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DanaT
11-29-2012, 02:14
This morning is not going well.

I went to leave Germany and I got detained / questioned by the German Federal Police. They seemed to think that I broke some immigration law. To make matters worse, I spoke German to them and not in a tourist manner. This made them have the feeling that I was a permanent resident without the correct authorization and I was in the country too long without authorization.

I got the grand tour of the federal police station in the airport.

Well after about an hour, after they told me I had to pay a large fine before I could leave (kinda ironic they didn't want me leaving until I cleared up why I was there too long) we got it all straightened out. Technically they said I was within te letter or law but not the spirit of the law.

But they were actually very polite. Gave me some coffee to drink while we cleared everything up. When they let me go, they apologized for taking my time but reminded me I need the correct form filled out and signed by the local govt before they will let me back in the country.

Not out yet, but flight leaves soon.

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Lone_Wolfe
11-29-2012, 02:18
Were they wearing their hats?

Critias
11-29-2012, 02:26
Yikes!

Glad you didn't miss your plane (or any other waiting transport), at least!

jpa
11-29-2012, 02:36
Did you ask them what their probably cause was?

Atlas
11-29-2012, 02:36
You talked to the police?

skeeter7
11-29-2012, 02:37
Hope everything works out for you Eurodriver...oh wait...forget it. :tongueout:

DanaT
11-29-2012, 02:43
Were they wearing their hats?

Actually quite funny. No he wasn't wearing his hat at first nor his ballistic jacket. But before I got t accompany him to the station he put on his hat and his ballistic jacket.


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DanaT
11-29-2012, 02:45
You talked to the police?

Um yeah.

I wanted on the plane. No talking to them and I would probably be visiting with them for a few days.

Am sitting on plane so I probably get to leave.

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DanaT
11-29-2012, 02:47
Did you ask them what their probably cause was?

No. Pretty well explained it. They counted number of days stayed in my passport. Luckily the original guy calculated wrong (this is why within the letter of the law but not spirit).


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Atlas
11-29-2012, 02:50
Last year in Stuttgart I went downtown to the Christmas Festival.
Wondered around for more than an hour and couldn't find my way back to the underground parking garage..

There were 5 police standing around so I asked for directions.
I speak no German, except "bier" and "taxi".
After a couple of the nice policemen helped me get oriented and locate the garage, one asked me "you are not from here, are you?".

We all cracked up.

Gallium
11-29-2012, 03:12
DanaT is on a plane, let's talk **** about him.

Wait...we do that to his face anyways, carry on. :)

Baba Louie
11-29-2012, 04:08
How do you ask, "Am I being detained?" in German?

I gather the Germans take their rules very seriously. :wow:

Probably wasn't too funny at the time, but hope you can look back on it some time in the future and have a (nervous) laugh sigh of relief, thinking of what you shoulda said as a good GT-GNG response (but not really).

Safe journey home or wherever your travels take you DanaT.

You think many German Fed Popos are members here? :wavey:
'Cause that'd be funny...

JW1178
11-29-2012, 04:23
The German mentality is that it's either 100% right, or all wrong, it has to be perfect, there is no middle ground. That is why they make great engineers and such. However, it sucks to have any discrepancies because you might as well just not have had anything.

Unlike the French where everything is wishy washy and if you aren't sure you just have a glass of wine. Repeat until it is clear.

Bruce M
11-29-2012, 04:25
Were they wearing their hats?
:rofl::rofl:
Did you ask them what their probably cause was?:rofl::rofl:

You talked to the police?
:rofl::rofl:

BobbyT
11-29-2012, 05:08
Did you consider Open Carry as a deterrent?

LoadToadBoss
11-29-2012, 05:14
"Ihre Papiere, bitte!"

RedTop
11-29-2012, 05:48
You talked to the police?

Niemals mit der Polizei reden.

Dana should have learned his lesson after getting pulled over a couple of weeks ago.

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2012/11/15/german-police-catch-speeder-with-over-top-mobile-office/?intcmp=featuresy

stolenphot0
11-29-2012, 05:55
Open carry would have prevented your departure. Good thinking. Safe flight back.

Brucev
11-29-2012, 06:09
Your not in Kansas any more.

Fox184
11-29-2012, 06:51
Isn't this the same guy that has joked about how easy it is to go from country to country in Europe, when illegal immigration has been brought up?


Yes I think it is.

dpadams6
11-29-2012, 07:00
What model hk was he sporting?

johnd
11-29-2012, 07:02
Good luck to you and Im glad it worked out in the end. I too have had more than a few visits to various polizia nationales but that was because I have and have used my 4 passports in ways they didnt like. Seems they want you to use the passport you went in with to get out with too yet the destination passport control want you to use the other one to get into their place.

rickbaales
11-29-2012, 07:07
Well at least you didn't end up on one Germany's game shows.

Stackenblocken - YouTube

Ian Moone
11-29-2012, 07:22
No. Pretty well explained it. They counted number of days stayed in my passport. Luckily the original guy calculated wrong (this is why within the letter of the law but not spirit).


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I'm sure that the SS is checking out the original counter's bloodline at this moment. If his original count was 100% wrong, then he must not be a real German and therefore should not be allowed to reproduce. :tongueout:

RenoF250
11-29-2012, 07:28
I would have told him that if it wasn't for the US they would all be speaking German. You got to remind them damn youropans.

Tango 1Zero
11-29-2012, 07:35
Any hawt German Police Chics????

Chuck TX
11-29-2012, 08:23
Nie mit der Polizei sprechen! :tbo:

I would have told him that if it wasn't for the US they would all be speaking German. You got to remind them damn youropans.

Golden. :rofl:

Calico Jack
11-29-2012, 09:13
Hope everything works out for you Eurodriver...oh wait...forget it. :tongueout:

Haha. I got to be honest... when I read the thread title I was expecting it to be a thread from ED. That guy has the worst luck.


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countrygun
11-29-2012, 11:44
Any hawt German Police Chics????

"Dear Penthouse Forum....."

NIB
11-29-2012, 12:01
Should have yelled out, "Es ist auf Cuzzz"!

Dennis in MA
11-29-2012, 12:09
Were they wearing their hats?

You know it!
http://carltonjordan.com/files/images/2010/03/m8jvk4.jpg

"Ihre Papiere, bitte!"

All I can think of is this scene:

Indiana Jones - No ticket!! - YouTube

Should have yelled out, "Es ist auf Cuzzz"!

:rofl:

Santa CruZin
11-29-2012, 12:19
Did you tell him you were going to put his name on the Montgomery Ward mailing list?

javelinadave
11-29-2012, 13:08
Hope everything works out for you Eurodriver...oh wait...forget it. :tongueout:

Funny and true!

Berto
11-29-2012, 13:20
You have to 'Sieg Heil' the CO, they love that.

fnfalman
11-29-2012, 13:33
What color is the leather of their jack boots?

DanaT
11-30-2012, 07:30
Last year in Stuttgart I went downtown to the Christmas Festival.
Wondered around for more than an hour and couldn't find my way back to the underground parking garage..

Did you have Gluehwein???

DanaT
11-30-2012, 07:31
"Ihre Papiere, bitte!"

They had my papers, they just werent in order.

Dennis in MA
11-30-2012, 07:32
What color is the leather of their jack boots?

Same as the boathouse in Hereford.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 07:35
Isn't this the same guy that has joked about how easy it is to go from country to country in Europe, when illegal immigration has been brought up?


Yes I think it is.

It very easy to go from country to country. There are essentially no borders. That is some of the problem with the papers. For example, is 100% legal ti live 90 days in Germany, then 90 days in France, then 90 days in Germany, 90 days in Italy, etc. The problem is there are no stamps in the passport.

Where the whole thing seemed to be an issue is that the policeman thought it was 90 days in a schengen visa area and not 90 days in a row in germany.

I have to leave Germany every 90 days.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 07:37
What model hk was he sporting?

Actually I am embarrassed. I didn't look closely. There were other minor details on my mind besides what firearm he had. He did have an HK though. I havent seen a German cop with something other than an H&K

DanaT
11-30-2012, 07:38
I would have told him that if it wasn't for the US they would all be speaking German. You got to remind them damn youropans.

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

DanaT
11-30-2012, 07:39
Any hawt German Police Chics????

There was one i saw. There were only about 10 cops milling around that I saw.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 07:47
So I made it out of Germany. As soon as I landed (before I even made to customs in USA) I had email sent to employer and was on phone with the CEO. German lawyers already working on it. They said a permanent residency permit should be arranged by the end of next week at most two weeks.

I was just having bad luck yesterday. I think they were all calling each other. So, I never have customs issues in the USA. I filled out the form like I do every time except this time I flew through a different airport and US customs had an issue how I filled out the form. I had cheese, wine and candy in my bags (all which are legal to bring into the USA). Customs has always told me that as long as it isnt meat, fruits, or vegetables, or unpasteurized milk, it is allowed and need not be declared. Well, the Newark guys wanted me to declare the cheese.

The customs officer that decides if there is any secondary inspection literally told me I needed to go to the "cheese police" inspection line. I had 15 minutes while they took my bags apart looking at my cheese. And then it was exactly what I described it as and they told me to have a nice day.

devildog2067
11-30-2012, 08:18
Isn't this the same guy that has joked about how easy it is to go from country to country in Europe, when illegal immigration has been brought up?


Yes I think it is.

It is very, very easy to go from country to country by road or rail in the Schengen agreement area (which covers most of continental Europe). Basically the same as driving between states in the US.

Leaving a country on an airplane, through passport control, to another country on another continent is a different story.

Critical thinking skills, sir, you should try them.

Big Bird
11-30-2012, 08:24
You obviously needed Letters of Transit.

Something Even You Have Never Seen - Letters of Transit.mov - YouTube

Chuck TX
11-30-2012, 08:47
Actually I am embarrassed. I didn't look closely. There were other minor details on my mind besides what firearm he had. He did have an HK though. I havent seen a German cop with something other than an H&K

I think a lot of them are using the HK P30 now.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 08:51
JUst got off phone with lawyer. They said that they expect by Wednesday or Thursday next week, everything should be approved and passport needs to go to German consulate for correct paper.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 08:52
I think a lot of them are using the HK P30 now.

I have seen may carrying P30s in Germany. Also see MP5s with the riot police outside of soccer matches.

Andy W
11-30-2012, 08:54
I'd like to live in Germany for a while. Sure, they make have their quirks and annoyances but don't they actually have some of the better gun laws in Europe?

series1811
11-30-2012, 08:58
So, in Germany, they actually enforce their immigration laws?

Maybe that's why they are not overun with illegal aliens like we are.

Dubble-Tapper
11-30-2012, 09:08
It is very, very easy to go from country to country by road or rail in the Schengen agreement area (which covers most of continental Europe). Basically the same as driving between states in the US.

Leaving a country on an airplane, through passport control, to another country on another continent is a different story.

Critical thinking skills, sir, you should try them.

bad day at the collider or what?:rofl:

devildog2067
11-30-2012, 09:12
So, in Germany, they actually enforce their immigration laws?

So do we, when you fly in or out of the country.

Maybe that's why they are not overun with illegal aliens like we are.

Nope; it's because they don't have a 2,000 mile long border with a third-world country.

devildog2067
11-30-2012, 09:13
bad day at the collider or what?:rofl:

I have a headache, but more than that, people who don't think irritate me.

Andy W
11-30-2012, 09:37
I have a headache, but more than that, people who don't think irritate me.

Yeah, here's what I'm hearing most of the time: Durka Durka... ******* Mexicans, durka durka....Muslims........durka durka ****in' gays........Rush Limabaugh.... 'Murica!

Cochese
11-30-2012, 09:48
Remember this Dana, next time you shoot your mouth off about us locals. :supergrin:

DanaT
11-30-2012, 09:57
I'd like to live in Germany for a while. Sure, they make have their quirks and annoyances but don't they actually have some of the better gun laws in Europe?

No Switzerland is the best guns laws in europeby far.

At least in Germany you can own them, just a lot of restrictions and essentially no carry allowed.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 10:13
Remember this Dana, next time you shoot your mouth off about us locals. :supergrin:

In general I have no problems with police and I cooperate with police. What I have a problem with is stupid actions and it is worse when people give them a pass on their actions because they have a badge.

I come home and see the crap with the commerce city cop and the dog. That is just a stupid action.

But what I cannot seem to wrap my head around is the difference in attitude when dealing with the German police and most American cops. When I have seen the German detain people, they normally are very formal, pleasant and ask people to get in the back of the car and come with them. It doesnt start with throwing their face on the hood of the car and putting handcuffs on them. What I cannot seem to get a grasp on are the USA police just that much more scared of the people they interact with, are the people they interact with just so that much worse in the USA, etc. I do not understand why the interactions are so much different in the USA vs Europe.

But the interaction yesterday, there was a difference in demeanor between the US CBP officers who were worried about cheese and the German Federal Officer that was concerned about a visa issue. With the CBP officer checking my cheese, i first had to get the lecture how bringing food into the country is illegal and they could give me a fine or imprisonment only after checking the cheese to be told that it was in fact legal. But really, I didnt need the lecture. If they want to see the cheese, fine see the cheese but no need to have the 'tude. It not like I had a banana like the guy before me. Seriously, he had a banana (for those of you who have went through customs, you understand the banana comment)

Cochese
11-30-2012, 10:40
I think its time for a ride along. :hugs:

wjv
11-30-2012, 10:43
You should have told them to back off, because all you have to do is push the wrong button at work, and all of Europe gets eaten by a black hole. . .

Andy W
11-30-2012, 10:50
In general I have no problems with police and I cooperate with police. What I have a problem with is stupid actions and it is worse when people give them a pass on their actions because they have a badge.

I come home and see the crap with the commerce city cop and the dog. That is just a stupid action.

But what I cannot seem to wrap my head around is the difference in attitude when dealing with the German police and most American cops. When I have seen the German detain people, they normally are very formal, pleasant and ask people to get in the back of the car and come with them. It doesnt start with throwing their face on the hood of the car and putting handcuffs on them. What I cannot seem to get a grasp on are the USA police just that much more scared of the people they interact with, are the people they interact with just so that much worse in the USA, etc. I do not understand why the interactions are so much different in the USA vs Europe.

But the interaction yesterday, there was a difference in demeanor between the US CBP officers who were worried about cheese and the German Federal Officer that was concerned about a visa issue. With the CBP officer checking my cheese, i first had to get the lecture how bringing food into the country is illegal and they could give me a fine or imprisonment only after checking the cheese to be told that it was in fact legal. But really, I didnt need the lecture. If they want to see the cheese, fine see the cheese but no need to have the 'tude. It not like I had a banana like the guy before me. Seriously, he had a banana (for those of you who have went through customs, you understand the banana comment)

Well, this isn't a direct explanation but what I've noticed is a good portion of Americans are *******s. No it's not a liberal vs. conservative thing and it transcends party lines. Think about it. How many people here go about their lives in a pretty much constant state of being pissed off or unhappy?

DanaT
11-30-2012, 15:07
I think its time for a ride along. :hugs:


OK. Sounds like a plan. What is a good night to go?

DanaT
11-30-2012, 15:11
W lives in a pretty much constant state of being pissed off or unhappy?

I am actually pretty happy with my life for the most part. I think I pay too much taxes, but at the same time there is an amount of taxes that are needed. I wish I was at home more; hopefully that will change in the near future.

The worse point of this whole mess, until I have the right paperwork I couldn't go back to Germany until mid/late February. That would have actually been nice. Lawyers seem like that will have everything taken care of, so I dont get to stay home as long as hoped.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 15:13
I think its time for a ride along. :hugs:

Do I need to get one of these first?

http://images.righttoolusa.com/original/75/cO5gsX5Gb6.jpg

DrMaxit
11-30-2012, 15:28
Wait wait wait.. all this happened yesterday? I swear I thought I read this post a while ago.... :therapy:

alphacat
11-30-2012, 15:37
Interesting story. Glad everything worked out for you. Sorry, you don't get to spend more time here at home. Enjoy your ride along..

Deanster
11-30-2012, 15:53
Lots of German Federal police carry P7M8's.

Hopefully you don't need to go get the 'Stempel und Unterschrift' from the local gov't office, letting them know where you're living, so they can find you. That process is a giant pain, as somehow there's ALWAYS something wrong with your form the first few times you go in, at least in Bavaria.

But yeah, German police are generally positive, professional, and profoundly inflexible.

cowboywannabe
11-30-2012, 15:58
you must look mexican because only mexican people get picked on for immigration status.

CAcop
11-30-2012, 16:23
http://img5.joyreactor.com/pics/post/sandbox-heaven-hell-countries-348345.jpeg

Sam Spade
11-30-2012, 17:09
But what I cannot seem to wrap my head around is the difference in attitude when dealing with the German police and most American cops. When I have seen the German detain people, they normally are very formal, pleasant and ask people to get in the back of the car and come with them. It doesnt start with throwing their face on the hood of the car and putting handcuffs on them. What I cannot seem to get a grasp on are the USA police just that much more scared of the people they interact with, are the people they interact with just so that much worse in the USA, etc. I do not understand why the interactions are so much different in the USA vs Europe.


If I had to enforce the law among a bunch of Germans, I bet guarantee that I'd act differently.

Keoking
11-30-2012, 17:45
http://img5.joyreactor.com/pics/post/sandbox-heaven-hell-countries-348345.jpeg

HELL would also include
Where the Politicians are Americans

Jade Falcon
11-30-2012, 18:01
And that would be the last time I ever went to Germany. What a bunch of idiots.

Another reason why I don't plan on going far outside the US.

devildog2067
11-30-2012, 18:16
And that would be the last time I ever went to Germany. What a bunch of idiots.


...because bureaucratic paperwork snafus can't happen anywhere else?


Another reason why I don't plan on going far outside the US.

There's a whole lotta world out there, and seeing it (and coming home) are among life's most simple pleasures.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 18:32
Lots of German Federal police carry P7M8's.

Hopefully you don't need to go get the 'Stempel und Unterschrift' from the local gov't office,

This is not a problem. That can be taken care of within an hour.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 18:37
If I had to enforce the law among a bunch of Germans, I bet guarantee that I'd act differently.

Why? You would be giving people tickets for walking across the street on a red walk signal? :tongueout: (Germans will actually stand there, in the cold rain waiting to cross a street when no car is sight because the walk light is red) That is actually a serious question. Maybe it is why I look at things so strangely. Having essentially lived in either Switzerland or Germany 70% for the last almost 5 years maybe has me seeing things in a much different manner.

DanaT
11-30-2012, 18:43
...because bureaucratic paperwork snafus can't happen anywhere else?

Lets not call it a paperwork snafu. As the police said, I was within the letter of the law, but as with American laws, there are loopholes that me and the company were taking advantage of (lets call them sometax loopholes). It was 100% legal, just not the spirit.

In someways I am surprised that none of the immigration people questioned it before.

But in general, most states in the USA define residency as more than 180 days/year. Many countries do the same. This means you pay taxes in one place or the other. Once you have enough residencies to not have to be in any country/state for more than 180 days, there are some large tax benefits.

Andy W
12-03-2012, 18:55
I am actually pretty happy with my life for the most part. I think I pay too much taxes, but at the same time there is an amount of taxes that are needed. I wish I was at home more; hopefully that will change in the near future.

The worse point of this whole mess, until I have the right paperwork I couldn't go back to Germany until mid/late February. That would have actually been nice. Lawyers seem like that will have everything taken care of, so I dont get to stay home as long as hoped.

What I was saying was maybe Americans in general are a much angrier nation than Germans are.


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TBO
12-03-2012, 19:06
Did they read you Miranda?

Were you provided an attorney before any questioning?

RedTop
12-03-2012, 19:25
Did they read you Miranda?

Were you provided an attorney before any questioning?


He talked to them, of course not.

TBO
12-03-2012, 19:28
If I had to enforce the law among a bunch of Germans, I bet guarantee that I'd act differently.
Germany's murder rate: 0.8
USA's murder rate: 4.2

I agree.
Culturally, there's significant differences between each nations citizens and their levels of responsible conduct.


2005 article: http://atlanticreview.org/archives/434-Murder-Rate-in-the-United-States-and-Germany.html

RedTop
12-03-2012, 19:37
Germany's murder rate: 0.8
USA's murder rate: 4.2

I agree.
Culturally, there's significant differences between each nations citizens and their levels of responsible conduct.


2005 article: http://atlanticreview.org/archives/434-Murder-Rate-in-the-United-States-and-Germany.html



The old 800 pound gorilla in the room?

TBO
12-03-2012, 19:39
Nah, just the usual heavy handed jack booted thugs. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v90/TheeBadOne/TBO/coplaughstick.gif

Averageman
12-03-2012, 19:47
Did they ask...
"Who is Juiceyfruit?"

TBO
12-03-2012, 19:50
A subjective comparison of Germany and the United States

http://math-www.uni-paderborn.de/~axel/us-d.html
----------------


An interesting perspective by a German including difference in Freedom between the US & Germany.

DanaT
12-03-2012, 20:10
Did they read you Miranda?

Were you provided an attorney before any questioning?


Well, considering that German police are not bound by US supreme court rulings...what would you think?

DanaT
12-03-2012, 20:15
Germany's murder rate: 0.8
USA's murder rate: 4.2

I agree.
Culturally, there's significant differences between each nations citizens and their levels of responsible conduct.
[FONT=Comic Sans MS][SIZE=1]




What do you surmise the difference is attributed to?

Extrapolate this out. Does the population in Germany being generally homogenous, as compared to the USA, contribute? Is the murder rate in the USA homogenous across different socio-economic groups? If the the reason for police treating people differently in Germany based upon lower murder rate, would that mean that in low crime areas of the USA police should treat people differently in every contact than in high crime areas?

TBO
12-03-2012, 20:28
Take a peek:

A subjective comparison of Germany and the United States

http://math-www.uni-paderborn.de/~axel/us-d.html (http://math-www.uni-paderborn.de/%7Eaxel/us-d.html)
----------------


An interesting perspective by a German including difference in Freedom between the US & Germany.

Veedubklown
12-03-2012, 20:31
Yeah, here's what I'm hearing most of the time: Durka Durka... ******* Mexicans, durka durka....Muslims........durka durka ****in' gays........Rush Limabaugh.... 'Murica!

That's sig line material right there.

DanaT
12-03-2012, 20:34
Take a peek:


Your point?

Some of it true and spot on. Some of it exaggerated.

JMarch
12-03-2012, 20:39
What do you surmise the difference is attributed to?
?
The poor quality of most American beer as compared to your average German brew.

Andy W
12-03-2012, 21:47
That's sig line material right there.

Haha yeah! That just rolled right out. At the time I was pissed off at certain elements of the republican party for costing us the election yet again.

JuneyBooney
12-04-2012, 11:51
Were they wearing their hats?

Their language is very hard to learn. I bet they has tin hats. :cool:

gigab1te
12-04-2012, 12:00
Well, considering that German police are not bound by US supreme court rulings...what would you think?

Not to totally hijack this thread, but what type of ID or documents does a tourist have to carry with them in Germany? Do tourists still leave their passports with their hotel? How about a foreigner who is legally residing in Germany?

DanaT
12-04-2012, 12:15
Not to totally hijack this thread, but what type of ID or documents does a tourist have to carry with them in Germany? Do tourists still leave their passports with their hotel? How about a foreigner who is legally residing in Germany?

I think letter of the law is you have to have a passport on your person. I rarely do this. What I have is my US drivers license and then I carry a passport card. Probably doesnt hurt to carry a copy of passport in wallet.

gigab1te
12-04-2012, 12:32
I think letter of the law is you have to have a passport on your person. I rarely do this. What I have is my US drivers license and then I carry a passport card. Probably doesnt hurt to carry a copy of passport in wallet.

Thanks. After the outcry last year over the German executive who was detained in Alabama for not carrying his ID, I wondered what the law was in his homeland.

airmotive
12-04-2012, 12:39
Take a peek:


I'm two sentences into this guy's observations on America and he already has a fundamental non-understanding on how the US elects its politicians. I'll keep reading though....

Lone_Wolfe
12-04-2012, 23:11
Their language is very hard to learn. I bet they has tin hats. :cool:

:rofl: :rofl:



I think letter of the law is you have to have a passport on your person. I rarely do this. What I have is my US drivers license and then I carry a passport card. Probably doesnt hurt to carry a copy of passport in wallet.

So you leave the passport in your hotel room? Is theft a big concern over there? If so, how do you secure it?