Glock 18 full auto

[fowl intent]

interesting video on YouTube. I had never heard of a G18 (or possible a converted G17) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sO4IxtkFHac&mode=related&search=

[halfmoonclip]

I have seen that before...and love to watch it every time.
Seems to me it is a converted G17 (anyone know by whom and how?).
The stock makes a ton of sense; anyone ever see a G18 fired w/o the stock? Controllable?
Moon

[RickJZ]

I can never understand what the allure is of a full auto pistol. One would (IMHO), be servered better by the H&K mp5k, mp7, or the new B&T tmp.

[KalashnakovKids]

Is it possiable to purchase A hk MP5k in semi auto? or in my case where im not a millionaire, are there clones of somewhat good quality on the market?

[26Glocker]

Originally posted by RickJZ
I can never understand what the allure is of a full auto pistol...
+1!
:thumbsup:

[shyguy24]

Vector Arms makes a pretty good MP5 clone. They sell for around $1500. Here is a link http://www.vectorarms.com/indexframe.html
HK used to import a semi-auto version, the HK94, but they fetch a pretty high price if you find somebody wanting to part with one.

[roymail]

Here's link: http://www.fss-g.com/index2.htm

Personally, I couldn't afford the ammo or the FFL.

[Glock19ster]

Originally posted by RickJZ
I can never understand what the allure is of a full auto pistol. One would (IMHO), be servered better by the H&K mp5k, mp7, or the new B&T tmp.

+2 I fired a real glock 18 right after a real HK mp5(both full auto of course) and I got much better results with the HK. The GLOCK 18 was a waste. It is not very controllable even when you hold it down. I can not imagine a situation where a police officer would ever need something like that. It was fun to shoot though I must say!

[RickJZ]

Originally posted by KalashnakovKids
Is it possiable to purchase A hk MP5k in semi auto? or in my case where im not a millionaire, are there clones of somewhat good quality on the market?
the closest you will get to the MP5K is the SP 89. They command a high price; around 3500. Many SP 89's were converted to full auto (with legal sears). For some one that has deep pockets, there are a few original MP5K's out there (18-21K). Armament Services International has many transferables in stock. check out their site www.autoweapons.com

[Butch]

Originally posted by RickJZ
I can never understand what the allure is of a full auto pistol. One would (IMHO), be servered better by the H&K mp5k, mp7, or the new B&T tmp.
It must have something to do with the skill level of the shooter involved.....I'd take a G18 over an MP-5 any day.....then I could put it in my holster and carry an M16 for serious work.

With a little training and practice the G18 is very shootable.

G18 VIDEO shooting Hornady Vector ammo (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=536247494592804906&hl=en) (Sorry about the video quality, it's recorded off a TV screen from a VHS tape with my digital camera)

This is a time lapse photo of the same string of fire that shows all the shots:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/ButchG17/1d46e721.jpg

And this is a snapshot also taken during the same string that shows one round from the muzzle all the way through the target...note the three cases in the air:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0603/ButchG17/6ec63200.jpg




:patriot:

[major]

I shot a G18 once at a firearms class I took.

Yeah, it was fun.
No, I don't see any real life benefit.

[DGallandro]

For me, full auto is the ultimate toy.

I get the giggles when I shoot full auto. I won't even try to explain it. To date, I've only fired one full auto, but I got to see the Glock 18 fired (same day I was shooting the Thompson) and I got to watch an MP5SD fired on a closed, indoor range with the muffs off. I could not actually believe how quiet the gun was. The impact of the bullets hitting the metal backstop was louder than the gun. "Pftftft! Brrring!"

But I digress.

I've seen a couple of videos of the G17 conversions. It is a real, mechanically viable workable full auto solution. It is also illegal for ordinary civvies to do it.

The blueprint for the actual unit, which replaces the backcap, can be purchased online, although I don't remember where.

The principle involves an angled piece of steel that engages the sear so that as the pistol closes into battery, the sear is forced downward, disengaging from the striker at just the right moment (the unit must be adjusted for the gun). The semi auto selection allows the angled piece of steel to float free, rearward, so that it need not engage the sear of the gun. When in the full-auto position, the angled piece of steel is rigid in the forward position.

The switch itself is either friction fit, or spring-detent for "on" and "off" and generally slides left to right. The entire unit, replacing the rear cap of the slide, sticks out the back of the slide about 1/4 inch. Generally, it is made of aluminum and spray painted, powder coated, or anodized to match the weapon.

In circumstances where such a conversion would be legal, it's a nifty little device. (I've seen videos of a class 2 demoing it...IIRC it's GlockConversion.mpg)

DG

[Glockerstein]

It's cool, but not accurate.

[G19c,PH]

Shooting full auto is cool and fun.:)

[roflcakes]

Originally posted by RickJZ
I can never understand what the allure is of a full auto pistol. One would (IMHO), be servered better by the H&K mp5k, mp7, or the new B&T tmp.

Maybe because its a full auto.. PISTOL?

As in, much, much smaller than mp5's or other SMG's. There's SMG's, and there's automatic pistols. If you don't understand why automatic pistols have their niche I'm guessing you don't understand why in the world anyone would want a rifle, shotgun or high powered sniper rifle. After all, they're different from the uses of the mp5 which is king!

Also, that's not a G18. G18's are 3 round burst and semi auto only. This is a G17 with a GSSF dropped in to give it a full auto function.

[17L1]

"full auto is the ultimate toy"

+1 :)

[Butch]

Originally posted by roflcakes
G18's are 3 round burst and semi auto only.
Nope.

G18's are select fire....semi and full auto only.

Did you look at the video I posted? That's a G18C.




:patriot:

[GLOCK23DK]

Originally posted by roflcakes
G18's are 3 round burst and semi auto only.

Why would you even post that? Based on that statement, it is clear that you have not even bothered to do a google search on a G18, or you would realize its a full auto pistol.

Im not TRYING to be a jerk, but man, its crap like this that perpetuates false info that others buy in to.

"think before you speak" : real life


"dont post crap that you dont know to be 100% true" : internet life

[roflcakes]

Originally posted by Butch
Nope.

G18's are select fire....semi and full auto only.

Did you look at the video I posted? That's a G18C.




:patriot:

Well, the glock 18 is no longer on the glock website.

I got the burst thing off of world.guns.ru. Guess their info is wrong. :\

http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg15-e.htm

"The select-fire version of the Glock, called Glock 18, available only in 9mm Luger and only for Military / Law enforcement sales. Glock 18 could fire single shots or three-shot bursts. Glock 18 may be equipped with 31-rounds extended magazines and after-market folding stocks. For security reasons, some parts of the Glock 18 ARE NOT interchangeable with Glock 17/19 pistols. The theoretical rate of fire in full-auto mode is 1200 rounds per minute."

[neeko]

Originally posted by roflcakes

Also, that's not a G18. G18's are 3 round burst and semi auto only.


Haha you clearly play too much Counter-Strike.

[Butch]

Originally posted by roflcakes
I got the burst thing off of world.guns.ru. Guess their info is wrong.
That would be my best guess, every G18 I've ever seen or fired has been full or semi only.

The Beretta 93R on the other hand, is semi or three shot....note the three little dots by the selector lever:
http://world.guns.ru/handguns/beretta93r-1.jpg

And, with the shoulder stock attached, the HK VP70 gave a three shot burst:
http://www.waffenhq.de/infanterie/vp70-links-schaft.jpg




:patriot:

[Butch]

Originally posted by roflcakes
Well, the glock 18 is no longer on the glock website.
It's on the Team Glock page: http://www.teamglock.com/Glock-Buyers-Guide/Glock-18.htm



:patriot:

[roflcakes]

Originally posted by neeko
Haha you clearly play too much Counter-Strike.

I just listed where I got that information are. Are you stupid?


Originally posted by Butch
It's on the Team Glock page: http://www.teamglock.com/Glock-Buyers-Guide/Glock-18.htm



:patriot:


Thanks for the link. :thumbsup:

[roymail]

My apologies to GLOCK23DK. I misunderstood your post and thought it was addressed to Butch. The comment I was referring to was originally made by roflcakes. My bad! Thanks to a GT friend for calling this to my attention.

[G33]

Have shot a G18 on several trips out.
It takes more practice than I have to shoot well.
Trigger control is key.

Now I did great with the MP5 on three round setting.
Jes!!
:supergrin: :banana:



I think a three round burst G18 or G17 would be the cat's meow.
:thumbsup:

[Infallible]

Originally posted by roflcakes
Maybe because its a full auto.. PISTOL?

As in, much, much smaller than mp5's or other SMG's. There's SMG's, and there's automatic pistols.

+1:thumbsup: Its the ultimate CQB body guard tool. It can be carried on the person under a suit jacket much easier than the smallest mp5.

[DGallandro]

Its the ultimate CQB body guard tool. It can be carried on the person under a suit jacket much easier than the smallest mp5.


See, that's what I was thinking. Imagine running the El Presidente drill with a G18. :supergrin:


DG

[GSD17]

I have shot the G18, and I completely agree with Butch, it is controllable.





AND FUUUUUUUUUUUNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!:banana:

[Lowrangerider]

I have also shot a G18 and didnt have a problem controling it. I was even complemented by the owner. He said "not many people can control this pistol, you have a great grip"

[Blitzer]

It is a Glock 17 with a select fire adapter, if you watch closely you see the operator accidentally flip the selector on the back of the slide and change it again. The Glock 18's selector is on the left side of the slide.

Here is one, not the one in the video:

http://www.fss-g.com/index2.htm

[halfmoonclip]

Originally posted by Lowrangerider
I have also shot a G18 and didnt have a problem controling it. I was even complemented by the owner. He said "not many people can control this pistol, you have a great grip"
The swing down foregrip on the dustcover of the full auto Berettas always looked like a good idea to me, tho' the Glock in the video seemed very much under control.
Moon

[Giggity-Giggity]

It's not an actual G18, but a modified G17. You can tell they added the switch on the rear of the slide.

[halfmoonclip]

Originally posted by Giggity-Giggity
It's not an actual G18, but a modified G17. You can tell they added the switch on the rear of the slide.

How, 'perzactly, is it possible to do that legally? Not meaning to put you on the spot, G-G; just hoping you might know.
What a neat toy, and what a testament to Glock durability.

BTW, no particular offense meant by the 'toy' crack; just thinking out loud what a bad idea it would be to actually get in a shooting with such a thing. Anyone recall the Ayoob tale of the H&K salesman beset by the biker gang? Guy had every reason in the world to put lead in the air, but his MP5 became the issue in the case; he apparently shot some BGs to doll rags.
Moon

[PromptCritical]

Originally posted by halfmoonclip
How, 'perzactly, is it possible to do that legally? Not meaning to put you on the spot, G-G; just hoping you might know.
What a neat toy, and what a testament to Glock durability.

BTW, no particular offense meant by the 'toy' crack; just thinking out loud what a bad idea it would be to actually get in a shooting with such a thing. Anyone recall the Ayoob tale of the H&K salesman beset by the biker gang? Guy had every reason in the world to put lead in the air, but his MP5 became the issue in the case; he apparently shot some BGs to doll rags.
Moon

Assuming you live in the US, if you have to ask, there is no legal way in any possible scenario for you to do that. It is simply not possible. I have heard that there are an extremely limited number (as in single digit) of converters registered before the '86 ban went into effect, but they would cost aobut the same as a new Cadillac to buy. Them's the breaks. I think it's crap.

My advice: if you want cheap full auto, but a transferable M11/9. If your state allows it, you should be able to get one for around $3500, plus $200 tax. It's the closest you can get to a machinepistol under $10,000.

Do a googel search for "NFA weapons" for more info, or read the stickied threads at the top of the FreeFire Forum.

Oh, and I heard the Hk guy used a Ruger AC556, and got jokingly criticised by his boss for not using an Hk product. Ayoob, btw, seems extremely sensitive to legal issues after a shooting. His stance is that, if you can, avoid using any defense that will give a presecutor reason to go after you. I think he's paranoid, but many guys have been put through the wringer after a good shoot because of their choice of weapon or ammo. A good case would be the poor guy in AZ, I think, who shot an attacker with a 10mm Kimber. They said it was too powerful and sent the guy to jail, even though he was technically justified in shooting the attacker.

[halfmoonclip]

Originally posted by PromptCritical
Assuming you live in the US, if you have to ask, there is no legal way in any possible scenario for you to do that. It is simply not possible. I have heard that there are an extremely limited number (as in single digit) of converters registered before the '86 ban went into effect, but they would cost aobut the same as a new Cadillac to buy. Them's the breaks. I think it's crap.

My advice: if you want cheap full auto, but a transferable M11/9. If your state allows it, you should be able to get one for around $3500, plus $200 tax. It's the closest you can get to a machinepistol under $10,000.

Do a googel search for "NFA weapons" for more info, or read the stickied threads at the top of the FreeFire Forum.

Oh, and I heard the Hk guy used a Ruger AC556, and got jokingly criticised by his boss for not using an Hk product. Ayoob, btw, seems extremely sensitive to legal issues after a shooting. His stance is that, if you can, avoid using any defense that will give a presecutor reason to go after you. I think he's paranoid, but many guys have been put through the wringer after a good shoot because of their choice of weapon or ammo. A good case would be the poor guy in AZ, I think, who shot an attacker with a 10mm Kimber. They said it was too powerful and sent the guy to jail, even though he was technically justified in shooting the attacker.

There is some other deal out there where you become a 'manufacturer' or 'dealer', and can possess but not transfer rock n' roll stuff. All moot to me; more trouble than I care to endure. A SBR might be fun.
You might be right about the Ruger; you are certainly right that ol Mas thinks waaaaaaaaaaaaay too hard about legal stuff, tho' sometimes he is eminently practical. Those of us who live in relatively gun-friendly places might not be in a jackpot, but the guy with the 10mm is just a mystification. Kinda like the two border patrol guys that wounded that drug perp, and ended up in jail.
Moon

[Blitzer]

Originally posted by Glockerstein
It's cool, but not accurate.

For what it is worth old Gunny praises the GLOCK 18 as the most accurate submachine gun on the market today.

There are a lot of information to indicate you are in error especially with the latest G18 models.

Having not shot one myself maybe you could enlighten us on your experiences with the GLOCK 18?

[PromptCritical]

Originally posted by halfmoonclip
There is some other deal out there where you become a 'manufacturer' or 'dealer', and can possess but not transfer rock n' roll stuff. All moot to me; more trouble than I care to endure. A SBR might be fun.
You might be right about the Ruger; you are certainly right that ol Mas thinks waaaaaaaaaaaaay too hard about legal stuff, tho' sometimes he is eminently practical. Those of us who live in relatively gun-friendly places might not be in a jackpot, but the guy with the 10mm is just a mystification. Kinda like the two border patrol guys that wounded that drug perp, and ended up in jail.
Moon

Manufacturers can make all they want, they just have to report that they made it. Dealers can buy just about anything but they need a "love letter" from an agency or department to buy dealer sample MG's. Both must be able to prove they have the licenses and tax status for the purpose of income, not just because they want to own cool toys. It can be done, but not for fun.

On the border patrol guys. I was pretty outraged when I first heard about it, but after hearing the facts, I think they were justly convicted. They shot the guy in the back (which doesn't immediately mean wrong-doing), but then they collected their casings and tried to bury it without doing the proper investigation following any LE shooting. I'm willing to bet that if they had simply reported it, and followed the rules, they probably wouldn't be in jail right now.

Anyway, you might wanna see about attending one of the numerous MG shoots held around the country, someone is sure to have a G-18 or one of the converters and would probably let you run a mag through it. I've fired a G-30 with a conversion, and it was interesting, but I still want to try a real deal G-18C. I tried the converter in my 17L, but it wouldn't run right.

From experience, I've found the MP-5 to be quite controllable, and I hear the SD version (integrated suppressor) is ultra controllable, but since I haven't shot a G-18, I really have no comparison.

[halfmoonclip]

PC-Thnx for the comeback; what you said about dealers/MFG sounds like what I've heard/read. :thumbsup:

I've had the pleasure of shooting an MP5, and have the picture to prove it. About as much fun as you can have with your clothes on, and VERY easy to control. A buddy has one,and he got it BEFORE the D's stuck the poison pill amendment in the Gun Owners Protection Act. He'll make a bunch of money if he ever sells it.
Moon

[UZIFORME]

The 86 ban that you are blaming on the Ds was signed by the most popular R of all time Ronald Regan was president and he signed off on it without a second through with reccomendations from the NRA

[halfmoonclip]

Uzi, do you understand a 'poison pill' amendment? One that is proposed in an effort to defeat a total piece of legislation?
If you are defending the D's, here was the deal. When it became obvious that the Gun Owners' Protection Act was a bill that had more than the votes to pass (in a Congress with a D majority; the original bill was the doing of the NRA), anti-gun D's added the amendment that banned the importation or manufacture of any more fully automatic weapons. Despite the fact that registered fully automatic weapons were involved in exactly one crime since 1936, the anti-gunners figured it was a win-win deal. If the bill passed, they'd have a ban on one type of weapon, and if the whole bill was defeated because of the 'poison pill', then they'd have what they REALLY wanted-stopping a progun piece of legislation.
Soooooo, given the choice of losing a piece of good legislation that was the result of years of work, or accepting an amendment that screwed some gun owners, the NRA acquiesced and supported the final bill, and Dutch Regan signed it into law.
Perhaps because of the fallout from this situation, the NRA has been very solid in its opposition to so called 'assault weapons' bans, and sport shooters have followed the NRA's lead in support of fellow gunnies who enjoy black rifles.
Despite some solid pro-gun Ds (John Dingell comes to mind, among many others), anti-gun legislation comes from the left side of the aisle.
Moon

[UZIFORME]

Originally posted by halfmoonclip
Uzi, do you understand a 'poison pill' amendment? One that is proposed in an effort to defeat a total piece of legislation?
If you are defending the D's, here was the deal. When it became obvious that the Gun Owners' Protection Act was a bill that had more than the votes to pass (in a Congress with a D majority; the original bill was the doing of the NRA), anti-gun D's added the amendment that banned the importation or manufacture of any more fully automatic weapons. Despite the fact that registered fully automatic weapons were involved in exactly one crime since 1936, the anti-gunners figured it was a win-win deal. If the bill passed, they'd have a ban on one type of weapon, and if the whole bill was defeated because of the 'poison pill', then they'd have what they REALLY wanted-stopping a progun piece of legislation.
Soooooo, given the choice of losing a piece of good legislation that was the result of years of work, or accepting an amendment that screwed some gun owners, the NRA acquiesced and supported the final bill, and Dutch Regan signed it into law.
Perhaps because of the fallout from this situation, the NRA has been very solid in its opposition to so called 'assault weapons' bans, and sport shooters have followed the NRA's lead in support of fellow gunnies who enjoy black rifles.
Despite some solid pro-gun Ds (John Dingell comes to mind, among many others), anti-gun legislation comes from the left side of the aisle.
Moon


That's a real purty excuse for comprimising with the enemy.

[halfmoonclip]

Originally posted by UZIFORME
That's a real purty excuse for comprimising with the enemy.

Not an excuse at all, Uzi. Just an explanation. Not everything in politics can be our way, and sometimes the other side can be pretty damn clever.
My point was to put the blame on the anti-gun Ds who created the situation, not the decent Ds and Rs who were stuck with an Hobsonian choice.
I'm glad it wasn't my decision to make. What would you have done?
Moon