Which single stage press? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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lightjunkie
05-12-2014, 22:09
Well finally after all these years I hole to finally take the plunge, especially in light of today's ammunition prices and the way current politics seems to be leaning on making ammo less available and the main reason is because of the uncommon calibers I shoot the .300 Weatherby and the 10mm auto to start reloading. I really could use some advise on picking a a reliable single stage press, a lot of people have told me to get a RCBS Rock Chucker, and I have plenty of free time so that being said I open the forum to opinions of more experienced re loaders and please explain why you made the decision. Thanks all in advance

WeeWilly
05-12-2014, 22:23
I have a 45 year old Rock Chucker that still works like new. You cannot go wrong with a Rock Chucker.

Another option of similar stoutness, perhaps a little better spent primer collection is the Lee Classic Cast press, it will also be a little cheaper to buy.

A Forster Co-Ax is a very sweet single stage press, but more money than you need to spend.

Those 300 Weatherby's are a lot to size, get a stout press.

Have fun.

Kentguy
05-13-2014, 05:56
Lightjunkie,

I have a Lee single stage, excellent press for the money. Since you are just starting out perhaps a "kit" would give you the best band for your buck.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/423081/lee-challenger-breech-lock-single-stage-press-anniversary-kit?cm_vc=ProductFinding

Of course I agree with WeeWilly, you can't go wrong with RCBS

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/937051/rcbs-rock-chucker-supreme-master-single-stage-press-kit?cm_vc=ProductFinding

Good luck and be safe out there

PCJim
05-13-2014, 07:04
Which ever brand of press you purchase, be sure it is of the "O" frame design and not a "C" frame. The O frame is supported on both sides where the C is supported on only one side. For handgun loads and maybe small caliber rifle, a C frame press is OK. For larger caliber rifle reloading, the O frame is a must to prevent frame flex.

Arnold Kuhl
05-13-2014, 07:08
I have a 45 year old Rock Chucker that still works like new. You cannot go wrong with a Rock Chucker.

Another option of similar stoutness, perhaps a little better spent primer collection is the Lee Classic Cast press, it will also be a little cheaper to buy.

A Forster Co-Ax is a very sweet single stage press, but more money than you need to spend.

Those 300 Weatherby's are a lot to size, get a stout press.

Have fun.
My Rockchucker is only 22 years old, and it's been great. For the limited amount of shooting I do, it serves me well. I also have an old-timer "Ohaus" beam scale, which is dead-on accurate (got weights, too). I have an RCBS priming tool bolted down on my reloading bench, and it's been great as well.

I'm still pretty fascinated when I see the high-speed industrial-strength progressive presses in action; however, they're not for me. I like to watch each individual stage of the process and have total control over what's going on.

Regards,
AK

Jimmy10mm
05-13-2014, 07:18
I'm still pretty fascinated when I see the high-speed industrial-strength progressive presses in action; however, they're not for me. I like to watch each individual stage of the process and have total control over what's going on.


+1 to what Arnold said. For some it may be a PITA, and I guess it depends on how much volume you load, but a single stage is good enough for me and it is kind of a zen thing.

Rock chucker since the 1970s. I've had a couple of Star Progressives back years ago but sold them many moons back.

F106 Fan
05-13-2014, 07:25
There are some 'stickies' at the top of the forum that are worth reading.

A single stage press will be capable of 50 to 100 rounds per hour depending on how you dispense the powder.

If you think ammo is scarce, wait until you try to find powder.

Richard

ess45
05-13-2014, 08:09
I have no experience with 300 Weatherby, but looking at the length of this round, I would get a press with a ram stroke of at least 4 inches. I would limit my choices to the Lee Classic cast, RCBS RC Supreme and if money is not a problem, the Redding Ultramag 700.

unclebob
05-13-2014, 08:15
My first metallic reloading press was the Herterís O magnum. Sold it when I no longer could find shell holders at that time. Bought a Rocker Chucker and modified the spent priming system. Sold it when I bought the Dillon 550. Then bought another Rock Chucker and modified the spent primer system again. Right after I bought it, I wish that I had bought the CO-AX. It is probably or close to the best press for accurate rifle reloading.
Around here I can find rifle powder. Handgun is a different story.

lightjunkie
05-13-2014, 08:34
Wow thanks all, speed is not an issue for me I think more Iam involved with each step of the process would be better and of course tight tolerances for increased accuracy? Unfortunately mo et will be an issue but I think k I'd rather spend the money once and get what I need than numerous times of failure.

dla
05-13-2014, 08:57
Funny, but "being involved more in each step" is exactly what causes double-charges. Why? Because machines don't have brain farts - people do.

Why not get a Lee Classic Turret? It will operate nicely as a single stage and it has a cool way to mount your dies.

Colorado4Wheel
05-13-2014, 09:18
Funny, but "being involved more in each step" is exactly what causes double-charges. Why? Because machines don't have brain farts - people do.

Why not get a Lee Classic Turret? It will operate nicely as a single stage and it has a cool way to mount your dies.

Exactly.

But if he is loading rifle mostly I would just get the single stage. A Redding t7 would also be very nice.

F106 Fan
05-13-2014, 09:21
Money, time and volume all come together in reloading. We're always trading one for another.

I'm looking in the Sinclair catalog and I see the RCBS Rock Chucker at $150 while the considerably more stout Redding Big Boss II is $190. Is it worth $40 extra? Probably.

BTW, these aren't necessarily the best prices available, it's just a catalog I had sitting on my desk.

Arguably the best single stage for loading rifle is the Forster Co-Ax and its about $300. Worth it? Well, I might consider it some day. At the moment, I load precision .308 on a Redding T7 turret press. I don't know if that press will handle .300 Weatherby. It's kind of light and overhung versus O-frame.

If it were just 10mm, I would buy the lightest SS press on the market. Anything will work fine. The Weatherby, OTOH, probably requires a bit of grunt to resize. And that brings up another point: Why would I want to resize the brass?

That's not a trick question! If you shoot the rounds through just one rifle (or can keep the brass separated by rifle), neck resizing is all that is required. and that will take less grunt than the 10mm. Since the 10mm is a semiauto, you will always do a full-length resize. Precision rifle? No. You finally have the fired brass sized perfectly for the chamber, there is no reason to mess it up by full-length resizing.

Ah, decisions...

I would spend the extra $40 for the Redding if for no other reason than the fact that the frame is offset such that the ram is easier to reach. See the 36 degree offset in this video:
Redding Big Boss 2 Press - YouTube

Richard

F106 Fan
05-13-2014, 10:23
FWIW, MidwayUSA just announced a sale on the RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme press and the complete reloading kit.

I have my doubts about the benefits of the 'kit'. I don't like the cheap powder scale and I can't find any possible use for the lube pad. That said, Midway wants about $290 for the complete kit versus $300-500 elsewhere. It pays to shop around.

The kit is entirely adequate for getting started. The scale can be upgraded later. It will work fine.

ETA: I didn't look close enough at the picture. The 5-0-5 scale is very nice. Much better than the one that came in my 'kit' back in the early '80s.

I don't see the Redding Big Boss II available as a kit. There is a Big Boss kit but that's the older version of the press.

A lot of people like the Lee Classic Cast and it is available from Midway for $107. I didn't see a kit format. I would still buy the Redding, but that's just me.

Spend some time at the Midway site:
http://www.midwayusa.com/category/reloading-supplies

Richard

Atomic Punk
05-13-2014, 10:37
i got a SS Hornady press a few years ago. Main reason was the quick lock system. Really like it, has been great for the handfull of pistol rounds i have, and the few rifle rounds im getting into.
However whenever i find the spare funds for a multi stage press i may not go Hornady, have heard of more issues than i would like.

WeeWilly
05-13-2014, 10:37
FWIW, MidwayUSA just announced a sale on the RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme press and the complete reloading kit.

I have my doubts about the benefits of the 'kit'. I don't like the cheap powder scale and I can't find any possible use for the lube pad. That said, Midway wants about $290 for the complete kit versus $300-500 elsewhere. It pays to shop around.

The kit is entirely adequate for getting started. The scale can be upgraded later. It will work fine.

I don't see the Redding Big Boss II available as a kit. There is a Big Boss kit but that's the older version of the press.

A lot of people like the Lee Classic Cast and it is available from Midway for $107. I didn't see a kit format. I would still buy the Redding, but that's just me.

Spend some time at the Midway site:
http://www.midwayusa.com/category/reloading-supplies

Richard

Excellent choice.

I disagree with Richard's observation of the scale in this kit, the 505 is an excellent scale that will last a lifetime. The other bits in this kit are all top notch, including the Uniflow measure, etc. This kit is far more than 2x better than an entry level Lee kit, where most of the stuff will be replaced as soon as you have your feet on the ground.

I do agree with Richard on the usefulness of the lube pad, you won't use it and it is kind of surprising RCBS even includes it. For pistol you will want a spray lube (or no lube) and for rifle a Lanolin based lube or Imperial Sizing wax.

F106 Fan
05-13-2014, 10:39
I should add, you can see the Sinclair wood reloading block in the video above. These are very nice, caliber specific, loading blocks. Far better than the more-or-less universal block that comes with any of the presses.

I have less of a tendency to knock the cases out of the wood block. Given the fact that I do, indeed, knock cases over, my process is to charge the case and seat the bullet before I return the cartridge to the block. I do NOT charge 50 cases and leave them sitting in the block just so I can gaze lovingly at the powder level.

That means that I need to mount the powder measure on a second stand (Google for 'powder measure stand'). Or, if I am trickle charging, I just dump the powder into the case. In either event, I seat the bullet immediately. This is quite easy to do with the Redding T7 Turret because I have a powder die in one station and the seating die right next door. I'm also using the RCBS ChargeMaster to dispense the powder. Kind of a second step up in the reloading world.

Richard

Colorado4Wheel
05-13-2014, 10:45
I just got to say

1) RCBS KIT does not have a cheap scale. It's a excellent Balance Beam scale.
2) I don't like the Forster or any other press with the handle way up high. Whats up with putting the handle in the wrong place. It's just weird.
3) Redding makes a sweet operating press. I love how nice they feel. Much nicer then any RCBS.
4) The Lee CLASSIC SS is as nice if not nicer then the RCBS. Just saying because it's true :)

F106 Fan
05-13-2014, 10:52
I disagree with Richard's observation of the scale in this kit, the 505 is an excellent scale that will last a lifetime.

My bad! I didn't look close enough at the picture. I was thinking of the cheaper scale that came with my RCBS RS kit back in the early '80s. Mine has that rotating spool under the beam instead of the little metal adjusting tabs (poises). I see RCBS doesn't even sell that scale any longer.

Even my old scale works well, I just don't prefer it. I think I would like one of the heavier cast units a little better.

Given the price of the 5-0-5 scale by itself, the kit just looks better and better.

Richard

WeeWilly
05-13-2014, 11:01
I just got to say

1) RCBS KIT does not have a cheap scale. It's a excellent Balance Beam scale.
2) I don't like the Forster or any other press with the handle way up high. Whats up with putting the handle in the wrong place. It's just weird.
3) Redding makes a sweet operating press. I love how nice they feel. Much nicer then any RCBS.
4) The Lee CLASSIC SS is as nice if not nicer then the RCBS. Just saying because it's true :)

I agree with point number 4. It is important to make the distinction between the Lee Classic single stage and the Challenger series. The Breech Lock Challenger presses are fine for pistol and short action rifle, but are too light for long action and magnum rifle calibers. The Challenger series press and ram are actually OK, but the linkage (toggles and cast bit that the toggles and arm bolt to) won't hold up under the stress of sizing big cases.

The Lee Classic is every bit as stout as my Rock Chucker. The Classic comes in two versions (screw in dies and Breech Lock bushing style). I would recommend the screw in style. The Breech Lock can be made to work (be tight in the press) but the time they save in die changes really is not that important when you use lock rings with the screw in style. With the screw in style setup the dies will always be tight. If you go with Lee dies, get real lock rings (RCBS, Redding, Hornaday, etc.) and skip the Lee non-locking, lock rings.

Hope all that made sense. Lots to digest.

unclebob
05-13-2014, 11:37
i got a SS Hornady press a few years ago. Main reason was the quick lock system. Really like it, has been great for the handfull of pistol rounds i have, and the few rifle rounds im getting into.
However whenever i find the spare funds for a multi stage press i may not go Hornady, have heard of more issues than i would like.

Just about any SS press that uses the large screw out die adaptor you can use the Hornady bushing system. You just screw out the large bushing and install the Hornady bushing. I like using them a lot better than having to screw dies in and out.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/858110/hornady-lock-n-load-press-and-die-conversion-bushing-kit?cm_vc=ProductFinding

Three-Five-Seven
05-13-2014, 12:38
If I was in the market for a single stage press today, I'd buy a Forster Co-Axial. I wish I had one, but am too cheap to add one to the collection. But, if I had it to do over, that's the press I'd have.

(I do most of my single stage loading on a T-7, which is a great press in its own right)

fredj338
05-13-2014, 12:38
IMO, if you are going to buy a ss press, buy a heavy duty one that can multi task. This excludes any C press or IMO, the new fad bushing presses. If you want to bullet swage or reform cases, etc, straight screw in dies are more robust than the bushings. The Lee Classic Cast is a good heavy duty press. The RCII or older RC also great. Presses made to load 50BMG, pretty stout, certainly get you thru any reloading task possible. The Co-ax is a great press, but not as versatile as a solid top, O press.

Colorado4Wheel
05-13-2014, 13:25
If the Lee Classic Cast said RCBS on it rather then Lee it would be the go to press for people to recommend.

dkf
05-13-2014, 14:00
If $$$ is not really an issue I would buy the Forster Coax. If money is more of a concern I would go with the the Classic Cast Breech Lock. You can change dies very quickly on both presses without having to always be screwing dies in and out.

Or for the about the same $$$ as the Coax you could buy a Lee Classic Cast AND a Lee Classic Turret press. Use the Classic Cast for .300mag and the LCT for 10mm. Of course the LCT could be used to load both.

lightjunkie
05-14-2014, 00:01
Okay thanks this is a lot to take in since I am starting at ground zero but 8 sound like the Rock Chucker and Lee S's are the most recommended, also I was always told from what little I do know that screw in dies were supposed to be better for form fired riffle cases as you could adjust the height but I really do appreciate all the input.

fredj338
05-14-2014, 01:07
Okay thanks this is a lot to take in since I am starting at ground zero but 8 sound like the Rock Chucker and Lee S's are the most recommended, also I was always told from what little I do know that screw in dies were supposed to be better for form fired riffle cases as you could adjust the height but I really do appreciate all the input.
All dies screw into the press. If you use bushings, you are just screwing the die into the bushing. IMO, way too much is made out of the process of swapping dies. With lock rings, it takes seconds to unscrew one die & screw in another & snugged up, they never come loose. :dunno:

F106 Fan
05-14-2014, 07:30
Some lock rings clamp to the die, others use a setscrew. Once adjusted, the rings are secured to the die and the setting is easily duplicated when reinstalling the die.

Other lock rings, like the Dillon, don't have any kind of retention. The assumption is that the die is mounted to a toolhead, adjusted, and left installed forever.

http://www.dillonprecision.com/content/p/9/pid/24511/catid/4/Dillon_5_Pack_Die_Lock_Rings

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/452945/redding-die-locking-ring-7-8-14-thread

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1165236200/hornady-sure-loc-die-locking-ring-7-8-14-thread

The Redding lock ring has the setscrew perpendicular to the threads. There is a little piece of lead that impacts the threads so there is no damage. I like the Redding rings but that's probably because I like Redding rifle dies.

The Hornady lock ring has a couple of flats so it is pretty easy to use a wrench to snug the die.

Richard

fredj338
05-14-2014, 08:36
Some lock rings clamp to the die, others use a setscrew. Once adjusted, the rings are secured to the die and the setting is easily duplicated when reinstalling the die.

Other lock rings, like the Dillon, don't have any kind of retention. The assumption is that the die is mounted to a toolhead, adjusted, and left installed forever.

http://www.dillonprecision.com/content/p/9/pid/24511/catid/4/Dillon_5_Pack_Die_Lock_Rings

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/452945/redding-die-locking-ring-7-8-14-thread

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/1165236200/hornady-sure-loc-die-locking-ring-7-8-14-thread

The Redding lock ring has the setscrew perpendicular to the threads. There is a little piece of lead that impacts the threads so there is no damage. I like the Redding rings but that's probably because I like Redding rifle dies.

The Hornady lock ring has a couple of flats so it is pretty easy to use a wrench to snug the die.

Richard
Correct. I have replaced the crappy lee rings with Hornady for use on my ss press. You almost have to use the Dillon lock rings on their tool heads, but then they rarely every get removed.

dla
05-14-2014, 08:41
If the Lee Classic Cast said RCBS on it rather then Lee it would be the go to press for people to recommend.

Boy aint that the truth! The LCT is the BEST entry-level press for the $ - bar none. Yet there are Green fanboys still. I was a Green fanboy back in the 70's when RCBS was an innovator. But it is 2014 and RCBS has been left in the dust.

Just having my dies setup on that removable toolhead makes the LCT a better single-stage to me.

Colorado4Wheel
05-14-2014, 08:57
Storing dies in the Hornady bushings is s PITA.

WeeWilly
05-14-2014, 09:37
Boy aint that the truth! The LCT is the BEST entry-level press for the $ - bar none. Yet there are Green fanboys still. I was a Green fanboy back in the 70's when RCBS was an innovator. But it is 2014 and RCBS has been left in the dust.

Just having my dies setup on that removable toolhead makes the LCT a better single-stage to me.

I think the LCT might be the ideal entry level press for handgun use. Unfortunately, it is not ideal for heavy rifle case resizing.

unclebob
05-14-2014, 09:37
Storing dies in the Hornady bushings is s PITA.

For me that was the only down side. Then I found some Lock Lock plastic storage containers that work great for storing the dies. P-Touch labels on the outside of what dies are in the box..

http://shop.locknlock-usa.com/ll-standard-pp/94-square-short-food-container-36-cups.html

ess45
05-14-2014, 10:02
This is what I use.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k504/1911pistol/015.jpg (http://s1113.photobucket.com/user/1911pistol/media/015.jpg.html)

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/818965/forster-deluxe-3-die-storage-box-red?cm_vc=ProductFinding

Colorado4Wheel
05-14-2014, 10:07
I think the LCT might be the ideal entry level press for handgun use. Unfortunately, it is not ideal for heavy rifle case resizing.

Why? It has the same linkage as the Single Stage? Yes the toolhead floats but besides that it's the same.

WeeWilly
05-14-2014, 10:12
Why? It has the same linkage as the Single Stage? Yes the toolhead floats but besides that it's the same.

The heavy cases really tear up the turret plates. A buddy was using his for his 30-06 round and actually cracked the webbing out on his plate.

In addition, if you are trying to bump shoulders a precise amount, it is impossible with the LCT, just too sloppy, albeit perhaps something only precision shooters care about.

It is kind of the opposite problem as the Challenger press, the linkage is fine, but the press design (AL plates) isn't robust enough for really heavy work.

dla
05-14-2014, 11:16
The heavy cases really tear up the turret plates. A buddy was using his for his 30-06 round and actually cracked the webbing out on his plate.

In addition, if you are trying to bump shoulders a precise amount, it is impossible with the LCT, just too sloppy, albeit perhaps something only precision shooters care about.

It is kind of the opposite problem as the Challenger press, the linkage is fine, but the press design (AL plates) isn't robust enough for really heavy work.Mostly BS. The accuracy of the lct has been studied by Joe@realguns and found to be excellent. No idea about the cracks other than a bad casting.

dkf
05-14-2014, 11:20
I have done a small amount of sizing on my LCT. I don't have much confidence in it holding up to much heavy work. Sizing some .434 22 BHN bullets put a lot of strain on it. The weak point looks to me like the turret.

WeeWilly
05-14-2014, 11:33
Mostly BS. The accuracy of the lct has been studied by Joe@realguns and found to be excellent. No idea about the cracks other than a bad casting.

So do you size a lot of heavy rifle cases with your LCT?

Uncle Don
05-14-2014, 12:21
I actually do my sizing on the LCT, even though I have a Classic SS. The reason is laziness in not wanting to remove the dies from the turret. Properly lubed, I have not had any issues. I do use Collet dies which arguably requires more pressure than general sizing.

Though not a great deal, I do size 7.5x55 Swiss, 45-70, 375 Winchester and 400 Corbon (forming 45 ACP cases) using steel dies. The rest is either carbide sizers for handgun, or Collet sizing for other rifle.

I will agree though that the sizing of the larger cases would be better done on the SS Classic, it's just the LCT will do it. My last point is the turret movement. I don't worry about it because the turret moves upward, not canted. That small difference is necesary for the turret to move and is overcome with the die adjustment.

unclebob
05-14-2014, 12:31
As you can tell there are a lot of different options on what even a single stage press someone should get and us. Most of the options are based on what the poster uses and what they shoot. A person that shoots a lot of rifle my not be the best press for what the poster suggested that shoot very little rifle and mostly pistol. Or vice versa. Also there is a lot of difference in how much people shoot. A press that a person only shoots 50 rds. maybe a week is not the same for a person that shoots 500 or more a week. A personís bank account has a lot to do with it also. Or how much they can spend in reloading supplies. How much time does a person have to reload for the amount that they can or afford to shoot?
So based on what people have posted take a look and judge by how much you shoot of what Based on what people have suggested. LCT if you shoot very little rife to any 0 frame single stage press based on the features you like on the press. Also remember most people do not prime on the single stage press.

Taterhead
05-14-2014, 12:51
There are several good SS presses. That being said, I recommend the RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme Master reloading kit. They have several kits, but that is the specific one you want. The reason is that the other gear in that is wanted for what you want to do, and it is top quality. The scale is great, as are the Uniflow powder measure, priming tool and Speer manual. The only demerit is the spent primer catch. Youll sweep up the occasional spent primer, but that isn't more than a slight gripe for me.

They break even for 10mm will come quickly.

You may want another solution for case lubing the 300, but the included pad is fine. It works.

You'd need dies and shellholders plus calipers. Id recommend a powder tickler and case cleaner too. All of that would get you over the $300 threshold for the $50 RCBS rebate.

You'll run into the need to trim cases. Several solution from the cheap Lee trimmers up to electronic trimmers.

dla
05-14-2014, 13:00
So do you size a lot of heavy rifle cases with your LCT?

270W, 30-30, & 45-70

Not that it matters. The accuracy doesn't vary with the cartridge until you are deforming the press. And I have no idea how anybody would crack one of those toolhead castings, so I'm assuming it was bad from the factory.

Are you really trying to say that you don't get enough mechanical advantage to resize your particular case? Now that is possible as the LCT has less than a RockChucker. Some folks might not find the force required for the LCT to be to their liking.

WeeWilly
05-14-2014, 13:23
270W, 30-30, & 45-70

Not that it matters. The accuracy doesn't vary with the cartridge until you are deforming the press. And I have no idea how anybody would crack one of those toolhead castings, so I'm assuming it was bad from the factory.

Are you really trying to say that you don't get enough mechanical advantage to resize your particular case? Now that is possible as the LCT has less than a RockChucker. Some folks might not find the force required for the LCT to be to their liking.

Instead of reposting everything I said, none of which had anything to do with mechanical advantage, I will just leave it at this: we disagree on the suitability of a LCT for sizing large rifle cases, especially when it comes to trying to get repeatable shoulder bumps, which has everything to do with flex and nothing to do with mechanical advantage.

On the aluminum turret plate breaking, it very well could have been a bad casting, but then that really is what I am talking about, a flat piece of cast aluminum taking the direct stress of the ram upstroke.

But we are not going to convince each other. I loved my LCT when I had it, loading tens of thousands of handgun rounds on it. I don't recommend it for anyone for large rifle sizing, there are far better options.

Colorado4Wheel
05-14-2014, 13:31
I load 30-06 on my LCT. Not sure if we call that large or not. Sizing a properly lubed case its not like sizing bullets. I even lube my bullets before sizing. Why make life harder. LCT is fine for 30-06.

Colorado4Wheel
05-14-2014, 13:40
From a kit point of view I would just get the RCBS. Great price. Quality stuff.

fredj338
05-14-2014, 13:43
FWIW, 06 family case are NOT large rifle cases. When you get into the FL magnums & super magnums, you DO need a more robust press or you just wear you & the press out. Not to mention the smaller O presses have small windows that barely allow the case to fit, much less seat bullets on top.
I started with an RCBS jr, still have it. Then when I got into the bigger bore rounds, bought the Ammo Master, made for 50BMG. It has more than enough leverage for sizing any case, forming & now I use it for bullet swaging. Buy once, cry once. Even if you never need the mech'l advantage of the heavier press, it will make normal case sizing that much easier. The only downside is $$$. I can always make $$.

Colorado4Wheel
05-14-2014, 13:51
Well the RCBS won't do a 50GMT. But I would still get it over the Lee AS if your just starting out. The RCBS kit is excellent. Only other kit I like is the Kempf.

dla
05-14-2014, 14:12
FWIW, 06 family case are NOT large rifle cases. When you get into the FL magnums & super magnums, you DO need a more robust press or you just wear you & the press out. Not to mention the smaller O presses have small windows that barely allow the case to fit, much less seat bullets on top.
I started with an RCBS jr, still have it. Then when I got into the bigger bore rounds, bought the Ammo Master, made for 50BMG. It has more than enough leverage for sizing any case, forming & now I use it for bullet swaging. Buy once, cry once. Even if you never need the mech'l advantage of the heavier press, it will make normal case sizing that much easier. The only downside is $$$. I can always make $$.

And the 5's of people buying "super magnums" (whatever that is) must be keeping RCBS afloat, because LCT's sell like hotcakes and continually get rave reviews.

I will faithfully recommend the LCT to noobs until such day that a better entry-level press comes along. And I will discourage folks from wasting their money on a RockChucker. I own both and the LCT is light-years ahead of the Green boat anchor.

Colorado4Wheel
05-14-2014, 16:38
If I was to buy a SS it would NOT be the RCBS. I have no need for the RCBS kit and there are much nicer SS press available. Nothing wrong with the RCBS but it's just a basic SS. It's not terribly smooth, it doesn't have a long stroke (if I were ever to need it). It's just a good press. I think there are a ton of RCBS presses because so many people buy the RCBS kit when they first start loading. And as a KIT it is the best choice.

Taterhead
05-14-2014, 17:01
If I was to buy a SS it would NOT be the RCBS. I have no need for the RCBS kit and there are much nicer SS press available. Nothing wrong with the RCBS but it's just a basic SS. It's not terribly smooth, it doesn't have a long stroke (if I were ever to need it). It's just a good press. I think there are a ton of RCBS presses because so many people buy the RCBS kit when they first start loading. And as a KIT it is the best choice.

I think this is a great point. We could talk all day about this press or that. Someone starting out needs a lot of doodads to go with the press, and that kit has great stuff. I happen to also really like my Rock Chucker. I wouldnt recommend the other RCBS kits besides the master reloading kit.

fredj338
05-14-2014, 17:46
And the 5's of people buying "super magnums" (whatever that is) must be keeping RCBS afloat, because LCT's sell like hotcakes and continually get rave reviews.

I will faithfully recommend the LCT to noobs until such day that a better entry-level press comes along. And I will discourage folks from wasting their money on a RockChucker. I own both and the LCT is light-years ahead of the Green boat anchor.

Actually, a lot of people buy, shoot & reload for "super mags". That is anything bigger in case size than the 300winmag case size. All the RUM's, Wby, Lapua, etc. Just sayin, buy once, you never know where your shooting takes you. I have shot just about every form of firearms competition, hunted most size critters including Africa. I never intended to do any of that when I bought my first centerfire 40yrs ago.
The LCT is a good press for most applications. It can still be used if one goes in a diff direction. The OP was asking about SS presses, My recommendation is go big & hvy, no breechlock, for the most versatility. I hate unitasking tools.:dunno:

PEC-Memphis
05-14-2014, 21:19
I'm still pretty fascinated when I see the high-speed industrial-strength progressive presses in action; however, they're not for me. I like to watch each individual stage of the process and have total control over what's going on.

A progressive press may not be for you, and that is your choice. But don't mislead anyone, you can watch each stage and have "total control over what is going on" with a progressive. Each has their purpose and price points.

I loaded 1000's of rounds of 9mm on a single stage, but it wouldn't have been practical (for me) to keep up with (my limted) action pistol competition without a progressive. In fact, it may very well be more consistent because I can adjust each die and leave it "set", even when changing calibers; unlike a single stage where each die is has to be adjusted for each, and every, batch.

Taterhead
05-14-2014, 21:33
A progressive press may not be for you, and that is your choice. But don't mislead anyone, you can watch each stage and have "total control over what is going on" with a progressive. Each has their purpose and price points.

I loaded 1000's of rounds of 9mm on a single stage, but it wouldn't have been practical (for me) to keep up with (my limted) action pistol competition without a progressive. In fact, it may very well be more consistent because I can adjust each die and leave it "set", even when changing calibers; unlike a single stage where each die is has to be adjusted for each, and every, batch.

I agree with your post except for a small quibble with the need to adjust dies every batch. There are several ways to maintain die settings using set screws or something like Hornady bushings.

lightjunkie
05-15-2014, 00:27
Well I guess I'll have to put it this way I am on a fixed inncome, with that being said if I had to spend say 200.00$+- 50.00$ won't break me I love shooting m all my fire arms everything from my 9x19mm ,10mm,.243 winchester .270 Winchester and especially my .300 wby mag. So as I stated before I have plenty of free time now as a work accident permanently retired me, I guess what i am saying I would like the most bang for the buck and will spend a "COUPLE" extra dollar's to get what works well and would hold up well in a single stage reloader, but I do appreciate everything giving their honest opinion m

Kentguy
05-15-2014, 04:28
lightjunkie,

sorry to hear about your accident. Reloading is good therapy, keeps the mind active. I have always said the act of putting a bullet together is simple, but the science behind it... now that takes quite a bit of homework.

Not discounting all the other's advice (some really good points offered) however given your stated budget I would think "LEE" equipment might be the way to go for you.

Good luck in your choice.

thomas15
05-15-2014, 06:39
...... I think there are a ton of RCBS presses because so many people buy the RCBS kit when they first start loading. And as a KIT it is the best choice.

I started reloading about 6 months ago so this discussion is fresh in my memory. The RCBS kit was my choice and this after much thought and pondering. I don't regret the decision at all because the stuff in the kit is good quality. Since I load both rifle and pistol, it was a good starting point.

However, I might load (on a good week) 25 rifle rounds vs. 500 9mm so it didn't take long before the decision to add a turret press was made. If the new handloader is going to be loading pistol in quantity, they may wish to consider the LCT kit as a starting point because the RCBS kit contains the Uniflow Powder Measure with the rifle drum, not the pistol drum. So, add $40.00 to the RCBS kit to make it pistol friendly. But at this level, in my mind, the real decision is "do I spend less for Lee and get the ability to load pistol at a much faster rate but live with a scale and powder measure that isn't as nice as the RCBS which will have a higher cost"?

RCBS offers a starter kit with their turret press. I don't see it promoted very much, why I don't know, and the cost is of course higher than the RC kit. The rest of the components are the same. If a comparison between the Lee and RCBS kits are to be made, the comparison should, in my opinion, be between the LCT and the RCBS turret kit, not the RC kit.

But as others have mentioned, if I had it to do all over again, personally, I would go the purchase single components route. That would put a Redding T-7 press with the optional primer kit on my bench, the RCBS Uniflow with case activated powder drop and the Dillon Eliminator scale. For 9mm I have both the Lee and RCBS dies and while the Lee works, the RCBS works (for me) better. Also, RCBS, Lyman and Hornaday dies come with lock rings, missing on the Lee. The Lee handbook, which can be found on Amazon, is in my humble opinion the best book for the beginner. Lee pocket reamers and misc hand tools are less expensive than the others and work.

So looking back on my experience, I wanted to go the kit route because I didn't have any hands on experience with my particular ammo needs to be able to make an informed decision on which tools to get. It's not that I'm lazy, I just didn't know. But experince is a great teacher and this hobby is addicting so add-on tools will follow. I have a friend who jumped full force into reloading and bought a Dillon 650 with all the stuff. He has a huge amount of $$$ in just hardware and shoots 1/4 the amount that I do. His ammo isn't any better than mine, infact I have had less beginner problems than he had. But he wanted a Dillon and I cannot fault him for that at all.

Colorado4Wheel
05-15-2014, 06:46
However, I might load (on a good week) 25 rifle rounds vs. 500 9mm so it didn't take long before the decision to add a turret press was made. If the new handloader is going to be loading pistol in quantity, they may wish to consider the LCT kit as a starting point because the RCBS kit contains the Uniflow Powder Measure with the rifle drum, not the pistol drum. So, add $40.00 to the RCBS kit to make it pistol friendly. But at this level, in my mind, the real decision is "do I spend less for Lee and get the ability to load pistol at a much faster rate but live with a scale and powder measure that isn't as nice as the RCBS which will have a higher cost


Buy the Kempf kit and you avoid the crappy scale.

F106 Fan
05-15-2014, 10:31
Lee says the Classic Turret will reload cartridges up to 3.313" OAL and for longer cartridges, the turret will need to be manually advanced. The .300 Weatherby Magnum is longer than that: 3.562". I doubt that it a big deal one way or the other but it's worth knowing. OTOH, I have never even seen an LCT.

Cartridge Dimensions:
http://www.loaddata.com/members/search_detail.cfm?MetallicID=5356

Lee web page:
http://leeprecision.com/reloading-presses/turret-press/

Still, it gets down to intent. If the .300 WM is for hunting, it would be common to full-length resize. If it is for target, neck sizing is all that's required. Again, I don't know anything about the LCT but I think I would rather full-length resize on a heavy duty single stage press if for no other reason than mechanical advantage. I still have my RCBS MAX press (no longer manufactured) and it will resize a Peterbilt.

And volume... I guess we have been assuming that the 10mm volume is low. For a fact, I wouldn't want to load more than a couple of hundred rounds per month on a SS press. If the objective is for higher volumes, the LCT is a nice way to go. Whether it is useful for the .300 Weatherby Magnum, I don't know.

Richard

fredj338
05-15-2014, 13:16
Well I guess I'll have to put it this way I am on a fixed inncome, with that being said if I had to spend say 200.00$+- 50.00$ won't break me I love shooting m all my fire arms everything from my 9x19mm ,10mm,.243 winchester .270 Winchester and especially my .300 wby mag. So as I stated before I have plenty of free time now as a work accident permanently retired me, I guess what i am saying I would like the most bang for the buck and will spend a "COUPLE" extra dollar's to get what works well and would hold up well in a single stage reloader, but I do appreciate everything giving their honest opinion m
It always comes down to time vs $$. f you have a lot of time, then a ss press may be fine. You can crank 60rds/hr & not be hurrying. So if you only shoot 100rds a week, 2hrs reloading, no big deal. I shoot about 300rds a week, more if there are family along. Since I work, spending 5-6hr a week top make ammo sucks. A progressive makes sense to me.
The LCT is a good press. I probably would have bought one when I started loading a lot of pistol, but wasn't available. Instead I went 550B. You can too, or buy the BL550, use it as a ss press & then have the ability to go full progressive later for a nominal cost.

justhere
05-16-2014, 18:04
Looking in to getting into reloading my self are the lyman reloaders any good seen a few kits at basspro.

PEC-Memphis
05-16-2014, 22:40
I agree with your post except for a small quibble with the need to adjust dies every batch. There are several ways to maintain die settings using set screws or something like Hornady bushings.

Yes, you are correct. You can get pretty darned close by using collars with set screws; but not exactly. As far as powder drops, the 550/650 system is then most consistent unless you are a system that actually measures every charge; which isn't what you are using for high volume ammunition. If you are shooting BR, that is a completely different story.

For most pistol, and almost every rifle, there isn't a downside to a progressive except initial cost; precision rifle being the possible exception.

fredj338
05-17-2014, 19:58
A lot of shooters reload precision rifle on their progressives. It can be done.

unclebob
05-17-2014, 20:25
David Tubbs uses a modified 550.

ess45
05-18-2014, 08:43
If you are getting a beam scale. This gadget (Handy view) may be of use to you. No need to place the scale at eye level.

https://farm3.staticflickr.com/2910/14026580849_ce548e5e73_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/nntTNR)

Glock&Schpeel
05-18-2014, 11:42
I have a Dillon 550 that I use for handgun cartridges. I might consider it for .223/5.56 but nothing larger.

I had a Redding T7 Turret press which I recently sold for a Forster Co-Ax. I would have kept the T7 because it was great but I reached the point where I was needing a second wheel and I didn't want to get into that. A small reason I didn't like the T7 was the bullet puller I was using couldn't spin freely and kept hitting neighboring dies or the primer tube making it difficult to use.

Well the pullet puller is just as difficult to use on the Co-Ax so I didn't gain anything there, but I do like the quick change ability and the universal shell holder system on it and for that reason I like it a little better. You can't go wrong with either though.

A side advantage for me with Co-Ax is that now I can get into a new pistol caliber for $40 bucks or so. For instance . . . I bought my first (and probably only) 10mm (G20). It's way too time consuming to configure the Dillon from .40 to 10mm and I don't envision shooting the 10 enough to justify spending all of that money on a Dillon caliber change setup so I just bought a set of dies and I use the Co-Ax and do them single stage. Set your dies once with their locking rings and just pop them in and go. It's great!

F106 Fan
05-18-2014, 13:36
I have a Dillon 550 that I use for handgun cartridges. I might consider it for .223/5.56 but nothing larger.


I have loaded .308 on my 550B and Dillon lists the setup for .300 Weatherby Magnum (and .338 Lapua) so my guess is that the 550B will handle all of these large cartridges other than the .50 BMG.

As I pointed out before, there is no point in full-length resizing for a bolt action rifle unless, maybe it is for hunting.



A side advantage for me with Co-Ax is that now I can get into a new pistol caliber for $40 bucks or so. For instance . . . I bought my first (and probably only) 10mm (G20). It's way too time consuming to configure the Dillon from .40 to 10mm and I don't envision shooting the 10 enough to justify spending all of that money on a Dillon caliber change setup so I just bought a set of dies and I use the Co-Ax and do them single stage. Set your dies once with their locking rings and just pop them in and go. It's great!

Wouldn't the change from .40 to 10mm just involve the powder charge and the setting of the seating die? From Dillon, it's the same die set. Kind of like the difference between .38 SPL and .357 Mag (also the same die set from Dillon).

I would love to try the Co-Ax for precision rifle but I sure wouldn't want to use it for pistol. I have better things to do with my time than load pistol on a single stage press.

Richard

fredj338
05-18-2014, 15:45
. . . I bought my first (and probably only) 10mm (G20). It's way too time consuming to configure the Dillon from .40 to 10mm and I don't envision shooting the 10 enough to justify spending all of that money on a Dillon caliber change setup so I just bought a set of dies and I use the Co-Ax and do them single stage. Set your dies once with their locking rings and just pop them in and go. It's great!

Just buy an addl tool head, powder die & die set to go from 40-10. Just swap the powder funnel. With lee dies, not very costly, less than 100rds of factory 10mm?
I load 223 $ 308 on my 550, no issues.

Colorado4Wheel
05-18-2014, 15:49
Going from 10 to 40 involves adjusting the powder, seating and crimp dies. Or just a new toolhead. Not a huge expense.

lightjunkie
05-18-2014, 16:09
It always comes down to time vs $$. f you have a lot of time, then a ss press may be fine. You can crank 60rds/hr & not be hurrying. So if you only shoot 100rds a week, 2hrs reloading, no big deal. I shoot about 300rds a week, more if there are family along. Since I work, spending 5-6hr a week top make ammo sucks. A progressive makes sense to me.
The LCT is a good press. I probably would have bought one when I started loading a lot of pistol, but wasn't available. Instead I went 550B. You can too, or buy the BL550, use it as a ss press & then have the ability to go full progressive later for a nominal cost.
What and where could you recommend I get and LCT6 press and everything to started other than calipers or deburrer as I already have those Iam looking to try in get in next 6 weeks ?

Colorado4Wheel
05-18-2014, 16:12
READ my sticky. But Kempfs is the place.

SWThomas
05-21-2014, 21:47
Forster Co-Ax. Got one and love it.

lightjunkie
06-20-2014, 15:50
How about this one :Lee Precision Classic Turret kit set for 204.95 @ Amazon.com would it be good for my 9mm 10mm ,.243 winchester .270 Winchester and .300 Weatherby , would this be a good starter kit and a good price?

unclebob
06-20-2014, 17:10
How about this one :Lee Precision Classic Turret kit set for 204.95 @ Amazon.com would it be good for my 9mm 10mm ,.243 winchester .270 Winchester and .300 Weatherby , would this be a good starter kit and a good price?

I would go with the Kemp deal. Youíre not getting the Lee scale. Plus the powder measure is better suited for handgun reloading.

F106 Fan
06-20-2014, 17:10
How about this one :Lee Precision Classic Turret kit set for 204.95 @ Amazon.com would it be good for my 9mm 10mm ,.243 winchester .270 Winchester and .300 Weatherby , would this be a good starter kit and a good price?

The reason for recommending the Kempf kit, as opposed to every other kit, like whatever you found at Amazon, is that is DOESN'T include a scale but it has everything else. That way you can buy a decent scale elsewhere. Dillon comes to mind...

I don't see .300 Weatherby listed at Kempfs as an available caliber and I don't know why. Lee makes a die set so I suspect it is just an oversight. I would call Kempf and find out.

And select the Pro Audodisk upgrade
https://kempfgunshop.com//index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=shop.flypage&product_id=630&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=41&vmcchk=1&Itemid=41

It also appears that if you order the press for large rifle cartridges, it comes with a different powder measure (Perfect Powder Measure instead of Pro Auto Disk). This may be significant because it may be necessary to have both. It seems to me that the Perfect Powder Measure is not a press mounted measure but I don't really know that. You would also want to buy the Double Disk for the Auto Disk Pro if you want to load large cases.

You need to decide if you are going to fully resize your large rifle cases. For a bolt action target gun, this is not required nor desired. Therefore, any light weight press can handle the neck sizing. OTOH, I don't know how the light weight aluminum presses hold up to full length sizing 300 WM.

Were it me, I would be looking at a Rock Chucker something or other (some large cast iron press) for the large rifle cartridges and the Lee Classic Turret for pistol and smaller rifle cartridges like .223 and .308. I want the grunt of cast iron for the bigger cases and the speed of a turret press for the bulk ammo.

Then again, I have never even see the Lee press so what do I know? Maybe one of the regular users will chime it.

Richard

fredj338
06-20-2014, 17:16
I bought my first (and probably only) 10mm (G20). It's way too time consuming to configure the Dillon from .40 to 10mm and I don't envision shooting the 10 enough to justify spending all of that money on a Dillon caliber change setup so I just bought a set of dies and I use the Co-Ax and do them single stage. Set your dies once with their locking rings and just pop them in and go. It's great!
You don't need a 10mm conv. to go from 40. All you really need for changing over from 40 to 10mm is tool head, dies & powder thru. Just pop the 40 expander into the 10mm power thru. :dunno:

lightjunkie
06-21-2014, 00:23
Okay I saw the Kempf kit and it seems to have about everything a d again no .300 Weatherby mag I could ask but would that be an upgrade? The other reason I brought up Amazon is because I have a 200.00$ gift certificate with them , so I was hoping the Lee would fit the bill.

F106 Fan
06-21-2014, 07:29
Okay I saw the Kempf kit and it seems to have about everything a d again no .300 Weatherby mag I could ask but would that be an upgrade? The other reason I brought up Amazon is because I have a 200.00$ gift certificate with them , so I was hoping the Lee would fit the bill.

The Amazon kit doesn't include dies, which you will need to buy separately (on the order of $35/set), and it does include the scale which is not highly regarded. It also includes the Pro Auto Disk (according to the picture I looked at, you didn't provide a link) so that's out of the way.

You were going to want to buy a decent scale anyway so the only difference in price is the add for the dies minus the Pro Auto Disk upgrade ($15) at Kempf. If you are a Prime member at Amazon, shipping is free. I'm not sure about Kempf.

So, sure, why not buy from Amazon? It seems to me the cost is about a wash and the gift card sweetens the deal at Amazon.

There will be some miscellaneous details to work out. Day one, I would concentrate on my highest volume cartridge (hopefully a pistol cartridge). Once I had that working, I would move to another cartridge and, personally, I would put that 300 Weatherby on the slow track.

I don't know what modifications will be necessary to reload that cartridge. Apparently you need another disk for the Pro Auto Disk or you need a completely separate powder measure. Then again, I would be individually weighing charges for a cartridge like that. I would probably charge the case off-press. You can disable the auto indexing of the LCT and use it like a single stage press when working on more precise ammo. That is, charging off-press, etc.

I am still not convinced that the LCT is a good choice for full length resizing of magnum rifle cases. I guess there's one way to find out. If it doesn't work out, look around for a decent cast iron single stage. It is unlikely that the volume of .300 Weatherby is really going to warrant a progressive press. You will be able to make about 50 rounds per hour on a pure single stage press and that's a lot for rifle. OTOH, 50 rounds is meaningless for pistol.

Richard

blastfact
06-21-2014, 13:30
lightjunkie

A bit of a pictorial story.

I had been out of the shooting sports for many years. I didn't have a lot of money to spend on the adventure.

My first bench after 10 years of not shooting or reloading. And I was darn happy to have it.
http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/638/medium/S7300229.jpg
11-16-09

A buddy of mine shows up with this lot on 11-23-09. A CZ-52 to welcome back to shooting. A older Lee Kit with .38/.357 dies that had never been used. And a old and complete Mec loader. ( missing Mec parts are in a box to the side )
http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/638/medium/S7300250.JPG

By 11-30-09 the little bench has a new top and shelve with the new gifted Lee kit installed.
http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/638/medium/S7300353.JPG

By 02-26-11 I had my LCT purchased from Kempf's Gun Shop and was loading 4 calibers on it.
http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/638/medium/bench3.jpg

And that brings me too today 06-21-14. I load 7.62x25, .38, .357, .380, 9mm, .357 Sig, 10mm, .45acp, .223/5.56, 7.62x39. All loaded on the LCT with complete turrets. Caliber change is seconds.
http://www.cleanmpg.com/photos/data/638/medium/bench062114.jpg

The one thing that will change down the road will be replacing the older Lee SS with a Lee Classic Cast SS. I myself will not load anything larger than 30-06 on my LCT. Others can do as they please. It is a wonderful press. But the large rifle stuff, naw, aint going to happen on mine. That's where the Lee Classic Cast comes into the game. And I'm sure that will involve the bench needing to be fastened to the floor and wall.

I know things are tough when you have a limited amount of money to work with. And being on a fixed income really does slow one down in getting there toys,,,, excuse me, tools.

If there is anyway at all you could swing it. I would get either a RCBS Kit as mentioned. Or bite the bullet and get a Lee Classic Cast SS and a LCT Kit. And then fill in the other tools as money allows. Believe me. While you have time on your hands you will thank yourself for getting the LCT for pistol and small rifle down the road.

IMHO the most important tool a loader can have is a set of check weights. They keep the scales and user honest.

fredj338
06-21-2014, 17:36
I would go with the Kemp deal. Youíre not getting the Lee scale. Plus the powder measure is better suited for handgun reloading.

^^This^^

RonS
06-22-2014, 17:58
Much as I love Lee, I have to agree on the lock rings. I would not hesitate to buy more Lee dies, but I am going to find a source of reasonably priced replacement lock rings.

I use my turret press as a single stage but I have it set up for .308, .44m, .357m, .45acp and 9mm with turrets for each. That is probably more important to me for five calibers than it would be for you to load two. I just like not having to adjust anything, pop in the turret and load. I'm in the process of setting up each set with it's own powder measure which will make it even more convenient.

lightjunkie
06-22-2014, 20:59
Talk about overwhelming, I hate to even ask about what kind loads to use ie, powders charges ,primers, brass, projectiles all being said, I have budgeted to spend the money if need be to go with the Kempf ' s setup ,I just don't know what die to get and if worse case scenario I'll get the one from Amazon.

F106 Fan
06-23-2014, 06:46
Talk about overwhelming, I hate to even ask about what kind loads to use ie, powders charges ,primers, brass, projectiles all being said, I have budgeted to spend the money if need be to go with the Kempf ' s setup ,I just don't know what die to get and if worse case scenario I'll get the one from Amazon.

If you buy the Kempf kit, it will come with Lee dies for one caliber. Either way works and the cost is about a wash. Amazon includes a scale but no dies, Kempf realizes the scale is sub-optimal and includes dies instead. Either way, you need to buy a decent scale.

There are other essentials: Ballistic hammer, check weights, scale (if you buy the Kempf kit, you need to buy a scale separately), calipers, case gauges (an item of considerable debate but absolutely essential for rifle cartridges), case lube (Hornady One Shot for pistol, Dillon spray lube for rifle), tumbler & media, Dillon polish, loading manuals (Hornady, Speer AND Sierra) and the list goes on and on. Hopefully I hit the highlights.

You picked a really bad time to start reloading! Powder is all but non-existent, primers are difficult to get and bullets are just barely coming back in stock.

Pick your first caliber (the one you ordered dies for) and get some powder recommendations. There will usually be a list of several to choose from but they might vary by caliber and load type (full power vs target). Then try your LGS and see what they have. It won't be much and they certainly won't have every type but you might be able to score a pound or two of something. You can load 1200+ rounds of pistol with a pound of powder (usually).

If you can score powder, then see if the LGS has primers. You probably won't get the best price but you will be lucky to get any supplies at all. Then you can order bullets (although you will have to select bullets before you can discuss powder (usually)).

You can check gunbot.net and if you find something useful (and I see a LOT of primers this morning), order a bunch. There is a $27.50 HazMat fee on the shipment of primers and powder so you need to buy in bulk. Typical orders are 10k or primers (or more) and 8# of powder (or more). That is the only way you can get the price of reloading down to the point it is worth doing. Otherwise, buy from you LGS in smaller quantities and realize that you won't be getting the best price.

Try Montana Gold, Precison Delta, S&S Casting (lead bullets) and TJConevera for bullets.

This isn't a pretty process right now. In my view it won't be easy to get components for the next 10 years but I'm an optimist. I don't know who is coming after Hillary...

Richard

thomas15
06-23-2014, 07:40
Talk about overwhelming, I hate to even ask about what kind loads to use ie, powders charges ,primers, brass, projectiles all being said, I have budgeted to spend the money if need be to go with the Kempf ' s setup ,I just don't know what die to get and if worse case scenario I'll get the one from Amazon.

lightjunkie, a word about purchasing smokeless powders. It is true that powder is in short supply, especally pistol powders. One of the big problems facing new handloaders is coming up with a workable load. This is hard enough if you have data available and a wide selection of powders. But alas, we buy powder based on availability not the available data.

If you go with a Lee kit it should come with the Lee book which lists many loads. In any event you need to own a reloading manual or two. All of the powder suppliers publish data also.

I started handloading in Feb of this year. I received my kit for Christmas and Lee dies and purchased 1 pound each of Tightgroup, Accurate #2 and Power Pistol powders, all from my LGS. The data sheet included in the Lee die set for 9mm listed loads using these powders and my LGS had some on the shelf. What you can do is research your calibers and make a list of powders that will work. I carry a list with me at all times so if I see powder, I check to see if it will work for me.

Getting back to powder availability. I'm in NE Pennsylvania. This is a very gun friendly area surrounded my gun restrictive states such as NY and NJ. I know people from NJ that shop in PA because it is easier than NJ. Anyway, I know powder is hard to find but since the beginning of the year I have purchased a total of 38 pounds of pistol/shotgun powder locally. It isn't easy but it is possible. Among my purchases: Tightgroup, WST, AA#2, Power Pistol, American Select, AutoComp, SR4756, SR7625 and CFE. All of this was purchased in small LGS, not big-box stores. The smaller the LGS, the better chance of getting some in my experience.

My advice is get the Lee die sets but purchase the Hornday lockrings. You can get good inexpensive calipers from Harbor Freight. The other stuff has been mentioned. Plated bullets (for your 10mm) are cheaper than FMJ. Primers are generally available now.

The biggest problem I have had as a new handloader is getting the dies set properly and getting the crimp right. I have loaded 5000+ rounds of 9mm and I'm on the verge of going back to square 1 on setting my dies up.

Colorado4Wheel
06-23-2014, 13:09
Talk about overwhelming, I hate to even ask about what kind loads to use ie, powders charges ,primers, brass, projectiles all being said, I have budgeted to spend the money if need be to go with the Kempf ' s setup ,I just don't know what die to get and if worse case scenario I'll get the one from Amazon.


Keep it simple. Follow my directions in the Sticky above. Kempf Kit Deluxe Style, Dillon Beam Scale, Lyman manual, Brass you got, Find some mid weight bullets for your caliber, Get a medium speed powder (in and around the Unique range), Any Pistol Primers thats the right one for your caliber. That should get it done. :wavey:

lightjunkie
08-12-2014, 23:55
Okay I know this will probably stirup the hornets nest and I'll probablyb hear alot of " you should of got thisor got that" but I went with the Lee 50th anniversary breech lockon system, and please hear me out, I have a friend qho on went to my church who told me he had the Lee breach lock single stage press and if I bought my own dies I could use his press anytime which for me was a nobrainer.aNo I In need go find some decent loads to start on my Glock stock 20 and my .300Weatherby in Remington 700. BUT THAN YOU ALL for your input and knowledge.

thomas15
08-13-2014, 06:46
Okay I know this will probably stirup the hornets nest and I'll probablyb hear alot of " you should of got thisor got that" but I went with the Lee 50th anniversary breech lockon system, and please hear me out, I have a friend qho on went to my church who told me he had the Lee breach lock single stage press and if I bought my own dies I could use his press anytime which for me was a nobrainer.aNo I In need go find some decent loads to start on my Glock stock 20 and my .300Weatherby in Remington 700. BUT THAN YOU ALL for your input and knowledge.

Actually, I think I speak for most here when I say that I wish you good luck and hope you enjoy handloading with the gear you have. Your gear will load excellent ammo if you do your part.

Personally, I'm going to load somewhere between 6-7 thousand rounds of 9mm for use in the upcoming winter. My garage is not heated and time being an issue, I want to have plenty for thursday night indoor pistol shooting. I'm going to do this on my RCBS turret press.

Right now, I have 8K brass tumbled, 3K of that is sized, primed and flaired. I'm going to keep sizing and priming brass until I have 8K completed. Then I'm going to start the actual reloading process. In the by and by, I've gathered together 7500 115g plated bullets, 4000 other size 9mm bullets, 12K primers, and I have a bit more dirty brass and plenty of powder to play with.

While doing this,I also need to produce ammo for right now. I have the supplies on hand, just need to the time to do it. Also, for my winter loads, I haven't finished testing different loads to convince myself that what I have will be the load that I want to have 7K rounds on hand. So I'm working on this also. The amount of stuff I have in my garage related to handloading, which I have been doing for a mere 7 months now, is staggering.

My whole point here is that some of the guys at my club are trying their hardest to convince me to get a Dillon progressive. I would like to have a progressive press, sure, but I'm not ready to cut the check. And most likely, when I do get ready to spend the money, I will probably get the Hornday progressive.

But before I get another press, I really want a second fish finder for the bow of my boat. That's the next thing on my wish list.

unclebob
08-13-2014, 07:43
My whole point here is that some of the guys at my club are trying their hardest to convince me to get a Dillon progressive. I would like to have a progressive press, sure, but I'm not ready to cut the check. And most likely, when I do get ready to spend the money, I will probably get the Hornday progressive.

You need to listen to your friends at your club.

Uncle Don
08-13-2014, 07:51
Okay I know this will probably stirup the hornets nest and I'll probablyb hear alot of " you should of got thisor got that" but I went with the Lee 50th anniversary breech lockon system, and please hear me out, I have a friend qho on went to my church who told me he had the Lee breach lock single stage press and if I bought my own dies I could use his press anytime which for me was a nobrainer.aNo I In need go find some decent loads to start on my Glock stock 20 and my .300Weatherby in Remington 700. BUT THAN YOU ALL for your input and knowledge.

Don't feel as though you have to somehow apologize for a choice. This is right for you, Dillon for others. I encourage you not to allow anyone to make you feel that you should fear "a hornets nest" or that your decisions are any less valid than anyone else's.

As Eleanor Roosevelt (even though I'm a die hard conservative) said, "no one can make you feel inferior without your consent". If I've misinterpreted you're post, I apologize.

WeeWilly
08-13-2014, 09:20
Many, many people start their loading on a Lee Breech Lock Challenger kit. It should get the job done for quite a while. If you end up going with a heavier, more complex press down the road, hang on to that press and the bushings, it makes a terrific "misc" operations press, after you have collected a bunch of specialty dies.

When you get into heavier sizing work like with those 300 Weatherby's, etc., the weak spot on the press is the toggles in the linkage. They can crack on the top of the drum portion of the toggle. If that happens, Lee will usually replace them free of charge. If you happen to get rejected on the warranty replacement request, they are pretty cheap to buy, install very easily and get you back up and running in no time. Just FYI.

Good luck and have fun with he new hobby.

PS - I have found with the Breech Lock bushing setup, if you clock the bushing around 120 degrees from where the notch would be sitting square, the bushing will sit tighter in the press. I have never seen a B/L press where the bushing would be tight in the press when the notch and button are lined up. Not a big deal, just give it a try and see if you like it better than the way the instructions say to install the bushings.

lightjunkie
08-13-2014, 10:10
Thanks , any one have any decent loads for 155 great 10mm in glock 20? I know I have to be careful because the Chamber isn't fully supported. I would like some decent velocity but nothing that may risk a kaboom or sacrifice accuracy.

Colorado4Wheel
08-13-2014, 10:43
10mm is not a difficult our dangerous cartridge to load. I have run plenty of full power loads in mine. Don't be afraid. Bit mid power loads are plenty strong.

F106 Fan
08-13-2014, 11:27
While doing this,I also need to produce ammo for right now. I have the supplies on hand, just need to the time to do it. Also, for my winter loads, I haven't finished testing different loads to convince myself that what I have will be the load that I want to have 7K rounds on hand. So I'm working on this also. The amount of stuff I have in my garage related to handloading, which I have been doing for a mere 7 months now, is staggering.


I seldom load more than a couple of thousand rounds at a time and for new loads it is far less. I don't want to find out that I really hate a load that now fills several ammo cans.



My whole point here is that some of the guys at my club are trying their hardest to convince me to get a Dillon progressive. I would like to have a progressive press, sure, but I'm not ready to cut the check. And most likely, when I do get ready to spend the money, I will probably get the Hornday progressive.



Like most reloaders, I started out with a single stage press which I still have. I wanted to shoot IPSC and that would take a few hundred rounds per week. There is simply not enough time to work for a living and crank out that much ammo on a SS press. At the time I was trickle charging the cases and, at best, I could load about 50 rounds per hour.

I moved up to a Ponsness-Warren turret press which is much like the RCBS turret press. It is actually far better for pistol because the mechanism isn't built for rifle and the handle stroke is much shorter. I used an RCBS Lil Dandy powder measure and things got much better. It's a really nice press.

HOWEVER, as nice as the PW press is, it is nowhere near as fast as a Dillon 550 and, over time, I wound up with a 450 (my first Dilloon) and a pair of 550s (one for large primer .45 ACP and one for small primer .38 wadcutter). Things were looking up!

And then RCBS introduced the "Green Machine" and my .45 ACP output skyrocketed. That machine, coupled to a Dillon case feeder, is every bit as fast as the 1050. Unfortunately, the machine is no longer available.

As to Hornady "Red" versus Dillon "Blue": most of the folks around here are guzzling the Blue Kool-Aid. With good reason, I might add!

Richard

F106 Fan
08-13-2014, 11:39
Okay I know this will probably stirup the hornets nest and I'll probablyb hear alot of " you should of got thisor got that" but I went with the Lee 50th anniversary breech lockon system, and please hear me out, I have a friend qho on went to my church who told me he had the Lee breach lock single stage press and if I bought my own dies I could use his press anytime which for me was a nobrainer.aNo I In need go find some decent loads to start on my Glock stock 20 and my .300Weatherby in Remington 700. BUT THAN YOU ALL for your input and knowledge.

No hornet's nest...

If I were loading 300 Weatherby, I would use either a SS press or my Redding T7 turret press (just a pumped up SS press). I would try to make the ammo as precise as I could. This is exactly the way I load my .308 precision ammo. But, 100 rounds of rifle ammo goes a long way. I might only shoot 25-30 rounds per trip to the range.

I wouldn't choose to load pistol ammo on a SS press if there was any volume at all. With 3 of us shooting, we can unload more in a minute than can be reloaded on a SS press in an hour. It's the same story for .223 and the ARs.

HOWEVER, it's a place to start. It may turn out that, over time, a second press shows up. It has certainly worked that way for most of us. We started with a SS press, realized that the volume expected for pistol was incompatible and moved up. But every one of us still has a SS press somewhere. I have two of them! One of them, an RCBS MAX, will resize a Volkswagen.

Richard

WeeWilly
08-13-2014, 12:29
Thanks , any one have any decent loads for 155 great 10mm in glock 20? I know I have to be careful because the Chamber isn't fully supported. I would like some decent velocity but nothing that may risk a kaboom or sacrifice accuracy.

Any powder or bullet manufacturer published data for the bullet you want to load will be perfectly safe in your stock Glock 20. Max loads from Hodgdon, Alliant, Hornaday, Speer, etc. will be VERY hot pistol loads but perfectly safe in your gun.

As CO4W states, mid range book loads are very stout and will work great, but anything published by a powder or bullet manufacturer will work fine in the G20.

lightjunkie
08-13-2014, 12:52
Thanks Iam just happy to get my feet wet after all these years and as it is now I have alot of down time being medically retired , I have taken up modding and upgrading cheap chinese flashlights I now am glad to be able to start rolling my own after over 20 years of trying .

PEC-Memphis
08-13-2014, 16:38
HOWEVER, as nice as the PW press is, it is nowhere near as fast as a Dillon 550 and, over time, I wound up with a 450 (my first Dilloon) and a pair of 550s (one for large primer .45 ACP and one for small primer .38 wadcutter). Things were looking up!

And then RCBS introduced the "Green Machine" and my .45 ACP output skyrocketed. That machine, coupled to a Dillon case feeder, is every bit as fast as the 1050. Unfortunately, the machine is no longer available.

Richard,

Do you have a case feeder for either of the 550's? I am considering getting one.

If you do, how much does not increase speed (I would imagine quite abit, because you can keep your hand on the handle).

How about noise?

How about reliability?

Will one work for all pistol cartridges?

fredj338
08-13-2014, 17:41
Having run a 550 for 25yrs, pass on the case feeder. It will speed you up for sure, when it is working well. Every caliber change will require tweaking to get it running & keep it running. This negates any speed advantage IMO. The 550 is simple, what makes it such a great tool. You can easily get 400-500rds per hour. A case feeder might get you to 600 sustained. If you want a case feeder, get a 650. It was designed to run exclusively with the feeder & runs very well.

F106 Fan
08-13-2014, 18:30
I'm with Fred. The Dillon case feeder for the 550 is an add-on, not a design-in as it is on the 650 and 1050. I don't know how well it works but since I have both the 650 and 1050, I don't really care. I'm not currently using my 550s but they are available for oddball calibers if that should come up.

Richard

lightjunkie
08-14-2014, 23:23
Wow I got my carbide lee dies , quick. Change bushings, case trimmers and my buddy has everything else , I went let to buy powder and projectiles and no one in Tucson had anything I could use wow !

Calidan
08-20-2014, 16:32
Look on E-BAY, you can buy used or new and you won't beat the prices ! Most any press you want (RCBS Rock Crusher, Lee ,Dillon)
Progressive or single stage ,Scales of all kinds. Practically any reloading equipment you would ever need is available. The trick is winning the bid ! GOOD LUCK

unclebob
08-20-2014, 17:25
Look on E-BAY, you can buy used or new and you won't beat the prices !

I have found in about 98% of the time you can buy a brand new one for less than in most cases they want a new one for. Especially after you throw in there stupid shipping charges.
I have seen and posted on here, people selling stuff from Dillon that you can get for free from them and no shipping charges.

F106 Fan
08-20-2014, 17:58
Wow I got my carbide lee dies , quick. Change bushings, case trimmers and my buddy has everything else , I went let to buy powder and projectiles and no one in Tucson had anything I could use wow !

Welcome to reloading! Powder is VERY difficult to get. Primers are somewhat more available and bullets 'should' be pretty easy to find. Especially pistol bullets.

You need to make a shopping list of all candidate powders. You won't get the powder you want but you might get something.

Visit the powder manufacturers web sites, wander through reloading manuals, whatever, just get a list of possible powders before you go shopping.

Richard

lightjunkie
08-20-2014, 19:21
disguise anyhow it's a learning experience I just go to a two hour class at Sportsmans Warehouse on reloading some pretty interesting stuff how to use the gun barrel in chamber as a gauge

lightjunkie
09-30-2014, 22:11
Well I haven't been able to get together with my buddy who said I could use his Lee single stage anytime
So I shamelessly sold flashlights, saved and recycled anything sellable , and ordered and received today my Lee breechlock Challenger kit , although many said to get the Lee classic cast iron vs the Challenger aluminum press it was either the Challenger or nothing,.I feel better than a kid at Christmas getting a new bike All I can say is thank you Lord I have wanted to reload since I was a teenager and thank you all for pointing me in the direction.

ChrisJn
10-01-2014, 02:40
Wow I got my carbide lee dies , quick. Change bushings, case trimmers and my buddy has everything else , I went let to buy powder and projectiles and no one in Tucson had anything I could use wow !

http://www.xtremebullets.com/dealoftheday.asp?utm_source=eBlast&utm_medium=email&utm_content=10-40-155-RNFP-p&utm_campaign=weekly

Uncle Don
10-01-2014, 04:32
Well I haven't been able to get together with my buddy who said I could use his Lee single stage anytime
So I shamelessly sold flashlights, saved and recycled anything sellable , and ordered and received today my Lee breechlock Challenger kit , although many said to get the Lee classic cast iron vs the Challenger aluminum press it was either the Challenger or nothing,.I feel better than a kid at Christmas getting a new bike All I can say is thank you Lord I have wanted to reload since I was a teenager and thank you all for pointing me in the direction.

Someone that excited to get into this hobby is nice to read. Enjoy - it isn't as magical as portrayed at times. Ask when not sure and follow the book. I remember starting and thinking about how therapeutic and rewarding it was (still is). Have fun and enjoy the fruits of your labor.

smokey45
10-01-2014, 05:24
Well I haven't been able to get together with my buddy who said I could use his Lee single stage anytime
So I shamelessly sold flashlights, saved and recycled anything sellable , and ordered and received today my Lee breechlock Challenger kit , although many said to get the Lee classic cast iron vs the Challenger aluminum press it was either the Challenger or nothing,.I feel better than a kid at Christmas getting a new bike All I can say is thank you Lord I have wanted to reload since I was a teenager and thank you all for pointing me in the direction.

It's great to see someone so excited about getting into reloading! Reminds me of myself back in the 60s when I got my first Lee Classic Reloader.
s45

lightjunkie
10-01-2014, 09:01
Well so far I stayed up until midnight sizing and de priming about 100 10mm cases, and I woke up early to work/play some more

Colorado4Wheel
10-01-2014, 09:54
Very nice. Congratulations. Enjoy the press and your new hobby.

WeeWilly
10-01-2014, 10:29
Well so far I stayed up until midnight sizing and de priming about 100 10mm cases, and I woke up early to work/play some more

10mm just got a lot cheaper to shoot, congratulations.

GLOCK45 460
10-01-2014, 10:38
Just my opinion but after 35 years of reloading RCBS is still the best bang for the Buck. I use a Rock Chucker to decap and seat bullets and a RCBS turret for everything else. Both presses have a lot of miles on them and are still tight and still do a fine job. Their carbide dies are second to none and I own dies from just about every manufacturer.

lightjunkie
10-01-2014, 12:22
Glock 45-60 the only reason I went with the Lee Challenger, was because it was literally the only one I could afford, I have nothing against RCBS , in fact when you look at my original post I wanted to get the RCBS rock chucker but I couldn't afford it.

dkf
10-01-2014, 12:48
A lot of this stuff is personal preference. Frankly I think RCBS dies are kinda crappy. From weak decapping pins, to poorly designed seating dies, to next to worthless lock rings.)that little screw don't hold squat) I much prefer the Lee dies over RCBS.

I plan to pick up a Lee classic cast SS for boolit work.

Uncle Don
10-01-2014, 14:13
Glock 45-60 the only reason I went with the Lee Challenger, was because it was literally the only one I could afford, I have nothing against RCBS , in fact when you look at my original post I wanted to get the RCBS rock chucker but I couldn't afford it.

You are going to be fine with what you have. Any color will work fine and some people are more specific to it. In your case, you have a press that is five times stronger than it needs to be. The Rock Chucker (I had one once) is 10 times stronger. If I recall, your press is a breech lock which means that when you can afford it, you can buy the bushings for your dies allowing them to just be placed and locked in instead of needing to thread them in.

In my own case, I loaded nearly 30,000 rounds (I keep track) on one of the original Challenger presses in the mid 80s. It never wore out, I just switched to something different. Today, I have a Lee Classic Cast single stage and LCT and both will last until I decide to stop loading. That said - if you want a Rockchucker someday, buy one, but I suspect you'll find that it isn't necessary.

Colorado4Wheel
10-01-2014, 15:58
I agree with Uncle Don. That press is more then enough to load any pistol cartridge. And on top of it all it has the very useful breach lock system.

lightjunkie
10-01-2014, 23:42
I did buy some breechlock bushings prior to the press kit I think what I am worried about is trying to re-sizing my .300Weatherby shells that is where all the controversy started over the aluminum challenger press over the classic or RCBS, but Iam extremely happy to get my feet wet .