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Yankee2718
09-30-2012, 15:38
A Glock 17 or a Glock 23? Either would accompany my .30-06. Maybe use it if I was presented a shot under 20 yards.

Travelin' Jack
09-30-2012, 15:54
Out of the two, definitely the 40. Hornady makes a 180 grain XTP in 40S&W, I'm sure it would do the trick.

collim1
09-30-2012, 16:06
I would carry the G17. People killed alot of deer with calibers that we consider pretty anemic today. Inside of twenty yards a double lung shot with either is game over.

I carry a pistol when I hunt for protection against two legged predators. You never know who could be using your property for a meth lab or outdoor grow. A scope rifle is far from ideal up close and personal.

I dont know who started the rumor that deer were armored. They are not hard to kill.

M 7
09-30-2012, 16:10
A Glock 17 or a Glock 23? Either would accompany my .30-06. Maybe use it if I was presented a shot under 20 yards.

Regardless of which caliber/load you choose, just treat it like bow-hunting and engineer your shot accordingly. I've taken a deer with a 17L (ammo was a 147 gr. XTP which expanded nicely) and it was a very rewarding challenge.

Tiro Fijo
09-30-2012, 16:44
The point is not IF you can do it, but whether you can do it consistently & humanely. Hunting is a sport, not a game. It is the hunter's obligation to kill the animal in question as humanely and quickly as possible as the animal is entitled to a noble death.

Yankee2718
09-30-2012, 17:16
On a range I'm capable of making hits consistently out to 50 yds with either, but that's too far when you're nerves and adrenaline are jacked up. 20-25 is the max. I'm kind of leaning towards a 124 gr bonded +P round, either PDX1, Speer GD, or Underwood GD.

The .40 in a 165 bonded or 180 HST/XTP isn't out of the question.

The double lung was what I was going to aim for.

Yankee2718
09-30-2012, 17:20
The point is not IF you can do it, but whether you can do it consistently & humanely. Hunting is a sport, not a game. It is the hunter's obligation to kill the animal in question as humanely and quickly as possible as the animal is entitled to a noble death.

I agree with you in principle, but there is no such thing as a noble death. Death is death. Bleeding, squealing, kicking. Taking bad shots and causing a slow, agonizing death is one thing, but there is no such thing as a noble death.

dkf
09-30-2012, 18:19
The G23 without any question. I would probably load it with a stout 180gr JHP or hardcast. A far more ideal whitetail sidearm is a 4"-6.5" .44mag.

SDGlock23
09-30-2012, 20:03
G23. Here's one article about G23 hunting
http://www.gunblast.com/JoeRiekers-NewAmmo.htm

Nickotym
09-30-2012, 20:28
Depends on your state I guess. In many states a 9mm is not allowed for deer hunting. not sure .40 would be either. here in VA, we are allowed to use anything bigger than a .22, but when I lived in ND, we could not use anything smaller than .357, but now it has changed there to be anything bigger than .35 caliber so 9mm would be ok.

Anyway, double check your regulations, don't want to get in trouble with johnny law out in the woods.
Have Fun!

Yankee2718
09-30-2012, 21:10
Depends on your state I guess. In many states a 9mm is not allowed for deer hunting. not sure .40 would be either. here in VA, we are allowed to use anything bigger than a .22, but when I lived in ND, we could not use anything smaller than .357, but now it has changed there to be anything bigger than .35 caliber so 9mm would be ok.

Anyway, double check your regulations, don't want to get in trouble with johnny law out in the woods.
Have Fun!

Centerfire 22 or larger

9mm +p+
10-01-2012, 02:30
Neither, 357 mag minimum, 44 better.

noway
10-01-2012, 03:16
ditto on the last post. Both of those caliber makes for a better hunting caliber than a 9mm.

vafish
10-01-2012, 06:10
Given only those 2 choices, the g23 with 180 gr bullets would be my pick.

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The Retired Sarge
10-01-2012, 07:40
Drop a 357SIG Glock 32 factory barrel in your 23 and you have the best option of your two pistols. Bill

Yankee2718
10-01-2012, 07:43
All of the testing I've seen, the 165s are penetrating more than the 180s. I think if I do use it I'll go with 165 pdx1.

SCmasterblaster
10-01-2012, 09:24
When I go deer hunting, I carry my Mossberg 550 with 12ga slugs, my S&W 629, and my G17. I carry a Spyderco Clipit Endura knife as well.

Yankee2718
10-01-2012, 10:01
When I go deer hunting, I carry my Mossberg 550 with 12ga slugs, my S&W 629, and my G17. I carry a Spyderco Clipit Endura knife as well.

Why the two handguns?

Yankee2718
10-01-2012, 10:02
I looked at the underwood 155xtp at 1300fps. That might be a good choice.

SCmasterblaster
10-01-2012, 10:05
Why the two handguns?

Well, my G17 in a shoulder holster makes for a quieter finishing shot on a wounded deer. I carry my .44 just to back up my shotgun.

Yankee2718
10-01-2012, 15:37
Well, my G17 in a shoulder holster makes for a quieter finishing shot on a wounded deer. I carry my .44 just to abck up my shotgun.

That makes sense.


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SCmasterblaster
10-01-2012, 16:16
I remember my first deer hunt in VT. A giant buck ran across the road in front of our car. By the time we stopped and got out of the car with our handguns, the buck was on the other side of a bare farm field standing there looking at us. I had my .44 Magnum out and on target, but I didn't shoot as the range was well over 100 yards. We never saw another deer like that for 10 years.

avenues165
10-02-2012, 21:57
I remember my first deer hunt in VT. A giant buck ran across the road in front of our car. By the time we stopped and got out of the car with our handguns, the buck was on the other side of a bare farm field standing there looking at us. I had my .44 Magnum out and on target, but I didn't shoot as the range was well over 100 yards. We never saw another deer like that for 10 years.

Regardless, you did the right thing. As a hunter I found it my duty to make sure any kill was quick and humane. Any shots outside of my abilities had to be passed.

I have since given up hunting, I now prefer to just watch wildlife. However, I realize and respect that others choose to hunt and have absolutely no objection to hunting.

Upland bird hunting was always my favorite, I'd do that again if given a chance to hunt in a place with decent pheasant numbers.

SCmasterblaster
10-03-2012, 11:07
Regardless, you did the right thing. As a hunter I found it my duty to make sure any kill was quick and humane. Any shots outside of my abilities had to be passed.

I have since given up hunting, I now prefer to just watch wildlife. However, I realize and respect that others choose to hunt and have absolutely no objection to hunting.

Upland bird hunting was always my favorite, I'd do that again if given a chance to hunt in a place with decent pheasant numbers.

My hunting friends thought that I should have taken the shot . . . . :upeyes:

fredj338
10-03-2012, 11:18
I'm not big on service calibers for any large game animal. Consider they are marhginal for stopping a 200# man, It's not agood choice for those that take hunting seriously. If you want a 25yd handgun shot, start toting a 41 or 44mag.

SCmasterblaster
10-03-2012, 11:26
I'm not big on service calibers for any large game animal. Consider they are marhginal for stopping a 200# man, It's not agood choice for those that take hunting seriously. If you want a 25yd handgun shot, start toting a 41 or 44mag.

A S&W Model 629 6-inch barrelled .44 Magnum revolver.

vafish
10-03-2012, 17:25
I'm not big on service calibers for any large game animal. Consider they are marhginal for stopping a 200# man, It's not agood choice for those that take hunting seriously. If you want a 25yd handgun shot, start toting a 41 or 44mag.

I've shot lots of deer with the .44 magnum from a hand gun. A couple of them were a little over 100 yards.

Compare the ballistics of the winchester 240 gr jsp at 100 yards with the ballistics of a .40 S&W at the muzzle. Almost identical.

Under 25 yards I'd have no problem with a service caliber handgun on deer.

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fredj338
10-03-2012, 17:33
I've shot lots of deer with the .44 magnum from a hand gun. A couple of them were a little over 100 yards.

Compare the ballistics of the winchester 240 gr jsp at 100 yards with the ballistics of a .40 S&W at the muzzle. Almost identical.

Under 25 yards I'd have no problem with a service caliber handgun on deer.

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Your decision, again, service calibers are barely adequate for their purpose of fight stopper, not really a good choice for any large animal IMO. Sure it can be done but why, there are better choices. A 4" " 41 or 44mag or 45colt carries almsot as well & offers quite a lot more in penetration & wounding.:dunno:

SCmasterblaster
10-04-2012, 10:09
I've shot lots of deer with the .44 magnum from a hand gun. A couple of them were a little over 100 yards.

Compare the ballistics of the winchester 240 gr jsp at 100 yards with the ballistics of a .40 S&W at the muzzle. Almost identical.

Under 25 yards I'd have no problem with a service caliber handgun on deer.

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Glad to hear your opinion. I am going to go deer hunting with a 6-inch .44 Magnum here in VT this November.

Remington 870
10-04-2012, 13:44
Get a glock 20sf and call it a day, load it with underwood 200gr ammo and have at it!

SDGlock23
10-04-2012, 14:42
Yeah you could, but why go buy the G20sf and get invested into another cartridge when the 9mm or better yet the .40 will kill a deer just fine?

Yankee2718
10-05-2012, 06:20
The biggest reason service caliber cartridges appear to not work very well is combat shot placement. Combat and hunting are two different environments. In combat shots are fired rapidly with rudimentary aiming a good deal of time, resulting in less than ideal shot placement. Hunting generally produces one well aimed shot.

In a defensive situation, the aggressor continuing to fight for several seconds or minutes after being shot is unacceptable. The same is not true in hunting. Even when shot by high power rifles deer can still run for a few seconds after being struck. The environments are totally different and comparing them is really apples to oranges.

At 20 yards, a well aimed shot from a .40 will dispatch a deer. That is contingent upon proper bullet selection. Arrows do it with 1/4 the kinetic energy. The wounding mechanism for an arrow and a pistol bullet are very similar. Cut and crush.

SCmasterblaster
10-05-2012, 10:30
The biggest reason service caliber cartridges appear to not work very well is combat shot placement. Combat and hunting are two different environments. In combat shots are fired rapidly with rudimentary aiming a good deal of time, resulting in less than ideal shot placement. Hunting generally produces one well aimed shot.

In a defensive situation, the aggressor continuing to fight for several seconds or minutes after being shot is unacceptable. The same is not true in hunting. Even when shot by high power rifles deer can still run for a few seconds after being struck. The environments are totally different and comparing them is really apples to oranges.

At 20 yards, a well aimed shot from a .40 will dispatch a deer. That is contingent upon proper bullet selection. Arrows do it with 1/4 the kinetic energy. The wounding mechanism for an arrow and a pistol bullet are very similar. Cut and crush.

I never thought of the similarity between arrow wounds and handgun wounds. Thanks! :cool:

M1a65
10-06-2012, 02:46
Neither the 9mm or the .40 would be my first choice for deer hunting, not even for a 20 yard shot. I'm sure it can and has been done thou. The above poster recommended a G20. If I were to use a Glock to hunt that would be the cartridge I'd use with a 6" barrel and propper hot 10mm loads. Of the choices the G23 would work better of the 2 with hot loads, check into what a Lone Wolf 6" barrel would cost. Nothing worse than losing a wounded 10 pointer due to a poorly aimed shot or from a weak caliber. (not to imply your aim sucks but I've seen it too many times at the hunt club on both counts). I may be biased since I use a .44 Super Black Hawk with a 7 3/4" barrel and 300gr flat nosed hard casts on the Ga deer/hogs. Good hunting and let us know how you make out.

Remington 870
10-06-2012, 07:57
yankee2718 to add to what you pointed out, a compund bow set with a draw weight of 35 lbs has the apprx the same or more penetration of a 357 magnun round.

Yankee2718
10-06-2012, 08:44
yankee2718 to add to what you pointed out, a compund bow set with a draw weight of 35 lbs has the apprx the same or more penetration of a 357 magnun round.

That's why bullet selection is important. A deep penetrating bullet like an XTP is required.

noway
10-06-2012, 09:41
yankee2718 to add to what you pointed out, a compund bow set with a draw weight of 35 lbs has the apprx the same or more penetration of a 357 magnun round.


Care to how you came to that conclusion? And what are you comparing the so call arrow to? FMJ,HC,JHP,JSP,Wadcutter,Keither, FN,etc.......

Remember arrows kill via bloodlost & wide wound track done to the animal. Bullets from handguns do not typically generate a permanent wide wound channel to a animal. And typically don't produce major blood lost

Penetration in a bullet is different than that of a requirement of a Arrow with a broadhead fixed or mechanical.

Brucev
10-06-2012, 09:46
A Glock 17 or a Glock 23? Either would accompany my .30-06. Maybe use it if I was presented a shot under 20 yards.

First, check the law. It is not likely that either the 17 or 23 are legal for use in hunting deer. Next, get real. For other than a very close shot, neither the 17 nor the 23 are "hunting capable." Yes, even with a .22 top unit on the 17, you could kill a deer... if you got lucky. But hunting deer is not about being a stunt player. It's about killing a deer in a humane manner. A .30-06 will in almost any instance kill very humanely. Neither of the two pistols you've listed are in that class.

SCmasterblaster
10-06-2012, 11:44
First, check the law. It is not likely that either the 17 or 23 are legal for use in hunting deer. Next, get real. For other than a very close shot, neither the 17 nor the 23 are "hunting capable." Yes, even with a .22 top unit on the 17, you could kill a deer... if you got lucky. But hunting deer is not about being a stunt player. It's about killing a deer in a humane manner. A .30-06 will in almost any instance kill very humanely. Neither of the two pistols you've listed are in that class.

I'd use my G17 or finishing shots only. :cool:

Remington 870
10-06-2012, 17:58
To answer your question NOWAY. the bullet would be a fmj and my formula is in the field experiance hunting deer with said weapons.

Kingarthurhk
10-06-2012, 18:26
Why on earth would you consider taking a 9mm to a deer? One, I am not even sure its legal, so the game warden may get with you if you try. Two, it is not humane, and would require multiple hits. Three, you might end up tracking it for a long time and never finding it it.

Yankee2718
10-06-2012, 22:52
Both are legal. Either will work in the right situation with the proper application.

PrecisionRifleman
10-07-2012, 16:45
What you should be looking at is a G20SF for the intended use. I've taken a doe with mine at 50 yards in an extended LWD 6.02" barrel and handloaded 180XTP @ 1300fps. The doe dropped on the spot, and the bullet completely penetrated.

If you want a double duty SD woods gun the G22/G23 would be the way to go for finishing shots, but I wouldn't try using it as a primary. .

SDGlock23
10-07-2012, 19:56
Unless perhaps you're packing a big revolver (.44 Mag, heavy .45 Colt and up), most handguns will not be your primary hunting tool, 10mm included and the OP stated that the pistol would accompany his rifle. Deer aren't exactly hard to kill, and service calibers will get the job done up close, which is more an issue of shot placement and not power. We all know a .22 will kill deer, so it's obvious a 9mm or anything bigger will too, heck there's a video of a girl killing a 900+lb hog with a .40.

PrecisionRifleman
10-07-2012, 20:26
Unless perhaps you're packing a big revolver (.44 Mag, heavy .45 Colt and up), most handguns will not be your primary hunting tool, 10mm included and the OP stated that the pistol would accompany his rifle. Deer aren't exactly hard to kill, and service calibers will get the job done up close, which is more an issue of shot placement and not power. We all know a .22 will kill deer, so it's obvious a 9mm or anything bigger will too, heck there's a video of a girl killing a 900+lb hog with a .40.

I've seen the video of the girl killing the hog. The results in that video are the exact reason a 40S&W should not be used. She had to use the entire magazine. Pumping round after round into a game animal is unethical. Also there is a significant difference between a 40S&W in a compact, and a warm handloaded 10mm in an extended 6" barrel IMO. In this format the 10mm beats out the 357Mag. and is moving into lower end 41 Mag territory.

Yankee2718
10-07-2012, 21:39
I've seen the video of the girl killing the hog. The results in that video are the exact reason a 40S&W should not be used. She had to use the entire magazine. Pumping round after round into a game animal is unethical. Also there is a significant difference between a 40S&W in a compact, and a warm handloaded 10mm in an extended 6" barrel IMO. In this format the 10mm beats out the 357Mag. and is moving into lower end 41 Mag territory.

At the ranges you used the pistol, sure, you're correct. I don't plan on using it for anything longer than 20-25 yards. Anything longer and I'll just use my rifle. I just don't see the point in blasting a deer with an '06 at 10 yards when a well placed 40 will do the trick. Also, using a scope, even at 3x at close ranges is difficult. I used to live in a shotgun only state. We had thick woods and normally ranges were short, maybe 75 yards at the most. A lot of guys would carry a revolver for short range work instead of slamming a 1oz slug into them.

I don't own a revolver. If I did, I'd probably bring that along. But I do own a .30-06 and a Glock 23.

NBT
10-07-2012, 22:03
I'm considering taking my 21SF this year as my Bowhunting side arm, ( I do have a 23 & 27) but we have had frequent bear visit's..not to hijack the thread...but what would you take considering a potential run in with a black bear?
The 23 does not have night sight's but does have a TLR1.
The 27 has night sigh'ts but is a Gen 1... I can also take the TLR1 off and put it on the 21SF.
We had one of the guy's have a run in with a bear, and no matter how much racket he made, that bear would not leave the base of his tree. After that bear milled around at his leisure...he finally waddled off...and our buddy made it back to camp a bit rattled. He only had a 1/2 mile walk...more like sprint. I don't want to be toting a 12G. TIA for any suggestions...and I apologize to the OP...even though it's somewhat still on track. Large game, handgun options...specific to what is owned.

Yankee2718
10-07-2012, 22:15
I'm considering taking my 21SF this year as my Bowhunting side arm, ( I do have a 23 & 27) but we have had frequent bear visit's..not to hijack the thread...but what would you take considering a potential run in with a black bear?
The 23 does not have night sight's but does have a TLR1.
The 27 has night sigh'ts but is a Gen 1... I can also take the TLR1 off and put it on the 21SF.
We had one of the guy's have a run in with a bear, and no matter how much racket he made, that bear would not leave the base of his tree. After that bear milled around at his leisure...he finally waddled off...and our buddy made it back to camp a bit rattled. He only had a 1/2 mile walk...more like sprint. I don't want to be toting a 12G. TIA for any suggestions...and I apologize to the OP...even though it's somewhat still on track. Large game, handgun options...specific to what is owned.

To be honest, I'm not sure the ACP will pack enough penetration. Perhaps a 230+P XTP/FMJ/FMJ-FP would do the trick. If it were me, I might pack the 23 with some 180gr FMJ rounds. Sure, the FMJ isn't legal to hunt with, but you aren't "hunting" with the pistol. I doubt if you shot an aggressive bear with an FMJ that anyone would give you a hard time, as long as you were justified.

Check out some of the underwood or buffalo bore stuff. People seem to really like their products.

NBT
10-07-2012, 22:30
To be honest, I'm not sure the ACP will pack enough penetration. Perhaps a 230+P XTP/FMJ/FMJ-FP would do the trick. If it were me, I might pack the 23 with some 180gr FMJ rounds. Sure, the FMJ isn't legal to hunt with, but you aren't "hunting" with the pistol. I doubt if you shot an aggressive bear with an FMJ that anyone would give you a hard time, as long as you were justified.

Check out some of the underwood or buffalo bore stuff. People seem to really like their products.

Thanks...I have two boxes of BB +P for the 40 and the 45. Were on 9000 acres of private property, so I doubt there would be a problem. I often thought of getting a Bear permit, but my stand isn't really where they hang out and it's an extra $350. Were bowhunting deer...and coyote are a bigger problem to be honest with ya...I do like my 23...mightl bring them both.

Yankee2718
10-08-2012, 05:10
Thanks...I have two boxes of BB +P for the 40 and the 45. Were on 9000 acres of private property, so I doubt there would be a problem. I often thought of getting a Bear permit, but my stand isn't really where they hang out and it's an extra $350. Were bowhunting deer...and coyote are a bigger problem to be honest with ya...I do like my 23...mightl bring them both.

9000 acres? Sign me up!!! If I were you I'd bring the 23. Smaller, easier to pack, pretty much does the same thing as the 21SF. The chances of needing it for a bear are probably small.

I find that I like my 23 more than most any other pistol. I just wish shooing it wasn't like putting gas in my car!

SDGlock23
10-08-2012, 09:06
I've seen the video of the girl killing the hog. The results in that video are the exact reason a 40S&W should not be used. She had to use the entire magazine. Pumping round after round into a game animal is unethical. Also there is a significant difference between a 40S&W in a compact, and a warm handloaded 10mm in an extended 6" barrel IMO. In this format the 10mm beats out the 357Mag. and is moving into lower end 41 Mag territory.

Yes she wasn't what I would call the best shot in the world either, it was her accuracy that called for the extra shots. I wouldn't have used the .40 in that situation myself, but I sure wouldn't have chose the 10mm either. Sure there is a difference between the .40 and 10mm but not like most make it out to be. It's understandable if one is shooting a small .40 throwing a 180gr @ 950 fps vs a hot 10mm in a 6" bbl @ 1300+ fps.

My G35 (5.3" bbl) easily throws a 180gr bullet @ 1200 fps using the right powder. When I drop in the 6" KKM G24 bbl I'm knocking on 1300 fps as well. I could claim that my .40 is in lower end .41 Mag territory too, but it's not a .41 Mag, just like the 10mm isn't...and both at their best would be a very lightly loaded .41 Mag. 10mm wins out on capacity verses the .357 (and all revolvers) but they're more or less about identical in the power dept. I've chronographed 180gr .357 Mag (6" bbl) at over 1300 fps w/H110, which is about the same as warm 10mm but with much higher sectional density.

SDGlock23
10-08-2012, 09:12
I'm considering taking my 21SF this year as my Bowhunting side arm, ( I do have a 23 & 27) but we have had frequent bear visit's..not to hijack the thread...but what would you take considering a potential run in with a black bear?
The 23 does not have night sight's but does have a TLR1.
The 27 has night sigh'ts but is a Gen 1... I can also take the TLR1 off and put it on the 21SF.
We had one of the guy's have a run in with a bear, and no matter how much racket he made, that bear would not leave the base of his tree. After that bear milled around at his leisure...he finally waddled off...and our buddy made it back to camp a bit rattled. He only had a 1/2 mile walk...more like sprint. I don't want to be toting a 12G. TIA for any suggestions...and I apologize to the OP...even though it's somewhat still on track. Large game, handgun options...specific to what is owned.

Your Buffalo Bore ammo should serve you very well. I would also add, in the G23, I would load up with either the 180gr Hornady XTP or get some 180gr Gold Dot from Underwoods, might be your best shot if you don't handload. http://www.underwoodammo.com/40sandw180grainjacketedhollowpointboxof50.aspx

For the .45, probably 230gr +P Hornady XTP or the Underwoods 230gr +P Gold Dot http://www.underwoodammo.com/45acpp230grainjacketedhollowpointboxof50.aspx

If you have an aftermarket barrel, buy some .45 Super from Underwoods, that would be your best bet.

XTP's don't expand the largest, but they are very consistent and penetrate deeply as well.

Kingarthurhk
10-08-2012, 10:32
Both are legal. Either will work in the right situation with the proper application.

I can see no reasonable justification of shooting a large game animal, such as a deer with a 9mm bullet. It just won't do the job, and you will end up with a wounded suffering animal that you may or may not be able to track. It doesn't make a lick of sense.

Yankee2718
10-08-2012, 12:28
I can see no reasonable justification of shooting a large game animal, such as a deer with a 9mm bullet. It just won't do the job, and you will end up with a wounded suffering animal that you may or may not be able to track. It doesn't make a lick of sense.

There are a lot of people who kill whitetail deer with the puny 9mm. Check out hipowers and handguns. That guy has shot quite a bit of deer using a 9mm hi power.

A lot of people list thr .357 as the baseline for deer. A 125 grain .357 magnum from a 4 inch barrel has a claimed muzzle velocity around 1450fps. Everyone know that is from a pressure barrel so you're talking 1350ish from a revolver. Add 2 inches and you make the claimed 1450ish with a big, heavy, gun.

9mm ammunition can easily be loaded to 1300-1350 fps. Watch tnoutdoors9 video of the 124 +p+ gold dot. That made 1300 fps. Out of a 17 that same load will be in the 1325-1350 ball park. Use an XTP and I think it'll work just fine at close range.

uz2bUSMC
10-08-2012, 13:20
I can see no reasonable justification of shooting a large game animal, such as a deer with a 9mm bullet. It just won't do the job, and you will end up with a wounded suffering animal that you may or may not be able to track. It doesn't make a lick of sense.

Somehow people trust the 9mm with their lives, depending on it to stop violent assailants but it can't kill a deer? The 9mm is more than fine for a deer. A deep penetrating round properly placed will have no trouble taking a deer humanely, especially within 20yds as Yankee has said.

If one doesn't have the ability to take a deer with a 9mm they shouldn't bother hunting at all.

Kingarthurhk
10-08-2012, 14:01
There are a lot of people who kill whitetail deer with the puny 9mm. Check out hipowers and handguns. That guy has shot quite a bit of deer using a 9mm hi power.

A lot of people list thr .357 as the baseline for deer. A 125 grain .357 magnum from a 4 inch barrel has a claimed muzzle velocity around 1450fps. Everyone know that is from a pressure barrel so you're talking 1350ish from a revolver. Add 2 inches and you make the claimed 1450ish with a big, heavy, gun.

9mm ammunition can easily be loaded to 1300-1350 fps. Watch tnoutdoors9 video of the 124 +p+ gold dot. That made 1300 fps. Out of a 17 that same load will be in the 1325-1350 ball park. Use an XTP and I think it'll work just fine at close range.

I have seen the end result of someone doing that. It was in the XD forums. A guy was proud of himself that he killed at fawn with his XD 9mm. It only took him half a dozen shots to do it. Why on earth would you do that to an animal on purpose?

I once was forced to kill a medium sized dog with a 9mm. It screamed and yelped before it died, and it took several hits to do it. It did not die well. These were solid heart long shots at nearly point blank range as it had me cornered. However, it was the only round I had at that moment. I know people think the 9mm is the be all and end all of rounds. It isn't.

GunAround
10-08-2012, 14:09
My G20 (2nd gen) is my woods carry and has taken 2 whitetails. I would for sure take my 40 over my 9 if those were my choices.

Yankee2718
10-08-2012, 15:17
I have seen the end result of someone doing that. It was in the XD forums. A guy was proud of himself that he killed at fawn with his XD 9mm. It only took him half a dozen shots to do it. Why on earth would you do that to an animal on purpose?

I once was forced to kill a medium sized dog with a 9mm. It screamed and yelped before it died, and it took several hits to do it. It did not die well. These were solid heart long shots at nearly point blank range as it had me cornered. However, it was the only round I had at that moment. I know people think the 9mm is the be all and end all of rounds. It isn't.

Everything kicks, screams, and yelps when it is dying. Even game animals shot with high power rifles. Killing is killing. This humane kill bull **** is just something people started spewing when PETA showed up. There is nothing noble or humane about killing something. People will ***** whine and complain about someone handgun hunting with a 9/40, but have no qualms about shooting an animal with an arrow.

If you ask me, while we're talking about the humanity of a kill, bow hunting is just plain stupid then. That's the most inhumane way to kill an animal. The mechanism for death is hemmorhage. An animal will be kicking and screaming for sometimes minutes after a bow shot, yet there is nothing wrong with that. How about all the bow hunters that wound animals and never find them. Ever seen a deer running around with a broken shaft in its thigh? I have. People even hunt elk and bear with bows. But that somehow is more humane than using a .40 handgun that produces both more penetration and foot pounds of energy with the proper bullet selection.

Kingarthurhk
10-08-2012, 15:36
Everything kicks, screams, and yelps when it is dying. Even game animals shot with high power rifles. Killing is killing. This humane kill bull **** is just something people started spewing when PETA showed up. There is nothing noble or humane about killing something. People will ***** whine and complain about someone handgun hunting with a 9/40, but have no qualms about shooting an animal with an arrow.

If you ask me, while we're talking about the humanity of a kill, bow hunting is just plain stupid then. That's the most inhumane way to kill an animal. The mechanism for death is hemmorhage. An animal will be kicking and screaming for sometimes minutes after a bow shot, yet there is nothing wrong with that. How about all the bow hunters that wound animals and never find them. Ever seen a deer running around with a broken shaft in its thigh? I have. People even hunt elk and bear with bows. But that somehow is more humane than using a .40 handgun that produces both more penetration and foot pounds of energy with the proper bullet selection.

The argument about taking large game with a 9mm makes about as much sense as hunting one with a Jennings .25 I suppose it holds still enough, that round can probably kill most things, right?

The point, is whenever possible to make a clean kill. Causing needless suffering is not about sportsmanship, or the sign of a good hunter.

uz2bUSMC
10-08-2012, 16:07
The argument about taking large game with a 9mm makes about as much sense as hunting one with a Jennings .25 I suppose it holds still enough, that round can probably kill most things, right?

The point, is whenever possible to make a clean kill. Causing needless suffering is not about sportsmanship, or the sign of a good hunter.

Yea, no it doesn't make the same amount of sense as shooting the animal with a .25. The .25 lacks the penetration ability and has a smaller crush volume. A double lung shot with a 9mm or .40 is as clean of a kill as any. If hunting was about the most humane method available only head shots would be taken. As was said, if the animal can be taken with a bow it can be taken with the 9mm or .40 just the same. People take hogs with dogs and a knife, guessing that a good shot with a 9mm or .40 is a bit less stressful for the animal than a couple of bay dogs circling while catch dogs jump on only to wait for the hunter to arrive and slice your throat. Or maybe trapping is humane...

Point is, the deer can be taken responsibly with a 9mm or .40 if the hunter refuses to take a shot that is above his/her capability or the cartidges.

barth
10-08-2012, 16:17
A Glock 17 or a Glock 23? Either would accompany my .30-06. Maybe use it if I was presented a shot under 20 yards.

Neither.
Personally I wouldn't consider anything less than a 357 mag or a 10mm for deer.

44 mag would be my handgun caliber of choice for close range work.
They hit something like a 30 30 carbine close up.

Yankee2718
10-08-2012, 16:22
The argument about taking large game with a 9mm makes about as much sense as hunting one with a Jennings .25 I suppose it holds still enough, that round can probably kill most things, right?

The point, is whenever possible to make a clean kill. Causing needless suffering is not about sportsmanship, or the sign of a good hunter.

My point is that no one thinks twice about using a bow and arrow, but using a .40 caliber handgun makes you an inhumane sob. If a 20 gram arrow at 315 fps can kill a deer, a 180 grain XTP at 1000 fps will too.

A poacher can kill a deer with a .22LR. I'm not advocating the handgun as a pirmary weapon. It's for short range applications. Im not pulling it the G23 for a 55 yard broadside shot.

Kingarthurhk
10-08-2012, 17:35
My point is that no one thinks twice about using a bow and arrow, but using a .40 caliber handgun makes you an inhumane sob. If a 20 gram arrow at 315 fps can kill a deer, a 180 grain XTP at 1000 fps will too.

A poacher can kill a deer with a .22LR. I'm not advocating the handgun as a pirmary weapon. It's for short range applications. Im not pulling it the G23 for a 55 yard broadside shot.

A poacher can take one by shooting it through the eye with a .22lr. I know, because my grandfather kept food on the table durring the Depression that way. However, it isn't the Depression. Adeqauate hunting weapons and ammo are not outrageously expensive and available.

The smallest semi-auto I would take for a broadside shot to a deer would be a 10mm. At least you are getting .41 caliber ballistics, especially if it is loaded properly.

But, there is no way I would consider taking my G17 out and popping rounds at deer.

I am actually hoping to try my hand at my scoped .454 casull this year.

Yankee2718
10-08-2012, 23:00
Neither.
Personally I wouldn't consider anything less than a 357 mag or a 10mm for deer.

44 mag would be my handgun caliber of choice for close range work.
They hit something like a 30 30 carbine close up.

A 9mm loaded to full potential isn't too far behind a .357 Mag out of weapons with similar barrel lengths. Underwood is hitting 1300 fps from a G19 with 124 gold dots. Not too far from .357 mag velocity from a 4 inch gun.

countrygun
10-08-2012, 23:12
IME the .41 mag gets the job done well when loaded down a bit with a 210-220 Gn KSWC. I go for 1,200 fps and it is good to as far as any hangun in my hands, which puts a t a 10mm in the ballpark, with a 200 gn so for me they are a wash. Ironically I have to handload the .41 down and the 10 up from common factory loads.

Kingarthurhk
10-08-2012, 23:18
A 9mm loaded to full potential isn't too far behind a .357 Mag out of weapons with similar barrel lengths. Underwood is hitting 1300 fps from a G19 with 124 gold dots. Not too far from .357 mag velocity from a 4 inch gun.

I've shot hot 9mm. I own a Smith 686 .357 magnum. The two aren't even comparible.

Yankee2718
10-08-2012, 23:31
I've shot hot 9mm. I own a Smith 686 .357 magnum. The two aren't even comparible.

Have you put them over a chronograph? What's the barrel length of your 686?

Kingarthurhk
10-08-2012, 23:49
Have you put them over a chronograph? What's the barrel length of your 686?

4" barrel. It kicks plenty with a full house load. You know you shot something. Again, nothing like a hot 9mm.

A .22lr and a .223 travel at pretty fast FPS, but I wouldn't take them grizzly bear hunting either.

Yankee2718
10-09-2012, 00:18
4" barrel. It kicks plenty with a full house load. You know you shot something. Again, nothing like a hot 9mm.

A .22lr and a .223 travel at pretty fast FPS, but I wouldn't take them grizzly bear hunting either.

Obviously not. The bullet construction is all wrong.

Kingarthurhk
10-09-2012, 04:57
Obviously not. The bullet construction is all wrong.

Exactly. That is why hunting a deer with a 9mm is absurd.

Yankee2718
10-09-2012, 07:25
Exactly. That is why hunting a deer with a 9mm is absurd.

Have you seen what modern pistol bullets will withstand? XTP bullets are tough. The modern bonded bullets hold together well too. Deer are thin skinned game. I think it's Winchester that is making .223 ammo for deer now. A 9mm pistol bullet is plenty tough enough to penetrate to vital organs in the accepted performance window of the cartridge.

If a 9mm can punch through a windshield or car door and still make 12 inches in gel, I think it'll work on a deer with no armor.

SCmasterblaster
10-09-2012, 07:47
Have you seen what modern pistol bullets will withstand? XTP bullets are tough. The modern bonded bullets hold together well too. Deer are thin skinned game. I think it's Winchester that is making .223 ammo for deer now. A 9mm pistol bullet is plenty tough enough to penetrate to vital organs in the accepted performance window of the cartridge.

If a 9mm can punch through a windshield or car door and still make 12 inches in gel, I think it'll work on a deer with no armor.

So true. I use my G17 for quieter finishing shots :cool:

Bilbo Bagins
10-09-2012, 07:56
Carrying a G17 would be a PITA. Too big so it will just get in the way. You really want to lug a full size Glock 17, with your bow and gear, while dragging a dead deer out of the woods?

.40S&W is a better caliber for woods walking and hunting. Personally I have a G27 and a Walther PPS in .40 that I use when out in the woods. The G23 should do you just fine.

SCmasterblaster
10-09-2012, 08:13
Carrying a G17 would be a PITA. Too big so it will just get in the way. You really want to lug a full size Glock 17, with your bow and gear, while dragging a dead deer out of the woods?

.40S&W is a better caliber for woods walking and hunting. Personally I have a G27 and a Walther PPS in .40 that I use when out in the woods. The G23 should do you just fine.

A 32-ounce handgun wouldn't be too much of a burden. :cool:

Bilbo Bagins
10-09-2012, 09:43
A 32-ounce handgun wouldn't be too much of a burden. :cool:

The loaded weight between the G17 and G23 is not much. The G23 is only an ounce lighter.

The PITA is the size. A full size service pistol needs to be carried on the hip, and it will just get in the way when your gutting and hauling. Compacts and subcompacts are just more comfortable to carry.

G17 Length 8.03" , height 5.43"

G23 Length 7.3", Height 5.00"

Yankee2718
10-09-2012, 09:53
The G23 does carry easier than the G17. Still debating. The whole debate may prove to be a moot point if I can't find the time to go this year. I think I will though.

SCmasterblaster
10-09-2012, 10:22
The G23 does carry easier than the G17. Still debating. The whole debate may prove to be a moot point if I can't find the time to go this year. I think I will though.

That's right. A G23 weighs several ounces less than a G17.

Kingarthurhk
10-09-2012, 16:19
Have you seen what modern pistol bullets will withstand? XTP bullets are tough. The modern bonded bullets hold together well too. Deer are thin skinned game. I think it's Winchester that is making .223 ammo for deer now. A 9mm pistol bullet is plenty tough enough to penetrate to vital organs in the accepted performance window of the cartridge.

If a 9mm can punch through a windshield or car door and still make 12 inches in gel, I think it'll work on a deer with no armor.

So I guess this means you'll be shooting deer with a .22 now?
Ruger .22 Pistol vs Car door - YouTube

Yankee2718
10-09-2012, 16:24
So I guess this means you'll be shooting deer with a .22 now?

Now you're just being ridiculous.

uz2bUSMC
10-09-2012, 16:24
So I guess this means you'll be shooting deer with a .22 now?
Ruger .22 Pistol vs Car door - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sq_3STLnSe0)

Notice how he said it can go through a wind shield or car door (which you highlighted) AND penetrate 12" in gel?

Can you not read well or is it hard for you to keep things in perspective? Seems to be both.

Kingarthurhk
10-09-2012, 16:43
Now you're just being ridiculous.

Just like hunting a large game animal with a 9mm is normal?:upeyes:

SCmasterblaster
10-09-2012, 18:23
Just like hunting a large game animal with a 9mm is normal?:upeyes:

Who said that? I suggested the 9mm for a finishing shot on a downed but still alive deer.

Yankee2718
10-09-2012, 20:34
Just like hunting a large game animal with a 9mm is normal?:upeyes:

The entire point of this thread is not to use the 9mm as a primary firearm, but as a short range weapon. The ranges were stated early on. The 9mm is being utilized as a sidearm to a .30-06 rifle.

And for the record, whitetail deer is considered medium, thin skinned game. But that's just semantics.

SCmasterblaster
10-10-2012, 07:33
The entire point of this thread is not to use the 9mm as a primary firearm, but as a short range weapon. The ranges were stated early on. The 9mm is being utilized as a sidearm to a .30-06 rifle.

And for the record, whitetail deer is considered medium, thin skinned game. But that's just semantics.

Don't be too concerned - he is just being argumentative. :upeyes:

Kingarthurhk
10-11-2012, 16:57
The entire point of this thread is not to use the 9mm as a primary firearm, but as a short range weapon. The ranges were stated early on. The 9mm is being utilized as a sidearm to a .30-06 rifle.

And for the record, whitetail deer is considered medium, thin skinned game. But that's just semantics.

It is semantics considering their pelt is thicker than human skin, and their bone structure is denser.

Kingarthurhk
10-11-2012, 16:58
Don't be too concerned - he is just being argumentative. :upeyes:

No, I am wondering how many of the mall ninjas really are hunters.

Yankee2718
10-12-2012, 11:14
No, I am wondering how many of the mall ninjas really are hunters.

I think this would qualify as mall ninjaish if the thread was about using a 40 to kill a deer at 100 yards.

I think my deer equipment will be a Marlin 336 30-30 and the Glock 23.

SCmasterblaster
10-12-2012, 13:55
No, I am wondering how many of the mall ninjas really are hunters.

VT deer season is approaching for me. I deer hunt every year.

vafish
10-12-2012, 15:34
VT deer season is approaching for me. I deer hunt every year.

A friend of my dads deer hunted every year for over 30 years.

He never shot a deer, he went to deer camp for a week's vacation from his wife.

I kill between 2 and 5 deer every year. I use bow, crossbow, muzzle loader, shotgun, rifle, and handgun. I have no problem with close shots and a service caliber handgun.



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vafish
10-12-2012, 15:36
Carrying a G17 would be a PITA. Too big so it will just get in the way. You really want to lug a full size Glock 17, with your bow and gear, while dragging a dead deer out of the woods?

.40S&W is a better caliber for woods walking and hunting. Personally I have a G27 and a Walther PPS in .40 that I use when out in the woods. The G23 should do you just fine.

I carry a g23 if I'm deer hunting or not. No more trouble to carry hunting than it is on any other day.

Oh and one of the properties I hunt is adjacent to a medium security prison.

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SCmasterblaster
10-13-2012, 14:10
I carry a g23 if I'm deer hunting or not. No more trouble to carry hunting than it is on any other day.

Oh and one of the properties I hunt is adjacent to a medium security prison.

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G23 is a great pistol!!!! :cool:

meatloaf samwich
10-21-2012, 20:03
40 S&W +P 180 Grain Bonded Jacketed Hollow Point Box of 50 (http://www.underwoodammo.com/40sandw180grainjacketedhollowpointboxof50.aspx)

Price: $27.36 underwood

Rev. ChadW
10-22-2012, 10:07
I carry a Ruger Blackhawk .45 Colt. I load it with a Remington 225 grain SWC.

SCmasterblaster
10-22-2012, 10:20
The loaded weight between the G17 and G23 is not much. The G23 is only an ounce lighter.

The PITA is the size. A full size service pistol needs to be carried on the hip, and it will just get in the way when your gutting and hauling. Compacts and subcompacts are just more comfortable to carry.

G17 Length 8.03" , height 5.43"

G23 Length 7.3", Height 5.00"

That makes good sense. Now I understand. :supergrin:

rustytxrx
10-22-2012, 17:40
since 1995 or 1996??? I have taken one Texas whitetail doe with a 9mm, two with a .40.

I have taken two cull doe every year since '95 or 96' with two glock 20s. One gen 2 and one gen 3. I have just put a new 6" barrel on my gen 2 and got a new Wolf barrel for my gen 3 to shoot heavy lead cast bullets for big pigs

All shots were within 20 yds and all double lungs. I wait till I get the shot I want. the last thing I look at is the angle the wound channel will be.

I post ya pic of the glocks as soon as I figure the process out :wavey:

rusty
Texas, I luv you

ps I know I ansered a question you didn't ask. If I was serious about deer hunting (and I am), I go with the Glock 20

lets see if I have this down yet

http://i1340.photobucket.com/albums/o727/rustytxrx/2012-10-17221652_zps8836d659.jpg

Boot Stomper
10-22-2012, 17:55
I have killed a deer with a hangun and I will tell you it can be tricky. A deer's head is shaped like a football and the handgun round tends to travel around the skull. Now, I try not to use a handgun to kill a deer, but if you have to shoot them aim for the heart and/or lungs.

I originally tried shooting the deer in the head to preserve meat for the guy that had hit it with his car.

rustytxrx
10-22-2012, 18:52
BTW I am not an expert on Glocks. I think the bottom g20 is a gen 2 but really not sure. I bought it in '95 or '96. ss# starts with BSFxxxx if that helps any. pretty sure the new one is a gen 3

rusty

Quick N Steady
10-22-2012, 19:11
First, if you are going to shoot any size deer with a pistol it should be a neck or head shot. That does not leave room for a non-lethal placement. If you can't hit those spots you should not be taking the shot. Second, Glock 21 or 1911 with a .460 Rowland conversion. My personal whitetail pistol is a S&W 44 mag. The .460 Rowland is 44 mag ballistics out of a semi-auto frame.

uz2bUSMC
10-22-2012, 19:26
First, if you are going to shoot any size deer with a pistol it should be a neck or head shot. That does not leave room for a non-lethal placement. If you can't hit those spots you should not be taking the shot. Second, Glock 21 or 1911 with a .460 Rowland conversion. My personal whitetail pistol is a S&W 44 mag. The .460 Rowland is 44 mag ballistics out of a semi-auto frame.

There's no need for a head or neck shot when a 10mm can give a complete pass through on a deer. 800+ ft lbs is plenty for normal harvesting of the animal.

Armchair Commando
10-22-2012, 19:28
First, if you are going to shoot any size deer with a pistol it should be a neck or head shot. That does not leave room for a non-lethal placement. If you can't hit those spots you should not be taking the shot.
Please never give hunting advice again. You are very misinformed and have obviously never hunted deer before.


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Quick N Steady
10-22-2012, 19:57
Please never give hunting advice again. You are very misinformed and have obviously never hunted deer before.


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Misinformed? I understand ballistics quite well. It as a matter of accuracy and challenge. Anyone can go for brown and down. Body shots are for either bow hunting or wasting meat and poor aim with a center fire.

rustytxrx
10-22-2012, 20:06
TheStreetKing - I agree with you absolutley. I could not decide what to do about that advice since it would be off topic....BUT don't every try a head or neck shot. Any deer hunter will tell you that is the most unethical hunting shot you can take. the chances of you wounding the deer and never find it are very high. just don't do it.

sorry that I posted on this thread.

rusty craine
fort worth, tx

Clutch Cargo
10-22-2012, 22:59
Neither, 357 mag minimum, 44 better.
I was told a 10mm would bring down Godzilla :rofl:

SCmasterblaster
10-23-2012, 10:45
Misinformed? I understand ballistics quite well. It as a matter of accuracy and challenge. Anyone can go for brown and down. Body shots are for either bow hunting or wasting meat and poor aim with a center fire.

Good answer, QNS :cool:

Armchair Commando
10-23-2012, 18:40
Misinformed? I understand ballistics quite well. It as a matter of accuracy and challenge. Anyone can go for brown and down. Body shots are for either bow hunting or wasting meat and poor aim with a center fire.

Im a bowhunter, and I've hunted deer with pistol and slug gun and i would never in a million years ever advise someone to shoot a deer in the neck or head regardless of what instrument was used to do the deed. The only way to kill a deer in the neck is to hit the artery and that's a very small window to hit.
Only a complete fool would purposefully shoot a deer in the neck or head. And what meat would you be destroying if you double lunged a deer exactly? Those little slices of rib meat? I've shot 4 deer with my remington and didn't destroy hardly any meat.
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Armchair Commando
10-23-2012, 18:42
TheStreetKing - I agree with you absolutley. I could not decide what to do about that advice since it would be off topic....BUT don't every try a head or neck shot. Any deer hunter will tell you that is the most unethical hunting shot you can take. the chances of you wounding the deer and never find it are very high. just don't do it.

sorry that I posted on this thread.

rusty craine
fort worth, tx

Good post

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vanilla_gorilla
10-23-2012, 19:54
This thread has been great entertainment. I facepalmed at first, but it became humorous very quickly.

And for those. I guess I can't kill a deer with my 9mm or .45 ACP this year. I'll be sure and tell the deer when I kill him. :whistling:

Yankee2718
10-24-2012, 01:03
I was just reading about the deer from the WMA I'm going to hunt. Average weight of a buck dressed was 85 pounds. I'm starting to think the .30-30 is overkill.:cool: I'm seriously looking into a Remington 700 SPS in .223. Might convert my Savage M12 .22-250 to a .243 or .260 though. Oh the options.

SDGlock23
10-24-2012, 08:33
I see no problem with using a Glock as a hunting tool. This thread was about a sidearm anyways, not your main gun. However, if you can get a deer in close and put the bullet where it needs to go, I don't see a problem. A bad shot is a bad shot, it doesn't matter what you're using. Put one through the boiler room and you've got a dead deer.

I hope to get to go hunting this year, my .308 will be my main gun, but I promise I will have a Glock with me too, either my G21 Gen4 w/KKM 4-port shooting .45 Super (230gr @ 1200+ or 200gr @ 1350+) or my Gen4 G35 .40 S&W with 6" G24 KKM barrel (165 Gold Dot @ 1400 or 180gr XTP/Gold Dot @ 1275). I wouldn't hesitate using either if the opportunity presented itself.

SCmasterblaster
10-25-2012, 17:46
I was told a 10mm would bring down Godzilla :rofl:

If G was coming at me, I would want a G20 with full-power 10mm ammunition.

rustytxrx
10-28-2012, 18:59
10mm! I hunted with it for 2 decades. Now 70 yrs old, I limit the size pig I am taking out of the boggy bottoms. Populations control I shoot for sexually immature females. That puts them under 18months old and maybe 120 or so pounds. If ya know pig anatomy, you are under 20 yds, you contol the location and direction of the wound channel.....the full power 10 mm from a. 6" glock 20 will put a lot of pork in the freezer.

In younger days the largest pig I've taken with the 10 mm (g20) was 234# boar. I was in ground blind. Shot was 12 yds. Took both lungs down and a hole in top of heart. He went farther than ya'd think with that shot.

10 mm is a terrific caliber. It is not magic though and is exactly as good as the shooter.

The glock 20 is a great partner for the 10mm. No hammer cock, no safety click, safety trigger stroke let's you make sure of wound channel path. The 6" barrel is worth an extra 100 fps or so.

Culling Texas white tail does and feral pigs for the freezer, perfect combo.

Rusty
Texas, I luv u

PS
What do you think
https://picasaweb.google.com/102738515278900281475/Trailcam?authuser=0&authkey=Gv1sRgCNi21KqPsdPPxgE&feat=directlink

rustytxrx
10-28-2012, 19:46
If I told you how many pigs and deer I have taken wit my two G20s, you would have thought me a teller of hunting tells or a fibber. Ill just let you pick a number after viewing 24 hour trail cam pics in ps of last post. If you have any doubt of the effectiveness of 10mm in the right hands......your doubt is misplaced

Rusty
Texas, I luv u

SCmasterblaster
10-29-2012, 11:50
If I told you how many pigs and deer I have taken wit my two G20s, you would have thought me a teller of hunting tells or a fibber. Ill just let you pick a number after viewing 24 hour trail cam pics in ps of last post. If you have any doubt of the effectiveness of 10mm in the right hands......your doubt is misplaced

Rusty
Texas, I luv u

I believe you, sir. You must be a good shot. :cool:

rustytxrx
10-29-2012, 13:31
I would likely be consider a good shot. The points I would make is that near all of my shots are under 50' and the Glock is lethally guiet. At 15 yds cocking a hammer or the click of a safety sounds like ya hit the 80 yd gong with a 45acp. Both are a very unnatural sound in the Boggy bottoms.

Before the 10 mm I hunted with s&w 41 mag. I also shot it double action so not to have the cocking sound.

Quiet and close is lethal. Being a good shot is an aid.

Rusty
Texas, I luv u

method
10-29-2012, 16:47
If you ask me, while we're talking about the humanity of a kill, bow hunting is just plain stupid then. That's the most inhumane way to kill an animal. The mechanism for death is hemmorhage. An animal will be kicking and screaming for sometimes minutes after a bow shot, yet there is nothing wrong with that. How about all the bow hunters that wound animals and never find them. Ever seen a deer running around with a broken shaft in its thigh? I have. People even hunt elk and bear with bows. But that somehow is more humane than using a .40 handgun that produces both more penetration and foot pounds of energy with the proper bullet selection.


People have successfully hunted everything that walks the earth with bow and arrow. As for humane...I've seen deer shot through the chest with an arrow, and they don't even flinch. They just stand there and then fall on their face dead after several seconds.

There is no comparison whatsoever between an arrow with a sharp broadhead and a .40 pistol. Someone said the two use the same mechanics...crush and cut...uh no. If your arrow is crushing tissue, you need to learn how to sharpen the head. No bullet will cut anywhere near as well as a broadhead either.

eta...you really thing a bullet in the thigh will put a deer down any better? Shot placement counts, for every kind of projectile out there.

c01
10-29-2012, 17:23
Regardless, you did the right thing. As a hunter I found it my duty to make sure any kill was quick and humane. Any shots outside of my abilities had to be passed.

I have since given up hunting, I now prefer to just watch wildlife. However, I realize and respect that others choose to hunt and have absolutely no objection to hunting.

Upland bird hunting was always my favorite, I'd do that again if given a chance to hunt in a place with decent pheasant numbers.

Good post. Exactly what I tell my son. Then we practice in the off season so he can make the shot. He was suprised at how fast a deer goes down when he shot his first through the heart.
D

SCmasterblaster
10-30-2012, 07:36
People have successfully hunted everything that walks the earth with bow and arrow. As for humane...I've seen deer shot through the chest with an arrow, and they don't even flinch. They just stand there and then fall on their face dead after several seconds.

There is no comparison whatsoever between an arrow with a sharp broadhead and a .40 pistol. Someone said the two use the same mechanics...crush and cut...uh no. If your arrow is crushing tissue, you need to learn how to sharpen the head. No bullet will cut anywhere near as well as a broadhead either.

eta...you really thing a bullet in the thigh will put a deer down any better? Shot placement counts, for every kind of projectile out there.

Thanks for the arrow info. I learned something. :cool:

ithaca_deerslayer
10-30-2012, 08:20
I use .44 mag handgun, at bowhunting ranges, and broadside. 240gr semi-jacket soft point. Plain old Winchester white box or Remington yellow & green box.

Both the bullet and the arrow will punch straight through both lungs. Even though one cuts and the other crushes, I don't see a big difference between them.

I've never used a 9mm, but I would if given the opportunity. Gold Dot 124gr from Glock 26. I carry it as my CCW. It is on me when I hunt with a rifle or shotgun. Left my shotgun at the bottom of a tree once to climb up and fix the treestand area above. A giant buck came through and you bet I was digging under my hunting clothes for my Glock. I would have taken a 10 yard heart lung shot on him. But he jumped off as I drew. No firing at a running away deer.

So in my opinion a 9mm defensive round on a standing broadside deer is fine. Under 20 yards sounds right for 9mm. You want precision and power.

Going up in caliber gives you more distance and more power for more difficult angles. That's why I like .44mag for handgun and .308/.30-06 for rifle :)

SCmasterblaster
10-30-2012, 09:02
This thread has been great entertainment. I facepalmed at first, but it became humorous very quickly.

And for those. I guess I can't kill a deer with my 9mm or .45 ACP this year. I'll be sure and tell the deer when I kill him. :whistling:

Say it isn't so! A mere 9mm against deer?