Almost a thousand bucks wasted on modification. Argh!!! [Archive] - Glock Talk

PDA

View Full Version : Almost a thousand bucks wasted on modification. Argh!!!


fnfalman
03-13-2006, 10:30
$960 later and all I got to show for it was a freakin' loud pipe!

Costs on Tuono's "performance modification":

$300 for Leo Vince slip-on
$270 for Power Commander
$200 for dyno tuning
$40 for K&N filter
$150 for Aprilia Racing 2-to-1 header (bought off eBay)

What do I get? A fookin' loud pipe. Yep. That's all I got. It makes some killer noise and that's all she wrote.

I got the slip-on and the Akrapovic for Aprilia header hooked up and the bike ran like crap. Snatchy throttle responses at low range and a nasty flat spot between 5500 to 7000 RPM. Put it on the dyno and the power curve showed exactly what I felt, not to mention a loss of 4-HP and 2-lbft of torque - 112-hp and 64-lbft.

Installed the PC and had it dyno tuned. The tuner said that's the best he could do without leaning the air-fuel ratio too much and make the bike run like crap. Dynoed it again and compared to bone stock set up (bone stock parts minus the derestricted airbox and exhaust baffle removed from stock can). The result was about the same as the stock setup. Actually the dip at 5500-rpm is a bit more with the current setup than from the stock setup, but thank goodness you can't feel it.

So, almost a grand worth of work resulted in nothing but a loud ass pipe. It's time to get me one of those T-shirts and wear it proudly, I guess.

However, my Aprilia guru said not to despair yet. He's going to sync the throttle bodies for me and play with the air-fuel mixture a bit more and then maybe some porting work on the heads, some internal polishings, Aprilia Racing chip to fool around with the cylinder timings, possibly some hotter cams and then he'll re-dyno tune the whole shebang for me, so at least the Power Commander won't go to waste.

The moral of the story is LOUD PIPES SAVE LIFE. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

J.R. Bob Dobbs
03-13-2006, 11:19
Welcome to the loud pipes crowd, real sorry to hear you're disappointed and that your wallet is lighter. I know what a disappointment that can be.

I've got a feeling that "the factory" spends lots of real engineering time to optimize the whole engine package. Many folks fall victom to advertizing claims that aftermarket parts will boost performance, but remember the old adage "Marketing has no use for facts".

This explains huge sales numbers by K&N, Hypercharger, Cobra, fuel line magnets, Tornado intake device, Slick 50, yadda yadda.

fnfalman
03-13-2006, 11:30
Well, that's not entirely true. My BMW benefited greatly from the aftermarket exhaust and the Power Commander. A gain of 13-HP and 5-lbft of torque.

J.R. Bob Dobbs
03-13-2006, 11:57
That's a nice and probably noticeable increase for your BMW, I can see why you had higher expectations for your Aprilia. Perhaps Aprilia spent more time with R&D for the Tuono, or maybe BMW made more concessions for US Emissions, etc....

I guess that really gives creedance to the phrase YMMV.

You're probably talking serious bucks with head porting, cam changes. There's always the possiblity of further performance decrease; porting and cams can hurt low to midrange power, where your bike might currently excel.

The tuners motto "one change at a time" may apply, but of course that takes more time (and $$$ if you're not doing the work yourself).

Definately not trying to criticize you, just a caveat emptor not to throw good money after bad.

fnfalman
03-13-2006, 12:58
Well, I gotta do something now. I can't accept defeat!~rf

Or I can do like what most smart people do and get one of those Jap liter bikes.

NMGlocker
03-13-2006, 13:27
Originally posted by fnfalman
Or I can do like what most smart people do and get one of those Jap liter bikes.
I'll take that as a compliment.
ZX10R baby!
;D

J.R. Bob Dobbs
03-13-2006, 13:52
How about dropping another tooth off the front? That'll cost under $50, make a real difference, and will improve your gas mileage too!!! (semi-private joke)

There's always nitrous ;P

Hey there's nothing wrong with being different and going European instead of Jap. I'm a Jap bike fan, but then again I'm a newbie and have no experience with anything else.

Kastivich01
03-13-2006, 14:02
I cant believe this hasnt been said yet:[$

fnfalman
03-13-2006, 14:47
I thought about posting a pic but why? No need to display my shame.

And I don't want to drop another tooth off the front or raise a couple in the rear. I don't want to ride a buzzsaw. The front had already gone down from 17T to 16T. My crazy Ape guru had his Mille set up with 15T front and 44T rear. The damn thing launches like a scolded cat but the vibration from highway riding is simply too much for me. And I think that his mileage drops down to like 30-MPG now.

However, since that the bike runs harder, the coolant circulation is greater, so he's running a few degrees cooler in the summer. ;P

J.R. Bob Dobbs
03-13-2006, 15:13
Pardon my ignorance, but what is the engine configuration in that bike? V2, I4, etc...

fnfalman
03-13-2006, 15:56
It's a 60-degree V-twin.

J.R. Bob Dobbs
03-13-2006, 16:47
Makes sense, I bet the inherant smoothness of an I4 makes it a better candidate than a V2 for lower gearing.

I'm thinking about doing another sprocket swap in my CB750, I love the change it made and it hasn't even hurt mileage (if anything it went up a tad).

But mine's an air-cooled I4, apples and oranges. Sorry to drift the topic.

Clydeglide
03-13-2006, 17:22
Originally posted by fnfalman
However, my Aprilia guru said not to despair yet. He's going to sync the throttle bodies for me and play with the air-fuel mixture a bit more and then maybe some porting work on the heads, some internal polishings, Aprilia Racing chip to fool around with the cylinder timings, possibly some hotter cams and then he'll re-dyno tune the whole shebang for me, so at least the Power Commander won't go to waste.

I don't think throwing more money at it is the solution. I'd put the bike back to the way it was and love it for what it is and not what you wish it to be.

Sell all that stuff and follow through on the liter bike thing. There's a reason our Busa's are bone stock.

I've done the mod thing on a couple of vehicles and was never quite happy enough with the result. I just couldn't justify the cost/benefit.

Ok, maybe I'll do a turbo on the Busa but that's it.

:cool:

fnfalman
03-13-2006, 17:34
But leaving a bike bone stock is too sensible of a thing to do.

We'll see about further engine modifications. Maybe I'll smart up and leave the damn thing as is. However, one thing for sure, the stock suspension must go. It's calibrated for a skinny Italian guy and I ain't neither skinny nor Italian.

Clydeglide
03-13-2006, 19:32
Originally posted by fnfalman
But leaving a bike bone stock is too sensible of a thing to do.

We'll see about further engine modifications. Maybe I'll smart up and leave the damn thing as is. However, one thing for sure, the stock suspension must go. It's calibrated for a skinny Italian guy and I ain't neither skinny nor Italian.

I think if you do the factory race chip or whatever they have would be a better way to go. Every person who has "derestricted" their bikes seem to be happy with them.

I am very wary of many "tuners". It takes more than the ability to purchase or lease a dyno to properly tune an engine.

:cool:

fnfalman
03-13-2006, 19:40
From what I can tell by chatting with various Aprilia owners, the factory chip is an iffy thing. It's very pipe specific. Some also have mixed results with the Evoluzione chip (Evoluzione is one of the specialty Ducati/Aprilia and soon to be BMW performance tuner). Many use the factory chip in tandem with the Power Commander and I think that's what I'm going to have to do.

The same that that dyno tuned the Tuono is the same guy that did my Rockster. He's no master tuner but he's pretty good at what he does. However, I'll let my personal Aprilia guru massage it a little bit and see what's up. If not then I'll consider it lesson learned.

bigtinva
03-13-2006, 19:47
But chicks dig loud pipes ;f

RBR
03-13-2006, 22:09
This'll fix that poor performing exhaust

http://www.ducati.com/bikes/my2006/ducatiModel.jhtml?family=superbike&modelName=999R-06

fnfalman
03-14-2006, 08:56
Thanks, but I like an Italian V-twin that I can ride on a daily basis without breakdowns.;)

And if I were to want a crotch rocket, an Aprilia Mille Nera will put out almost as much horsepower without the reliability issue.

MikeG22
03-16-2006, 01:02
When I wanted more out of my 04 GSX-R 600 I just bought a 750 motor with the ECU and everything and swapped it in. 1500 bucks and gained like 25hp+ and alot more usable torque. That was nice.

I'm thinking about buying one of the new 06 GSX-R 750's. They are sweet!! And still 20hp more than the tuono yet still being nice and light and flickable.

http://suzukicycles.com/images/ProductImages/logo/500/GSXR750K6.jpg

fnfalman
03-16-2006, 09:40
The Gixxer750 only puts out 9-HP more than the Tuono (the first generation and not the current 06 generation Tuono) but also at close to 10-lbft of torque less. And it's not a V-twin.