Buying a PM9! Answer some questions?

[Philly K-9]

After several months of going back and forth to gun shops and asking several questions on GT I've decided to buy a Khar PM9!!! Your posts and replys have helped me a lot!! Thank-you All!!!

Will you "experts" answer a few more questions to help me out?

First off, is $545.00 + tax and transfer a good price? I know it's a hell of a lot to me but is it a good deal for one of these weapons?

What do I do when I go to buy it? I've always just accepted the weapon handed to me at the shop. Of course I've checked them out but nothing like some of the things I've read here and elsewere on Glock Talk. I know this has been gone over in other posts but it's a lot of info to search. I know that I need to print out the posts about the recalled barrels. Also, someone posted about breaking it down to check for swirls and other marks. I really don't know what to look for other than something that stands out. Can someone give me some easy tips for picking a good PM9 at the store?

Black DLC or stainless two tone finish?

I'll need a good IWB holster! Something light, thin and of good quality, maybe thin leather or suede. I plan to carry it IWB at about 1:30. In another section of GT someone wrote something to the affect of "...why by a $10.00 holster for your $600.00 gun?" How true!

What is the best ammo for carry? I plan on using Federal Tactical 124 gn. JHP +P+. Will the PM9 handel this load well? Will the recoil be too much to control?

I look forward to reading your answers! Thanks in advance!!!

[cal s.fingers]

hi,try 525.00 if not buy it anyway.then go shoot it.taking it apart is up to you. the factory will stand behind it not the dealer.i love mine!

[JKG]

FWIW, I paid $599 OTD for my PM9 with Mepro night-sites (no sales tax in Oregon).

I would field strip any gun before buying it. The swirls you mentioned are machining marks (should not affect function). The slides are bead blasted, so look for anything that doesn't look uniform in finish. The underside of the slide should have the same finish as the top and sides.

Warmrain has mentioned before that you can simply use the slidelock to look at the underside of the slide. If you find one that looks good using this method, ask the salesperson to field-strip the gun. Yeah right, they probably won't have a clue, so learn how to strip a Kahr before you handle one. Its easy, but can be tricky the first time. The manuals are online at Kahr's website.

Check the firing pin, barrel fit, etc. while you have it stripped. Ask about return policies before you buy.

Good luck and have fun.

[drofnas]

$540 for mine locally, with standard sights.

Holster: Fist K4, with cant, and body shield for me. Tuckable. "ultra-thin" holster, and mine has the thin for the belt J-hook. I don't want the ultra-thin there since it gets some wear and tear. They are great with custom requests. I have a IWB tuckable mag carrier that they made special for me. Perfect.

Ammo choice will be very personal. I carry 147 grain hollow points in mine. I happen to have Ranger T, but Gold Dots, or Golden Sabers would also be among my chosen. The heavier is a tad less "snappy" for quicker follow up shots.

[Philly K-9]

cal s.fingers

$525.00?!?! $545.00 is with my police discount! Is there a program I'm missing out on?

I've rented a PM9 at this same store. I LOVE how it shoots, but I was only aboe to fire soft to normal rounds not the +P+ I plan on using. any sugestions on ammo?

[JKG]

Unless something has changed, the PM9 is not rated for +p+, only +p.

[Diogenes]

The ammo is not the problem -- well, it is, but you can correct the problem without having to select around certain ammo. I had the same problem with my PM9 -- racking perfectly with round points, but jamming with hollow points. After posting about this issue, I read a reply from an informed member. He told me of the fluff-n-buff, with polishing cream, to correct the problem. I did it, and it worked (shoots al hollow points fine). Just do a search on this issue to find the answer.

[cal s.fingers]

hi,no 545.00 is a great price but the answer is no unless you ask,i also think our p-m9s are rated for +p ammo.

[EldoEsq.]

High Noon Hidden Ally...35 bucks, leather, thin, conceals perfectly in dress slacks and a button down as well as any other outfit.

[warmrain]

$599 also (with night sights) at Sportsmen's Warehouse.

[jessegaronpresl]

$555 for two tone with nightsights at ordnanceoutsellers.com. $590 for DLC with nightsights.

[jlh2600]

Yeah night sites and black slide make a huge difference.

With standard sights, you can get the stainless NIB for $506 pre shipping/transfer etc. Add about a hndred for both night sights and the black finish.

[Banshee365]

I paid $500 for my 2 tone PM40 with night sights. It was returned to Kahr because the first owner put the recoil spring on backwards and it jammed up. Kahr replaced the guide rod and spring and sold it as a certifieid used weapon. Hell of a deal, the gun is flawless.

-Kelly

[c10bonanza]

I bought mine lnib from a GT member. It is the black DLC slide with green Meps. I paid $535.

I also bought a Hedley pocket holster and mag carrier. Fantastic holster.

[Philly K-9]

I'm starting to think I'm paying too much for this weapon! I'm being quoted $545.00 + 7% tax & $10.00 transfer fee for a PM9 with a stainless slide and standard sights! That's $593.15 out the door!Night sights will add $90.00 bucks! And that's with the discount the shop is giving to cops.

I'm a little confused about the cost. I've been to and have called several area shops and all have given me a higher price than the shop I'm going to buy from. What could be the reason for such a vast difference in cost between the shops here and where you people are shopping?

[warmrain]

Philly',

I don't know. The small shop that knows me well (I'm in there once a week, I've bought 10 weapons from them this year) quoted me $710 on a PM9 with night sights. That was their best good buddy price. I picked it up at Sportsman's Warehouse for <$600. Who's to say why where should be a $110 difference.

Now on a Kimber Ultra CDP the local shop wanted $1059 and S.W. wanted $1000 but couldn't tell me when I could get one (it took about 4 months), so for that $60 (consider the % between the 2 transactions) I got it at the local shop.

[Banshee365]

The price I got my PM40 for is close to $300 under retail. Kahr just raised the prices of there gun's so any gun ordered from them since the 17th, I think, will be more expensive. Basically what I'm saying is if you want a deal like I got you have to look around. The price you're getting quoted is below normal for a PM9, I'd consider that a good deal. Most places can't even get them wholesale for that much. If you want one really cheap like I got you'll need to find a factory used and refurbished gun.

-Kelly

[Blacktails]

Call or email dnrsports.com (http://) and get them to quote you a price for the PM9 model you are interested in. Don't go by the price that is listed on their web site, as the actual price will likely be lower. I bought my K9 Elite 2003 with night sights through them this way, and got a good deal.

[warmrain]

Everyone is talking like a Kahr product is just another commodity. They are not. I want to see the particular example I'm buying. I want to see if there are tooling marks, poorly dove tailed sights, galled stainless, etc. All problems that I've had to return guns to Kahr service in order to have them replaced.

Of course I'd like to test fire it too ;Q

[buddah]

Philly K-9, you are paying too much for the PM9. I am also a LEO. On Long Island N.Y my dealer charges $500.00 for 2 tone PM9 and $509.00 for DLC coating both w/ standard sights (price not incl. NYS sales tax of 8.75%). These are his LEO prices. If your Chief will give you a dept. letterhead you can purchase PM9 from www.interstatearms.com. They are in Mass. and prices are decent and they will ship direct to your Dept.

[Philly K-9]

Are you KIDDING ME! I just put down a $50.00 deposit on one this morning!!!!! I just now read your reply! @!$%&(@)!!!!!! I wish I read this before now! :soap:

Thanks alot for the info. I just checked out the web site. Even with the FFL fees I can get a PM9 WITH NIGHT SIGHTS cheeper than I'm paying now. Maybe I can get my $50.00 bucks back :(

Believe me when I tell you $545.00 is the lowest price around here. I've checked all the local cop freindly gun shops in and around Philly. All are at or above that price. I guess I'll have to beg for my money back.

Really, thanks for the info!!! I may use them for my next gun buy even if I can't do it for the PM9.

John

[Suburban]

Get the DLC coating. . . unless you don't mind a little rust. Getting the 2-tone model Robarized later would cost a lot more.

Fist 17 or 17A for the IWB holster. I tried the 19A, but it rides too high for my taste, and feels like it's flopping around. His mag pouches are great, and don't stick out like many of the belt loop pouches.

[Philly K-9]

I went back to the shop yesterday and told the manager about the difference in price. It works out to be a $61.00 diference in price. He took my number and told me he would "see what he can do" and call me.

As I wrote above I gave him a $50.00 deposit to hold the last PM9 with the black slide. I really don't expect him to refund my deposit. After all, it was my idea to give it to him to hold the weapon, not his.

Besides, it may be worth the $61.00 to but the weapon face to face and have someone to come back to if I have any problems.

[Philly K-9]

I e-mailed KAHR and asked them about using Federal Hydra-shock 124 grain +P+ in the PM9. My reply really did'nt answer my question. Whoever answered me suggested COR-BON 115 grain +P ammo but never gave me a yes or know answer about using +P+!

So I'll ask you guys. If the weapon is rated for +P, will +P+ make much of a difference? If it can handle +P's it should handle +P+, right?

I really like this round for carry. Besides, I have several boxes of it just laying in closet!

Can anyone help me out?

John

[Banshee365]

I really wouldn't carry +P+ in a little Kahr. Just get some Cor-bon Powerball and you're set if you want power.

-Kelly

[warmrain]

Philly,

Saying "If it can handle +P's it should handle +P+, right?" is like saying "If it can handle P's it should handle +P, right?"...

No. I'm mean, really... Just cause you have a few boxes... OK sure, it will handle it - for awhile... Even +P in a weapon "certified" for it is going to shorten its life.

The reason they recommended CorBon 115 gr. +P is probably because:
It is one of the more accurate rounds in this particular pistol (my my experience and several hundred $$ worth of testing this is my result and the RSOs at my club will confirm it). And the the little 3" bbl. Kahrs benefit from the velocity a lighter bullet achieves.

I think 124 gr. (or the Corbon 125 gr.) +Ps are fine too.

Some folks will shoot 9mm SMG ammo in their 9mms, OK fine... That works too for awhile, sometimes a short while.

OK, I'm off my :soap: now...

I fly with guys who say something like: "well if the Flight Manual says the plane will pull 6 Gs positive doesn't stand to reason that it will pull 6 Gs negative!". I tell them, "OK, you can be the test pilot, but not with me aboard and not with my aircraft."

Sure the plane might do it once, twice... You just can't see or measure the damage that's being done. And that damage will come and bite you when you least expect it and at the worst time.

Stay inside the envelope guys! ;)

[warmrain]

Won't everyone please stop talking about "price out the door" and just say the price. We all don't have the same sales tax, etc. and this makes it very difficult to compare.

It's not the shop's job to give you the best price out the door. It's the best price!

[Jercdevil]

I just bought the DLC with nightsights today it was $589.00.(Florida) It looks nice but why are they so much money ;P

[Philly K-9]

Originally posted by warmrain
Philly,

Saying "If it can handle +P's it should handle +P+, right?" is like saying "If it can handle P's it should handle +P, right?"...

No. I'm mean, really... Just cause you have a few boxes... OK sure, it will handle it - for awhile... Even +P in a weapon "certified" for it is going to shorten its life.

The reason they recommended CorBon 115 gr. +P is probably because:
It is one of the more accurate rounds in this particular pistol (my my experience and several hundred $$ worth of testing this is my result and the RSOs at my club will confirm it). And the the little 3" bbl. Kahrs benefit from the velocity a lighter bullet achieves.

I think 124 gr. (or the Corbon 125 gr.) +Ps are fine too.

Some folks will shoot 9mm SMG ammo in their 9mms, OK fine... That works too for awhile, sometimes a short while.

OK, I'm off my :soap: now...

I fly with guys who say something like: "well if the Flight Manual says the plane will pull 6 Gs positive doesn't stand to reason that it will pull 6 Gs negative!". I tell them, "OK, you can be the test pilot, but not with me aboard and not with my aircraft."

Sure the plane might do it once, twice... You just can't see or measure the damage that's being done. And that damage will come and bite you when you least expect it and at the worst time.

Stay inside the envelope guys! ;)

Ok, I understand your reasoning. I makes sense. I don't have much experience with +P ammo. My department only uses Remington 115 grain JHP ammo. Not a very good round for patrol officers in a major city IMHO.

The +P+ ammo was given to me by a cop in another Dept. when they went to .40's. It's much better than the stuff we are issued. When I had a G26 it ate that stuff like candy. I felt safe carrying it off duty. Our issued ammo just doesn't give me the same feeling!

When I buy the PM9 I'll buy a few boxes of the COR-BON 115gr. +P and see how I like it. As for the several boxes of Hydra-shok +P+, I guess I'll just have to buy a G19 to get rid of it all! ;)

[warmrain]

I didn't mean to beat you up Philly', ;)

I think you'll find the recoil of +P to be quite enough in the PM9 and I think that, while I might be tempted to trust the stainless pistols to +P+, I would not want to subject the little SS rails in the PM9 to it.

There will continue to be the argument over which weight of bullet is most effective in the very short bbls. Sanow and Marshall (I know guys) state that the data supports the 115 gr. because the short bbls. don't give a 147 gr. time to accelerate to sufficient speed to obtain reliable expansion...

I'm wondering where that puts the 124-125 gr. bullets. I'm concidering the CorBon 125 gr. +P

I don't feed my MK9 or PM9 a steady diet of +P, but I do carry it (after confirming that the gun will feed it).

Others might say that on the same philosophy that you could just carry the +P+, but you'd have to do some range testing... The whole thing makes me a little nervous...

[Philly K-9]

I never thought you were beatting me up! I respect the fact that you seem to know a lot more about this than I do and respect your advice. I'm very grateful for all the help the people on this forum have given me. In fact, being prior military and a cop I thought I knew a lot about weapons. I WAS WRONG! While I know more about them than most people I know, I know less than I thought I knew. Keep the advice comming! I'm listening!

As for the rounds I plan to use, I plan on firing standard pressure rounds most of the time at the range anyway. I will, of course, pratice with my choice of carry round but standard rounds will be my staple at the range.

Thanks again, and keep the advice comming!
John

[warmrain]

We're all learning John. It is an incredible resource and venue for sharing knowledge and ideas... ;c

[BikerRN]

I use Corbon 125 grain +P in all 3 of my 9mm's. It's accurate, reliable and fun to shoot. It doesn't hurt my hand like 125 grain .357 Magnums do out of a J-Frame lightweight.

I love the 124 grain +P round, but can't get them here. The Corbon 125 is as close as I can get, so it's what I use. I have always liked Corbon ammo. I know some people don't, to each his/her own I say.

[Suburban]

www.georgia-arms.com

124 gr. +P Gold Dot loads, they call it Shear Power Plus

Perhaps not the most effective ammo available, but very good, and at $11.50/50 rounds you can actually afford to shoot it.

[Philly K-9]

Well, I finaly bought my Kahr PM9!!!! I put 125 rounds thruogh it today. No malfunctions at all and it was dead-on at 20-30 feet. It was a little low/right further out but still very tight.
I loved firing it!!

I got the shop to take $40.00 off of the price by explaining about the better deal I got from www.interstatearms.com. The shop came within $20.00 of the better deal so I went whth them. It was worth the extra $20.00 to not have to deal with any hassle!!!

I carried it tonight for the first time off-duty. I really like how easy it is to carry!

The only problem I have is that I can't find a good IWB holster for it at the local gun shops. I had to opt for a cheep Uncle Mikes job for now.

Thanks a lot to all who helped me out! Really, THANKS!!!!!

[warmrain]

Cool deal Philly', I think you'll find some threads here on IWB holsters for the PM9 and MK9... If not just start a thread and we'll all jump on.

[drofnas]

FIST K4 for me. IWB, tuckable. I had them make an IWB mag carrier to match. Love it. Have them make the holster ultrathin, but the belt attachments in thin. Mine broke, but they fixed it for free to my request. Great customer service.

[Sgt127]

I have a case of Federal 9BP+P+ laying around. I used to shoot it in my Kahr MK9 and in my P7. Great ammo. I tried a box of it in my PM9 and it just beat the holy snot out of the barrel hood. Sent it back to Kahr, they tuned everything back up. I'm not sure how much advantage you are getting shooting +P or +P+ out of a barrel that short anyway. And, it just ticks me off how expensive designer ammo is getting these days. My solution was to stick to the WWB 115 GR HP. Get it at Walmart. I have shot about 1000 rounds of that stuff through my PM9. I know where it hits...I know it will run in my gun.
It seems to be about equal to the regular Federal 9BP as far as ballistics are concerned. And, its cheap.

[warmrain]

Yes, the boutique ammo is getting pretty pricey but it hasn't bothered me too much. Once the gun breaks in on ball ammo I run enough of a choosen SD ammo to be sure the gun likes it and then it only gets used periodically when I feel it needs to be replaced...