G20

[bobehud]

Well guys this is a new style post for me.I am haveing an issue with a Glock.lol..
I recently got a G20 in a trade it has a Jarvis 6" and some change barrel,Wolf FLAT 22# recoil,spring,guide rod,buffer,etc,etc.
What is going if I release the slide when it strips the first round off it jams between top of mag and top of barrel.Now if i swap out the
Silvertip(Which is what i keep about 12 boxs of)and put Remignton UMC
hardball FN strips first round off perfect.
Heres the wierd part if i grab the slide and give a fast hand cycle
it will strip the Silvertips off just fine,AND i can hand cycle an entire 15 rnd mag like that also(which with that damn recoil springs gives the ol' hand a workout)
I have had a G36...and had Zero issues so i am like WTF this is a GLOCK THEY ALWAYS WORK...lol
I own two other 10mm and this completes my 10mm quest for now so i really,really,really want to get this figured out.(Oh the other 10's are a Wonder finish Witness,and a Smith 1006.)Smith is a tank of a gun.
To add insult to injury the other two 10's have also worked flawless.

So i go to the temple of 10.
HELP!!

Thanks
Bob

[G33]

Too many variables.
Put it back to stock condition.
Make one change at a time and see.
:supergrin:

Silvertips are one of my two favorite and reliable loads.
Double Tap is the other.

[MakeMineA10mm]

A few points/ideas:

1. G33 makes a great point, and to track down the problem, you'll have to do this to identify the real cause of the issue.

2. How does it do feeding when you're shooting it? Any hang-ups then, or just when hand-cycling that first round?

3. There have been many threads in General Glocking describing this kind of hang-up. Unfortunately, I don't remember the answer off the top of my head, but if you do a search over there with some words like "barrel hood hang-up" that should get you there.

4. We were taught in semi-auto transition class that all guns' slides are meant to be operated at full-force (after all, when shooting the slide moves so fast, we just about can't perceive it), so there's no suprise that if one "babies" the slide and rides it down as one is cycling that there could be operator-induced malfunctions. It doesn't sound to me like this is what's happening, but you didn't clearly say it isn't either, so watch out for this. The proper way to cycle the slide is to pull it fully to the rear and LET GO. Do not even allow any of your parts (heel of slide-pulling hand, thumb of gripping hand, jacket, shirt, etc.) to brush against/rub against the slide, as that slows slide velocity.

I really think this may be just you getting used to pulling the slide hard enough with that 22# spring. When there is a major change like you alluded to with the extra effort required with that spring, sometimes we compensate as we learn to use it by using the minimal force needed to over-come the spring, when, in reality, what the gun wants is a good jerk of the slide to the rear and allowed to run home under it's full power.

[bobehud]

I saw that thread also and cant remember tried that search didnt get a hit.
What i do to cause the issue is lock slide to the rear insert Mag and hit slid release if it has Hardball Remingto snaps close like butter.Damn Silvertips it at a 45 degree stop top of barrell and in the mag.BUT and this a big BUT (come on were all adults here..lol)
If I insert Mag and Lock my arms and jerk it back strips it of fine,and as i said i can do an entire mag like that .In fact last night did 4 mags like that loaded them up and gave the ol' forearm a workout.

Now i have been checking cant be a WOlf spring they do not make a flat spring and thats what this has little blue buffer,hex in the front SS guide rod.

[10mm4ever]

Drop in the stock barrel and recoil spring and try it. I dont recommend any other aftermarket recoil springs except Wollf or ISMI. Some of these springs will "crash" before the slide can hit its rear stop, which will cause a host of problems, such as short stroking. Luckily with the Glock you can lock the slide to the rear, and see if there's still some space between the coils, by looking through the space between the dustcover and slide.

[klmmicro]

Originally posted by bobehud
Now i have been checking cant be a WOlf spring they do not make a flat spring and thats what this has little blue buffer,hex in the front SS guide rod.

I have an Aro-Tek SS guide-rod with flat 20# spring that I bought through Lone Wolf. It sounds just like your description. Could this be what you have?

It has already been suggested to return to completely stock and work forward again, but you could try just changing the recoil spring assembly back to stock as a starting point.

[bobehud]

Thatis first thing i thought of i am a shop owner coil stack is bad for struts too.
Does have space left between coils.See the issue is i DO NOT have any of the old parts,which is odd i got the tupperware with unopened warranty envelope,little white brush,etc.All the new stuff,4 15 round mags.
Gun looks pristine.When i broke it down still had the gold assembly,or anti seize whatever they use at Glock.Have not shot gun yet going to go to my lest favorite indoor range tonight.See how it acts there.
See i work with mechanical things constantly this gun isnt haunted something is just off a bit. If man cen build it,it can be fixed.
I have never had an issue with my other Glock.A G36.Soo I am trying
to trouble shot.

Thanks guys for any input.I have done more no BS trade and purchaese since i came to GT.:thumbsup: :supergrin:

[klmmicro]

I would order a stock recoil assembly. They are like $10 (or cheaper) and keep it on hand.

Yes, it does sound like something simple and it will probably fix quickly once the offending part is focused on. The easiest point to start with is the recoil assembly.

[MakeMineA10mm]

I just re-read your original post and saw the word "buffer"... See this thread: http://www.glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=635499&highlight=jam

Also, check out this failure to feed thread. I'm running out the door, and didn't read all of it, but it looks like what you're describing:
http://www.glocktalk.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=626783&highlight=feed+jam

[bobehud]

Is it possible because i hand cycle the slide is moveing alot faster then when i just drop the slide.?
Like i said prior not used to haveing to fiddle with a glock.
Want to buy a KKM 6" .357 SIG barrel so i can see how much noise i can make.Was looking at DT loads they are JUST what i want.Love the 10mm,love even more then fact with a quick barrel switch you can shot three different loads.
I am just thinking about takeing it back down to stock a piece at a time.LMAO god ,have to take all the fun stuff off.If doesnt go BANG its just an expensive club.

[G33]

1. take buffer out.
2. put in stock recoil rod/spring.
Check it.
:supergrin:

[bobehud]

Odd angle locks up slide.top of round jammed against barrel.

[bobehud]

Left to right

Hydrashock..feeds fine (yes i know its junk)
Silvertip..Wil produce THIS jam everytime you drop slide.
Remington UMC..Feeds fine

For some reason the Silvertip round ends up at an odd angle in the breech.The Hydrashock is alot more open,gapping even and will feed fine from a slide drop.

Me..getting a drinking habit soon..lol

Thanks guys

[bobehud]

now pics

[bobehud]

New twist after reading post's detail stripped gun lubed it properly.
Now with Glock 10 round mags..NO ISSUE..With Glock 15 round mags,same jam every time.
Now those dang HydraShocks are wide open like ashtrays they fees fine.
The Silvertip feed great in every other Ten i own.I had them all out.
It looks as if the slid is not for some reason getting a good grab on the Silvertip and as it feeds foward cocks the bullet at an acute angle jamming the gun with the round.

[Vulcanese]

bobehud:

Do you have the same problem with the Glock barrel?

I had problem that I think you are describing with my Jarvis barrel in a G20. The rounds were hanging up at the 12 o'clock position at the mouth of the chamber.

I used a Dremel with a Diamond Taper Point (part number 7134) to round the chamber mouth at 12 o'clock. Problem solved.

Take care not to remove too much material. Just round the sharp edge. This G20 now functions flawlessly.

http://www.amazon.com/Dremel-7134-Diamond-Taper-Point/dp/B00004UDJB

Hope this helps!
Vulcanese

[bobehud]

Exactly right jams solid with the Silertips points 12 o'clock high.
Have the Dremel ,and have the tool.
Just a small radius,do not want to remove case support but give the round a radius instead of a sharp edge...

[Vulcanese]

Originally posted by bobehud
Exactly right jams solid with the Silertips points 12 o'clock high.
Have the Dremel ,and have the tool.
Just a small radius,do not want to remove case support but give the round a radius instead of a sharp edge...

Yes, this solved the problem for me. I actually have 2 Jarvis barrels for the G20, one 4.6" (stock length) and one 6". Had to do this to both. I'll take some pics and post them later if you like.

[bobehud]

Okay im calling this gun CHRISTINE..Went to an indor range today was like well lets see how bad this is.......
Not one failure shot 100 rounds Remington UMC,then 80 rounds of the Silvertip which i just knew was going to be BANG,clear jam,BANG clear jam.......UM nope.
Even the friggin laser (Arma Laser) was dead on.
Ran like a damn sewing machine.So there you have it i have for the first time named a pistol.CHRISTINE is now my house gun.
It was a super sweet gun to shot,you could tell that 6 in barrel helped the Silvertips, I was standing back in the booth a little to much and you could feel as well hear the Silvertips cook off.

Love Glocks.Next thing i know ill wake up and will have applied the Digital urban camo job i want to do on it...lmao..
Guys thanks i do not get it but its a Glock so it just WORKS.
Bob:hearts: :hearts: :hearts:

[VN350X10]

The chamfering/radiusing that you did at the 12 o-clock position is standard operating procedure on every KKM 10MM bbl that I've ever encountered. Something to do with the tightness of the chamber itself.
A stock Glock chamber is a garbage mouth & will feed everything/anything known in the universe in the caliber it's designated in. My G29 in-shop carry gun is totally stock except for the polishing job on the internals just for that reason.

On the "race guns" in 10MM, we've even opened the chamber a bit by lapping using a fired case as a mandrel & starting with 600 grit "Clover" brand valve lapping compound, opening the chamber by about .001" for reliability & finishing up with "Mothers Mag & Aluminum Polish" on another case to give the chamber a mirror finish.

Once "clearenced" in this manner, the race guns are as reliable as a stock Glock & tend to frustrate the 1911 crowd who think that a Glock is only good for production or ltd.10 class.
It really gets them going when a "race gun" goes "bang" every time....



uncle albert

[bobehud]

Used a diamond hone rod for sharpening knives(build those as a hobby)at the 12 0'clock.
Did not use Mothers but another silicone based polish and a felt bullet shaped polisher on my Dremel got the edge off and its slick as glass now.
All i can say for the gun now is WOW..!

[VN350X10]

Sounds good to go.

Another benefit to 10MM.........

Nobody picks up your brass by mistake.



uncle albert

[bobehud]

But finding it is a whole new adventure.

[VN350X10]

When I run short I buy 5000 at a time from Starline. Great prople & excellent quality brass.

uncle