Chronograph results [Archive] - Glock Talk

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quake
08-14-2012, 16:27
I'd mentioned in some thread that I'd been chrono'ing some loads recently, and had a couple PM requests for the info. Rather than multiple PM's to folks, I figured I'd put it out here for anyone who cares.

Some of the results are recent (the 9mm Pow'rBall most recently), and some are old, going back years in some cases. So weather conditions, temperature, barometric pressure, etc, are all variable and that may worry some hardcore chronograph purists; personally, I'm not quite that ocd about it. I can say that all were done using a Chrony F1 at 8 to 15 feet from the muzzle, in temperatures ranging from probably 60 to 95 degrees; close enough for me personally, with these types of loads and at this distance.

Not sure how to format it in a post that will end up readable, so it's a PDF attachment. If someone smarter than me knows how to 'insert' rather than 'attach', have at it; I'd appreciate it but don't know how to do it, at least in a way that looks decent.

The results are broken down by caliber, by gun (mostly for barrel-length comparison purposes), and then by load and/or bullet weight. The "FPS" and "Ft/Lbs" are averages of one or more five-shot strings.

Most of the numbers are on 9mm; various loads from various guns, some old and some new. There's also some numbers on .45acp, .380acp, .45LC, .32acp, and 9x18mm.


Fwiw, there were some interesting things I noticed when looking at the info compiled in one location like this. The weakness of Win-USA "BEB" loads in both 9mm and .45acp, the velocities reached in the 9mm carbine when using +P loads, the 9x18 results, and the Taurus Judge results.

The BEB stuff in 9mm and .45acp was always, without exception, the slowest round out of every gun it was fired from. It's a shame really; I'm a big fan of the flat-point shape. But at these velocities (670fps from a full-size colt and 615fps from the little detonics), it's down ridiculously near .380acp power levels. That's idiotic imo. If they'd load it to normal velocities, I could see the BEB bullet style being a decent choice in 9mm and a VERY good choice in .45acp, but at this power level, it's like carrying an old webley revolver or something.

On the other hand, the +P and +P+ from the 9mm carbine did surprisingly well, with the Pow'rBall averaging 1826fps and 740ft/lbs over two five-shot strings. (I ran a second five-round string just to be sure, because the velocity frankly surprised me.) That's nearly into .44magnum & m1 carbine power levels. Not quite up to those levels, but well beyond what most would expect a 9mm to reach. Now... how well a Pow'rBall bullet would perform at that velocity is another question; a question I confess I don't have the answer to.

Also, the Taurus Judge - I've read horror stories of horribly-low velocities from this gun, due to the extremely long bullet jump involved when firing .45LC's in a .410-length chamber. Seems like a logical problem, but not what I found when actually chronographing them.

Final thing worth noting imo is the much-maligned 9x18mm. These numbers were all obtained using a small P64 pistol, roughly the size of the little PPK/s; a full-size makarov would get even better velocity. Using the SilverBear 115-grainers, the little blowback gun darn near matches some 9x19 loads. (And you do feel it when you touch it off.) Unfortunately, the SB 115 is now discontinued, replaced with a 94-grain at roughly the same velocity.

Anyway, fwiw the numbers are collected into one document & attached.

LongGun1
08-16-2012, 16:31
Been a very busy week... :faint:

..thanks for the reminder or I would have missed this! :thumbsup:


The oldie but goodie 9BPLE still is an "attention getter"! :supergrin:

But I need to try out the CorBon Pow'rBall you have been discussing! ;)

quake
08-16-2012, 17:44
Fwiw, I found some old .22LR results as well.

The biggest thing to take away from this set of numbers imo is the barrel-length issues of snubnose guns. Minimags are one of my favorite .22LR loads, but from a little pocket auto or mini-revolver, they've just got no genuine oomph to them. From the mini-revolver, the .22LR Minimag has 45 ft/lbs of energy at 8 feet.

Before someone asks, no, I don't want to stand in front of one. But compare the results to other handguns.

A .32acp - which is borderline at best imo - is twice that powerful; and the .32acp is twice that powerful at a hundred yards if you're using corbons. Yes, seriously.

A .380acp is nearly THREE times as powerful at a hundred yards, as the mini-revolver is at the muzzle.

For another perspective, compare to the lowly .22LR rifle. Fired from a rifle, that same minimag has the Beretta's 57ft/lbs at 325 yards. The 45 ft/lbs of the mini-revolver, is matched by the rifle at more than 450 yards.

From a strictly capability standpoint, I can't see that as something I'm ever planning to again trust for defensive use.

quake
08-16-2012, 19:21
...I need to try out the CorBon Pow'rBall you have been discussing! ;)

Definitely. I'd like to see some more performance tests of it; it seems to do well in tests using gelatin and denim-covered gelatin, but not in plain water-only tests. :dunno:

But power-wise, it's "the stuff". It runs near 1,400 fps from the little subcompact G26, and over 1450 from the G19. (And 1825 fps from the carbine - oy.)

quake
08-24-2012, 14:15
Had a funny thing pointed out to me today, from the 9mm chrono results. Something that goes to one of my favorite topics - pistol-caliber carbines.

With all the derision of pistol-caliber carbines that goes on here & other places, it turns out that even the cheap, generic Win-USA JHP stuff from the little 9mm carbine, is actually more powerful than ANY of the major-manufacturers' 10MM offerings from a pistol. Remington, Federal, Winchester, Hornady and PMC; none of their 10mm offerings even claim to match what the little 9mm carbine has been measured to do. WWB 115 JHP from the carbine averages 579 ft/lbs - Hornady's 10mm 155grain XTP comes closest to this with 551 ft/lbs. Some of the exotic & semi-exotic mfr's do exceed that; Corbon, DoubleTap, etc. But from a pistol, no 10mm load you can buy over-the-counter most places even matches the 'pitiful' USA JHP from the carbine.

And when you get to the better 9mm loads - the +P loads especially - the gap is wider still. The Corbon +P load from the little carbine averages 740 ft/lbs; more than one-third more powerful than a 10mm handgun loaded with even the most powerful Hornady load.

Admittedly, comparing a carbine to a pistol is apples & oranges; even when it's a compact, lightweight carbine like this. But still very worth noting imo, the way folks continuously bash pistol-caliber carbines as 'not enough gun'. The way it was presented to me today was that if a 9mm carbine is such a turd, then a 10mm pistol must be a little baby fart... That just hugely cracked me up when it was pointed out to me. :rofl:

For women, kids, or just for ammo-matching purposes, the pistol-caliber carbine can often be a very good option.


{edit - I had bad info on 10mm loads. Turns out the winchester silvertip typically runs 1230-1240fps - for 575 ft/lbs - from a full-size pistol. So it does match the non-plus-P loads from the carbine. Doesn't exceed them, but does match them. And it still doesn't match the commonly-available 9mm+P loads. That said; my bad, I was wrong. I had bad info and just found this one when double-checking some things.

Confess it still cracks me up though, with all the emotional 10mm worship & pistol-caliber-carbine bashing. The fact that a 10mm pistol with the ONE hottest-loaded mainstream load, just barely matches the 9mm carbine using white-box "generic junk"... :supergrin: }

Glock21Owner
08-24-2012, 18:20
This is great info, thanks for the effort. Is there a site that tests ammo per request? I am trying to find the performance of 62 grain Silver Bear 5.56 soft point, specifically expansion into ballistic gelatin.

quake
08-26-2012, 19:09
...Is there a site that tests ammo per request?...
Not that I'm aware of; at least not on a regular basis. Paco at gunblast.com and leverguns.com, and the guys at theboxotruth.com, have done a few ad hoc tests like that, but I don't know anyplace that does them regularly.

It'd be worth looking up, to see if you can find anyplace; if so, it'd be something good to share.


Fwiw, been busy this weekend with home & church stuff, so didn't get to load up any of the expoxy/jacket bullets I've got made up. Hopefully soon.... :dunno:

G26S239
08-26-2012, 20:54
Interesting results. Thanks for sharing this information. Is the Detonics a 3.25" or 3.5"?

quake
08-28-2012, 08:25
A 3 1/4" version, bearing in mind that that includes the chamber of .9" or so.

So the actual usable barrel length is only 2 1/3", compared to the 4.1" that a full-size 1911 has to work with. No surprise that it was so hard to make a reliable subcompact 1911.