Original Black Talons?

[steel]

Do any of you guys have any experience with original Black Talons in 10mm? I know that they were 200 grain slugs. I have a chance to buy some, but it is expensive. Is it worth it? How fast are the slugs going? I have always preferred shooting heavier slugs in any given caliber. I have some old .357 Black Talons that were made in 180 grain. Did the Black Talons perform better as heavier slugs? I know that a lot of guys say that the Ranger-Ts are the same thing, but are they really? The Ranger-Ts are not as heavy in each respective caliber.

[G33]

Not worth it.
Old/under powered.
DT ammo is better.
If you reload you could pull the bullets.
But SXT or XTP are available for reloads.
IMHO

[steel]

Thanks for the reply. I do shoot DT regularly, and am currently packing their 165 grain Gold Dots in my G20. I just liked the idea of having a 200 grain slug doing the job. I know that DT sells 200 grain 10mms, but not in either the Gold Dots or Golden Sabers (biggest is 180 grain). It would be great if someone made a 200 grain slug along the lines of Ranger-T/Black Talon/Gold Dot so that DT could load it to maximum power. I wonder why the Ranger-Ts are not available in 10mm and/or why Winchester does not provide 200 grain Black Talon-like slugs for the purpose of reloading.

[G33]

Ask Mike to load some?;)

[DanaT]

Where does one find SXT bullets for reloading?

I have asked winchester and they said no way. The silver tips are available, but not the SXT from what I have been able to find.

Do you have a source for them?

-Dana

[G-Bone]

Mike at Double Tap is goint to be loading some 210gr Gold Dot JHP for the 10mm in the future!

He is using a 41 Magnum 210gr Gold Dot swagged down to fit the 10mm, what an awsome idea!

So, if you want weight, speed and a Gold Dot in a 10mm, call Mike, he will put you on the list!

866-357-10MM

Oh ya, as for 200gr Black Talons... Well I have a few hundred rounds of them still. I fire a few every once and a while just to remind myself why I now carry Double Tap! Don't waist the money, IMHO.

[steel]

Wow!!! 210 grain Gold Dots would be ideal! I will definitely get some of these.

[390ish]

I missed a running groundhog with 5 rounds of black talon 10mm. Sure kicked up a lot of dirt. Think it scared him.

[VN350X10]

The Win. Ranger LE only ammo has the next generation "talon" bullet, but without the black oxide coating of the 1st gen.

The original B.T. ammo should be saved in full boxes as a collectors item. It was over-rated & over-hyped by the media.
Win. dropping it with the b.s. story of "why" was the smartest thing ever. Dump a poor product & generate good p.r. with help of the mass media in the proscess. P.T.Barnum would have been proud!


uncle albert

[Tazz10m]

Winchester is one big fat corporate hypocrite.

They refuse to make the Talon type bullets, SXT's and Rangers available for 10mm reloading or for "personal defense", although, they make the other calibers available along with hyped up advertising pushing them that totally contradicts their lame excuses to exclude 10mm. Screw them!

I talked with the Winchester execs at length about making these bullets available, so don't think i am just making all this up.

The 10mm Black Talon bullets themselves are a pretty darn good design, BUT, Winchester went and downloaded them to around 1000 fps in order to make the FBI happy and keep them sub-sonic in the MP5-10mm's. This made them a waste as they didn't really have enough velocity to expand properly except with longer barrels, close range, and idea "target media", and, if you are going to play the sub-sonic game with cool supressors you might as well shoot a slug that is going to be more effective at sub-sonic velocities like the .45 ACP. They might have also been a bit held back by the worry that if they did make them available they might be loaded to higher velocities than designed for causing a bit of jacket separation and the bad press that comes with it.

Give me DT's any day! Real ammo with balls from a company with balls!

Winchester, take note.

[glockawakka]

i use the dt 200gr xtp. for carry, for woods walking, for sitting on the nightstand.

[bambihunter]

I had a whole ammo crate full of 10mm, .44 mag, and .300 Win mag and sold the whole lot. I probably could have sold 'em for more, but as others have already stated, there is better ammo available for all 3 of the calibers I had it in. Besides, selling it bought my Kimber! ;f

[VN350X10]

I talked to a chap from Win. about the B.T.'s at length a few years back. Seems that in testing on IL whitetails, doing cull hunting for the Dept. of Cons. all of the BT's expanded rather well, except the 10MM. They couldn't tell expansion, as every one hit also had an exit hole. Test shooting was being done with T.C.Contenders w/10" bbls. to keep relative results valid. He didn't know if it was due to the low velocity/hard construction of the bullet or what. His thoughts were it was rather like using a .30 cal 180gr in a .30-30, where you get fantastic penatration due to bullet strength.
Had the velocities been like the old Norma ammo, it might have been a different story.



uncle albert

[steel]

Thanks for the info. That's interesting.