Underwood ammo hype update. [Archive] - Glock Talk

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theSteve
08-19-2012, 14:27
Recently posted about me purchasing five boxes of underwood ammo in various calibers...well I went and shot all of it up today and I must say, I have never been more disappointed in my life. Did it live up to its reputation of performing at the velocities stated? I don't know. But what I can tell you is that every single gun I fired with underwood ammo had some sort of failure. Whether it was ejection or feeding, it happened at least once out of every mag I shot it out of. And trust me I WISH I was exaggerating with that statement. And just to prove my theory that it was poor quality ammo, I shot a box of Winchester between my gen 4 21 and kimber pro raptor and had not a single failure. But my sig sp2340 jammed and so did my gen4 27. So short story long, I will never in my life purchase this junk again. As for you individuals who have nothing but good results with this ammo, consider yourself as lucky as those who own a gen4 19 and have no ejection issues.

Beretta92guy
08-19-2012, 14:59
man, sorry to hear that........

and i was just about to order some of their .45 ammo :((

edit: I think the guy that owns Underwood posts on here sometimes, maybe he can offer some intel on why that happened....

CanyonMan
08-19-2012, 15:29
Man I know 'nothing" about this Underwood ammo, except the 10mm guys love it... But, What you just said, Is why I hand load everything and have for about 45 years... I believe any one can hand load. Even guys in small aprtments. You can make it work if ya really want to. I was stuck livin in a small mobile home out on a ranch my wife and I leased when we firs got married, and built a little table with a 2X12 top and 2x12 legs, with a 2x4 running across to each leg towards the bottom. Bolted the press to the top, and went to it !

It beats buyin ammo, and hopping it works !



Good luck OP. I'd send the stuff back amigo !








CM

gofastman
08-19-2012, 16:28
http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_liksechtRU1qfz3l8.png

elliotb33
08-19-2012, 16:40
TN9 has yet to have a problem in his videos.
Still will be getting some 9mm and 44 mag soon from them.

Happypuppy
08-19-2012, 17:07
I have fired many rounds of it in a G23, 19 and XD tactical .45. No miss feeds or problems of any kind. Everything from standard to +p 230 .45 and 124 grain +p+

ceverhart
08-19-2012, 17:11
Sorry you had issues, all of my underwood ammo has been good. I thought I read where he had said that he had a under performing batch of ammo go out? If I recall correctly he was making it right with the people that got it.....

theSteve
08-19-2012, 18:13
Like I said, some people have great luck with it and in situations like mine, they will not. I'm sure everyone can agree that they would rather know that the reason for their firearm to failure to feed or eject is because of bad ammo and not bad parts. It's a lot easier to just not buy a specific brand of ammo than it is to replace specific parts. So all in all I'm pretty satisfied with that.

CanyonMan
08-19-2012, 19:26
Like I said, some people have great luck with it and in situations like mine, they will not. I'm sure everyone can agree that they would rather know that the reason for their firearm to failure to feed or eject is because of bad ammo and not bad parts. It's a lot easier to just not buy a specific brand of ammo than it is to replace specific parts. So all in all I'm pretty satisfied with that.


Again, amigo. If your not havin problems with any other ammo.... It is a no brainer, and warrants no further discussion. ( as you know) send the stinking ammo back man, and tell him it does not work for you as you have explained to us here. Do not pay for stuff that does not work for ya.... I buy NO one's relaods, and this guy may be a real stand up guy, I do not know. But I do know, that for $300.00 + a few pennies, I do not care how cramped yopu are or where you live, you can reload your own...

Just a suggestion..... ;)



Again, good luck, and I would never use that brand again, Obviously.














CM

unit1069
08-19-2012, 19:43
But I do know, that for $300.00 + a few pennies, I do not care how cramped yopu are or where you live, you can reload your own...

I looked into reloading a couple of years ago and for the life of me I couldn't see how to do it with only $300 outlay, especially after visiting the GT Reloading thread and reading of guys who'd paid upward of $1,000 for equipment and still couldn't produce a single shootable round.

I've got about 1,500 once-fired 9mm casings and probably 1,000 once-fired .357sig casings. I know 9mm is what I'd start with until I became good enough to tackle the more difficult .357sig but I never took the first step after checking out the reloading volume from the library. From what I can tell it's a more complicated process than it appears and I've appealed to the NRA to conduct reloading classes as part of their services, to no avail so far.

kjunderwood
08-19-2012, 21:05
Recently posted about me purchasing five boxes of underwood ammo in various calibers...well I went and shot all of it up today and I must say, I have never been more disappointed in my life. Did it live up to its reputation of performing at the velocities stated? I don't know. But what I can tell you is that every single gun I fired with underwood ammo had some sort of failure. Whether it was ejection or feeding, it happened at least once out of every mag I shot it out of. And trust me I WISH I was exaggerating with that statement. And just to prove my theory that it was poor quality ammo, I shot a box of Winchester between my gen 4 21 and kimber pro raptor and had not a single failure. But my sig sp2340 jammed and so did my gen4 27. So short story long, I will never in my life purchase this junk again. As for you individuals who have nothing but good results with this ammo, consider yourself as lucky as those who own a gen4 19 and have no ejection issues.

As our website states, "If for some reason Underwood Ammunition fails to meet performance expectations, we stand by our product 100% and will make sure the customer is satisfied with every purchase."

I'd love for you to shoot us an email, give us a call, whatever you prefer. I consider myself a pretty easy guy to get along with and would appreciate the opportunity to make this right. This kind of issue is definitely a first for us. Let me know if you need our email address or number. Thanks much, Kevin

CanyonMan
08-19-2012, 21:18
I looked into reloading a couple of years ago and for the life of me I couldn't see how to do it with only $300 outlay, especially after visiting the GT Reloading thread and reading of guys who'd paid upward of $1,000 for equipment and still couldn't produce a single shootable round.

I've got about 1,500 once-fired 9mm casings and probably 1,000 once-fired .357sig casings. I know 9mm is what I'd start with until I became good enough to tackle the more difficult .357sig but I never took the first step after checking out the reloading volume from the library. From what I can tell it's a more complicated process than it appears and I've appealed to the NRA to conduct reloading classes as part of their services, to no avail so far.



Man, My dear amigo.... I don't know how to answer without this being a "novel." haha

Listen, We'll do some more on PM "if ya want to..." But for now, forget all that crap on the GT reoading thread....

Ok, you can get ALL you need from a single stage reloading press (which I have been using for almost 45 years) from cabela's for 300.00 $. About 40.00 for the dies for your particular round, then 1 Pound of powder for 18.00 and the case's you got, and then the primers and bullets, SOOOOO , for about 450.00 you are ready to start with at least "one" caliber...

I started with 44mag 45 years ago, and put 'C' clamps on the press and fixed them to my kitchen counter (I was a bacholer then ha) and loaded tons of 44mag this way until I built a little bitty bench that would fit into a closet.

All I am trying to say is, I will PM you if you want me to (let me know throuh a PM,) and will give you the low down on this, in detail and you should be able to START with actually a $500.00 bill and that is higher than it really is going to be, I am over shooting this (no pun intended) ha.


Does reloading save you tons of money ? NO, does it save you some ? YES ! The major benifit is you'll have them YOUR WAY amigo, and not have to hassle with factory fodder again.

There are tricks and ways of doing this to save $$$$ but we will get into that if ya want to do the PM, or PM me with a Phone # and we can talk. Half of GT already got my # and I get calls all the time anyway ... hahaha. So your more than welcome. NOT that I am some expert, but I do know what I am doing and been doing it most of my life, and love helping folks, so feel free pard.

Rather than take up more space here, if you interested, man shoot me a Pm, and if ya want to hook up on the phone which is MUCH easier than all the typing and PM's, then we can deal with this and get ya set up, and believe me, it will be a blessing to ya, and you'll be glad ya took the step. Yes it cost a few bucks, as i layed out to ya to start, BUT NOT $1,000, NO NO NO.... We are going to forget that junk and keep it at half that !

So man, let me hear from ya if ya want to, and I'll spend all the time ya want to spend, and we'll get 'er done for ya.... ;)



Bless ya.










CM

matt_lowry123
08-19-2012, 22:00
As our website states, "If for some reason Underwood Ammunition fails to meet performance expectations, we stand by our product 100% and will make sure the customer is satisfied with every purchase."

I'd love for you to shoot us an email, give us a call, whatever you prefer. I consider myself a pretty easy guy to get along with and would appreciate the opportunity to make this right. This kind of issue is definitely a first for us. Let me know if you need our email address or number. Thanks much, Kevin


Wow!!! That's some really good customer service!!

I've heard nothing but good things about this company. This justifies it that much more!!

unit1069
08-19-2012, 22:08
So man, let me hear from ya if ya want to, and I'll spend all the time ya want to spend, and we'll get 'er done for ya.... ;)

I'll send you a private email when I figure out how to do it via Glock Talk. I have all GT site messages turned off and it's late tonight so I will give it a go later in the week. I'm semi-retired but will be working the next two weeks full time so be patient. I really do want to learn about reloading and I understand having the brass is a big part I already have covered.

Thanks for the offer.

CanyonMan
08-20-2012, 08:02
I'll send you a private email when I figure out how to do it via Glock Talk. I have all GT site messages turned off and it's late tonight so I will give it a go later in the week. I'm semi-retired but will be working the next two weeks full time so be patient. I really do want to learn about reloading and I understand having the brass is a big part I already have covered.

Thanks for the offer.


Sounds good man. Ask one of the mods how to find the turned off PM feature or what ever, or when ya find it and check mark it to activate it, just click on the word CanyonMan, and you will see 'send a private message'.... !

Look forward to hearing from ya amigo.







CM

plouffedaddy
08-20-2012, 08:11
Wow!!! That's some really good customer service!!

I've heard nothing but good things about this company. This justifies it that much more!!


I've always had a good experience with Underwood ammo and Kevin is great to deal with as well. He'll provide just about any product information you want and does it in a timely manner.

WiskyT
08-20-2012, 12:12
I'll send you a private email when I figure out how to do it via Glock Talk. I have all GT site messages turned off and it's late tonight so I will give it a go later in the week. I'm semi-retired but will be working the next two weeks full time so be patient. I really do want to learn about reloading and I understand having the brass is a big part I already have covered.

Thanks for the offer.

I'm not criticizing CanyonMan as I have read his posts for years and he will give you good usable information. His instructions WILL WORK and you WILL be making your own ammo in short order.

What I will do is say that you can be in business for well under $300.00 if you buy Lee equipment. Their single stage presses work without issue and their dies are some of the best out there.

I would also suggest you get a reloading manual. Lyman, Hornady, Speer, Sierra, it doesn't much matter. You can by the older editions for just a few bucks on Amazon etc or even take one out at the library. You only need one. More manuals only adds to the confusion, which will be minimal with CanyonMan training you.

GTReloading is a mixed bag of info. Really, the internet itself is a mixed bag of reloading info. There are too many people who make reloading too complicated. Many of my posts in GTR are along those lines, that newbs are intimidated by all the info. It chases good people away from reloading.

If your goal is to make consistent, safe, accurate ball ammo, it can easily be done as CM says, and without breaking the bank. Any gear you buy now that down the road seems to slow to use, will still be used by you to do other reloading tasks, so you won't be wasting any money on the stuff you buy now even if you graduate up to fancier gear.

I started out with a Lee hand press, which they still make, and a set of dies. My reloading gear, all of it, fit in a shoebox. That was in 1986 and I still use it even though I have much more elaborate gear.

Also, reloading is FUN. It is just as much of a hobby as shooting. It's a way to do "gun stuff" without even getting dressed. You can reload in your PJ's. You don't need to drive half an hour to the range and half an hour back, only to find it is raining when you get there, pay $10.oo for range time and then shoot $50.00 worth of ammo.

paragon1
08-20-2012, 13:22
I started with a Lee Classic Turret Press. If I had started with a single stage it would have been money wasted. You can run single stage till you get your settings right.

Foxtrotx1
08-20-2012, 13:29
To avoid thread derail, I think it's important to contact the manufacturer and make sure they have a say before you rag on them here.

Besides, this would be the first complaint I have seen. No I'm not a fanboy.

wct097
08-20-2012, 13:41
I looked into reloading a couple of years ago and for the life of me I couldn't see how to do it with only $300 outlay, especially after visiting the GT Reloading thread and reading of guys who'd paid upward of $1,000 for equipment and still couldn't produce a single shootable round.

I've got about 1,500 once-fired 9mm casings and probably 1,000 once-fired .357sig casings. I know 9mm is what I'd start with until I became good enough to tackle the more difficult .357sig but I never took the first step after checking out the reloading volume from the library. From what I can tell it's a more complicated process than it appears and I've appealed to the NRA to conduct reloading classes as part of their services, to no avail so far.

I collected brass for a while, then started buying stuff a little at a time. I bought the cheapest single stage press I could find (~$40 from Lee), Lee Dies ($45), Powder Thrower (~$30), digital scale ($40), tumbler ($50), a few boxes ($20), calipers ($20), primer tool (~$30), powder ($20), and primers ($30). I figure even with the small things & tools that I got in for under $300. I'm probably going to upgrade my press, scale, and primer tool soon, but only for efficiency.

With my current setup, I can knock out about 100 rounds an hour while being very careful with measurements and double checking stuff. Not going to supply me for competition shooting, but it's more than enough to keep me shooting.

WinterWizard
08-20-2012, 14:05
Recently posted about me purchasing five boxes of underwood ammo in various calibers...well I went and shot all of it up today and I must say, I have never been more disappointed in my life. Did it live up to its reputation of performing at the velocities stated? I don't know. But what I can tell you is that every single gun I fired with underwood ammo had some sort of failure. Whether it was ejection or feeding, it happened at least once out of every mag I shot it out of. And trust me I WISH I was exaggerating with that statement. And just to prove my theory that it was poor quality ammo, I shot a box of Winchester between my gen 4 21 and kimber pro raptor and had not a single failure. But my sig sp2340 jammed and so did my gen4 27. So short story long, I will never in my life purchase this junk again. As for you individuals who have nothing but good results with this ammo, consider yourself as lucky as those who own a gen4 19 and have no ejection issues.

So in other words, your guns have an issue with whatever brand/type of hollow point bullets that Underwood is using (Gold Dots, I believe). You do realize that Underwood does not design/manufacture their own projectiles, and barring a problem in OAL, your guns are probably at fault, seeing as no one else seems to be having the same problem.

Sorry, I call BS on this one. All the signs are there: new member, claims multiple types malfunctions with multiple guns, claims a malfunction at least once every mag, and of course no proof (just hearsay). I call super BS, and I don't even care what the OP says, because a BS'er will always try to defend their BS.

WiskyT
08-20-2012, 14:06
I collected brass for a while, then started buying stuff a little at a time. I bought the cheapest single stage press I could find (~$40 from Lee), Lee Dies ($45), Powder Thrower (~$30), digital scale ($40), tumbler ($50), a few boxes ($20), calipers ($20), primer tool (~$30), powder ($20), and primers ($30). I figure even with the small things & tools that I got in for under $300. I'm probably going to upgrade my press, scale, and primer tool soon, but only for efficiency.

With my current setup, I can knock out about 100 rounds an hour while being very careful with measurements and double checking stuff. Not going to supply me for competition shooting, but it's more than enough to keep me shooting.

Yes, and you don't actually need the tumbler, boxes, or calipers. I reloaded for years without them. I used them for a brief time, and rarely, if ever, use them now.

Untumbled brass works just as well as shiny brass. I have never scratched a carbide die in 26 years of reloading. A factory round can be used to adjust dies without the need of a calipers, and I use empty peanut butter jars for my ammo as boxes are a PITA. Free boxes are available for those not too proud to dumpster dive at the range.

So, if you really wanted, or needed to save about $90.00 off of your total, you could still have made ammo.

crnama
08-20-2012, 14:12
Sorry that you have run into issues with your Underwood Ammo, but they make some great ammo that is really hot. I shoot it in both .357 SIG and 10mm and both have been flawless. Kevin is a stand up guy and like he said above will take care of any problems you have. I screwed on an order when I placed it. I called up and Kevin actually answered the phone, figured I would have to leave a message. Kevin fixed my mistake no problem and still shipped the order the same day.

cowboy1964
08-20-2012, 14:16
I looked into reloading a couple of years ago and for the life of me I couldn't see how to do it with only $300 outlay

Lee Classic Turret. I got started for right around $300 I guess, including tumbler, kinetic bullet puller, all that stuff.

I'm ready to upgrade to a Dillon 550B but don't want to drop $500 or whatever right now.

Adamz04
08-20-2012, 14:41
So in other words, your guns have an issue with whatever brand/type of hollow point bullets that Underwood is using (Gold Dots, I believe). You do realize that Underwood does not design/manufacture their own projectiles, and barring a problem in OAL, your guns are probably at fault, seeing as no one else seems to be having the same problem.

Sorry, I call BS on this one. All the signs are there: new member, claims multiple types malfunctions with multiple guns, claims a malfunction at least once every mag, and of course no proof (just hearsay). I call super BS, and I don't even care what the OP says, because a BS'er will always try to defend their BS.

Kinda what I was thinking, but I never like to accuse someone of being dishonest. I've shot underwoods 357 sig GD and fmj with no issues. I was very accurate with it. I have some 380 and 9mm on deck but haven't made it to the range yet. IMO the only thing that could make underwood ammo better is if Kevin could get a ahold of the hST bullet. I know it won't happen but I can wish.

I really like my underwood ammo and will continue to buy it.

PghJim
08-20-2012, 15:35
I have shot well over 1,500 rounds of Underwood in 9mm, 38 Super, 40 S&W, 10mm, 357 Sig and 45 ACP. I have not had one failure to feed or eject. The guns would be a Kimber 10mm, G29, two G19's, Kahr P45, two G32's, a G23 and a custom 1911 I built in 38 Super.

No Mercy
08-20-2012, 17:58
Ive shot underwood out of everything from glock's,beretta's, and Smith's. No issues what so ever. I trust my life to it and all my handguns are loaded with it. I think Kevin's post here says alot about him and his business.

Snapper2
08-20-2012, 18:19
No problems here either. I rank it higher than Buffalo Bore and Doubletap because of the price.:cool:

theSteve
08-20-2012, 20:07
So in other words, your guns have an issue with whatever brand/type of hollow point bullets that Underwood is using (Gold Dots, I believe). You do realize that Underwood does not design/manufacture their own projectiles, and barring a problem in OAL, your guns are probably at fault, seeing as no one else seems to be having the same problem.

Sorry, I call BS on this one. All the signs are there: new member, claims multiple types malfunctions with multiple guns, claims a malfunction at least once every mag, and of course no proof (just hearsay). I call super BS, and I don't even care what the OP says, because a BS'er will always try to defend their BS.

Actually no, their 185 grain golden saber hollow points functioned flawlessly in both my gen4 21 and kimber pro raptor that I purchased less than three months ago. So I guess not Kevin's ammo anymore that has the problem, it's my brand new guns. Hmm...makes me wonder though about the hundreds of other rounds I have shot through both of those firearms and never had an issue with. I guess it was all smoke and mirrors. Oh wait, it must be because I'm a new member and have no idea what I'm talking about. I guess I'll just take everything you have to say as the truth and move on with my life. It makes me happy to know that you have heard every single review and were present with everyone while they were shooting their underwood ammo to know exactly how it functioned for them. It puts me at ease knowing that you are so knowledgable. Thank you for your enlightenment.

PghJim
08-20-2012, 20:48
The Wizard of Oz likes to accuse people of BS, but I will say that it sounds unusual. The ammo may be to blame, but I would guess it to be maybe something else. At least contributing. Can you describe the failures to feed and what kind of ejection problems (if I remember the first post correctly) were you experiencing. I am not calling it BS, but believe there may be something else here at work. Also, it is not unusual to have a gun that does not like a particular round, whether Underwood, Speer, Federal, Winchester, etc.

Also you were not specific. It looks like you were shooting two 40's and two 45 ACP's. Which Underwood rounds were you having trouble with? Kevin makes a lot of different rounds and I just learned that the GS 45's were OK. Also, do not be upset if people want additional information. You are negatively painting an entire company with a pretty wide brush.

WinterWizard
08-20-2012, 20:55
Actually no, their 185 grain golden saber hollow points functioned flawlessly in both my gen4 21 and kimber pro raptor that I purchased less than three months ago. So I guess not Kevin's ammo anymore that has the problem, it's my brand new guns. Hmm...makes me wonder though about the hundreds of other rounds I have shot through both of those firearms and never had an issue with. I guess it was all smoke and mirrors. Oh wait, it must be because I'm a new member and have no idea what I'm talking about. I guess I'll just take everything you have to say as the truth and move on with my life. It makes me happy to know that you have heard every single review and were present with everyone while they were shooting their underwood ammo to know exactly how it functioned for them. It puts me at ease knowing that you are so knowledgable. Thank you for your enlightenment.

Predictable. Now go tell someone who cares. You, too, Jim. :wavey:

PghJim
08-20-2012, 21:00
Predictable. Now go tell someone who cares. You, too, Jim. :wavey:

Hey, I am not disagreeing with you. At least this time.

theSteve
08-20-2012, 22:07
Predictable. Now go tell someone who cares. You, too, Jim. :wavey:

Apparently you cared enough being that you involve yourself. Which I find confusing because all you did was embarrass yourself. Its okay though, i definitely dont mind your opinion. Hell everyone has one.

theSteve
08-20-2012, 22:23
The Wizard of Oz likes to accuse people of BS, but I will say that it sounds unusual. The ammo may be to blame, but I would guess it to be maybe something else. At least contributing. Can you describe the failures to feed and what kind of ejection problems (if I remember the first post correctly) were you experiencing. I am not calling it BS, but believe there may be something else here at work. Also, it is not unusual to have a gun that does not like a particular round, whether Underwood, Speer, Federal, Winchester, etc.

Also you were not specific. It looks like you were shooting two 40's and two 45 ACP's. Which Underwood rounds were you having trouble with? Kevin makes a lot of different rounds and I just learned that the GS 45's were OK. Also, do not be upset if people want additional information. You are negatively painting an entire company with a pretty wide brush.

If what I had to say about my experience is negatively painting an entire company with a wide brush, well then you buddy are easily persuaded. Ones personal experience and opinion is just that. Nothing more, nothing less. I am more than confident that underwood ammo is a quality product. If it wasn't, there wouldn't be people like that wizard guy defending them like it's his teenage daughters virginity.

Glockbuster
08-20-2012, 23:03
This is why I always buy and shoot the ammo that I and my guns like best with no problems.

Tiro Fijo
08-20-2012, 23:08
...Whether it was ejection or feeding, it happened at least once out of every mag I shot it out of. And trust me I WISH I was exaggerating with that statement. And just to prove my theory that it was poor quality ammo, I shot a box of Winchester between my gen 4 21 and kimber pro raptor and had not a single failure. But my sig sp2340 jammed and so did my gen4 27. So short story long, I will never in my life purchase this junk again. As for you individuals who have nothing but good results with this ammo, consider yourself as lucky as those who own a gen4 19 and have no ejection issues.


I've highlighted what for me are clues. Was the Underwood ammo that you "attempted" to shoot hot stuff or their range fodder? If it was the hot stuff then you may need + power mag springs as the slide is recoiling too quickly to retrieve another cartridge. However, that you were also having ejection problems leads me to believe...


shooter induced error. The odds are infinitesimal that THREE entirely different type cartridges from the same maker used in multiple guns would have multipe FTF's & FTE's on the same day. The only other option is that you are the unluckiest shooter on Earth and I think not.

Also, in the future contact the manufacturer BEFORE you post on the Internet slamming them. It's classier.

brausso
08-20-2012, 23:19
I've purchased 10mm, 357 sig, 45, and 9mm from Underwood and never had an issue. As others have said, Kevin is a stand up guy and clearly offered to fix your problem. Give the guy a chance before spewing it all out on GT.

I've shot many rounds and trust their ammo with my life and is what I currently carry

theSteve
08-21-2012, 00:09
Kevin is a very stand up guy. We actual spoke on the phone today for a half an hour trying to figure out what the problem was. So I am more than aware that he is willing to "right a wrong." I am very appreciative of his time and concern for not only his company but his customers. As for not having adequate mags to accommodate the + P rounds I was shooting, that very well may be the case.

PghJim
08-21-2012, 05:26
If what I had to say about my experience is negatively painting an entire company with a wide brush, well then you buddy are easily persuaded. Ones personal experience and opinion is just that.

I think you should re-read your first post.

WiskyT
08-21-2012, 05:26
Kevin is a very stand up guy. We actual spoke on the phone today for a half an hour trying to figure out what the problem was. So I am more than aware that he is willing to "right a wrong." I am very appreciative of his time and concern for not only his company but his customers. As for not having adequate mags to accommodate the + P rounds I was shooting, that very well may be the case.

You started a separate thread bashing the ammo before you even bought it. I agree with Wizzard.

Even your description of the malfunctions is practically non-existent. You post a barely literate blurb about how none of it worked in anything. But to defend yourself against the charge of being a troll, you go to great effort.

You're a troll.

Glockbuster
08-21-2012, 07:53
Kevin is a very stand up guy. We actual spoke on the phone today for a half an hour trying to figure out what the problem was. So I am more than aware that he is willing to "right a wrong." I am very appreciative of his time and concern for not only his company but his customers. As for not having adequate mags to accommodate the + P rounds I was shooting, that very well may be the case.

I am glad you have a different perspective.

This company is going about the great way of making business reborn. I myself are amazed at the lengths he is going through and we should all be supportive for his growth. Who knows where this company might be a few years from now and it is in our best interest.

theSteve
08-21-2012, 08:10
I think you should re-read your first post.

Because I said it was junk and it malfunctioned for me? Yeah that still sounds more like a personal opinion and experience to me.

theSteve
08-21-2012, 08:17
You started a separate thread bashing the ammo before you even bought it. I agree with Wizzard.

Even your description of the malfunctions is practically non-existent. You post a barely literate blurb about how none of it worked in anything. But to defend yourself against the charge of being a troll, you go to great effort.

You're a troll.

"I started a separate thread bashing on the ammo before I even bought it?" Well actually that's not true. If you did your research there is two threads, pre and post purchase. And how are my discriptions non-existent? Are feeding and ejection issues not existent?

WiskyT
08-21-2012, 08:21
"I started a separate thread bashing on the ammo before I even bought it?" Well actually that's not true. If you did your research there is two threads, pre and post purchase. And how are my discriptions non-existent? Are feeding and ejection issues not existent?

Back to the manic phase I suppose...

PghJim
08-21-2012, 08:45
Because I said it was junk and it malfunctioned for me? Yeah that still sounds more like a personal opinion and experience to me.

We take personal experiences here at CC seriously, at least by people we trust. I would not be on this site if there was nothing to learn. If that is your "official" position, please put in your posts that others may wish to ignore it.

PghJim
08-21-2012, 08:50
And how are my discriptions non-existent? Are feeding and ejection issues not existent?

That tells us nothing about the type of feeding and ejection issues you say you were experiencing.

jbglock
08-21-2012, 09:54
No experience with Underwood. Next time you talk to him though please ask him what exactly is 40 cal +P ammo when it is my understanding their is not SAAMI standard for +P loading in that caliber as they consider it unsafe. Gun where required are proofed at a load that is only at 130% the CIP max. A 135 grain JHP at 1500fps sounds like it would be a proof load. Corbon isn't exactly known for light loading anything and their 135 grain JHP is at 1325 fps muzzle. Is Underwood testing for pressure?

theSteve
08-21-2012, 10:13
We take personal experiences here at CC seriously, at least by people we trust. I would not be on this site if there was nothing to learn. If that is your "official" position, please put in your posts that others may wish to ignore it.

Well from my experience here on GT and what I've witnessed everyone else do is thee exact same thing I have done. I've stated an opinion and experience just like everyone else has. It's not my problem if it's not the same opinion or experience you have.

matt_lowry123
08-22-2012, 07:55
@thesteve. I'd just quit while you're behind!!! None of us were there, so we can't really say what happened. You're fighting an uphill battle.

theSteve
08-22-2012, 08:27
@thesteve. I'd just quit while you're behind!!! None of us were there, so we can't really say what happened. You're fighting an uphill battle.

Fighting an uphill battle? Don't flatter yourself. You said it yourself, you weren't there. Leave it at that.

Glockbuster
08-22-2012, 10:41
I donīt think The Steve has an agenda against Underwood ammo, look at his more recents posts. What is this about knocking other posterīs experiences ?

PghJim
08-22-2012, 10:53
If I recall, he started another post, "Underwood Ammo Hype..." when he ordered some and hoped that it is as good as everyone says. I actually think he may had some problems not associated with the ammo, that were exagerated a bit.

As Steve would say, that is just my opinion.

theSteve
08-22-2012, 11:30
If I recall, he started another post, "Underwood Ammo Hype..." when he ordered some and hoped that it is as good as everyone says. I actually think he may had some problems not associated with the ammo, that were exagerated a bit.

As Steve would say, that is just my opinion.

Can you elaborate as to what problems you think I may have had? I ask because I didn't have any problems with the other ammo I shot.

uz2bUSMC
08-22-2012, 15:42
I've highlighted what for me are clues. Was the Underwood ammo that you "attempted" to shoot hot stuff or their range fodder? If it was the hot stuff then you may need + power mag springs as the slide is recoiling too quickly to retrieve another cartridge. However, that you were also having ejection problems leads me to believe...


shooter induced error. The odds are infinitesimal that THREE entirely different type cartridges from the same maker used in multiple guns would have multipe FTF's & FTE's on the same day. The only other option is that you are the unluckiest shooter on Earth and I think not.

Also, in the future contact the manufacturer BEFORE you post on the Internet slamming them. It's classier.



This.

matt_lowry123
08-22-2012, 19:46
Fighting an uphill battle? Don't flatter yourself. You said it yourself, you weren't there. Leave it at that.

:upeyes:

You're trying pretty hard to convince everybody about your ammo problems!! Sorry there's an error in your grip and or guns. You don't have to justify it to me. This whole thread comes off like a noob. Probably because you're new around here.

copo9560
08-22-2012, 20:02
I am another very satisfied customer of Underwood. Mostly 10mm but have also tried their 9mm+p for wife's S&W. All so far have performed 100%.

The 10mm loads are near nuke hot - one of the few companies that know how to load it right and maintain a reasonable price.

theSteve
08-22-2012, 20:25
:upeyes:

You're trying pretty hard to convince everybody about your ammo problems!! Sorry there's an error in your grip and or guns. You don't have to justify it to me. This whole thread comes off like a noob. Probably because you're new around here.

Don't exactly know what being new has to do with anything, but okay. I can't really take you or what you have to say seriously specifically because your posts resemble how a 13 year old school girl texts. I've never met an adult who felt it was appropriate to do things such as ":upeyes:" That just seems feminine/childish. But it's okay, I'm probably just mistaking it for you being the cool guy around here.

JimIsland
08-22-2012, 20:28
This is the first I've heard of an issue with Underwood ammo. Just for the record, Ive shot a ton of this stuff in .380, 10mm, 9mm and 357 Sig. Zero issues and yes....I am a fan as I love his stuff. Your isolated situation is an unfortunate one.

matt_lowry123
08-22-2012, 21:25
I am a 13 year old girl. I also don't limp wrist it. Do you not work your grip enough?

theSteve
08-22-2012, 22:53
I am a 13 year old girl. I also don't limp wrist it. Do you not work your grip enough?

Cool guy strikes again! I look forward to your next comical post.

Beretta92guy
08-23-2012, 03:59
maybe the OP is really Mike Mcnett from DoubleCRAP ammo trying to sabotage the competition who is making a superior product to his inferior crap

uz2bUSMC
08-23-2012, 04:45
:upeyes:

You're trying pretty hard to convince everybody about your ammo problems!! Sorry there's an error in your grip and or guns. You don't have to justify it to me. This whole thread comes off like a noob. Probably because you're new around here.

This too.

PghJim
08-23-2012, 06:28
Can you elaborate as to what problems you think I may have had? I ask because I didn't have any problems with the other ammo I shot.

I was not talking to you.

theSteve
08-23-2012, 08:14
I was not talking to you.

Yeah well now I'm talking to you.

WiskyT
08-23-2012, 08:22
Yeah well now I'm talking to you.

That Biden-like wit really helps your credibility:rofl:

jbglock
08-23-2012, 08:51
theSteve, most of those posting sound like kids. I don't know why you are encouraging them. If they don't have enough sense to know something can be dangerous then they certainly aren't going to understand you stating that different ammo in your gun doesn't cause these problems you are reporting.

theSteve
08-23-2012, 08:52
That Biden-like wit really helps your credibility:rofl:

I don't follow politics. So that statement was just as useless as all of your others. Good try though. : patsyouontheback :

theSteve
08-23-2012, 09:16
theSteve, most of those posting sound like kids. I don't know why you are encouraging them. If they don't have enough sense to know something can be dangerous then they certainly aren't going to understand you stating that different ammo in your gun doesn't cause these problems you are reporting.

Truth be told, I'm not really encouraging it. I stated what I had to say and left it at that. People took it upon themselves to challenge what they dont know.

JasonC8301
08-23-2012, 10:13
So what made the ammo suck? I read your original post twice then the thread, what went wrong with the ammo? What kind of jams? Stove pipe, double feed, failure to feed?

WiskyT
08-23-2012, 11:41
I don't follow politics. So that statement was just as useless as all of your others. Good try though. : patsyouontheback :

If you don't know who biden is, then I don't think that is going to win over any believers of your nonsense.

theSteve
08-23-2012, 12:20
If you don't know who biden is, then I don't think that is going to win over any believers of your nonsense.

I said I don't follow politics, not that I didn't know who he was. If you don't know how to read a simple statement and understand it, then I don't think that is going to win over believers of your nonsense. :thumbsupforagoodtry:

uz2bUSMC
08-23-2012, 13:10
So what made the ammo suck? I read your original post twice then the thread, what went wrong with the ammo? What kind of jams? Stove pipe, double feed, failure to feed?

See, you are wasting your time. He doesn't want help or to hear that there might be something he can fix with his shooting technique and/or firearms. He prefers to argue.

Wait for it...

JasonC8301
08-23-2012, 13:58
See, you are wasting your time. He doesn't want help or to hear that there might be something he can fix with his shooting technique and/or firearms. He prefers to argue.

Wait for it...


Figures.....

theSteve
08-23-2012, 13:59
See, you are wasting your time. He doesn't want help or to hear that there might be something he can fix with his shooting technique and/or firearms. He prefers to argue.

Wait for it...

Thank you for speaking for me. That just saved me a lot of arguing. Truth be told I'm not avoiding explaining anything, just avoiding all of these self proclaimed shooting experts saying its limp wristing. Whats the point in explaining something to people who already have a preconceived mentality as to what the problem is. Yeah...I'll pass on that.

luisbet1032
08-23-2012, 14:24
Underwood ammo: two boxes of each and all good here. 9mm +p+ hp, 10mm xtp 180gr hp, 10mm 180 saber hp,10mm 200gr hp. The best ammo I shot so far. Great for the price....This ammo really rock my glocks....More to come.

uz2bUSMC
08-23-2012, 14:39
Thank you for speaking for me. That just saved me a lot of arguing. Truth be told I'm not avoiding explaining anything, just avoiding all of these self proclaimed shooting experts saying its limp wristing. Whats the point in explaining something to people who already have a preconceived mentality as to what the problem is. Yeah...I'll pass on that.

Well, some here have asked for more details. This usually happens when you post a problem. Many will want those details to try and help. From what you have said of your problem it seems that you have not seen this happen before and have not come across this problem through research. Unfortunately, the problem really does sound like a combination of two things: weak mag springs and limp wristing. This is why you have not had a problem with normal factory ammo prior to this. You may not be a new shooter but you seem to be new to hot ammo. People can only offer advice based on the information you give and that is what has happened.

If you are unreceptive to the possibility that you and/or your weapons are the problem you may never fix the issue. Can the ammo be the culprit? Sure. Is it likely based on the information you are willing to share? Not really. At least in my opinion.

theSteve
08-23-2012, 15:40
Well, some here have asked for more details. This usually happens when you post a problem. Many will want those details to try and help. From what you have said of your problem it seems that you have not seen this happen before and have not come across this problem through research. Unfortunately, the problem really does sound like a combination of two things: weak mag springs and limp wristing. This is why you have not had a problem with normal factory ammo prior to this. You may not be a new shooter but you seem to be new to hot ammo. People can only offer advice based on the information you give and that is what has happened.

If you are unreceptive to the possibility that you and/or your weapons are the problem you may never fix the issue. Can the ammo be the culprit? Sure. Is it likely based on the information you are willing to share? Not really. At least in my opinion.

Truth be told, my main intention WAS to post about my experience and get some insight about what the possibilities could have been. But before it could even come to that point, everyone that has a underwood ammo hard-on started bashing my credibility. So what once had the potential to be insightful for anyone willing to read quickly turned into a pissing match. Which is fine, everyone has their own opinion. But the events that have occurred haven't really made me want to put in any effort in explaining anything. I will say this, do I shoot hot ammo often? Eh...occasionally. I usually just buy basic target ammo when I shoot. But I've never had issues before with any kind of ammo. And you stated that it could also be my mag springs. Okay, that very much well could be it as well. I will add though that all of my firearms are fairly new and have also bought better quality(I hope) mags for my 1911. Another point I would like to make is that I doubt everyone who has fired underwood ammo through their gun has updated their mag springs. That just seems silly to me. I can't imagine someone thinking to themselves, "my underwood ammo just arrived, time to update my mag springs." With that being said, that leaves open the idea of me limp wristing. If it makes a difference, my very first handgun was a sig sp2340 chambered in .357 sig. That gun has a lot of kick behind it and over the years I've learned to control it. So handling something as smooth as a gen4 21, gen4 27 and a 1911 is a breeze. With all that being said, agree or disagree but it is what it is.

uz2bUSMC
08-23-2012, 15:53
Truth be told, my main intention WAS to post about my experience and get some insight about what the possibilities could have been. But before it could even come to that point, everyone that has a underwood ammo hard-on started bashing my credibility. So what once had the potential to be insightful for anyone willing to read quickly turned into a pissing match. Which is fine, everyone has their own opinion. But the events that have occurred haven't really made me want to put in any effort in explaining anything. I will say this, do I shoot hot ammo often? Eh...occasionally. I usually just buy basic target ammo when I shoot. But I've never had issues before with any kind of ammo. And you stated that it could also be my mag springs. Okay, that very much well could be it as well. I will add though that all of my firearms are fairly new and have also bought better quality(I hope) mags for my 1911. Another point I would like to make is that I doubt everyone who has fired underwood ammo through their gun has updated their mag springs. That just seems silly to me. I can't imagine someone thinking to themselves, "my underwood ammo just arrived, time to update my mag springs." With that being said, that leaves open the idea of me limp wristing. If it makes a difference, my very first handgun was a sig sp2340 chambered in .357 sig. That gun has a lot of kick behind it and over the years I've learned to control it. So handling something as smooth as a gen4 21, gen4 27 and a 1911 is a breeze. With all that being said, agree or disagree but it is what it is.

Gotcha. I understand your point on the "updating" mag springs. Some have done this while shooting hotter reloads or understand why they are getting failures to feed and go ahead and do that. It's not so much updating to brand new springs but upgrading to heavier weight springs. I would still venture to guess that this will help your problem... as far as the failures to eject, I don't know.

stevewonderful
08-25-2012, 14:28
So in other words, your guns have an issue with whatever brand/type of hollow point bullets that Underwood is using (Gold Dots, I believe). You do realize that Underwood does not design/manufacture their own projectiles, and barring a problem in OAL, your guns are probably at fault, seeing as no one else seems to be having the same problem.

Sorry, I call BS on this one. All the signs are there: new member, claims multiple types malfunctions with multiple guns, claims a malfunction at least once every mag, and of course no proof (just hearsay). I call super BS, and I don't even care what the OP says, because a BS'er will always try to defend their BS.

I'm with you on this Winter. That was my first thought also. I read many, many forums and this is the first time I have heard a complaint about their ammo.

Me thinks this could possibly be McNett from DoubleCrap or one of his workers. (his ammo is twice the price and his velocity claims are usually off by an average of 200fps)
I imagine Underwood has seriously cut into his sales.

Or maybe its Buffalo Boring ammo who sells montana gold bullets in his ammo and markets them as gold dots....

Or I could be wrong. Smells fishy to me though.

This fellow has done alot of testing:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AjsXvXEryDJjdFhsRUcwSHRUcktCMmhOMTVFa25xa1E#gid=0

https://www.facebook.com/pages/10mm-ammo/188837037856507

cowboy1964
08-25-2012, 15:23
Or maybe its Buffalo Boring ammo who sells montana gold bullets in his ammo and markets them as gold dots....


Do you have a link to said marketing?

Beretta92guy
08-25-2012, 19:01
i too, think this OP is affiliated with DoubleCRAP ammo....

we all know how much DoubleCRAP overstates its velocity, and its over twice the cost of Underwood.....

nice try McNett......maybe you need to find another line of work, like putting out DECENT ammo that works at an affordable price......

Kingarthurhk
08-25-2012, 20:03
Interesting. I have had trouble with the XTP underwood 10mm rounds causing a double feed in all my magazines using an LWD barrel. I have had the feed ramp and throat polished just in case that was the issue. I plan on trying to pop some more rounds next week and see if this solves the issue.

I would like to believe it is the grail of ammo at its price point. But, only time and experimentation will tell until I run out of the ammo I bought.

The pistol in question is a G20SF with a grip reduction, standard slide, tungsten guide rod, 22lb spring, with trigicon night sights and the LWD barrel.

What I am trying to do is get full power 10mm to feed reliably. I am wondering if if the barrel throat that I just had worked on.

I had the same problem with Swamp Fox XTP's and and Underwood XTP's. I wondering if it is just the shape of the bullet before getting the feed ramp and throat polished.

But, like I said, a range trip will tell one way or the other I hope.

stevewonderful
08-25-2012, 20:34
Do you have a link to said marketing?

Not anymore. I just checked his 10mm page and he now shows a picture of a montana gold jhp (which are target bullets) where I'm told (hear say) he use to post gold dot pictures. https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=114

Montana Gold bullets are designed and produced as target bullets. The are NOT for defensive use or hunting. They are not consistent performers as seen by your test of the 45acp+p 230gr. JHP load. Buffalo Bore .45 ACP +P 230 gr JHP AMMO TEST - YouTube

Although I will say my water jug test of his 10mm 180gr. JHP listed above was impressive. But living things aren't water surrounded by plastic.

s0nspark
08-26-2012, 17:05
Truth be told, my main intention WAS to post about my experience and get some insight about what the possibilities could have been.

You would have been better served, then, by starting this thread with more details and less of the "never buying this junk again" stuff.

If you really thought bad ammo was to blame why vent online instead of taking it up with Underwood so they can make it right? They are a good company and they stand behind their product.

theSteve
08-26-2012, 18:12
You would have been better served, then, by starting this thread with more details and less of the "never buying this junk again" stuff.

If you really thought bad ammo was to blame why vent online instead of taking it up with Underwood so they can make it right? They are a good company and they stand behind their product.

Thank you for telling me what I would be or would have been better off doing. That helps a lot for future references. And it's quite obvious that you either A) don't know how to understand what you read or B) skipped to the very last page of this thread to post your own opinion. if you must know, I spoke personally with Kevin and the issue was made right.

s0nspark
08-26-2012, 18:30
Thank you for telling me what I would be or would have been better off doing. That helps a lot for future references. And it's quite obvious that you either A) don't know how to understand what you read or B) skipped to the very last page of this thread to post your own opinion. if you must know, I spoke personally with Kevin and the issue was made right.

Glad to hear it. ;-)

9mm +p+
08-26-2012, 19:37
God let this die already...

spyderhead
02-27-2014, 10:08
Hundreds of rounds of Underwood 10mm ammo fired without one single glitch. Glock 20 and Underwood - marriage made in heaven!

intecooler
02-28-2014, 07:24
Sounds like crappy guns. I will trade or buy your crappy Underwood ammo.

1canvas
03-06-2014, 12:49
I looked into reloading a couple of years ago and for the life of me I couldn't see how to do it with only $300 outlay, especially after visiting the GT Reloading thread and reading of guys who'd paid upward of $1,000 for equipment and still couldn't produce a single shootable round.

I've got about 1,500 once-fired 9mm casings and probably 1,000 once-fired .357sig casings. I know 9mm is what I'd start with until I became good enough to tackle the more difficult .357sig but I never took the first step after checking out the reloading volume from the library. From what I can tell it's a more complicated process than it appears and I've appealed to the NRA to conduct reloading classes as part of their services, to no avail so far.

I reload and have less than 500.00 at today prices if I bought new but 300.00 when I purchased.