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View Full Version : the most copied pistol design ever?

magnut
02-25-2005, 14:40
Okay I have to admit I still think it is the 1911. But think about this... Pretty much every Ring of Fire gun, Hi Point and many Many others are patterned after the Raven Design. Adesign that ,with the proper metals/materials, can stand up to many different cartridges from 22s to 45s. How many millions of pistols have this design. Just thought I would share an interesting observation on the SNS history.
DEATHROW
02-25-2005, 16:35
For sheer numbers you would have to say that breech loading revolvers were the most copied design.

For automatics you would have to go with the basic Browning design of the 1911. The barrel link locking system has to be the most imitated (and best) action of any automatic IMO.

Deathrow :cool:
magnut
02-25-2005, 18:29
Yup , have to agree the 1911 is the king, still though there are alot of raven copies out there beacuase the are just so many sns lot have emremely high numbers in terms of manufacturing.
RyanSBHF
02-25-2005, 19:03
Walther PP/PPK. Almost every company has a gun based off the design.
shark_za
03-01-2005, 12:49
Browning 1905/6 is probably it.
Hundereds of spanish, french, chinese copies.
StockGlock23
03-06-2005, 14:27
Originally posted by RyanSBHF
Walther PP/PPK. Almost every company has a gun based off the design.

I forgot about that one but I would have to say the Browning 1911 or the Hi-Power. I can't think of any brands that copy The Hi-Power off hand but I have seen numerous "clones".

I vote strongly for the Walther PP/PPK!
RyanSBHF
03-06-2005, 17:56
The Beretta M9 is also copied extensively.
Slinger646
03-06-2005, 18:06
Colt SAA?
CVDean
03-09-2005, 13:35
The Early Browning blowback autos (1903,1906 etc.) are probably much more copied than any other gun. Probably one of the easiest designs to manufacture cheaply. They have been made all over Europe, the Middle East, Asia, North America and a few places I'm not mentioning.
waktasz
03-14-2005, 18:11
Originally posted by RyanSBHF
The Beretta M9 is also copied extensively.

They didn't invent that style of locking system, nor does Beretta call it an m9...that's the army's name for it.
RyanSBHF
03-14-2005, 18:57
Originally posted by waktasz
They didn't invent that style of locking system, nor does Beretta call it an m9...that's the army's name for it.

No, they copied the locking system off the Walther PPK. I meant the Beretta M92F has been copied by several countires, like South Africa.
shark_za
03-15-2005, 04:48
Its the Walther P38 style lock, not PPK.

And the South African Z88 is not a copy, its manufactured under licence, like the M9.
RyanSBHF
03-15-2005, 14:22
Originally posted by shark_za
Its the Walther P38 style lock, not PPK.

And the South African Z88 is not a copy, its manufactured under licence, like the M9.



But the P38 style lock was from the PP/PPK. Back in the 30's when the German Army was looking to replace the Luger, Walther chambered the PP in 9x19, but it was rejected because they wanted a locked breech design. That gun became the P38. Beretta & S&W are two companies that most notably copied the Walther system.
CVDean
03-15-2005, 14:51
I was under the impression that S&W pistols used a Browning style locked breech. The DA/SA lockwork might be copied from Walther, but I don't think the breech is.
RyanSBHF
03-15-2005, 18:41
Originally posted by CVDean
I was under the impression that S&W pistols used a Browning style locked breech. The DA/SA lockwork might be copied from Walther, but I don't think the breech is.



You're right. The modern Walther P88 & P99 also use the Browning method IIRC.
shark_za
03-20-2005, 13:49
So Beretta copied the locking mechanism of a gun that has no lock?
Interesting.

Anyways, take a look at a reference work like Zhuks book and see all the guns copied from the Browning 1906, it easily wins, in both numbers of guns and numbers of makers.
Tough call is if the Colt Autos are copies of the FN or vice versa ;o)
CVDean
03-22-2005, 18:29
Shark, I think it is neither. Browning sold the patents to FN to make pistols for the European market and Colt to make them for the American market.
oldgranpa
03-22-2005, 20:43
I have to agree with magnut, if we are just talking the most copied SNS design, I vote for the Raven. I have no numbers on the original Raven production, but for the Phoenix Raven .25acp a history site says:
1992 67,824
1993 93,860
1994 26,148
1995 15,662

Then the anti-SNS dorks in Kalifornia made them stop production, I think. Maybe somebody has better history than what I found.

Cheers,
og