti-American bigotry. Why? Because banning people based solely on their religion is a violation of the Constitution. The same Constitution you claim to have taken an oath to protect, but now happily discard in pursuit of your own bigotry. You also have uniformly failed to demonstrate what you call a "fact", that "more Muslims equal less freedom, more jihad bloodshed of innocents, and more sharia tyranny". Not that you'll let that stop your rants.

Third, speaking of 'actual questions you have been repeatedly asked', but failed to answer, when will you: Have I claimed there is no violence in Muslim areas or committed by Muslims? Have I claimed any of the things you've listed don't happen? If so, could you point out the specific posts?
-cite where Christians... you know, the ones you keep saying are just as bad as Muslims... Where have I said this? Where have I said either Muslims or Christians are "bad"? That's your tactic, not mine.
have been shooting people in the back, the way supposedly loyal Muslims are doing these days with our troops in Afghanistan? Mexico.
-cite where Christians have beheaded 17 young people for having a mixed-boys-girls party with music and dancing, the way Taliban supposedly tolerant Muslims just did? Where did I claim they had? Of course, if you're just looking for beheadings without the exact same specific justification, there's always good old Mexico.
-cite where hundreds of Christian girls under age 10 are married, the way hundreds of girls ( in a supposedly healthy-for-children, non-pedophile Muslim society) under age 10 are in Iran? Africa.
-cite where Christians are firing rockets into civilian homes to murder innocent people, the way Palestinian supposedly peaceful Muslims are in Israel? Both Africa and Mexico.
I'm sure you'll provide satisfactory answers to these questions, being an honest atheist and all. Or maybe you won't, thereby tacitly admitting that you were knowingly lying from the beginning? Does this mean you'll be answering the questions I asked now? Oh!! Happy Day!!

snowbird
09-04-2012, 19:07
...banning people based solely on their religion is a violation of the Constitution...
...You also have uniformly failed to demonstrate what you call a "fact", that "more Muslims equal less freedom, more jihad bloodshed of innocents, and more sharia tyranny"...
...Both Africa and Mexico (fire rockets into civilian homes to murder innocents)


Where does the Constitution deny our sovereign right to determine who does and who does not get to immigrate into our country?

Are you saying that Red China could have conquered us during the Cold War simply by sending a few hundred million communist immigrants here against our will because the Constitution would bind us into accepting that? Sorry, I'm going to have to call buffalo bagels.

Any honest look at history and current events shows that "more Muslims equals less freedom, more jihad bloodshed of innocents, and more sharia tyranny". How else do you explain centuries of Islamic slave-taking raids against Christendom and Africa and India? What other reason is there for the Hindu Holocaust, the Armenian Genocide, 9/11, and countless other massacres by murderous Muslims? Why else do you suppose the total number of deadly Muslim attacks today keeps growing by leaps and bounds?

As for child marriage, Wiki says it is "fairly widespread in parts of Africa, Asia...frequently associated with arranged marriage". "In Arabic and Altaic societies arranged marriages were and are common" "In Mali the female/male ratio of marriage before 18 is 72:1". In Kenya it is 21:1 (Wiki is too PC to use the word Muslim or Islamic, but the places it mentions have lots of Muslims. Altaic includes Turkic, Mongolic (both Muslim) and Japonic and Korean (I was in these countries and saw no evidence of child marriage. I don't believe it exists there). So I don't see any evidence of hundreds of Christian girls being married under age 10 anywhere, while there is such evidence in Islam.

As for Mexican cartel murders, that is all about criminality and not Christianity. Christians can go against the Bible and sin by committing murder, but it's unGodly. OTOH, the Koran, supposedly the word of Allah, commands Muslims to "slay the infidel" (we call that murder). So, again, Christianity and Islam are not morally equivalent at all, contrary to leftist claims.

Animal Mother
09-04-2012, 20:25
Where does the Constitution deny our sovereign right to determine who does and who does not get to immigrate into our country? If that decision is based solely on religion? The First Amendment.
Are you saying that Red China could have conquered us during the Cold War simply by sending a few hundred million communist immigrants here against our will because the Constitution would bind us into accepting that? Sorry, I'm going to have to call buffalo bagels. National origin isn't a freedom guaranteed by the Constitution. Maybe you should try actually reading it sometime.
Any honest look at history and current events shows that "more Muslims equals less freedom, more jihad bloodshed of innocents, and more sharia tyranny". How else do you explain centuries of Islamic slave-taking raids against Christendom and Africa and India? What other reason is there for the Hindu Holocaust, the Armenian Genocide, 9/11, and countless other massacres by murderous Muslims? Why else do you suppose the total number of deadly Muslim attacks today keeps growing by leaps and bounds? I asked for facts, not crazed ranting. Let's take one of your examples though. How many people were involved in planning the 9/11 attacks? 50? 100? How does that indict the 1.6 Billion Muslims worldwide?
As for child marriage, Wiki says it is "fairly widespread in parts of Africa, Asia...frequently associated with arranged marriage". "In Arabic and Altaic societies arranged marriages were and are common" "In Mali the female/male ratio of marriage before 18 is 72:1". In Kenya it is 21:1 (Wiki is too PC to use the word Muslim or Islamic, but the places it mentions have lots of Muslims. From your source: The vast majority of Kenyans are Christian (83%), with 47.7% regarding themselves as Protestant and 23.5% as Roman Catholic.[78] 621,200 of Kenyans are Orthodox Christians.[79] Notably, Kenya has the highest number of Quakers in the world, with around 133,000 members. Bang up job you're doing there of proving my point. Thanks.
Altaic includes Turkic, Mongolic (both Muslim)[/QUOTE} Most Mongols are buddhists.
[QUOTE] and Japonic and Korean (I was in these countries and saw no evidence of child marriage. I don't believe it exists there). If you don't personally see it, it doesn't exist? Interesting perspective.
So I don't see any evidence of hundreds of Christian girls being married under age 10 anywhere, while there is such evidence in Islam. You must not have read that article on child marriages too closely. Perhaps you should go back and review it.
As for Mexican cartel murders, that is all about criminality and not Christianity. Christians can go against the Bible and sin by committing murder, but it's unGodly. OTOH, the Koran, supposedly the word of Allah, commands Muslims to "slay the infidel" (we call that murder). So, again, Christianity and Islam are not morally equivalent at all, contrary to leftist claims.The same people committing the murders in Mexico are wearing crucifixes and going to Church on Sunday. The challenge was to name a place where Christians were shooting people in the back, that challenge was met.

If you could point out the part of the Qur'an that orders, or even allows for, killing someone for attending a party, you might have a point about Islam commanding such things.

But then that would require answering a direct question, and we both know you don't do that.

snowbird
09-05-2012, 11:51
If that decision is based solely on religion? The First Amendment.
National origin isn't a freedom guaranteed by the Constitution.

Our Constitution only applies to Americans, so if we, the People, wisely decide to not let Muslims immigrate and end our freedom, we may do so. The fact is, as you've been told many times but keep ignoring, Islam is a totalitarian political ideology as much as it is a 'religion'. But even if we limit our immigration restrictions to 'national origin', we're still okay. True Muslims owe their first and foremost allegiance to the Ummah, the worldwide Islamic nation, a hostile foreign nation. They cannot be loyal Americans and faithful Muslims. And since Islam also teaches takiyya, their word is not to be trusted. Therefore, bar all of them until Islam reforms itself on foreign shores in however many centuries that may take.

Since 2007, deceptive (takiyya) supposedly loyal Muslims have killed 110 coalition people in Afghanistan; 40 of them this year, so far. Sadly, our General Allen is a dhimmi. He made a Care-Bear statement, "One of our battalion commanders publicly and openly hugged his Afghan battalion counterpart. And that solved the problem right on the spot".

Any bets that he's wrong? That a hug won't end the jihad?

Field grade officers are political appointees and as such, conform to current political winds, which are still disastrously dhimmi-oriented.

The hard fact is, the enemy is inside our lines. The Spanish monarchy in 1492 solved the problem of Muslim guerrillas in reconquered Spain by expelling all Muslims. Maybe not 'politically correct', but effective -it maintained Spain as a Christian nation.

The enemy, Islam, maintains captive populations through the mechanism of Dhimmitude (in the original sense of the word, partial slavery).

We are setting ourselves up for protracted guerrilla warfare in our homeland by allowing large populations of unassimilated Muslims to enter our borders. Look at Dearborn where they already stone Christians (videos of this are on youtube). Their totalitarian Islamic ideology is diametrically opposed to conservative Christian freedom ideology, although not so much to totalitarian Hard Left ideology. I guess that's why leftist dhimmis help them 'spread the Big Lies' about Islam being a religion of peace, Christianity and America and Israel being 'evil', etc.

Animal Mother
09-05-2012, 14:40
And since Islam also teaches takiyya, their word is not to be trusted. I find it increasingly odd that you continually rail about your own, invented, version of takiyya while spewing forth a non-stop string of lies. If Muslims supposedly not telling the truth is bad thing, what are we supposed to conclude about you given your documented tendency to simply invent things when you think it will serve your purpose?

snowbird
09-06-2012, 06:46
I find it increasingly odd that you continually rail about your own, invented, version of takiyya while spewing forth a non-stop string of lies. If Muslims supposedly not telling the truth is bad thing, what are we supposed to conclude about you given your documented tendency to simply invent things when you think it will serve your purpose?

So you're saying that you agree with General Allen, that that hug will end the jihad?

snowbird
09-06-2012, 06:48
Guess what?

Reality has already proved you wrong.

Today's total of deadly Muslim attacks just since 9/11, has now risen to 19,554.

Nice try.

Animal Mother
09-06-2012, 13:23
So you're saying that you agree with General Allen, that that hug will end the jihad?
No, I'm saying that you frequently resort to dishonesty when you feel it might serve your purpose. Was I somehow unclear about that?

snowbird
09-06-2012, 15:21
While you're prevaricating on behalf of Islam, over in Bangladesh, there have been 300 Christian children abducted and forcibly converted to Islam.

And in Pakistan, a 60 year-old Muslim man raped a 10 year-old Christian girl, then left her on the floor naked, unconscious, and bleeding (www.asianews.it/news-en/Ten-year-old-Christian-girl-raped-by-60-year-old-Muslim-merchant-in-Faisalabad-25716.html)

Yeah, you really have the moral high-ground:upeyes: (NOT!!!)

Animal Mother
09-06-2012, 21:42
While you're prevaricating on behalf of Islam, over in Bangladesh, there have been 300 Christian children abducted and forcibly converted to Islam. Where have I been prevericating? Why do you find it so impossible to answer direct questions?
Yeah, you really have the moral high-ground:upeyes: (NOT!!!)Between you and I? Of course I do, unlike you I'm willing to answer the questions asked of me and don't find it necessary to constantly lie.

snowbird
09-07-2012, 09:53
Where have I been prevericating(sic)? ... find it necessary to constantly lie.

You certainly do seem to find it necessary to constantly lie. So much so that it would be more to the point to ask, where have you not been prevaricating?

Your posts are full of lies, such as:

-the Koran and the Bible are equally violent
-Islam's war teachings constitute only "a tiny minority" of the religion, and anyway...
-...'Christianity is just as bad as Islam'
-America deliberately committed genocide against Native American Indians
-Islam wasn't responsible for the Armenian Genocide
-Islam was the foundation of a Golden Age of science and culture
-the Crusades were all wrong
-Islam is all about pious religion and not about bloodsoaked politics of hate and genocide
-our Constitution compels us to allow massive, unlimited Muslim immigration and accommodation

snowbird
09-07-2012, 10:21
If Muslims supposedly not telling the truth is bad thing...

Well, folks, here we see a leftist defending falsehood ("IF not telling the truth is a bad thing...":upeyes:).

Dogs bark, ducks quack, and leftists lie. Notice how well the Bolshevik philosophy of fabrication ties in with the Islamic doctrine of takiyya. Yes, leftists these days love Islam. And Islam is willing to use the left as an ally of convenience for the time being.

CAIR is boasting that over 100 delegates at the Democratic Nat'l Convention are Muslim, more than double from 2008. Muslims overwhelmingly backed Obama in 2008, just as Animal Mother backs Islam here at GTRI. Both AM (the left) and Islam disdain conservative Christians.

But watch out, Animal Mother (and all the rest of the left)! They will turn on you when they deem their numbers to have grown sufficiently. They hate your feminism and LGBTism. Today, the DNC is a satanic cesspool of Islamic propaganda, lies about Muslims being part of the founding of this nation, baby killing, changing the definition of marriage, hating God, hating America, promoting pedophilia, Marxism, and sodomy. Soon enough, though, lefties will be like that Hindu activist in India who just died from a Muslim stabbing attack that took place on a university campus 2 months earlier. You'll be like those 6 Russians in Datykh, Ingushetia, who were just ambushed and killed by Muslim mujahideen.

Today's total of deadly Muslim attacks just since 9/11, has climbed to 19,559. You could be next.

Wake up!

High-Gear
09-07-2012, 14:48
Well, folks, here we see a leftist defending falsehood ("IF not telling the truth is a bad thing...":upeyes:).

Dogs bark, ducks quack, and leftists lie. Notice how well the Bolshevik philosophy of fabrication ties in with the Islamic doctrine of takiyya. Yes, leftists these days love Islam. And Islam is willing to use the left as an ally of convenience for the time being.

CAIR is boasting that over 100 delegates at the Democratic Nat'l Convention are Muslim, more than double from 2008. Muslims overwhelmingly backed Obama in 2008, just as Animal Mother backs Islam here at GTRI. Both AM (the left) and Islam disdain conservative Christians.

But watch out, Animal Mother (and all the rest of the left)! They will turn on you when they deem their numbers to have grown sufficiently. They hate your feminism and LGBTism. Today, the DNC is a satanic cesspool of Islamic propaganda, lies about Muslims being part of the founding of this nation, baby killing, changing the definition of marriage, hating God, hating America, promoting pedophilia, Marxism, and sodomy. Soon enough, though, lefties will be like that Hindu activist in India who just died from a Muslim stabbing attack that took place on a university campus 2 months earlier. You'll be like those 6 Russians in Datykh, Ingushetia, who were just ambushed and killed by Muslim mujahideen.

Today's total of deadly Muslim attacks just since 9/11, has climbed to 19,559. You could be next.

Wake up!

I already know the answer to this but I'll ask anyway....

Do you have any sources to back up your claims? Pedophilia now, really?:rofl:

Animal Mother
09-07-2012, 18:26
You certainly do seem to find it necessary to constantly lie. So much so that it would be more to the point to ask, where have you not been prevaricating?

Your posts are full of lies, such as:

-the Koran and the Bible are equally violent-Islam's war teachings constitute only "a tiny minority" of the religion, and anyway...
-...'Christianity is just as bad as Islam'
-America deliberately committed genocide against Native American Indians
-Islam wasn't responsible for the Armenian Genocide
-Islam was the foundation of a Golden Age of science and culture
-the Crusades were all wrong
-Islam is all about pious religion and not about bloodsoaked politics of hate and genocide
-our Constitution compels us to allow massive, unlimited Muslim immigration and accommodationI eagerly await your evidence that I've said any of these things and, if I did, that they are untrue. All I see here is more of your ranting hatred.

Animal Mother
09-07-2012, 18:28
Well, folks, here we see a leftist defending falsehood ("IF not telling the truth is a bad thing...":upeyes:).

Dogs bark, ducks quack, and leftists lie. Notice how well the Bolshevik philosophy of fabrication ties in with the Islamic doctrine of takiyya. Yes, leftists these days love Islam. And Islam is willing to use the left as an ally of convenience for the time being.

CAIR is boasting that over 100 delegates at the Democratic Nat'l Convention are Muslim, more than double from 2008. Muslims overwhelmingly backed Obama in 2008, just as Animal Mother backs Islam here at GTRI. Both AM (the left) and Islam disdain conservative Christians.

But watch out, Animal Mother (and all the rest of the left)! They will turn on you when they deem their numbers to have grown sufficiently. They hate your feminism and LGBTism. Today, the DNC is a satanic cesspool of Islamic propaganda, lies about Muslims being part of the founding of this nation, baby killing, changing the definition of marriage, hating God, hating America, promoting pedophilia, Marxism, and sodomy. Soon enough, though, lefties will be like that Hindu activist in India who just died from a Muslim stabbing attack that took place on a university campus 2 months earlier. You'll be like those 6 Russians in Datykh, Ingushetia, who were just ambushed and killed by Muslim mujahideen.

Today's total of deadly Muslim attacks just since 9/11, has climbed to 19,559. You could be next.

Wake up!
You've really lost it, haven't you?

snowbird
09-08-2012, 09:27
I already know the answer to this but I'll ask anyway....

Do you have any sources to back up your claims? Pedophilia now, really?:rofl:

Well, let's see. The Left glorifies Islam, which was founded by a guy who, in his fifties 'married' a SIX-YEAR-OLD. Is that pedophilic enough for you?

I remember back in the sixties, while I was still an agnostic, reading Playboy magazine (which I later discovered is leftist) which revered Alfred Kinsey, who helped usher in the 'sex revolution'. Kinsey's research turned out, however, to go beyond theory and into participation in perverted sexual activities. He used data from pedophiles, passing it off as being from various sources. And he reported observations of orgasms in over 300 children between the ages of FIVE MONTHS (!) and 14 years. Is that pedophilic enough for you?

Left-leaning MTV sells America's youth (role models) that it's "cool" for adolescent males to be crude. Rap music lyrics, "B****(lady-dog), you's a ho. And ho, you's a b****. Come on!" And they sell adolescent females a 'new kind of female empowerment', "I am a sexual object, but I'm proud of it".

Then there's lefty Bill Clinton's escapades with Monica -ya think that could have had any bad influence on middle-school sexual adventures? Likewise, lefty Hollywood's and our leftist public schools' promotion of the 'gay lifestyle', which is loved by homosexual predators out to molest children (and the left demonizes the Boy Scouts for keeping homosexual predators at bay). Jesus said any who harm "these little ones" would be better off drowned in the sea. Christianity taught, before the left's 'sexual revolution', wholesome sex-only-in-marriage family morality. An AIDS epidemic later, maybe we're ready to turn back to what's right: Biblical standards.

I think I already know the answer, but I'll ask anyway...is the Christophobic left pedophilic enough for you?

Animal Mother
09-08-2012, 09:44
Well, let's see. The Left glorifies Islam, which was founded by a guy who, in his fifties 'married' a SIX-YEAR-OLD. Is that pedophilic enough for you?

I remember back in the sixties, while I was still an agnostic, reading Playboy magazine (which I later discovered is leftist) which revered Alfred Kinsey, who helped usher in the 'sex revolution'. Kinsey's research turned out, however, to go beyond theory and into participation in perverted sexual activities. He used data from pedophiles, passing it off as being from various sources. And he reported observations of orgasms in over 300 children between the ages of FIVE MONTHS (!) and 14 years. Is that pedophilic enough for you?

Left-leaning MTV sells America's youth (role models) that it's "cool" for adolescent males to be crude. Rap music lyrics, "B****(lady-dog), you's a ho. And ho, you's a b****. Come on!" And they sell adolescent females a 'new kind of female empowerment', "I am a sexual object, but I'm proud of it".

Then there's lefty Bill Clinton's escapades with Monica -ya think that could have had any bad influence on middle-school sexual adventures? Likewise, lefty Hollywood's and our leftist public schools' promotion of the 'gay lifestyle', which is loved by homosexual predators out to molest children (and the left demonizes the Boy Scouts for keeping homosexual predators at bay). Jesus said any who harm "these little ones" would be better off drowned in the sea. Christianity taught, before the left's 'sexual revolution', wholesome sex-only-in-marriage family morality. An AIDS epidemic later, maybe we're ready to turn back to what's right: Biblical standards.

I think I already know the answer, but I'll ask anyway...is the Christophobic left pedophilic enough for you?
I think we broke him.

snowbird
09-08-2012, 09:58
I think we broke him.

A note to wise parents; keep this guy away from your kids.

Animal Mother
09-08-2012, 10:23
A note to wise parents; keep this guy away from your kids.If the issue ever arises, I'll be sure to show them our mutual posts. I'm sure they, like everyone else, will be able to identify the dangerous, hate-filled, deceitful, lunatic.

snowbird
09-08-2012, 14:03
... identify the dangerous, hate-filled, deceitful, lunatic.

Well, here's a dangerous, hate-filled, deceitful, lunatic...but no doubt, not who you're referring to, traitor that you are.

Yesterday in Nashville, a Muslima, Amal Ahmed Abdullahi, 29, a worker at South Nashville Dell, told a coworker that, "Her people..."



...Now stop right there. Notice this complete LACK OF LOYALTY to the USA. She has zero loyalty to Americans, and 100% loyalty to the Muslim Ummah, a hostile foreign state. Why does Animal Mother falsely keep insisting that our Constitution demands we keep letting hordes of these hostiles invade and occupy our homeland? Maybe because he too lacks loyalty to the USA?



"...Her people were dying for Allah every day; that she was ready to die for Allah...that this country is full of non-believers...and she should pick up a gun and shoot all these people".

Like Auschwitz Nazis, she's 'just following orders'...the Koran clearly, repeatedly commands, "Slay the infidel" (2:191, 4:89, 9:5). And many, many Muslims around the world are acting in accordance with these Koranic passages. Amal's crime is not an 'isolated incident'. It is part of a widespread, persistent pattern of Islamic intimidation. Today's total of deadly Muslim attacks has now soared to 19,565.

So what does a quistling Animal Mother do? Why, spew vitriol at patriotic counterjihadists, in craven support of bloody Islam, of course.:upeyes: A friendly word of warning, Animal Mother: when you're bent that far over, kissing Muslim-whatever, your neck is exposed quite nicely for a quick scimitar lopping off of your head. Are you perverse enough to wait until it comes to that?

Cavalry Doc
09-08-2012, 15:15
There are tolerant muslims. I met many of them in Kosovo. I was shocked by the Ft. Dix six BS. The Kosovar Albanian muslims were actually contacted by Al Qaeda while we were there, and asked to carry out attacks against the Americans. AQ was laughed out of the country. The first time I heard Osama Bin Laden's name and of AQ was during an intel brief in Kosovo.

Gotta admit, I have no sorrow for the mayhem we visited on them in Afghanistan or Iraq. We fought them there so we wouldn't have to fight them here. According to pew research group, that had the desired effect. We may have to do it a few more times, if provoked. That will be sad, cause The United States Military is the best there is at what we do, but what we do isn't very nice.

I'd prefer that muslims could find a way to leave us alone. I just think there will always be some that can't. We have ordnance for such problems.

High-Gear
09-08-2012, 16:55
Well, let's see. The Left glorifies Islam, which was founded by a guy who, in his fifties 'married' a SIX-YEAR-OLD. Is that pedophilic enough for you?

I remember back in the sixties, while I was still an agnostic, reading Playboy magazine (which I later discovered is leftist) which revered Alfred Kinsey, who helped usher in the 'sex revolution'. Kinsey's research turned out, however, to go beyond theory and into participation in perverted sexual activities. He used data from pedophiles, passing it off as being from various sources. And he reported observations of orgasms in over 300 children between the ages of FIVE MONTHS (!) and 14 years. Is that pedophilic enough for you?

Left-leaning MTV sells America's youth (role models) that it's "cool" for adolescent males to be crude. Rap music lyrics, "B****(lady-dog), you's a ho. And ho, you's a b****. Come on!" And they sell adolescent females a 'new kind of female empowerment', "I am a sexual object, but I'm proud of it".

Then there's lefty Bill Clinton's escapades with Monica -ya think that could have had any bad influence on middle-school sexual adventures? Likewise, lefty Hollywood's and our leftist public schools' promotion of the 'gay lifestyle', which is loved by homosexual predators out to molest children (and the left demonizes the Boy Scouts for keeping homosexual predators at bay). Jesus said any who harm "these little ones" would be better off drowned in the sea. Christianity taught, before the left's 'sexual revolution', wholesome sex-only-in-marriage family morality. An AIDS epidemic later, maybe we're ready to turn back to what's right: Biblical standards.

I think I already know the answer, but I'll ask anyway...is the Christophobic left pedophilic enough for you?

I think snowbird has some deeply repressed sexual issues. He obsesses about what he truly desires!

snowbird
09-08-2012, 18:27
There are tolerant muslims. ..I'd prefer that muslims could find a way to leave us alone. I just think there will always be some that can't. We have ordnance for such problems.

How can we reliably distinguish the tolerant ones (often known as 'apostates') from the 'true believers' who want to emulate Mohammed and "slay the infidel" as they did on 9/11, during the Armenian Genocide, and numerous other massacres?

Answer: we can't.

So let's help them "find a way to leave us alone". Stop Muslim immigration. They stay over there, and we stay over here. Then they won't be able to pull off so many stunts like Fort Hood. And if we ever find we need to use our "ordnance" on them, well, it's better we drop ordnance on their homelands than on ours, no?

Animal Mother
09-08-2012, 18:34
Well, here's a dangerous, hate-filled, deceitful, lunatic Finally you admit it. Congratulations, that's the first step towards getting help.

Cavalry Doc
09-08-2012, 20:44
How can we reliably distinguish the tolerant ones (often known as 'apostates') from the 'true believers' who want to emulate Mohammed and "slay the infidel" as they did on 9/11, during the Armenian Genocide, and numerous other massacres?

Answer: we can't.

So let's help them "find a way to leave us alone". Stop Muslim immigration. They stay over there, and we stay over here. Then they won't be able to pull off so many stunts like Fort Hood. And if we ever find we need to use our "ordnance" on them, well, it's better we drop ordnance on their homelands than on ours, no?

Well, you can't kill your way out of all problems. But we have done a pretty good job in the last 11 years.

http://www.pewglobal.org/2011/05/02/osama-bin-laden-largely-discredited-among-muslim-publics-in-recent-years/

http://pewresearch.org/pubs/1338/declining-muslim-support-for-bin-laden-suicide-bombing

The Fort Hood has a special significance to me. Not only was a friend of mine killed that day as he tried to take out the muzzy jihadist, but I was on post that day, first time in over a year.

Anyway, the politically correct muslim outreach mentality made many afraid to point the finger at the bastage. He was even caught conversing with a known terrorist that he had previously known. If an officer had any unsanctioned contact with an eastern block citizen in the '80's, he'd have lost his clearance so fast it would have made your head spin. We had a cold war mentality back then, we need to keep a warm war mentality in between flairs. I don't condone genocide against anyone. But since jihadists tend to lay low when they are threatened...... that works for me. I do think the next country we go to war with, we need to simply break them and leave. Let the neighbors pick the carcass clean.

It's not a nice thing to do, but this game doesn't give prizes for being nice.

High-Gear
09-09-2012, 00:43
Well, you can't kill your way out of all problems. But we have done a pretty good job in the last 11 years.

But since jihadists tend to lay low when they are threatened...... that works for me. I do think the next country we go to war with, we need to simply break them and leave. Let the neighbors pick the carcass clean.

It's not a nice thing to do, but this game doesn't give prizes for being nice.

We didn't go to war with Iraq because of jihadists, we went there (supposedly) to liberate the people from a despot who was amassing WMD's. How is breaking them going to help liberate the people?

Al Qadea was not in Iraq before our invasion, in fact Sadam was against them. How about we up our human intelligence gathering assets and strike Al Qaeda leaders, or terror cells and not invade anyother countries wasting trillions in the process?

snowbird
09-09-2012, 06:57
Well, you can't kill your way out of all problems.

Agreed.

And that's the beauty of stopping all Muslim immigration, nobody has to kill anybody. We just keep the murderers and genociders out of here. Whether they are openly howling or in takiyya stealth mode, just distance them from our women and children, and our peaceful homelife has a far better chance of remaining peaceful.

snowbird
09-09-2012, 07:07
I think snowbird has some deeply repressed sexual issues. He obsesses about what he truly desires!

Here we see what 'liberals' do so often; it's called projection.

Gear, Mother, and other 'liberals' rant and rave, foam and froth at the mouth over a little display of American patriotism, a little common sense, and the Christian faith of our founders. You see, this threatens their Leftist Atheist Homosexual Establishment (which they now, so 'inclusively', extend to Islamofascism as well).

My small rebellion against their tyrannical 'political correctness' sets them aghast. But as Thomas Jefferson noted, "I hold that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical".

Even so, come Lord Jesus!

Cavalry Doc
09-09-2012, 07:10
We didn't go to war with Iraq because of jihadists, we went there (supposedly) to liberate the people from a despot who was amassing WMD's. How is breaking them going to help liberate the people?

Al Qadea was not in Iraq before our invasion, in fact Sadam was against them. How about we up our human intelligence gathering assets and strike Al Qaeda leaders, or terror cells and not invade anyother countries wasting trillions in the process?

You do understand that not all goals can be broadcast. OpSec is important.

You are right that AQ was not a large presence in Iraq before we invaded. How many of those guys traveled to Iraq to be killed or captured there?

We have been going after the leaders. But it's also a valid strategy, if you can figure out how to do it, to deplete their pool of recruits.

Saddam inadvertently invited us there, believing we would not dare invade. Location, location, location. Can you name another place that would have been better to invite AQ to leave their hidden cells and coalesce into a fighting force to meet us in battle?

Cavalry Doc
09-09-2012, 07:12
I think snowbird has some deeply repressed sexual issues. He obsesses about what he truly desires!

School on Saturday......