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JinLA
05-19-2005, 11:58
I'm getting a new system with plenty of hard drive, and having been curious about linux of a while, figure I might as well put both Linux and win xp on it.

Questions:
What version should I get? (will download and burn to CD to install on the new box)

What's the best way to set up booting so I can choose linux or xp?

How big a hard drive partition should I make for the linux install?

thanks folks

HerrGlock
05-19-2005, 12:36
Originally posted by JinLA
Questions:
What version should I get? (will download and burn to CD to install on the new box)

What's the best way to set up booting so I can choose linux or xp?

How big a hard drive partition should I make for the linux install?

thanks folks

Get a handful of different distributions and try them all. Suggestions are: Fedora, SuSE, Mandrake.

Load WIN first. WIN will blow away the entire boot sector and make it boot WIN only. Linux will load fine and ask you if you want to dual boot, WIN will not.

For messing around and learning it, about 10 Gig will give you enough to play with and learn on.

DanH

Washington,D.C.
05-19-2005, 13:46
Try Litrix 2.1 EX ftp://litrix.codigolivre.org.br/pub/litrix/litrix-EX.iso.zip

It's one of the most funtional the way it is.You must unzip it before burning the iso,It's all on one CD so not too much to download.It will run as a live CD and as a hard drive install.It's based on Slackware so it's not the easiest to add software but comes with about everything for a desktop system.With todays large hard drives make a swap partition of one gig.The root partition should be 5 to 6 gigs or larger if no seperate home partition.Home partition is not required but can be 5 gigs or whatever extra storage space you want.The software from the one CD will fill about 2 gigs on the hard drive not counting the swap and storage space.You can use a floppy to boot Linux.If you can use two drives install Windows on your largest one and then make it the slave and then the 2nd the master and install Linux on it with the Linux bootloader on it's MBR and then you can boot Windows and Linux both from the Linux bootloader.You can always remove it and use the other for Windows only as usual.

fastvfr
05-19-2005, 16:55
FWIW, I always use a smaller HDD than the main to both preserve data integrity in XP if the *Nix installer is buggy and also to allow for the booting of multiple Linux systems. See sig for details.

Knoppix, SimplyMepis and Fedora Core3 are all good. So is SUSE and Mandrake from what I have seen, though I have never actually installed MD--it is pretty n00b-friendly, from what I hear, though, so you might go with that one.

And I use G.A.G. Bootloader to run the whole mess. Works very well for me.

grantglock
05-20-2005, 15:08
live cd's are slow, they work but i dont like them and i would never try and "show off" linux by using a live cd. Its way slower than a real install.

Washington,D.C.
05-20-2005, 15:31
Litrix,Mepis and Kanotix are live CD's but are designed to be installed on a hard drive.Knoppix is optimized to be run as a live CD and doesn't always work well run on a hard drive.Mepis is Debian compatible.Kanotix is very updated.Litrix is one of the most complete and easiest to use once installed.

fastvfr
05-20-2005, 18:28
DC, what issues have you found with Knoppix?

I have installed it to HDD dozens of times flawlessly, and it takes no time at all to customize it and patch up KDE.

I like its later iterations better than Kanotix or Mepis, too.

Washington,D.C.
05-20-2005, 19:21
If you make no changes to Knoppix it works fine.Sometimes updates will work ok but other times things will break.Trying an apt-get ugrade will result in many broken apps.Kanotix is designed for hard drive install and the latest apps.Mepis maintains full compatibily with Debian.Odd thing is the Knoppix installer recomends the "beginners install with auto hardware detection and Kanotix recomends the "Debian install".The only Knoppix I had real problems was Knoppix 3.7 and the only Kanotix that gave problems was Kanotix 10.Both are now beyond those and the newer versions are better.I have Knoppix 3.6 on one PC right now.Mepis runs well as a hard drive install but is the slowest live CD of the bunch.

Washington,D.C.
05-20-2005, 19:26
The really neat thing about Litrix for non-techies is it includes the Nvidia 3d video drivers,Java and all of the mulltimedia codecs.It also runs very fast.It is based in Slackware and most of it's support is in Portuguese but the version I posted is the all English version.

fastvfr
05-20-2005, 21:12
Oh yeah, I agree with you on the Apt-get updates. You are dealing with Unstable Sid, after all, and this version isn't exactly Debian though it is pretty close.

LOTS of orphaned dependencies show up if you try to do every last update and install every last game and app.

Been there, tried that. Was NOT happy with the results.

But if you just add a few important apps, harden the SSH security permissions, lock down KDE and add custom cursor and font files, Knoppix Debian works great.

I like the 3.6 kernel, too.

Washington,D.C.
05-20-2005, 21:29
The main reason I keep Knoppix 3.6 on that PC is is it runs great and 3.7 would fail to install.I never did figured out why that was.Knoppix Professional comes with ectra security software but it's default language is German so you must boot the CD with the cheat code for Rnglish but you must do it at first with a German key map.After that the hard disk install is all English.

fastvfr
05-20-2005, 23:31
Sprechen se Deutsch? NEIN?!? Ach du liber!!

Seriously, though, I can make newer Knoppix run on these boxes, but, hey, if it ain't broke...;f ;a ;f

Kevin108
05-21-2005, 00:31
The easiest/prettiest/fastest/most complete distro I have ever used is PCLinuxOS. http://www.pclinuxonline.com (http://www.pclinuxonline.com/pclos) It's a Live CD that you can install from as well. It comes with Java, nVidia drivers, and lots of other goodies that most distributions leave out. Check it out. I bet you'll like it.

Washington,D.C.
05-21-2005, 01:24
I have PCLinuxOS too.It seems really good but adding software is bit limited.It does have an easy to use interface.It even has ATI drivers precompiled in one version.It was the only disto that would install on one PC but on another Java worked on the live CD but broke after the hard drive install and couldn't be replaced.

Washington,D.C.
05-21-2005, 01:28
Originally posted by fastvfr
Sprechen se Deutsch? NEIN?!? Ach du liber!!

Seriously, though, I can make newer Knoppix run on these boxes, but, hey, if it ain't broke...;f ;a ;f Knoppix 3.8 wasn't a problem but 3.7 never worked properly except on the CD.Knoppix 3.6 works so well on that PC I left it alone.It even survived an apt-get update and an apt-get upgrade.I didn't try a dist upgrade.The German language wasn't a problem but I don't have a German keyboard.

Washington,D.C.
05-21-2005, 01:31
Oh yeah I do have a problem downloading DVD iso's from FTP's.I can get the small ones but over 2gig or so I don't know how to save the whole iso or put it together.The download just keeps going and doesn't finish.

Kevin108
05-21-2005, 08:37
Is your hard drive full?

Washington,D.C.
05-21-2005, 15:05
No I don';t think space is the problem.If the iso is over a certain size it continues to look like it's downing even past the size of the iso.All I can do at that point is cancel it which loses the whole thing.

HerrGlock
05-21-2005, 18:09
What filesystem type are you using? Some cannot handle a file over 2G.

Also, a lot of the distros mentioned are good, some are really good, but you have someone who is asking to start getting into this stuff and if you look at the distros that have the best support, newsgroups, forums, distro pages, and followings, I would not suggest almost any of them for a beginner in that situation. If they get stuck, there is much more help available for the RedHat based and SuSE based versions than just about any other.

DanH

JinLA
05-21-2005, 18:11
Try a different downloading program? One with a pause/resume function maybe.

Thanks for all replies. I've got a lot of downloading and CD burning to do! ;f

Washington,D.C.
05-21-2005, 21:06
File syatem is Linux ext 3.I can't download a DVD to my Windows disk due to lack of space.I need space to store it and a DVD's worth of extra space to burn it.I have downloaded DVD iso's smaller than 2 gigs to my Linux disk.Also some large DVD iso are broken into two files you must download seperately and somehow put together for one complete iso on DVD.I don't know how to do that.So right now my iso's are all CD's or small DVD iso's.As far as the distro's.I understand about getting a big name commercial one,but the free versions of them are missinmg a lot of useful apps that a Linux noob might have a difficult time adding any time soon.I suspect Litrix doesn't even have license full all of the apps they have.It was originally designed as a desktop system for people in Brazil that can't afford MS Windows.For as heavy as it is with apps it's really one of the fastest distro's I've tried.It's like getting the paid non-free version odf the commercial distro's.For it's support the Slackware forums,message boards,etc should be plenty as it's based on Slackware.

Washington,D.C.
05-21-2005, 21:22
Oh yeah,The other thing about the big commercial distro's now is that they only come with the 2.6 kernel and some hardware(mostly older but some newer) doesn't like the 2.6 kernel and some of the other distro's include the 2.4 kernel along with 2.6 so you can choose at install and see what works best.

fastvfr
05-22-2005, 06:57
Oh, and DC - I ran across that problem, too.

I installed an old 20GB drive, formatted as FAT32, to handle those bigger downloads on my main Linux box, which is now full and needs upgrading.

One of these days. I still have 15GB free on the ol' Samba right now, so it isn't a priority.

Washington,D.C.
05-22-2005, 14:08
Ok,so I take it,it's a limit of the file system.I'll have to rethink my partitions and see what I can do.Thanks ^c

HerrGlock
05-22-2005, 16:16
Not really. Ext3 filesystem should be able to handle a 6+ Gig file.

The programs you are using, may be using the older (32 bit) version of off_t. Unix API used a "long" to represent offsets within files (including the offset to the end of the file, i.e. its size). On a 32-bit system, a "long" is only 32 bits, so can only hold values up to +/- 2Gb.

If you compile the download program using the 64 bit compiler, you get up to the 6Gb+ file limit with a smaller block size. When you start getting into the larger block sizes, you get up to a TB max filesize before running into problems.

DanH