Legalizing a sawed off...

[emt1581]

A few years ago my friend came into possession of a sawed off 12ga. semi-auto that his grandfather bequeathed to him. The only problem is that the barrel was 13 inches...one inch short of being legal to own. Plus the stock was cut down to a pistol grip of sorts.

I think he chucked the illegal barrel so he wouldn't be in violation of any laws, but held on to the stock and receiver.

Since there is no regulation on the need for rifle's/shotgun's to have a certain lengh stock, he figures if he got a new barrel and kept it at normal length or cut it down to 14 inches or so, he'd be fine and not breaking any law.

Is this assumption correct or is he still going to be breaking some law?

Is 14 inches the legal limit for how short a non-SBS can be?

Thanks!

-Emt1581

[Kenneth Lew]

Google is your friend.

[HunterCO]

The barrel must be at least 18" for a shotgun and the over all length must be at least 26".

As long as he puts a barrel on it that is 18"+ and the over all length is 26"+ he will be fine.

Option 2 is to form 1 the gun as an SBS when he gets the approved form back he can put a short barrel on it.

[emt1581]

I thought Non-LE couldn't do the NFA route with a SBS unless the shotgun was originally made a SBS or if it's an AOW.

So 26" overall and at least an 18" Barrel?

Thanks!

-Emt1581

[HunterCO]

Originally posted by emt1581
I thought Non-LE couldn't do the NFA route with a SBS unless the shotgun was originally made a SBS or if it's an AOW.

So 26" overall and at least an 18" Barrel?

Thanks!

-Emt1581

You thought wrong the only thing a civilian can not form 1 is a MG.

[emt1581]

Ok thanks!

So as long as it's kept at the specified lengths he doesn't need to go any NFA routes.

Thanks

-Emt1581

[MrWithasee]

Would it be transferable?

[RWBlue]

Originally posted by MrWithasee
Would it be transferable?

Yes, but unless it is special you will have a hard time getting your $200 making fee because they will have to pay a $200 transfer fee.

i.e. Why buy when I can make my own?

Same is true of SBR.

[MrWithasee]

Originally posted by RWBlue
Why buy when I can make my own?

My thoughts exactly. I didn't know it was that easy.

[MrWithasee]

One other question:
Once I get the Form 1 back approved, what methods are aceptable for shortening the barrell? Do I need to purchase a new short bbl from a dealer with my Form 1 or can I cut the existing one?

[r2kba]

The ATF would still prosecute you, even if the gun is not in an illegal SBS configuration now, if they wanted to. No different than if they had information that you were making illegal Assault weapons during the AWB, they would still gladly toss you in jail for it today, even though the ban is expired.


It's not a "sawed off", it's a Short barreled shotgun.

[RWBlue]

Originally posted by MrWithasee
One other question:
Once I get the Form 1 back approved, what methods are aceptable for shortening the barrell? Do I need to purchase a new short bbl from a dealer with my Form 1 or can I cut the existing one?


After you gat an approved Form 1 back:
ATF doesn't care if you shorten the barrel
OR
Buy a barrel
OR
Decide you don't like the short barrel, and put a long barrel on the gun.

Remember to mark the frame.

[RWBlue]

Originally posted by r2kba
The ATF would still prosecute you, even if the gun is not in an illegal SBS configuration now, if they wanted to. No different than if they had information that you were making illegal Assault weapons during the AWB, they would still gladly toss you in jail for it today, even though the ban is expired.


It's not a "sawed off", it's a Short barreled shotgun.

r2kba, your post doesn't make sence.

Gun was in illegal configuration. When found out, the gun was made into a non-illegal configuration. No one in power can prove that it was illeagal configuration. They are thinking about making a SBS. They file the paperwork, do the right thing.

What am I missing?

[r2kba]

Originally posted by RWBlue
r2kba, your post doesn't make sence.

Gun was in illegal configuration. When found out, the gun was made into a non-illegal configuration. No one in power can prove that it was illeagal configuration. They are thinking about making a SBS. They file the paperwork, do the right thing.

What am I missing?


Just the fact that it was at one time contraband, is enough for ATF if they could articulate it.

[SilentGLOCK]

Once again: www.atf.gov

They have the answers to the questions.........

[PromptCritical]

EMT,

not really a flame here, but you have been posting in the NFA forum for quite some time and you don't know the definitions of various NFA items?! C'mon, this is easy stuff. The only place where it gets kindof hairy is how the ATF interprets various things and exactly what they use as measurements.

I'll be nice and post some quick definitions:

Short barreled shotgun: Shotgun designed or adapted to be fired from the shoulder with a barrel less than 18 inches or an overall length of less than 26 inches.

Short barreled rifle: Rifle designed or adapted to be fired from the shoulder with a barrel less than 16 inches or an overalll length of less than 26 inches (this includes attaching a stock to a pistol).

Machine gun: Any gun that will, or can readily be converted to fire more than round with a single activation of the trigger.

Silencer: Any device, or separate components of a device designed to reduce the report of a firearm.

Any other weapon: oddbal guns, zipguns, smoothbore pistols, pistols with forward vertical grips, gadget guns, disguised guns, shotguns originally equipped with only a pistol grip and ...

You know what? Just read the @#$%ing FAQ's stickied at the top. It pretty much has everything you need to know.

Oh and in addition: After GCA 1968 I believe, a SBS is required to be registered BEFORE actually becoming an SBS. If that is not the case, it is ILLEGAL. I would recommend you read up on the law before you post future situations which could be indicative of laws being broken. 10 years and $250K is pretty steep for a few inches of pipe. The NFA and GCA, and 922(o) are all total crap, but we gotta follow the law until they can successfully be repealed.

[RWBlue]

Originally posted by r2kba
Just the fact that it was at one time contraband, is enough for ATF if they could articulate it.

Ah Ok
I am arguing what they didn’t know will not hurt them. If it was marked contraband, registered contraband, then it would just be a matter of time until the ATF knocks on the door.

I think they are pretty safe registering it as SBS and then making the appropriate barrel.

[PromptCritical]

Originally posted by RWBlue
Ah Ok
I am arguing what they didn’t know will not hurt them. If it was marked contraband, registered contraband, then it would just be a matter of time until the ATF knocks on the door.

I think they are pretty safe registering it as SBS and then making the appropriate barrel.

Yeah, but I wouldn't go shouting about it on the internet. That's just dumb...

In the eyes of the ATF, regardless if you register it as a SBS now, whoever had posession of it while it was an unregistered SBS has broken the law. End of story. The days of being able to register after the fact ended with the amnesty in 1968. I have no idea on what the statute of limitations says about gun violations, but this is one of those things where you probably won't get caught if you keep your mouth shut.

I would recommend deleting this thread. It serves absolutely no constructive purpose and may even violate site rules.

Once again, as a gun enthusiast, YOU are responsible for knowing the laws which apply.

[r2kba]

+1