RRA TAC M4 versus SA Scout Squad

[stiletto raggio]

Okay, here is the deal: I can get a Rock River AR in the configuration I prefer (shorty stock w/ adjsutable buttplate, 1/8" stainless barrel with muzzle break, quad rail mount) for roughly $1100 all told. I can also get a Springfield Armory Scout Squad with Realtree stock for about $1300. If I get the AR, I would also have to buy a sling mount, foregrip, rail covers, etc, so I think total cost would be aobut the same. I have six milspec mags for each weapon type already (my dad has a pre-ban ColtA1 and I have a SA NM wtih a 4-14x SA scope). The question is this: which should I invest in first? I want to buy both eventaully, but although I ahve the cashflow, I don't want to spend 3 grand on two rifles at the same time just now. I would mount EOTech's on both of them since I have the NM for any really precision shooting I want to do.

Does the Scout Squad have good CQB handling characterstics? I am quite familiar with the M14/M1A weapons family and the overall weight and length would actually be about the same between the two weapons. However, recoil is noticeably higher with a .308 than a 5.56. The Scout has a range, power and penetration advantage, while the AR is easier to accesorize and cheaper to shoot.

I see the Scout as being much more general purpose (it would be a good hunting rilfe, too) while the RRA sems to be a superior CQB weapon.

Thoughts?

[w30olds]

I have a standard M1a from Springfield. While I've not really got to handle the scout in a CQB type application, but I have held and shot one. My friend has a synthetic stock scout with an Aimpoint on it and it's a good weapon. It's a nice package and with the shorter barrel it's pretty easy to move around. Not to mention you get a .308 round for longer shot placement. If you are going to just be shooting at the range and perhaps hunting it would be perfect. I have an Aimpoint mounted on my standard model and it rocks. I'm happy with it.

I also own an AR-15 and if weights an issue for you then go with the AR-15. Hope this helps.

[Shady]

Tough call...

But if you already have an M1A, seem logical to get the AR just to round out your capabilities. For pure fun shooting the AR is hard to beat, and it's easier to clean than the M1A.

Let's muddy the waters... you do know that SA is coming out with a new version of the scout rifle with a 16" barrel just any day now, don't you?

Edited to correct the length of the SA rifle's barrel to 16" rather than 16'. Egads... its the new .5mm howitzer.

[w30olds]

Originally posted by Shady
Tough call...

But if you already have an M1A, seem logical to get the AR just to round out your capabilities. For pure fun shooting the AR is hard to beat, and it's easier to clean than the M1A.

Let's muddy the waters... you do know that SA is coming out with a new version of the scout rifle with a 16' barrel just any day now, don't you?

I have to disagree with you on the cleaning issue. My AR is alot more time consuming to clean than my M1a. Just my opinion. :cool:

[freezinglockin]

Sounds like you're going to end with both anyway. But, the only thing I can add is this, if you have never had the chance to fire a 16" AR in the dark without a flash hider (post ban), you should try it. Blinding. It did not seem to matter on ammo brands either. My M1A Scout rifle, with muzzle break, wasn't bad at all. About 15% of the flash of a post ban AR. As far as I am concerned, that would be the only downfall of the AR, other than it not being a .308. I have both, and I would consider them both worthy CQB weapons.

[Shady]

Originally posted by w30olds
I have to disagree with you on the cleaning issue. My AR is alot more time consuming to clean than my M1a. Just my opinion. :cool:

Didn't say faster... just easier. ;) Being able to break the AR into components makes the job easier. I always have to fight with the chamber brush in the M1A. You can't get behind it to remove it when it's a tight fit. Patches snag on the flash suppressor, breech access in the AR is easier, and I don't have to worry about the bolt slamming shut on me while cleaning (that drives me nuts and I never got around to buying the do-hickey to block it open). Love the rifle, hate cleaning it.

[w30olds]

Originally posted by Shady
Didn't say faster... just easier. ;) Being able to break the AR into components makes the job easier. I always have to fight with the chamber brush in the M1A. You can't get behind it to remove it when it's a tight fit. Patches snag on the flash suppressor, breech access in the AR is easier, and I don't have to worry about the bolt slamming shut on me while cleaning (that drives me nuts and I never got around to buying the do-hickey to block it open). Love the rifle, hate cleaning it.

I do like the ability to break the AR into seperate parts. Makes it a lot easier to clean that way. I hear you about the bolt slamming on your hand. I've been lucky so far and have managed to avoid the crushing bolt blow ;P After some practice they both are rather straight forward to clean and put back together. Still have to say the M1a is easier and faster to clean though;P

[stiletto raggio]

I second that. The direct gas system of the AR makes it a huge pain to clean. To properly clean an M1A, you just have to clean the barrel, chamber and action: no damn star cluster. Neither is really too bad, though.

Also, I saw the SOCOM and though it looked cool, but I really think 18" is the shortest I want to go with a .308. Also, I have no need for a tritium front sight. Obviously there is some overlap in capabilities (hence my dilemma), but I would definitely rather use a 5.56 indoors, which is the only place I can see the SOCOM being an advantage over the Scout.

[artherd]

I don't think they will be even close in weight.

Maybe if the AR was scoped with a heavy NightForce, had a bipod, and 3 full mags cliped together, then MAYBE it would get CLOSE to a completely bare magless M1A 18" barrel.

Otherwise you're talking 4-5lbs+ in weight.

Black Hills 77gr SMK loads have flash suppressant in them, they are supposed to be very good.

[ToyotaMan]

Originally posted by Shady
Tough call...

But if you already have an M1A, seem logical to get the AR just to round out your capabilities. For pure fun shooting the AR is hard to beat, and it's easier to clean than the M1A.

Let's muddy the waters... you do know that SA is coming out with a new version of the scout rifle with a 16" barrel just any day now, don't you?

Edited to correct the length of the SA rifle's barrel to 16" rather than 16'. Egads... its the new .5mm howitzer.

Where does this information come from? Their website or another source? Can you provide the source? Any pictures?

[Shady]

Here's a pic.

http://www.imagestation.com/picture/sraid91/p13549c0ce3233eb1ac4c9ff58d26c868/fa6b894e.jpg

Do a google search for Springfield Socom 16 and you'll find a couple links. Battlerifles.com has a thread or two running on the topic. 16" Barrel, HK style front sight.

Not sure about going down to 16" on a .308 either... 18" seems to be pushing it. Love to try it myself and find out.

[stiletto raggio]

Okay, I decided to order the RRA right now, because it will take a3-6 weeks to get it. I'll be able to shoot it over spring break if it gets to my FFL in less than five.

Here is what I ordered:

RRA Elite CAR A4
Mid-length free-float quad rail mount
stainless 1/8" twist Wilson match barrel with Tactical Muzzle Break
Entry buttstock

Total cost: $1009

I'll be ordering an adjustable buttplate from Fulton Armory ($55 bucks or so) and a Holosight soon, as well as the obligatory vertical foregrip.

Any particular suggestions on the Holosight/EOTech? I am thinking the Tactical model 512, but is it worth 90 bucks for a hood and AA battery usage? The batteries will be cheaper and easier to find, but it makes the sight weigh a tiny bit more and take up an inch more space on the gun.

[www.glock19.com]

good move as all springfield M1as are now going to come with mostly new springfeld parts as opposed to left over govt M14 parts .This is a bad thing as springfield parts are *cough* inconsistant to put it nicely