hog hunting with knifes? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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noway
01-06-2005, 16:00
Anybpdy here hunted and killed a hog with a knife? This seems to be the growing trend in these parts with variou shog hunters. If you have taken one with a blade, can you give the step-by-step break down on what you used and what you did?

surfinusa
01-06-2005, 18:56
I've never done this but it goes something like this. The hog is chased with hounds or curs. Then the catch dog (usually a pit bull or similar breed is released and grabs the hog by the ear. The hunters run up as the catch dog is holding the hog, lift the hog by its hind legs, then push a rather large knife into its heart. You must be quick or the hog will seriously injure or kill the dogs (this is not a sport for your family pet).

Some guides using dogs prefer this method as opposed to an excited hunter possibly shooting a dog.

Hog hunter magazine and various web sites can provide more guidance but you get the general picture.

vafish
01-06-2005, 21:56
Had friends who did it when I lived in Australia.

Pretty much how surfinusa described it.

noway
01-07-2005, 10:16
thanks but have anybody every did it was the real question and what did you use?

btw:pitbulls are rarely used down here and make for sorry dogs for hunting hogs.

I have a reservation for a hog hunt in feburary and asked the guide to get me paired up with somebody that's going to knife a hog on that morning. I will see as a 2nd party, 1st hand on how it's done.

Erich
01-07-2005, 10:27
I knew a local cop who took one with a Cold Steel kukhri, and another who used a Cold Steel spear.

Wildpony
01-07-2005, 15:36
Around here we sometimes hunt them off of horses when we get bored. Now the thing is that these things have tusks. I had a friend who had one run under his horse and instantly gutted it where it stood. My poor Buddy had to shoot his horse and you cant imagine the sound a wounded horse makes. Good thng I was'nt there to see it but the moral is that I want something a little more deadly than a knife between me and any hog before I go hunting them. Knife hunting them is in my opinion crazy. Them hogs are mean and will use any excuse to make an attempt to eat your lunch.;5 ^3

noway
01-07-2005, 15:58
Long time since I've rode a horse but their belly aren't that low to the ground for our hogs to tusk them, Interesting story tho.

btw, I see your a Texan, I graduated HS in Abilene from Abilene H.S and used to live near Mockingbird ln on the North Side.

Wildpony
01-07-2005, 17:55
Long time since I've rode a horse but their belly aren't that low to the ground for our hogs to tusk them, Interesting story tho.

By your screen name I see that you may be a bit of a sceptic. But with all due respect your perception of horse hight when compared to a hogs tusk reach is not accurate. Further more it cannot explain away the fact that there was a horse laying dead in the field whith his guts hanging out which, I had to help drag off. No kidding they get big around Coleman you just havent seen the right hogs.

There may be another explination for your scepticism though. you may be confusing javelinas with the hogs. If so then the presumption that they are too short to kill a horse would be correct. They are a different species of pig that are endiginous to the area. The hog that killed my buddy's horse was either a wild hog that had domestic ancestry, some kind of "Russian boar" which have somehow become comon in the area, or some type of hybryd of the two. They easily get upward of 300+lbs. Trust me you don't want to be messing with thes bad boys.

On a side note Howdy! it is good to hear from folks from the Abilene area. I graduated from Abilene Christian High School so I guess talking football with you would be boring to you because we played six-man and never had any rivalry with any of the Abilene schools. But anyway it is good to hear from you.

HighVelocity
01-07-2005, 17:59
Whoa, been awhile since I've heard of this. When I was in College, late 80's, I had a friend named Jim and we called him the Flyin' Hawaiin. He claimed that he hunted wild boar with a knife and pit bulls. The way he described it was that the dogs would latch onto that boar and when the boar started to wear down, Jim would jump on his back and stab it in the neck. ;P

Of course, we all thought he was full of it.

surfinusa
01-07-2005, 20:02
Originally posted by noway

btw:pitbulls are rarely used down here and make for sorry dogs for hunting hogs.

Noway,

Actually pitbulls are used all the time for hunting boars down here. They may be basically illegal to own in Miami-Dade county but not in the rest of the state. Contrary to popular belief the pitbull is not just a fighting dog and has been used as a catch dog throughout the south because of its strong jaws and tenacious nature. Like I said, hounds such as the black and tan, bluetick or redbone and curs like the catahoula or southern blackmouth do the actual finding and chasing. Then the catch dog (pit bull) is released and he holds the hog for the hunter.

Just because I haven't chosen to participate in this area of the sport doesn't mean I don't know how its done or that I don't know people that do it.

Good luck in your future attempts at this. Move quickly and with confidence, the dogs especially the catch dog is depending on you.

noway
01-07-2005, 21:10
{There may be another explination for your scepticism though. you may be confusing javelinas with the hogs. ]

I hate to inform you I hunted numerous javelinas as a kid and know the difference between a hog and musk hog. Typical hogs down here has a shoulder height of 30" or less. Also hogs aren't the real killers that alot of people make them out to be.

Either way, good to hear from another abilenian and our rivalry crosstown was Cooper High was joke, we stump them everytime we played. The real football school we fear,was Odessa. They would kick the snot out of us everytime. The last game I play with Odessa high we lost like 48 -0 and that was the better of the numerous losts that we had ;)

Very tuff school as far as football. Midland was also tuff as nails.

{Actually pitbulls are used all the time for hunting boars down here}

Nine out 10 times, the black mouth cur is the number one dog used here. In all of the private guided hunts I've been on since the last 5 years, only once did I ever see a pitbull run hogs. The catch dogs where either american coon hounds ( aka Black & tans ) or curs.

noway
01-07-2005, 21:18
oh btw, I just want to correct you on ;

{They may be basically illegal to own in Miami-Dade county but not in the rest of the state. }

pits are true not Ilegal in Miami-Dade , you just need to provide insurance of minimum of 50K dollars and this has been that way since 1990s. I know numerous folks with pits or pits crossbreds in Dade. And they still are sorry dogs when compared to curs or black&tans for hunting hogs.

noway
01-07-2005, 21:36
curs

noway
01-07-2005, 21:38
and again

noway
01-07-2005, 21:41
and lastly up close

muddydog
01-07-2005, 22:53
we hunt with dogs and use knives..

we hunt your normal everyday feral hogs..3-4 generation feral..usually with hog dogs that are pits..and dogos..

you use a knife or spike to prevent a bullet from hitting one of the dogs.

our dogs use cut vests...and we also live catch. if its a 1st generation feral we feed and sell...at market.


those dogs will GIT IT ON....

ECVMatt
01-07-2005, 22:58
I was in North TX and it is great fun. I have killed a few with knives and here is how it goes. We usually ride mules and follow our scent dogs. If it is a long ride we will carry our catch dogs (pit bulls)over the saddle. When the scent dogs strike a fresh trail we chase them on the mules for as long as possible. Sometimes we can ride right up to the fight. When we get in visual range of the hog, we release the catch dog/dogs. The catch dogs will try to bite the hog in the head and hold on. The hog will try to kill the dog. At this point we grab the hind legs and flip the hog on its' side. Then we stick it behind the grisle plate and in a few moments the hog dies. Sometimes we catch the pigs alive if they are not too big. We use these for training other dogs or sell them to a pay and slay ranch nearby. The last one I stabbed was rather large. I will not tell you the weight, because I am sure people will doubt it. I used a bowie style knife and had some problems sticking it all the way to the lungs. I think a bayonet/straight style blade (w/o serrations) would be better. However, I borrowed the knife from a man that hunts like this almost year round and kills many/many hogs with the knife so maybe I did not hit it hard enough. I have some pixs, but do not know how to up load them. It is great fun to hunt like this, but can be hard on the dogs if you do not act quickly. Hope this answers your question.

Matt

hrt4me
01-07-2005, 23:37
There may be another explination for your scepticism though. you may be confusing javelinas with the hogs. If so then the presumption that they are too short to kill a horse would be correct. They are a different species of pig that are endiginous to the area.

Actually, Javelinas are rodents.

Wildpony
01-08-2005, 02:10
Well NOWAY it sounds like you think you are an expert on everything. ;Q

surfinusa
01-08-2005, 08:39
Noway, as I said pit bulls are basically illegal in Miami-Dade county. Technically, you can still own a pit bull however, most people can't get the required insurance or the cost is prohibitive, i.e., creating a de facto prohibition on ownership. Although I do know that there are still a number of owners and breeders in violation of the ordinance.

As my previous posts may have led you to believe I am quite familiar with the breeds used in this sport. And I will say that the pictures you provided are of a nice looking dog. But Blackmouths are usually used as chase dogs and not as catch dogs, as with anything there are exceptions and some will do both.

In your third picture the cur has the hog bayed up, now its time to release the catch dog. As soon a he gets a good hold, you better be there to take care of business or this dog is getting hurt even with a cut vest on. Keep in mind, many in Florida don't use a cut vest (high heat) because over heating the dogs can be as harmfull as the pigs.

Reading the other posts its obvious that others and myself have provided you with good accurate information regarding this sport in response to your question.

Now my only question is, since you know so much more than the rest of us on this subject, why did you bother to post your question the first place?

Wildpony
01-08-2005, 09:38
Go to this site to see a horse standing next to a dead boar. http://www.northmorgan.com/hog1.htm

surfinusa
01-08-2005, 10:13
EVCmatt I've heard of people taking their dog on the saddle but have never seen it done. How do those little dogs like bouncing around in the saddle like that?

Down here its mostly 4 wheel drive and swamp buggies.

mpol777
01-08-2005, 15:50
Originally posted by hrt4me
Actually, Javelinas are rodents.

I was told this a few years back. I found out later that was false though. They are neither pigs nor rodents, but have a closer relationship to pigs.

They are all mamals (Class Mamalia-Eutheria), but then they all break. Pigs and Javelina and in the Artiodactyla Order while rats, squirrels, gophers, etc are in the Rodentia Order. Pigs and peccaries break again, pigs being in the Suidae Family and peccaries are in the Tayassuidae Family. Then they all go their seperate ways down to the specific animal.

Don't think I'm some sort of walking enclyopedia. I have to look it all up each time to get the names right. It is pretty darn interesting to see how everything relates to each other. All the critters make for one crazy family tree. ;f

It all breaks out like so:

Javelina (aka Collared Peccary)
Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Subphylum: Vertebrata
Class: Mammalia
Order: Artiodactyla
Family: Tayassuidae
Genus: Pecari

Wild Hog
Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Subphylum: Vertebrata
Class: Mammalia
Order: Artiodactyla
Family: Suidae
Subfamily: Suinae
Genus: Sus
Species: Sus scrofa

American Beaver (rodent)
Kingdom: Animalia
Phylum: Chordata
Subphylum: Vertebrata
Class: Mammalia
Order: Rodentia
Suborder: Sciurognathi
Family: Castoridae
Genus: Castor
Species: Castor canadensis


I've never hunted hogs, but if you expect me to jump on a 300lb anything with just a knife you had better get me good and likkered up first.

ECVMatt
01-08-2005, 16:52
and only carry them once they seem to be getting tried. We will also carry them if there is thick mud. They don't seem to mind and we use mules wich seem to have a more steady gait. One thing is for sure, they are ready to fight when we put them down.

Matt

surfinusa
01-08-2005, 19:35
ECVmatt, very cool. Those little pit bulls don't have the endurance of a hound or a cur but man are they tenacious. They just won't give up, even if it cost them their lives. I can just picture them bouncing down some trail laying across a saddle.:) Man I'll bet they are ready to go when they get there. sounds like a great time.

CanyonMan
01-08-2005, 22:46
Well NOWAY it sounds like you think you are an expert on everything


Well, wildpony, i tell ya. I believe you about the hog gutting the horse ok.

I went to your website, and saw a few pics. looks nice.

I have cowboyed forever, form one of the largest ranches in NW Oklahoma, to 'our ranch' here in W. Tx. about an hour or so West, and some South, of Abiliene.I have never seen one of the wild hogs as big as you described to Noway, that gutted the horse, but again, i believe ya.

Sorry to hear about your friends horse being put down. I hate to hear that. I have a great respect and love for horses, since i have trained and broke them for a long time. So i really feel for the horse, and your buddy.


Noway, is a real good friend of mine, and really 'does not' need my vindication of his hunting knowledge. But, i can assure you, this man 'does know about hogs,' and hog hunting, and has killed a good number of them.


But i will say this to ya. You 'do not' help 'your credibility', or your ranch hunting/guiding service 'buy being rude.' Noway 'never' implied that he "knows everything," he was 'simply telling' what he 'does know.' And like the rest of us... we are all learning in the process!

So, Hoss, why not back off, and chill out, and relax, and "let it go."
This 'is not' any way for you to gain credibility 'here', or, for your ranch. I am sure we can all agree on that, right!



CanyonMan

noway
01-09-2005, 05:07
{In your third picture the cur has the hog bayed up, now its time to release the catch dog. As soon a he gets a good hold, you better be there to take care of business or this dog is getting hurt even with a cut vest on. Keep in mind, many in Florida don't use a cut vest (high heat) because over heating the dogs can be as harmfull as the pigs.

Reading the other posts its obvious that others and myself have provided you with good accurate information regarding this sport in response to your question.

Now my only question is, since you know so much more than the rest of us on this subject, why did you bother to post your question the first place?}

thanks, I posted a simple question of those that have hog hunted with Knives. That's the latetest trend of activity dog here. I'm sreiously thinking on purchasing a knive just todo this hunt before I get to old.

Also, very few guides use catch dogs due to the danger of the dog being killed. The perfer that the hog is stop and "bayed" and distracted so you can shot or stab or whatever you plan on doing with the hog.

You are correct that the protection vest are not normally used due to the heat and restriction of the dog movements.

From every person that I have hunted with that runs dogs, they DO NOT use pitbulls, they don't like pits and perfer a more compact and easier to trained dogs like cur.

Btw, Pitbulls are NOT illegal in miami-dade county never have been, and numerous people own pits and pit-mixes that live in Miami-dade ( btw, most don't get the insurance ) so they are in violation of the county ordinace.

Now for ecvmatt & muddydog, any length of blade that you used on your hog? The guide that I planning on using ( if I get the courage ) has had guys do it with everything from as small as a 6" to 12" or plus in length. He does make you sign an additonal wavier for liability issues ;)


also mpol777, has it right tha javelinas are not hogs and in some areas of the US they are classified at varmints or non-game animals. Btw, one more piece of fact, hogs aren't native to america but javelinas are.


{but if you expect me to jump on a 300lb anything with just a knife you had better get me good and likkered up first.}

Come on live alittle One of the guide workers wife who is about 130lb kill one with knife. She did say ," just keep stabbin till it's dead". ;f

Wildpony
01-09-2005, 08:27
CanyonMan
Ill take your advice, I just dislike being sneered at. But around here it seems that you just have to expect it. I would do better to just ignore it when that happens.

By the way that was not my websight and has no affiliation to my ranch.

surfinusa
01-09-2005, 09:22
Noway sorry I misundstood your original question. I thought you wanted to know how it was done not just what type of knife was used. (any quality knife with a 6 inch or longer blade that is 1/4 inch thick should be long enough and strong enough although 9 inch is probably what is recommended most often).

Of all the people that I know or talked to that hunt with a knife none do this without a catch dog. None. A bayed up hog is fine for hunting with a handgun. But without a catch dog, nobody gets that close to a boar especially a large one. Hell, even with the catch dog its still got a large element of danger to it, as seen by the number of dogs injured or killed every year and the number of hunters that end up in the ER with stiches.

ECVMatt
01-09-2005, 12:21
I would not personally try to stab a pig w/o a catch dog attached to it's head. You just cann't control them and one hit from the mighty tusks can be quite devastating. On my last hunt, the hog managed to stick 8 out of 9 dogs (including the catch dog who was wearing a cut vest and collar). As to the kind of knife I would use, I would say use a straight bladed knife from 6 to 9 inches in length. One fellow who came with us had a 2 foot bowie knife and it was just too long, got in the way, and we ended up using a buck 110. Honestly, I think a Glock bayonet w/o serrations would be a great knife. The best place to stick them is in the "arm pit". This usually gets the heart and the game is over quickly. If the pig is too big to flip over, then I try to stick them high into the ribs, right behind the grisel plate. Then I push the knife down to elongate the wound. I try to not stop cutting until a large stream of frothy red blood is shooting out of the wound. This usually means you have got to the lungs. I also would recomend a double action revolver or a Glock type pistol in an open top holster. I use my Glock 20. I would stay away from heavy magnums that might shoot all the way through a pig and hit a dog or another person. I think the 10mm, .357, and mid range .41's, .44. .45 colts are the best. With this set up if a pig gets on you, you can pull your pistol and begin to fire w/o decactavating safeties or cocking hammers.

Hope this helps,

Matt

CanyonMan
01-09-2005, 21:27
wildpony,

Well, man everything is fine.... I don't think you were getting sneered at, so don't take it that way. Let's just move on.
No problem.


Buenos Noches


CanyonMan

mpol777
01-09-2005, 21:58
Do hogs respond to a call like javelina? A couple 40lb javelina coming for you is pretty exciting. Those little buggers can get quite nasty. Add on a couple hundred pounds in the case of a hog and it'd be interesting to say the least.

noway
01-09-2005, 23:27
thanks ECVmatt, that answer'd my orginal question. I actually have that buck 110 knife, never reall used it and was thinking it was too short for this type of hunting.

{One fellow who came with us had a 2 foot bowie knife and it was just too long, got in the way}

I can't even begin to picture a 2ft long bowie , being using ;) That's way they have this additional wavier for liability, I heard storyies of others folks stabbing the hog and stabbing themselves in the proccess.

CanyonMan
01-10-2005, 19:57
Noway,

as you know... i build, (on the side), custom knives. hearing you talk about the 2' bowie, reminds me of the movie, "The Scackets" ole Tell Sacket, had an elk handle bowie under his arm pit that had a blade on it like a pirate sword! I got a piece of elk here suited for a "Sacket knife," And i guy i know is going to supply me with the monster Sacket blade for it..." It ain't worth doing anything with.." Most Bowie's aren't. Except for using on 'folks' or grizz! :)

I just wanted to do one, to say i did it...!


But, seriously on those hogs the way you guys are talking here, a regular hunting blade, or "small bowie" would seem to be good, i would think. I am mostly 'just listening here', since this "knife hunting for hogs," is interesting, but a real "new thing to my ears.." First i hear if this!


CanyonMan

ECVMatt
01-10-2005, 23:18
but it was way too big. My good fried used a spyderco police model and it worked great. I kinda like fixed blades because they are easier to get into action. Others like folder in case you get rolled by your mule and will be less likely to stick yourself. Less important is the knife, most important is a trustworthy catch dog. If he lets go then things are apt to get western real quick.

Matt

Speaking of mules, has anyone here seen the pictures of the mule killing the mountian lion. They are pretty crazy. I would post them, but I am not that up on things like that.