Firefighters shot while battling New York blaze [Archive] - Glock Talk

PDA

View Full Version : Firefighters shot while battling New York blaze


Restless28
12-24-2012, 08:04
I guess its time to arm Firefighters.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/24/us/new-york-firefighters-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t3

Random
12-24-2012, 08:13
Someone really wanted that building to go up.

Dan_ntx
12-24-2012, 08:53
Crazy story... I just saw the blurb video on Fox and the FD spokesman only spoke about the wounded fireman who drove himself from the scene. No mention at all about the 2 that had were killed... The title of the story indicated 2 were killed, the anchor presented it as 2 firefighters killed, but no details.

I am interested it what they find out about the fire, the gunman, and the origin of the weapon... I think unfortunately this will be a painfully obvious trifecta of stupidity. Arson to cover a crime, a repeat felon behind the gun, and a gun that was less than legally obtained.

Ptayers to the families of the fallen.

coastal4974
12-24-2012, 08:59
Iím sure it was a band of Democrats hyped up on big gulps they smuggled in from a Wawa in Jersey.

ucop27
12-24-2012, 09:00
2 firefighters died.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk

Dan_ntx
12-24-2012, 09:04
2 firefighters died.

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk

Yeah that's the headline here on Fox and Yahoo, but no details yet. I hope they catch the gunman alive for a change. I'm tired of these idiots taking the easy way out.

Again, prayers to the families...and Godsspeed to the cops, get that guy!

jeager
12-24-2012, 09:08
FFs used to carry shotguns in their rigs
during "civil unrest" of the '60s.

Andy W
12-24-2012, 09:15
I was expecting it to be in the projects somewhere in NYC. Apparently this is not the case.

Cavalry Doc
12-24-2012, 09:15
Hope they find this guy, or guys, and give them a needle.

Rabid dogs need to be put down.

Restless28
12-24-2012, 09:17
This is an awful thing. I cannot imagine stepping out of the rig and being fired upon at 0600 on Christmas Eve.

Restless28
12-24-2012, 09:32
One suspect is in custody

Restless28
12-24-2012, 09:45
West Webster FD Firefighter.

http://westwebsterfd.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/Fire-Silhouette-Penfield.jpg

Restless28
12-24-2012, 09:51
One of the deceased was also a LT. in the Webster PD. The Police Chief had to choke back tears in the press conference. All of these guys are volunteers.

It appears that the shooter killed himself.

Zombie Surgeon
12-24-2012, 09:58
This didn't really happened. Must be a mistake.
Mayor Bloomberg assured us that cities like NY who ban guns are safer than cities who don't.

diamondd2
12-24-2012, 10:01
WTF? Is this some kind of ghetto neighborhood or something?



posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire (http://www.outdoorhub.com/mobile/)

Restless28
12-24-2012, 10:01
This didn't really happened. Must be a mistake.
Mayor Bloomberg assured us that cities like NY who ban guns are safer than cities who don't.

:upeyes:

Restless28
12-24-2012, 10:02
WTF? Is this some kind of ghetto neighborhood or something?



posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire (http://www.outdoorhub.com/mobile/)

It does not appear so. It's on the waterfront.

Magnus2131
12-24-2012, 10:05
Just reported on Fox News ... No idea if the weapon used was the type of assault rifle people have been talking about. Wow!

bockerSV
12-24-2012, 10:08
Webster is actually a fairly rural community in upstate NY. All of us New Yorkers aren't downstate, big city folks. 2 firefighters dead, 2 wounded in guarded condition. Had a firefighter who was on scene say that it may have been another firefighter that did the shooting although nothing of that sort had been said in the news so it's speculation as of right now.

cfrye11
12-24-2012, 10:08
Guy this is not NY city. This is a up scale town in western NY on lake Ontario .west Webster is a very nice place to live just minutes from Rochester.

This murder set a trap to kill fire fighters.

Two brave heroes are dead. At least two more are shot. The murder is dead. Six plus houses are burning .


Sad sad day here in Rochester.

molan labe

TheExplorer
12-24-2012, 10:13
It just keeps getting crazier. What the hell is going on? Is this a conspiracy?

Payers for the families.:sadangel:

cfrye11
12-24-2012, 10:13
This happened durring the LA Riots and Katrina. Maybe they thought they men with the houses were going to take their Nikes?:whistling:



You sir are the guy that gives all gun owners a bad name.

molan labe

frank4570
12-24-2012, 10:30
It just keeps getting crazier. What the hell is going on? Is this a conspiracy?

Payers for the families.:sadangel:

I know. I'm not a conspiracy guy, and I don't believe this has anything to do with a conspiracy.
But this is just about the worst time for this to happen.

Random
12-24-2012, 10:56
I was expecting it to be in the projects somewhere in NYC. If that was the case, I was going to say they should block off the whole area so no one gets in or out, and burn everything to the ground.

It's a relatively upscale area outside of NYC that's 95% white. I take it you no longer support trapping everyone inside and killing them?

TBO
12-24-2012, 10:58
Prayers for the victims and their families.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Copatalk 2

Andy W
12-24-2012, 11:01
It's a relatively upscale area outside of NYC that's 95% white. I take it you no longer support trapping everyone inside and killing them?

I googled the city before posting. What I was saying is I would have expected it from an inner city area. Race doesn't factor in to my post. It's the attitudes of the vast majority of people living in those areas. My last post was a bit extreme.


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

Patchman
12-24-2012, 11:04
They are all volunteers, at least one of whom is a LEO. Volunteerism runs deep for those who want to serve and protect.

RIP guys. Condolences to your families, who were expecting all of you to return home safely tonight.

Patchman
12-24-2012, 11:08
I was expecting it to be in the projects somewhere in NYC. If that was the case, I was going to say they should block off the whole area so no one gets in or out, and burn everything to the ground.

It's a relatively upscale area outside of NYC that's 95% white. I take it you no longer support trapping everyone inside and killing them?

I googled the city before posting. What I was saying is I would have expected it from an inner city area. Race doesn't factor in to my post. It's the attitudes of the vast majority of people living in those areas. My last post was a bit extreme.


Yes... I'd say so. And kudos for recognizing that.

ClydeG19
12-24-2012, 11:14
Horrible situation. Hopefully the killer gets what he deserves in the afterlife.

oldman11
12-24-2012, 11:23
You are out of bounds here. Two firefighters are dead and you make a terribly insensitive joke, reminiscent of a pre-pubescent kid.
+1 :steamed:

Gallium
12-24-2012, 11:24
I know some people who know some people on that dept...and I have some people up there. :sad:

IndyGunFreak
12-24-2012, 11:34
Mayor Bloomberg assured us that cities like NY who ban guns are safer than cities who don't.

First, thoughts and prayers to the fallen. This is a tough time to lose a family member.

Second, regarding the quote above.. that's what I was thinking. NY is *almost* the model of gun control for Bloomberg and his ilk, and it still didn't stop a single thing.

Obviously, they will simply say NY doesn't go far enough. :upeyes:

Glocksanity
12-24-2012, 11:40
Horrible situation. Hopefully the killer gets what he deserves in the afterlife.

No worries. The law of karma dictates he will get exactly what he deserves in his subsequent incarnations.

God bless the victims and the families and friends.

Random
12-24-2012, 11:46
I googled the city before posting. What I was saying is I would have expected it from an inner city area. Race doesn't factor in to my post. It's the attitudes of the vast majority of people living in those areas. My last post was a bit extreme.


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

My post was a bit inflammatory as well. I apologize.

-Black Firefighter Random

Mrs. VR
12-24-2012, 11:55
Thanks to those who have simmered down on their own. Those who have not, this is neither the time or the place for it.

SCHADENFREUDE
12-24-2012, 11:59
I wish there was a way to stop these things. It is crazy. Banning guns or certain types of guns isn't the answer but I wish we could think outside of politics and come to some solutions.

I bet that those that knew this mutt will say something like "I knew something like this was going to happen."

If some one is mental around you turn them in. In my neck of the woods the police nor mental health will do nothing to get the people off the streets but at least there will be a record of trying.

Andy W
12-24-2012, 12:25
My post was a bit inflammatory as well. I apologize.

-Black Firefighter Random

I think you had a right to be inflammatory. I apologize for what I said.


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

Andy W
12-24-2012, 12:28
I wish there was a way to stop these things. It is crazy. Banning guns or certain types of guns isn't the answer but I wish we could think outside of politics and come to some solutions.

I bet that those that knew this mutt will say something like "I knew something like this was going to happen."

If some one is mental around you turn them in. In my neck of the woods the police nor mental health will do nothing to get the people off the streets but at least there will be a record of trying.

We definitely need to reform our mental health system. That will do a lot more than any gun control law will.


Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

Restless28
12-24-2012, 12:38
The idea of this ambush is terrifying. These guys volunteered for their community and died for doing nothing more than responding to help their fellow man. I have this image in my head of these guys rolling up, sizing up the fire and gearing up, preparing to stretch hoselines to fight this fire. They were shot without warning, without reason for doing their jobs.

This is almost surreal to me. I don't know how to defend against this. These families of the fallen will be in my prayers from this day on.

This is senseless and beyond reason murder.

skeeter7
12-24-2012, 12:45
Shooter was convicted of killing his grandmother in 1981. Was out on parole. Two Firefighters killed, others injured. Seven homes destroyed. Absolutely horrific. What has this world come to?

Rotn1
12-24-2012, 12:46
The idea of this ambush is terrifying. These guys volunteered for their community and died for doing nothing more than responding to help their fellow man. I have this image in my head of these guys rolling up, sizing up the fire and gearing up, preparing to stretch hoselines to fight this fire. They were shot without warning, without reason for doing their jobs.

This is almost surreal to me. I don't know how to defend against this. These families of the fallen will be in my prayers from this day on.

This is senseless and beyond reason murder.

Unbelievable...... sets a trap to kill Firefighters who'se only sin is rushing into danger to help their fellow man.

Dispicable and insane.

*ASH*
12-24-2012, 12:47
prayers and thoughts to those who died and injured , very very sad :crying::crying:


they released one of the 911 calls and you can hear one fire fighter say they were being fired on , seems to be an assault rifle . ofcourse not confirmed

the guy killed himself . career criminal .

MedicOni
12-24-2012, 12:50
Lets hope this doesn't give any more wackos any ideas. I don't want to run on my fellow Fire/EMS people... let alone get stuck in one of these myself. Scares me sometimes that the GF runs rescue in my county...

truetopath
12-24-2012, 12:54
As a volunteer firefighter about an hour away from this incident, I am shaken to the core. Who's safe anymore, if firefighters are getting shot trying to help others. My thoughts and prayers go out to my fallen brothers and their families during this most difficult time.

Firefighters prayer:
When I am called to duty, God
Wherever flames may rage
Give me strength to save a life
Whatever be its age.
Let me embrace a little child
Before it is too late
Or save an older person from
The horror of that fate.
Enable me to be alert
And hear the weakest shout,
and quickly and efficiently
To put the fire out.
I want to fill my calling
To give the best in me,
To guard my friend and neighbor
And protect their property.
And, if, according to your will,
While on duty I must answer deathís call;
Bless with your protecting hand
My family, one and all.

Kevin108
12-24-2012, 13:01
That happens fairly regularly, at least firefighters being fired at because a gang banger needs his victim to expire and the meat wagon is wanting to take him away still breathing.

cfrye11
12-24-2012, 13:03
Convicted killer strikes again . 62 year man kills again. In 1981 he killed his grandma served 17 years and was released to kill again.

The story keeps getting worse

molan labe

BigAlE
12-24-2012, 13:03
So how'd this guy get his guns?

havensal
12-24-2012, 13:13
This hits close to home in more ways than one! Prayers to the families.
Here is a link to the radio transmissions between one of the shot firefighters and dispatch.

http://youtu.be/b7VXwnyAvp8

Twists my stomach listening to that. A former member of our dept. moved up there a year ago or so. As far as I know he was not involved.

ray9898
12-24-2012, 13:13
wow...what a tragedy. I know what the families, friends and their FF brothers are going through. RIP.

On another note...gun owners are getting as bad as the anti's. Every time something happens does not mean is should immediately used as material for your agenda. There are times when respect and restraint is the correct path.

This has nothing to do with NYC, the gun control in the city or the opinion of the mayor.

Restless28
12-24-2012, 13:19
That audio is terrifying!

They were pinned down by a murdererer using what the Fire Officer described as an assault rifle.

Random
12-24-2012, 13:35
That happens fairly regularly, at least firefighters being fired at because a gang banger needs his victim to expire and the meat wagon is wanting to take him away still breathing.

Now see, THAT'S what I would expect. That makes sense to me. You show up to help. Someone on the scene doesn't want you to and things go TI. I've been drawn on by people wanting us to not help an injured party. I've had people try to threaten us for NOT helping an injured person when the scene wasn't safe yet. I had a guy 'strongly urge' me to not put a fire out. I've never been specifically pulled into a trap designed to target me. In all of those calls there was always an injured 3rd party. I was never a primary target. I doubt I would fare well in that kind of scenario. Don't know if I can switch gears that fast.

Patchman
12-24-2012, 13:36
That audio is terrifying!

They were pinned down by a murdererer using what the Fire Officer described as an assault rifle.

Terrifying indeed. Can you imagine the thoughts they must have had while being pinned down? I'm sure one thought was whether they would be making it home to their families.

Again, RIP guys. Crazy, man, crazy!

havensal
12-24-2012, 13:42
Don't know if I can switch gears that fast.

That's the scary part. With adrenaline running high, I don't know if I could even recognize the danger in time to protect those under my command. Another unnecessary risk I have to protect my firefighters from. Truly scary!! Maybe it's time I mount my AR next to my turnout bag. (Only half serious)

Random
12-24-2012, 13:55
During Katrina there was a point where the Chief authorized everyone in the firehouse whose homes were still accessible to return home to retrieve their firearms. No one went home. 3 guys went out to their trucks. 2 guys just walked over to their lockers. Fire Chief /facepalm.

oldman11
12-24-2012, 13:56
That's the scary part. With adrenaline running high, I don't know if I could even recognize the danger in time to protect those under my command. Another unnecessary risk I have to protect my firefighters from. Truly scary!! Maybe it's time I mount my AR next to my turnout bag. (Only half serious)
You may have been only half serious but I think you need to get "full serious". I am surprised that police didn't respond with firemen when they originally arrived.

sourdough44
12-24-2012, 13:58
The shooter sounds like an felon with mental issues, a bad combination. Just crazy is all I can say.

SCHADENFREUDE
12-24-2012, 15:06
Just was on the local news that he was just released from prison for killing his grandmother. Apparently you only get 17 years for beating granny to death in this great state.

havensal
12-24-2012, 15:08
You may have been only half serious but I think you need to get "full serious". I am surprised that police didn't respond with firemen when they originally arrived.

In this area they secure the scene before we arrive, but only if there is any indication of safety issues. Otherwise they are there but we don't wait for them. It will cost lives and property if that changes after this.

Lone_Wolfe
12-24-2012, 15:13
Damn, just damn. Prayers sent for the victis and families.

Trapped_in_Kali
12-24-2012, 15:38
http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-basic/rip.gif (http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys.php)

ithaca_deerslayer
12-24-2012, 16:15
Shooter was convicted of killing his grandmother in 1981. Was out on parole. Two Firefighters killed, others injured. Seven homes destroyed. Absolutely horrific. What has this world come to?

Locking murderers up for life would be a good start to ensuring safety for the rest of us.

Little Joe
12-24-2012, 16:26
Just was on the local news that he was just released from prison for killing his grandmother. Apparently you only get 17 years for beating granny to death in this great state.

Plea bargained down to manslaughter.

Restless28
12-24-2012, 16:37
It appears that this murdering coward set fire to a car to lure the Fire Department into a killing zone. It must have seemed like an eternity for the guys who were pinned down before the police arrived.

I just don't see how a FD can prepare for a situation like this. It almost sounds like something a terrorist would come up with.

Patchman
12-24-2012, 16:38
It appears that this murdering coward set fire to a car to lure the Fire Department into a killing zone. It must have seemed like an eternity for the guys who were pinned down before the police arrived.

I just don't see how a FD can prepare for a situation like this. It almost sounds like something a terrorist would come up with.

Any word as to the motive? And why lure FD as opposed to PD? Or did the killer simply screw up as to what to use as lure?

Curiouser and curiouser.

Restless28
12-24-2012, 16:47
WHEC TV in Rochester says that no motive has been found, but that the murdering coward's sister is unaccounted for. He was shooting from a berm. It was a trap.

The names have been released too. Lt. Mike Chiapperini who was killed was also a Lt. in the PD. He was named Firefighter of the Year 2 weeks ago.

Firefighter Tomasz Kaczowka was also killed. He was also a 911 Dispatcher and had joined the FD a little over a year ago.

cowboywannabe
12-24-2012, 16:53
the system and laws failed those men and their families, again.

onebigelf
12-24-2012, 17:02
This will be made to be about the gun, not about the fact that the system released on parole after serving only 17 years a man who beat his 92 year old grandmother to death with a hammer.

The issue is everything BUT the gun or guns that were used, but that is what we'll hear about and that is what they'll want to do something about.

These stories aren't unique, but there is a BIG push in the media right now to publicize nationally ALL stories of gun violence to drum up support for new gun laws.

It's no longer cheap, but buy it and stack it. We're going to need it.

John

Caver 60
12-24-2012, 18:37
So how'd this guy get his guns?

I thought a felon could not purchase a gun? Didn't that law work? Sarcasm off.

Tragic situation. Thoughts and prayers for the victims families.

TheExplorer
12-24-2012, 18:44
I thought a felon could not purchase a gun? Didn't that law work? Sarcasm off.


I bet it's the first time it ever happened.:tempted:

jrpro130
12-24-2012, 19:48
This is an extremely unfortunate situation.

I doubt they will arm firefighters in my lifetime. The closest we got is Swat medic but in reality on a fire scene there would be no way to carry with bunker gear on. Not to mention I wonder the melting point of polymer? Our live burns get to roughly 700*F

I'm on duty tonight and this was a topic of conversation. Some of the neighborhood I serve is less than desirable so to speak. It's always a worry in the back of our head even on medical calls. Truly sad RIP my brothers.


Should be wrenching instead of using TapaTalk

Patchman
12-24-2012, 19:53
When they say "armed" I assume guns on the rigs. In addition to guns melting, the ammo will cook off also.

Spiffums
12-24-2012, 20:48
The media splashes stories all over the air waves and the crazies come out at the holidays.

Pwhfirefighter
12-24-2012, 21:10
Rest in peace, my brothers. Prayers for all the families of the deceased, wounded, and the all rest of the first responders.

And prayers for all the first responders (FIRE, LEO, EMS, and anyone else) who I know will continue to answer the call throughout this nation.

KY Moose
12-24-2012, 21:12
RTF - Remember the Fallen

fireguy129
12-24-2012, 21:20
When they say "armed" I assume guns on the rigs. In addition to guns melting, the ammo will cook off also.

If ammo on my belt, next to my skin an under my bunkers is cooking off, I've got other things to contend with.....

jrpro130
12-24-2012, 21:23
When they say "armed" I assume guns on the rigs. In addition to guns melting, the ammo will cook off also.


Absolutely,

But guns on the rigs come with responsibility, we aren't at the truck at all times. Any medical call the truck is unattended, and also if you are 3rd due to a residential/commercial fire, everyone goes to work. If you are 1st/2nd due the drive stays with the truck but let me tell you his least concern is anything inside the truck. His job is getting water to us.

I could see if it was maybe locked up, but again, whats the point. I'd love to be able to open carry at the FD, but what would I do when bunker gear has to go on? On medical calls it's almost becoming necessary to wear bullet proof vests. Just last year shots were fired at a medical call in a neighboring city...scary.

jrpro130
12-24-2012, 21:26
If ammo on my belt, next to my skin an under my bunkers is cooking off, I've got other things to contend with.....

My bunker gear fits just right...and there is not a single way on earth i could open carry and get my bunkers on correctly, not to mention my SCBA strap goes right at my waist.

I could IWB carry but with a tucked in shirt that would be all too obvious, we wear class C hanes t-shirt with pocket.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for it, I just see us if anything being open carry and I prefer drop thigh rig...

Pwhfirefighter
12-24-2012, 21:37
You may have been only half serious but I think you need to get "full serious". I am surprised that police didn't respond with firemen when they originally arrived.

Our city LEOs usually do try to respond to calls with us, but those guys are usually pretty busy, stretched thin, and obviously they can't be everywhere at once. But they do a great job in getting there with us when they can.

As far as being armed, as a CCW holder, I would be lying if I said that I have not considered violating city policy and arming up. Legally I can't carry on 1)Fed property (a given), 2)LEO stations, 3)jails/prisons, 4)courtrooms with court in session, and 5)places of nuisances. Anywhere else I can legally carry.

BTW, no one has ever been able to show me in writing about that city policy......just saying. But I still follow it

LLL
12-24-2012, 23:19
on regular news i think i heard assualt rifle 3 times, lol :wow:

stevelyn
12-24-2012, 23:59
Obviously, they will simply say NY doesn't go far enough.



No, they'll blame those us outside NY because we're not like them. Bloomberg has already run that play by sending his goons to other states to make gun purchases. Remember?

Of course the real blame lies with a failed legal system that allowed a known killer out of his cage and onto the street.


Shooter was convicted of killing his grandmother in 1981. Was out on parole. Two Firefighters killed, others injured. Seven homes destroyed. Absolutely horrific. What has this world come to?


Whether you are religious or not, there is a passage in the Bible that says evil men will wax worse and worse. Evil should not have been out on parole.

Seems to be more of it lurking out there these days.

humanguerrilla
12-25-2012, 04:41
Another criminal not affected by gun laws especially when they want to commit murder suicide. I hope that first responders have the free time to jump through the NY hoops to arm and defend themselves and our prayers are with them.

HOTHEAD
12-25-2012, 06:55
Prayers for all involved..

Gallium
12-25-2012, 07:14
Another criminal not affected by gun laws especially when they want to commit murder suicide. I hope that first responders have the free time to jump through the NY hoops to arm and defend themselves and our prayers are with them.

No 1st responder agency (volunteer or paid FF/EMS) is going to allow their 1st responders to be armed, on record. Some (two I know of) agencies here specifically and explicit state rescue/emergency personnel cannot be armedwith firearms.

My heart goes out to those families of the deceased and injured. What a sh**ty Christmas they have been saddled with, for the rest of their lives. :sad:

Cavalry Doc
12-25-2012, 08:45
No 1st responder agency (volunteer or paid FF/EMS) is going to allow their 1st responders to be armed, on record. Some (two I know of) agencies here specifically and explicit state rescue/emergency personnel cannot be armedwith firearms.

My heart goes out to those families of the deceased and injured. What a sh**ty Christmas they have been saddled with, for the rest of their lives. :sad:

The thought process is that liberals think if paramedics have guns, criminals will want to use them to confront them.


Because we all know that police, fire, and rescue being armed is what makes bad guys want to have guns. If no one had them, no one would want them>



Liberal mentality will be to call for gun confiscations, which Gov. Cuomo has already done very recently.


http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1459616


Heartfelt best wishes for the families of those killed, and to those injured. It seems as if people are out there trying to come up with the most heinous crimes imaginable, and unfortunately, they are doing a good job of causing mass misery.

Averageman
12-25-2012, 09:02
I would be happy volunteer to ride shotgun for my local F.D.
They are a cool bunch and have a great weight room.

I am curious how someone who beats a 92 year old Woman to death gets pled down to manslaughter? Perhaps we should look in to the how's and why's of why this scumbag shouldn't have taken a ride on ol' sparky?

fireguy129
12-25-2012, 10:45
Did they identify what type of rifle he used yet?

G31
12-25-2012, 11:29
Fox says Bushmster .223. Again.

THEPOPE
12-25-2012, 12:54
Let us review.....

Guy kills his granny with a HAMMER, gets convicted...

Fast forward to the other day....

He kills AGAIN, because the FIRST time they didn't take him out back and 'ear-lead' him...

leaving him free to do the same damned thing again, no follow-up mental evals....put him on meds that are known to cause violent behaviour and suicidal tendencies...

Sounds like a 'mental-health ' issue, AGAIN....

" ....BUT THE HANG-MAN ISN'T HANGIN'...."

" GO BACK, JACK, DO IT AGAIN...WHEELS TURNIN' 'ROUND AND 'ROUND..."


uH HUH.....I AM OUT......:crying:

HOTHEAD
12-25-2012, 15:59
Im local, 3pm press release states,

S&W 38
Mossberg 500
.223 rifle with 4 30 round mags. 1 of which was empty, 3 still loaded.

His sisters remains were found in burned house remains.He had a 3 page letter on him when his body was discovered. It outlined his plan, and local PD is reporting one quote "I'm going to see how much of the neighborhood I can burn down, and start doing what I do best..killing people.

He took cover on a burm across the street and waited for responders.They were all shot in the back.

KennyFSU
12-25-2012, 16:23
The justice system has failed again.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Resqu2
12-25-2012, 16:27
No 1st responder agency (volunteer or paid FF/EMS) is going to allow their 1st responders to be armed

Weeeeell you may be wrong on this one statement, our Vol. Dept has several that carry on a regular basis, I usually respond to the scene in POV and if not in turnout gear I'm usually open carrying :supergrin: I am in rural VA and guns are just part of our area. I do usually lock it up in my vehicle if its an active house fire.

In our area most all CCW classes are held at FD's and the FF's gets the class for free :supergrin: Did I mention how great VA is :wavey:

fireguy129
12-25-2012, 16:29
Fox says Bushmster .223. Again.

Unreal, they are going to have an absolute field day with that. The only mitigating issue, if there is one, is he was clearly prohibited from possessing the rifle.

KommieforniaGlocker
12-25-2012, 16:32
I have met alot of New Yorkers, it is my opinion

New Yorkers do not deserve Fire Fighters

HexHead
12-25-2012, 16:48
He took cover on a burm across the street and waited for responders.They were all shot in the back.

Wait until the confiscations start.

ithaca_deerslayer
12-25-2012, 17:48
I have met alot of New Yorkers, it is my opinion

New Yorkers do not deserve Fire Fighters

Um, ok.

HOTHEAD
12-25-2012, 18:02
Um, ok.



Right

Most of us "upstaters" are the lowest form of life on earth..:faint:

OrangePwr9
12-25-2012, 18:40
I have met alot of New Yorkers, it is my opinion

New Yorkers do not deserve Fire Fighters

That comment will be remembered.

janice6
12-25-2012, 19:25
What terrible news expecially on Christmas day. All the talk is of love your fellow man and forgiveness, and you get some piece of trash to prove that there are "kinks" in the DNA.

I know of no worse news for the families than their loved ones, on a selfless call to help others, have been killed. Words are not enough.

Bless them all and please don't let this convict all humanity.

RIP

KommieforniaGlocker
12-25-2012, 19:38
That comment will be remembered.
http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6704u3rYP1r2oa9ko1_500.gif

KommieforniaGlocker
12-25-2012, 19:44
Right

Most of us "upstaters" are the lowest form of life on earth..:faint:
My apologies I should have been more specific, New Yorkers from New York City, the people who brought us the bystander effect, or "Genovese Syndrome."

Those don't deserve Fire Fighters, Police officers, or any type of first responders. You would have though experience such a tragic event 9/11 would have made them more "humane" or care for their fellow man, not a chance. That being said most won't lift a finger, to dial 9-1-1 for some one, so why should they be allotted such services.

HollowHead
12-25-2012, 19:50
...so why should they be allotted such services.

Because they pay for it. Don't be a dick. HH

truetopath
12-25-2012, 19:50
I have met alot of New Yorkers, it is my opinion

New Yorkers do not deserve Fire Fighters

As a firefighter in Western NY, I hope that if you ever need emergency assistance that our tires our flat and the traffic is deadlocked, and you burn in fiery hellish inferno because you sir are a grade A *******.

Infraction well worth it.

NDCent
12-25-2012, 19:55
He should have been put to sleep 17 years ago.

KommieforniaGlocker
12-25-2012, 19:57
As a firefighter in Western NY, I hope that if you ever need emergency assistance that our tires our flat and the traffic is deadlocked, and you burn in fiery hellish inferno because you sir are a grade A *******.

Infraction well worth it.



I appreciate you guys, that's why I am telling you, you guys deserve to better and should serve a community that appreciates you more...

Think I am lying? How many posts and threads whining about first responder pays and union membership??

All I am saying is New Yorkers have a track record of being jerks. :wavey: And I don't like them, That being said why should I apologize for my feelings?

I think the Bay Area in California needs to be taken out by the Giant Earthquake? So what? You don't see any of those folks with their panties in a bunch.

KommieforniaGlocker
12-25-2012, 20:00
As a firefighter in Western NY, I hope that if you ever need emergency assistance that our tires our flat and the traffic is deadlocked, and you burn in fiery hellish inferno because you sir are a grade A *******.

Infraction well worth it.

BTW, I have no desire to visit New York, (been there over rated, not impressed) AT ALLm that being said don't hold your breathe


You like law enforcement s and other first responders erve communities that don't appreciate you. NY is one of them

Cavalry Doc
12-25-2012, 20:00
My apologies I should have been more specific, New Yorkers from New York City, the people who brought us the bystander effect, or "Genovese Syndrome."

Those don't deserve Fire Fighters, Police officers, or any type of first responders. You would have though experience such a tragic event 9/11 would have made them more "humane" or care for their fellow man, not a chance. That being said most won't lift a finger, to dial 9-1-1 for some one, so why should they be allotted such services.

Generally speaking, generalizing is bad. You are painting with a brush that is way too broad, and being a DB in a thread about a tragedy.

Go away.

KommieforniaGlocker
12-25-2012, 20:01
Because they pay for it. Don't be a dick. HH

Come on dude let me troll a little, besides I don't like NYer's like I don't like folks from Bay Area in California.

KommieforniaGlocker
12-25-2012, 20:03
For the fire fighters that died, I don't have any words, and probably am typing **** I shouldn't I am projecting my own issues over any tragedy I see...as I am going through some bs

I am sorry laters, sorry for being an idiot

jrpro130
12-26-2012, 07:12
Our pd responds to all high priority calls with us, but still, when they aren't there is usually when we need them. And they are still 3 minutes away when we need them in 3 seconds. That is my reasoning for wanting to carry on duty


Should be wrenching instead of using TapaTalk

GreenDrake
12-26-2012, 09:18
The article had to reinforce that the weapon had a "flash suppressor" good grief.

ithaca_deerslayer
12-26-2012, 09:27
The article had to reinforce that the weapon had a "flash suppressor" good grief.

Had to be a pre-ban (1994 or earlier), or else what he was doing was against the law. A flash hider and bayonet lug are very dangerous and not allowed on an AR in NYS post-ban.

He should have read up on this stuff, as he may be in legal trouble.

TBO
12-26-2012, 10:15
Did someone with a firearm drive the gunman off?

aircarver
12-26-2012, 10:34
Guys there is a vast difference between the city NY-ers and the country NY-ers.

It is a horrible example of letting your city people dominate politically ... :frown:

.

ithaca_deerslayer
12-26-2012, 12:02
Did someone with a firearm drive the gunman off?

Don't know. Early reports now being changed in the news :)

Patchman
12-26-2012, 12:17
One article I read said an off-duty LEO drove his car between the gunman and the FFs, then engaged the gunman.

A second article I read said the off-duty LEO drove his car between them and was injured when the gunman fired on his car. A second LEO engaged the gunman.

mgs
12-26-2012, 13:29
I guess its time to arm Firefighters.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/24/us/new-york-firefighters-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t3

Not in NY....they have strict gun laws!

el_jewapo
12-26-2012, 13:42
They're on the news right now blaming it on Bushmaster. Never mind the fact that he killed his grandmother in 1980 and was released in 1998. That couldn't be the problem. It was the gun for sure.

HarleyGuy
12-26-2012, 13:45
One article I read said an off-duty LEO drove his car between the gunman and the FFs, then engaged the gunman.

A second article I read said the off-duty LEO drove his car between them and was injured when the gunman fired on his car. A second LEO engaged the gunman.

Right, AND he did not have an "off-duty" weapon with him.


Says he has mixed emotions.

Just wondering if their departmant allows their officers to carry a personal weapon off-duty?

Even as a civilian, I carry 100% of the time (where I can legally) and cannot understand how any sworn officer would not do the same.

ithaca_deerslayer
12-26-2012, 16:51
The D&C is saying the ATF finished tracing the 223, 12ga, and 38, but by statute the ATF can't release what found. Huh?

Cavalry Doc
12-26-2012, 16:54
The D&C is saying the ATF finished tracing the 223, 12ga, and 38, but by statute the ATF can't release what found. Huh?

Must not fit the preferred story and agenda then.

SCHADENFREUDE
12-26-2012, 17:09
Cuomo's going to have a field day with this. Nothing to get the sheep on your side like stories of children and firemen getting killed by the evil bushmaster. It all seems a little too convenient.

I know for a fact that NYS mental healthcare is awful. THe police and the mental health people are hand tied by lack of funds and laws.

But the welfare hordes keep getting there's.

*ASH*
12-26-2012, 17:14
they keep getting rifle name wrong , its a Bushwacker

Resqu2
12-26-2012, 17:21
I listened to the radio traffic that was from the scene early on, someone on the radio said they engaged the gunman, fired 4 shots at the BG and they thought he went down, I guessed it was the off duty cop but I can't see him having much luck with a pistol? May have made the BG take better cover or quit firing at them?

Patchman
12-26-2012, 18:05
I listened to the radio traffic that was from the scene early on, someone on the radio said they engaged the gunman, fired 4 shots at the BG and they thought he went down, I guessed it was the off duty cop but I can't see him having much luck with a pistol? May have made the BG take better cover or quit firing at them?


Based on the two articles I read, whoever fired back (whether it was the off duty or the on duty) fired back with a rifle.

Resqu2
12-26-2012, 19:12
Based on the two articles I read, whoever fired back (whether it was the off duty or the on duty) fired back with a rifle.

I just read that on CNN, they said it was an off duty officer who returned fire with a rifle. Good thing he had that, don't know many that carry anything other than a pistol. Bet the BG wasn't expecting that either.

Stopdropnroll
12-26-2012, 19:14
It's a mad world.

654Boomer
12-26-2012, 20:03
This hits close to home in more ways than one! Prayers to the families.
Here is a link to the radio transmissions between one of the shot firefighters and dispatch.

http://youtu.be/b7VXwnyAvp8

Twists my stomach listening to that. A former member of our dept. moved up there a year ago or so. As far as I know he was not involved.

Greetings havensal,

Thanks for posting this (post #48 in this thread). I am totally in AWE! When you listen to Officer (Fireman) Theodore Scardino's voice in this audio link and hear how calm and collected he maintains himself while quietly calling for police support--and already determining that if nothing happens soon to extricate him from the "danger zone", that he is going to die. "I need EMS or I am going to join them."

No screaming or freaking out, just calm and collected, despite the two bullets that have injured him (lower leg and lower back). He didn't panic and run up and try to get away--he maintained composure enough to keep shielded from the opposite side of the fire truck where the gunman was firing from. And to top it off . . . what does he politely request (not demand) as a personal priority? Not for others to unnecessarily risk their lives . . . but to contact his family to calm them down. From news sources . . . "While he waited and bled, Scardino made a request. "Is it possible to notify my next of kin and apprise of the situation?" Again . . . not thinking of himself, but wanting to calm and serve others right to the very end. A true servant's heart!

Absolutely amazing . . . I am in AWE of his character. I am sure there are many firemen, police, EMS, military soldiers/sailors with this same character that go unnoticed everyday. But I am able to listen to him through this link above while he remained trapped in the worst of conditions. At best . . . I could only hope that I could be half as calm as he remained during this scenario as it played out. He had resolved in his mind and purposed in his heart that he was going to die soon, and his primary focus remained on everyone else. His extrication from this condition was secondary. Amazing. We are absolutely blessed to have people with this servant character watching over us.

Patchman
12-26-2012, 20:31
Which is why it's important to allow all U.S. LE to have/carry whatever class of guns available to the general public.

If a gun is legally available, it'll make it into the hands of BGs, who will still have the advantage of choosing the time and place of ambush.

ithaca_deerslayer
12-26-2012, 20:47
Which is why it's important to allow all U.S. LE to have/carry whatever class of guns available to the general public.

If a gun is legally available, it'll make it into the hands of BGs, who will still have the advantage of choosing the time and place of ambush.

And allow all civilians to have those guns as well. Because the bad guys are after us too.

Cavalry Doc
12-26-2012, 21:02
And allow all civilians to have those guns as well. Because the bad guys are after us too.

Ditto.


Go after the bad guys. Leave the good guys alone to have what they can afford to protect themselves. I'd be cool if LE could get class III tax free. Wish law abiding civilians could to, but one step at a time.

MB-G26
12-26-2012, 22:05
:wow: :steamed::faint: :angel: :sad: :sad:

SCHADENFREUDE
12-27-2012, 17:04
The local news is reporting that he attained the weapons from a female neighbor and her daughter. He apparently wrote how he got the weapons in the manifesto he left.

qas1178
12-29-2012, 08:14
March 8, 2000 - A routine fire call that erupted in bloodshed left firefighters reeling. A firefighter just back from a leave emerged from a burning home in southeast Memphis, ambushed and killed two Fire Department colleagues and a Sheriff's deputy. Inside the house was the body of the suspect's wife, Stacey Williams; they were newlyweds. Frederick Williams was charged in the deaths of his wife, deputy Rupert Peete and firefighters William Blakemore and Javier Lerma. On CNN, President Clinton said of the incident: "It's a tragic thing. . . . The firefighters, police, they put their lives on the line a lot, but they don't expect to be shot at the scene of a burning house."

Restless28
12-29-2012, 08:23
Looks like the Bushmaster and shotgun were obtained via straw purchase. The Feds are gonna come down hard on the stupid girl, and rightfully so.

ithaca_deerslayer
12-29-2012, 10:52
Looks like the Bushmaster and shotgun were obtained via straw purchase. The Feds are gonna come down hard on the stupid girl, and rightfully so.

Media (a Fox News link), says it has a combat style flash suppressor, yet was bought in NY in 2010 at Gander Mountain. Unless it was a pre-ban (which I doubt), there was no flash supressor. He could have added it illegally aftermarket (wait, illegal for him to own a gun, wait again, illegal for him to murder someone).