If you were worried about the economy becoming worse [Archive] - Glock Talk

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RMTactical
11-07-2012, 16:13
than it is now, what would you do to prepare yourself and your family?

Glock20 10mm
11-07-2012, 16:32
Living off grid is step one. Check
Building the local community and relationships within is step two. Check
Purchasing silver as a method to maintain buying power is step three. Check but buying more.
Own firearms and maintain proficiency with said firearms is step four. Check

Wait. Check

427
11-07-2012, 16:38
Getting out of debt.

I've been doing more and more flipping.

Living life on a cash basis.

Philippe
11-07-2012, 16:41
Living off grid is step one. Check
Building the local community and relationships within is step two. Check
Purchasing silver as a method to maintain buying power is step three. Check but buying more.
Own firearms and maintain proficiency with said firearms is step four. Check

Wait. Check


Let me ask this. Are you buying silver to actually make money or are you actually thinking when and if the entire nation crashes you can use this as a barter item? I deal in pm's myself and i like to hear others stories of why they are in the market.

Beretta92guy
11-07-2012, 16:43
living within your means (and thats hard when you are a gun enthusiast, LOL), paying off debt, no car payments, saving cash....working....

hell what else can we do????????????????????????

Andy123
11-07-2012, 16:47
A lot of people are saying, "Paying off debts," but if massive inflation is coming, shouldn't we live on debt and save in hard assets?

427
11-07-2012, 16:48
A lot of people are saying, "Paying off debts," but if massive inflation is coming, shouldn't we live on debt and save in hard assets?

If I pay off my debt, I have more cash to work with.

Glock20 10mm
11-07-2012, 16:49
The silver I buy is my hedge against the fiat currency failing. Many say it can't happen... but it has happened before many times in history. Most recently in Argentina. And as with those previous fiat currency failures, people said it couldn't happen... but it did. And the people that had PM's were the ones that had buying power.

It wasn't that long ago the British Stirling was the global currency... where is it now? Sure the UK is still around, but they went through a period where their fiat currency failed. Let's go back to the Wiemar Republic, the Deutsch Mark ballooned to failure due to inflation... we are seeing the same things happening here now.

With all the QE BS from DC and the over borrowing, and spending more than we are cutting it's a matter of time before the deck of cards called the US dollar comes crashing down.

I am basically doing what my great grandfather did just before the great depression and dust bowl. I am doing what I can to ensure my family remains fiscally solvent enough to ride the pain out. I have no illusion of making money in the PM market, that's not my goal.

427
11-07-2012, 16:58
The silver I buy is my hedge against the fiat currency failing. Many say it can't happen... but it has happened before many times in history. Most recently in Argentina. And as with those previous fiat currency failures, people said it couldn't happen... but it did. And the people that had PM's were the ones that had buying power.

It wasn't that long ago the British Stirling was the global currency... where is it now? Sure the UK is still around, but they went through a period where their fiat currency failed. Let's go back to the Wiemar Republic, the Deutsch Mark ballooned to failure due to inflation... we are seeing the same things happening here now.

With all the QE BS from DC and the over borrowing, and spending more than we are cutting it's a matter of time before the deck of cards called the US dollar comes crashing down.

I am basically doing what my great grandfather did just before the great depression and dust bowl. I am doing what I can to ensure my family remains fiscally solvent enough to ride the pain out. I have no illusion of making money in the PM market, that's not my goal.

I've been buying older gold and silver jewlry and hording.

heliguy
11-07-2012, 16:58
Before the election moved $750k in 401k to cash.... Knew if oblowme won the market would tank today....

Patchman
11-07-2012, 17:06
Rid myself of debt. Cash is king. Shed $Euros$. Purchase Chinese $RMBs$.

syntaxerrorsix
11-07-2012, 17:10
Getting out of debt.

I've been doing more and more flipping.

Living life on a cash basis.

Uh why? If it's an economic collapse why aren't you borrowing as much as you can?

Afraid they are gonna collect?

No offense intended and I have a great credit rating because I pay my bills but if your going to spend money and you are really worried about a collapse spend someone elses and keep your own.

syntaxerrorsix
11-07-2012, 17:10
A lot of people are saying, "Paying off debts," but if massive inflation is coming, shouldn't we live on debt and save in hard assets?


Beat me to it.

Beretta92guy
11-07-2012, 17:16
Before the election moved $750k in 401k to cash.... Knew if oblowme won the market would tank today....

"oblowme":rofl::rofl:

fnfalman
11-07-2012, 17:19
I'm marrying rich.

427
11-07-2012, 17:20
Uh why? If it's an economic collapse why aren't you borrowing as much as you can?

Afraid they are gonna collect?

No offense intended and I have a great credit rating because I pay my bills but if your going to spend money and you are really worried about a collapse spend someone elses and keep your own.

We aren't in a economic collapse right now, are we? The key word is right now.

I'll be debt free soon, no more money going toward payments.

And yes, I pay my bills, just like you.

syntaxerrorsix
11-07-2012, 17:29
We aren't in a economic collapse right now, are we? The key word is right now.

I'll be debt free soon, no more money going toward payments.

And yes, I pay my bills, just like you.


If you are really concerned about collapse you wouldn't be paying off bills. Afraid your credit rating will drop?

syntaxerrorsix
11-07-2012, 17:30
Lets be honest.

geofri
11-07-2012, 17:37
I'm marrying rich.
Does she have a sister?

427
11-07-2012, 17:41
If you are really concerned about collapse you wouldn't be paying off bills. Afraid your credit rating will drop?

Dude, I want to be debt free. I'm almost there. It's that simple. ┐Comprende?

syntaxerrorsix
11-07-2012, 17:43
Dude, I want to be debt free. I'm almost there. It's that simple. ┐Comprende?


Oh no I get it. A noble goal. However, if I really felt we were on the verge of a collapse I wouldn't care.

Andy123
11-07-2012, 17:44
Being debt free is an honorable thing, and I am somewhat close myself. But I do believe that the US financial system will collapse before 2020. I have no children, my serious thought is, what should I be doing.

I'm a bit at a loss.

syntaxerrorsix
11-07-2012, 17:47
Being debt free is an honorable thing, and I am somewhat close myself. But I do believe that the US financial system will collapse before 2020. I have no children, my serious thought is, what should I be doing.

I'm a bit at a loss.

Become beholden to no one you cant walk away from.

southernshooter
11-07-2012, 17:50
I have cash stockpiled. May not do any good if a loaf of bread is $100 etc.

syntaxerrorsix
11-07-2012, 17:52
I've stockpiled useful tools and items as opposed to currency.

JackMac
11-08-2012, 11:40
satisfy my debts, be more frugal, prepare to feed and clothe my family, prepare to provide for my needs and that of my family with the goal being "zero" tolerance for dependence upon local, state, or federal government. "Be Prepared".

Jumper
11-08-2012, 13:20
I've stockpiled useful tools and items as opposed to currency.

Interesting. Would you mind elaborating on what kind of items/tools?

I think I've had similiar thoughts: Keep useful items around for bartering as goods or, to provide services for other services.

Glock20 10mm
11-08-2012, 14:11
Interesting. Would you mind elaborating on what kind of items/tools?

I think I've had similiar thoughts: Keep useful items around for bartering as goods or, to provide services for other services.

A short list to start...

MRE's for days when you need lots of calories and have no time for preparing a decent meal

Seeds (not the GMO variety either) for food production

Basic hand tools (saws, hammers, screw drivers)

Repair materials (tar paper, nails, extra wood)

Extra clothes in vacuum sealed bags (old stuff will wear out eventually)

Extra shoes also in vacuum sealed bags

Re-chargable batteries with solar charging components

Canned goods

Canning materials (jars, paraffin wax, lids, pressure cooker)

Bulk iodized salt in a dry storage container

Bulk pure can sugar in a dry storage container

Honey... it lasts damn near forever

Aspirin, motrin and other over the counter pain relievers

Soap, shampoo, toothpaste, toilet paper, paper towels

If you have women, feminine hygiene products

Cooking oil and lard (lard can be used to make soap) How to make: Old Fashioned Lard Soap - Hot Process Method - YouTube

Ropes of various diameter, lengths and composition

Reloading materials

Extra parts for guns

Gun cleaning equipment and solvents and oils

Ammo

Silver / Gold

There, that should get you started!

Taurus851
11-08-2012, 14:37
living within your means (and thats hard when you are a gun enthusiast, LOL), paying off debt, no car payments, saving cash....working....

hell what else can we do????????????????????????

this. even in good economic times this is what people should be doing.

Taurus851
11-08-2012, 14:39
Before the election moved $750k in 401k to cash.... Knew if oblowme won the market would tank today....

really? You transferred 3/4 of a million to cash because of one bad day in the market?

have you seen how much the market has gained since 2009? more bad days will happen, that much I can promise you. but we are way way up from a few years ago overall

bubba803
11-08-2012, 14:42
A short list to start...

MRE's for days when you need lots of calories and have no time for preparing a decent meal

Seeds (not the GMO variety either) for food production

Basic hand tools (saws, hammers, screw drivers)

Repair materials (tar paper, nails, extra wood)

Extra clothes in vacuum sealed bags (old stuff will wear out eventually)

Extra shoes also in vacuum sealed bags

Re-chargable batteries with solar charging components

Canned goods

Canning materials (jars, paraffin wax, lids, pressure cooker)

Bulk iodized salt in a dry storage container

Bulk pure can sugar in a dry storage container

Honey... it lasts damn near forever

Aspirin, motrin and other over the counter pain relievers

Soap, shampoo, toothpaste, toilet paper, paper towels

If you have women, feminine hygiene products

Cooking oil and lard (lard can be used to make soap) How to make: Old Fashioned Lard Soap - Hot Process Method - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ySkJfIznX4)

Ropes of various diameter, lengths and composition

Reloading materials

Extra parts for guns

Gun cleaning equipment and solvents and oils

Ammo

Silver / Gold

There, that should get you started!

What about toilet paper?:)

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire (http://www.outdoorhub.com/mobile/)

bubba803
11-08-2012, 14:42
My bad. Didn't read well enough!

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire (http://www.outdoorhub.com/mobile/)

syntaxerrorsix
11-08-2012, 17:12
Interesting. Would you mind elaborating on what kind of items/tools?

I think I've had similiar thoughts: Keep useful items around for bartering as goods or, to provide services for other services.

Mostly quality knives, assorted edged tools, non-power tools like saws, hand drills, hammers, batteries, filters. I've also got a pretty good stock of .22 ammo, spare parts for common weaponry and the like. I think I've got enough surplus items to allow me to trade for other useful items. I just don't think money will always be able to get you what you want although I am diversified :supergrin:

snappy
11-08-2012, 17:49
Don't forget a GOOD water filter. You can't live without fresh water. A water filter will be damn near worth it's weight in gold if things went south.

Glock20 10mm
11-08-2012, 18:23
Don't forget a GOOD water filter. You can't live without fresh water. A water filter will be damn near worth it's weight in gold if things went south.

http://www.m4040.com/Survival/Skills/Water/Water.htm

http://www.wilderness-survival-skills.com/how-to-make-a-water-filter.html

In emergencies there are always solutions... you just need to be aware of what they are.

17&27
11-09-2012, 08:45
I've been having a little good natured political back and forth with my customer base for the last couple of years.
My next step in preparing for an economic down turn is adding a hidden 7.5% surcharge to the obama supporters.

GAFinch
11-09-2012, 09:14
Don't underestimate the worth of liquor for survival/bartering/boredom during power outages.

devildog2067
11-09-2012, 09:15
than it is now, what would you do to prepare yourself and your family?

Make some more money.

hotpig
11-10-2012, 09:09
Doom and Gloomers. Where have you been for the last four years, a Tea Party?

My wife watches MSNBC so her perception is 360 degrees from ours. In MSNBC world the economy is growing. The sick are being saved by obamacare. The illegals are being united with their families and becoming Doctors and Scientists. Green Energy is cost effective and climate change is responsible for all evil that is not perpetrated by Bush.

The party of no wants to control womens bodies. They want the old and the sick to die of starvation on the streets. They want to have war with everyone since they are full of hate.

From the land of everything that is good and fair, Chicago. A great Saint rose by the name of obama (only Liberals can say his full name, any other person that says it is a racist). With a wave of his pen everything evil turned good. The Country was saved. The only thing blocking a perfect utopia is the Party of no in Congress.

I can not believe you guys did not know this.

engineer151515
11-10-2012, 09:15
Add purchases of high proof grain alcohol in small bottles to the list.

I'd say Everclear but it's banned in some spots.

Multiple uses including medicinal, barter and fuel.

The larger point is to start thinking in terms of a barter economy.


Don't underestimate the worth of liquor for survival/bartering/boredom during power outages.


Beat me to it!

paynter2
11-10-2012, 09:16
Does she have a sister?

In some states - he may mean the sister's brother... :whistling:

paynter2
11-10-2012, 09:22
A lot of people are saying, "Paying off debts," but if massive inflation is coming, shouldn't we live on debt and save in hard assets?

Good question. If the dollar is devalued will you be able to pay off your debts at the same amount as before (the devaluation)?

Say you owe $50K on your house and the dollar is devalued by 50%. Will you owe $50K in the devalued dollars? Or will you owe $100K? I've been looking for the answer to that question. Many financial writers blow their bazoo every day - but I still haven't read an answer to that question...

Z71bill
11-10-2012, 09:44
Good question. If the dollar is devalued will you be able to pay off your debts at the same amount as before (the devaluation)?

Say you owe $50K on your house and the dollar is devalued by 50%. Will you owe $50K in the devalued dollars? Or will you owe $100K? I've been looking for the answer to that question. Many financial writers blow their bazoo every day - but I still haven't read an answer to that question...

Your mortgage says you own $50K - if the value of the dollar drops 99.99% - and a gallon of gas is now $350 - minimum wage is a $800 an hour - your home is worth $10 million in devalued dollars -

You still own $50K on the home.

Part of the reason the FED wants inflation is to allow the government to pay off its massive debts in dollars that are worth less.

The dollar has been losing value for decades.

Carrys
11-10-2012, 10:02
than it is now, what would you do to prepare yourself and your family?

No offense my man, but that is exactly what folks here have been talking about and preaching to the masses about forever. It's darn near impossible to list everything one would need and should be doing here, just too much information.

Go back, read some posts about the topics you mention. I'm sorry to say......but if you are just now wanting to learn these things, good luck.:wavey:

paynter2
11-10-2012, 11:00
Your mortgage says you own $50K - if the value of the dollar drops 99.99% - and a gallon of gas is now $350 - minimum wage is a $800 an hour - your home is worth $10 million in devalued dollars -

You still own $50K on the home.

Part of the reason the FED wants inflation is to allow the government to pay off its massive debts in dollars that are worth less.

The dollar has been losing value for decades.

"You still own $50K on the home.

Part of the reason the FED wants inflation is to allow the government to pay off its massive debts in dollars that are worth less."

The FED wants to pay off in 'inflated' dollars. Inflation and devaluation are not the same thing. If you were allowed to pay off your loans with devalued dollars all banks would go broke. In the example I used, bank loans would be (effectively) cut in half.

I don't think your answer is correct. But I don't know for sure.

GAFinch
11-10-2012, 11:48
Your mortgage says you own $50K - if the value of the dollar drops 99.99% - and a gallon of gas is now $350 - minimum wage is a $800 an hour - your home is worth $10 million in devalued dollars -

You still own $50K on the home.

Part of the reason the FED wants inflation is to allow the government to pay off its massive debts in dollars that are worth less.

The dollar has been losing value for decades.

Assuming your loan has a fixed interest rate. If it's variable, then it increases as inflation happens.

jpa
11-10-2012, 13:10
Assuming your loan has a fixed interest rate. If it's variable, then it increases as inflation happens.

That's only if the rate that your variable rate loan is tied to (usually LIBOR) increases.

RMTactical
11-10-2012, 14:36
No offense my man, but that is exactly what folks here have been talking about and preaching to the masses about forever. It's darn near impossible to list everything one would need and should be doing here, just too much information.

Go back, read some posts about the topics you mention. I'm sorry to say......but if you are just now wanting to learn these things, good luck.:wavey:

I've been "prepping" for years now. I'm just throwing this out to the masses. Almost like a rhetorical question. However, I admit I love seeing the answers, and I don't think I have all the answers, so I am open to hearing what people say/think.

I am far more prepared than most...

ICARRY2
11-10-2012, 14:58
I've stockpiled useful tools and items as opposed to currency.

This is my thinking as well.

Useful things are better than pm's, booze, and cash.

Z71bill
11-10-2012, 15:30
Assuming your loan has a fixed interest rate. If it's variable, then it increases as inflation happens.

No it does not - the payment may increase if the interest rate goes up but the principal does not change -

Z71bill
11-10-2012, 15:33
That's only if the rate that your variable rate loan is tied to (usually LIBOR) increases.

Not sure I understand this -

many loans have interest rates that adjust based on LIBOR - but I have not ever seen one that has the principal amount be adjusted. Are these mortgages common?

GAFinch
11-10-2012, 15:41
Not sure I understand this -

many loans have interest rates that adjust based on LIBOR - but I have not ever seen one that has the principal amount be adjusted. Are these mortgages common?

No, but even if your advanced enough in your mortgage where what you owe in interest is minimal and that interest rate skyrockets from 5% to 400% during a hyperinflationary period, you'll still be affected.

Z71bill
11-10-2012, 15:50
"You still own $50K on the home.

Part of the reason the FED wants inflation is to allow the government to pay off its massive debts in dollars that are worth less."

The FED wants to pay off in 'inflated' dollars. Inflation and devaluation are not the same thing. If you were allowed to pay off your loans with devalued dollars all banks would go broke. In the example I used, bank loans would be (effectively) cut in half.

I don't think your answer is correct. But I don't know for sure.

Interesting -

Sure devaluation and inflation are not the same thing -

But IMHO what the FED is doing causes both inflation to be higher & devalues the dollar.

If you owe the bank $50k and over time the dollar becomes worth only 1/2 of what it is now VS other currencies -

You would still owe the bank $50K - not $100K - the mortgage is in dollars - at least mine was. :dunno:

Z71bill
11-10-2012, 17:01
No, but even if your advanced enough in your mortgage where what you owe in interest is minimal and that interest rate skyrockets from 5% to 400% during a hyperinflationary period, you'll still be affected.

So - you own a home worth $100K and have a variable rate mortgage of $50K.

Hyperinflation makes the value of your home jump to $400K - you still owe $50k on the mortgage.

You could sell the home - pay off the mortgage - not be in bad shape.

Compare to --

You have a $100K home and a $50K mortgage - deflation takes the value of your home down to $50K - you still owe $50K.

Which case are you "better" off?

syntaxerrorsix
11-10-2012, 17:50
So - you own a home worth $100K and have a variable rate mortgage of $50K.

Hyperinflation makes the value of your home jump to $400K - you still owe $50k on the mortgage.

You could sell the home - pay off the mortgage - not be in bad shape.

Compare to --

You have a $100K home and a $50K mortgage - deflation takes the value of your home down to $50K - you still owe $50K.

Which case are you "better" off?

The part where you find a buyer at hyperinflation rates.

Nowhere else.

Providence
11-10-2012, 18:04
There are plenty of scenarios where being debt free is beneficial. During a slow collapse or a depression where debt is called in, the person without debt has more options. Don't know if I'm explaining myself well.

RonS
11-10-2012, 19:33
If the financial markets and banking industries run as they have in the past you can game the system with the live on borrowed money, keep your own just pay the interest plan. I suspect that in a real collapse the Obama administration would take care of whoever is paying the most into the campaign chest. Which would be the bank lobby. I think you would see lots of streamlining of the rules for kicking you out of your house and taking your stuff in the interest of paying off debt.

We are paying off debt and accumulating wealth. Wealth comes in many forms. Including green and white boxes marked UMC. And quality tools, and things like alternate means of heating and cooking and lighting up lights.

My hope is that if what I expect to happen comes to pass we will have time to buy a distressed home in the country for cash and get a garden in. My widowed grandmother kept 8 kids fed, clothed, housed and educated during the great drpression with a truck patch in the back yard. They wouldn't have made it without a basement full of Ball jars of food.

ColdSteelNail
11-10-2012, 22:12
Other than one's home and maybe an automobile every 10-12 years there's no real reason to go into debt. Credit card debt is an absolute no-no.

Z71bill
11-12-2012, 19:31
Other than one's home and maybe an automobile every 10-12 years there's no real reason to go into debt. Credit card debt is an absolute no-no.

What about a loan to go to college or start a business?

Aurora
11-14-2012, 05:08
I always suggest that people read The Alpha Strategy by John Pugsley. It's available for free on the internet as a .pdf. Be advised that there is an old version and an updated version to choose from.

Honestly folks, I've been tracking investment gurus for many, many years. Most are not worth your time. The above-mentioned book is an exception that is a great place to start.

Sane advice.

V.