How to get an Airborne Slot? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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chR|5
07-23-2007, 18:43
I want my wings, do I have to re-up, or is there an "easier" way to obtain a slot?

Currahee
07-24-2007, 06:17
I worked as a BN schools NCO for a year in a light infantry BN.

Airborne is a difficult school to get without getting it in your re-enlistment contract. The Army uses it as a recruiting and rewards tool so there aren't many slots handed out to non-Airborne units.

Are you are good terms with your 1SG? If so, talk to him about it (go through your chain of command of course). He can find out if there are slots available and push for you to get one if available. Don't talk directly to the Schools NCO or your 1SG. If you are on bad terms with your 1SG then just forget about it because he will have to push to get you a slot.

Feel free to PM me if you want further advice.

fourdeuce2
07-29-2007, 14:25
Getting the SCHOOL used to be easy. Getting assigned to an airborne unit used to be a bit tougher. I had no problem when I put in for Airborne School. I typed up my 4187 and gave it to the battalion commander(I was working in the S-1 shop at the time ;) ). He asked me if I wanted to get out of his unit that bad.:animlol: I told him I had been thinking of going Airborne for years, which was true. He signed the paperwork, and a few months later, I went to the school.
I had assignment instructions to go to an Airborne unit after completing Airborne School, but when I got to Germany(where they sent me), they said they didn't have any Airborne units there. They said they could either send me to an Airborne unit in Italy or keep me in Germany. I decided to stay in Germany.:wavey:

xxiv
07-31-2007, 08:48
Originally posted by chR|5
I want my wings, do I have to re-up, or is there an "easier" way to obtain a slot?

Do you want to be a paratrooper or just wear the wings of one?

chR|5
08-01-2007, 11:38
Now after thinking over it, I want to get stationed at Fort Bragg. I am at my first duty station, is there a minimum amount of time I have to be here? I would like to actually re-up with Ft. Bragg in my contract.

fourdeuce2
08-01-2007, 12:57
Originally posted by xxiv
Do you want to be a paratrooper or just wear the wings of one?

When I went throught Airborne School, the black hats let us know that once you pinned on those wings you became a paratrooper. You're not just a leg wearing the wings.;) That description is for people who go to the PX and buy jump wings.:)

To chR5, once you're eligible for re-enlistment you can re-enlist for that unit-of-choice option, but you don't have to wait that long for the school. Requesting the school only takes a 4187, but that won't guarantee you a slot at Bragg.
There used to be an informal(unspoken) rule that you had to be at a unit for a certain amount of time before you could request reassignment, but it wasn't written in stone. I was at Fort Carson for 3 months(back in 1984) when I put in my 4187 requesting Airborne School. Of course, I had an inside track since I was working in the S-1 section at the time(that was the reason I wanted to get reassigned,- I wasn't a Clerk/Typist by MOS).

Currahee
08-01-2007, 16:35
Originally posted by chR|5
Now after thinking over it, I want to get stationed at Fort Bragg. I am at my first duty station, is there a minimum amount of time I have to be here? I would like to actually re-up with Ft. Bragg in my contract.

Typically you will spend 3 years at an assignment (there are exceptions such as Korea). What duty station are you at? How many years do you have left on your contract? This will all make a big difference in how to go about getting airborne school and to Ft. Bragg. If you have senior NCOs in your chain of command who are old 82nd Airborne guys, they will typically try to help young soldiers who want to go there (at least that was the way they were in my unit). Ask one of them, that's better than the internet. As long as you are respectful, they should be happy to help out a soldier who wants to re-enlist and go to Bragg.

xxiv
08-02-2007, 14:20
Originally posted by fourdeuce2
When I went throught Airborne School, the black hats let us know that once you pinned on those wings you became a paratrooper. You're not just a leg wearing the wings.;) That description is for people who go to the PX and buy jump wings.:)


If you wear wings and never served in an airborne unit then you're airborne qualified, which does not a paratrooper make. Just like if you complete ranger school and tab out, you're ranger qualified, not a ranger unless having served in the 75th.

Disclaimer: being airborne qualified and not a paratrooper is in no way shape or form an insult, but no they are not the same thing.

Of course the black hats tell everyone they're paratroopers now. They also took the black beret from the 75th and gave it to every leg walking to raise moral and "unify" the army.

My suggestion to the OP is if he wants his wings and wants them to really count, he reup for an airborne unit and put that P identifier on the end of his MOS.

xxiv
08-02-2007, 14:24
Originally posted by chR|5
Now after thinking over it, I want to get stationed at Fort Bragg. I am at my first duty station, is there a minimum amount of time I have to be here? I would like to actually re-up with Ft. Bragg in my contract.

I really enjoyed my time at Bragg. What's your MOS?

fourdeuce2
08-02-2007, 18:00
Originally posted by xxiv
If you wear wings and never served in an airborne unit then you're airborne qualified, which does not a paratrooper make. Just like if you complete ranger school and tab out, you're ranger qualified, not a ranger unless having served in the 75th.

Disclaimer: being airborne qualified and not a paratrooper is in no way shape or form an insult, but no they are not the same thing.

Of course the black hats tell everyone they're paratroopers now. They also took the black beret from the 75th and gave it to every leg walking to raise moral and "unify" the army.

My suggestion to the OP is if he wants his wings and wants them to really count, he reup for an airborne unit and put that P identifier on the end of his MOS.

Actually, I had a black beret they gave me back around 1988(in a cav unit) which I never wore because I thought it was a bad idea back then. I got out of the Army before they issued the black berets to everybody and I was glad I did.

BTW, I was "paratrooper" enough to be invited to be an instructor at Airborne School while I was stationed at Fort Benning, but I declined the offer. It didn't look like a job I could take for too long. The classes had to be given verbatim, with every gesture and word by the book. Not my idea of a job I'd enjoy. I stuck with Infantry Officer Basic Course. At least there we had some fun, shaping future platoon leaders.:thumbsup:

chR|5
08-03-2007, 16:38
Three years?! Holy crap:sad:. I'm currently at Ft. Irwin.
I have like 1 year and ~4 months left on my contract. I had a 2 year contract. My MOS is 11C. I don't think any of my NCOs came from the 82nd, actually, I can't think of one with his wings.:upeyes: Going there seems like a good move to me, closer to home, getting my jump wings, being at a unit that I know will deploy, which I would hope means alittle more comradery then what I'm used to here.:sad:

xxiv
08-03-2007, 17:51
Originally posted by chR|5
Three years?! Holy crap:sad:. I'm currently at Ft. Irwin.
I have like 1 year and ~4 months left on my contract. I had a 2 year contract. My MOS is 11C. I don't think any of my NCOs came from the 82nd, actually, I can't think of one with his wings.:upeyes: Going there seems like a good move to me, closer to home, getting my jump wings, being at a unit that I know will deploy, which I would hope means alittle more comradery then what I'm used to here.:sad:

You'll get your fill of deployments at the 82nd, but as the saying goes, be careful what you wish for. I've had some incredibly awesome times though such as training West Point cadets in NY and cross training with the British Parachute Regiment where we got to go to England for 3 weeks to drink, train, and jump for our Brit wings. Experiences and friends I miss daily.

Also as an 11 series with the AA count on plenty of field time.

You will definetly make life long friends though, who would lie in traffic for you when the time comes.

Jammer Six
08-03-2007, 17:51
When yer forty, three years will be a short time.

When yer fifty, it will be a very short time.

Currahee
08-04-2007, 07:13
Originally posted by chR|5
Three years?! Holy crap:sad:. I'm currently at Ft. Irwin.
I have like 1 year and ~4 months left on my contract. I had a 2 year contract. My MOS is 11C. I don't think any of my NCOs came from the 82nd, actually, I can't think of one with his wings.:upeyes: Going there seems like a good move to me, closer to home, getting my jump wings, being at a unit that I know will deploy, which I would hope means alittle more comradery then what I'm used to here.:sad:

When you have 1 year left, you can go talk to the re-enlistment NCO. Yes, there will be better comraderie at a deployable unit - and a greater proportion of NCOs who have seen combat and know how to take care of their soldiers. To me, what is the point of being infantry if you don't see combat?

So just tell your re-enlistment NCO that you want an airborne assignment - either 82nd Airborne or 173rd Airborne. And sign up for the minimum number of years available (shouldn't be more than 3).

Lastly, even though you have a "2" year contract, if you don't re-enlist you will be in either the National Guard or Reserves and go to Iraq anyway.

Good luck.

Jammer - 1/9 IN was our sister BN in Iraq. "Keep Up the Fire!" , right?

Bravo-Four
08-05-2007, 13:46
I got my wings by failing pathfinder (2nd phase) and literally walking over to airborne school as a walk on :sad:

xxiv
08-05-2007, 14:18
Originally posted by Bravo-Four
I got my wings by failing pathfinder (2nd phase) and literally walking over to airborne school as a walk on :sad:

I was under the impression you had to be airborne qualified for a slot at badgefinder school :D

Probably just a lie the schools NCO liked to tell to get out of paperwork.

fourdeuce2
08-05-2007, 21:07
Like I said in my ealier post, there are all kinds of lies told in lots of places. ;)

Many people get told that you can't request reassignment until you've been at your current assignment a certain amount of time, and when I was working in the S-1 shop as a clerk-typist, my boss told me to tell people that too, even though it wasn't true. He just didn't want us wasting our time typing up paperwork for people who didn't like the unit even though they had just arrived there. :hugs:
Some of those lies get repeated so often that people start believing they're true. My boss in that S-1 shop was very squared away. He knew the regulations VERY well, and even though I didn't like working as a clerk/typist(my MOS was 11C), I did admire his knowledge of his job.:thumbsup:
I was working as the battalion finance clerk and we had a lieutenant who was getting overpaid(yeah, imagine that:rofl: ). The lieutenant tried to correct the problem every month, but the people at the Finance office couldn't see his point and didn't agree that he was getting overpaid, so they kept overpaying him every month.:supergrin: After a long time of doing this every month, we took him up to the Finance office again, but my boss brought the regulation book with us to show them where they were wrong.:laughabove: They finally got the message, and told the lieutenant he'd have to pay back all the money, but my boss had a surprise for them. He showed them another part of the regulations that said the lieutenant didn't have to pay the money back.:tongueout: Sure pays to know the rules.;)

Bren
08-06-2007, 05:34
Originally posted by fourdeuce2
When I went throught Airborne School, the black hats let us know that once you pinned on those wings you became a paratrooper. You're not just a leg wearing the wings.;) That description is for people who go to the PX and buy jump wings.:)

Most paratroopers who have served in airborne units do not share the black hats' opinion - I suspect the blackhats don't either, but they have to motivate the troops.

As for going to jump school, I waited until I was near the end of my tour in Europe and told my chief I'd like to go to jump school when I went back to the states and we did the paperwork and I went. On the other hand, I am currently in the Army reserve and this weekend my CSM asked one of our sergeants if he wanted to go to jump school because we had a slot nobody was taking, so they can't be that rare.

fourdeuce2
08-06-2007, 09:22
No, slots in Airborne School aren't too rare(at least they weren't during the 2 years I spent at Benning ;) ). They have some BIG classes going through there, and they're good at getting them through in a week(or less). I did Jump Week during Thanksgiving week, so we did our 5 jumps in 3 days. It was hectic, but we got it done. There are a lot more slots at the school than there are slots in airborne units.

As for whether I'm a paratrooper or not, well I guess everybody can have their own opinion on that. ;) I'll keep my wings, though, since I earned them. I understand the snobbery thing. I ran into that in the Army. Most of the combat arms looks down their noses at the REMF MOS's, and the active duty guys look down their noses at the guard and reserve guys. Of course, the "REMF" MOS's look down their noses at the combat arms guys, too. ;)
I spent most of my time in the Infantry, but did 3 years in a Signal battalion, so I got a little taste of the non-combat-arms life.
When I worked at the Infantry Officer Basic Course I was pleasantly surprised to see that one of the hardest charging lieutenants that I helped train there was a National Guard lieutenant, and one of the biggest duds that I saw in 2 years there was a graduate of VMI(he was voted,by his own platoon-mates,as the "Lieutenant Most Likely to Get Fragged in Peacetime", and he was active duty.:upeyes: I was also "fortunate" enough to enjoy the experience of working with a class of West Point graduates.

xxiv
08-06-2007, 11:24
Originally posted by fourdeuce2
No, slots in Airborne School aren't too rare(at least they weren't during the 2 years I spent at Benning ;) ). They have some BIG classes going through there, and they're good at getting them through in a week(or less). I did Jump Week during Thanksgiving week, so we did our 5 jumps in 3 days. It was hectic, but we got it done. There are a lot more slots at the school than there are slots in airborne units.

As for whether I'm a paratrooper or not, well I guess everybody can have their own opinion on that. ;) I'll keep my wings, though, since I earned them. I understand the snobbery thing. I ran into that in the Army. Most of the combat arms looks down their noses at the REMF MOS's, and the active duty guys look down their noses at the guard and reserve guys. Of course, the "REMF" MOS's look down their noses at the combat arms guys, too. ;)
I spent most of my time in the Infantry, but did 3 years in a Signal battalion, so I got a little taste of the non-combat-arms life.
When I worked at the Infantry Officer Basic Course I was pleasantly surprised to see that one of the hardest charging lieutenants that I helped train there was a National Guard lieutenant, and one of the biggest duds that I saw in 2 years there was a graduate of VMI(he was voted,by his own platoon-mates,as the "Lieutenant Most Likely to Get Fragged in Peacetime", and he was active duty.:upeyes: I was also "fortunate" enough to enjoy the experience of working with a class of West Point graduates.

There were always slots to be filled in my platoon/company, on the infantry side of the house. I don't know where you're getting your sitrep from but I've never heard of anybody getting turned away from the 82nd because it's full.

Listen man, nobody is insulting you when they're saying you're not a paratrooper. You seem to be very defensive. Be proud of the fact that you got to go to school for your wings.

Being a paratrooper is a way of life, that you have to be in unit to experience...jumping in ABN school is almost nothing like jumping in an ABN unit. If we talked about it would you have much of an idea about what I mean or would all your stories refer to a 3 week course? How many jumps do you have outside of airborne school? Did you wear the maroon beret? I'm trying to say this without "snobbery" as you put it.

Oh and edit, the REMF's can look down on 11B's all they want, because they're still REMF's.

fourdeuce2
08-06-2007, 12:23
"There were always slots to be filled in my platoon/company, on the infantry side of the house. I don't know where you're getting your sitrep from but I've never heard of anybody getting turned away from the 82nd because it's full."

I never said the 82nd was full. I said they send a LOT more people to Airborne School than they have airborne slots for. ;)

Currahee
08-06-2007, 12:23
Oh and edit, the REMF's can look down on 11B's all they want, because they're still REMF's.

Yup. That's kind of like the football team's waterboy looking down on a starting player.

xxiv
08-06-2007, 12:33
Originally posted by fourdeuce2
"There were always slots to be filled in my platoon/company, on the infantry side of the house. I don't know where you're getting your sitrep from but I've never heard of anybody getting turned away from the 82nd because it's full."

I never said the 82nd was full. I said they send a LOT more people to Airborne School than they have airborne slots for. ;)

Ah, I stand corrected, sorry.

xxiv
08-06-2007, 12:36
Originally posted by Currahee
Yup. That's kind of like the football team's waterboy looking down on a starting player.

lol I like that, mind if I use it in the future?

Currahee
08-06-2007, 12:51
Please be my guest

(As you can see from my earlier posts, I was a pogue myself at one point - at S3. Lucky for me I was able to escape when we deployed. )

xxiv
08-06-2007, 19:32
Originally posted by Currahee
Please be my guest

(As you can see from my earlier posts, I was a pogue myself at one point - at S3. Lucky for me I was able to escape when we deployed. )

A little time spent in the shops is forgivable as long as you fought to get out. I almost got nabbed to be the BC's RTO but during the interview purposely came off as the biggest ****bag I could...I mean I was kicking my boots into the curb to scuff them up that's how badly I wanted to avoid it.

fourdeuce2
08-06-2007, 20:42
Originally posted by Currahee
Yup. That's kind of like the football team's waterboy looking down on a starting player.

Yep, but still they do it. For the one tour I spent in the Signal Battalion I listened to the REMF's talking about how stupid people in the combat arms MOS's were. My usual response for them was to let them know my first MOS was 11C and then to compare GT scores with them. Mine was 155.
While I was in that Signal battalion I took one college class. One of my fellow photographers talked me into taking the course because they needed enough bodies to give the class. The funny thing was she didn't think I could pass the class because I had 3 strikes against me. I had dropped out of high school. I had not completed the prerequisites for this course(Psych 441, senior level psychology), and I had been in the Infantry.
At the end of the class I got the only A.:rofl:

KNEESINTHEBREEZ
08-06-2007, 21:17
Originally posted by xxiv
If you wear wings and never served in an airborne unit then you're airborne qualified, which does not a paratrooper make. Just like if you complete ranger school and tab out, you're ranger qualified, not a ranger unless having served in the 75th.

Disclaimer: being airborne qualified and not a paratrooper is in no way shape or form an insult, but no they are not the same thing.

Of course the black hats tell everyone they're paratroopers now. They also took the black beret from the 75th and gave it to every leg walking to raise moral and "unify" the army.

My suggestion to the OP is if he wants his wings and wants them to really count, he reup for an airborne unit and put that P identifier on the end of his MOS.
Bingo! Hey xxiv, are you over at ArmyParatrooper.org by chance?

xxiv
08-06-2007, 23:14
Originally posted by KNEESINTHEBREEZ
Bingo! Hey xxiv, are you over at ArmyParatrooper.org by chance?

Yeppas. That you Cal?

xxiv
08-06-2007, 23:22
Originally posted by fourdeuce2
Yep, but still they do it. For the one tour I spent in the Signal Battalion I listened to the REMF's talking about how stupid people in the combat arms MOS's were. My usual response for them was to let them know my first MOS was 11C and then to compare GT scores with them. Mine was 155.
While I was in that Signal battalion I took one college class. One of my fellow photographers talked me into taking the course because they needed enough bodies to give the class. The funny thing was she didn't think I could pass the class because I had 3 strikes against me. I had dropped out of high school. I had not completed the prerequisites for this course(Psych 441, senior level psychology), and I had been in the Infantry.
At the end of the class I got the only A.:rofl:

155 GT, you are a smarter man than I. I know plenty of smart cats in combat arms. Technically and tactically proficient involves a lot of learning. Good on ya for putting the craphats in their places as an 11 series. :thumbsup:

Currahee
08-07-2007, 06:25
xxiv - When I was at Camp Warrior, waiting for my assignment to a BN in 2ID Korea, the 1st BDE OPS SGM pulled me and a few other college grads out of formation to go to the BDE S3 shop. I told him I had a prior history of drug use and therefore couldn't get a security clearance. He got right in my face and told me that if I was lying he would find out and rip my balls off. I told him "I swear it's the truth Sergeant Major!" Of course it wasn't , I just didn't want to go to staff. Of course my typing ability finally caught up with me anyways :( It all ended up OK though.

What's funny about me getting stuck in the S-3 shop: my Dad had enlisted in 1974 with his college degree. He went to BN S-3. He finally got out when the BDE CDR was inspecting and asked my Dad "Troop, how's morale?". My Dad blurted out, "Sir please get me out of here, I want to be in the line." And the BDE CDR told his CO to have him transferred that day. When we were in the S3 shop and we would interview soldiers to come up, of course all the 1SGs would send us their trash. If a soldier said "I want to be in the S3 shop" we would send them back to their company. If a soldier said "I don't want to be in the S3 shop, I want to be a real soldier in the line" we considered keeping them. No real infantry soldier wants to work staff. I don't blame the guys on permanent profile though, after Iraq virtually our whole S3 shop consisted of WIAs.

Anyways, my Dad warned me that since I had a college degree the same thing would happen to me when I enlisted. And it did. I had an awesome Ops SGT and Ops SGM and told them both I wanted out when we got to Iraq and they hooked me up - even sent me back to my old company.

xxiv
08-07-2007, 09:20
Currahee lol man yeah I know exactly what you mean. One of our new guys once upon a time was a prior service zoomie on his way to being a fighter pilot, college degree, smart as a whip, the works. I don't remember what but he got booted for misconduct of some kind. Within a month of showing up he was ripped from the line and made Smaj's personal driver. I LOL'd my balls off poking fun at the fact that he went from almost flying around F16's to driving some tired old staff HMMV. He was a good kid though and since I was his first team leader I got to hear all the juicy brass talk. Staff guys may get poked fun at, but the 11 series staff are always welcomed back and appreciated for the information they leak down to companies.

That's so true also about keeping the guys that said they didn't want the job. I told you in an above post I did everything I could, including lying about my APFT, GT, the works. I walked in looking like I had no idea what I was doing. Ops SMAJ Dotten, I remember that mans piercing glare as he paid extra special attention to interviewing me (we were all in the same room) with questions about the ASIP etc. He knew I was lying but let me off the hook anyway.

BC RTO would have been death. Platoon RTO was bad enough.


After telling me to get a haircut.

Currahee
08-07-2007, 09:46
That's pretty funny. I had order to Bragg in hand when we got our deployment orders from Korea to Iraq (I was in 2 BCT 2 ID). I decided to stick with my BN instead of going to Bragg and then deploying as a cherry E5 with a team of guys I didn't know that well, even though I really wanted to be part of the 82nd AB. The whole reason I enlisted was to be 82nd. I got a Airborne Infantry contract, AND ... not knowing the way the Army works I thought "why would they spend all this money on sending me to jump school and not send me to an airborne unit". Well I ended up in Korea :rofl:

The whole thing ended up really well in the end. If I had spent my tour in Iraq in staff I would have probably died from the sense of guilt. Our OPS SGM was an old 82nd vet, was with them during Desert Storm. Best g---d----d senior NCO to be in combat with. SGM Pocaro was his name. He probably slept 4 hours a night (if that) the whole tour. Always out there with the troops, no matter the hour or conditions. It could be 3am on a cold rainy night and he would show up on your OP and just pull guard with you for hours. Or he'd pull a soldier off a patrol and take their place so they could have a day off. Great soldier, great reflection on the 82nd patch he wore.

Bren
08-07-2007, 17:25
Originally posted by fourdeuce2
As for whether I'm a paratrooper or not, well I guess everybody can have their own opinion on that. ;) I'll keep my wings, though, since I earned them. I understand the snobbery thing.
I'm not saying the snobbery is worth anything - my unit in the 82d (1980's) were a bunch of dope smoking thugs who weren't even close to the mental or physical training standards of my previous leg unit in Germany, but they thought they were pretty hot &^%$% because they were paratroopers and most of them had come straight there from basic and didn't know any beter - they just believed their own hype.

KNEESINTHEBREEZ
08-07-2007, 21:38
Originally posted by xxiv
Yeppas. That you Cal?
Maybe...;)

My cover is blown. :supergrin:

Meat-Hook
08-13-2007, 00:04
"I want my wings, do I have to re-up, or is there an "easier" way to obtain a slot?"
*********************
Army Regulations:

AR 614-200??????

Covers the requirements for Airborne/Ranger/Special Forces????

or mabe not? You do the homework?.."Airborne".;)

xxiv
08-14-2007, 17:12
Originally posted by Bren
I'm not saying the snobbery is worth anything - my unit in the 82d (1980's) were a bunch of dope smoking thugs who weren't even close to the mental or physical training standards of my previous leg unit in Germany, but they thought they were pretty hot &^%$% because they were paratroopers and most of them had come straight there from basic and didn't know any beter - they just believed their own hype.

Which unit was this?

xxiv
08-19-2007, 23:31
Still waiting Bren.

16vmkII
08-20-2007, 10:09
Originally posted by xxiv
Still waiting Bren.

let the vetting process begin. :thumbsup:


<--- Just a leg

Bren
08-23-2007, 18:41
Originally posted by xxiv
Still waiting Bren.
First time I've checked back - 1/319 FA.

Currahee
08-23-2007, 19:04
Field Artillery ... say no more :upeyes:





;)

16vmkII
08-24-2007, 11:33
Originally posted by Currahee
Field Artillery ... say no more :upeyes:





;)

Field Artillery is cool..boom!

xxiv
08-26-2007, 00:05
Originally posted by Currahee
Field Artillery ... say no more :upeyes:





;)

:laughabove:

One of the FO's we had attached was a guy I really liked, other than that my side of the house never really got along with FA.