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Smitty1283
09-22-2012, 08:46
I started on a Lee Single Stage and all 500 124gn LRN fired without issue. I sold the rest of the hardcast bullets, bought Barry's and I get a Dilon 550b and haven't had any success yet.

Specs:
Tite-group 3.5gn
115gn Barry's Plated RN
CCI 500 primers
1.14OAL
Glock 19 Gen4
and
Glock 23 w/ 40-9 conversion LWD barrel

My specs from Hodgden says 115LRN gets 3.5-3.9gn.

Everything cleared the barrel but after every round I needed to either clear a stovepipe or I would have to manually rack the slide to extract the brass.

I even ran some of the rounds through my old Lee factory crimp die to see if it was something with my Dillon and it didn't make a difference.

I think I need to throw 3.7gns and see if I have success. I don't have a chronograph so I have no idea what velocity I'm working with.

Disclaimer---I bought tite-group with little knowledge of powders. If I would have known that .4gns was the difference between minimum and maximum loads, I wouldn't have gone with it.

Thoughts?

J

Colorado4Wheel
09-22-2012, 09:07
Just work it up. Your simply not generating enough slide velocity. Titegroup isn't evil. It's a great powder if you just are careful. Plated bullets exist between lead and jacketed. So look at the FMJ data as well.

Good for you for being cautious. Just keep working it up till the load works better.

ColoCG
09-22-2012, 09:08
I started on a Lee Single Stage and all 500 124gn LRN fired without issue. I sold the rest of the hardcast bullets, bought Barry's and I get a Dilon 550b and haven't had any success yet.

Specs:
Tite-group 3.5gn
115gn Barry's Plated RN
CCI 500 primers
1.14OAL
Glock 19 Gen4
and
Glock 23 w/ 40-9 conversion LWD barrel

My specs from Hodgden says 115LRN gets 3.5-3.9gn.

Everything cleared the barrel but after every round I needed to either clear a stovepipe or I would have to manually rack the slide to extract the brass.

I even ran some of the rounds through my old Lee factory crimp die to see if it was something with my Dillon and it didn't make a difference.

I think I need to throw 3.7gns and see if I have success. I don't have a chronograph so I have no idea what velocity I'm working with.

Disclaimer---I bought tite-group with little knowledge of powders. If I would have known that .4gns was the difference between minimum and maximum loads, I wouldn't have gone with it.

Thoughts?

J

It sounds like your load is too light, Hodgdon's web site lists 3.9gr as starting and 4.3grs as max for titegroup wit the 115gr lrn in 9 mm. With an oal of 1.100". Especially in a Gen 4, you might want to increase your load slightly .1gr. at a time to see if you can get prper functioning.
Hodgdon's FMJ loads start at 4.5gr. of Titegroup and go to 4.8gr. as max.
And yes I am not a big fan of Titegroup either. WSF or Unique would be a better choice. IMO.

Colorado4Wheel
09-22-2012, 09:20
Also you are loading really long. Look at the data posted in the other active 9mm powder/problems threads and you will see some chrono data for 124gr bullets using 4.2 grs of TG. Your lighter bullets and longer OAL loads will require even more powder.

shotgunred
09-22-2012, 09:37
Specs:
Tite-group 3.5gn
115gn Barry's Plated RN
CCI 500 primers
1.14OAL
Glock 19 Gen4
and
Glock 23 w/ 40-9 conversion LWD barrel

Thoughts?

J
http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp
Titegroup OAL 1.100 3.9 gr = 1075 4.3 = 1151

By looking at hodgon data you are running your load to light. You are running less powder at a longer OAL than their minimum. Bump up your powder charge.

fredj338
09-22-2012, 10:21
I doubt the 3.5gr charge is giving you enough slide momentum Starting loads, any powder, rarely give 100% reliable functioning IME. Bump the charge wt a bit. WHile Steve thinks TG is a "great powder" I do think it's an evil plot to eliminate reloaders/shooters. That's an entirely diff thread though.

WiskyT
09-22-2012, 11:10
Also, the 40 caliber slide and your conversion barrel weigh more than the 9mm barrel/slide combo, so there is more inertia to deal with.

fredj338
09-22-2012, 13:10
Also, the 40 caliber slide and your conversion barrel weigh more than the 9mm barrel/slide combo, so there is more inertia to deal with.

I run a 9mm conv in my G32, runs fine w/ normal vel 9mm loads in any bullet wt. The OP's issue is his load, not the gun.:dunno:

WiskyT
09-22-2012, 13:37
I run a 9mm conv in my G32, runs fine w/ normal vel 9mm loads in any bullet wt. The OP's issue is his load, not the gun.:dunno:

It's called a contributing factor. Yes, his load is too light, but the heavier slide and barrel are aggravating the issue as well.

Smitty1283
09-22-2012, 16:27
It's called a contributing factor. Yes, his load is too light, but the heavier slide and barrel are aggravating the issue as well.

I tried the loads in both a gen4 g19 and in a gen3 g23 with a conversion barrel.

I agree....problem is definitely with the loads. I loaded up 20 at 3.9gns and 5 at 4.0gns.

I'm looking for the minimum load to cycle reliably.

Jon


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Arc Angel
09-22-2012, 17:22
Too long a cartridge OAL. Way too light a powder charge for Tightgroup and BERRY'S MANUFACTURING plated bullets. (I've shot 10's of 1,000's of them.) According to the Speer manual sitting on my desk, Tightgroup isn't recommended for use with lead (or plated) bullets. Using a COAL that's long enough to engage the rifling might not be a good idea, either. Is your brass showing any signs of increased ignition pressure?

There are other considerations to using a progressive press to reload with besides economy. I always liked to use whatever powder filled the case up the best. (This way it would be easier for me to spot a double-charge should one ever occur.) My favorite powder for 9mm remains Alliant Red Dot. (Although I, also, used Blue Dot for +P loads.) If my pistol bullets are long enough to easily fit into the magazine, chamber completely, and just protrude into the leade area of the chamber, then, I'm happy; and getting them to fly where I want is more up to me than the specifications of whatever pistol round I'm shooting.

shotgunred
09-22-2012, 20:16
I agree....problem is definitely with the loads. I loaded up 20 at 3.9gns and 5 at 4.0gns.

I'm looking for the minimum load to cycle reliably.

Jon


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Why the minimum load to cycle reliably?
I think you will find that going above that will improve accuracy.

Smitty1283
09-23-2012, 17:52
Why the minimum load to cycle reliably?
I think you will find that going above that will improve accuracy.

Never knew that...!

I'm just looking for a low recoil round for plinking steel and paper.

J


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fredj338
09-23-2012, 17:59
Never knew that...!

I'm just looking for a low recoil round for plinking steel and paper.

J


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Powders burn efficiently within a certain range. So starting loads will seldom give best accuracy or functioning. A proper load workup in 1/10gr increments will tell you what your gun likes.

shotgunred
09-23-2012, 19:15
I load for accuracy first.
I will start a bit below published min. Load up 10 and then step up .2 gr and load another 10. I will go this several times stopping several 10ths below max. Bring a target for each batch and shoot off a bench rest. Once I find the most accurate load I go up and down a 10th to finalize the most accurate load.

fredj338
09-23-2012, 22:45
I load for accuracy first.
I will start a bit below published min. Load up 10 and then step up .2 gr and load another 10. I will go this several times stopping several 10ths below max. Bring a target for each batch and shoot off a bench rest. Once I find the most accurate load I go up and down a 10th to finalize the most accurate load.

The ammo has to function, so reliability is always #1. I have a 223 load that will shoot uunder 1/2MOA in my 20" hvy, but you have to single load it, so it doesn't get the nod. I have rarely if ever found a load below starting, for anything, that is 100% reliable in a semiauto. WHile accuracy is #2, some guys must make a min PF for gun games, so that also comes into play. Again, a load that shoots one ragged hole @ 15yds is pretty useless if it doesn't make min PF for your gun game. Point is, lots of things to consider when reloading for a given gun/caliber.:wavey:

Arc Angel
09-24-2012, 11:20
The ammo has to function, so reliability is always #1. I have a 223 load that will shoot uunder 1/2MOA in my 20" hvy, but you have to single load it, so it doesn't get the nod. I have rarely if ever found a load below starting, for anything, that is 100% reliable in a semiauto. WHile accuracy is #2, some guys must make a min PF for gun games, so that also comes into play. Again, a load that shoots one ragged hole @ 15yds is pretty useless if it doesn't make min PF for your gun game. Point lots of things to consider when reloading for a given gun/caliber.:wavey:

:thumbsup: Brilliant!

(I don't know, 'Why' you even had to say it?) ;)

BubbaD
09-25-2012, 08:43
I have had this problem with my daughters S&W M&P shield. I was loading 3.3 gr TG, 124 gr FN @ 1.075 OAL. I bumped the TG to 3.5 and the problem went away. In my Speer book and in my lyman book I think COAL was 1.075