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Sheppick.dan
09-26-2012, 19:45
I have been looking at getting the lee single but was curious what everyone thought? I have read mixed reviews so far. My one question is can I literally do everything with this press minus measuring the length to make sure it's correct? I know it can't clean the brass. My main concern is can it prime the brass?

Thanks in advance for your help!
Dan

unclebob
09-26-2012, 20:19
Yes, But you would be better off using a different type of priming system. A hand primer would work better.

Colorado4Wheel
09-26-2012, 20:55
Lee Classic presses prime on press really well. Don't know if the others are the same. From a process point of view a hand primer probably makes more sense for a SS anyway.

countrygun
09-26-2012, 21:00
I've used their singles for years but their hand priming system is cheap and handy enough I don't prime on press with a SS.

In fact, I used to use one of the "clamshell" type hand presses to deprime/resize and flare while I was watching tv in the living room then I'd hand prime and go to my loading room (cleverly concealed as a "den"), to do the powder and bullet seat/crimp with the SS.

dkf
09-26-2012, 22:14
I would get the Classic cast version versus the standard aluminum version. The Lee Safety Prime setup will work very well on the press once you have it set up. It makes a lot more sense to me to prime the case on the press right after sizing.

Honestly if you plan to load any pistol cartridges with the press just get the Classic Turret press and done. You can use it as a single stage, just take out the index rod.

Oldgoat03
09-26-2012, 22:27
I have both a single stage and a Classic Turret and recommend the Turret. The Lee Classic Turret (LCT) is as simple to use as a single stage in my opinion. In fact you can remove the index rod and it will operate one die at a time just like a single. When you are comfortable you can reinstall the index rod (30 seconds) and with each lever pull perform the next die/step function without having to switch dies. Just set-up each die once and leave in the turret. No further set up req'd. Faster than a single and not nearly the complexity of a progressive.

Also I always prime on the press and its very simple and never have issues.

Just my 2 cents.

What ever you decide good luck and enjoy.

Bob

fredj338
09-26-2012, 22:29
When I loaded a lot on a ss press, I always primed off press. The cheap Lee hand primers work pretty well & it's just faster to do off press.

sessumrd
09-26-2012, 23:58
If you are loading mostly rifle, then the Lee Classic cast is a great press. However like the others have suggested, you probably would do better to prime off the press. But if you are loading primarily pistol---get the Turret. I just finished loading 150 @ 9mm tonight in 45 minutes on the Turret press...

ilgunguygt
09-27-2012, 00:15
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/807734/lee-reloader-single-stage-press

Not saying its the best, or perfect for everyone, but I sure got a lot of bang for my buck with one of those. It was my first press. I started with that, a lee handprimer, a set of lee dies and a used dillon eliminator scale. I made some damn good ammo too, my most accurate .45 ammo came off that press. To this day its still bolted on my bench, next to my other presses, and still gets used from time to time.

Sheppick.dan
09-27-2012, 08:09
Thanks for all of the suggestions guys. My main reason for looking for the single stage hand loader was purely because I don't have a work bench area that I could use. With my kids running around the house I am not wanting to leave anything out where they could possibly get to it. And also money is an issue. I was hoping to get into it as cheap as possible but have decent equipment. It hard for me to spend twice as much for buying ammo at the store then what I could do it for on my own.

DoctaGlockta
09-27-2012, 08:23
I have the Lee Classic cast. It has worked well. It will do the job of priming but as Fred mentioned the Lee hand primer is a better option (that is what I use to prime cases).

Good luck but where ever you place the press it will become a magnate to those kids who will want to pull on the handle. At least it is with both my boys.

dkf
09-27-2012, 08:59
Thanks for all of the suggestions guys. My main reason for looking for the single stage hand loader was purely because I don't have a work bench area that I could use. With my kids running around the house I am not wanting to leave anything out where they could possibly get to it. And also money is an issue. I was hoping to get into it as cheap as possible but have decent equipment. It hard for me to spend twice as much for buying ammo at the store then what I could do it for on my own.

The Lee classic turret takes up the same bench space as the single stage presses. Lee also makes a quick mount setup for its presses as do some other companies. If you want to store the LCT away all you have to do is remove the turret with the dies, powder measure and etc and put it in a closet or something. It takes seconds to remove the turret.

F106 Fan
09-27-2012, 10:13
I have been looking at getting the lee single but was curious what everyone thought? I have read mixed reviews so far. My one question is can I literally do everything with this press minus measuring the length to make sure it's correct? I know it can't clean the brass. My main concern is can it prime the brass?

Thanks in advance for your help!
Dan

Yes, many of us have loaded pistol on a single stage press. That's the reason we recommend almost anything else!

Richard

fredj338
09-27-2012, 14:57
Yes, many of us have loaded pistol on a single stage press. That's the reason we recommend almost anything else!

Richard

True that! If you only want say 100rds of 44mag a month, a ss press is fine. If you want 500rds of 9mm every weekend, a ss press gets old quick.:whistling:

F106 Fan
09-27-2012, 15:37
I have been looking at getting the lee single but was curious what everyone thought? I have read mixed reviews so far. My one question is can I literally do everything with this press minus measuring the length to make sure it's correct? I know it can't clean the brass. My main concern is can it prime the brass?

Thanks in advance for your help!
Dan

No, you can't do everything using just a single stage press. The one operation we haven't discussed is charging with powder.

If you want to keep costs to an absolute minimum, a tactic I don't support, BTW, you won't be buying a powder measure.

You will be buying a scale (Dillon Eliminator is a good one) regardless of how you charge the cases so you will be faced with trickling the powder into the scale pan and ultimately dumping it through a funnel into the case. It is better to do this with the cases in a loading block. So, you need a powder trickler, funnel, scale and loading block.

I predict a powder measure will be on the shopping list after the first batch of reloads. I like the RCBS Uniflow...

Here are the steps after cleaning:

Install (and adjust) the resizing die. Decap and resize all of the brass.
Prime all the cases using a hand primer tool or some attachment to the press. I prefer the hand tool. On some single stage presses, you can prime right after depriming during step 1.
Remove the resizing die. Install (and adjust) the neck expander die (pistol). Expand all the case mouths.
With all the cases in a loading block, charge them.
Remove the expander die. Install (and adjust) the bullet seating die. Seat bullets in the cases.
Remove the seating die. Install (and adjust) the taper crimp die. Crimp all the cases to just remove the taper. For the Lee dies, buy a 3 die carbide set (this omits the Factory Crimp Die) and buy the taper crimp die separately.
If the lockrings on the various dies have a setscrew, you can maintain the adjustment between uses. You would adjust the dies the first time and then simply verify the setting before additional uses.

There are several powder measures for single stage presses but, after they are adjusted and known to be consistent, using such a measure eliminates the need to check each charge on a scale. You just run the ram up with a case in the shellholder and operate the handle on the measure. This will be a LOT faster than trickling.

But, at some point, your costs are going to approach that of the Kempf Lee Classic Turret (you still need to buy a powder scale) and the turret press will be a whole lot faster.

If you go with the LCT, make sure it is the Kempf kit because that kit DOESN'T include the Lee scale. Add the optional Pro Autodisk Powder Measure. You would still need to buy the taper crimp die separately. Unfortunately, you are stuck with the 4 die set.

Richard

WiskyT
09-27-2012, 15:54
Thanks for all of the suggestions guys. My main reason for looking for the single stage hand loader was purely because I don't have a work bench area that I could use. With my kids running around the house I am not wanting to leave anything out where they could possibly get to it. And also money is an issue. I was hoping to get into it as cheap as possible but have decent equipment. It hard for me to spend twice as much for buying ammo at the store then what I could do it for on my own.

You have the right idea. Too many people stay away from reloading because they think they need to spend a thousand Dollars and have a dedicated room just for reloading. A single stage press can get the job done and won't be a waste if you graduate up to higher end equipment down the road. If you get the Lee press for $25.00 and use it for 5 years. before buying more expensive gear, you only spent $5. a year on your press even if you gave it away after that term. Of course you would still have it to use for different jobs or for teaching your then older kids how to reload.

You could leave a SS press someplace mounted to a bench even if your kids could get at it. Unless they smash it with a hammer, they can't screw it up. You can keep your dies and components in a locked tool box.

My buddy shoots a couple of hundred rounds of 9mm a month. Sometimes not even that much. He got the Lee cheapo SS press, a set of dies, and a hand priming tool for about $100.00 total and has been reloading for two years now while others in our group keep buying walmart ball ammo for twice what he pays for his ammo.

dkf
09-27-2012, 16:12
No, you can't do everything using just a single stage press. The one operation we haven't discussed is charging with powder.

If you want to keep costs to an absolute minimum, a tactic I don't support, BTW, you won't be buying a powder measure.Screw the riser for the Lee pro auto disk in the Lee breech lock bushing and you can charge powder on the single stage no problem for relatively little money. All it takes to remove the works is a couple seconds. Of course an LCT would be better IMO but just saying it is possible.

Or just mount a powder measure stand to the table.

Kentguy
09-27-2012, 17:15
Sheppick.dan,

This would be your best bang for the buck.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/423081/lee-challenger-breech-lock-single-stage-press-anniversary-kit

For $100.00 you get practically everything you need to get started without taking a 2 mortgage out on your house.

WiskyT
09-27-2012, 17:54
Screw the riser for the Lee pro auto disk in the Lee breech lock bushing and you can charge powder on the single stage no problem for relatively little money. All it takes to remove the works is a couple seconds. Of course an LCT would be better IMO but just saying it is possible.

Or just mount a powder measure stand to the table.

He can even use the Lee dipper that comes with the dies and drop the charges right through the PTE die.

PsychoKnight
09-27-2012, 19:53
When you say single stage "hand loader" and that you don't have any place to mount a press, I assume you are eyeing the "handheld" Lee hand press. That thing is pure misery.

A mounted single stage is slow enough, but to use a hand just to hold the press, and use another hand to move back and forth between the handle and the cases, its just totally ludicrous. The engineer who designed the Lee hand press did it as a venge-joke as he was retiring from the company, and never thought they'd actually produce for some poor soul to use. I kidding about the engineer. I'm not kidding about the hand held press being the epitome of longsuffering for no purpose.

WiskyT
09-27-2012, 20:53
When you say single stage "hand loader" and that you don't have any place to mount a press, I assume you are eyeing the "handheld" Lee hand press. That thing is pure misery.

A mounted single stage is slow enough, but to use a hand just to hold the press, and use another hand to move back and forth between the handle and the cases, its just totally ludicrous. The engineer who designed the Lee hand press did it as a venge-joke as he was retiring from the company, and never thought they'd actually produce for some poor soul to use. I kidding about the engineer. I'm not kidding about the hand held press being the epitome of longsuffering for no purpose.

I loaded thousands of rounds on mine, I love it.

trashcat
09-27-2012, 21:26
I started with a lee classic, there's nothing wrong with it except being a bit slow. I upgraded to a lee cast iron turret and I should have started with one, they're only a little bit more and will do everything the classic will except operate the BMG 50 dies.
If you're in a small space build a reloading box that will hold everything. I built one where the press bolts to the top and the box sits on a chair or coffee table without needing to be clamped down. If you have inquisitive little fingers in the house a couple locking clasps should keep them at bay.

dhgeyer
09-28-2012, 11:59
I was all but out of handloading for a few years, and all I had was the cheapest Lee single stage press they made. A "C" press as opposed to the stronger "O" design, and made mostly of aluminum. It was fine for pistol ammo. Never had a problem with it. I am talking about a bench mounted press. I got it used for almost nothing. Still have it, but don't use it anymore. You don't have to leave a bench mounted press set up all the time. You can mount it to a board and clamp the board to a table when in use, and put it away after you're done. Use more than 1 clamp. Anyway, you will want to use a hand primer. In addition to being faster, it gives you a better feel for how the primer is seated. You will need a way to measure powder. For $18.00 you can get a set of dippers from Amazon. These are slow and a bit aggravating, but they work. They will get you started if you are really on a shoestring. You can get the powder measure and scale later. You set the powder measure with the scale. If you reload the same cases enough times you will need to trim them. So, add some kind of case trimmer. But to start you can simply discard a set of cases when they start to grow. You didn't mention what caliber you're reloading. 9mm cases can be loaded quite a few times before it's an issue, but when it is, it's a safety issue. You really want to have some kind of caliper to measure case length and overall length. I have a vernier caliper that I have owned for 40 years, and it has outlived all the dial calipers I bought and wore out.

The main accessory you do not want to do without is a good basic book on reloading. There is quite a bit to it, and you don't want to make a mistake because you didn't know about some step or something to look for.

One of the gun stores around here has used reloading equipment. Single stage presses don't normally wear out in regular use, and can be a very good buy for someone on a budget. You might want to check around.

I have had progressive reloaders, but I have gone back to a single stage press - an RCBS Rockchucker. I'm retired and time isn't an issue. I listen to music on the radio app on my phone and find it relaxing. I started 50 years ago and still enjoy doing it pretty much the same way I started out. But, as others have pointed out, if you need to load volume, then you will want something more automated sooner or later.

A single stage press isn't a bad investment. Even if you get heavily into handloading and get a progressive, a single stage press is a quicker way to try a small batch of a new bullet or load without having to change a whole machine around after it's set up for production of a proven load.

F106 Fan
09-28-2012, 12:17
You will need a way to measure powder. For $18.00 you can get a set of dippers from Amazon. These are slow and a bit aggravating, but they work. They will get you started if you are really on a shoestring. You can get the powder measure and scale later.

I think I would make a good scale the FIRST item on my list. I don't care what the chart says, I want to see how much powder that dipper is dispensing.

Richard

F106 Fan
09-28-2012, 12:20
If you're in a small space build a reloading box that will hold everything. I built one where the press bolts to the top and the box sits on a chair or coffee table without needing to be clamped down.


http://glocktalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=227997&d=1348802738

That could be a neat setup for taking to the range. There would need to be a way to keep wind from interfering with the scale but that ought to be easy to work out.

Pretty clever!

Richard

fredj338
09-28-2012, 13:24
http://glocktalk.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=227997&d=1348802738

That could be a neat setup for taking to the range. There would need to be a way to keep wind from interfering with the scale but that ought to be easy to work out.

Pretty clever!

Richard

Just set the scale inside the box. I have a traveling setup for teaching. I use a folding workmate, but C clamping to a bench works fine too.

WiskyT
09-28-2012, 14:41
For $18.00 you can get a set of dippers from Amazon. These are slow and a bit aggravating, but they work. They will get you started if you are really on a shoestring. You can get the powder measure and scale later.

The problem with the dipper set is that they are too far apart for pistol reloading. There are only three in the set that can be used and really, only the 0.5cc dipper is useful. The 0.5 comes with most pistol dies and covers most calibers one way or the other with different bullet/powder combos. The rest of the set will collect dust for just pistol use. When my buddy wanted something different than the 0.5cc load of Unique he was using, I made him dippers with cut down 9mm or 32ACP brass and labled the bamboo skewers I superglued on to them for handles.

countrygun
09-28-2012, 14:53
When you say single stage "hand loader" and that you don't have any place to mount a press, I assume you are eyeing the "handheld" Lee hand press. That thing is pure misery.

A mounted single stage is slow enough, but to use a hand just to hold the press, and use another hand to move back and forth between the handle and the cases, its just totally ludicrous. The engineer who designed the Lee hand press did it as a venge-joke as he was retiring from the company, and never thought they'd actually produce for some poor soul to use. I kidding about the engineer. I'm not kidding about the hand held press being the epitome of longsuffering for no purpose.

I have used them for years. I even got a deal on a spare one at a shop close out sale and with two of them, and a little planning you can get pretty efficient. It also makes a nice addition to a SS if you crimp seperately or if, like me, you don't like charged cases sitting there you cans run, say 20 at a time in a PTE die and seat them with the hand press.

Depriming with one while watching the boob tube is a great way to put spare time to good use.

They are not the fastest thing in the world, but you wouldn't really have that expectation.

dhgeyer
09-28-2012, 15:33
Couple of additional thoughts.

1. No one has said this yet, but in my opinion if one is totally new to reloading, one should definitely start on a single stage press. There's enough involved already, and enough important details that could easily be missed, that doing it one step at a time is the best way to learn. I've done the merry-go-round thing, and it's a lot easier to miss something that way. I think it should be left to experienced reloaders.

2. The dippers again: I did not know that they were limited to one useful one for pistol charges. The OP has not said just how tight of a budget he is on. The dippers are far less than ideal to be sure. But they are better than nothing. I would strongly counsel against getting a scale without a powder measure. Weighing each charge is a real good way to convince yourself that the whole idea is not worth it. I suppose if one is handy with tools one could get a scale and make dippers out of old cases like has been mentioned here. I have done that. All you really need is a suitably sized fired case, a file, a piece of wire and some glue of some kind. Soldering (not around the powder!) is even better if one has the tools. But measuring each charge individually - I'd probably give up reloading myself if I had to do that.

dkf
09-28-2012, 15:56
I started loading shotgun with a manual index progressive and started loading metallic cartridges with a turret press. You don't need to start with a single stage.

WiskyT
09-28-2012, 15:59
Couple of additional thoughts.

1. No one has said this yet, but in my opinion if one is totally new to reloading, one should definitely start on a single stage press. There's enough involved already, and enough important details that could easily be missed, that doing it one step at a time is the best way to learn. I've done the merry-go-round thing, and it's a lot easier to miss something that way. I think it should be left to experienced reloaders.

2. The dippers again: I did not know that they were limited to one useful one for pistol charges. The OP has not said just how tight of a budget he is on. The dippers are far less than ideal to be sure. But they are better than nothing. I would strongly counsel against getting a scale without a powder measure. Weighing each charge is a real good way to convince yourself that the whole idea is not worth it. I suppose if one is handy with tools one could get a scale and make dippers out of old cases like has been mentioned here. I have done that. All you really need is a suitably sized fired case, a file, a piece of wire and some glue of some kind. Soldering (not around the powder!) is even better if one has the tools. But measuring each charge individually - I'd probably give up reloading myself if I had to do that.


The dippers in the kit start with 0.3 then go to 0.5 and 0.7. 0.3 is too small for all but the lightest loads like 38 wadcutters and 380ACP, and the 0.7 is too big for almost all pistol loads. 0.5 works for just about everything one way or another. While the dipper concept is great, the kit, for $18.00 is too much oney when you can really only use the 0.5. The Lee perfect measure isn't that much more and can do everything provided you have a scale. Lee needs to include a 0.4 and 0.6 in the kit, or to sell a 0.4 and 0.6 as they, along with the 0.3, 0.5, and 0.7 would cover darn near every pistol caliber that exists. They could sell it as a "Pistol Dipper Kit" for say $7.00 and it would be a better way to go.

Since the Lee die kits already come with 0.5 included, the best budget way to do it is to just find a bullet/powder combo that works with that "free" dipper and call it good. If you want something lighter or heavier, go over to a friends house with your powder, some empty cases, and a file and use his scale to make your own dippers.

countrygun
09-28-2012, 16:31
Couple of additional thoughts.

1. No one has said this yet, but in my opinion if one is totally new to reloading, one should definitely start on a single stage press. There's enough involved already, and enough important details that could easily be missed, that doing it one step at a time is the best way to learn. I've done the merry-go-round thing, and it's a lot easier to miss something that way. I think it should be left to experienced reloaders.

.

THIS^^^^^^^

is a very important point. If you don't inderstand each step how do you know if a "high-speed" press is working right?

I have heard of guys "cutting loose" with their new toys and cranking out a few hundred rounds that wouldn't chamber in their guns or had other repeated problems.

SARDG
09-28-2012, 16:48
...No one has said this yet, but in my opinion if one is totally new to reloading, one should definitely start on a single stage press...

THIS^^^^^^^

is a very important point. If you don't inderstand each step how do you know if a "high-speed" press is working right?

I started loading shotgun with a manual index progressive and started loading metallic cartridges with a turret press. You don't need to start with a single stage.
...and I started on a 650, with Titegroup, and am awfully glad that I never considered a SS.

Within 2 weeks after I started my reloading 'career' with the 650, I was second guessing myself, thinking I should have bought a 1050.

Colorado4Wheel
09-28-2012, 17:16
Starting on a Lee Classic Cast is actually safer then a Single Stage. It's basically a progressive single stage and you can't get things out of order.

trashcat
09-28-2012, 17:35
One thing I noticed when I first stated reloading with a single stage was I took much more deliberation with my shots. When you've invested 45-60 minutes in one box of rounds you don't want to wast them.
I also don't like dippers for pistol reloading, however the lee perfect powder measure works great with a single stage and it's only $20 at misdwayusa. I always set it up by weight instead of the cc markings but it always threw consistent charges once set.

fredj338
09-28-2012, 18:00
Starting on a Lee Classic Cast is actually safer then a Single Stage. It's basically a progressive single stage and you can't get things out of order.

You can get things wrong on any press. I have known guys to double on a 650 or LNL as well as get squibs. It's always gong the be the guy pulling the handle.:dunno:

Sheppick.dan
09-28-2012, 18:11
Thanks everyone for all of the advice. Just to clarify, I am looking to load 9mm currently, maybe at somepoint a .40 but for now just 9mm. I do not go out shooting as much as i'd like so I would only prolly shoot a couple hundred rounds per month (not many). I was hoping to get started for around 100 bucks. I understand there is always a way to do it right and usually I am all about buying the best of the best to do anything that I do. BUT, until I know that I like it and am going to want to spend the time to reload I'd like to stay as easy on the pocket book as I can.

This is what I have gathered that I need other than the press, materials and die set.

Caliper (to check bullet length, I have read too many horror stories online)
scale (make sure the powder measure is correct)
hand primer
LOADING BOOK!!!!

Thanks everyone for all of the suggestions and advice I truly do appreciate it and will let you know what I end up getting. Hopefully something in the next few weeks!

Dan

unclebob
09-28-2012, 20:42
...and I started on a 650, with Titegroup, and am awfully glad that I never considered a SS.

Within 2 weeks after I started my reloading 'career' with the 650, I was second guessing myself, thinking I should have bought a 1050.

Kitty
Go ahead and blame me.



If a person gets a progressive press and loads one round at a time to learn the ropes. Isnít it the same as a single stage press?
Then if he wants to go progressive he can. With a single stage press you still have a single stage press.
At least for me changing a 650 press over to do load development is a lot easier, faster than trying to do it on a single stage press.

F106 Fan
09-28-2012, 21:05
When cost is a big concern, the single stage press is at least a workable approach. That $100 Lee Anniversary kit from Midway seems like a very decent way to start. The scale isn't much but it will do for now.

Add check weights to your list! I loaded a lot of shells before I bought a set and perhaps they aren't as important for beam scales. Still, they should be somewhere on the list and are a definite requirement for digital scales.

A case gauge is handy but you can use your barrel for a while.

Shooting is one of those things that tends to grow bounded only by available funds (and eating is optional). Don't be surprised if rifle shooting comes up and that single stage press will work great for precision rifle. There's always something that can be done with one.

Just get started and see how it goes.

Richard

countrygun
09-28-2012, 22:04
If nothing else, as you move up, a single-stage is the best way to size and lube cast bullets.

SARDG
09-28-2012, 22:32
Kitty
Go ahead and blame me...
Yes Bob, you were certainly one of the main Dillon fans recommending 650s. Now Richard... he could have recommended the 1050, and who knows....

k

PsychoKnight
09-28-2012, 23:32
{Lee Hand Press} I loaded thousands of rounds on mine, I love it.

That's really funny.

I was going to say something else but my grandmother taught my father, who passed down to me, that whenever he's about to be shocked and pissed about something, that he should just laught it off. Maybe those weren't the exact words, probably something lost in translation.

Okay, there are times I'll recommend the Lee Hand Press. I've decided that for some people who lack common sense and a minimal level of intelligence, they should never get into reloading, or own a gun for that matter (like the original owner of my first house, didn't know his own phone number after 26 years of having the same number, had to find a shirt to put on and look on the 'fridge for the note to give to my r.e. agent - yes, he owned a couple long guns). Maybe a Lee Loader and a mallet for these people as a warm up to the hand press.

Colorado4Wheel
09-29-2012, 00:47
You can get things wrong on any press. I have known guys to double on a 650 or LNL as well as get squibs. It's always gong the be the guy pulling the handle.:dunno:

I said it was safer not foolproof. But, in auto index mode its pretty dang close. One case 4 pulls of the handle and you have a loaded round.

WiskyT
09-29-2012, 06:00
That's really funny.

I was going to say something else but my grandmother taught my father, who passed down to me, that whenever he's about to be shocked and pissed about something, that he should just laught it off. Maybe those weren't the exact words, probably something lost in translation.

Okay, there are times I'll recommend the Lee Hand Press. I've decided that for some people who lack common sense and a minimal level of intelligence, they should never get into reloading, or own a gun for that matter (like the original owner of my first house, didn't know his own phone number after 26 years of having the same number, had to find a shirt to put on and look on the 'fridge for the note to give to my r.e. agent - yes, he owned a couple long guns). Maybe a Lee Loader and a mallet for these people as a warm up to the hand press.

I don't know about your grandparents, but your mother never taught you to be coherent. WTF are you talking about? Try again in English. Other languages can be made to work since we have several second languages availble to us among the members of GTR, and Babalefish does a pretty good job if you were to respond in, say, Farsi. It must be of this Earth though.

ETA: If you are a heroine users, post before sticking yourself. We might be able to understand you better.

unclebob
09-29-2012, 07:28
Yes Bob, you were certainly one of the main Dillon fans recommending 650s. Now Richard... he could have recommended the 1050, and who knows....

k

When you started out you wanted to know between a 550 and 650. Know that you have the 650 you will not be happy until you get that 1050. I believe Dillon still has the 3 easy payment plan. Quit talking about it and just do it. There I twisted your arm.:whistling:

F106 Fan
09-29-2012, 08:40
Yes Bob, you were certainly one of the main Dillon fans recommending 650s. Now Richard... he could have recommended the 1050, and who knows....

k

I would recommend the 1050 over the 650 if there is any possibility that the primers are crimped for the rounds being loaded; subject to funding, of course. 9mm and .223 come to mind as a particular problem.

Speed of 650 vs 1050 probably doesn't justify the difference in cost. The 650 is a great machine.

When I bought the 1050, I was replacing my RCBS Green Machine so I wanted speed in reloading .45 ACP. That was the only caliber I really cared about. Still is...

Fast forward a few months and my grandson wanted to shoot 9mm and I was thinking about IDPA. So, I bought the 650 for 9mm and .223. That was something of a mistake because both of those cartridges have crimped brass which the 1050 can handle but causes an issue with the 650.

The proper solution is to do a caliber conversion on the 1050 so it can handle small primers such as 9mm and .223 and another conversion for the 650 so it can handle .45 ACP. Probably won't happen...

Somehow the idea of caliber conversions on the 1050 doesn't appeal to me. I know other users do it but there's a lot of stuff to adjust when changing primer size.

If funding is available for a 650 with case feeder, I would highly recommend it. It's fast, caliber conversions are simple and it just plain works.

There's certainly nothing wrong with a 550. They are the workhorse of the reloading community. Sure, they're not as fast but they are certainly versatile. And affordable...

Richard

unclebob
09-29-2012, 09:04
She wants to use a bullet feeder and also have powder check and does not want to use a seat crimp die.

countrygun
09-29-2012, 13:40
I don't know about your grandparents, but your mother never taught you to be coherent. WTF are you talking about? Try again in English. Other languages can be made to work since we have several second languages availble to us among the members of GTR, and Babalefish does a pretty good job if you were to respond in, say, Farsi. It must be of this Earth though.

ETA: If you are a heroine users, post before sticking yourself. We might be able to understand you better.

Well said. I think we have someone here who wasn't coordinated enough to use the simpler tools to good effect. For instance, I can deprime and resize and prime brass while babysitting my daughter from the couch. No danger to the quality of the reloads and I am therefore able to turn "down time" into useful reloading time, but this requires multi-tasking skills that drug abusers lack. They are best left to a focused project where they can focus what they have left that still works in the cerebellum like an automaton. Using simple tools where you have to plan ahead and have to organize you work is a strain on their capabilities. It is best that they understand their limits and stick to the simpler methods.

The sad part is that those folks feel inadequate because they could not master the basic tools and therefore have to belittle them. Much like a woodworker who uses nothing but power tools because thetechniques of choosing a hand tool, like a plane, and using it effectively elude them. Ergo they may turn out functional work but it lacks the aesthetics and quality of an item that is created by someone who understands the grain of the wood and works with it, rather than uses power tools to ignore the natural strengths and weaknesses of the material.

Sad really that he references his Grandparents. My Grandfather taught me to use a table saw and a jointer but he also taught me the sometimes a hand saw makes a better unique dovetail joint, and a cabinet scraper may produce a better effect than a power sander.

F106 Fan
09-29-2012, 13:58
She wants to use a bullet feeder and also have powder check and does not want to use a seat crimp die.

I was thinking about that as well. The first 5 of 8 stations are pretty well defined:

Case insertion
Resize and decap
Primer pocket swage
Primer insertion
Powder measure
Powder check
Bullet seat
Taper crimp
I see two approaches: First, give up the powder check and use that station for the bullet feeder or, second, use the bullet feeder at station 7 and use station 8 for seat and crimp (combined).

We all got along without the powder check for decades and somehow we are still all here. Seriously, as long as the hopper has powder, how many times has the powder drop been incorrect? We have a powder hopper alarm so the chance of running dry isn't very high.

If I decide to add a bullet feeder, I think I am going to replace the powder check die. I like the idea of doing the taper crimp separately from bullet seating.

Richard

SARDG
09-29-2012, 16:41
She wants to use a bullet feeder and also have powder check and does not want to use a seat crimp die.
Your memory is too good Bob, that's all exactly right.

I've had the RCBS bullet feeder sitting here for more than 2 months and have engineered the mounting bracket I need for my application, but have been so busy loading and shooting I haven't had time to get the bracket bent up and feeder mounted.

I think what I will try is eliminating the powder check as I've gotten more confidence in the 650 and its powder throws (and my process). My min to max recommended load with N320 is about .5-.6gr anyway and the powder check isn't really going to help much unless the case is empty or double-charged (which fills the 9mil case.)

If (when?) I graduate to rifle loads, I may also graduate to a 1050 - in addition to the 650. One problem in Florida is that there is only a finite amount of room to set up one's hobbies.

Kitty

magman687
09-29-2012, 16:47
Love my lee single press I load 25-06 with it

Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

F106 Fan
09-29-2012, 19:09
If (when?) I graduate to rifle loads, I may also graduate to a 1050 - in addition to the 650. One problem in Florida is that there is only a finite amount of room to set up one's hobbies.

Kitty

OK, I get it! You believe people will think you odd if your living room has more than one press complete with case feeder instead of a couch. Goodness knows what the old biddy across the street might think! And you know she'll be watching through your living room windows when the curtains are open. There's a reason she bought those 20x binoculars!

Well, forget about the neighbors, get the 1050 and start loading.

Richard

SARDG
09-29-2012, 19:55
OK, I get it! You believe people will think you odd if your living room has more than one press complete with case feeder instead of a couch....

...Well, forget about the neighbors, get the 1050 and start loading.

Richard
But my life still represents a modicum of normalcy and a couch is far more comfortable to sit on and watch TV, than a 1050.

You and unclebob are bad influences... :supergrin:

unclebob
09-29-2012, 20:08
But my life still represents a modicum of normalcy and a couch is far more comfortable to sit on and watch TV, than a 1050.

You and unclebob are bad influences... :supergrin:

Since when does anyone listen to me? :dunno: Since no one listens to me how could I be a bad influence?:headscratch:

F106 Fan
09-29-2012, 20:09
But my life still represents a modicum of normalcy and a couch is far more comfortable to sit on and watch TV, than a 1050.

You and unclebob are bad influences... :supergrin:

With some people, assimilation takes a little longer. It'll come!

Besides, you can sit on the loading stool.

Richard

shotgunred
09-29-2012, 20:14
Couple of additional thoughts.

1. No one has said this yet, but in my opinion if one is totally new to reloading, one should definitely start on a single stage press. There's enough involved already, and enough important details that could easily be missed, that doing it one step at a time is the best way to learn. I've done the merry-go-round thing, and it's a lot easier to miss something that way. I think it should be left to experienced reloaders.

I think you are completely wrong! It is much easier to forget a charge or double charge when you are doing blocks of 50 or 100. If you want to break reloading down to one step at a time and be as safe as possible you should start with a lee turret press. One cartridge at a time. Each step in a forced order until done.

Secondly reloading on a single stage quickly loses its appeal when you are a volume shooter. Most people don't want to spend hours and hours at their press just to shoot their ammo in a few minutes.

SARDG
09-29-2012, 20:19
Since when does anyone listen to me? :dunno: Since no one listens to me how could I be a bad influence?:headscratch:
Yeah, true 'nuff. :supergrin:

But I did get a 650!

SARDG
09-29-2012, 20:24
With some people, assimilation takes a little longer. It'll come!
For me... or my neighbor with the 20X binos?

unclebob
09-29-2012, 20:28
A Dillon 650 with case feeder. Once it is set up place a bullet on the case at station 4 pull handle down raise handle fill primer being seated seat primer. Look at station 3 to verify powder is in the case. Put bullet on case at station 4. Pull handle. Keep doing this until the primer buzzer goes off.

unclebob
09-29-2012, 20:31
Yeah, true 'nuff. :supergrin:

But I did get a 650!

But then that was what you asked for. 550 or 650? figured you did your homework on the 1050.

F106 Fan
09-29-2012, 20:36
For me... or my neighbor with the 20X binos?

Actually, it could go either way :whistling:

Richard

SARDG
09-29-2012, 20:48
But then that was what you asked for. 550 or 650? figured you did your homework on the 1050.
Well, I did to a degree... but eventually determined the extra cost, added complexity, and less warranty weren't worth it. Now....???

unclebob
09-29-2012, 20:57
Well, I did to a degree... but eventually determined the extra cost, added complexity, and less warranty weren't worth it. Now....???

What you wish for is what you will receive.
Probably did not do it with you. But most of the time I ask the OP what they will be loading for? How much do they shoot? Are they into or think about getting into competition? How much time do they have to reload? What guns do they have now and what are their plans in the future? Just to name a few. Arenít you lucky I didnít tell you to get a 550?:wow:

SARDG
09-29-2012, 20:58
A Dillon 650 with case feeder. Once it is set up place a bullet on the case at station 4 pull handle down raise handle fill primer being seated seat primer. Look at station 3 to verify powder is in the case. Put bullet on case at station 4. Pull handle. Keep doing this until the primer buzzer goes off.
But I plan to drop the bullet at Sta 3, seat in 4, crimp in 5. I can check Sta 3 before raising the platform.

SARDG
09-29-2012, 21:03
...Arenít you lucky I didnít tell you to get a 550?:wow:
Definitely. I'm sure it's a fine machine, but you know I shoot through too much competitive ammo - and besides, I like the increased capabilities and auto-indexing for sure. For what I am doing, the 550 would have been a dead end.

shotgunred
09-29-2012, 21:16
How many rounds do you shoot a week?

SARDG
09-29-2012, 21:41
How many rounds do you shoot a week?
If I religiously go to regularly scheduled match practices, and then 4 monthly matches and say... one additional club event per month... about 1600-1800 / month, plus a GSSF match every couple of months for another 500-600 rounds at a match. With that, I was on track for about 25,000 rounds / year (centerfire), but now am likely down to 15,000 / year as I just can't make all the practices and matches lately. Plus it takes time to reload some. I don't suppose that's a lot compared to a champ, but I'm just a hacker.

With actual time piddling around, I most certainly don't load 800 rounds / hr in real-life time.

shotgunred
09-29-2012, 21:56
When I was loading 15K rounds a year I was happy reloading on my 550. To much life has happened this year and I doubt I have reload 5K on my 650. Hopefully I will be back to that level next year.

unclebob
09-30-2012, 07:02
But I plan to drop the bullet at Sta 3, seat in 4, crimp in 5. I can check Sta 3 before raising the platform.

That was no directed to you. It was for People that think that they have to look at every operation of the 650 press.
But yes if you install a bullet feeder that is how you do it. The bullet feeder takes the place of the powder check.
If you would load standing and get the press at the right height production rate goes up also.

SARDG
09-30-2012, 07:38
...If you would load standing and get the press at the right height production rate goes up also.
Maybe, but I'm not using the Strong Mount and I'm not in a rounds/hour race. I may hold the record for fewest average rounds produced per hour on a 650. :cool:

unclebob
09-30-2012, 07:52
Maybe, but I'm not using the Strong Mount and I'm not in a rounds/hour race. I may hold the record for fewest average rounds produced per hour on a 650. :cool:

I think you missed my point and you donít need to use a strong mount. Even though for me a strong mount works better in a lot of different ways.
It takes me about 7 to 8 minutes to load until the buzzer goes off. For me it is a very smooth relaxed speed.

fredj338
09-30-2012, 13:11
Definitely. I'm sure it's a fine machine, but you know I shoot through too much competitive ammo - and besides, I like the increased capabilities and auto-indexing for sure. For what I am doing, the 550 would have been a dead end.
Not really Sarg. Running a 550 @ 500rds/hr is not a dead end, just not the 800rds/hr of a 650. The vast majority of shooters can't even realize the speed of a 550B. Even at 2000rds/m, that's 1hr/wk on a 550, again, hardely a dead end. Run a 650 w/o the case feeder, it's no faster than a 550B.:dunno:

SARDG
09-30-2012, 14:14
Not really Sarg. Running a 550 @ 500rds/hr is not a dead end, just not the 800rds/hr of a 650. The vast majority of shooters can't even realize the speed of a 550B. Even at 2000rds/m, that's 1hr/wk on a 550, again, hardely a dead end. Run a 650 w/o the case feeder, it's no faster than a 550B.:dunno:
It's not so much a dead end for speed, as I am no speed demon with the 650 anyway; it would have been a dead end for adding a bullet feeder - unless I also combined seat and crimp AND dropped the powder alarm.

I don't care so much about rated capacity, as I do about efficiency for the rounds I do produce. In other words, if I need 500 rounds for a weekend match, I'd rather spend 2 hours on a 650, than 3 hours (or whatever) on a 550. I am all about efficiency and ease of production per (quality match) round, than saving a couple of bucks on a press that costs me more personal time per round.

ETA: I have the 650 case feeder. Again.... time savings and efficiency.

fredj338
10-01-2012, 18:22
It's not so much a dead end for speed, as I am no speed demon with the 650 anyway; it would have been a dead end for adding a bullet feeder - unless I also combined seat and crimp AND dropped the powder alarm.

I don't care so much about rated capacity, as I do about efficiency for the rounds I do produce. In other words, if I need 500 rounds for a weekend match, I'd rather spend 2 hours on a 650, than 3 hours (or whatever) on a 550. I am all about efficiency and ease of production per (quality match) round, than saving a couple of bucks on a press that costs me more personal time per round.

ETA: I have the 650 case feeder. Again.... time savings and efficiency.

Very true, the 4stn does limit one. I use a powder cop only for my rifle stuff & that runs fine on the 550. I would like a bullet feeder for the 650, but I shoot lead bullets almost exclusively. They are not happy running in most bullet feeders unless you go moly & I hate moly.

PsychoKnight
10-01-2012, 20:30
Well said. I think we have someone here who wasn't coordinated enough to use the simpler tools to good effect. For instance, I can deprime and resize and prime brass while babysitting my daughter from the couch. No danger to the quality of the reloads and I am therefore able to turn "down time" into useful reloading time, but this requires multi-tasking skills that drug abusers lack. They are best left to a focused project where they can focus what they have left that still works in the cerebellum like an automaton. Using simple tools where you have to plan ahead and have to organize you work is a strain on their capabilities. It is best that they understand their limits and stick to the simpler methods.

The sad part is that those folks feel inadequate because they could not master the basic tools and therefore have to belittle them. Much like a woodworker who uses nothing but power tools because thetechniques of choosing a hand tool, like a plane, and using it effectively elude them. Ergo they may turn out functional work but it lacks the aesthetics and quality of an item that is created by someone who understands the grain of the wood and works with it, rather than uses power tools to ignore the natural strengths and weaknesses of the material.

Sad really that he references his Grandparents. My Grandfather taught me to use a table saw and a jointer but he also taught me the sometimes a hand saw makes a better unique dovetail joint, and a cabinet scraper may produce a better effect than a power sander.

Okay, sorry - talking like a politician during a campaign.

Point is: The Lee Hand Press sucks.

Wisky loves it; made thousands of rounds on it.

It still sucks.

OP Sheppick said "looking for the single stage hand loader was purely because I don't have a work bench area," so I assume he's talkin' Lee Hand Press. It was first loader (borrowed) & processed 300 rds 44mag on it.

Did I mention it sucks?

F106 Fan
10-01-2012, 20:58
Okay, sorry - talking like a politician during a campaign.

Point is: The Lee Hand Press sucks.

Wisky loves it; made thousands of rounds on it.

It still sucks.

OP Sheppick said "looking for the single stage hand loader was purely because I don't have a work bench area," so I assume he's talkin' Lee Hand Press. It was first loader (borrowed) & processed 300 rds 44mag on it.

Did I mention it sucks?

Yes, but I'm not sure the point has been made forcefully enough.

I can't even imagine how grim it would be to make pistol ammo on that little press.

Richard