870P vs 870 express

[Stony]

Howdie all. I'm thinking of getting another shorty shotty.
Can anyone tell me the selling points between a Rem 870 Police and a 870 Express since there is about 100$ difference?
I really like the looks of the 870 that comes with pistol grips both on the front and rear.

[JimmyN]

Originally posted by Stony
Howdie all. I'm thinking of getting another shorty shotty.
Can anyone tell me the selling points between a Rem 870 Police and a 870 Express since there is about 100$ difference?
I really like the looks of the 870 that comes with pistol grips both on the front and rear.


Here is what Remington says about it


REMINGTON ARMS COMPANY, LE DIVISION
Important differences between Remington 870 Police and 870 Express shotguns
The 870 Express has been an important part of Remington’s offering to the sporting market.
It was designed to meet a price point in the commercial market while still providing classic 870 functionality.
All of Remington’s 870’s have interchangeable parts, even if they have cosmetic differences.
It is also important to note that many manufacturers use the 870 Express platform for their Police / Combat models.
Without exception, every manufacturer who utilizes our 870 platform serves to upgrade their system to a more efficient, street worthy platform.
While the 870 Express is still an 870, the best pump shotgun on the market, there are some very important cosmetic and functional differences between it and the 870 Police.
To our customers in Law Enforcement, Military, Corrections, and Security, whose lives depend upon the unfailing performance of Remington shotguns, the Police modifications are of paramount importance. Synopses of the variances are provided below.

• 870 Police shotguns go thru a special 23 station check list – ranging from visual inspection, functional testing, test firing, and final inspection.

• All Police shotguns are assembled in a “special build area” at the plant in Ilion, NY. This section is secured and serves only to build LE and Military shotguns, with the same factory personnel working at that assignment each shift.

• All parts that enter the “special build area” are visually inspected by hand to ensure top quality and functionality.

• Due to heavy recoil in buck and slug loads, all 870 Police guns have a longer magazine spring which ensures positive feed and function.

• A heavier sear spring is used to generate a reliable, positive trigger pull between 5 and 8 lbs.

• A heavier carrier dog spring is used to ensure when the carrier elevates the shell, it will be held there until the bolt can push it into the chamber. This ensures positive feeding when using heavier payload rounds.

• Police shotguns do not have an ISS (Integrated Safety System) which is a locking mechanism on the safety of commercial shotguns. This type of locking mechanism can cause delay to an officer who needs the weapon but does not have the appropriate key. LE shotguns have the standard, proven, cross bolt safety.

• The fore-end on the Express model is longer and not compatible with many police shotgun vehicle racks.

• The Police shotguns utilize the heavy duty SPEEDFEED Stocks and Fore-ends.

• The Express model will not allow for the addition of an extension tube without physical modification to the tube and barrel, which can nullify the warranty.

• The Express model has a BEAD BLAST BLUE finish while the Police models utilize either High Luster bluing or Parkerization.

• The Express model utilizes a synthetic trigger housing while the Police models use a compressed metal housing.

• The Police shotgun barrel is locked down with a “ball detent” system in conjunction with the magazine cap vs. a lesser grade “synthetic magazine spring retainer” lock down as used on the Express system.

• The receivers used in Police guns are “vibra honed” to smooth out rough finishes and remove burrs before parkerization or bluing.

• Police shotguns use machined ejectors and extractors, as opposed to powdered metal cast which are utilized on the Express models.

[Stony]

much obliged JimmyN- you just made my decision for me. Next pay I'll be going with a 870P!:thumbsup:

[stmcelroy]

Good choice.

I picked up a police trade-in Remington 11-87 Police last year for $400, and have absolutely fallen in love with this gun.

I whole heartedly recommend the Police series of Remington shotguns to everyone.

Steve

[Ian]

IMO The Police model is worth double the price.
Do not buy an express! POS

[Skintop911]

Originally posted by Ian
IMO The Police model is worth double the price.
Do not buy an express! POS

Indeed, the Police model is more desirable, but I'm not sure I'd label the Express a "POS." I'd reserve that for certain others.

[Raoul Duke]

Originally posted by Skintop911
Indeed, the Police model is more desirable, but I'm not sure I'd label the Express a "POS." I'd reserve that for certain others.

Exactly. I've owned several Express models over the years and not one has been a POS. They've all functioned exactly as intended and i have confidence that the one I currently own will go bang when I pull the trigger. Certainly the Police models are better made, but what exactly makes the Express a POS?

[Ian]

I had many problems with mine, and would try to convince any person to purchase the Police model instead

[ElevatedThreat]

Originally posted by stmcelroy
Good choice.

I picked up a police trade-in Remington 11-87 Police last year for $400, and have absolutely fallen in love with this gun.

I whole heartedly recommend the Police series of Remington shotguns to everyone.

Steve

Agreed.

Do not underestimate the value of the extra care and inspections, and the extra skill of the assemblers (reading between the lines, that is what they really mean), given to the police guns.

It is not so much that the police line is better than Remington quality from "the good old days" -- it is more that, like with a lot of places, the quality of the non-police guns at Remington seems to be going downhill more often today, perhaps along with the skill and care of some of the employees.

All too common in America today, and not just in guns.

Not only are some of the key parts in the police guns more desirable (machined vs. MIM), but the non-police production lines seem more inclined to have the occasional lemon.

-ET

[Z71bill]

How old is this list of differences?

My 870 express magnum is parkerized not blued -
Came with a factory mag extension (6 round mag)
Has the ball detent system not the plastic thing
My extractor & ejector look machined to me (not cast)

I called Remington to ask them if it was possible to upgrade my "plastic" trigger to a metal one - had not had any problems with the plastic one - just thought metal would be better. I specifically ask if the trigger group from the 870 police model would fit my 870 Express - I was told that all 870's use THE EXACT same trigger group now - and that all are plastic - and all have been plastic for "quite a while now".

Is this correct- or was the Remington tech mistaken? I wanted to buy one - so why wouldn't they want to sell me one?

Anyone buy a 870P with a plastic trigger group? If you have a metal one on your 870P - how long ago did you buy the gun?

I have a heavy duty Wolff magazine spring on order from Midway - $5.00 - and also plan to add a metal magazine follower -

[Norman]

From my knowledge, the 870P's had a metal trigger group and trigger guard. Not plastic.

[DT]

My 870P which I got about 6 months ago has an aluminum, not plastic trigger guard. It also has the heavier sear spring. It also has an 18 inch IC barrel. Most of the 870 express models I have seen come with plain cylinder bore barrel. I also think the parkerization is a lot better than the matte finish on the express. Finally it came with a speedfeed stock with limbsaver recoil pad and does not have the crazy dimples on the mag tube that you need to drill out on the express to use mag extensions.

If you want to upgrade I think you can by the barrel and trigger group from Brownells but they are not cheap.

[ElevatedThreat]

If the Remington Wingmaster now uses a PLASTIC trigger group, I would be VERY disappointed.

MIM is bad enough, let alone (ugh!) plastic....

-ET

[Raoul Duke]

Originally posted by ElevatedThreat
If the Remington Wingmaster now uses a PLASTIC trigger group, I would be VERY disappointed.

MIM is bad enough, let alone (ugh!) plastic....

-ET

Yeah. God forbid Glock would use plastic.
:upeyes:

[stmcelroy]

Originally posted by Raoul Duke
Yeah. God forbid Glock would use plastic.
:upeyes:

Yeah, but Glock does not use plastic on pins and points of contact.

Steve

[Stony]

+1
Also, Glocks were designed to use polymer. The Original 870's were designed around using metals. Until Cheapy McCheapskate got in there and decided to compromise gun design to save a few bucks. Oh, and don't forget to add the sales pitch "New 870! Even lighter to carry!":supergrin:

[Raoul Duke]

I guess I just don't see it as that big a deal. I hate the silly trigger lock on mine more than the plastic trigger group and even that didn't keep me from buying one. If it ever breaks, then maybe I'll agree with you guys.

[ElevatedThreat]

Originally posted by Raoul Duke
Yeah. God forbid Glock would use plastic.
:upeyes:

It's a question of intent, not function.

My GLOCK is like a bic lighter -- function is all, and polymer is very functional.

But a Remington WINGMASTER shotgun is supposed to have decades of American gun-making tradition behind it -- a masterpiece in figured, checkered walnut and high-polished blued steel.

They might use plastic in matte-and-synthetic HD or economy hunting shotguns, and I'm sure it's very functional, which is fine for THOSE guns.

But you don't buy a WINGMASTER (or pay the associated price :shocked:) because you expect to get a hardwood stock, or a plastic triggerguard!

-ET

[Stony]

Here's my bump in the night collection.http://www.geocities.com/decemstein/bitn.jpg
Remington 870 Police
Glock 19 w/ Glock Tac light
Streamlight Scorpion LED

[DaveA]

What about the 870 Tactical Magnum? Where does this one fall? It's not a police one or an Express. What's the quality on those are I was looking at getting one. I was looking at the second one down when you check this link. It's got the solid stock with the pistol grip.

http://www.remington.com/tactical/tactical_shotgun_specs.asp

[demusn79]

11-87 Police
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/th_IM000953.jpg (http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/IM000953.jpg)
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/th_IM000952.jpg (http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/IM000952.jpg)
Comes with plastic trigger guard.

[Norman]

Originally posted by demusn79
11-87 Police
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/th_IM000953.jpg (http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/IM000953.jpg)
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/th_IM000952.jpg (http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b317/demusn79/IM000952.jpg)
Comes with plastic trigger guard.

You're kidding me. Seriously? That's messed up. An 11-87 Police ought to come with an aluminum trigger guard just like the 870 Police. And it's plastic?


Hmph.

[GLOCK35TX]

Another 870~V~870P Thread


FOR THE LOVE OF GOD!! - Someone please shoot me to put me out of this misery !!!



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