21 power

[Ian]

Had a chance to shoot the 21 again, I don't often get a chance.
I love this gun. It is very smooth, and accurate.
One thing that I don't understand though, for every action there is a reaction, but for me, it doesn't recoil anymore than the 9 mm’s or 40’s, but it sure hits harder.
When shooting pins, a hit with a nine will always knock the pin over, but not always off the table. The 45 though lifts them clear of the table (up to the ceiling sometimes)

[Dandapani]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Momentum

[9mmMike]

It is a terrific illustration of a heavy bullet.

[ColoradoGlocker]

.

[Ian]

Thanks for the link, but it is way beyond me.:embarassed:
Can you explain it briefly in layman's terms?

[Mike of Oregon]

The heavy slide absorbs a lot of the recoil when it's thrown back instead of the shooter's body.
Mike

[epsylum]

I use my 21L for bowling pin matches. We do allow 9mms to shoot "minor" (pin set halfway back on table, instead of near the front). It has allowed our little matches to grow in popularity. It may be a slight advantage to those shooting 9mm, but nothing huge as the "major" guys beat the "minor" guys enough to not worry anyone.

I love the .45acp Glocks.

[blinddog]

Momentum is sort of like the old big rock little rock argument of ballistic energy.
A little rock can be thrown faster and tends to sting when it hits you, A big rock cannot be thrown as fast but it is heavier and larger so even though it is going slower it hurts more.
Just about any threory of stopping power uses either enrgy or momentum as the prime equasion.My personal theory is that both have a place depending on the caliber. Some smaller diameter bullets need to go fast to give a reasonable amount of stopping power, others with larger diameter bullets, and more wt. use momentum as the prime integral of stopping power.
I think a slow heavy bullet can have as much or more real stopping power than a small light bullet, no matter how fast it is going.
But either can hurt or kill, depending on placement.

[ColoradoGlocker]

.

[blinddog]

I knew somone was going to bring that up, I just did not want to get to abstract with the higher math:tongueout:

[Arc Angel]

:upeyes: Personally, I prefer the 45 auto. I've always thought that the surface area over which a bullet's energy is delivered has a lot more to do with the amount of shock and damage that is ultimately realized than just velocity or mass alone.

I mean no matter how fast a 5.56 round is jacked up to, no matter how much it may tumble and shed energy on deceleration, smacking someone with as a big, old, slow moving, 50 caliber miniball has got to do more significant damage - especially to appendages.

(Don't forget all those arms amd legs that were blown clean off during the Civil War.) :shocked:

As far as, 'perceived recoil' goes, well, the 45 acp reminds me of a slow heavy push - A push that is, still, quite manageable and easy to get used to. Other calibers like the 9mm and 40 S&W seem to feel like hard fast shoves to me - Lighter, for sure, than the 45 acp and (with experience) easier to manage.

When I pull the trigger on my G-21 I feel, 'power' and weight in my hands. When I pull the trigger on my 9mm I feel something that is faster, lighter, and easier to control.

(I don't know how else to say it.) ;)

[10mm4ever]

The .45 Super launched from a 6 inch pipe can never be a bad thing. Big AND fast always wins!
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f7/masterofg3/100_1236.jpg
http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f7/masterofg3/100_1235.jpg

[blinddog]

I got to agree with you guys while big is better, BIG and fast is better still.

I also have to say that i have a predjudice towards the 9MM while i have owned a couple I never thought they were much more effective than the old 38 spl round nose. Much of that I know comes from the Dept. I retired from, since their we weren't authorized to carry a 9 even off duty. And IMHO the 380 is even worse, I do have some fondness for the 40 though, I had a G27 that oi carried as much or more than I did my SP101 357 off duty and as a backup. 357 is an example of fast making up for big and heavy, the 125 GRN JHP at close to 1400 fps is rated at close to the 45 ACP 230 JHP at 950 FPS as a stopper.

[epsylum]

Originally posted by ColoradoGlocker
Be careful with your analogies about big and slow vs smaller and fast. Remember - MV². (Increases in velocity increase energy at the square while mass increases are just linear.) Best is big and fast!!

Actually it is 1/2 M*V^2 (the formula for kinetic energy). Momentum is just M*V. Two different things. Sort of like how horsepower and torque are related, but tell two different sides of the story.

Big and heavy is obviously the way to go as it increases both the KE and momentum. But as far as penetration goes, momentum and sectional density is key.