Legal advice, sort of. [Archive] - Glock Talk

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frank4570
06-03-2007, 15:51
A guy I know, said that if you are convicted of assault you will loose your carry permit.
Does anybody know if that is true?

Truckee
06-03-2007, 16:27
without knowing the circumstances... it's very possible.

frank4570
06-03-2007, 17:00
Originally posted by Truckee
without knowing the circumstances... it's very possible.

Well then, I'll give you more to work with.
Hypothetical,which didn't happen, but could have. I get into a verbal altercation with another business owner. He goes too far, and I punch him in the mouth.For the sake of argument, I am not carrying when I hit him.
Is my permit in jeopardy at this point?

pjva04
06-03-2007, 17:52
Originally posted by frank4570
Well then, I'll give you more to work with.
Hypothetical,which didn't happen, but could have. I get into a verbal altercation with another business owner. He goes too far, and I punch him in the mouth.For the sake of argument, I am not carrying when I hit him.
Is my permit in jeopardy at this point?

Goes too far physically? Or is he just talking smack?

MY OPINION... Say he is screaming obscenities at you on your business, I believe you may have the right to "escort" him off (still better to call the police), but hauling off and smacking him one could get you an assault charge and possibly jeopardize your CCP

vafish
06-03-2007, 18:10
I am not a lawyer,

But coming from the VA State Police web site for reasons you can be denied a CHP:

http://www.vsp.state.va.us/Firearms_ResidentConcealed.shtm

14. An individual who has been convicted of any assault, assault and battery, sexual battery, discharging of a firearm in violation of 18.2-280 or 18.2-286.1 or brandishing of a firearm in violation of 18.2-282 within the three-year period immediately preceding the application.

And a little further down the page under Revocations and suspensions:


Any person who has a felony charge pending or a charge pending for an offense that would be a disqualification for a permit who holds a concealed handgun permit may have such permit suspended by the court before which the charge is pending.

Any person convicted of an offense that would disqualify that person from obtaining a permit or who makes a false statement in an application shall forfeit his permit to the court, or shall be subject to suspension or revocation of the permit.

So yes if you get charged with simple assault you will most likely lose your permit, it will be permanent if you are convicted..

frank4570
06-03-2007, 19:11
Wow, I think you nailed it vafish. And to take it a step further, if a person lies and says I shoved them, that can be the end of my permit.
I really really disagree with the law here,but it is what it is.
Thanks.

alien-Glocker
06-04-2007, 14:30
I was interested in the legal definition/distinction for assault and battery in Virginia.

Virginia Code 18.2-57 codifies the offense of simple assault and battery as a class 1 misdemeanor; however, this code section relies upon what is called the common law to define the elements of the offense....The common law definition of an assault and battery is an intentional harmful or offensive contact.

An "assault is the apprehension of a harmful or offensive contact". Thus, even if you did not actually make contact with the individual, if you intended to make contact, you could be found guilty of assault. A battery is the actual harmful or offensive contact.

If the other person can "prove" that they had a fear of bodily harm from your actions, then you could be charged with assault.

Link: http://virginiacriminallawyers.vatrafficlaw.com/pages/assault-and-battery.html

Truckee
06-04-2007, 19:40
vafish and alien-Glocker have nailed it and have posted the info that I did not have time for during my original answer.

Find a sympathetic bench hearing a simple assault, you likely won't get into trouble with your CHP. The judge will have to determine if the "perception" of an assault actually occurred.

In the hypothetical you cite, you were being assaulted (providing you had reason to believe that your situation was unstable and open to escalation). Once you shove or punch him in the mouth, then you have committed the physical "battery" and your CHP is surely in jeopardy.

A word of advice, if I may... he who calls 911 first is the complainant... he who dials last is the suspect... and a judge, whom wasn't there, will sort it out in the end.