Why .45 need some help from folks with the knowledge

[PD7575]

Hear is the deal my dept issues S&W 9mm The unit I work for wants to go to the Glock 21 but I need to know real answers why the glock is better then S&W and why the .45 round is better then the 9mm. Our main concern is that we work in all types of weather on a bike and also most of our work is done in close proximity with criminals. Any help or web sites would be appreciated. Thank you

[SVTNate]

I'm far from an expert, but since no one else has helped you out yet try a search. Try searching for words like "expansion" or "ballistics" in this forum and Caliber Corner. Try looking around www.FirearmsTactical.com for info.

One popular notion is summed up in this neat little saying (I may be butchering it a lil' bit) -

"9mm hollowpoints may or may not reliably expand, but .45ACP is not very likely to shrink"

Basically, you count on 9mm to expand to be an effective round. .45ACP makes a similar size hole before any expansion whatsoever, creating a larger wound cavity. Working in close quarters, you would definitely want a criminal to drop and drop fast, and the larger wound cavity is going to create more blood loss, sending the bad guy into shock and stopping him from attacking you or a civilian (me, hehe!).

This is just what I have picked up. I'm learning as I go along. I'm sure I messed at least some of that up, but I figured I'd try and get you started since no one else has replied.

9mm, S&W...talk about ineffective! :) Glock 21 is a reliable gun in a reliable caliber. Good luck, and sorry for such a layman's response.

[Brasso]

There's not going to be a definitive answer to this. Both guns and calibers are good. I think the glock makes a much better leo weapon than a smith due to the fact that it is almost impossible to make a glock rust (rain) and it requires very little maintenance to keep it running. The .45 is definitly a more powerful round than the 9mm, but just how much better is more a factor of what brand and weight of ammo you use. The glock21 is a big gun. Better make sure everyone is comfortable with the large grip. You may find that a glock 22 is better suited.

[noway]

Different strokes for different folks.

Both calibers are great for defense. SVTnate brought up a good point about the 9mm ( .355 ) & 45ACP ( .451 ) caliber where the 45 before expansion has already make a bigger hole. So the way I see it, if the typical 9mm is expanding to a .50-.60 diameter, then the 45ACP still wouldn't have to expand that much more to stay equal in expansion. They both have adequate penetration levels and a long history of being good "stoppers".

Now some of the cons with the 45ACP are capacity G21 (13rds vrs G17/19 17or15rds. You didn't specify what model S&W but I'm assuming it's a 59XX series so ( AFAIK ) who have 15rds capacity their.

I think you will be impress with the glock 21.

[DAVEKO]

I am no expert either and I am not a Leo;
13 rounds of .45 with a 200 grainer +p Gold Dot Pro Load or Triton's 450 smc 230 .45 at 1150 fps and 675 fpe with only a heavy spring change this round will put you above .357 mag energy. Texas ammo also has some 200 grain .45 super ammo that is very fast and also above .357 mag energy.

Ditto on the Big hole to start with vs the 9mm.

Glock has no external controls for anyone to have to turn off or on or to get hooked and hung up on.
The Smith has external controls.
Glock is durable, reliable, combat accurate, & safe (I rate the Glock above the Smith.)
Glock can also have night sights and weapons lights (surefire).
Glock is easier and easy for you to field strip and clean or repair.
Glock has great service and support and parts.
Glock has alot of after market barrels, springs, guide rods, triggers, etc...
Glock is a modified single action type with no second strike, rack the slide. The smith does have second strike.
Glock has a much better trigger - no comparison with it's quick reset trigger vs a smith. you can short stroke a smith and it will not fire- the trigger has a long reset trip.
Not that your dept would want to but the G21 can shoot alot of other rounds, ie....45 acp, .45 tactical, .45 super, 450 smc all with only a spring change, and .400 corbon and .40 super with a barrel and spring change. The smith can't do that yet.
You can customize both pistols.
A Glock G21 around here goes for $575 - you would get a discount
A Smith around here goes for $575+ - you would get a discount
You can fit the grip to your hand by grip reduction, a grip, etc...
The Glock has less parts - to go wrong with.
The Glock is easy to train with and use.

One setup of several that I would choose;
G21, kkm or barsto barrel, Wolff Gunsprings steel guide rod and springs #21 - #23 Lbs non captured, 10% extra strength mag springs from Wolff. Mepro night sights, surefire weapons light, extended mag release, extended slide release, hi cap mags, and you may want a NY trigger type/maybe not. Blade Tech owb holster and spare mag/surefire light holder and double mag holder Blade Tech also has other holders ie. cuffs, etc...You can make a custom pistol out of it.
Then get a G30 as back up & use the same ammo and mags if you had to do so.

But in the final choice;
I would pick the one which I could shoot the best, most accurate (good shot placement), with. I shoot better with the Glock.


What I don't like about the Smith
1.) Trigger
2.) Grip
3.) external controls
4.) overall versatility, all inclusive

What I don't like about the Glock
0.)