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MCNETT
08-25-2003, 20:11
Use this thread to post your Alliant powder data.

MCNETT
08-25-2003, 20:12
I had a chance to get out and chrono some loads that I had worked up. These were all 1.26"OAL Win LP primers and Starline cases. Temp 90F elev 5000ft.

G20C:

13.5gr 2400 180FP - 1109fps
7.3gr Power Pistol 220FP - 1028fps
11.0gr 800X 165 Sierra JHP - 1380fps

6"KKM:

13.5gr 2400 180FP - 1240fps
7.4gr PP 220 west coast FP - 1141fps
7.3gr PP 220 Precision FP - 1162fps
9.2gr PP 180 Lead FP - 1366fps
13.0gr STEEL 200WFN lead - 1274fps
13.5gr STEEL 200WFN lead - 1255fps?
12.0gr STEEL 220 Precision - 933fps
12.5gr STEEL 220 Precision - 1141fps
12.0gr 2400 200XTP - 1106fps
12.5gr 2400 200XTP - 1147fps (compressed HP)
13.5gr 2400 200XTP - 1194fps (closed HP)
13.5gr 2400 200WFN - 1242fps
14.5gr 2400 200WFN - 1304fps
11.0gr 2400 220 Precision - 1072fps
11.5gr 2400 220 Precision - 1106fps (deformed)

G29:

13.5gr 2400 180FP - 1051fps
7.3gr PP 220 West Coast - 1007fps
11.0gr 800X 165 Sierra JHP - 1366fps

This is slightly tainted data. The primers were Win non-magnum. I usually use CCI 350 MAG primers. I believe especially with the STEEL loads that it produced inconsistent ignition causing sad chrono readings. This test drives the point home," IF YOU ARE GOING TO USE SLOW POWDERS IN THE 10MM, USE MAGNUM PRIMERS, PLEASE!" I had a lot of fun shooting these, but I am definitely using CCI 350's next time.

MCNETT
08-25-2003, 20:23
All handloads are 1.26"OAL CCI LP MAG primers avg. 5 shots use caution PLEASE! From my stock G29.

180 West Coast FP 9.2 PP - 1152fps
180XTP 11.0 Blue Dot - 1167fps
180 GDHP 11.8 BD - 1257fps
135 Nosler JHP 10.5 PP - 1297fps
220 West Coast FP 10.0 BD - 1162fps (hot)

PLEASE drop all of my loads by 2.0gr and work up in .5gr increments until pressure signs raise their ugly head, then back off by .5gr! Hope this helps.
-Mike

MCNETT
08-25-2003, 20:31
Here are a couple of the results from the 10"T/C:
AVG 10 shots Starline cases, CCI 350, 1.26" OAL

200XTP 11.2gr BD - 1566fps 38,600psi

MCNETT
08-25-2003, 20:35
1/8/01 - Went to the range with my first ever loadings of the 220gr. precision bullet in my 10mm. For starters, my G20C is equipped with 22lb spring and a 6" KKM bbl. I had no loading info, so this load started as a WAG (wild ass guess)! COL was 1.26in, CCI Large Pistol Magnum primers, once fired Starline brass, and Precision 220gr bullets over 10.0gr of Blue Dot.
5 shot avg. was 1192fps!
No signs of overpressure, 25F cold, cold, cold, elev 2500ft.
This load was shot through my aftermarket bbl, please don't fire this load through your stock bbl. I will work up a load with AA#9 and I will try to improve on this Blue Dot load as well.

Using just a little bit more Blue Dot under my 220's and shooting indoors @ 72f vs. sub 20 degree weather made a HUGE difference. I lengthened the OAL to 1.27in.
Here are my results:
5 shots 6"KKM BBL
1351
1318
1361
1343
1354
AVG=1345fps and 884 ft/lbs!!
No sign of over pressure, but you had better bell out the inside deep or the case will bulge enough to impede reliability in the KKM. The stock bbl. feeds them with or without the bulge.

Here's the wrap-up on the chrono testing the 220's 6"KKM:
Precision 220gr 8.8gr Blue Dot
5 shot avg. 1187fps nice manageable load
G20C stock bbl:986fps

6" KKM:
9.9 Blue Dot 220 Precision 1261fps
same load w/ West Coast 220: 1233fps

6.9 Power Pistol/ Precision 220: 1068fps
same w/ West Coast: 1042fps

All velocities are an avg. of 5 shots over my chrono. The temp was 30f and elevation was 5800ft. OAL was 1.26".

10.0gr Blue Dot WC220 - 1285fps 6"KKM
10.0gr Blue Dot PB220 - 1318fps 6"KKM
10.0gr Blue Dot PB220 - 1219fps G20
10.0gr Blue Dot WC220 - 1115fps G29 65F

10.5gr STEEL PB220 - 1226fps 6"KKM
11.0gr STEEL PB220 - 1257fps 6"KKM
11.5gr STEEL PB220 - 1291fps 6"KKM
12.0gr STEEL PB220 - 1301fps 6"KKM
7.3gr Power Pistol WC220 - 1007fps G29 85F ??? faster than G20C
7.3gr Power Pistol WC220 - 997fps G20C 85F
7.3gr Power Pistol WC220 - 1149fps 6"KKM 85F
7.3gr Power Pistol PB220 - 1200fps 6"KMM 85
8.0gr Power Pistol PB220 - 1149fps G20 WARM 55F
8.0gr Power Pistol PB220 - 1101fps G29 70F
11.0gr 2400 PB220 - 1072fps 6"KKM 85F
11.5gr 2400 PB220 - 1101fps 6"KKM 85F

Hope this helps all of you that are working up loads with 220gr bullets!

MCNETT
09-23-2003, 14:42
1.26" OAL CCI 350 primers 45F 5000ft elev:
155gr GDHP 11.8gr Blue Dot - 1264fps (G20C)
155gr GDHP 9.9gr Power Pistol - 1420fps (6"KKM)
155gr GDHP 12.8gr Blue Dot - 1451fps (6"KKM)
155gr GDHP 14.7gr 2400 - 1356fp (6"KKM)
155gr GDHP 12.8gr Blue Dot - 1305fps (G20C)
155gr GDHP 11.5gr STEEL - 1183fps (6"KKM)
155gr GDHP 12.5gr STEEL - 1394fps (6"KKM)
155gr.GDHP 13.0gr STEEL - 1425fps (6"KKM)

Here are some 155gr loads that I have use din the past.
-Mike

bdc
10-17-2003, 12:02
www.alliantpowder.com does not list Bullseye data for 10mm light weight bullets.

Lyman 5" barrel data shows: 135gr JHP, 7.3gr @ 1335f/s.
150gr JHP, 7.0gr @ 1263f/s.

(Alliant data shows 40SW 4" barrel, 135gr JHP, 7.6gr @ 1350f/s. Bullseye is doing its thing in 10mm in far less than 5".)

I was surprized that actual tests in my stock G-29 with used Winchester brass produced Glocksmiles at 9.2gr for 135gr JHP, and 9.0gr for 150gr JHP.

Dropping back a few tenths grains & new brass for safety, I had some of my most accurate 10mm loadings. (Heavier bullets are very accurate with Bullseye also.)

At about 600 fLbs, PF 190, +P+ load is adequate for most uses. Clearly not a maximum power powder.

Meters great, great sight reaquisition characteristics, a bit smokey, no flash or great blast, with standard or 21# recoil spring the brass drops at your feet.

According to the Alliant Tec Rep (1.800.276.9337), Power Pistol is a powder derived from the Bullseye formula. This ball shape powder meters well but the slower burn rate causes ignition problems. The longer the barrel the more accurate the load (smaller velocity standard deviation numbers), due to a more complete burn.

Grip reduction: http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=13213462#post13213462

Training & Targets: www.glockfaq.com www.sportshooter.com www.mytargets.com www.tackdriver.com Be sure to explore the links!

bdc
10-18-2003, 11:34
www.alliantpowder.com does not list 10mm loads, but 40SW data for 4" barrels is listed and appropriate as starting loads for 10mm.

Sierra and Lyman do list a few 10mm 5" barrel loads:

135gr JHP, 7.2gr Red Dot, 1375 f/s, 567 fLbs, PF 186
150gr JHP, 6.5gr " " , 1243 f/s, 514 fLbs, PF 187
170gr JHP, 6.0gr " " , 1100+f/s
180gr JHP, 6.0gr " " , 1080 f/s. 466 fLbs, PF 189

Red Dot is a flake powder which does not meter well. With a great effort, quite accurate loads are possible. Bullseye is a probably a better choice if you are looking for a fast burn rate powder.

The other mentioned powders are derived from Red Dot, per the Alliant Tec Rep.

Promo is the same burn rate as Red Dot, but a little denser. Less charge weight is required.

E3 has the same burn rate as Red Dot as well. Alliant has no plans to market it as a pistol powder, but the Tec Rep states he has already loaded it using the Red Dot published data in all bullet weights of the 9mm Lugar.

MCNETT
11-03-2003, 19:51
For those of you using Beartooth WFN 200gr. bullets:
With each load, you should drop 1gr and work up:
Starline brass CCI 350primers 1.26"OAL 35F 5000ft

11.0gr. BD - 1336fps 6"KKM
12.0gr. STEEL - 1380fps 6"KKM
12.5gr STEEL - 1396fps 6"KKM
13.0gr.STEEL - 1410fps 6"KKM
11.5gr STEEL - 1232fps G20
11.0gr. BD - 1246fps G20

-Mike

Lone Wolff
11-03-2003, 21:47
edited to remove irrelevancy...;9

Sabot 23
01-11-2004, 00:49
Well, I've only loaded a grand total of 71 cartigdes. But FWIW, here's what I loaded, and I think it worked out well. I had no access to a chrony, so I don't know the fps, only that it worked and didn't blow up my gun.

180gr GS BJHP - 7.2gr Unique WLP primer 1.26" OAL

I wont post any more loads unless I actually have some Numbers that are worthy of posting, but, since this is the first Unique data on this thread, I think it has it's place.:cool:

If not, just delete this post. I think I'll try a load of 7.4 next. I'm starting to get the hang of this.;f

Peter M. Eick
01-19-2004, 18:25
The following data is from a les baer 10mm heavyweight monolith. All rounds are 155 grn Remington JHP with cci300 primers. 1.250 COL.

ALSO 20 shot strings!

11.2 grns blue dot, winchester brass 1321+, 1203-, 118e, 1245m, 36s
11.2 grns blue dot, winchester brass 1303+, 1155-, 148e, 1243m, 36s
11.2 grns blue dot, elo brass 1269+, 1154-, 115e, 1210m, 35s
11.2 grns blue dot, federal brass 1287+, 1188-, 099e, 1241m, 27s
11.2 grns blue dot, remington brass, 1352+, 1162-, 190e, 1251m, 38s

So the next time someone says don't sort your brass, remember there are some variations.

mineisa10mm
07-07-2004, 16:25
Hi Mike,

first of all: Thank you for the work you are and have been doing and especially for sharing your knowledge with us. :)

For reloading I will use
- a Glock 20
- Winchester brass,
- cci 350 primers,
- Speer 180gr GDHP and Speer 200gr FMJ bullets and
- Blue Dot powder (I would have preferred IMR 800X but that is impossible to get in Germany :( )

The official suggestions from the Alliant-manual are
for 180gr: maximum of 10,4 gr
for 200gr: maximum of 8,9 gr.

As you posted above, you tried 11,8 gr instead of 10,4 and the gun didn`t blow up. So my question: What is the "hottest" yet still safe load you can recommend?

And why do people prefer Blue Dot over Power Pistol?

Thank you!

BuffaloBo
07-22-2004, 14:12
At a quick glance I didn't see anybody posting results for Unique. So here goes:
Stock G20 except 22# Wolff recoil spring

Components:

180 gr Winchester FMJ's
Winchester nickel cases
CCI Standard & Magnum Primers
8.0 grains Unique

(Standard Primers)

1161
1217
1168
1169
1145
1143
1148
1178
1145
1173

Avg: 1165 (fps)
Std Dev: 22 (fps)


(Magnum Primers)

1176
1170
1177
1174
1157
1153
1195
1180
1186
1164

Avg: 1173 (fps)
Std Dev: 13 (fps)


In both sample primers did not appear pushed out or flattened. These are respectable velocities for this particular powder and charge amount. I think this powder
may match Blue Dot in the sub or 1200 (fps) neighborhood if just bumped up a little. The magnum primers seem to offer consistent velocities.

Overall, I am impressed and do think it is a winner.

Vulcanese
07-27-2004, 16:06
.

BuffaloBo
08-03-2004, 18:39
Some new data today.

Glock 20 5" KKM barrel
22# Wolff recoil spring
180 gr Win FMJ
CCI Standard
Win cases
11.5 gr Blue Dot


1254
1252
1275
1264
1263
1265
1258
1247
1260
1258

Avg: 1260
Std Dev: 8

Cases look fine thanks to the tight chamber of the KKM barrel.

P.S. Hey Mike, I'm woking up to that 1300 fps mark!

BuffaloBo
08-03-2004, 18:43
Some more data with good 'ol Unique

Glock 20 5" KKM barrel
22# Wolff recoil spring
180 gr Win FMJ
CCI Standard
Win cases
8.3 gr Unique


1203
1226
1206
1234
1222
1227
1217
1228
1231
1242


Avg: 1224
Std Dev: 12


Again, good numbers and a pretty small spread.


BuffaloBo

Catbird
08-03-2004, 19:12
Originally posted by MCNETT
...This is slightly tainted data. The primers were Win non-magnum. ...This test drives the point home," IF YOU ARE GOING TO USE SLOW POWDERS IN THE 10MM, USE MAGNUM PRIMERS, PLEASE!"...
I'm confused; my Winchester Large Pistol primers are labeled "For standard or magnum pistol loads". Can you clarify, please?

MCNETT
08-04-2004, 17:53
Winchester says that this is a "multip-purpose primer" I prefer to shoot dedicated Magnum primers.
-Mike

Medpilot 2
08-08-2004, 18:04
Power Pistol chrono results:

I'm surprised more people don't use Power Pistol over Blue Dot.

More goes farther and there is slightly less flash. The flash is still there, but just not as bad.

Power Pistol / Zero 180gr FMJ / Starline brass / CCI 350 / OAL 1.250"

Glock 29 KKM Barrel

5 shot ave:

8.7=1171
9.0=1252
9.3=1307
9.6=1311

There's was a decent jump for just 0.3grs. except between 9.3 and 9.6. I'm guessing that the magnum primers must have helped the numbers get up so high. No huge signs of over pressure that I could see. Primers were a little flat, but not too bad. I'd stick with between 9.0 and 9.3 as my max since 9.6 didn't yield much more.

BuffaloBo
08-08-2004, 18:33
Originally posted by Medpilot 2


Glock 29 KKM Barrel

5 shot ave:

8.7=1171
9.0=1252
9.3=1307
9.6=1311



These are good numbers! I'd always wanted to try PP, but I can't find it anywhere locally. :( Maybe someday I'll do the mail order thing.

P.S. How about Herco? It's slightly faster than BD. Whadayathink?

Medpilot 2
08-08-2004, 21:49
I don't buy my powders locally since they price gouge. A pound of your favorite powder will run you $22-24 around here. I placed a order with Powder Valley for 12 different powders and some primers. The $20 hazmat fee divided up between 17 items came out to just over a $1 per item.

As far as Herco goes, it looks like it's right in-between PP and BD on speed. I've never tried it and it's a powder I don't hear very much about. I'll have to put that on my wish list for my next order.:)

BuffaloBo
08-11-2004, 21:32
Another installment of Blue Dot data.

Glock 20
5" KKM barrel
CCI Standard Primers
Winchester Nickle brass
11.8 gr Blue Dot

Ave: 1308
Std Dev: 9
Hi: 1320
Lo: 1290

Cases looked normal, as did the primers.

kidcoltoutlaw
08-21-2004, 18:57
power pistol 9 plus grains
win brass win pr
speer gold dot 125
col 1.143
5 shots
hi 1552
lo 1516
es 36
avg 1535
sd 12
energy 654
temp 73

same load 3.9 inch barrel
5 shots
hi 1433
lo 1405
es 28
avg 1419
sd 10
energy 559
temp 73

BuffaloBo
09-02-2004, 17:40
Some new data today.

Glock 20
5" KKM barrel
CCI Standard LP Primers
200 gr Hornady FMJ FP bullets

Blue Dot Samples

10.0 gr Load (7 shots)
Avg: 1136
Std Dev: 10
Hi: 1148
Lo: 1122


10.4 gr Load (7 shots)
Avg: 1163
Std Dev: 20
Hi: 1195
Lo: 1139



Unique Samples

7.5 gr Load (7 shots)
Avg: 1147
Std Dev: 25
Hi: 1188
Lo: 1118


7.9 gr Load (7 shots)
Avg: 1201
Std Dev: 18
Hi: 1217
Lo: 1169


Some observations:

Felt recoil was moderate. Cases and primers appeared normal. I'll try to push a little more some other day.

Carphunter
12-11-2004, 09:22
? for McNett.

I'm using a Glock 6". Gotta guess on max BD load with 180 FMJ or HP's when used with Blue Dot?

JoeAverage
05-11-2005, 15:08
LB 5" with Kart Barrel.

Win brass
Fed large HG primer (non mag)
180 grn plated
10 grn Blue Dot

1250 fps


All 15 rounds +/- 15 fps

Good luck

ColoradoGlocker
08-20-2005, 10:18
.

Lennyjoe
03-10-2006, 15:14
Anyone use 180gr Meister hard cast over Blue Dot?

I'm looking for some lead loads and have plenty of Blue Dot left.

BTW, it out of a Storm Lake barrel.

Lennyjoe
03-15-2006, 16:22
Disregard. I found an uber accurate load with 10.4gr of Blue Dot under the 180gr Meister Hard cast bullets thru the Storm Lake barrel. ;f

freakshow10mm
11-10-2006, 11:58
Anyone chrono this (5" barrel):

155gr XTP 12.5gr Blue Dot 1.26" WLP

freakshow10mm
03-12-2007, 11:49
Chronoed this load in a 4" 1911. 5 shots averaged 1399fps.

freakshow10mm
03-26-2007, 13:31
Rainier 155gr FP
10.8gr Blue Dot
WLP 1.260
Est 1200fps 4"

Maine1
07-22-2007, 14:13
Anyone use unique EXTENSIVLEY in the 10mm? its my favorite powder, and i'd like to use it for a general purpose load, 180 at 1200 or so.

Also.. is there any use for 2400 in the 10mm? I have four pounds unused...

freakshow10mm
11-04-2007, 08:19
10.0gr Blue Dot WC220 - 1285fps 6"KKM
10.0gr Blue Dot PB220 - 1318fps 6"KKM
10.0gr Blue Dot PB220 - 1219fps G20
10.0gr Blue Dot WC220 - 1115fps G29 65F

Is this right? I have a home cast 220gr SWC for the 10mm that takes up a whole lotta case. I was going to load 8gr to start off with (backing off 2gr) but I looked at the powder column and noticed that if I did, the powder would be compressed a great deal if I seated a bullet, and I can only seat to 1.27" OAL before I crush a case.

I chickened out and loaded a charge down to a level that would let airspace remain between the powder and bullet. I went down to 6gr, as this is a bit below starting for a 200gr XTP in Hornady's #7 manual. I will go to the range this afternoon and test these out (with a load of 5gr WSF too). Here is a pic of the bullet next to a dummy of the same seated to 1.275".

Let me know your thoughts.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/freakshow10mm/Boolit%20Casting/Reloading10507004.jpg

f4tweet
11-05-2007, 02:22
Sounds like it's time to go to your .41 Magnum.

DeltaEliteMan
03-12-2008, 13:48
I use 6.0grs of Unique under a 180gr Xtreme bullets FMJ with Winchester Large Pistol primers (OAL 1.255") in my Glock 29.

I got:
Shot 1 - 968fps
Shot 2 - 1008fps
Shot 3 - 964fps

Very accurate and clean.
Great for making economy minded practice loads...

Glocker 4 Life
03-14-2008, 16:30
.....

tooouter
08-18-2008, 21:29
8.7 grn of Power Pistol / G20 stock barrel / 180 grn Win FMJ FP / CCI 300 / 1.255"

1,131 Median fps
30.6 Stdev
Min = 1,098
Max = 1,179

GPE427
09-16-2008, 16:15
My most accurate 10mm load Temp 80+F Elevation 4600

7.9 gn Power Pistol / G20 stock 4.6 barrel / 180 gn Rainier FP / CCI 300 / 1.25

1158 Average Velocity

7.9 gn Power Pistol / Glock 6.0 barrel / 180 gn Rainier FP / CCI 300 / 1.25

1194 Average Velocity


Curious why Tooouter uses so much more powder.

texas 48
09-17-2008, 07:38
8.7 is max published load for 180gr for power pistol.

Carphunter
10-29-2009, 09:11
new starline brass, cci 350, oal 1.257~ , 180 Remington Golden Saber JHP. 11 gr Blue Dot

Glock 6" barrel
Low 1248
High 1341
Avg 1297

10mm Carbine
Low 1407
High 1461
Avg. 1436

This 11 grain load gave me really consistent velos in the carbine. No overpressure signs in the Glock. Think it will be the load a build a pile of for the pair.

new starline brass, cci 350, oal 1.257~ , 180 Remington Golden Saber JHP. 11.5 gr Blue Dot

Glock 6"
Low 1266
High 1367
Avg 1327

Carbine
low 1479
high 1550
Avg 1511

11.5 load didn't give me 5 consistent shots in Glock. Velos all over. I'm guessing it's still expanding after bullet has left barrel, so powder's being wasted. Carb was ok. No real pressure signs in glock. didn't make full chamber expansion all the time. Least I know I should be safe to this point if I get variances in progressive loaded 11 gr loads.

Carphunter
10-29-2009, 09:18
new starline brass, cci 350, oal 1.257~ , 165 Remington Golden Saber JHP. 11 gr Blue Dot

Glock 6"
Low 1273
High 1391 (1 out of 4 oddball, 100 fps faster than the rest)
Avg 1307

Carbine
Low 1419
High 1550
avg 1489

load wasn't super consistent in carbine. in glock, 1 round 100 fps over the rest.

AJE
02-02-2010, 21:54
I did some testing of Power Pistol today. I didn't get quite the velocity that some have but I was pretty happy with the results (you bastards up in the mountains have it easy). Elevation 1,115ft, temp 35 F.

All of these were with 165 grain Speer Gold Dots, new starline cases, OAL 1.258 (.002). I shot 10 loads of each over the chrono, however a few of them didn't read on the display so I don't have 10 readings for each load). Also, all of these loads were tested out of my Glock 20/21 with the 6" KKM 45-10mm barrel, and 24# spring. Most importantly, I did not have a single malfunction of any kind during today's shooting.

I also compared the difference between the large pistol primer (CCI300) and Federal Large Pistol Magnum primer.

9.7 grains of Power Pistol:
First, the Large Pistol primer (CCI300):
Loads measured: 10
Max: 1383fps
Min: 1328fps
Std Dev: 16.89
Max energy: 701 ft/lbs
Ave energy: 678 ft/lbs

Now with Mag Primers (Federal)
Loads measured: 10
Max: 1383
Min: 1348
Std Dev: 9.94
Max energy: 701 ft/lbs
Ave energy: 683 ft/lbs

Conclusions... The mag primer makes the load burn more consistent, although not really significantly more powerful (exact same max velocity and just five more pounds average energy).

Now the 10.0gr loads (which are the max listed load per Alliant)

CCI Large Pistol Primer
Loads measured: 8
Max: 1427
Min: 1384
Std Dev: 12.63
Max energy: 746 ft/lbs
Ave energy: 720 ft/lbs

Federal Large Pistol Magnum Primer
Loads measured: 7
Max: 1412
Min: 1375
Std Dev: 11.87
Max energy: 730 ft/lbs
Ave energy: 713 ft/lbs

The mag primers were slightly more consistent but for some reason gave slower velocities.

texas 48
02-06-2010, 01:01
I did some testing of Power Pistol today. I didn't get quite the velocity that some have but I was pretty happy with the results (you bastards up in the mountains have it easy). Elevation 1,115ft, temp 35 F.

All of these were with 165 grain Speer Gold Dots, new starline cases, OAL 1.258 (.002). I shot 10 loads of each over the chrono, however a few of them didn't read on the display so I don't have 10 readings for each load). Also, all of these loads were tested out of my Glock 20/21 with the 6" KKM 45-10mm barrel, and 24# spring. Most importantly, I did not have a single malfunction of any kind during today's shooting.

I also compared the difference between the large pistol primer (CCI300) and Federal Large Pistol Magnum primer.

9.7 grains of Power Pistol:
First, the Large Pistol primer (CCI300):
Loads measured: 10
Max: 1383fps
Min: 1328fps
Std Dev: 16.89
Max energy: 701 ft/lbs
Ave energy: 678 ft/lbs

Now with Mag Primers (Federal)
Loads measured: 10
Max: 1383
Min: 1348
Std Dev: 9.94
Max energy: 701 ft/lbs
Ave energy: 683 ft/lbs

Conclusions... The mag primer makes the load burn more consistent, although not really significantly more powerful (exact same max velocity and just five more pounds average energy).

Now the 10.0gr loads (which are the max listed load per Alliant)

CCI Large Pistol Primer
Loads measured: 8
Max: 1427
Min: 1384
Std Dev: 12.63
Max energy: 746 ft/lbs
Ave energy: 720 ft/lbs

Federal Large Pistol Magnum Primer
Loads measured: 7
Max: 1412
Min: 1375
Std Dev: 11.87
Max energy: 730 ft/lbs
Ave energy: 713 ft/lbs

The mag primers were slightly more consistent but for some reason gave slower velocities.
These numbers are consistant with the results I got using 9.7gr PP with 165gr Montana Gold in new starline cases CCI 350 LMP and COL 1.256 .02. I was getting 1260ft/sec with a 3.78 standard Glock barrel with no pressure signs. Have not taken to 10.0gr . I just bought a G20 and would expect to get 50 to 75 ft/ with the longer barrel that would be about 1310. Good enough for me. I have had good results with PP. I can still drop 1.0 gr with reloads and @ 8.7 saw 1100ft/sec.

AJE
04-03-2010, 08:27
In addition to testing some reloads, I shot some Double Tap and "factory" reloads available for purchase from Vandalia Range and Armory.

First, I will admit that during the first string of shots over the chrono, I hit one of the sun shades. :crying: Luckily it was with the .45 since the 10mm might have sent the whole chrono into orbit :supergrin: . Even though the back sensor looked damaged, the chrono still seemed to work, I just got more errors than I usually did before. I tried 10 shots over it for each different load, but I rarely got all ten loads to read. Tonight it's supposed to be rainy so I'll try to rig something up to make it work better.

All of these were tested with a Glock 21SF, Lone Wolf 6" slide, and KKM 45-10mm conversion barrel and 24lb recoil spring. USE EXTREME CAUTION as these loads might not be safe in an unmodified gun with a chamber that is not as tight!

Anyway, on to the results.

All data collected on 4/1/10, 76F, elevation 1,115ft.

I did some messing with Blue Dot and 180gr FMJ's flirting a little over max and trying with Large Pistol and Mag primers.

180gr FMJ, 11.0gr Blue Dot Powder, Large Pistol Primer (max load listed on Alliant's website, tested at 1295fps)
8/10 loads measured
Min velocity: 1274fps
Max velocity: 1355fps
Average velocity: 1314fps
Average energy: 690ft/lbs
Std Dev: 23.99

Same load, Mag primers.
6/10 loads measured
Min velocity: 1327fps
Max velocity: 1403fps
Average velocity: 1359fps
Average energy: 738ft/lbs
Std Dev: 30.16
Due to the results with a bigger powder charge, I think this one might have been a little more consistent if I would have had a reading for all of the shots on the chrono. Obviously the mag primers did push more velocity out of the load with Blue Dot.

Now I bumped up the powder charge to 11.4gr (this is OVER MAX)
Large pistol primer;
7/10 loads measured
Min velocity: 1327fps
Max velocity: 1376fps
Average velocity: 1356fps
Average energy: 735ft/lbs
Std Dev: 20.72

Now, with mag primers:
8/10 loads measured
Min velocity: 1363fps
Max velocity: 1405fps
Average velocity: 1381fps
Average energy: 762ft/lbs
Std Dev: 14.13
This load was the most consistent out of all of them. Next test I will need to work up to this load with the XTPs.


Before I got my loader set up I bought some of the range ammo they sell at Vandalia Range and Armory (http://www.vra-ohio.com/). I was pleasantly surprised, as they were only $17 a box of 50 and they felt as if they were loaded pretty powerfully. They are loaded with 180gr flat point FMJ, and mixed cases (most of them Federal).
I did manage to get all 10 loads to measure on the chrono.
Min velocity: 1255fps
Max velocity: 1329fps
Average velocity: 1292fps
Average energy: 677ft/lbs
Std Dev: 22.36


Double Tap. Advertised 1350fps out of a stock Glock 20 bbl (4.4"). Doesn't quite measure up, even with my 6" bbl.
Link to ammo (http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_25&products_id=122). I did kill a deer with this load last year, it went in the neck and nearly penetrated lengthwise (stopped somewhere in the intestines).
Loads measured: 9/10
Min velocity: 1279fps
Max velocity: 1376fps
Average velocity: 1309fps
Average energy: 685ft/lbs
Std Dev: 29.46

Next, 180gr XTPs. These were my answer to the Double Tap rounds, intended on using for deer or other similar sized game animals (or blowing **** up). I worked some of these up to the powder charge before, so I know they were safe in my gun but this is OVER MAX for the powder charge.
Brass: Starline New
Bullet: Hornady 180gr. XTP
Primer: CCI Large Pistol
Powder: 9.6gr of Alliant Power Pistol

Loads measured: 8/10
Min velocity: 1398fps
Max velocity: 1505fps (this one was 50+ more than all the rest of them, I'm not sure what happened with it, but WOW, that's 905ft/lbs!)
Average velocity: 1433fps
Average energy: 820ft/lbs
Std Dev: 35.89

This one was more consistent than the data suggests, as the 1505fps load was the only one that was anywhere near that high. If you remove that one from the data pool, the Std Dev is inline with the others. (1422fps average velocity, 22.55 Std Dev) I did have some problems keeping the OAL consistent with the XTP bullets (I believe due to the seating stem not matching well with the bullet profile) so that one could have been shorter and I missed it for some reason.

I found the addition of Federal Magnum Large Pistol primers with Power Pistol powder lowered the average velocity, but did make the loads more consistent. Same load with the mag primers:
Min velocity: 1374fps
Max velocity: 1437fps
Average velocity: 1399fps
Average energy: 782ft/lbs
Std Dev: 21.74



Observations:

1400fps is scorching for a 180gr bullet. *****DO NOT try to replicate this without starting LOW and working your way up.****

Magnum primers will bump up the velocity for Blue Dot not necessarily for Power Pistol. Both powders kick ass, though. Next test I will load up some XTPs with Blue Dot and compare to two, and hopefully not hit my damn chronograph again.

I intended on doing accuracy on paper as well as chronograph data but it was windy and all my stuff was blowing around. I was getting frustrated enough keeping everything from blowing away while walking around the yard with the cast on my leg so I scrapped those plans at the start of my shooting.

Taterhead
04-03-2010, 13:41
In addition to testing some reloads, I shot some Double Tap and "factory" reloads available for purchase from Vandalia Range and Armory.

First, I will admit that during the first string of shots over the chrono, I hit one of the sun shades. :crying:

Been there. It is a bit embarassing. My buddy asked me to repeat the velocity of my previous shot as I was getting ready to send another. The old saying that you tend to shoot where you look... well I hit the sun shade rod right where it attaches to the chrony housing; about 1.5" northeast of the velocity read out. It burned lead residue into the housing in about a 2" circle. It shook the guts of the chrony so hard that it dislodged all of the internals. The sunshade rod now has a large horeshoe shaped bend in it. I had to take it all apart and re-assemble. Works fine now.

After re-assembly, I did some test strings inside the house by firing rubber bands over it. You may be interested to know that a blue elastic band from a bunch of broccoli fired from a full stretch has a 5 shot ave velocity of 69 fps.

You may consider disassembling and seeing if anything needs to be reset into place or cleaned up. Mine had bits of plastic and lead junk that had become dislodged and were floating around.

1400 fps on a 180 gr projectile is moving! I found it interesting that the std dev with BD and mag primers actually opened up relative to the standard primers. You are right that it could be a function of sample size with the misreads.

Thank you for posting that data.

AJE
04-03-2010, 15:09
Thanks... I know I'm not the first and I know I won't be the last. I will make sure to set it up a little closer to my rest next time.

AJE
10-21-2010, 19:48
Did some more today in preparation of deer season ***still with the same chronograph :supergrin:

Same Glock 21SF, 6" conversion bbl


Both loads tested were with 180gr XTP, Federal Large Pistol Magnum primers, loaded to 1.257 OAL, in new Starline brass.



9.6gr Power Pistol, 10 loads measured;
Min: 1,336fps Max: 1,412 Avg: 1,380fps Std Dev: 19.42


11.4gr Blue Dot, 10 loads measured;
Min: 1,387fps Max: 1,448fps Avg: 1,412fps Std Dev: 16.75


Groups (stepped off at about 15 yards, so probably 45-50 feet). Rested off of the tailgate of my truck.

target: (can't get picture to imbed for some reason)
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c353/AJErvin/Guns/10mmtargets.jpg


Power Pistol on top (10 shots), Blue Dot loads on bottom (15 shots). During the middle of the Blue Dot group I pulled the two on the right, then tried to "fix myself" and pulled the one to the left. I walked away for a few minutes then settled down and came back and finished it. The first two were the ones at 12 oclock that were touching :supergrin:

xdmikey
12-26-2010, 12:14
My most accurate 10mm load Temp 80+F Elevation 4600

7.9 gn Power Pistol / G20 stock 4.6 barrel / 180 gn Rainier FP / CCI 300 / 1.25

1158 Average Velocity

7.9 gn Power Pistol / Glock 6.0 barrel / 180 gn Rainier FP / CCI 300 / 1.25

1194 Average Velocity


Curious why Tooouter uses so much more powder.

if i was wanting to use this laod, can anyone suggest a start load?

thanks

_The_Shadow
12-26-2010, 13:38
XDMikey, What bullet are you going to be using as everything is relevent! Note the quoted GPE427 is using a 4.6" & 6" barrels in the testing. Those plated bullets can have very thin plating and if driven beyond what it can take it will sheer off, others complain of keyholing. The only plated bullets I've used were Speer Gold Dots.

I used the following data for a 200 XTP seated to 1.260" CCI 300 Remington Nickel brass...Use with caution as it is slightly above the recomended data for 200FMJ's and the XTP's are longer in total length.

200gr Hornady XTP 8.0grs. PowerPistol 1170 fps – 1200 fps Tested 1006
200gr Hornady XTP 8.0grs. PowerPistol 1080 fps – 1127 fps Tested Glock 29

These functioned well and preformed well from these guns set up with Wolff 22lb Recoil spring in the S&W and Wolff 21lb springs and noncaptured rod w the G-29.

g29guy
04-12-2011, 22:57
I just received my 10mm 180 grain truncated cone flat point hard cast bullets.
Ill be using a KKM 4.75" barrel with a g29 and 23# spring.
Im looking for an accurate load for target/hunting without going close to nuclear. Any BlueDot recipies that you'all have been using or advice on hard cast loads with Blue Dot? I'm new to cast reloading. Am I alright just using FMJ info minus 10% and working my way up?:dunno:

Starline brass
CCI 300 primers
180 grain TC HardCast

P.S. I have 800X:whistling: for hot loads, Just looking for fun/accurate loads at the range or smaller game hunting with BD.

21Carrier
04-13-2011, 08:21
I just wanted to post these two loads here, as they are my favorites so far with Blue Dot.

Perfect Target Load:
-Used brass
-CCI 300 primers
-Blue Dot 10.3-10.4gr
-180gr FMJ (I used local Magnus 180gr FMJ-TC)
-Exceptional accuracy, nice Goldilocks load, not too hot, not too cold.

My carry load:
-Once-fired brass (new would be better)
-CCI 300 primers
-Blue Dot 12.9gr
-Hornady 155gr XTP
-Awesome load, incredibly accurate, nice and hot, serious BD flash and bang. Maybe not the best for nighttime use, but I'd sure run like hell if I saw a 3 foot fireball coming at me!!!

Please be careful with these loads, especially the second one. Start lower, be safe.

Jitterbug
04-13-2011, 10:11
Back in the day when I carried a 4" 686, I loved those fireballs, bigger the better, I figured the same thing, if I missed the BG would die of heart failure...until I fired one in the night, I couldn't see for a week.

Nowadays...low flash is one of my top criteria for a carry load.

21Carrier
04-13-2011, 13:14
I don't think they are really that bad. The first time I tested that load it was actually getting dark so I saved a few to shoot when it was really dark. It was impressive, but not too bad on my eyes. I was still able to reacquire my target. And truthfully, I did that test way out in the woods, where it's REALLY dark, so that's worst case scenario. If I ever have to use my pistol in the dark, it will likely be around a city where there will be some kind of lights making the situation somewhat better. This is also my backpacking bear defense pistol, but for that I will DEFINITELY carry some low flash loads. Some of the darkest nights I've ever experienced were on backpacking trips (Grand Tetons, Wind River Range, etc.).

g29guy
04-14-2011, 14:22
I just received my 10mm 180 grain truncated cone flat point hard cast bullets.
Ill be using a KKM 4.75" barrel with a g29 and 23# spring.
Im looking for an accurate load for target/hunting without going close to nuclear. Any BlueDot recipies that you'all have been using or advice on hard cast loads with Blue Dot? I'm new to cast reloading. Am I alright just using FMJ info minus 10% and working my way up?:dunno:

Starline brass
CCI 300 primers
180 grain TC HardCast

P.S. I have 800X:whistling: for hot loads, Just looking for fun/accurate loads at the range or smaller game hunting with BD.

So far I'm reading that 9.0 grains of BD puts 180 grain Hard Cast at about 1050 fps and is a great plinking/target load that isn't rough on brass. I know I could go alot higher but My original post was for a target/hunting load. Ill be experimenting with higher velocities using 800x.

Jitterbug
04-14-2011, 14:31
G29

Not Blue Dot...

I've used a Missouri Bullet or similar 180 TC with 9.0 grains of AA7, it's my standard "plinking load" for a 10mm, 1911 Commander, I've had good luck with it and used it many years ago with a 1006. I'm guessing it's running about 950-1000 fps or so. You can take up from there if you want, that load is inexpensive, easy on brass, gun and me.

Without re-reading the posts...I'm assuming you have an after market barrel for shooting lead in your Glock?

g29guy
04-14-2011, 15:04
G29

Not Blue Dot...



Without re-reading the posts...I'm assuming you have an after market barrel for shooting lead in your Glock?

Yes, Its a 4.75" KKM I'm using with a g29.
Alliant powder chart only shows a speer GDHP with 11 grains BD as max load at 1295fps so naturally my thought process was to go 10% less to start at which is 10.1 grains and 10% less for lead which would put me at 9.09 grains.
(Unless Hard cast doesn't need to be de-rated 10%? I'm not sure if that is just for soft lead. Any feed back would be appreciated.):embarassed:

Jitterbug
04-14-2011, 15:15
My Lyman 49th has...

Two different Blue Dot loads for a 175 grain cast bullet.

9.3 -- 10.4 grains @ 1.253" OAL 1175 -1275 fps.
9.0 -- 10.4 grains @ 1.260" OAL 1100-1245 fps.
CCI-300

Slight differences in the two bullets and I do believe hardcast due to the published velocity.

Hope that helps.

Taterhead
04-14-2011, 15:23
Deleted.

g29guy
04-14-2011, 15:35
My Lyman 49th has...

Two different Blue Dot loads for a 175 grain cast bullet.

9.3 -- 10.4 grains @ 1.253" OAL 1175 -1275 fps.
9.0 -- 10.4 grains @ 1.260" OAL 1100-1245 fps.
CCI-300

Slight differences in the two bullets and I do believe hardcast due to the published velocity.

Hope that helps.

Thanks jitterbug,

I think starting at 9.0 and working up is the way to go. I will load a bunch of ammo this week. My father in law invited me to go shooting Monday as we both have the day off.. Ill try and get results asap.

_The_Shadow
04-14-2011, 19:31
G29guy, you shouldn't have any problems with the 10.4 grains Blue Dot under the 175 grain cast bullets, that is my target load from my S&W1006 1220-1235 fps and Glock 29 about 1075-1100 fps. Been shooting that load since 1990...

Just be aware, be sure you are not getting any leading especially in a factory Glock barrel. I cast my own 175 gr alloy 0.401" bullets and the Zambini lube works well to prevent leading for me. I have shot some 156 gr alloy at 1400 fps with ever so slight streaks.

g29guy
04-19-2011, 00:04
Went to the range today. I was able to work up 9.0-9.8 grains of Blue Dot on the press. I wanted to go further but ran out of time. Ill continue on up later.

No signs of any stress or leading out of my KKM 4.75" barrel, 23# recoil spring. No failures either.
Recoil jumped at the 9.8 load but brass and accuracy were great.
Definitely a loud flashy dirty powder, but great to get turned heads at the range(especially out of a 29, big bang in a small package)

I just wish I could get more published data for hard cast ammo.

CCI 300 primers
New Starline brass
180 grain Truncated Cone Flat HardCast bullets
1.256 OAL
9.0-9.8 Blue Dot

Thanks For all your feedback and sugestions

Jitterbug
04-19-2011, 07:07
I've found it's always best to START at the lowest published data or very close to it after finding at least two sources of published data by what I consider to be reputable sources, bullet manufacturer, powder manufacturer or Lyman.

I think Lee publishes data, but I'm not familiar with it.

Over the past weekend I was at Sportsman's Warehouse and they had those One load/One Book manuals for about $8.00 each. I'm thinking it might be a good idea to pick one up for each caliber I load, they're only about $8.00 each and can be found at Midway. And I ALWAYS get two sources, not just one.

So I STRONGLY suggest confirmation of what you find in any manual, the data is constantly being updated and typo's do happen. Often before starting a load, I'll have three or more published sources...then get confirmation and remarks from a reloading forum.

g29, I've had good luck with AA7 in 10mm, my plinking load is 8.8 gr. - 9.0 of AA#7 under a 180 gr. Missouri Bullet 180 gr. TCBB. This is a mild load, I was trying to find the mildest load I could, attempting to duplicate a .45acp load. It's a good outdoor load, and due to the lube a bit smokey in doors, but no flash and it cleans up easily, not to mention accurate in my gun.

The Accurate Arms manual can be downloaded in PDF format from their website, as well as many others.

In the future I intend on trying out some AA#9 for 180 XTP's. AA#9 seems to give more velocity at the same pressure from what I've read.

As always what works in my gun may not work in yours so please verify and always use manufacturer START data.

Good luck!

g29guy
04-19-2011, 14:17
I've found it's always best to START at the lowest published data or very close to it after finding at least two sources of published data by what I consider to be reputable sources, bullet manufacturer, powder manufacturer or Lyman.

I think Lee publishes data, but I'm not familiar with it.

Over the past weekend I was at Sportsman's Warehouse and they had those One load/One Book manuals for about $8.00 each. I'm thinking it might be a good idea to pick one up for each caliber I load, they're only about $8.00 each and can be found at Midway. And I ALWAYS get two sources, not just one.

So I STRONGLY suggest confirmation of what you find in any manual, the data is constantly being updated and typo's do happen. Often before starting a load, I'll have three or more published sources...then get confirmation and remarks from a reloading forum.

g29, I've had good luck with AA7 in 10mm, my plinking load is 8.8 gr. - 9.0 of AA#7 under a 180 gr. Missouri Bullet 180 gr. TCBB. This is a mild load, I was trying to find the mildest load I could, attempting to duplicate a .45acp load. It's a good outdoor load, and due to the lube a bit smokey in doors, but no flash and it cleans up easily, not to mention accurate in my gun.

The Accurate Arms manual can be downloaded in PDF format from their website, as well as many others.

In the future I intend on trying out some AA#9 for 180 XTP's. AA#9 seems to give more velocity at the same pressure from what I've read.

As always what works in my gun may not work in yours so please verify and always use manufacturer START data.

Good luck!

I need to get me a caliber specific book too. I own a speer reloading book and borrow or copy info out of my fathers books as a precaution.
I agree on the starting levels of any caliber unless you are familiar with the load.
The trouble I'm having is finding several good sources of data on hardcast or lead. I might find a good source for a 180 grain bullet but then have to compare with a couple of 175 grain bullet loads.

I'm open to trying different powders. Next time I see AA#9 ill pick up a pound and see. I hand weigh all my loads so metering isn't a problem, but having several different recipes helps to keep range time fun and interesting.

BenKeith
04-25-2011, 19:18
I've been doing a lot of experimenting with my Glock 20SF and Blue Dot powder with 165 grain Golden Saber's.

Most Accurate Load.
10.4gr Blue Dot, glock factory barrel, New Starline brass, CCI 300 primers OAL, 1.250, 165 grain Golden Saber bullets.
(first three shots at 50' were in the same hole, and I mean the SAME hole)

Max load to date
12.0gr Blue Dot, everything else the same
Glock barrel, 1,285 fps
6" Lone Wolf barrel, 1,425 fps
Neither of these barrels are showing any extreme pressure signs. The brass is showing absolutely no increase in size mic'ing the base before and after each shot.

Gonna shoot a few hundred of these before I try going any higher.
Will work on 180 grain Golden Saber loads until I'm sure the 165gr Max load doesn't throw me any surprises.

joey0870
05-01-2011, 21:21
Hey guys I am new to the site, and to reloading the 10mm. I have a G20sf and cant seem to hit a sweet spot! I am using 155gr. xtp,starline brass, cci 300, I've tried blue dot charges from 10.5 to 12.5gr. in 5 shot strings, also no crimp to enough to slightly deform the pill! still it wont group. it acts like it needs more powder! Any ideas?

_The_Shadow
05-01-2011, 21:35
Joey Welcome to the forum!
It may not be your handloads that are the problem...
Have you tried longer bullets like the 165gr or 180 gr to see if accuracy improves?

Also look at the "shooter wheel" to see if you are doing things you may be unaware of...http://airbornecombatengineer.typepad.com/airborne_combat_engineer/2007/01/chart_for_ident.html

Also aim small and close to build your proficency...aiming at a smaller dot to fine tune your sight picture will help shot placement.

21Carrier
05-22-2011, 22:41
Just thought I'd add some new loads that I just made that I REALLY like. Joey, this first will help you, also see my post at the top of page 3 for a very accurate max Blue Dot/155 XTP load. All fired from my stock G29.

Awesome Blue Dot/155gr XTP load:
Federal brass
CCI 300
Hornady 155gr XTP
Blue Dot 12.0gr
COAL 1.260"

Awesome target load, medium recoil, low flash for BD, very well might be the most accurate load I've ever shot (or maybe I'm just getting better!).

Unique/180gr FMJ target loads

Fed. brass
CCI 300
Unique 7.0gr
Magnus 180gr FMJ-TC
COAL 1.260"

VERY accurate, nice shooting, low-mid recoil round

Also, for even softer rounds, use either 6.0 or 5.5gr of Unique, with the same recipe. These are all very accurate, nice shooting rounds. The 5.5gr load is like a mild .40S&W (this load can be a little smoky). I made these so my girlfriend could shoot without scaring the holy hell out of her, but I have a feeling that they will become regular range fodder. It seems I've gotten all the nitrous oxide out of my veins, and my quest for 10mm horsepower is subsiding. I'll still shoot the hot stuff AT LEAST 50% of the time, but I forgot how nice it was to just shoot some light, fun stuff, and focus on technique.

OhioGlockMan
05-27-2011, 17:51
Ladies and Gentlemen, thought I finally got around to purchasing a chronograph, thought I'd share some data... All 10mm shot in my Glock 20 W 22# recoil spring & 6 inch Wolf stainless barrel....

200 Grain Laser Cast lead hardcast with blue dot powder, Winchester WLR primer, average of 3 shots....

9.2 gr. bluedot- 1195 FPS
9.4 gr. bluedot- 1235 fps
9.6 gr. bluedot- 1265 fps FWIW I had been shooting for a long time 10 grains of blue dot (mcnett said to use that as a start with the 200 hardcasts he sold on here). I didn't even bother to chrono the 10 grainier, with these velocities I'm just sticking to 9.4 grains. I kinda think 10 grains might batter the gun, even though I never saw a sign of pressure when shooting it.

180 Grain Speer Gold Dot, 11 grain blue dot, CCI 350 primer- average 1390 FPS- my jaw dropped when I saw this. Holy mackerel, 1390 fps. Wowsers

180 Grain Hornady HAP bullets (same exact bullet as the xtp, but no serrations in hollow tip, made for bulk cheap purchase and target work).
10.4 grain bluedot, CCI 350 primer- average 1300 FPS. Makes excellent full power pinking load

FYI I shot these loads in starline, Remington UMC, and double tap brass. Did not make a noticeable difference in anything pressure or velocity wise

ModGlock17
07-25-2011, 14:42
I ran an experiment With Blue Dot, trying to find a comfortable operating range on my G20 and G29sf.

Condition: 93F, about 150ft elevation above sea level

Toy elements: G20, G29sf, CCI primer 300, Blue dot, once fired Starline brass, Berry flat nose bullet 180gr, Chrono F1. Also chrono'd BVAC and Georgia Arms 165gr.

Experiment: 10.0gr, 10.2gr, 10.5gr, 10.8gr, BVAC, GArms each had 5 samples for each gun.

Chrono placed about 10ft out, no choice... had to get out of the roof area.

G20 ave result:
10.0 => 1070fps std8.6, 458 ft-lbs
10.2 => 1073fps std7.3, 460 ft-lbs
10.5 => 1098fps std6.6, 482 ft-lbs
10.8 => 1135fps std30.7, 515 ft-lbs

BVAC 180gr => 1056fps std 6.1, 445 ft-lbs
GArms 165gr => 1226fps std4.9, 551ft-lbs advertised 1250fps at muzzle.

G29sf ave result:
10.0 => 995fps std14.0, 395 ft-lbs
10.2 => 1005fps std15.0, 404 ft-lbs
10.5 => 1063fps std9.9, 452 ft-lbs
10.8 => 1076fps std10.6, 463 ft-lbs

A few conclusions
1. Speed loss from G20 stock barrel to G29sf stock barrel was around 60fps.
2. Powder weights for 180gr plated bullet from 10.0gr to 10.8gr are rather anemic. Extrapolate to 11.0gr, and perhaps 11.2gr should be the next experiment. That should make it good for target shooting, not stressing the gun too much.
3. Speed gain on G20 is still increasing at 10.8gr of BlueDot.
4. Standard deviation trend is tightening on G20 (with exception of one datapoint at 10.8gr) with higher powder weight.
5. G29sf generally results in wider standard deviation, probably shorter barrel causing less consistency.
6. GeorgiaArms has pretty good stuff at just over 40cents/round, for a factory round.

Note: G29sf had just a couple hundred rounds so far, can be considered "not fully broke-in" as yet. But including it for 11.0+ gr experiment is worth doing.

Taterhead
07-25-2011, 15:02
;
Chrono placed about 10ft out, no choice... had to get out of the roof area.

G20 ave result:
10.0 => 1070fps std8.6, 458 ft-lbs
10.2 => 1073fps std7.3, 460 ft-lbs
10.5 => 1098fps std6.6, 482 ft-lbs
10.8 => 1135fps std30.7, 515 ft-lbs

BVAC 180gr => 1056fps std 6.1, 445 ft-lbs
GArms 165gr => 1226fps std4.9, 551ft-lbs advertised 1250fps at muzzle.

G29sf ave result:
10.0 => 995fps std14.0, 458 ft-lbs
10.2 => 1005fps std15.0, 460 ft-lbs
10.5 => 1063fps std9.9, 482 ft

Nice report. You may want to check your energy stats for the G29. I believe they should be:

364
404
452
463

Question: did you, by chance get these on paper? I have been trying to get the same bullet to remain stable at speeds above 1100, but I find inconsistent precision. Blue Dot @ 1025-1050 works great though.

GTRhino24
07-25-2011, 15:04
I ran an experiment With Blue Dot, trying to find a comfortable operating range on my G20 and G29sf.

Condition: 93F, about 150ft elevation above sea level

Toy elements: G20, G29sf, CCI primer 300, Blue dot, once fired Starline brass, Berry flat nose bullet 180gr, Chrono F1. Also chrono'd BVAC and Georgia Arms 165gr.

Experiment: 10.0gr, 10.2gr, 10.5gr, 10.8gr, BVAC, GArms each had 5 samples for each gun.

Chrono placed about 10ft out, no choice... had to get out of the roof area.

G20 ave result:
10.0 => 1070fps std8.6, 458 ft-lbs
10.2 => 1073fps std7.3, 460 ft-lbs
10.5 => 1098fps std6.6, 482 ft-lbs
10.8 => 1135fps std30.7, 515 ft-lbs

BVAC 180gr => 1056fps std 6.1, 445 ft-lbs
GArms 165gr => 1226fps std4.9, 551ft-lbs advertised 1250fps at muzzle.

G29sf ave result:
10.0 => 995fps std14.0, 458 ft-lbs
10.2 => 1005fps std15.0, 460 ft-lbs
10.5 => 1063fps std9.9, 482 ft-lbs
10.8 => 1076fps std10.6, 515 ft-lbs

A few conclusions
1. Speed loss from G20 stock barrel to G29sf stock barrel was around 60fps.
2. Powder weights for 180gr plated bullet from 10.0gr to 10.8gr are rather anemic. Extrapolate to 11.0gr, and perhaps 11.2gr should be the next experiment. That should make it good for target shooting, not stressing the gun too much.
3. Speed gain on G20 is still increasing at 10.8gr of BlueDot.
4. Standard deviation trend is tightening on G20 (with exception of one datapoint at 10.8gr) with higher powder weight.
5. G29sf generally results in wider standard deviation, probably shorter barrel causing less consistency.
6. GeorgiaArms has pretty good stuff at just over 40cents/round, for a factory round.

Note: G29sf had just a couple hundred rounds so far, can be considered "not fully broke-in" as yet. But including it for 11.0+ gr experiment is worth doing.

+1 on the write up! Same guns, bullet weight, primers, brass, and powder that I use so this is especially helpful. I look forward to the results north of 10gr! 10.5 is my target round. Thanks again! Oh, COAL? I set mine at 1.255 as it seems to feed a bit better than 1.260.

ModGlock17
07-25-2011, 16:42
Nice report. You may want to check your energy stats for the G29. I believe they should be:

364
404
452
463

Question: did you, by chance get these on paper? I have been trying to get the same bullet to remain stable at speeds above 1100, but I find inconsistent precision. Blue Dot @ 1025-1050 works great though.


You're right. Sorry about that. I was copy&paste to avoid retyping the units, then got in a hurry to pickup my little one.

I correct the main report now, in case people didn't see your correction. Thanks.

I wasn't trying hard to aim, more concerned about missing the chrono and where the brass lands so I can inspect them. But I did get them within a 4" circle at 10 yrds. Is that what you mean?

I did notice pretty good POI-POA for the 10.5gr group. But trying to keep data straight and limited by time, I did not pay enough attention to that.

Now the next group 11.2 should be the only group, so I can be more of a shooter and we will see how that goes. If accuracy falls apart, then I already decided to move back to 10.5 as my target weight.

ModGlock17
07-25-2011, 16:54
+1 on the write up! Same guns, bullet weight, primers, brass, and powder that I use so this is especially helpful. I look forward to the results north of 10gr! 10.5 is my target round. Thanks again! Oh, COAL? I set mine at 1.255 as it seems to feed a bit better than 1.260.

I do have a caliper somewhere, but not at hand. I basically eyeballed and kept the setup same or under BVAC/GArm's COAL. And made sure the test round(s) would load in dry firing.

ModGlock17
07-25-2011, 21:02
Upon further reflection, I think pushing above what was done with 11gr+ group is futile.

It’s about the sound barrier and the ability to break it with sufficient margin.

The 10.8gr sample had large std with a data point that seemed like an aberration, but it tells a story about breaking the sound barrier caused instability, thus inaccuracy. At 68F, the SBarrier is around 1124fps at sea level. The 95F day pushes it to around 1145fps (varies by the square root of temperature in degree Kelvin).

Now if you’d break the barrier with sufficient margin, you’d maintain accuracy. The GArms 165gr sample at 1250fps was always accurate for me.

But at 11gr of Blue Dot, the space within 10mm is full without packing. This means Blue Dot is simply not the powder to drive a 180gr bullet sufficiently pass the sound barrier to maintain accuracy, using a 10mm case.

So if you picked Blue Dot and 180gr bullet, you inherently picked subsonic reloads, which should be quite accurate for target shooting. I agree that around 10.5gr is a good load for 180gr bullet subsonic. Go slightly above it, and you’re effectively asking for inaccurate rounds with large speed standard deviation.

If you want transonic, you’d have to pick lighter bullet, or a powder that is stronger per weight unit.

_The_Shadow
07-25-2011, 21:26
I don't think the sound barrier has anything to do with accuracy that is achievable with Blue Dot, but some bullets are affected by speed and rotation, friction and drag.

Blue Dot can be used in a slightly compressed load which can actually improve the burn characteristics...

The S&W1006 running 200XTP's at 1200 fps are very accurate using Blue Dot.
The accuracy of my 44 magnums bothe pistol and rifle at speeds well over the sound barrier are deadly accurate with Blue Dot.

Taterhead
07-26-2011, 08:04
I don't think the sound barrier has anything to do with accuracy that is achievable with Blue Dot, but some bullets are affected by speed and rotation, friction and drag.

Blue Dot can be used in a slightly compressed load which can actually improve the burn characteristics...

The S&W1006 running 200XTP's at 1200 fps are very accurate using Blue Dot.
The accuracy of my 44 magnums bothe pistol and rifle at speeds well over the sound barrier are deadly accurate with Blue Dot.

I agree with you completely. I do not think that the speed of sound is at issue with the plated bullets. I believe that the bullet constuction is the culprit. They simply have a speed limit, as acknowledged by the manufacturer, but I think it is a good deal south of what the manufacturer claims.

Transonic velocites can affect the stability of bullets of certain shapes (typically rifle bullets), but I was recently hammering away at a steel target @ 7/8 mile with a 25-06 Speer BT. It was not impacted by transonic flight at all. I have not found the shorter pistol bullets to be affected by the sound barrier either. Blue Dot under a 180 XTP is very accurate with velocities ranging from 1000 fps to 1230 fps, and all throughout the transonic range. As are any other projectiles pushed by Blue Dot like 165 grain Sierras.

In my experience, you could push the Berry's plated clear above supersonic speeds and groups would continue to get worse not better.

_The_Shadow
07-26-2011, 09:39
Plated bullets being a blend of a lead bullet and a jacketed bullet performance at reduced jacketed bullet cost...this is the key! The manufacture is electroplating/copper depositing to a lead core, the thinner the more the manufacture makes, the thicker the better for the shooter. Too thin it will shear, errode thru friction as it travels the bore which gets worst with increased speeds.

Speer's Gold Dots are said to be plated but seem to be thicker. Maybe the plating process is different or better, but they seem to work much better!

15GLOCKGUY
08-01-2011, 20:31
Blue Dot is all I use in 10MM. Both are GLOCKS. One G-20 and one G-29. I use a 8.6 grain medium load with either 180 TMJ or 180 JHP. Best accuracy is out of the G-20 with a Hornady XTP 180 grain.

g29guy
08-28-2011, 03:15
I have no experience with power pistol, but bought a pound of it to try its metering capabilities for a hard cast medium-hot load.

I have loaded it starting at 7.9 grains and worked up to 8.7 grains.

Any experience with hard cast and power pistol? I have had good results with blue dot and 800x with HC, but wanted something that meters better for target/range.

Ill get back with results as soon as i can shoot them.

Glock 29 23 lb spring, kkm 4.75" barrel

1.255 coal
300 cci primers
starline brass once fired
power pistol powder
180 grain tcfp hard cast bullets

glock20c10mm
11-22-2011, 18:29
Originally posted this in another thread for hubcap500 and brought it over here per the advice of nickE10mm. As a side note, I am only human and have been known to make a mistake or two:supergrin:, but was careful to and believe I did copy all information correctly. Still, you guys know the drill...start with a lesser charge...and work your way up...watching for pressure signs from your setup...:)
Think I stumbled across something for ya. Curiosity got the best of me and I started poking around.

From Mike McNett -

200gr XTP, COL = 1.260, CCI350, 11.2gr Blue Dot, claims it's at 38,600 PSI

G29 = 1250fps
G20 = 1311fps
6" KKM = 1421fps
10" Contender = 1566fps


As for comparison to a "MAX Book Load", my Hornady Manual 6th Edition claims -

200gr XTP, COL = 1.260, WLP, 9.4gr Blue Dot, ???PSI

Colt Delta Elite (5" barrel) = 1150fps


Definitely looks to me like some data you could play with! Not thinking your going to get any better data to play with as McNett has actual PSI listed for ya. Have Fun!:)

_The_Shadow
11-22-2011, 18:50
I wish someone could actually post the picture of that page in the Hornady #6 Manual...

I posted the picture of a supplement from Speer...here is a link,
http://i1086.photobucket.com/albums/j441/_The_Shadow/Speer10mmSupplmentData-1.jpg

glock20c10mm
11-22-2011, 19:10
I wish someone could actually post the picture of that page in the Hornady #6 Manual...

I posted the picture of a supplement from Speer...here is a link,
http://i1086.photobucket.com/albums/j441/_The_Shadow/Speer10mmSupplmentData-1.jpg
No problem, I'll get it for you relatively shortly.

glock20c10mm
11-22-2011, 19:42
Hornady 6th Edition listing for 10mm Auto -

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s271/glock20c10mm/Ammo%20Pics/P1060289.jpg

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s271/glock20c10mm/Ammo%20Pics/P1060291.jpg

Really sucks we can't just use the "" code around here.

Edited to add; sorry about the flash somewhat washing out some of the text, but I think it's still all readable, and w/o the flash was worse.

_The_Shadow
11-22-2011, 20:54
Thanks for the pictures, it confirms my thoughts!
As for comparison to a "MAX Book Load", my Hornady Manual 6th Edition claims -

200gr XTP, COL = 1.260, WLP, 10.7gr Blue Dot, ??? PSI

Colt Delta Elite (5" barrel) = 1250fps

That is why I asked...the above post listed the 200 grain XTP as using 10.7 grs Blue Dot, but the picture shows it to be the 180 gr. XTP which is what I had suspected.

I have taken the 200XTP to 1180-1200 from my S&W using 10.5 grains of Blue Dot and consider it to be max!

glock20c10mm
11-22-2011, 20:58
Thanks for the pictures, it confirms my thoughts!


That is why I asked...the above post listed the 200 grain XTP as using 10.7 grs Blue Dot, but the picture shows it to be the 180 gr. XTP which is what I had suspected.

I have taken the 200XTP to 1180-1200 from my S&W using 10.5 grains of Blue Dot and consider it to be max!
Thank You for the correction! Fixing it now.

_The_Shadow
11-22-2011, 21:09
Glock20c10mm, You are very welcome...I am just a sticular for the details, because of safety! It has kept my self and my guns safe for 35+ years. Some guns may actually be able to handle that loading but it would be pushing the envelope, especially on the 100 degree days.

While firefighting the attention to details have kept my people and I safe also...Some actually say I'm anal! LOL :)

glock20c10mm
11-22-2011, 21:29
Glock20c10mm, You are very welcome...I am just a sticular for the details, because of safety! It has kept my self and my guns safe for 35+ years. Some guns may actually be able to handle that loading but it would be pushing the envelope, especially on the 100 degree days.

While firefighting the attention to details have kept my people and I safe also...Some actually say I'm anal! LOL :)
Me too with the details. But, just got another reminder I'm still human. I HATE making those types of simple mistakes. It wasn't like I was doing a calculation on how to retrieve a 10mm bullet back from orbit. Glad you pay attention. Continue to stay safe out there. Anal?! Nah.:supergrin:

XmmAUTO
12-18-2011, 22:49
Here is some data from back in July
Enjoy

Crimped .005"
All loads shot through stock barrel
20# Wolff spring

-- CHRONOGRAPH DATA --
FIREARM: Glock 20 DATE: 7/21/11 CAL: 10mm Auto
LOAD: Winchester Case
135 Nosler JHP
12.0 gr Blue Dot
CCI 300
1.26 OAL
Temp 63 F
Elev Approx 1000' ASL
Velocity Dev.
1171.0 -130.1
1300.0 -1.1
1287.0 -14.1
1365.0 63.9
1310.0 8.9
1308.0 6.9
1350.0 48.9
1277.0 -24.1
1355.0 53.9
1288.0 -13.1
Average: 1301.1
Ave. Dev.: 36.5
Std. Dev.: 55.2
95% Prob.: 41.6
High: 1365
Low: 1171
Ext. Spd.: 194
 
CALIBER: 10mm Auto
MUZZLE VELOCITY: 1301.0 fps
BULLET WEIGHT: 135 gr.
BALLISTIC COEFFICIENT: 0.121
SIGHT HT.: 0.27 in.
ZEROED AT: 100 Yds.
INCLINE ANGLE: 0 deg.
WIND: 0 mph
STANDING TARGET
ATMOSPHERE: Army Metro Absolute
43 F./4500 ft./24.98 in. HG/78% R.H.
'G1' STANDARD FLAT BASE
Range Vel. Energy Drop Path
0 1301.0 507 0.00 -0.3
10 1265.4 480 0.10 0.9
20 1231.8 455 0.43 1.8
30 1200.0 432 0.98 2.5
40 1170.3 411 1.77 3.0
50 1142.6 391 2.81 3.2
60 1117.0 374 4.13 3.1
70 1093.3 358 5.72 2.8
80 1071.6 344 7.60 2.2
90 1051.5 331 9.78 1.2
100 1032.9 320 12.28 0.0

TRAJECTORY CROSSES LINE OF SIGHT AT 2.2 & 100 yds.
PATH IS 3.2 IN. OVER LINE OF SIGHT AT 53.3 yds.
BORE ANGLE IS 11.9834 MINUTES OR 3.55 MILS
SPEED OF SOUND = 1102.9 fps

-- CHRONOGRAPH DATA --
FIREARM: Glock 20 DATE: 7/21/11 CAL: 10mm Auto
LOAD: Winchester Case
135 Nosler JHP
12.5 gr Blue Dot
CCI 300
1.26 OAL
Temp 63 F
Elev Approx 1000' ASL
Velocity Dev.
1331.0 10.3
1315.0 -5.7
1318.0 -2.7
1256.0 -64.7
1357.0 36.3
1384.0 63.3
1251.0 -69.7
1346.0 25.3
1338.0 17.3
1301.0 -19.7
1331.0 10.3
Average: 1320.7
Ave. Dev.: 29.6
Std. Dev.: 39.9
95% Prob.: 28.1
High: 1384
Low: 1251
Ext. Spd.: 133
CALIBER: 10mm Auto
MUZZLE VELOCITY: 1320.0 fps
BULLET WEIGHT: 135 gr.
BALLISTIC COEFFICIENT: 0.121
SIGHT HT.: 0.27 in.
ZEROED AT: 100 Yds.
INCLINE ANGLE: 0 deg.
WIND: 0 mph
STANDING TARGET
ATMOSPHERE: Army Metro Absolute
43 F./4500 ft./24.98 in. HG/78% R.H.
'G1' STANDARD FLAT BASE
Range Vel. Energy Drop Path
0 1320.0 522 0.00 -0.3
10 1283.5 494 0.10 0.9
20 1248.9 468 0.41 1.8
30 1216.1 443 0.95 2.5
40 1185.3 421 1.72 2.9
50 1156.6 401 2.74 3.1
60 1129.9 383 4.01 3.1
70 1105.3 366 5.56 2.7
80 1082.6 351 7.40 2.1
90 1061.6 338 9.53 1.2
100 1042.3 326 11.97 0.0

TRAJECTORY CROSSES LINE OF SIGHT AT 2.2 & 100 yds.
PATH IS 3.12 IN. OVER LINE OF SIGHT AT 53.3 yds.
BORE ANGLE IS 11.6861 MINUTES OR 3.46 MILS
SPEED OF SOUND = 1102.9 fps

-- CHRONOGRAPH DATA --
FIREARM: Glock 20 DATE: 7/21/11 CAL: 10mm Auto
LOAD: Winchester Case
135 Nosler JHP
13.0 gr Blue Dot
CCI 300
1.26 OAL
Temp 63 F
Elev Approx 1000' ASL
Velocity Dev.
1399.0 56.1
1257.0 -85.9
1386.0 43.1
1332.0 -10.9
1365.0 22.1
1284.0 -58.9
1322.0 -20.9
1342.0 -0.9
1399.0 56.1
Average: 1342.9
Ave. Dev.: 39.4
Std. Dev.: 50.1
95% Prob.: 40.9
High: 1399
Low: 1257
Ext. Spd.: 142
CALIBER: 10mm Auto
MUZZLE VELOCITY: 1342.0 fps
BULLET WEIGHT: 135 gr.
BALLISTIC COEFFICIENT: 0.121
SIGHT HT.: 0.27 in.
ZEROED AT: 100 Yds.
INCLINE ANGLE: 0 deg.
WIND: 0 mph
STANDING TARGET
ATMOSPHERE: Army Metro Absolute
43 F./4500 ft./24.98 in. HG/78% R.H.
'G1' STANDARD FLAT BASE
Range Vel. Energy Drop Path
0 1342.0 540 0.00 -0.3
10 1304.5 510 0.10 0.8
20 1268.8 483 0.40 1.7
30 1234.9 457 0.92 2.4
40 1203.0 434 1.67 2.8
50 1173.1 412 2.65 3.0
60 1145.2 393 3.89 3.0
70 1119.4 376 5.39 2.7
80 1095 .5 360 7.18 2.1
90 1073.6 345 9.25 1.2
100 1053.4 333 11.62 0.0

TRAJECTORY CROSSES LINE OF SIGHT AT 2.3 & 100 yds.
PATH IS 3.03 IN. OVER LINE OF SIGHT AT 53.4 yds.
BORE ANGLE IS 11.3529 MINUTES OR 3.36 MILS
SPEED OF SOUND = 1102.9 fps

-- CHRONOGRAPH DATA --
FIREARM: Glock 20 DATE: 7/21/11 CAL: 10mm Auto
LOAD: Winchester Case
135 Nosler JHP
13.5 gr Blue Dot
CCI 300
1.26 OAL
Temp 63 F
Elev Approx 1000' ASL
Velocity Dev.
1399.0 -29.8
1436.0 7.2
1425.0 -3.8
1391.0 -37.8
1438.0 9.2
1453.0 24.2
1480.0 51.2
1430.0 1.2
1407.0 -21.8
Average: 1428.8
Ave. Dev.: 20.7
Std. Dev.: 27.7
95% Prob.: 22.6
High: 1480
Low: 1391
Ext. Spd.: 89
CALIBER: 10mm Auto
MUZZLE VELOCITY: 1428.0 fps
BULLET WEIGHT: 135 gr.
BALLISTIC COEFFICIENT: 0.121
SIGHT HT.: 0.27 in.
ZEROED AT: 100 Yds.
INCLINE ANGLE: 0 deg.
WIND: 0 mph
STANDING TARGET
ATMOSPHERE: Army Metro Absolute
43 F./4500 ft./24.98 in. HG/78% R.H.
'G1' STANDARD FLAT BASE
Range Vel. Energy Drop Path
0 1428.0 611 0.00 -0.3
10 1387.1 577 0.09 0.7
20 1347.7 544 0.35 1.5
30 1310.0 514 0.81 2.1
40 1274.0 487 1.47 2.5
50 1239.9 461 2.35 2.7
60 1207.6 437 3.45 2.7
70 1177.4 416 4.79 2.4
80 1149.2 396 6.38 1.9
90 1123.1 378 8.24 1.1
100 1099.0 362 10.36 0.0

TRAJECTORY CROSSES LINE OF SIGHT AT 2.6 & 100 yds.
PATH IS 2.71 IN. OVER LINE OF SIGHT AT 53.5 yds.
BORE ANGLE IS 10.1556 MINUTES OR 3.01 MILS
SPEED OF SOUND = 1102.9 fps

-- CHRONOGRAPH DATA --
FIREARM: Glock 20 DATE: 7/21/11 CAL: 10mm Auto
-- CHRONOGRAPH DATA --
FIREARM: Glock 20 DATE: 7/21/11 CAL: 10mm Auto
LOAD: Winchester Case
135 Nosler JHP
CCI 300
14.0 gr Bluedot
1.26 OAL
Temp 75F
Elev Approx 1500 ASL
Velocity Dev.
1414.0 -19.8
1439.0 5.2
1420.0 -13.8
1452.0 18.2
1412.0 -21.8
1453.0 19.2
1409.0 -24.8
1410.0 -23.8
1419.0 -14.8
1502.0 68.2
1487.0 53.2
1413.0 -20.8
1428.0 -5.8
1428.0 -5.8
1421.0 -12.8
Average: 1433.8
Ave. Dev.: 21.9
Std. Dev.: 28.4
95% Prob.: 16.3
High: 1502
Low: 1409
Ext. Spd.: 93

_The_Shadow
12-18-2011, 22:58
Thanks for posting the data, great format BTW! :wavey:

mpatch
01-15-2012, 19:14
G20 6" LWD
CCI 350
mixed brass
180gr HP plated unknown maker
7.8 gr Power Pistol
oal 1.26"
chony about 15 feet away
5 shot string
Low 1144
High 1170
Av 1153
Es 26.xx
sd ? forgot to write it down

same as above with stock barrel
low 1091
high 1141
es 50
sd 23

Any Cal.
03-04-2012, 23:55
Posting fail...

Kamikaze1384
03-05-2012, 20:40
I just started reloading a few weeks ago. I started working up a load today with Unique.

155g RMR bullets, 10.2g unique, new star line brass. Glock 29sf. I'm going to chronograph tomorrow. It was starting to swell, and I feel this is the max before you start compressing the powder. Nothing exploded though out of a stock 29.

preventec47
03-17-2012, 11:46
I found this 1996 ALLIANT 10mm Load Data and converted it into a much
easier to read and print document. I am providing the original and the
"enhanced version" with the powder in order of burn rate and also the
density of the each powder. I suggest you down load and print the
enhanced verison at full resolution if possible. I am just now learning
how this image shack works.

http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/2633/alliant10mm1996loaddata.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/845/alliant10mm1996loaddata.jpg/)
http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/7400/loaddata10mmalliant1996.th.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/818/loaddata10mmalliant1996.jpg/)

Merrixs
04-29-2012, 04:17
So I have been slowly working up to find the maximum powder charge of the above components in MY G20. I do not intend to shoot the maximum all the time if even ever, I just want to know where it's at. The only reason I am sharing is to give others, with the same components, an idea of where their maximum load might end up if they should choose to try to find it.

My max load ended up at 12.0gr. The brass looked fine at 12.0, but I shot 4 rounds of 12.2 yesterday and one of them gave me a good smile. The other 3 had hints of wanting to smile, but all 4 showed the primers starting to flatten. I am confident the worst one could not have been more then 0.05 different then the rest, so I am going to play it safe and say I'm done.

glock20c10mm
04-29-2012, 10:36
So I have been slowly working up to find the maximum powder charge of the above components in MY G20. I do not intend to shoot the maximum all the time if even ever, I just want to know where it's at. The only reason I am sharing is to give others, with the same components, an idea of where their maximum load might end up if they should choose to try to find it.

My max load ended up at 12.0gr. The brass looked fine at 12.0, but I shot 4 rounds of 12.2 yesterday and one of them gave me a good smile. The other 3 had hints of wanting to smile, but all 4 showed the primers starting to flatten. I am confident the worst one could not have been more then 0.05 different then the rest, so I am going to play it safe and say I'm done.
Thanks for sharing.:thumbsup:

Would have been fun to know the velocity you reached with the 12.2gr loading. I believe it's reasonable to guess you would have cleared 1350fps. And I'm wondering if you weren't bumping or achieving 1400fps being that you were using an extended LoneWolf barrel.

Anyway, awesome work. I am wondering if the 12.2gr load was compressed? And if so, how heavily? And depending on the answer to that I wonder if 12.2gr would have smiled if a non magnum primer was used. Thanks again!:wavey:

Merrixs
05-04-2012, 06:28
Your welcome.

I tried to find someone with a crony the day I went testing but now luck. I guess I will just have to buy one someday.

After I added the powder I shook the case to let it settle down. I do believe the bullet was pushing down on the powder, but blue dot is a medium to large flake and it didn't seem to have a problem with a little less room. I do have some non mag primers on hand, so I will give them a try sometime.

On a side note, while I was working up to max with 2400 and 180gr bullets, 13.5gr was all that would fit in the case before i needed extra pressure to seat the bullet the last couple thousandths (truly compressed). I never reached high pressure signs either.

glock20c10mm
05-04-2012, 11:06
Your welcome.

I tried to find someone with a crony the day I went testing but now luck. I guess I will just have to buy one someday.

After I added the powder I shook the case to let it settle down. I do believe the bullet was pushing down on the powder, but blue dot is a medium to large flake and it didn't seem to have a problem with a little less room. I do have some non mag primers on hand, so I will give them a try sometime.

On a side note, while I was working up to max with 2400 and 180gr bullets, 13.5gr was all that would fit in the case before i needed extra pressure to seat the bullet the last couple thousandths (truly compressed). I never reached high pressure signs either.
Great info. Hardly anyone brings up 2400 powder with the 10mm Auto.

Yes, a chronograph would be great, even a cheap one being better than nothing. I'm slowly piecing reloading stuff together to get into it myself.

You said you never reached high pressure signs with 13.5gr-2400 w/180gr bullet. Did you also use magnum primers with that load?

With either the 2400 and Blue Dot loads did you go with a COL over 1.260" for more powder capacity?

Merrixs
05-04-2012, 17:23
I was using magnum primers with the 2400 as well. With both powders I maintained 1.260" OAL.

glock20c10mm
05-04-2012, 18:26
I was using magnum primers with the 2400 as well. With both powders I maintained 1.260" OAL.
That helps put it into a clearer perspective. Thanks again for sharing.

CanyonMan
06-28-2012, 17:54
Great info. Hardly anyone brings up 2400 powder with the 10mm Auto.Yes, a chronograph would be great, even a cheap one being better than nothing. I'm slowly piecing reloading stuff together to get into it myself.

You said you never reached high pressure signs with 13.5gr-2400 w/180gr bullet. Did you also use magnum primers with that load?

With either the 2400 and Blue Dot loads did you go with a COL over 1.260" for more powder capacity?



Craig,


I don't have much to add here, but I used 2400 in the G20 waaaay back years ago when I first got a 10mm, probablt 14/15 years ago ?? Because I shoot so much 2400/Unique/H110 in the big bores, I had plenty 2400 on hand. I was using 13+ grs with a Beartooth 200gr cast bullet for a tad over 1200fps, stock barrel.

I finally landed on a "sweet spot' with blue Dot, so that is about all I use in the 10mm now, but the 2400 worked fine (at least with the HC bullets) and was very accurate out at extremely long range. I used standard 300 CCI primers. I just never liked mixing a mag primer with 2400. Doable, Just was not what I do/did.

I guess I'm just saying, that I really have no problem with 2400 in the 10mm with a 200 gr bullet. I used it for a deer load and a stuff hit the fan load out on the place for a long time, until, as I said I discovered that BD was giving me some what better results. Now I see so many on here usng LS powder and it has aroused (sp) my interest, so I may try that.

2400 in 10mm, I liked it and it worked great. But I am a "major" 2400 fan..


Stay safe !






CM

glock20c10mm
06-28-2012, 19:41
Craig,


I don't have much to add here, but I used 2400 in the G20 waaaay back years ago when I first got a 10mm, probablt 14/15 years ago ?? Because I shoot so much 2400/Unique/H110 in the big bores, I had plenty 2400 on hand. I was using 13+ grs with a Beartooth 200gr cast bullet for a tad over 1200fps, stock barrel.

I finally landed on a "sweet spot' with blue Dot, so that is about all I use in the 10mm now, but the 2400 worked fine (at least with the HC bullets) and was very accurate out at extremely long range. I used standard 300 CCI primers. I just never liked mixing a mag primer with 2400. Doable, Just was not what I do/did.

I guess I'm just saying, that I really have no problem with 2400 in the 10mm with a 200 gr bullet. I used it for a deer load and a stuff hit the fan load out on the place for a long time, until, as I said I discovered that BD was giving me some what better results. Now I see so many on here usng LS powder and it has aroused (sp) my interest, so I may try that.

2400 in 10mm, I liked it and it worked great. But I am a "major" 2400 fan..


Stay safe !






CM
Sounds like 2400 is a good "Honorable Mention" for 10mm. Not the best, but respectable.

Is 2400 a flame thrower (lots of muzzle flash) like Blue Dot?

dm1906
06-28-2012, 20:28
Sounds like 2400 is a good "Honorable Mention" for 10mm. Not the best, but respectable.

Is 2400 a flame thrower (lots of muzzle flash) like Blue Dot?

It's a flame thrower, especially heavier loads in short barrels. I use a lot of it, but I need better performance in longer barrels (16-24"). Use magnum primers and start with a low charge and work up. The 2400 burn rate is slower than BD and LS, and little faster than AA9.

CanyonMan
06-29-2012, 06:41
Sounds like 2400 is a good "Honorable Mention" for 10mm. Not the best, but respectable.

Is 2400 a flame thrower (lots of muzzle flash) like Blue Dot?



about the same perhaps. I know it has never bothered me in any kind of way, or blinded me..... I am sure there are better powders and with lower muzzle flash. But I just like the BD and the 2400. BUT, I am on the road to trying out the LS and take a look see at it as well. :wavey:



Later







CM

dm1906
06-29-2012, 12:18
Sounds like 2400 is a good "Honorable Mention" for 10mm. Not the best, but respectable.

Is 2400 a flame thrower (lots of muzzle flash) like Blue Dot?

Some things to consider:

Just noticed your username, and will assume you are shooting a 20C. This presents a unique situation when considering full power loads.

More gas/flash will result in more gas/flash in your face (view). Returns on increased power rounds will be less comparative performance, while increasing the volume of gas. You will have to decide the balance between sufficient velocity and acceptable gas levels. While it can be a benefit, in regards to muzzle flip, you will reach a point when it works against you, and kills accuracy and handling characteristics. The 20C, in OEM form, is not the best candidate for full power (or higher) loads for these reasons. Best performance will be found with faster powders and modest velocities. If you want more than that, you'll have to get a standard Glock or aftermarket barrel. Or..... If you want the big bang and huge muzzle/port flash, work up your loads accordingly. Also, in case you haven't considered it, DO NOT fire a "C" gun, or any vertically ported barrel, from inside a vehicle or indoors with a low ceiling. High-flash, slow powders can set fire to the headliner/ceiling, or cause other damage. It can also be very unpleasant during low-draw hip firing.

Unless you are seriously considering higher power loads, do yourself a favor and get another barrel. Additionally, your slide is considerably lighter than non-C models, so you'll have to compensate with a heavier RSA, as well.

Otherwise, if your intent is to shoot near OTC load levels, stay away from the slower powders. There a lot of good options in faster powders. HS7, Autocomp, HS6, AA5, 800X, WSF, Power Pistol, Unique, W231/HP38 (in order of slower -> faster). There are many others, but these are common and produce good results. Don't exceed modest published charges, and always work up to the max.

drew02a
07-05-2012, 16:23
I've been reloading with Blue Dot and bought some 135 grain Nosler HPs for fun

Most accurate load out of my Glock 20C so far is
New Starline Brass
CCI #300 primers
13.0 grains of Blue Dot
135 Grain Nosler HP
1.25" OAL

I know I'm not getting the same velocity I could with a faster powder, but it's a really nice load. I loaded with 13.5gr of powder too and the groupings started opening up just a little. I think the real sweet spot will be somewhere around 13.2-.3

dm1906
07-05-2012, 22:01
I've been reloading with Blue Dot and bought some 135 grain Nosler HPs for fun

Most accurate load out of my Glock 20C so far is
New Starline Brass
CCI #300 primers
13.0 grains of Blue Dot
135 Grain Nosler HP
1.25" OAL

I know I'm not getting the same velocity I could with a faster powder, but it's a really nice load. I loaded with 13.5gr of powder too and the groupings started opening up just a little. I think the real sweet spot will be somewhere around 13.2-.3

Blue Dot is best with 180 gr. and larger bullets, perhaps down to 155 gr. at maximum loads. Smaller should be using a faster powder, such as 800X, AA7/5, Unique (try it, you'll like it for 135's), for the same velocity (and faster) and accuracy you are seeing, at close to half the price (for powder), and a cleaner burn. The smaller bullets just accelerate too fast to get a complete burn with Blue Dot, which is likely why you started to see a loss of accuracy at modest velocities. I use BD a LOT for most of the full power stuff, and some nukes, but it isn't for every load. Dense, slow powders are more expensive by the pound, require a lot more per charge, and yield modest results with light bullets. If you want to continue using BD (nothing wrong with it, really), try reducing your C.O.L. if you can, and use magnum primers, before increasing powder charge (start at a lower charge and work up again). You may improve the results considerably.

[edit]
Just noticed your pistol is a "C". That changes things quite a bit. Increasing gas volume (such as with slower powders) will decrease accuracy, with little velocity gain once out of the comfortable range for the bullet/powder combo. Faster burning powders will help considerably, in this case.

drew02a
07-05-2012, 22:51
Thanks,
I mostly use Blue Dot for 200gr HPs and fire them from a 6.5" barel. Like you said, slow powder is great with heavier bullets and longer barrels, because it has time to build pressure and burn completely. The 135gr loads were just for fun since there's not even a real practical use for it if you load it at max velocity.

I was mostly surprised by the accuracy I was getting. The light bullets stabilize nicely in the OEM Glock barrel

dm1906
07-06-2012, 01:00
Thanks,
I mostly use Blue Dot for 200gr HPs and fire them from a 6.5" barel. Like you said, slow powder is great with heavier bullets and longer barrels, because it has time to build pressure and burn completely. The 135gr loads were just for fun since there's not even a real practical use for it if you load it at max velocity.

I was mostly surprised by the accuracy I was getting. The light bullets stabilize nicely in the OEM Glock barrel

I hear ya. I've done (and do) some things for no other reason than just the fun of it. I've stumbled onto some real discoveries in the process, too. Practical is for when you're wearing your serious hat.

SodaThal
07-11-2012, 13:11
Hi All,
Finally got registered and have some questions.
Curently I'm loading 165grn Rem GSHPs behind 11.5grns of Blue Dot, using PMC and or Win Brass, Fed 150 primers, OAL 1.258". In a Stock G20sf with no signs of over pressure.

The question is, when should I use the 22# spring I have and have any of you used Mag primers with this 165grn bullet and load? TIA for the replys!

drew02a
07-11-2012, 13:15
...The question is, when should I use the 22# spring I have and have any of you used Mag primers with this 165grn bullet and load? TIA for the replys!

There's no definitive answer for when to use a heavier recoil spring, but in general, it's a good idea to use it with heavier bullets and hotter powder loads. A good gauge is how far your brass is flying. If it's bouncing off the ceiling, or flying more than a few feet away from you, a heavier recoil spring might be in order.

Yondering
07-11-2012, 19:39
The question is, when should I use the 22# spring I have and have any of you used Mag primers with this 165grn bullet and load? TIA for the replys!

I would use the 22# spring all the time, unless you have function issues with weaker ammo.

Don't bother with magnum primers in the 10mm. It's neither necessary or helpful.

Taterhead
07-11-2012, 22:45
Hi All,
Finally got registered and have some questions.
Curently I'm loading 165grn Rem GSHPs behind 11.5grns of Blue Dot, using PMC and or Win Brass, Fed 150 primers, OAL 1.258". In a Stock G20sf with no signs of over pressure.

The question is, when should I use the 22# spring I have and have any of you used Mag primers with this 165grn bullet and load? TIA for the replys!

I switched to a 22# spring for a while but switched back to the stock RSA. I got failures with hot loads with the heavier spring, and it did not do much to tame the brass ejection. The 17# stock RSA is 100%. Also, felt recoil is softer with a lighter spring. The harsher forward slide return from the 22# spring made it a bit longer for me to get back on target. All in all, I found the stock spring easier to shoot; and it has been 100% for function. I replace it every 3000 rounds.

What Yondering said about mag primers is correct: really is not essential for 10mm.

SodaThal
07-12-2012, 00:36
Thanks for the info guys, it helps out alot! Since I don't have a chrony, would any of you happen know what the velocity and energy may be with that load(or any 165grn load with 11.5grns of Blue Dot)? I will be getting one soon hopefully.

PerfectShooter
07-21-2012, 22:40
Removed

Yondering
07-22-2012, 14:28
delete

SDGlock23
08-13-2012, 12:01
8grs Unique loaded to 1.250" shooting Montana Gold JHP. CCI LP primers (I think). Average velocity was 1143 fps out of stock G20sf. I had previously loaded up some 10.5gr Blue Dot and that got me 1165 out of the stock G20sf...same 180gr MG JHP.

Got some glock-belly on the brass which isn't surprising, but then again no so grand at this power level...but it is a book max load too. The above BD (10.5gr) load exhibited some pretty ugly bulging too, I certainly wouldn't want to push past the 11gr listed max for BD in the stock setup. FWIW, I know 6.5gr will shoot a 180gr (.40 SW) over 1100 fps so the above 10mm load isn't really giving me much gain for the extra 1.5gr powder. 1200 fps is possible with a 180gr .40 SW, but in the 10mm you don't have to be quite as powder specific, there are several powders that will do that and meter better at the same time.

I was just messing around trying to find a good mid-level plinking load, which so far Power Pistol has delivered well. 8.5gr averages just over 1200 fps with a 180gr JHP. I don't know why I settled on 1200 fps as my general use 180gr speed, but I feel it gives a good balance. Not on the extreme side of things but still shooting something befitting of the 10mm.

nickE10mm
08-13-2012, 12:50
...I was just messing around trying to find a good mid-level plinking load, which so far Power Pistol has delivered well. 8.5gr averages just over 1200 fps with a 180gr JHP. I don't know why I settled on 1200 fps as my general use 180gr speed, but I feel it gives a good balance. Not on the extreme side of things but still shooting something befitting of the 10mm.

Yep.... My first pet load EVER was 8.6gr PP over a 180gr XTP (CCI300 primers). Got about 1250+ in a 6" Fusion. Great middle warm load for the field.

SDGlock23
08-13-2012, 19:37
Very nice! I'm really liking Power Pistol, it meters well and it's no slouch in delivering good performance. I've grown quite fond of it in the .45 Super as well.

SDGlock23
08-15-2012, 19:40
165gr Sierra JHP @ 1.260"
9.8gr Power Pistol w/ CCI LP
Stock G20sf

Average: 1,311 fps/ 630 ft-lbs

Brass looked great (was using 1x Remington Nickle) and feel the book max of 10grs is perfectly safe. I'm really liking Power Pistol more and more. 10gr is shown to get 1314 fps and I'm right there with 9.8gr. So far with 10mm, Power Pistol has been very, very close to giving me what they said it will, and I like that.

I tested some Longshot with the same setup as above today also and while it's velocity averaged higher, PP was a little more consistent. I'm sure it could be driven faster, but in the stock setup, I think 1300+ is plenty fast for a 165gr.

_The_Shadow
08-15-2012, 21:37
Thanks for the report. I find the Power Pistol provides better velocity than other powders (Blue Dot LongShot) in the shorter barreled pistols like G-29...

pasky2112
08-16-2012, 16:20
Very nice! I'm really liking Power Pistol, it meters well and it's no slouch in delivering good performance. I've grown quite fond of it in the .45 Super as well.
Good to see someone else using MG 180's (JHP, CMJ, etc.) I can't find a better bullet for the price. I just got a case of 155g JHP this week to try out this week. Anyone know how well those MG JHP's (155g, 180g's) expand? Wondering if they'd b good for hunting or SD/CCW. I don't have a range to do my own testing. I can't test on prisoner's in this country.
Also, 7.3g Power Pistol in .40 w/ CCI SPP in my G23 stock..or KKM for that matter, is a great balance of power and accuracy. They'll take down plates even on an edge hit. I haven't tried PP in 10mm G20FS yet. Any pet accurate loads you might suggest for 10mm using BD, PP, AA#7, AA#5, Silohouette or W231? I'm just starting to reload 10mm for the first time this week. But I've loaded .40's all year.

Anyone load 10mm rounds in .40 S&W cases? Thoughts? I'd like to shoot .40's in my G20FS for relatively cheap plinking and practice. I shot some of my hotter .40 reloads (MG 180 JHP 1.125" COAL @ 1100 fps avg on chrono) in my G20 and they seems just fine.

TIA for replies!

Yondering
08-16-2012, 22:18
The Montana Gold JHP's expand OK in the 10mm, but shed their jackets quickly.

Yes, I load 10mm rounds in 40 S&W cases. As long as you're long-loading to 10mm OAL (say, 1.240-1.260" or so), just use 10mm load data. You'll probably find that pressure and velocity are slightly lower than the same loads in 10mm brass.

Shooting 40 S&W in the 10mm barrel also works fine, in the Glocks. Not advisable in other guns.

SDGlock23
08-17-2012, 09:29
I've only "jug tested" the expansion of the MG 180gr JHP and Yondering is right. I only tired it in the .40, using a max load of Power Pistol and it expanded okay (about .63 ") but nothing to get excited about and the jacket came off and separated into five pieces. I would expect slightly better expansion at full 10mm velocities but don't expect the jacket to stay on the bullet.

I've had good results from Power Pistol in the G20sf. TiteGroup does pretty well as does Unique, but in all honesty they all shoot very well. As a side note, if you ever load up plated bullets, remember to not over crimp them as it can cause key holing. I loaded up some with Longshot (180gr and 200gr plated) one time and it didn't shoot groups, it shot patterns...and pretty rough patterns at that. I learned my lesson on that one.

I've not really paid much attention to AA9 and AA5 accuracy wise, but would assume it's pretty good as the numbers are fairly consistent. However I've never got anywhere near the advertised velocity AA9 or AA5 claims for the 10mm...even out of the 6" KKM bbl (AA says they use 5" bbl). For example AA5 claims almost 1200 with a 180gr but I didn't even break 1100 fps from the G20sf. With AA9 I was getting slower than advertised speed with the 6" kkm bbl as well. Longshot does pretty good in getting advertised velocity, not quite as close as some of the Alliant powders, but good nonetheless.

Since I know the .40 has no problem breaking 1100 fps with a 180gr bullet, I just stick to it for that velocity range. If I want a little faster, I load up the 10mm. Having .40's and the 10mm, I don't see a point in loading the 10mm real light personally, but I could understand if one didn't have a .40 to load for.

That's one thing I like about the .40/10mm, if you load for both you have pretty much everything covered. You can load light .40's for game use or whatever, normal/mid range .40's for duplicating factory loads. Warm .40's pretty much duplicate mid-level 10mm loads and visa versa, then the 10mm can scoot them on out a bit faster still if you get the itch for extra speed.

WilliamDahl
09-13-2012, 13:43
Promo is the same burn rate as Red Dot, but a little denser. Less charge weight is required.

From what I've read on Alliant's site, Promo is the same by weight, but not by volume to Red Dot, thus the charge weight remains the same, but the volume is different. So, you need to reset the volume on whatever type of adjustable volume based powder measure that you might be using. If you are one of those folks who actually measures the weight for each and every charge, you can continue to use the same method that you have been using, but you might notice a difference in the level of the power in the brass afterward.

RDub01
09-15-2012, 11:34
Hello
I might pick up some Pro Reach if I can find any in town.. Give it a try with 180gr bullets and Starline brass, again with what I can find..
I wonder where a good place to start is..?
I see Alliants shotshell data Pro Reach is about 10grs behind Blue Dot, with equal loads, for more velocity than BD loads.. Haven't seen PR on any powder burn charts yet..
But this powder looks like a high energy powder and sure sounds like interesting candidate for research with 10mm..

dm1906
09-15-2012, 13:50
Hello
I might pick up some Pro Reach if I can find any in town.. Give it a try with 180gr bullets and Starline brass, again with what I can find..
I wonder where a good place to start is..?
I see Alliants shotshell data Pro Reach is about 10grs behind Blue Dot, with equal loads, for more velocity than BD loads.. Haven't seen PR on any powder burn charts yet..
But this powder looks like a high energy powder and sure sounds like interesting candidate for research with 10mm..

The Pro Reach burn rate (ONLY) falls between Blue Dot and Longshot. Powder densities though, are very different, requiring varying case volume capacities. You can't get enough Pro Reach into a 10mm case to be practical with any bullet weight. It's a (high energy/magnum/long distant) shotgun powder, and should be limited to that. Some shotgun powders work well in some handgun and rifle loads, but NOT all. For example, Blue Dot is a "Magnum Shotshell" powder, as it was originally formulated and intended, and was labeled as such. Now, it's labeled "Magnum Shotshell & Handgun Powder". Other modern powders are labeled similarly, and some that were labeled like this aren't now.

RDub01
09-15-2012, 17:10
The Pro Reach burn rate (ONLY) falls between Blue Dot and Longshot. Powder densities though, are very different, requiring varying case volume capacities. You can't get enough Pro Reach into a 10mm case to be practical with any bullet weight. It's a (high energy/magnum/long distant) shotgun powder, and should be limited to that. Some shotgun powders work well in some handgun and rifle loads, but NOT all. For example, Blue Dot is a "Magnum Shotshell" powder, as it was originally formulated and intended, and was labeled as such. Now, it's labeled "Magnum Shotshell & Handgun Powder". Other modern powders are labeled similarly, and some that were labeled like this aren't now.

Well there ya have it.. Thanks

chuck11976
12-10-2012, 12:50
I've been reloading with AA#9 for my Hornady XTP 180 grain bullets using new Starline brass and CCI300 primers. What I would like is to get some suggestions for using the same components but with Power Pistol. I don't need nuclear loads, I just want to develop a nice, powerful self defense load for my stock G20. Any help would be appreciated.

_The_Shadow
12-10-2012, 13:52
Alliant shows the following with 180 grain JHP bullets from 5.5" barrel COAL 1.250"

Power Pistol 8.7 grains @ 1,240 fps 34,900 psi


You could start lower than this 8.0 grains will probably be about 1180 fps for your setup.

chuck11976
12-10-2012, 15:47
Where did you find that Alliant info? I can't find it anywhere, not even on their website.

_The_Shadow
12-10-2012, 16:56
Chuck11976, I collect the data over many years of handloading (33+), if you wish I'll email you a PDF from the data I posted. But that is all they show for the 10mm using a 180 grain JHP bullet. I have tested this data from my guns, Power Pistol is a little faster than Blue Dot and using a little less makes it more ecconomical.

You can't collect enough data resourse materials to make decisions.

RDub01
12-10-2012, 20:18
I've been reloading with AA#9 for my Hornady XTP 180 grain bullets using new Starline brass and CCI300 primers. What I would like is to get some suggestions for using the same components but with Power Pistol. I don't need nuclear loads, I just want to develop a nice, powerful self defense load for my stock G20. Any help would be appreciated.

Hello
There is a group shot with Power Pistol here at the end;

http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1441315


9.0grs behind an XTP was one the most accurate loads shot through this factory G20-SF.
But.. I only found this load after carefully working up from 8.4grs in 0.2grn increments, and paying close attention to case head measurements.

Jay/g20
12-24-2012, 01:47
12/23/2012 11:30 cloudy 27 degrees light n.w @ 1-3 mph 726 feet above sea level

Equipment:

Alpha Master Chrony {I have to check batteries to see if they are at least 7.5 volt}
10ft. from Chrony shooting distance
Glock G20 / KKM Precision 6" drop-in / 17 bs. tungsten guide rod /spring

Load test:

PowerPistol 8.7 grain
WLP Primer
Starline Nickel plated *new* .960 case length /fresh out of the box
1.260 C.O.A.L
crimp .422
Hornady XTP 180 grain
6 shot average 1348 fps.

I question the accuracy of the Chrony due to cold and possible low 9 volt battery. The cases landed 4 o'clock 12 ft away. Controllable recoil and seemed accurate. Shot 60 yrds. @ 16" round gong target 5 out of six hit, my bad on 1st shot looked away for ejected case.

nickE10mm
01-02-2013, 12:14
12/23/2012 11:30 cloudy 27 degrees light n.w @ 1-3 mph 726 feet above sea level

Equipment:

Alpha Master Chrony {I have to check batteries to see if they are at least 7.5 volt}
10ft. from Chrony shooting distance
Glock G20 / KKM Precision 6" drop-in / 17 bs. tungsten guide rod /spring

Load test:

PowerPistol 8.7 grain
WLP Primer
Starline Nickel plated *new* .960 case length /fresh out of the box
1.260 C.O.A.L
crimp .422
Hornady XTP 180 grain
6 shot average 1348 fps.

I question the accuracy of the Chrony due to cold and possible low 9 volt battery. The cases landed 4 o'clock 12 ft away. Controllable recoil and seemed accurate. Shot 60 yrds. @ 16" round gong target 5 out of six hit, my bad on 1st shot looked away for ejected case.

The velocities seem close, but you may have just been standing a couple feet too close to your chrony and the blast beat the bullet to the chrony.

hubcap500
02-04-2013, 11:44
Chuck11976, I collect the data over many years of handloading (33+), if you wish I'll email you a PDF from the data I posted. But that is all they show for the 10mm using a 180 grain JHP bullet. I have tested this data from my guns, Power Pistol is a little faster than Blue Dot and using a little less makes it more ecconomical.

You can't collect enough data resourse materials to make decisions.

I'd like the info too if you don't mind.

_The_Shadow
02-04-2013, 13:14
Alliant data PDF from 2006, Sent to Hubcap500!

g29guy
04-02-2013, 19:08
I finally purchased a chrono to help with numbers.

220 grain hard cast from s&s casting
1.26 oal med crimp
assorted brass
300 cci primer
70 degrees
40 % humidity
920' asl
blue dot powder 8.8 grains
shot from Kimber eclipse custom II

1095 fps Low
1190 fps
1101 fps
1119 fps
1130 fps High

ave 1111 fps
dev 35

brass/primers were in perfect shape

Taterhead
04-02-2013, 19:18
That sounds like a very nice load there g29guy. Thanks for posting that. I imagine that the powder burn was pretty clean?

g29guy
04-02-2013, 19:50
That sounds like a very nice load there g29guy. Thanks for posting that. I imagine that the powder burn was pretty clean?

Definitely a clean burn for Blue Dot, Ill try to do a work up with my Glock 29 and KKM barrel and get some faster results. I know this can be worked much faster but my Kimber is new and im trying to get the spring combo and fps matched up. Dont want to push it yet.

g29guy
04-02-2013, 20:05
10 mm
TCFP 180 grain lead Mid Atlantic
1.26 oal med crimp
assorted brass
300 cci primer
70 degrees
40 % humidity
920' asl
Power Pistol powder 7.9-8.7 grains
shot from Kimber eclipse custom II

7.9 g P.P. ave 1182fps
8.1 g P.P. ave 1213fps
8.3 g P.P. ave 1226fps
8.5 g P.P. ave 1240fps
8.7 g P.P. ave 1257fps

All could be house loads. noticed recoil jump at 8.7 grains

nickE10mm
04-03-2013, 09:22
10 mm
TCFP 180 grain lead Mid Atlantic
1.26 oal med crimp
assorted brass
300 cci primer
70 degrees
40 % humidity
920' asl
Power Pistol powder 7.9-8.7 grains
shot from Kimber eclipse custom II

7.9 g P.P. ave 1182fps
8.1 g P.P. ave 1213fps
8.3 g P.P. ave 1226fps
8.5 g P.P. ave 1240fps
8.7 g P.P. ave 1257fps

All could be house loads. noticed recoil jump at 8.7 grains

8.6gr PP under a 180gr XTP is a favorite load of mine.... 1250fps RELIABLY.... good stuff!

Kwesi
04-03-2013, 20:00
12/23/2012 11:30 cloudy 27 degrees light n.w @ 1-3 mph 726 feet above sea level

Equipment:

Alpha Master Chrony {I have to check batteries to see if they are at least 7.5 volt}
10ft. from Chrony shooting distance
Glock G20 / KKM Precision 6" drop-in / 17 bs. tungsten guide rod /spring

Load test:

PowerPistol 8.7 grain
WLP Primer
Starline Nickel plated *new* .960 case length /fresh out of the box
1.260 C.O.A.L
crimp .422
Hornady XTP 180 grain
6 shot average 1348 fps.

I question the accuracy of the Chrony due to cold and possible low 9 volt battery. The cases landed 4 o'clock 12 ft away. Controllable recoil and seemed accurate. Shot 60 yrds. @ 16" round gong target 5 out of six hit, my bad on 1st shot looked away for ejected case.

I chrono'd these:

PowerPistol 8.6 grain
WLP Primer
Starline Nickel (not virgin)
1.250 C.O.A.L
Precision Delta180 grain FMJ
Average 1196 fps.
EAA Witness Limited

Big difference!

harley45
04-26-2013, 07:53
I bought a mold that was part of a group buy over on cast boolits a while ago that casts a WFN and has pins for a HP and a cup point and finally got a chance to chrono it last night. With the cup point pins installed the boolit weighs 195 GR. load was 9.0 Blue Dot with CCI Large Pistol Primers.
AVG: 1192
ES: 69
SD: 19.2
Chrono was a CED
It's an accurate load but did leave a slight amount of leading in the last inch or so of my 5 inch 1911. I may lower it to 8.5 as I was kinda looking for closer to 1100FPS

tilefish
06-10-2013, 21:09
I am trying to find a starting point for Power Pistol or HS-6 under a Speer 155 grn TMJ. Can anyone point me at one?

This is the closest I can find but its for lead...

LFP 9.5 gr Power Pistol 1,320 fps 1.25" Fed 150 Alliant
Suggested starting load: 8.6 gr
Pressure: 33,000

_The_Shadow
06-10-2013, 21:53
Alliant 2006 shows a 10mm with 150 gr JHP with 9.7gr @ 1,415 fps 35,600 psi

I just did a Pull Down of Buffalo Bore 180 and that data is shown here: http://10mm-firearms.com/factory-10mm-ammo-pull-downs/buffalo-bore-180gr-sierra-jhp-pull-down/
They are using 10.0 grains of PP in that load.

tilefish
06-10-2013, 22:16
Alliant 2006 shows a 10mm with 150 gr JHP with 9.7gr @ 1,415 fps 35,600 psi

I just did a Pull Down of Buffalo Bore 180 and that data is shown here: http://10mm-firearms.com/factory-10mm-ammo-pull-downs/buffalo-bore-180gr-sierra-jhp-pull-down/
They are using 10.0 grains of PP in that load.

Thanks Shadow, I can work with that. I figure I can start around 9 gr Power Pistol and see how that goes.

I also had some HS-6 sitting around and I just finished a batch of 50, using a recipe very similar to recipe in Bongo Boy's thread. I will break out the Power Pistol in the morning and load up another 50.

I am really looking forward to testing some loads tomorrow! All I have put through the G20 thus far was a box of American Eagle junk.

SDGlock23
06-29-2013, 15:30
Ran some handloads through the new G20 Gen4, and here is my Alliant data.

Glock 20 Gen4 (stock)

80 degrees outside, 1000 ft elevation.

1x Remington brass, CCI LP primers. Velocities are averages.

180gr MG JHP, 8.7gr Power Pistol @ 1.250": 1,210 fps (34 fps ES)

180gr MG JHP, 9.0gr Power Pistol @ 1.250": 1,245 fps (9 fps ES!, 5 fps SD)

MG = Montana Gold. 8.7gr wasn't as consistent as usual for PP but I'm more than pleased with the 9.0gr load. I feel this load fired from a better supported KKM barrel, with it's tighter tolerances and different twist rate would have been faster, but I'm pleased with 1,250 fps. I don't feel the need to push a 180gr JHP anything beyond 1200-1250 fps, so this fits the bill perfectly.

SDGlock23
06-30-2013, 12:58
Since the G20 was still dirty from yesterday I decided to run a couple more loads. Two with 3N38 and one more with Power Pistol. Here is the Power Pistol data.

Glock 20 Gen4 (stock). About 70 degrees outside, roughly 1000 ft elevation.

1x Midway (Starline?) brass, CCI LP primers. Velocities are averages.

200gr Nosler JHP, 8.0gr Power Pistol @ 1.250": 1,154 fps (21 fps ES)

Yesterday, as noted above, I loaded 9.0gr PP under a 180gr JHP and averaged around 1,250 fps. Today 8.0gr averages just over 1,150 fps, which isn't bad. Neither are barn burners but they're good loads nonetheless and should have no issue dispatching critters. Brass looked fine from the stock G20 barrel, and with either load I feel it would okay to work up and extra .2-.4gr in the stock setup.

SDGlock23
09-01-2013, 14:18
Glock 20 Gen4 bone stock. Around 75-80 degrees out and humid.

180gr PD FMJ, 10.8gr Blue Dot @ 1.255" (1x PMC, Win LP): 1,244 fps (21 fps ES)

200gr Missouri Steeler, 10.5gr Blue Dot @ 1.250" (1x PMC, Win LP): 1,201 fps (28 fps ES)

Both shot very well, brass looked fine in the stock barrel. The Missouri bullet did lead a little, but nothing substantial at all.

Andrew Tacquard
09-10-2013, 16:00
I've been out of the reloading game for about 10 years. Well I got back in to shoot USPSA and IDPA. Shooting production class in both, so no need for 165 power factor, however I started here.

For the powder I wanted something available local. I chose BE, strictly for this reason. The local guy had 1 or 2 cans of various powders and had something like 15 cans of BE. So I figured he order more of it, so it should be in regular supply. Overall, it meters well in my lee pro1000 with the charger bar (I haven't tried the regular cylinders, but should do the same). With my digital scale I can get consistent 5.2 every charge.

Bullets, I got the 1st 180 grain I could find (on Midway). Rainer 180 grain HP. I have since ordered some precision delta 180 FMJ, Rainer FMJ 180, and Berrys 180 FMJ.

Primers, well I had some WLP and Rem. I have since switched to federal as I was getting some light strikes (more with WLP, and very few with the Rem).

These are all random head stamp, and did not check COAL (I know it is various as I can visually see differences). For OAL I set 1.255 (I think about +/- .002 on my digital calipers).

Chrono data was with my G20 Rem primers, Rainer 180 HP, 5.2 BE. Did not get weather, but was warm (probably 85 degrees, with some humidity).
String Velocity
1 910
2 926
3 930
4 913
5 910
6 926
7 935
8 890
9 926
10 931

Number of Shots: 10
Low: 890
High: 935
Average: 920
Extreme Spread (fps): 45.00
Energy (ft. lbs.): 338
Standard Deviation (fps): 13.75


This is right at a 165 for power factor. If I shoot a class with major I will use it. Pistol shot well, no malfunctions. I plan on working towards a 125 power factor for production class to game the game.

nickE10mm
09-12-2013, 14:48
BE = Bullseye

:) I learned something today

_The_Shadow
09-12-2013, 15:16
My Alliant data shows the use of Bullseye (BE)
180 gr JHP over 6.4 grains @ 1,125 fps 35,900 psi

Just understand that if you are not very careful a double charge can fit in the case...

Andrew Tacquard
09-12-2013, 17:03
YES WARNING MUST WATCH THE CASE FOR DOUBLE CHARGE!

Thanks I forgot about that point. I just loaded down a few, if the wx is good ill test them.

Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Ohub Campfire mobile app

SDGlock23
09-21-2013, 16:06
Gen4 Glock 20

180gr FMJ (Precision Delta), 8.0gr Unique @ 1.250": 1,183 fps avg (36 fps ES)

165gr Sierra JHP, 10.0gr Power Pistol @ 1.250": 1, 292 fps avg (38 fps ES)

135gr Nosler JHP, 12.5gr Power Pistol @ 1.250": 1,472 fps avg (1 fps ES)

Brass looked good. Could have gone higher with the 135gr load I'm sure but having no data you gotta start somewhere. It was very consistent though.

littlejohn3rd
10-08-2013, 14:08
Did some testing with 155 gr. Rainiers and Power Pistol and got some great results. I went above the book load of 10.0 gr, as I tried that a few weeks ago and found it to be very safe, no pressure signs whatsoever.

155gr Rainier, Power Pistol powder, 1.25 c.o.l., Fed LP primers, G20 w/6in. LW barrel, 5 shot strings. Temp 60 deg. F.

1. 10.4 gr, 1402 avg, es 55; slight flattening of primers
2. 10.7 gr, 1447 avg, es 56; same slight flattening
3. 11.0 gr, 1490 avg, es 49; same slight flattening, case still ok
4. 11.3 gr, 1551, avg, es 54; still only slight flattening, cases look ok, will have to measure

This compares to 13.3 gr AA#7, 1420 avg, es 13, at what I would call a max load.

From same gun 11.0 800-X gave 1550 fps, but did have higher pressure signs, still acceptable though.

13.1 of Vihta Vouri 3N38 gave 1514 fps avg, es 59, at similar pressures.

I found that at the lighter bullet weights, Power Pistol seems to hold it's own quite well. I have not tested it's flash properties, I heard it has some flash, but it does seem to push the light bullets well. I have some 135 gr tests to further prove this I will post too.

littlejohn3rd
10-08-2013, 14:25
I did some testing with 135 gr. Sierra's today, and got some fantastic results.

135gr. Sierra, Power Pistol powder, G20 w/ 6 in. LW barrel, 1.250 c.o.l., Fed LP primers, 5 shot strings, temp 60 F.

1. 11.8 gr, 1652 avg, es 45; very slight flattening of primer, less than WIN 175 gr Silvertip though.
2. 12.1 gr, 1703 avg, es 74; same slight flattening
3. 12.4 gr, 1707 avg, es 30; same slight flattening
4. 12.7 gr, 1738 avg, es 33; primers still the same, case expansion too much, very very tiny smilies.
5. 13.0 gr, 1771 avg, es 18; primers still only slightly flattened, case expansion too much, tiny smilies showing up.

I wouldn't hesitate to shoot the last couple of rounds in the LW barrel, but I would not shoot them in a factory one. The 12.4 load though I would shoot in a factory barrel and check for case expansion.

This compares to a control load of 14.6 gr AA #7, max in a factory barrel, showed 1521 avg, es 50, from the LW 6 inch.

I did run some Vihta Vouri 3N38, but was getting erratic results, and will have to restest. I did see 1690 fps with 14.0 gr of 3N38, but my es was over 300, with a few shots down at 1390, which I know 14.0 3N38 should be faster than that, so I will retest.

It did seem though that the Power Pistol was giving better velocities than the 3N38 at this lighter bullet weight. I will be buying some Longshot to try and do a comparison when I retest the 3N38.

SDGlock23
11-16-2013, 17:36
Some data for the masses.

Glock 20 Gen4 with 4.6" KKM barrel

180gr Remington JHP, 8.3gr Power Pistol @ 1.250": 1,195 fps avg (14 fps ES)

180gr PD (Precision Delta) FMJ, 10.5gr Blue Dot @ 1.255': 1,212 fps avg (30 fps ES)

The Remington JHP is a favorite of mine, but it doesn't really like a lot of speed, and I didn't really know what to expect from the new barrel, but was looking for a muzzle velocity of around 1,150 which is what I think is about max for this bullet. I'm a little high, but figure 8.0gr should get me there. But either way I like the load and it was nicely consistent.

The Blue Dot load shot well too, nothing outstanding, but it went bang and rather loudly.

Kwesi
11-16-2013, 20:34
Glock23: you seem to be getting better velocity. I chrono'd 180gr PD FMJ @ 1.250 using Win LPP's 8.6gr PP @ 1196. Fired in a EAA Witness Limited. IIRC same barrel length. I've found the Win LPP's to get +20 FPS over CCI's. NOTE: 8.5gr got 1188.

AJE
11-16-2013, 23:44
I've been out of the reloading game for about 10 years. Well I got back in to shoot USPSA and IDPA. Shooting production class in both, so no need for 165 power factor, however I started here.

For the powder I wanted something available local. I chose BE, strictly for this reason. The local guy had 1 or 2 cans of various powders and had something like 15 cans of BE. So I figured he order more of it, so it should be in regular supply. Overall, it meters well in my lee pro1000 with the charger bar (I haven't tried the regular cylinders, but should do the same). With my digital scale I can get consistent 5.2 every charge.

Bullets, I got the 1st 180 grain I could find (on Midway). Rainer 180 grain HP. I have since ordered some precision delta 180 FMJ, Rainer FMJ 180, and Berrys 180 FMJ.

Primers, well I had some WLP and Rem. I have since switched to federal as I was getting some light strikes (more with WLP, and very few with the Rem).

These are all random head stamp, and did not check COAL (I know it is various as I can visually see differences). For OAL I set 1.255 (I think about +/- .002 on my digital calipers).

Chrono data was with my G20 Rem primers, Rainer 180 HP, 5.2 BE. Did not get weather, but was warm (probably 85 degrees, with some humidity).
String Velocity
1 910
2 926
3 930
4 913
5 910
6 926
7 935
8 890
9 926
10 931

Number of Shots: 10
Low: 890
High: 935
Average: 920
Extreme Spread (fps): 45.00
Energy (ft. lbs.): 338
Standard Deviation (fps): 13.75


This is right at a 165 for power factor. If I shoot a class with major I will use it. Pistol shot well, no malfunctions. I plan on working towards a 125 power factor for production class to game the game.

Glad to see this, I came in here looking for some loads to (barely) get over 165pf instead of setting the world on fire with a big boom.

I have a bunch of Power Pistol and WST. I was going to load the PP pretty hot and the WST to get me to major power factor.

SDGlock23
11-17-2013, 07:26
Glock23: you seem to be getting better velocity. I chrono'd 180gr PD FMJ @ 1.250 using Win LPP's 8.6gr PP @ 1196. Fired in a EAA Witness Limited. IIRC same barrel length. I've found the Win LPP's to get +20 FPS over CCI's. NOTE: 8.5gr got 1188.

Kwesi, earlier in the stock Gen4 barrel, I tried 8.7gr PP with a MG 180gr JHP and averaged 1210 fps using CCI LPP's. This time around I am using a brand new KKM 4.6" barrel that I have already fire lapped, and from what I've read, once you do that it's normal to see some velocity gains. Plus a different type of rifling and rate of twist likely have something to do with it too.

Kwesi
11-17-2013, 08:24
Kwesi, earlier in the stock Gen4 barrel, I tried 8.7gr PP with a MG 180gr JHP and averaged 1210 fps using CCI LPP's. This time around I am using a brand new KKM 4.6" barrel that I have already fire lapped, and from what I've read, once you do that it's normal to see some velocity gains. Plus a different type of rifling and rate of twist likely have something to do with it too.

What is fire lapped?

_The_Shadow
11-17-2013, 09:43
Fire Lapping uses several bullets that are treated with abrasive compounds (sort of like valve grinding compounds) when loaded and shot they tend to polish the bore as they are fired through it. Firing many rounds of FMJ or copper jacketed bullets will work over time, just not as fast.

Mainly its used to smooth out machining or tool marks or transition areas.

Kwesi
11-17-2013, 10:05
Thanks Shadow: lots of FMJ's down the pipe.

Andrew Tacquard
11-17-2013, 10:40
Glad to see this, I came in here looking for some loads to (barely) get over 165pf instead of setting the world on fire with a big boom.

I have a bunch of Power Pistol and WST. I was going to load the PP pretty hot and the WST to get me to major power factor.

I couldn't really find much on this either (light loads in the 10mm). I did notice many folks with 40s and 9s shooting Idpa/uspsa for the lighter recoil, and folks downloading 45. With the weight of the glock20 at reduced loads (165 pf) I almost feel like I am cheating.

Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Ohub Campfire mobile app

AJE
11-17-2013, 19:14
I couldn't really find much on this either (light loads in the 10mm). I did notice many folks with 40s and 9s shooting Idpa/uspsa for the lighter recoil, and folks downloading 45. With the weight of the glock20 at reduced loads (165 pf) I almost feel like I am cheating.

Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Ohub Campfire mobile app

It's not cheating just because they didn't think of it :supergrin:

I think it would be good for GSSF too.

Andrew Tacquard
12-28-2013, 16:49
did some more work with the BE today. I have three more pounds of this crap then I am switching. It works, but not my favorite. Anyways, I wanted to switch to lead as it is even cheaper than the plated bullets and I shoot outside. I've heard the BE results in excessive smoke, we'll after the three pounds is gone I'll try something else. Anyways, again looking for a load to shoot uspsa and I came up with something I like. All loads were done in my new G29 (which I love, and will start using in uspsa). Stock RSA no failures of any kind, groups were nice and tight. Mixed head stamp, federal large pistol primers (150), bullseye powder, 1.26" OAL, 200 grain Missouri bullet co steelers, 12 degrees C, 30.25. I am using my Lee load master with the auto disk and list the volume with the powder below for the other lee loaders out there. Velocities were averages, standard deviations were low teens, spreads low 40s. I'll probably load to make major as some day might shoot in something other than production.

3.7 grains (.40) 728 fps power factor - 145
4.0 grains (.43) 765 fps power factor - 153
4.3 grains (.46) 798 fps power factor - 159
4.6 grains (.49) 846 fps power factor - 169 (major!)

WeeWilly
12-29-2013, 12:29
did some more work with the BE today. I have three more pounds of this crap then I am switching. It works, but not my favorite. Anyways, I wanted to switch to lead as it is even cheaper than the plated bullets and I shoot outside. I've heard the BE results in excessive smoke, we'll after the three pounds is gone I'll try something else. Anyways, again looking for a load to shoot uspsa and I came up with something I like. All loads were done in my new G29 (which I love, and will start using in uspsa). Stock RSA no failures of any kind, groups were nice and tight. Mixed head stamp, federal large pistol primers (150), bullseye powder, 1.26" OAL, 200 grain Missouri bullet co steelers, 12 degrees C, 30.25. I am using my Lee load master with the auto disk and list the volume with the powder below for the other lee loaders out there. Velocities were averages, standard deviations were low teens, spreads low 40s. I'll probably load to make major as some day might shoot in something other than production.

3.7 grains (.40) 728 fps power factor - 145
4.0 grains (.43) 765 fps power factor - 153
4.3 grains (.46) 798 fps power factor - 159
4.6 grains (.49) 846 fps power factor - 169 (major!)


4.6gr of Bullseye, the universal charge. Works for my 124gr jacketed in 9mm, 200gr LSWC's in .45 ACP, now Major PF with 200gr G29 loads.

leeward419
02-08-2014, 08:23
180gr PD FMJ, 10.8gr Blue Dot @ 1.255" (1x PMC, Win LP): 1,244 fps (21 fps ES)


I found this same load to be very accurate out of my G20 ( have a 22# recoil spring so I don't have chase brass down to the other end of the range)

How did this load shoot for you?

You also may want tot considerAA9, I found this powder to work really well w/ 180 JHPs. Both the AA9 and Blue Dot loads have been really accurate.

Thank you for posting the FPS, I was looking for confirmation for this load.

Also planning on developing a similar load using Alliant Unique Power.

BE has a pretty fast burn rate and is probably not ideal for this cartridge, but will work.

I have used BE in 45, but got better results with Unique, Do use it in 380, It does smoke with lead but not as bad with JHP or plated. Will switch to AA2 or AA5, power pistol if I can find some or Unique for 380 when I run out of BE. A few pounds of this seems to last FOREVER.

hubcap500
02-10-2014, 18:38
did some more work with the BE today. I have three more pounds of this crap then I am switching.

1 lb. = 7000 gr. 7000/ 5.2 gr. = 1,346.15 charges X 3# = 4,038.46 loads!

Andrew Tacquard
05-18-2014, 17:27
1 lb. = 7000 gr. 7000/ 5.2 gr. = 1,346.15 charges X 3# = 4,038.46 loads!


shooting has been slow, down to one pound, wst next. probably going to a moly coat, bullet lube is just to dirty. anyways, shot at VA/MD sectional
4.6 grains (.49) was 168 pf through the 29, and 173 through the 20. Don't remember the wx, probably 65 F, and avg pressure day.

hubcap500
05-19-2014, 19:30
You've already shot nearly 2900 rounds of 10mm since Feb., and that's slow?:wow::faint: Or do you load other stuff w/BE too?

As for the dirty shooting, you might try powder coating the bullets. Google or YouTube it. Good stuff.

Andrew Tacquard
05-21-2014, 08:05
You've already shot nearly 2900 rounds of 10mm since Feb., and that's slow?:wow::faint: Or do you load other stuff w/BE too?

As for the dirty shooting, you might try powder coating the bullets. Google or YouTube it. Good stuff.


Just 10mm, loading for 2 now. I got my daughter into uspsa as well, she likes slinging lead when it comes to Texas stars. I've got 2k more on the Missouri bullets, Ill look at powder coating.

nickE10mm
07-13-2014, 14:22
Hi all,

Got out to chrono a couple loads today and I just so happened to have a few BD loads ready to shoot.

Fusion 6" 1911 Hunter, fully supported barrel
92 deg, sweltering
200gr XTP over 10.5gr Blue Dot
CCI300 primers
new Starline brass

Low-Hi-Avg-ES-SD
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1192-1271-1241-79-30