Lightning a trigger. [Archive] - Glock Talk

PDA

View Full Version : Lightning a trigger.


AusJunior
01-20-2013, 02:27
What is the best way to lighten a glock trigger? and is the zev tech fulcrum trigger ultimate kit good?

Travelin' Jack
01-20-2013, 02:30
Lightning is way too dangerous for your trigger. I would recommend you look at alternative options.

AusJunior
01-20-2013, 02:36
Lightning is way too dangerous for your trigger. I would recommend you look at alternative options.

Why is this? What is wrong with a full drop in trigger? and your not being a smart ass are you?

AusJunior
01-20-2013, 02:47
Lightning is way too dangerous for your trigger. I would recommend you look at alternative options.

Why is this? What is wrong with a full drop in trigger? and your not being a smart ass are you?

skyboss_4evr
01-20-2013, 04:56
Lightning is way too dangerous for your trigger. I would recommend you look at alternative options.

You stole my reply!!

jdw174
01-20-2013, 05:31
Just how "light" do you want to make it? My 19 was listed as the 5.5lb trigger, but pulled higher than that. I went with the infamous ".25 cent trigger job" and the addition of a 3.5 connector. Trigger is now fine but not super light. Changing the springs to competition springs will take it further, but I wouldn't do that for any sidearm that I used for EDC/SD. Matter of fact, I wouldn't do that for a range gun either.

ignantmike
01-20-2013, 05:36
Why is this? What is wrong with a full drop in trigger? and your not being a smart ass are you?
i think there is some info in the gunsmithing forum.....just do i search there....various way's to do it.....

Ryobi
01-20-2013, 05:47
For playing around, it's fine. But the stock trigger is more than adequate in the hands of a skilled shooter. No amount of modification will make a novice shooter shoot like a pro keep it clean and lubed properly (tiny drop as per the manual).

elijah58
01-20-2013, 06:50
There is a post here somewhere, you have to search for it but you can modify your factory trigger and lighten the trigger pull by a lot. I lowered the pull on my G22 to under 2 lbs. I know there are people here that don't agree with this but it's what I wanted and I love it. I also built a jig to put the trigger in to be able to drill them the same every time.
Eli

F-111 John
01-20-2013, 07:13
You stole my reply!!

I think you meant "you stole my thunder!!"

breacher1
01-20-2013, 07:50
There is a post here somewhere, you have to search for it but you can modify your factory trigger and lighten the trigger pull by a lot. I lowered the pull on my G22 to under 2 lbs. I know there are people here that don't agree with this but it's what I wanted and I love it. I also built a jig to put the trigger in to be able to drill them the same every time.
Eli

Drill the trigger? What exactly are you drilling?

I just dropped a Ghost 3.5 connector along with a complete Wolff competition spring kit in mine to get the trigger close to 3 lbs. The striker spring made the biggest difference- G35 for range use only.

SouthpawG26
01-20-2013, 09:56
Lightning

Lightening..

Badaboom

24601
01-20-2013, 10:13
some people won't modify a glock and others enjoy customizing their gun....i lean more towards the latter in order to customize a gun for me.....that being said, for my current CCW i've done the following:

G32C
smooth trigger (hate the serrated)
25 cent trigger job with polishing stones (400, 600,900 grit and flitz)
modified stock safety plunger (ground down/polished edges until it was a smooth dome)
6lb striker spring
reduced power safety plunger spring
6lb trigger spring
3.5lb ghost rocket

yes, you can seriously mess up your gun and i wouldnt recommend anyone carry this without a lot of testing at the range.....but i have tested it quite extensively and it works without issue.....the trigger is as smooth as butter...light, crisp break, short reset.....my gun does not double tap on it's own or go full auto....

people will say you should never modify the trigger on a CCW due to accidental discharge, but if you keep your finger off the trigger and only plan on putting it on the trigger if you're going to fire, then the trigger job shouldn't be an issue IMO....if you walked around with your finger lightly on the trigger routinely/prepping the trigger by shortening the movement, then of course having a lighter trigger is retarded....but you shouldn't be prepping the trigger anyway ....

i personally agree with the creator of the ghost trigger as the debate on light vs heavy trigger on a CCW is very well argued here http://www.ghostinc.com/category/1triggerweight/

that being said, i'll never knock anyone for wanting to keep their gun stock, but you sure as hell will find people on this forum knocking those that modify their CCW guns....to each his own....

i'm an above average shooter and once i did the above modifications, especially the polishing, i noticed that my groupings were better by about 10% due to the lack of 'wasted' energy pulling on a trigger that was 'rough' and had more resistance at the breaking point....that being said though, i would NOT recommend anyone doing the above if you goal is JUST to improve accuracy....work on technique first and when you're confident enough in your shooting and gunsmithing skills, the above will be the icing on the cake...


for those interested in doing their own trigger job, these four pages do an excellent job of explaining it with great pictures...

Glock trigger job part 1 (http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=103781)
Glock trigger job part 2 (http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=103933)
Glock trigger job part 3 (http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=103973)
Glock trigger job part 4 (http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=103981)


and yes, i've owned a zev fulcrum....nice trigger and if you aren't confident enough to do the gunsmithing yourself and are intent on a different setup, it would be a good choice...but if i had to compare my own work to the zev, i'd have to say i prefer mine at this point...i wish i could give you more information on zev, but it's been a long time since i've gotten rid of it....

robhic
01-20-2013, 10:41
people will say you should never modify the trigger on a CCW due to accidental discharge, but if you keep your finger off the trigger and only plan on putting it on the trigger if you're going to fire, then the trigger job shouldn't be an issue IMO...

After getting run over by an aggressive, smart prosecutor, you might think differently. Everyone hopes never, ever to have to go through this but in a legal situation, modifying the gun used to shoot someone will be used against you.

Not just a ND but the fact that you changed the gun from the manufacturer's specifications will be a negative mark against you. Ayoob talks about such things all the time.

If you do it, so be it. But just be forewarned and aware of possible consequences and hope to never have to test the system....

4095fanatic
01-20-2013, 11:12
I think you meant "you stole my thunder!!"

I'm shocked you would say such a thing.

M 7
01-20-2013, 11:35
I'm shocked you would say such a thing.

What an electrifying discussion. :alex:

TheGlockTalker
01-20-2013, 11:36
I've heard of too many accidental misfires and double fires to even be tempted to do that.
Besides once you get used to the stock trigger it's just fine.
I have competed IDPA with a 34, 26, and a 21 all 100% original and I don't do any worse than anyone else. So I'm not entirely sold on the necessity of doing trigger jobs in the first place.
Maybe........just maybe for open competition but anything else you don't have to.
Watch some of the Hickock 45 videos. He seems to do ok with original Glocks.
Bottom line: spend your money on ammo, the gun is fine as is.

24601
01-20-2013, 11:38
After getting run over by an aggressive, smart prosecutor, you might think differently. Everyone hopes never, ever to have to go through this but in a legal situation, modifying the gun used to shoot someone will be used against you.

Not just a ND but the fact that you changed the gun from the manufacturer's specifications will be a negative mark against you. Ayoob talks about such things all the time.

If you do it, so be it. But just be forewarned and aware of possible consequences and hope to never have to test the system....

you do bring up a valid point ....but where do you draw the line at modifying the gun? night sights? well seeing as most SD situations happen in low light, an aggressive prosecutor could look at the fact that you've put night sights on your gun to improve the odds of killing someone at night...self-defense ammo like winchester ranger-T with sharp petals? he could point out that you're using sharp petals to inflict more damage than necessary as opposed to using a round nosed bullet or snake-shot, etc....while we're at it, he could also say that you carry a gun (as opposed to leaving it at home) with the intent to shoot someone and kill them....he could point out that you could have purchased a taser instead of a gun.....you see, someone can continually find something to nit pick about in this stupid litigious society we live in....

there are those that like to take into consideration worst case scenarios and all possible outcomes....and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that....in life, we weigh options and take calculated risks....i have a friend who buys all his music off itunes because he is afraid of downloading it off piratebay and getting sued....and there are others who haven't paid for music since the dawn of file sharing :whistling:

but i respect your opinion...:wavey:

TheGlockTalker
01-20-2013, 12:01
you do bring up a valid point ....but where do you draw the line at modifying the gun? night sights?


I leave everything alone on my carry weapon.
No night sights....nothing.
It is 100% original.

This is why it's important to buy a gun you really like for carry. Not a gun you intend to customize.

In other words if night sights are important to you get a gun that comes originally with night sights.
XDs comes to mind, and many others.

That being said I doubt anyone would hold night sights against you in court but a trigger job.......forget about it!

elijah58
01-20-2013, 12:12
I lightened the trigger on my G22 for my own benefit. I used the guide online and moved the trigger pin location by .130", then cut the trigger bar inside the trigger itself to allow for the extra length. The safe fire mechanism is still intact and works just like stock. The pull is less than 2lbs and the reset is about 1/16" this one is just awesome, I would like to do it to all of my guns but sadly I don't for the above mentioned reasons. I carry a complete stock G33 and keep my G22 for the range. On a Side note, why don't you ever hear them go after the perpetrator the way they go after the victim? You hear all the above reasons for having a weapon and you have been planning this shooting since you bought the gun in 1982. What you don't hear is the lawyers pointing the finger at the defendant saying, why would you have a unregistered gun, with the serial numbers removed and with you being a convicted felon, surely you went here planning to inflict injury or possibly death while trying to attack a man and his family and take what they have because you are too frikin lazy to work for it yourself. But no that is not the way to treat someone, give me a break it burns me just talking about it, In my Opinion, defense lawyers are among the lowest forms of humanity, right down there with animals who will rape and kill innocent little 4 year old kids because they wanted to and couldn't get a woman. Those lawyers are no better when they can sit knowing what their client has done and argue to the court that he is innocent and the kids were in the wrong. If I ever had to use deadly force on one of these animals I would hope that I would have to go through his lawyer first to get to him. I know there are many people out there that's gonna disagree with me but so be it...... It's the way I feel and nothing is going to change it.
Eli

ctious
01-20-2013, 12:12
I customize my carry as far as I can. I want it to be the most deadly thing I can make it. If I ever have to use it I want to be a one shot kill. No wounding. Just kill. End the danger. If they want to argue that I was out looking to kill I will say yes. It was either do these changes to my gun or carry a much bigger gun. I chose to make changes instead of carrying a 454 that would pass through more people and walls possibly harming others.

Pretty sure a jury will see it your way.

4095fanatic
01-20-2013, 12:18
What an electrifying discussion. :alex:

I am rather pleased though how this conversation is being conducted


Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire (http://www.outdoorhub.com/mobile/)

elijah58
01-20-2013, 12:31
Drill the trigger? What exactly are you drilling?

I just dropped a Ghost 3.5 connector along with a complete Wolff competition spring kit in mine to get the trigger close to 3 lbs. The striker spring made the biggest difference- G35 for range use only.

You actually have to move the pin location back .130" and re drill the bar for the new hole. Then you have to remove the tip of the trigger bar and reassemble and test.
Eli

24601
01-20-2013, 13:33
This is why it's important to buy a gun you really like for carry. Not a gun you intend to customize.




so let's take sig sauer for example....

if i go by what your personal opinion is, should i go ahead and buy a sig that is customized? http://www.sigsauer.com/CustomShop/SpecialCTU.aspx

it's technically a 'factory gun', BUT it's also customized!! :wow: now what? is it ok because sig did it?

what's the difference when sig does it and when i do it? just because it comes from the factory doesn't mean a human (who isn't perfect) can't make an error that could affect performance.....they churn out far more custom gun work, true, but they aren't and can't be as dedicated to each gun when compared to one guy who is taking all the time in the world to painstakingly modify his primary gun because his life depends on it....

your argument is weak....not everything is black and white....

that being said, i'm not saying your view is wrong as you're entitled to your opinion....

VinnieG
01-20-2013, 13:41
24601
Great posts brother. I couldn't agree more.

24601
01-20-2013, 13:56
24601
Great posts brother. I couldn't agree more.


:thumbsup:

M 7
01-20-2013, 15:00
I am rather pleased though how this conversation is being conducted



D'oh! Now that is just plain wrong. :supergrin:

Tiny Killer Robot
01-20-2013, 15:04
I like Viani's comments about not putting your finger on the trigger until you are committed to firing a shot. My Colt 6920 has a Geissele SSA that pulls at a crisp 4.1 lbs. It's crazy to have my G17 pull at 6.3 when it is already a hell of a lot harder to shoot accurately with a pistol vs a carbine/rifle.
I also think it's going to be tough to sell an AD to a jury if you have justifiable circumstances and put 3-5 rounds rapid fire into the target.

"How do we know that you didn't accidentally shoot Mr. X? Your trigger pulls is lighter than standard for your pistol make/model."
"I am sure that the fact that Mr. X broke into my house in the middle of the night, had a weapon, and was shot 5 times would show conclusively that there was no accident in discharging the firearm. I shot until he stopped presenting a threat to me and my family."

I keep the springs stock, will polish trigger components if the feel is gritty, and run a 3.5 connector with absolutely no worries. With all due respect to Mas (who I have enjoyed reading even back before the internet days), he knows of a couple of cases where this was an issue. Considering the thousands of self defense shootings (and almost certain gun/trigger mods is some of them), it is almost statistically insignificant. Hell, if you just fire one round, it could be argued that you had an AD/ND even with a 'stock' gun.

SCmasterblaster
01-20-2013, 15:18
Just how "light" do you want to make it? My 19 was listed as the 5.5lb trigger, but pulled higher than that. I went with the infamous ".25 cent trigger job" and the addition of a 3.5 connector. Trigger is now fine but not super light. Changing the springs to competition springs will take it further, but I wouldn't do that for any sidearm that I used for EDC/SD. Matter of fact, I wouldn't do that for a range gun either.

Amen! The 3.5 connector to start with.

TheGlockTalker
01-20-2013, 23:19
so let's take sig sauer for example....
if i go by what your personal opinion is, should i go ahead and buy a sig that is customized?


Yes you should.
Because that is the way the gun comes from the factory. Customized or not it isn't something YOU did. You got it new like that from the factory.

That's my point.

TheGlockTalker
01-20-2013, 23:25
what's the difference when sig does it and when i do it?


Jeeeeeezzzzzzz........the difference is that should you be taken to court you can in one case say they, the factory, did it and it came like that from the factory and you haven't done a single thing to customize it since you got it and in the other case you have to explain to them that YOU spent YOUR time ordering specialized parts and installed all the CUSTOM parts your self and that my friend will immediately make you a gun expert ready to kill to the jury.

Get it?

AusJunior
01-21-2013, 03:42
Look guys, i am appreciative for all the info but i am building a racegun for open division ipsc. not a carry gun. i dont want to here about how you keep yours completely, i want to know tips about lightening a trigger. thanks though

Tom in Arizona
01-21-2013, 04:48
Look guys, i am appreciative for all the info but i am building a racegun for open division ipsc. not a carry gun. i dont want to here about how you keep yours completely, i want to know tips about lightening a trigger. thanks though

Yes, that Fulcrum is as about as good as it gets! I have three different pistols with the Ultimate packages installed, no problems, excellent performance. It like a performance sports car, not for everyone but in the right hands a pleasure to use.

robhic
01-21-2013, 10:06
you do bring up a valid point ....but where do you draw the line at modifying the gun? night sights? well seeing as most SD situations happen in low light, an aggressive prosecutor could look at the fact that you've put night sights on your gun to improve the odds of killing someone at night...self-defense ammo like winchester ranger-T with sharp petals? he could point out that you're using sharp petals to inflict more damage than necessary as opposed to using a round nosed bullet or snake-shot, etc....while we're at it, he could also say that you carry a gun (as opposed to leaving it at home) with the intent to shoot someone and kill them....he could point out that you could have purchased a taser instead of a gun.....you see, someone can continually find something to nit pick about in this stupid litigious society we live in....

but i respect your opinion...:wavey:
Thank you, as I respect yours. You make valid points, also, but the trigger-pull getting lighter is probably the biggest issue. I am going by Mas Ayoob's words and certainly not from personal experience.

But night sights, if you carried a flashlight that would make seeing at night easier, too. But it's not a crime. I think specific ammo is weak because HP ammo is recommended for efficiency and lack of adding collateral damage. Easier to defend.

So let's just hope no one has to prove anything in court! :wow: And our days (and nights) are safe.

Duck of Death
01-21-2013, 11:39
AusJunior

These might help, I run 2lb triggers on my 2 Glock 34 open guns:

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=549549&highlight=Duck+Death+trigger+job

http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=52311

SouthernBoyVA
01-21-2013, 14:25
Thank you, as I respect yours. You make valid points, also, but the trigger-pull getting lighter is probably the biggest issue. I am going by Mas Ayoob's words and certainly not from personal experience.

But night sights, if you carried a flashlight that would make seeing at night easier, too. But it's not a crime. I think specific ammo is weak because HP ammo is recommended for efficiency and lack of adding collateral damage. Easier to defend.

So let's just hope no one has to prove anything in court! :wow: And our days (and nights) are safe.

A victim's deliberate actions are going to be hard for a prosecutor to prove that the shooting was the result of an ND, too.