Finally had a chance to shoot a Kahr tonight..

[Mr986]

A good friend of mine was kind enough to make available a K9 Elite and a PM9. I brought along my G26 for comparison. The G26 has a Hogue grip, finger extension and Wolf uprated recoil spring.

Shot the G26 first then the PM9 and K9. PMC 115 fmj, CCI 147 fmj and then GS 124+p ammo were the ammo choices.

First observations:
PM9
--Accurate
--Nice light trigger
--sights were OK
--Lots of muzzle flip with any ammo; I didn't think I ever got a real good hold on the gun, even using the 7 round mag with pinkie extension.
--Accurate Double taps? boy, this will take some practice.
--in the waistband the small size was a dramatic change from the G26

K9
--very accurate
--Definately heavier .
--Nice trigger but maybe a tad heavier than the PM9
--The soft rubber grips really helped with control, along with the weight. Double taps seemed really smooth in the second mag--I really liked that gun.
--Sights (NS) seemed small and not easy to pickup.
--in the waistband: slimmer than the G26 but the heft reminded me that something substantial was there.
--Jewel-like is how I would describe the quality of this gun

Conclusions:
I don't think I'd be happy with the PM9; a hogue grip with Agrip on top might help but it moved more than I would have liked it to. The more I shot it the more I thought of the MK9.

The K9 was terrific;just a bit too heavy.

The SS matte finishes on both made me appreciate the black finish on the G26--I seemed to pick up the sights easier with the black slide top. To my eye, the DLC would be the way to go.

I'm thinking P9 or P9 covert; since you can't get a P9
covert with DLC, then I'm limited to the P9. BTW, I emailed Kahr with that suggestion, thinking they could just subsitute a P9 DLC slide for the matte.

Questions:
Is it fair to say that a P9 with hogue grip & Agrip should be as controlable as the K9?
Does wolf offer a stiffer spring for the P9?
------
At end, I thought I'd come out of this comparison with a clear view of what I wanted. Even though I have a better feel for the two versions, I'm still struggling with the weight/size issues vs. shooting feel. Would appreciate how others have dealt with this.
Thanks in advance

[Article2]

The PM9 was optimized for one purpose: To be available on your person when you need it for self-defense. No excuses for not having it with. A PM9 is not an ideal "all around" gun. It doesn't perform as well as a K9 for precision shooting because to do so would compromise it's primary purpose. On the other hand, a K9 doesn't perform as well as a PM9 for concealed carry. The things that add to a K9's precision are of little value in a self-defense situation especially if the K9 is at home, in the vault, when you *really* need it. So, the question is not which model is better relative to one another but rather, which model is best for your intended purpose. Once your purpose becomes clear so does the choice.

[NJ3]

Originally posted by Article2
The PM9 was optimized for one purpose: To be available on your person when you need it for self-defense. No excuses for not having it with. A PM9 is not an ideal "all around" gun. It doesn't perform as well as a K9 for precision shooting because to do so would compromise it's primary purpose. On the other hand, a K9 doesn't perform as well as a PM9 for concealed carry. The things that add to a K9's precision are of little value in a self-defense situation especially if the K9 is at home, in the vault, when you *really* need it. So, the question is not which model is better relative to one another but rather, which model is best for your intended purpose. Once your purpose becomes clear so does the choice.

Well said. ^6

[Michigun]

Originally posted by Mr986
At end, I thought I'd come out of this comparison with a clear view of what I wanted. Even though I have a better feel for the two versions, I'm still struggling with the weight/size issues vs. shooting feel. Would appreciate how others have dealt with this.
Thanks in advance

I chose the one I wanted/needed & then practiced. ^c

[cpirtle]

Your observations on the triggers are accurate since the PM9 has the Elite trigger system and the K9 does not. Michigun posted a parts list in the gunsmithing forum for upgrading to an Elite trigger and it runs less than $30 in parts. I changed out my K40 and its trigger now is almost identical to my PM9, a welcome upgrade.

If you like the size of the PM9 but not the grip maybe you should try to hold an MK9/40. It will give you a little more gripping surface and comes from the factory with rubber grips. Other than being a tad bit longer the grip on the K9 is the same as the grip on the MK9.

[WIG19]

Originally posted by Michigun
I chose the one I wanted/needed & then practiced. ^c
No fault with that philosophy.

FWIW, I found the mindset necessary for shooting my Covert successfully was to think of it as a skinny J-frame Smith and just make moderately-quick but smooth squeezes of the trigger. And, given its role (up too close & get out of my personal space), I never demanded accuracy out of it on par with my Glocks; but it was more than adequate, definitely minute-of-badguy. And it pocket carries like a charm.

Perhaps if you really like the P9 Covert, but not the finish, you could shop for one and get CCR to make it any color you want, since their finish protects as well. :)

[compman]

The Mk9 is the way to go and my 11th Kahr, the TP9 is a nice gun but it's still not compaarable to the MK9. THe MK9 comes in an ELite version. If you can find one an '03(the newest one) but it. The MK9 is the easiest Kahr to customize and modify, I.E. Wolff springs and stainless guide rod. You can relly make it the way you want it and it carrys real well IWB,OWB, and in a pocket holster I have for it.

I'm glad you had the experience though. Many people don't and pre-judge it because they believe bigger is better, and Glock or nothing. The Kahr is a great gun. By the way the MK9 Elite has the Elite trigger like the one you like. Its actually even a bit smoother. The grip is not rubber but a type of nylon-plastic. Made to draw smooth out of the holster.

You can order it with the sights you want. Bar&dot, or various night sights. The sights can be done afterwards, too and ordered from the website. Just make sure you have a good gunsmith to change the sights since the tolerances are very tight.

[Blacktails]

If I'm not mistaken, the grips on the MK guns are different than the K guns. K's are "textured soft polymer", and the MK's are "textured hard nylon". There is a difference in feel to me. That being said, my K9 Elite handles and carries exceptionally well, and I'm very happy with my choice of steel. I don't think you would regret picking one up. ^c

[cpirtle]

You guys are correct, I was going from memory on the grips since I don't own an MK. I'd almost have to believe rubber is available if you wanted them, just never checked.

FWIW, I love the rubber grips that came with my K40 and would not change them for anything.

[sharpshooter]

The P9 DLC is a great compromise for a carry gun. It's large enough to get a full grip (barely) yet light enough to carry easily. It's not a front pocket gun, but cargo pockets work well.

I love the feel of the K9 and I'd love to have one. But I'd prefer a lighter gun for CCW. I have other range guns, this is a waistband gun.

[LittleFoot]

i guarantee if you shoot that pm9 again with a hogue handall jr. you will notice a HUGE difference in your ability to control her, FWIW

[Engineer]

Glad to see you took lots of mental notes when you were shooting my Kahr's :). FWIW, the K9 Mr986 was shooting was an Elite 98 and not the standard K9.

[patman]

Were the night sights the same color front and rear?That will make them hard to pick up on any pistol.You SHOULD have different colors front and rear.In low enough light you lose your 3D making it hard to differentiate front to rear.Just an observation I've made with my own pistols with night sights.I will never get same color front to rear again.

[compman]

I tried the regular day sights the Kahrs come with for the first time. All now(12 of my Kahrs) all have night sites but the stock sites are a lot easier to pick up for me. Also, them being bright white you can see them in very little light. The problem with the night sights that I have are the dots are not big enough. I would like the big dots.

[Mr986]

BTW, thanks for all the responses.

Ed, thanks again for the opprtunity to try out both of your pistols. With any luck my G26 will begone in the next week or so.

Compman:
Regarding the night sights agreed, I thought they were small and a bit difficault for me to pick up. I'mguessing that a set of Ashley express night sights will be on the Kahr that I get.

[Michigun]

Little dots/marks found on sights really have nothing to do with a correct sight picture...