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Eye Cutter
08-02-2004, 19:48
Guys and Gals:

To those who compete, why do you participate in IPSC or IDPA matches?

To all those who do not compete, why not? Does it really ingrain bad habits?

How do you practice your gun handling and marksmanship skills? How do you simulate the pounding of the adrenalin rush?

Is practical or combat shooting really practical? Your views on this controversial topic please.

:cool:

Eye Cutter
08-02-2004, 19:55
...it is a lot of fun

...self-discipline around firearms is non-pareil

;f

jasonub
08-02-2004, 20:00
ipsc is not practical and does not teach tactics but its hell of fun!

idpa ditto, though they do give you some rules to protect yourself. they made too much rules. you should only engage target x at this port. though you can see it way back. do a tactical reload here. you cant use this kind of gun though you carry it.

The bottom line is both are games and you need points to win.

But in real life its different. tunnel vision. targets behind you etc.

my 2cents

jundeleon
08-02-2004, 20:28
Its true gun games teach you how to shoot with precision/accuracy and to handle guns with proper care and discipline. As a hobby, its fun although expensive to pursue.

However, as a training ground for self defense situations, to me it doesnt seem to be completely practical or relevant. I think it will never totally replicate real world shooting situations where the targets shoot back and a host of dynamic circumstances are present. IMHO a more relevant, practical training would be the one which simulate actual shooting scenarios like the ones used by police and feds in the us where real service guns firing simunitions (paintball-like bullets) are utilized.

JuDGe
08-02-2004, 20:32
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
...it is a lot of fun

...self-discipline around firearms is non-pareil ;f

And I get to hang-around with superb guys who share the same passion! ^c

antediluvianist
08-02-2004, 21:08
I don't compete - yet - because I am fairly new to shooting and my eyesight is bad.

But it's something I may do in the future, especially when I retire, just for the hell of it. Do they have contests using shotguns?

batangueno
08-02-2004, 21:33
I join matches (IPSC or IDPA) for fun, friends and food (join Team ParatingBusog). ;f

ogiebb
08-02-2004, 21:38
i shoot IPSC because it makes me a better IDPA shooter;f ;f ...i shoot because its fun and i get to piss off some "Rambo" junkies and range geeks...

ogiebb
08-02-2004, 21:40
Originally posted by batangueno
I join matches (IPSC or IDPA) for fun, friends and food (join Team ParatingBusog). ;f


;z he he Mang enteng pa order naman po ng Lomi at tapsi..

Eye Cutter
08-02-2004, 22:14
IPSC Shotgun is not as popular as IPSC Pistol but there is almost always a shotgun event when major matches are held at Armscor.

;K

Eye Cutter
08-02-2004, 22:15
to all the defensive mindset junkies:

so how do you hone your skills in the local setting?

:cool:

Eye Cutter
08-02-2004, 22:23
during the recent Eastern Police District Cup held at Armscor, it was an eye opener to see how our men in blue perform in their gun handling and marksmanship skills! wala ba silang yearly qualification and proficiency tests?

mikey177
08-03-2004, 02:43
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
to all the defensive mindset junkies:

so how do you hone your skills in the local setting?

Hey, who are you calling a junkie?! (just kidding) :)

I compete occasionally (about once a quarter) just so they don't kick me out of my gun club. ;Q For non-competition practice, I also run courses of fire, but with a defensive mindset (sometimes shooting strong-hand, sometimes weak hand, while running, while behind cover, kneeling, in reduced light, etc.). Also, shooting with other like-minded individuals helps me to critique areas or skills where I may be deficient.

I also work on close-quarter shooting skills at home using an airsoft replica of my gun, since doing the same at a range may freak the ROs out. I'm still trying to convince people to join me in airsoft force-on-force simulations. These are quite difficult to set up on one's own.

But hey, I like going to competitions too, just because the other BoGs will be there ;)

Alexii
08-03-2004, 05:54
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
to all the defensive mindset junkies: so how do you hone your skills in the local setting?:cool:

He he-- in other words, me, mikey, and darwin.;f

Whenever I have the chance to visit the range, I try to expend 100 rounds doing various defensive drills, mostly shooting on the move. The objective here is to hit the targets consistently while moving. Whenever possible, I shoot also with the lights switched off at the range (using a Surefire white light). You'd be amazed of how much smoke a gunfire generates in darkness and therefore becomes a tactical consideration.

At home or in the office, I practice draw/move/shoot (dryfire) similar to what I do when in the range. While behind the wheel, I play out in my mind scenarios such as sudden stops, flank/rear attack, plus the "jimmying-with-my-car-door" robbery attempt.

I don't compete but I believe it instills good gun safety habits. It doesn't offer everything for training the warrior within, but at least it's something.;)

Allegra
08-03-2004, 06:42
I'm amused by a lot talk that ipsc shooters would just charge blindly in a room or just stand in the open and wouldnt know how to take cover :)
I'm thinking if a guy was shooting at me, the first thing I would do was run or run for cover. Unless I'm too shocked to move hehe

a lot of police and pilitary ipsc shooters here have been in gunfights and they have done pretty well . Pero, I think they won the fight because the bgs were not really skilled with guns.

IMO, the biggest advantage of IPSC competition is that it trains you to be able to think on your feet.
Sa ipsc, your shooting, moving, changing mags etc while simultaneously engaging static and moving targets in the fastest order under pressure. Ang hirap nun! Lalo na when there are jams, reengages , missed activators etc.
The basic skills become automatic freeing your mind to think of other things ( like tactics ).
Di ba advantage yun sa fight?

bulm540
08-03-2004, 06:48
I'd rather be with an IPSC shooter than with anybody else when sh^% happens.

4eyes
08-03-2004, 07:05
Originally posted by bulm540
I'd rather be with an IPSC shooter than with anybody else when sh^% happens.

I will add "good" to the above. Watching master and upper "A" class IPSC shooters perform is like watching modern day ballet. Those guys shoot accurately from any body position and brass runs out of the gun about 3-4 inches apart. I wish I could have been "wired" that fast. I know, slightly, a couple team shooters that run 500 rounds a day through their guns as practice. And more rounds a day just prior to a match.

Alexii
08-03-2004, 07:09
Originally posted by Allegra
IMO, the biggest advantage of IPSC competition is that it trains you to be able to think on your feet.
Sa ipsc, your shooting, moving, changing mags etc while simultaneously engaging static and moving targets in the fastest order under pressure. Ang hirap nun! Lalo na when there are jams, reengages , missed activators etc.
The basic skills become automatic freeing your mind to think of other things ( like tactics ).
Di ba advantage yun sa fight?

You're correct there, Allegra, especially when a hundred pair of eyes are boring down on your neck watching your every move. The pressure alone it exerts down your shoulder makes the exercise relevant to the development of a self defense mindset.

I've read somewhere that it takes 3000 correct repetitions of an action for it to become second nature to the individual. Get the fundamentals down pat so you can deal with other unpredictable variables of the gunfight. So it boils down to supervised, regular practice. It helps if you have someone there with you to tell what you've been doing right or wrong. Not to mention it's more fun.;)

Allegra
08-03-2004, 08:15
Dun sa other glock forum
i gather that ipsc shooters are at a disadvantage at close range
wala kasi alam na tactics defense
ex. - bubunot ka ba when the bg is at spitting distance with a knife?
Ako tatakbo :)hah! di ako kaya abutin nun

the bigger the distance, mas advantage sa ipsc shooter

doctabako
08-03-2004, 08:23
There's another thread here in GT related to this topic which is now 55 pages long with more than 1,200 replies entitled A good competitor does not a gunfighter make (http://www.glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=254971&highlight=ipsc+shooting+and+tactics) and the replies range from amiable to hostile indicating the controversy and passion that this topic entails to some people.

My take on this is that engaging in gun games IS trigger time(Fun time, the best kind ;f) and as they say practice makes perfect. If you're methodical enough in your approach,huge rewards can be gleaned from diligent practice as opposed to those who compete just to throw slugs downrange without regard to improving how they do it.
A good competitor should be under no illusion that what he is doing will automatically make him a better gun fighter when the SHTF as various things do come to play and some people aren't wired for fighting(some become passive and/or take flight). Engaging in gun games will make you better prepared as you become proficient with the use of your weapon and conversely your limitations with it as well. All of which will serve you in good stead when you develop the mindset and summon enough courage to use it when necessary. :)

casmot
08-03-2004, 09:01
Before I started joining competition I was a little scared of my gun. :) I would go to an indoor range and finish 50 rounds as fast as I could ;I. Heck, all I know was the basic gun handling stuff. After joining my first IDPA competition (thanks eyecutter ;W) I was addicted. It was fun, you get to learn but most important, I started to trust my gun. It was no longer a bomb. It became just a tool that you don't have to be afraid of, if you use it properly.

Originally posted by Allegra
IMO, the biggest advantage of IPSC competition is that it trains you to be able to think on your feet. Sa ipsc, your shooting, moving, changing mags etc while simultaneously engaging static and moving targets in the fastest order under pressure. Ang hirap nun! Lalo na when there are jams, reengages , missed activators etc.
The basic skills become automatic freeing your mind to think of other things ( like tactics ).
Di ba advantage yun sa fight?

I agree. After a while it all becomes second nature.

9MX
08-03-2004, 09:16
I compete because:

1. IPSC shooting is a childhood dream
2. I've always been fascinated by guns
3. I like the confidence it gives me knowing that should the need arises, i have a higher probability of hitting a perp;f
The bonus is..hanging out with BOGs and learn new things in the process:cool:

Eye Cutter
08-03-2004, 09:20
problema ko ngayon, wala na yung kaba ko when i'm on the line. i'm so used to the experience that it does not matter who're watching me or how i'd do in a stage.

competitive shooting makes you think on your feet, fast! just like when you're on the street. and that is a good thing. nagiging second nature na ang gun handling skills mo, e. wherever you look and whenever you present your pistol, naka align na agad sights mo. nagiging automatic. and that is also another good thing...

it is my opinion that those who compete, even if they don't win, are much more confident and capable with their firearms.

yun lang

;K

9MX
08-03-2004, 09:23
Originally posted by Eye Cutter

it is my opinion that those who compete, even if they don't win, are much more confident and capable with their firearms.

yun lang

;K

korek! we become more one with the gun:cool:

too many minds....no mind;)

rhino465
08-03-2004, 09:26
Originally posted by bulm540
I'd rather be with an IPSC shooter than with anybody else when sh^% happens.


I agree with Remo. How practical IPSC is (or is not) depends entirely on the mindset of the individual shooting the matches. Being able to shoot very quickly and accurately as well as engage multiple targets is a very valuable set of skills that you simply can't develop to the same degree anywhere else. Certainly there is more to defensive or combat shooting, but you learn those things elsewhere.

Here is an example of an A-class USPSA shooter handling the situation:

http://www.thetimesonline.com/articles/2004/07/29/news/lake_county/dcff9b91e1ccd2ae86256ee000014014.txt

jerrytrini
08-03-2004, 15:53
That's why I shoot IPSC. Competition shooting makes me think (really fast) on my feet.
Clearing a structure e.g. house, business, warehouse etc is a tedious task for LEO's. Each section of a structure is a threat no matter how trivial it may be. Be aware of your 180 when crossing a threshold, if something tells you "Don't" then DON'T. If the hair in the back of your neck suddenly suddenly stand up, DON'T cross that threshold.

bulm540
08-03-2004, 17:19
Originally posted by doctabako
There's another thread here in GT related to this topic which is now 55 pages long with more than 1,200 replies entitled A good competitor does not a gunfighter make (http://www.glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=254971&highlight=ipsc+shooting+and+tactics) and the replies range from amiable to hostile indicating the controversy and passion that this topic entails to some people.

My take on this is that engaging in gun games IS trigger time(Fun time, the best kind ;f) and as they say practice makes perfect. If you're methodical enough in your approach,huge rewards can be gleaned from diligent practice as opposed to those who compete just to throw slugs downrange without regard to improving how they do it.
A good competitor should be under no illusion that what he is doing will automatically make him a better gun fighter when the SHTF as various things do come to play and some people aren't wired for fighting(some become passive and/or take flight). Engaging in gun games will make you better prepared as you become proficient with the use of your weapon and conversely your limitations with it as well. All of which will serve you in good stead when you develop the mindset and summon enough courage to use it when necessary. :)
That's according to the tactical Ninjas.

JuDGe
08-03-2004, 17:28
Compete To Live (http://www.handgunsmag.com/tactics_training/compete_0309/)

Testing defensive handgun skills in a sporting environment
By Walt Rauch

A good read..... :)

Eye Cutter
08-03-2004, 18:59
why do we own guns? the final answer almost always boils down to a defensive reasoning for having one.

how you master your chosen tool, to each his own way. the bottom line is, you should be able to use it on demand without second thoughts or apprehension...

:cool:

cznayr
08-03-2004, 23:14
I dread the day that I have to use my gun. But if ever that time comes I hope that I can incorporate all the skills that I learned. So guys, pakituruan po ako :)

Any one who bought a gun and thinks that all there is to it is pulling the trigger will be in a big surprise when it's time to do so.

So mga parekoy practice lang ;)

agentrod
08-04-2004, 00:02
I dread the day that I have to use my gun. But if ever that time comes I hope that I can incorporate all the skills that I learned. So guys, pakituruan po ako

I share the same sentiments as canayr... I dread the day that I have to use it, but that it the reason why I bought it - to protect my family.

I'm learing a lot from this (and other) forums, I was at Northstar yesterday and still have those nasty "flicking" when I start shooting, after a few coaching (again) seem to correct it. I wonder when I will be in the state of "second nature" na sa akin yung draw-chamber-aim-shoot.

antediluvianist
08-04-2004, 00:34
Population pressures will inevitably increase local crime, even if overall economic parameters do not decline too much because OFWs can continue to find work abroad (if that ever becomes difficult, look out!)At the present rate of growth- and there is no indication at all that it is slowing - the population of the Philippines will be 210 million by the year 2050. That's almost three times as many people as already exist, and we are already straining basic services such as housing , sanitation, and education.

My longer-range plan is to sell off my family's 2 houses and just keep everybody in a guarded condo.

Even then, familiarity with how to use a handgun will be important. One never knows. And a guarded condo is no protection once one leaves the condo.

Most cops are not like that guy Corpuz who killed the three bus robbers. Most cops won't even be around, or will arrive late, or will be relatively unhelpful/even harmful (I regretted ever having called them after a burglary- they just kept dropping by asking for money "to help with the investigation". I've experienced several incidents like that. Cops generally suck. So do fiscals.)

darwin25
08-04-2004, 06:25
Originally posted by Allegra
the bigger the distance, mas advantage sa ipsc shooter

but contrary to IPSC shooters I see on the range and competitions, laging pasugod sila sa target. I am yet to see an IPSC course where a shooter shoots while gaining distance from his targets


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
to all the defensive mindset junkies:

so how do you hone your skills in the local setting?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

hey, who are calling a junkie?;f

I have nothing against IPSC. I think its fun. I dont have anything against IDPA either but I think its very dogmatic in its principles.

Practice? Mostly a few rounds on the range (but not lately) and some shooting drills with buddies. I always see to it that I practice my own repetitions.

Hey I like hanging out with the BOGS although most of the time I cant.

So when is the next funshoot and non-shoot meet?

bulm540
08-04-2004, 07:15
Originally posted by rhino465
I agree with Remo. How practical IPSC is (or is not) depends entirely on the mindset of the individual shooting the matches. Being able to shoot very quickly and accurately as well as engage multiple targets is a very valuable set of skills that you simply can't develop to the same degree anywhere else. Certainly there is more to defensive or combat shooting, but you learn those things elsewhere.

Here is an example of an A-class USPSA shooter handling the situation:

http://www.thetimesonline.com/articles/2004/07/29/news/lake_county/dcff9b91e1ccd2ae86256ee000014014.txt
Sounds like an IPSC speed shoot. Who says IPSC ain't practical. Looks like a C and D hit.

Allegra
08-04-2004, 07:45
My longer-range plan is to sell off my family's 2 houses and just keep everybody in a guarded condo.

Even then, familiarity with how to use a handgun will be important. One never knows. And a guarded condo is no protection once one leaves the condo.


**************************
umm...nothing is safe kahit condo
at the cost of a gallon of gas lang and styrofoam, a bg can just lob some molotovs.
Water from the sprinkler system will just spread the gas
san ko kaya nakukuha mga ideas ko ? hehe


Most cops are not like that guy Corpuz who killed the three bus robbers. Most cops won't even be around, or will arrive late, or will be relatively unhelpful/even harmful (I regretted ever having called them after a burglary- they just kept dropping by asking for money "to help with the investigation". I've experienced several incidents like that. Cops generally suck. So do fiscals.) [/B][/QUOTE]

*******************************
hehe

Allegra
08-04-2004, 07:53
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by Allegra
the bigger the distance, mas advantage sa ipsc shooter
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



but contrary to IPSC shooters I see on the range and competitions, laging pasugod sila sa target. I am yet to see an IPSC course where a shooter shoots while gaining distance from his targets


*********************************
a true ipsc shooter can shoot pa urong, pa side ways, while clinging to a rope with either hand, while contorted like a ppretzel etc.

maganda yung comparison ni Brian enos if I remember correctly
tacticians are like rescue swimmers while ipsc shooters are the olympic swimmers

Alexii
08-04-2004, 08:02
Originally posted by Allegra
maganda yung comparison ni Brian enos if I remember correctly
tacticians are like rescue swimmers while ipsc shooters are the olympic swimmers

Di yata magandang analogy yan--

Rescue swimmers = performs CPRs, wears cool orange shorts and Aviators

Olympic swimmers = tested consistently for drugs, shave their legs, ...

Sorry Allegra, can't help it. Peace, man.;f

Eye Cutter
08-04-2004, 08:11
but contrary to IPSC shooters I see on the range and competitions, laging pasugod sila sa target. I am yet to see an IPSC course where a shooter shoots while gaining distance from his targets

you know what i really appreciate learning in ipsc shooting? i can shoot with confidence while moving forward both walking and at a run, paatras, sideways, naka-dapa, naka-squat, kneeling, nakasilip sa ilalim ng drum, sa mga butas, while baluktot likod, sitting, nakapulupot sa barricade, while on a swaying bridge, 1 hand, one foot up, with both feet up, etc.

tama ba fafa allegra?

jerrytrini
08-04-2004, 08:38
Norco IPSC had a stage a few months ago, where the shooter had to shoot a set of targets approx 45 degrees to his left and another array to his right while stepping back. A local match organizer has the option to design such course of fire or similar. Hindi nga lang "safe" because the RO has to run much faster backwards than the shooter.

Allegra
08-04-2004, 08:51
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
you know what i really appreciate learning in ipsc shooting? i can shoot with confidence while moving forward both walking and at a run, paatras, sideways, naka-dapa, naka-squat, kneeling, nakasilip sa ilalim ng drum, sa mga butas, while baluktot likod, sitting, nakapulupot sa barricade, while on a swaying bridge, 1 hand, one foot up, with both feet up, etc.

tama ba fafa allegra?


plus when caught in a gunfight,you learn na maganda magtago sa likod ng popper. ang hirap tamaan nun eh :)

jerrytrini
08-04-2004, 08:54
Ang masama doo, maski na ilang beses mo nang tinamaan ang popper, ayaw pa rin matumba. He he he.

Valor1
08-04-2004, 10:13
Where else can you apply the precepts of Diligentia, Vis, Celeritas? Where else can you learn to shoot better while moving and thinking all at the same? Where else can you meet the excellent folks of the BOGs? It may be sometimes expensive but hell, it's just money (you'll still end up spending it elsewhere i.e. Lexus, Pegasus, Asus).;b

rhino465
08-04-2004, 20:07
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
why do we own guns? the final answer almost always boils down to a defensive reasoning for having one.


Amen, my brother!

I play the shooting games because I own guns (for my own reasons, mostly defense and also political statements) and I want to get better at their proper use. I do not own guns solely to play the games.

That's the big problem with many shooters in Europe and other parts of the world. They only own guns for sports and they accept that as a normal if not good thing. The problem is, you can't justify playing a game being more important than some false but pervasive perception of "public safety," so they will all lose their guns over the next few years.

On the other hand, when you can and do assert your BASIC HUMAN RIGHT TO SELF-DEFENSE, gun ownership rights will always trump people's "feeling" in reality, if not always in a legal system.

mc_oliver
08-04-2004, 23:10
Originally posted by Valor1
...hell, it's just money (you'll still end up spending it elsewhere i.e. Lexus, Pegasus, Asus).;b
Hehe, balita ko sarado na Lexus dre. ;)

batangueno
08-05-2004, 00:11
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
... while on a swaying bridge, 1 hand, one foot up, with both feet up, etc.
Habang nakasakay sa kotse, sa bangka, sa kabayo, sa helicopter, atbp.;f

mikey177
08-05-2004, 00:55
Originally posted by Allegra
umm...nothing is safe kahit condo
at the cost of a gallon of gas lang and styrofoam, a bg can just lob some molotovs.
Water from the sprinkler system will just spread the gas
san ko kaya nakukuha mga ideas ko ? hehe

Yes. This kind of reminds me of Charlton Heston in "The Omega Man (http://movies.yahoo.com/shop?d=hv&cf=info&id=1800102790)", which I saw as a little kid and which, on hindsight, has influenced me in my desire to be better prepared for likely hostile scenarios. This is the synopsis from Yahoo Movies: "The last survivor of germ warfare hides from nocturnal mutants in a fortified mansion, gathering supplies by day from a deserted L.A. whose streets are strewn with the post-apocalyptic flotsam of the super-funky '70s."

I emphasized the word "likely," lest you all think I'm stockpiling for an imminent onslaught of mutant killer zombies :)

Valor1
08-05-2004, 05:35
Originally posted by mc_oliver
Hehe, balita ko sarado na Lexus dre. ;)


Sarap siguro kung may firing range sa tabi ng mga bars;Q
Kung sarado na Lexus, gawin na lang range.;f

antediluvianist
08-05-2004, 05:52
"umm...nothing is safe kahit condo
at the cost of a gallon of gas lang and styrofoam, a bg can just lob some molotovs"

Yup, that's true, Allegra. If civil breakdown gets to the point where masa or whomsoever are lobbing cans of gas into condos, then I'll fry.

But barring something that bad, I believe the Ayala guards and the Makati police (hey, they have to earn the Christmas bonuses they get from Ayala Land) will keep the masa back.

Seriously, we all ought to watch the signs in the future. I hope we have enough time to get our families out of here before the eruption. 210 million Filipinos by 2050. I'm glad I'll be dead by then.

jojo_G19
08-05-2004, 08:53
i agree with IDOL EYECUTTER,
;z

"you know what i really appreciate learning in ipsc shooting? i can shoot with confidence while moving forward both walking and at a run, paatras, sideways, naka-dapa, naka-squat, kneeling, nakasilip sa ilalim ng drum, sa mga butas, while baluktot likod, sitting, nakapulupot sa barricade, while on a swaying bridge, 1 hand, one foot up, with both feet up, etc. " - (di ako marunong mag lagay nang qoute from other posts ;f ;f )
;z

and if you are so used doing these things, kahit hindi mo isipin, u'll do it by instinct, so pag realthing na.. kahit na magpanic ka pa(i know i would) u can still give those BGs one hell of a fight. ;f ;f ;f



jojo :(

mc_oliver
08-05-2004, 20:33
Originally posted by Valor1
Sarap siguro kung may firing range sa tabi ng mga bars;Q
Kung sarado na Lexus, gawin na lang range.;f
Teeheehee, I'm imagining the "pulot girls" bending down picking up my brass. ;f

julianz
08-06-2004, 05:27
Originally posted by mc_oliver
Teeheehee, I'm imagining the "pulot girls" bending down picking up my brass. ;f

pulot girls can pick up my brass and i can pick up their bras using my mouth;f ;f

Seriously guys. MY reason of owning guns and learning to shoot in IPSC or just simply shooting at the range are the same reason you guys have:
1. Defense 2. a tool for stress management 3. you got extra money to burn spending it to buy bullets is much better than spending it on drugs.

Im not that good yet in shooting compare to some BOG's but for me Screwing up in IPSC match is better than screwing up in real life situation when a life may be at stake , In IPSC I can re shoot anytime and learn from my mistakes if i do good on the next shoot everybody will agree it feels like "heaven" summing it all up it really builds up confidence and prepares the mind on what to do and not to do in real life situation.

Allegra
08-06-2004, 09:59
Seriously guys. MY reason of owning guns and learning to shoot in IPSC or just simply shooting at the range are the same reason you guys have:
1. Defense 2. a tool for stress management 3. you got extra money to burn spending it to buy bullets is much better than spending it on drugs.

now that we've all praised ipsc , babaliktad naman ako :)
being a good ipsc shooter gives one a false sense of security
Fancy shooting will do you no good if you get shot from behind or if the BG closes in and breaks your elbow
Kaya mag drugs nalang tayo :) I'm addicted to hydroxycut

Saruman
08-07-2004, 10:47
Originally posted by Allegra
Seriously guys. MY reason of owning guns and learning to shoot in IPSC or just simply shooting at the range are the same reason you guys have:
1. Defense 2. a tool for stress management 3. you got extra money to burn spending it to buy bullets is much better than spending it on drugs.

amen master LL.. :) :) .. pero now mas gusto ko ilagay sa bula ng beer pera ko.. hehehehe;c ;c

Allegra
08-07-2004, 23:07
Originally posted by Saruman
amen master LL.. :) :) .. pero now mas gusto ko ilagay sa bula ng beer pera ko.. hehehehe;c ;c

ooops, i didnt post that :)

mc_oliver
08-08-2004, 00:34
Originally posted by Allegra
:) I'm addicted to hydroxycut
Uy, sasali ka ba sa Mr. Olympia Master A? ;);f

Allegra
08-08-2004, 09:26
Originally posted by mc_oliver
Uy, sasali ka ba sa Mr. Olympia Master A? ;);f

umm....hindi, anorexic kasi ako hehe

julianz
08-08-2004, 10:16
Originally posted by Allegra
umm....hindi, anorexic kasi ako hehe


;i ;i


i forgot to mention ok na ubusin ang pera sa bala kesa sa Casino.

I have a friend na bangkarote sa kaka casino, ubos assets ng pamilya kala siguro mapapataob nya PAGCOR;f

revo
08-08-2004, 10:23
Ano po yung 'pulot girls' ?

Hmmm

Eye Cutter
09-15-2006, 05:27
bump up ko lang for our new members :bump:

paltiq
09-15-2006, 05:42
IPSC= nakakatulong ng malaki upang mabuild ang confidence,skills,
=a good place to test if your guts & guns works:thumbsup:

IDPA= a good place to exercise other than what you learn in IPSC

wargames (paintball or airsoft)= a good place to exercise other things na hindi mo nagagawa sa IPSC at IDPA (cover & concealment/shooting while moving, enemies who shoot back & running)

.......in other words, lahat yan ay fun & expensive at kailangan mong humanap ng alibi kay kumander-in-chief:tongueout:

jimbullet
09-15-2006, 06:07
At least in IDPA, emphasis is needed in using cover in its course, but there are moves here that you would still not do in real life. Rules are somewhat strict in how you engage a stage. IPSC it lets you think out of the box how to engage targets quicker. Efficiency of your action to get it done in less time.

Wargames is only good for CQB trainings since your targets shoot back. Limited distance. Maganda sana if there is an all pistol game lang. wargames normally kasi ratratan, full auto machine pistols, m4's, which is not practical for real life situation. You dont carry an mp5 on your hip do you?

royal glockster
09-15-2006, 06:45
I played both IPSC and IDPA, and both formats are fun and exciting. :thumbsup: However, i agree with Jeff Cooper, one of the founders of IPSC and an IDPA advocate, that IPSC is a gamer's game while IDPA is a shooter's game...:)

pipo
09-15-2006, 06:51
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
bump up ko lang for our new members :bump:


Thanks for bringing this thread back to life doc ec. I've been thinking of the same thing for a while now. I'm actually thinking of joining my friends in their airsoft games to complement my training. IPSC for actual gun familiarity/handling skills and airsoft so that one can practise with targets who are capable of shooting back with the ability to outwit you. Pain of an airsoft pellet to emphasize fact that someone's strategy was better than yours.:supergrin:

i_am_infinity
09-15-2006, 06:57
Discipline...we tend to be more disciplined when we carry compared to those gun slinging wannabes out there and makes the responsible gun owners look bad.

EYEMD
09-15-2006, 07:23
yes discipline....agree ako with infinity, mas disiplinado mga shooters who frequent the range, lalo na mga nag cocompete ipsc or idpa. saka masarap amoy ng pulbura:supergrin:

ahtsay
09-15-2006, 07:29
Ever since I was a kid, I love guns....toy guns, air guns, airsoft, paintball, etc. I like the feeling of hitting a target yards away. I guess you can compare it to hitting the sweet spot of your golf club, making a basket in basketball, hitting a winning smash in badminton.
I compete in IPSC because I love to compete. It makes me feel good if I do well in a match. Tapos I make a lot of friends din, so what else can be better!
:supergrin:

MR_BIG
09-15-2006, 08:10
Originally posted by Eye Cutter
during the recent Eastern Police District Cup held at Armscor, it was an eye opener to see how our men in blue perform in their gun handling and marksmanship skills! wala ba silang yearly qualification and proficiency tests?

nag train last month ang LAGPSG(lito,tito louie, larry,etc) ng men in blue ng muntinlupa, yes it was an eye opener indeed. last week,i bought some friends with me sa range, they were avid airsoft fans, hirap sila sa popper kahit, 15m lang, i told them, you wont learn real marksmanship with toys, you'll learn it with real guns....sabi ko di pa nga kayo gumagalaw nyan...then we played airsoft at home.....ayun...ako ginawang toy.

horge
09-15-2006, 16:59
I once tried a Level 1 (checking it out lang 'ba), before even
posting to BoG way back, and have also watched a ton of borrowed
IPSC match/tech videos.

My conclusion is that beyond a definite initial value in honing
certain motor skillsets, long-term IPSC can be detrimental to
SD shooting capability. It's a mindset thing: all the difference
between training to eat fast and learning to cook with creativity.
JMO lang naman. I'd rather not go on and on about it.
Mahirap na, at baka merong mga pikon, hehehe.

Doc Alvin and others mentioned long ago that handling the
adrenal stress of a comp/match is good prep for a real-world
shoot, and that makes a healthy amount of sense.


How do I train?
90% of it has nothing to do with guns. Maybe even 95%
The remainder is just repetitive shooting exercises from variations
of (at present)18 different positions, weakhand and stronghand,
drawing from IWB or ankle. It is very tiring going through all of
them, and my condition (MVP) doesn't really allow for a lot of that.


Peace
:)

MR_BIG
09-15-2006, 19:44
well, one thing is for sure, i wont go in a gun fight with the likes of doug,todd and little robbie;)

dinggaling
09-15-2006, 21:59
Originally posted by JuDGe
And I get to hang-around with superb guys who share the same passion! ^c

+1 jojo, indeed camaraderie and shared passion for the sport recharges the person! :banana:

Ferdz
09-16-2006, 09:48
I occassionally shoot sa mga level-1 IPSC pistol matches in standard (single-stack) division and production division pati IDPA pistol matches in CDP and SSP, lately I'm trying airsoft wargames. The reason I join these gun related activities is to enjoy firing my guns, hone my shooting and survival skills as well as being in the company of gun enthusiasts. :)

choi_tan2000
09-17-2006, 02:37
doc e.c.

ganda nitong thread mu .

well i agree IPSC & IDPA is not really as practical as we heard. +1

but remember when wer on college ???? 4 years of training and academe pero ilang % ba nun ang ginagamit ntn sa job ntn ngaun ???? 20 % 40 % the most cguro.

ganun din sa IPSC and IDPA diba.

pero mas malinaw sa sport ntn and nkukuha ntn

1. safety safety safety

2. accuracy

3. discipline

4. confidence

5. a lot of friends (good friends) that will help you anything about guns..........

like here in BoGs dami good members whos always in the mood to help new shooters like us diba


cheeeeeeeers


more power to all responsible gun owners/ shooters

jasonub
09-17-2006, 06:34
IPSC and IDPA are games.

as for real world thing, guess who trains spec ops, swat etc on shooting. No other than IPSC shooters. JErry Barnhart, Tod Jarret, etc.

Allegra
09-17-2006, 07:30
Hah! IPSC kicks butt!
Ask anyone sa IPSC na napalaban na

quick
09-17-2006, 19:48
for me, any range time with my weapon is time well spent. :supergrin:

ipsc and idpa are just like icing on the cake. obviously, the ipsc and even idpa matches are no way near the real thing. but from a practical point of view, it is the closest one can get to simulating real world experiences. and at the very least it trains the shooter how to think. with more practice, teh shooter gets comfortable and quite proficient with his weapon in most if not all aspects of gun handling.

i do believe the competitive shooter would definitely have an edge in a real world SHTF scenario.


Originally posted by jimbullet
Wargames is only good for CQB trainings since your targets shoot back. Limited distance. Maganda sana if there is an all pistol game lang. wargames normally kasi ratratan, full auto machine pistols, m4's, which is not practical for real life situation. You dont carry an mp5 on your hip do you? :supergrin:

heavy and i play airsoft too (adik talaga sa baril). although my airsoft gun is an M4, i make it a point to get as close to the opfor as i can in every game so i can waste them with my pistol. :supergrin:

we have tried playing all pistol games, but they inevitably turn into "run-and-gun" type games because the players feel like if they run real fast, they won;t get hit. :sad:

besides, its way more satisfying in airsoft to waste bad guys who are carrying long and powerful guns with just a pistol!

s.g
09-17-2006, 20:33
Originally posted by Allegra
Hah! IPSC kicks butt!
Ask anyone sa IPSC na napalaban na

Sir,

Seriously, sino kaya ang pwedeng tanungin na willing mag-share ng experience nila kahit sa private message. Yung totoong kwento ha, ito yung tipo ng valuable info na hinahanap ko sana.

Salamat po.
:)

bulm540
09-17-2006, 20:37
Originally posted by jasonub
IPSC and IDPA are games.

as for real world thing, guess who trains spec ops, swat etc on shooting. No other than IPSC shooters. JErry Barnhart, Tod Jarret, etc.

ditto!!!! A lot of IPSC shooters are training L.E. and military folks over here.

Allegra
09-17-2006, 21:37
Originally posted by s.g
Sir,

Seriously, sino kaya ang pwedeng tanungin na willing mag-share ng experience nila kahit sa private message. Yung totoong kwento ha, ito yung tipo ng valuable info na hinahanap ko sana.

Salamat po.
:)


Hi pards, nobody will be....umm stupid enough aamin kasi thats like a written confession kahit pm pa
hahaha basta ako nagkekwento lang
halata naman sa accuracy ng details ng isang kwento kung totoo o hindi
it's up to you guys to decide kung totoo o hindi
Basta pag tinanong ako , I'll deny it