Suppressor Information

[obxemt]

YES, PROGLOCK, I did read the FAQs and it's clear as mud, forgive me for posting, but I figure this is the place to go! GT members know their stuff and seem to love to help others. If you get tired of seeing this question here I apologize but I did not find specific information on search. I will confess my ignorance up front!

State and local law does allow for suppressors where I am.

So:

Is paperwork submitted to make you eligable to purchase before you have actually found one? Forms I looked at on "titleii.com" showed a space for make and model. No dealers around here have them, so I am not sure how to begin the process.

It is a $200 tax, not $5, correct?

If I were to get this for say, a USP Tactical, what sound level can I expect? I have read that it is not "silent", just supressed.

So, are they worth it? I want this just for the "toy" value of it, and because I am a HK and pistol fanatic, this seems like it might be the next step in my sickness.

Thanks in advance, I much appreciate it!

[Hackit25]

Bunch of guys at my gun club have USP Tactical's with silencers. I dont know exactly what model they use but without any thing in the can, like water, oil, etc you can expect the gun to sound like a cap gun while indoors.

[ProGlock]

Originally posted by obxemt
YES, PROGLOCK, I did read the FAQs and it's clear as mud, forgive me for posting, but I figure this is the place to go! GT members know their stuff and seem to love to help others. If you get tired of seeing this question here I apologize but I did not find specific information on search. I will confess my ignorance up front!

State and local law does allow for suppressors where I am.

So:

Is paperwork submitted to make you eligable to purchase before you have actually found one? Forms I looked at on "titleii.com" showed a space for make and model. No dealers around here have them, so I am not sure how to begin the process.

It is a $200 tax, not $5, correct?

If I were to get this for say, a USP Tactical, what sound level can I expect? I have read that it is not "silent", just supressed.

So, are they worth it? I want this just for the "toy" value of it, and because I am a HK and pistol fanatic, this seems like it might be the next step in my sickness.

Thanks in advance, I much appreciate it!

Heheh - so long as you at least read it, that's fine.

You don't indicate what suppressor you're considering, so I can't comment on what sort of sound reduction you'll get.

I would not get paperwork filled out beforehand. What you could do before and purchase is get your 2x2" pictures and 2 sets of fingerprints done, that will at least speed up the process in that regard.

The reason you don't want to do the form 4 ahead of time is because only the dealer or whomever you're buying the weapon from will have the serial number. True you could probably just call and ask them which one you'll be getting, but a lot of people, myself included, like to go by the book and fill out the new transfer papers exactly as the previous transfer papers were done, except of course the new transferee.

Suppressors carry a $200 tax stamp.

[r2kba]

Bowers makes a can called the ATAS for the.45 usp pistols( and others ) that is as quiet as my high quality gemtech .22 can.

Best thing to do is be more specific where you LIVE. There is always someone who will do the transfer. ANY FFL can transfer NFA, its just that some of them freak out because it invites scrutiny by the ATF.... I would also try subguns.com and post an inquiry on their NFA forum.

[obxemt]

Originally posted by ProGlock
You don't indicate what suppressor you're considering, so I can't comment on what sort of sound reduction you'll get.

What you could do before your purchase is get your 2x2" pictures and 2 sets of fingerprints done, that will at least speed up the process in that regard.

The reason you don't want to do the form 4 ahead of time is because only the dealer or whomever you're buying the weapon from will have the serial number. True you could probably just call and ask them which one you'll be getting, but a lot of people, myself included, like to go by the book and fill out the new transfer papers exactly as the previous transfer papers were done, except of course the new transferee.

Suppressors carry a $200 tax stamp.

Don't know what supressor... any guidance would be greatly appreciated. The quieter, the better, but I hope that something decent would be in the $300-$500 range.

I have an FBI number. Are new fingerprint cards still required?

So since I should not do the paperwork ahead of time, can I purchase the suppressor and have it shipped to my FFL first? That's what I am getting at, I reckon, I need to have the suppressor to get the paperwork, and vice versa. I don't want to drop cash and then have the paperwork denied and the suppressor sitting at my FFL.

Thanks very much.

[obxemt]

Originally posted by r2kba
Bowers makes a can called the ATAS for the.45 usp pistols( and others ) that is as quiet as my high quality gemtech .22 can.

Best thing to do is be more specific where you LIVE. There is always someone who will do the transfer. ANY FFL can transfer NFA, its just that some of them freak out because it invites scrutiny by the ATF.... I would also try subguns.com and post an inquiry on their NFA forum.

Thanks for the reccommendation.

I live in North Carolina. I have a local FFL dealer (FINALLY!!!) who I am sure would do it. I used to have to drive an hour north or an hour-and-a-half south to get to one.

[RenegadeGlocker]

Originally posted by obxemt


If I were to get this for say, a USP Tactical, what sound level can I expect? I have read that it is not "silent", just supressed

I have a HEMS. The USP/TAC is difficult to suppress, but you can expect to be able to shoot it without hearing protection all day long.

It works better wet, and does NOT require exotic "Grease Application Module" like ATAS-45. I would run from anything that requires more than a little spit in the back to run quiet.

[ProGlock]

Originally posted by obxemt
Don't know what supressor... any guidance would be greatly appreciated. The quieter, the better, but I hope that something decent would be in the $300-$500 range.

I have an FBI number. Are new fingerprint cards still required?

So since I should not do the paperwork ahead of time, can I purchase the suppressor and have it shipped to my FFL first? That's what I am getting at, I reckon, I need to have the suppressor to get the paperwork, and vice versa. I don't want to drop cash and then have the paperwork denied and the suppressor sitting at my FFL.

Thanks very much.

Well, .45ACP in my opinion is sorta hard to get suppressed when compared to smaller rounds obviously, such as a 9mm or .22. I'd say the best you could expect would be to not have to wear ear protection, but even still outdoors it still 'ring' a bit in the ears.

The quietest I've heard (as RenegadeGlocker pointed out) is SWR's HEMS suppressor. It runs for around $975, plus your $200 tax.

The way you should do it is just put down the $$$ to buy the thing, have whomever it is transfer to your FFL on form 3, once it arrives, then you start the form 4 process. Don't worry yourself so much about trying to speed things up. Trust me, the BATF does not concern themselves with approving transfers in what would be considered a expedited manner.

[FreakyBig]

I just recently ordered a .22 suppressor. I knew about the $200 tax stamp, but just found out that my dealer is going to charge me $110 for a transfer fee. Is this a usual amout, I feel like I'm getting screwed here. I expected that the transfer fee would be the same as transfering a handgun and was never told otherwise before I ordered it.

[hcook]

$110!?! ;P Your instincts aren't lying to you. I think you're getting screwed hard, and not in a good way.

[RenegadeGlocker]

Originally posted by FreakyBig
I just recently ordered a .22 suppressor. I knew about the $200 tax stamp, but just found out that my dealer is going to charge me $110 for a transfer fee. Is this a usual amout, I feel like I'm getting screwed here. I expected that the transfer fee would be the same as transfering a handgun and was never told otherwise before I ordered it.

I pay $20.

[FreakyBig]

I usually pay $35 for a transfer through them, which I dont have a problem with. So it really threw me off when the guy told me that it would be that much for the suppressor. I believe they are the only class III in the area, but I'm definitely gonna check around now.

[ProGlock]

For any sort of NFA transfers, I pay $50. That $50 is if I'm buying the weapon from another dealer and they transfer it in for me, not just a regular walk in the door and buy an NFA weapon off their counter. It's probably about average - there are cheaper places, but I like the convenience because they are close to where I work.

[Jakk]

I have paid anywhere from $0 to $100 for a transfer. $25 to $50 seems to be about the average.

You might be able to get your Sheriff to sign the form 4 without you having the S/N, Model, etc filled out yet. Mine has never had a problem filling out a form that way. He is aware of what I already have (since he signed for those as well) and he knows that ATF would deny anything that is not legal.

RenegadeGlocker, I don't think the ATAS "requires" the use of the grease module dohickey. It just makes it handy to squirt the grease in all the way to the back of the can. With my Bowers can (his other .45 can) I just squirt a little hair gel in and let it rip.

[FreakyBig]

I called the guys from Tactical Innovations and they said that $110 is on the higher side, but not an unusually high price (usually $50-100). He said that it was a somewhat fair price for all of the paperwork that the dealer has to do and the amount of time that the suppressor will have to be stored with them. I guess seeing how theyre the only class III dealer in my area and the fact that I've already paid for the damn thing, I dont have many choices but to just pay their high transfer fee. They've kinda got me by the balls here. I'll just learn to do more reasearch in the future before I jump into things like this. ^2

[Jakk]

Don't sweat it that much. Pay the fee and get your can. You'll get years of use out of it. Just be happy you are able to get one. I now live in a no-silencer state. I only get to visit my cans when I go home in the summer and hollidays.

[r2kba]

Originally posted by FreakyBig
I just recently ordered a .22 suppressor. I knew about the $200 tax stamp, but just found out that my dealer is going to charge me $110 for a transfer fee. Is this a usual amout, I feel like I'm getting screwed here. I expected that the transfer fee would be the same as transfering a handgun and was never told otherwise before I ordered it.


Umm... Rip-off!!!!! I get charged 25$ by my dealer. The idea of charging 100+ for Title2 is gouging. It dosent take any more time or effort, and the 'storage' for form4 clearance is NOT a valid reason since it's beyond you're control. I drove 4 hours to pick up a can because another dealer wanted to charge me bogus fee's like this. I'd rather drive, than give someone cash they dont deserve.

[UZIFORME]

I charge $100 for transfer fees. On a repeat customer I would go $50 on a silencer. You want me to store and insure your $10,000 machinegun and deal with the ATF when the transfer goes screwey for $25 not gonna happen here.

Be careful of going to cheap on your dealer. You really do get what you pay for.

[FreakyBig]

I agree UZI, but you also cant compare a $10,000 machinegun to a $200 suppressor.

[ProGlock]

$200 for a suppressor? Man that's cheap, and likely crap. Most good suppressors I buy cost me at least $750, before tax stamp.

[RenegadeGlocker]

Originally posted by ProGlock
$200 for a suppressor? Man that's cheap, and likely crap. Most good suppressors I buy cost me at least $750, before tax stamp.

Depends on application. Wait till you hear my TAC65 for Walther P22. Very quiet, and it was under $150. Agree in principle though, anything centerfire will cost a good bit.

[ProGlock]

Good point RG...any <i>centerfire</i> suppressor for $200 is probably crap ;f

Btw RG, I'd definitely like to hear that one next month. I'm wanting to get SWR's Omega .22 for my P22.

[Kenneth Lew]

I pay $100 per NFA transfer and it does not bother me. Just think of it as being as a secured locker rental.

Kenneth Lew

[r2kba]

Sorry folks I disagree with 100$ transfer fee's. Call me spoiled I guess or something i've never been charged more than 25$.

If its a 10k+ item, ok fine. If you can swing that kinda cash for a gun, you can swing the 100$ dealer 'fee' too I suppose. But on supressors, no, sorry, I'm WELL aware of dealer cost of most supressors, and most dealers make between 50$ and 200$ on a can sale namely the gemtech and other top brands, which is pretty damn good 'payment' for the transfer. Additional fee's of 100$ or more is greedy, and lousy business practice. NFA business is usually a small group of folks/dealers, and I like to think that Title2 dealers are more customer oriented than the typical pistol salesman.


Those tac22-cans are quiet can's considering they are only around 100$+/- and I plan on buying one if ATF ever approves the Form3 that my OTHER .22 can (Tony Gooch) is sitting on going on 9 months now. I also have the Gemtech Vortex2, and I've never heard another muzzle can compare.

[Jakk]

Originally posted by r2kba
I'm WELL aware of dealer cost of most supressors, and most dealers make between 50$ and 200$ on a can sale namely the gemtech and other top brands, which is pretty damn good 'payment' for the transfer.

That is true if you are buying the can from that dealer. If you buying from out of state, and the dealer is just transfering it to you, he does not get any kind of markup. In the instances where you do "buy" from the dealer, there should not be any additional fee. Weather or not you agree with the fee pricing is up to you. If you don't like the price, you are free to find another dealer.

Of course, you should always find out what the guy is going to charge you before you start a transfer through him. If you don't, you have nobody to blame but yourself.

[UZIFORME]

The paperwork and effort required to transfer a $100 is the same as for a $10,000 machinegun. I get to set what my time is worth. A customer who uses a $25 dealer gets just that a dealer who is worth $25. A dealer who does $25 transfers gets the same deal in reverse he gets $25 customers. If your looking at transfering $100 or less silencers and putting them on Lorcins or Jennings then I am sure that $25 dealer will fit the bill for you just fine. If you pay for quality then you will get it.

[r2kba]

Originally posted by Jakk

Of course, you should always find out what the guy is going to charge you before you start a transfer through him. If you don't, you have nobody to blame but yourself.


Thats why I only get charged $25 :)

[r2kba]

Originally posted by UZIFORME
If you pay for quality then you will get it.


It's called competition. If you can get customers at 100$ a pop in NE, go for it.

[RenegadeGlocker]

If dealers would carry inventory, we would not need to transfer through them for most NFA.

It is the dealers who set up their business model to just be paper jockeys, and thus allow it to become a commodity going to the lowest bidder. If that is what you want great, but don't complain when people can find someone who can push the paper for less.

I myself would much rather buy from a stocking dealer, than go through the hassle of buying it myself out of state, fronting the money, waiting on F3s, etc.