Avoid Downtown after dark

[IPDBrad]

Unless you enjoy someone else firing into a crowd.

Indiana Black Expo Summer Celebration

July 20-22

[Patrick Graham]

I think I'll stay completely away from indy for the whole month of July.. and the month of August to give them a chance to clean the place up.. scrub the walls down.. and generally disinfect the whole area... :shocked:

[absrio]

I happen to be in downtown Indy last year during the black expo. Went to an Indians game then walked to Buffalo Wild Wings. My girlfriend will not let us go back down there when thats going on. Sidewalks completely crowded around steak n sheak and people were yelling at us for walking through there. How many gang shootings this year??

[Geeorge]

What about moving the Black Expo to Martinsville?:banana:

[KSFreeman]

Now, now, when's the last time they had any shootings at Black Expo? It's been years now. Knuckleheads everywhere.

BTW, I just winning Winning the Race by John McWhorter. He has an entire case study on Indianapolis and gives an excellent explanation for the violence at Black Expo.

[Snowman92D]

I figured out what the explanation is for the violence there a long time ago.

[FThorn]

Sounds like a perfect OPEN CARRY outing.

[slewfoot]

They could move the Black Expo to Philadelphia. The extra gun shots will be hardly noticed.

[IPDBrad]

Originally posted by KSFreeman
Now, now, when's the last time they had any shootings at Black Expo? It's been years now. Knuckleheads everywhere.


Do you mean when excluding the three shootings last year?

[FThorn]

another thing, too is they should just close some streets to auto traffic and make them pedestrian during this time.

[R. Emmelman]

Originally posted by slewfoot
They could move the Black Expo to R. Emmelman's neighborhood. The extra gun shots will be hardly noticed.

Fixed it for you :animlol:

[rhino465]

This will give us a chance to wear our chest rigs and learn whether we like our single point or two point slings better. :supergrin:

[slewfoot]

Originally posted by R. Emmelman
Fixed it for you :animlol:

Are you up for a local Juneteenth celebration in your neighborhood too. How is your ammo holding up? :animlol:

[R. Emmelman]

Originally posted by slewfoot
Are you up for a local Juneteenth celebration in your neighborhood too. How is your ammo holding up? :animlol:
Razor-wire and a street-sweeper....

[KSFreeman]

Three shootings LAST year?:shocked:

Sometimes I think I live in a bubble or something.

[IPDBrad]

Originally posted by KSFreeman
Three shootings LAST year?:shocked:

Sometimes I think I live in a bubble or something.

Yeah, it is surreal seeing muzzle flashes downtown.

[esrice]

I can remember seeing a huge crowd of kids running into Parisian when someone popped off a shot in the food court at Circle Center a few years back. That was when I was doing loss prevention. We would catch 5X the number of shoplifters during BE. Even had a guy freak out on PCP in the store. That was interesting. . .

I liked watching the fashion changes from year-to-year. One year EVERYONE was wearing some type of sports jersey. Then the next it was ALL BabyPhat.

[FThorn]

There was a guy that worked for my company that got shot as a shoplifter/thief ran from/through Parisian a few years ago.

[epsylum]

I avoid downtown as much as possible year 'round. ;)

[snuffy33]

:agree:

[boilergonzo]

I'm normally comfortable anywhere I go, from downtown Chicago to downtown Indy. However, based upon historical problems with shootings I will be avoiding downtown Indy this weekend.

[IndyGunFreak]

Originally posted by KSFreeman
Three shootings LAST year?:shocked:

Sometimes I think I live in a bubble or something.

I was kinda confused what you were talking about, the shootings lat year had a lot of press here. All the politicians and "community leaders", talking about very few problems, minor incidents, etc. I'm curious if 3 shootings during the State Fair, Indy500/Brickyard 400 related events, would be deemed "minor incidents"...

I remember working downtown during expo, it was a freakin disaster(around 7yrs ago)

IGF

[fire1035]

I remember taking MTO when I was still working at fire control and driving back to Speedway from Washington and State. I completely forgot that da expo was going on and here I am driving through downtown at 2300 hours on Friday night..... Awkward!

[KSFreeman]

I'll be out of town that weekend. Off to see sifu in Michigan.

Maybe I was out of the state last year too and missed all the chaos???

[toots shor]

i had to drive down there to pick up my sister. holy ****. it was a zoo.

[SHINGLE MONKEY]

I frequent the downtown area atleast once a week for dinner, at elmo, oceanaire, ruth chris or any of the other great restraunts that we have.

51 weeks out of the year,the other week is a joke and a disgrace to our city and the people that built it.


After 10pm on expo weekend is about as lawless as it gets, and because of the pussifications of the politicans it is allowed to happen.

If I was a betting man I would say that IPD...oops IMPD has a hands off policy on the blacks that weekend..unless murder is commited.

Hey atleast th black clergy that run this city will be happy with the low arrest rates for the weekend.

[IPDBrad]

Originally posted by SHINGLE MONKEY
I frequent the downtown area atleast once a week for dinner, at elmo, oceanaire, ruth chris or any of the other great restraunts that we have.

51 weeks out of the year,the other week is a joke and a disgrace to our city and the people that built it.


After 10pm on expo weekend is about as lawless as it gets, and because of the pussifications of the politicans it is allowed to happen.

If I was a betting man I would say that IPD...oops IMPD has a hands off policy on the blacks that weekend..unless murder is commited.

Hey atleast th black clergy that run this city will be happy with the low arrest rates for the weekend.

Kabam!

Welcome back, long time no hear. And with a winner of a post.

Thats what we call hitting the nail on the head.

[rhino465]

Soft body armor ... check
plate carrier ... check
plenty of loaded AR mags in pouches on the plate carrier ... check
carbine and sling ... check

staying at home anyway . . . check! :banana:

[KSFreeman]

When you guys say "lawlessness", what exactly goes on then?

Is it just young guys hanging out being young guys, or is it criminal behavior? If criminal behavior, what goes on then?

[fire1035]

Originally posted by SHINGLE MONKEY
I frequent the downtown area atleast once a week for dinner, at elmo, oceanaire, ruth chris or any of the other great restraunts that we have.

51 weeks out of the year,the other week is a joke and a disgrace to our city and the people that built it.


After 10pm on expo weekend is about as lawless as it gets, and because of the pussifications of the politicans it is allowed to happen.

If I was a betting man I would say that IPD...oops IMPD has a hands off policy on the blacks that weekend..unless murder is commited.

Hey atleast th black clergy that run this city will be happy with the low arrest rates for the weekend.

Where do you get the money to eat at any of the downtown restaurants? My tax bill prevents me from doing that. :steamed:

[R. Emmelman]

Originally posted by KSFreeman
When you guys say "lawlessness", what exactly goes on then?

Is it just young guys hanging out being young guys, or is it criminal behavior? If criminal behavior, what goes on then?
Scoping out business? :laughabove:

[Snowman92D]

Originally posted by IndyGunFreak
I'm curious if 3 shootings during the State Fair, Indy500/Brickyard 400 related events, would be deemed "minor incidents"...

Indeed. :noevil:

[epsylum]

Originally posted by fire1035
Where do you get the money to eat at any of the downtown restaurants? My tax bill prevents me from doing that. :steamed:

I could eat at those places, but I wouldn't be able to afford to eat for the rest of the week. ;)

BTW I hear Oceanaire absolutely great. I have heard mixed opinions on St. Elmo however.

[IPDBrad]

Originally posted by KSFreeman
When you guys say "lawlessness", what exactly goes on then?

Is it just young guys hanging out being young guys, or is it criminal behavior? If criminal behavior, what goes on then?

Underage drinking
public intox
public smoking of weed
fights
random jumpings
stolen vehicles
vehicle larcenies
carjackings
shootings

Those were the crimes I either witnessed or heard go out over the radio last year, downtown only

Mind you, that was during a 6 hour period.

The problem with Expo isn't the events, especially the daytime events. It is the 1000's of people, usually youths, loiteering about for hours after midnight on the city streets. Some drinking, some smoking a few committing criminal acts.

This doesn't even touch on the traffic issues and driving behavior that some drivers exhibit.

[boilergonzo]

That is a pretty exciting six hour shift... stay safe if it is that crazy again this year.

I feel for the police in this situation. We don't need Cincinnati-like race riots where people felt the police were discriminatory, overly brutal, and violence erupted, but it is also unreasonable to expect the police to turn a blind eye to very real crime they see being committed. The perception of a crowd of a police officer struggling with an uncooperative criminal can look physical (and I don't think anyone here would support the criminal for not obeying orders and resisting... some might approve of even more force!), but crowds and perception can be a funny thing...

What to do, what to do?

[R. Emmelman]

Cover me, I'm going in!

Wife has a rehearsal downtown tonight ;)

[Shooting Alpha's]

I love Greenwood right now.

[sjstill]

If your avatar is in G'wood, so do we :banana: :animlol:

Originally posted by originalshooter
I love Greenwood right now.

[Shooting Alpha's]

Originally posted by sjstill
If your avatar is in G'wood, so do we :banana: :animlol:

:supergrin:

[boby]

Did you get detailed to work the expo Brad? I hope not for your safety! I thought it was funny they actually had to have a meeting and decide whether CVPS should work the expo or not. I defiantly would not work it even if it was mandatory. Maybe if they gave me an AR-15 and full body armor... If you do get detailed, make sure your fogger is in order, I hear it comes in handy!

Its hilarious that they even let the lawlessness of black expo happen but they want to switch back to white paint because black is "intimidating". I think thousands of young thugs running around shooting each other is a hell of alot more intimidating then a black police car...

---- Hijack ----
As far as resteraunts, Oceanaire is AMAZING. Its defintly my favorite resteraunt. I do not care for St. Elmos. Both times I have went I received very poor service and my steaks were cooked wrong. Mo's steak house kicks St. Elmos butt.
http://www.mosaplaceforsteaks.com/ . Another good resteraunt is The Melting Pot in Castleton.
---- End hijack ----

[FThorn]

What is WHITE PAINT in that context, boby?

[boby]

Originally posted by FThorn
What is WHITE PAINT in that context, boby?

Well I have been told by many officers that the department will be returning to white police cars as opposed to the new black cars. They are to scary looking apparently. Tint is also not allowed on police cars as to not be intimidating.

Indianapolis reminds me of the Camelot scene from Monty python and the holy grail. "On second thought lets not goto Indianapolis, its a silly place!" (http://youtube.com/watch?v=D_6vYDCG0P8&mode=related&search=)

[paddling_man]

Wow! I just moved to Indy three months ago. Recently? 8 years in St. Louis, fifteen in Knoxville and Daytona Beach before that...

I'm a broadcast engineer and, due to the job, had to spend some time in a few pretty lawless places.

St Louis? Late night visits to East Saint Louis to deal with live show issues from a casino. Spooky place... The real life set of "Escape from New York." Barrels with burning trash with all manner of zombies around. Hookers, drug dealers, homeless/nutty, winos. Muzzle flashes were par for the course. All this in a place where (People Republik of Illinois) the gun laws were nearly as draconian as CA or the new england states. A CCW permit holder here who was forced, legally, to put the carry weapon into the car safe once I crossed old muddy.

Knoxville? In general, it was fine. Except... when I had to go the the transmitter site. Unlike all the other tv stations, our transmitter was outside of town by 20 miles - 6 miles up a fourwheel drive trail to the top of Windrock Mountain. This little peak was, as the crow flies, about 4-5 miles from Brushy Mountain Federal Penitentary. You know? Where they kept James Earl Ray and Hannibal Lecter was being transferred in Silence of the Lambs? On one of my first visits, I was stopped at the based of the mountain by a LEO. He asked where I was going. I told him and he asked if I had a gun. On that visit, no. "You don't want to be up there after dark unarmed, son." OK - point taken. Never again.

In addition to the CCW, I kept the Mossberg 20" in the back of the Jeep and loaded it at the base of the mtn. Cheap but effective. Weekly, there were new cars along the trail that were taken there to be stripped and then burned. Same thing with bass boats. I even saw the sleeper cab of a semi up there once... burning. There were numerous trails to make it to the top. Periodically, a random guy on an atv would be parked blocking a particular trailhead, AR resting in his arms. If you slowed down, indicating you were turning that way, he would just grimly shake his head "no."

Daytona? Drunken frat kids (I wouldn't want my daughter growing up there) and bike week. Bike Week, of all these things, was by far the safest. Treat people with respect and the same was returned. (As a later adult, I've been to a couple of Harley Rallys in Cherokee, NC. Very safe environment - at least as your average white guy.)

So, now I move (transfer) to indy. I'm told about all the "bad" places in town. I can't resist - know your environment. I don't want to stumble into the wrong area WITH THE WIFE AND KIDS after we sell the house and I get them moved here. East/West Washington and 10th. So far, it all seems pretty tame compared to East St. Louis. Not to get lulled into a false sense of security, but, except for the occasional hooker/drug dealer, it didn't seem like the burned out, third-world environment I'm used to being "bad." (Now Gary, on the other hand, seemed "bad!")

The best way to beat the odds and survive, in my view, is to avoid trouble to start with - the scale of risk is magnified when the wife and kids are in tow. I've eaten at a handful of mexican places on West Wash. Great food! Daylight hours, virtually no English spoken - my spanish is passable for at least an eatery.

So, during black expo, we are talking riot type conditions and open gunfire / weed smoking?? Geez, this I would have found unexpected - the Indy police seem to typically do a pretty good job of keeping everything under control. I've heard of similiar problems in Atlanta events like this but didn't expect it here.

Either way, sorry for the thread hijack - consider this my "Howdy - let me introduce myself" to the Hoosier crowd.

In the Glock realm, G30 here. Can you guys recommend any decent, local outdoor ranges for centerfire rifle?

[cougar_guy04]

Originally posted by boby
Well I have been told by many officers that the department will be returning to white police cars as opposed to the new black cars. They are to scary looking apparently. Tint is also not allowed on police cars as to not be intimidating.
Is this the same reason ISP is going from the Boilermaker colors to Indiana State colors?

Heck, I like the black cars . . . pretty mean looking and the black/gold ISP cars are some of the best looking ones I've ever seen.

[boby]

Originally posted by cougar_guy04
Is this the same reason ISP is going from the Boilermaker colors to Indiana State colors?

Heck, I like the black cars . . . pretty mean looking and the black/gold ISP cars are some of the best looking ones I've ever seen.

Im not sure. Again what I have heard could just be rumors.

I think the new IMPD cars look awesome. If you think they are scary then your probably a criminal...

[boilergonzo]

Welcome to Indy. I've been to E. St. Louis and Gary. Indy is a lot nicer, but that is not to say we don't have our problems. This particular problem is not the convention, but the folks that roll in to hang out after hours. As hinted at above, one doesn't want to provoke racial tension, and things just seemed to escalate last year into something beyond the norm. That is why this one weekend was noted as a time to keep the kids away from downtown. If law and order prevails this year and next, we may be back to normal, but last year was so extreme for Indy it was memorable (for all the wrong reasons).

Overall, it's a safe place to be. Avoid the near east side (Rural Street area) and a few others, and you will be about as safe as decent sized cities get. Your previous experiences will have you well-prepared for the worst Indy has...

[paddling_man]

Thanks, Boiler.

I was wondering if there was something I was overlooking and should be care of in the future. We'll probably end up in Carmel/Fishers/Westfield, like all of the other transplants. My wife is aware there there are certain areas of town to avoid, wherever we've lived, and this will be no exception.

Anyone with range rec ommendations?

Thanks!

[Gump]

paddling_man,
Up in that area you'll be real close to Atlanta Conservation Club.
http://www.atlantacc.net/

[bradp]

It almost reminds me of Freaknik in Atlanta when I worked it back in the 90's. Stop the cruising and hanging out after hours and they WILL leave.

[Scutter01]

Originally posted by paddling_man

I was wondering if there was something I was overlooking and should be care of in the future. We'll probably end up in Carmel/Fishers/Westfield, like all of the other transplants. My wife is aware there there are certain areas of town to avoid, wherever we've lived, and this will be no exception.

Anyone with range rec ommendations?

Thanks!

I posted this in another thread:

There are only two indoor ranges (that I know of) that are worth a darn in the greater Indianapolis area. One is Popguns on the east side at 10th and Post and the other is Bullseye in Kokomo. Don's Guns also has a range on 38th street west of downtown, but I refuse to spend a dime there for a number of reasons.

Bullseye is my indoor range of choice, but it's a bit of a hike to get up there. Popgun is a nice range, but it's usually very crowded. Even with a membership, there's often a wait for a lane.

You can also try the Atlanta Conservation Club, which is members-only. It's an outdoor range, but it's possible they are open year-'round. Also, there's the Eagle Creek (http://www.ecpr.4t.com/) range on the west side. It's another good outdoor range.

[KSFreeman]

paddling, welcome.:)

[boilergonzo]

Fall Creek Valley Conservation Club has an outdoor range, and is about twenty minutes east of the Fishers/Geist area (just south of Anderson).

http://www.fcvcc.org/maininfo.htm

If you are just moving in, realtors tend to steer people to the Fishers/Geist/Carmel area. It is nice, but spend some time in the traffic in the morning and evening rush, and make sure you are comfortable there. The area is growing, and is getting a bit difficult.

The west (Avon/Plainfield), south (Greenwood), and far east (Greenfield) have easier commutes and lower property costs. However, all our friends in Geist and Carmel laugh at me living in Greentucky (Greenfield)! Until they see my property taxes... then they cry!

Welcome, and post questions if you have them. Don't buy Emmelman's house (unless you reload, and want to reuse the lead bullets from the walls...)! Sorry, couldn't resist!

[fire1035]

Speedway is nice and we have lots of houses available in town right now.

p.s. Pop Guns is at Washington and Post not 10th and Post.

[paddling_man]

Thanks, guys.

I work at Intech Park - 71st and 465. We've got a 3 and 6 year old so both good (and safe!) schools are the primary consideration above virtually all else. Both kids have slightly "special needs:" one is a six year old reading at the sixth grade level - the other is the three year old whom doctors believe is on the outer/mild range of autistic. It makes finding the right school system pretty nerve racking for Dad. ;)

Due to the corner of town for employ, far east is probably out. 'Til we sell our house in St Louis, the wife and kids will stay there and I'm temp living in my motorhome in the Southport area. Greenwood wouldn't be out of the question but it did have an "other side of town" feel when driving. Fishers and Westfield seemed ok but I've heard stories about the traffic. (I didn't like, and couldn't afford anyway, the Carmel area.)

Brownsburg seemed like a possibility. Also, Lebanon - not sure about the smalltown politics there.

Due west of Eagle Creek would be great if I could find the right school system. We're probably lower-middle to middle-middle class - especially since my wife is a "stay at home" while the kids are young so I'm the only income. Due to $$$ I can't consider private school and living wherever we want.

I appreciate the welcome and may try and solicit more local advice from you guys.

[boilergonzo]

Yep. I wouldn't drive from the east side or Carmel daily. No way. I used to work for a company in Park 100. From that side you have lots of options ranging from Brownsburg to Zionsville with an easy commute. I'll leave it to the west and northwest siders to guide you. Welcome, and good luck with the schools. The general view seems to be the suburb schools are all fairly decent, the IMS (Indy) schools vary depending upon the area.

[SHINGLE MONKEY]

We live in the area of Kessler and Michigan Rd (south west of this intersection) behind broadmore country club, check out that area. houses range from 100's and up and Crooked Creek elm school is one of the better schools around.

If you need a tour of the area send me a PM.

My wife works in the park 100 area its less than 10 mins to work.

[bradp]

We live in SW Boone County and kids go to Western Boone Schools. Much better than when they went to Lebanon schools. My wife works at Michigan Rd and 465. It takes her about 30 minutes to get to work from Jamestown. Boone County also has a Great Sheriff (Ken Campbell)

[bill123]

The range at Atterburry is open. South on I65