HELP !! I'm moving to NY, what to do?? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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USMCGLOCKER
12-27-2007, 15:53
New Yorkers!!

I'll be moving to Rochester, NY (from Indiana) for about a year after this upcoming semester for work, and am wondering if any of you know what I need to do to keep my guns legal (all of the ones in my signature line). Online resources, personal experiences, and other references are all good. I would like to be able to carry still, but mainly, I just want to be able to have them in my place legally when I live there (if possible). I doubt the AR15 will fly, but the pistols are hopefully good to go. Whaddaya think?... other than don't move away from the great free state of Indiana. ;)

-Brett

FrankRochester
12-29-2007, 12:14
none of your guns are ok to have in NY. You have to have a license just to possess a handgun in NY. And they don't give out non-resident versions. And your AR-15 is a no-no if it is in "Pre-Ban" configuration. We have our own version of the 1994 Federal AWB. And it never expires. So no post ban high cap mags either. Better plan on leaving your guns home. Where are you going to be working in Rochester?

USMCGLOCKER
12-29-2007, 13:07
none of your guns are ok to have in NY. You have to have a license just to possess a handgun in NY. And they don't give out non-resident versions. And your AR-15 is a no-no if it is in "Pre-Ban" configuration. We have our own version of the 1994 Federal AWB. And it never expires. So no post ban high cap mags either. Better plan on leaving your guns home. Where are you going to be working in Rochester?

I appreciate your info, and I had kind of come to the realization that I would be without them for the year... :crying:

I am not sure where I'll be working just yet, but this semester I'll be applying in a number of places. It is likely that I will end up working with Rochester U doing something related to academics.

Damn NY for being so commie !!

FrankRochester
12-29-2007, 16:21
University of Rochester is a good school. Keep in touch, when are you moving?

USMCGLOCKER
12-29-2007, 16:38
Will do. I'm moving in the summer. I have one more semester of college here to do first !

da chef
12-30-2007, 14:26
i lived in rochester for about 12 years. at one time had picked up the ccw application but never completed so i'm no authority on the subject but if memory serves me correctly you needed 6 months of residency plus references. might be a bit more difficult as you're coming from out of state but still possible that u won't be without your handguns for the entire year. of course laws may have been changed and i might even be completely wrong about the residency requirements but don't lose all hope i had plenty of friends and family in rochester with their ccw.

Good luck!!!

da chef
12-30-2007, 14:37
:upeyes:
sorry i forgot the application process can take up to 6 months!

http://www.monroecounty.gov/clerk-pistolpermits.php

da chef
12-30-2007, 14:43
housing links

http://nothnagle.com/

http://rentrochester.com/

USMCGLOCKER
12-30-2007, 15:25
Thanks! That rentrochester site is great!

buddah
01-02-2008, 19:49
If you feel that you must have a gun while living in Rochester, why not buy a Mossberg 500?? They make a great home defense weapon and you could pick up a used mossberg for around $200.00. And best part is, you don't need a permit.

Hef
01-02-2008, 20:12
My condolences.

USMCGLOCKER
01-02-2008, 20:47
no permit required for shotguns? I won't even be a resident. Can a non resident get a shotgun?

da chef
01-03-2008, 21:34
buddah, that's a great idea

Spydermonkey
01-11-2008, 13:37
If you:

-got rid of all the non-preban mags
-converted your AR to Ban configuration(fixed stock, no flash hider/no bayo lug) or just sold the upper and put a ban compliant one on
-found a local (NY) FFL that was willing to recieve your firearms and to hold the pistols for you till your handgun permit was issued

You would probably be all set

btw unless you're a leo I wouldn't plan on getting a CCW permit, although this does depend on the county and your reasons for requesting one

FrankRochester
01-11-2008, 15:19
That is absolutely false... I received my CCW in 5 months and so did all my other friends. If you are near NYC forget about CCW. Buffalo and Syracuse are difficult as well. But Rochester is pretty much a shall issue area. I know of no one who has ever been denied.

Spydermonkey
01-11-2008, 17:50
Well I live in Syracuse, I have my CCW but pretty much everyone else gets denied. Also, the surrounding counties are pretty bad now too. I'm glad you live in a free county. G'Luck to the OP with the move.

XD9 4 ME
01-12-2008, 08:39
I wouldn't hold your breath on getting your guns back in a year... I'd be safe and say 2 to be sure. Figure you wait the 6 months and then have to wait up to 8 months(atleast in my case). It's funny even the state governments don't follow their own laws.. (I believe they have to have an answer back to you within 6 months)

I also haven't heard of anyone have a target only permit in Monroe County. Now other counties... absolutely...

Your damned you won't your guns but you'll be happy that once you have em that you'll be able to carry em!

BTW if you call it Rochester U you'll get picked on like a redheaded step child. Call it the U of R..... Just trying to help out ;)

FrankRochester
01-13-2008, 08:58
From what I've been led to believe. In Syracuse, they will give you the "hunting/target shooting" permit. Then, if you have been a good boy for a few years they will give you the concealed carry permit if you re-apply. The funny thing is, in NY there is no law for a hunting/target shooting permit. The judges are illegally placing restrictions on the permits. Someone needs to take them to court.

Spydermonkey
01-14-2008, 03:02
From what I've been led to believe. In Syracuse, they will give you the "hunting/target shooting" permit.
Correct

Then, if you have been a good boy for a few years they will give you the concealed carry permit if you re-apply.
Absolutely freaking not!

The funny thing is, in NY there is no law for a hunting/target shooting permit. The judges are illegally placing restrictions on the permits. Someone needs to take them to court.
Agreed

Spydermonkey
01-14-2008, 03:58
It is advised to request the "Sportsman" permit because unless you are leo it will most likely be denied. It is free and you can apply as many times as you'd like after to have your permit "upgraded" to a different class. Good luck with that though. A friend of mine has applied 3-4 times and been denied every time even though he followed the judges suggestion to the "T" the following time he applied.

This ones gonna cause carpal tunnel but heres Onondaga County's print out word for word when applying for a "Concealed Carry" pistol license, even the words that are capitalized when they shouldn't be are exactly as found on the form.

"Proper Cause" for a "Carry Concealed" Pistol License

The New York State Legislature restricts the types of pistol licenses that the court may issue to NYS Pistol License Holders. Under Penal Law Section 400.00 (1):

1: possesion in a dwelling by a householder
2: possesion in a place of business by a merchant or storekeeper
3: have and carry concealed while employed as a messenger of a banking institution
4: have and carry concealed by an employee while on duty in a correctional facility
5: have and carry concealed, without regard to employment or place of possesion, by any person when proper cause exists for the issuance thereof.

If your application seeks what is popularly known as a "have and carry concealed" without limitation pistol license, the New York Legislature authorizes the court to approve it only where it meets the "proper cause" standard. Our state's highest court, the Court of Appeals, has ruled that the Legislature has expressed an "obvious regulatory purpose of the statute" in enacting the phrase "proper cause" which would be frustrated if courts did not apply it as it was meant to be applied. (O'Brien vs. Keegan, 87 NY2d436 (1996). Appellate court decisions binding upon the pistol licensing officer define "proper cause" for the issuance of a "have an carry concealed" without limitation pistol license as grounds which demonstrate "a special need for self-protection distiguishable from that of the general community or a persons engaged in the same profession (Matter of Kaplan vs. Braton, 249 AD2d 199 (1st Dept. 1998).

Pistol license applicants should be aware that if you apply for a Pistol License for a particular purpose then it will be limited to that purpose. Also, if you desire a license for self-protection you would be advised to apply for an on-premise license. This is not a carry license and restricts the possension of the handgun to the dwelling or place of business listed in the application. No applicant will be issued an unrestricted carry permit unless he/she is able to demonstrate a special need for the issuance thereof. Self-protection is not a sufficient need for the issuance of a carry concealed license.

A statement of grounds which meet the test of "proper cause", i.e. "a special need for self-protection distiguishable from that of the general community or of persons engaged in the same profession", is necessary in order for the licensing officer to apply the law as enacted by the Legislature and interpreted by the higher Courts. As there is limited space availible on the application form for a statement of "proper cause", an "Optional Statement" form has been provided with this information sheet should you wish to supplement your application beyond this form.

Please understand that a court acting as a licensing officer is duty bound to follow the law. Should you Disagree with the "proper cause" requirement, and feel, as many citizens do, that any law abiding citizen has The right to the issuance of a full carry pistol license without making a "proper cause" showing, then you are Encouraged to contact your state legislature and urge the repeal of the "proper cause" requirements.

Here is page two that you must fill out according to what they ask of you. Keep in mind that the above and below are only for those applying for a CCW "unrestricted" permit.

OPTIONAL SUPPLEMENT TO APPLICATION FOR THE ISSUANCE OF A "HAVE AND CARRY CONCEALED" WITHOUT LIMITATION PISTOL LICENSE

1. Please state in detail the "proper cause" for the issuance of a pistol license which authorizes you to carry a concealed pistol on your person twenty-four hours a day without limitation:

Space given for you answer

2. Please state why the grounds set forth above constitute "a special need for protection from that of the general community and persons engaged in the same conduct, profession or Business" referred to in section one above:

Space given for you answer

So reading the above word for word makes you wonder how leo could even get their permit if "Self-protection is not a sufficient need for the issuance of a carry concealed license" and "A statement of grounds which meet the test of "proper cause", i.e. "a special need for self-protection distiguishable from that of the general community or of persons engaged in the same profession"". Wouldn't that mean that you would have to show why you need a permit more than other leos since "Self-protection is not a sufficient need for the issuance of a carry concealed license"?

My fingers hurt after typing all that out so I'm done for a bit.

steelvipersedg
01-14-2008, 09:00
Any one have the info on Erie county.

DeltaEliteMan
01-14-2008, 09:45
USMCGLOCKER,

Do not get rid of your guns if you are moving here permanently.
Do not plan on "leaving your guns home"!!!

Getting a concealed carry permit is easy.
I live in the Rochester area and I work at the U or R.
I am also the Secretary for S.C.O.P.E. (Shooter's Committee on Political Education) here in NY.
Please PM me for all the info you need, including FFL info.
You can have all the AR's (with a few mere mods), shotguns and handguns you want.
In NYC you'd have a real problem, but not in Upstate NY.

There is a great shooting "scene" here in Rochester. IPSC (pistol , rifle & 3-Gun), IDPA, DSM, Bullseye, High Powered Rifle Matches, everything you could want.
It's a great town!
Let me know and I'll show you the ropes!

USMCGLOCKER
01-14-2008, 22:32
USMCGLOCKER,

Do not get rid of your guns if you are moving here permanently.
Do not plan on "leaving your guns home"!!!

Getting a concealed carry permit is easy.
I live in the Rochester area and I work at the U or R.
I am also the Secretary for S.C.O.P.E. (Shooter's Committee on Political Education) here in NY.
Please PM me for all the info you need, including FFL info.
You can have all the AR's (with a few mere mods), shotguns and handguns you want.
In NYC you'd have a real problem, but not in Upstate NY.

There is a great shooting "scene" here in Rochester. IPSC (pistol , rifle & 3-Gun), IDPA, DSM, Bullseye, High Powered Rifle Matches, everything you could want.
It's a great town!
Let me know and I'll show you the ropes!

Hey, if that's the case, I'll hit you up when I get there... get some stuff straightened out, then have the folks send out what they can. Do you know something the rest of these people don't?

I hope so...... ;)

MakeMineaP99
01-14-2008, 22:54
Any one have the info on Erie county.

Hunting and Target will be issued only, unless you know a judge. The only people I have seen with Erie County unrestricted pistol permits are old timers who got them in the 70s and 80s.

<---Lived in Erie County until '02.

MakeMineaP99
01-14-2008, 22:56
USMCGLOCKER,

Do not get rid of your guns if you are moving here permanently.
Do not plan on "leaving your guns home"!!!

Getting a concealed carry permit is easy.
I live in the Rochester area and I work at the U or R.
I am also the Secretary for S.C.O.P.E. (Shooter's Committee on Political Education) here in NY.
Please PM me for all the info you need, including FFL info.
You can have all the AR's (with a few mere mods), shotguns and handguns you want.
In NYC you'd have a real problem, but not in Upstate NY.

There is a great shooting "scene" here in Rochester. IPSC (pistol , rifle & 3-Gun), IDPA, DSM, Bullseye, High Powered Rifle Matches, everything you could want.
It's a great town!
Let me know and I'll show you the ropes!

He'll still have to wait six months to establish residence and them wait for a permit. He'll only be there a year, will he get a permit before he leaves NYS?

FrankRochester
01-15-2008, 04:35
Why hasn't the NRA filed a lawsuit? LEO's are no better than the rest of us. This is the problem. These people like to create to classes of people.

JBlitzen
01-24-2008, 00:38
I just moved here as well, though I grew up here so it's less of a shock. The pistols, as mentioned, are basically nonstarters unless you plan to be here for at least 18 months. Leave them with out of state friends or family.

The rifle is a question mark. The "city of rochester" has an absolutely draconian assault weapons law on the books that essentially bans, with slight exceptions, any semi-automatic centerfire firearm capable of accepting magazines holding more than 5 rounds, regardless of manufacture date or configuration.

If you live outside the city of rochester, in the general vicinity, you only have to contend with the NYS assault weapons law, which, while awful, is about identical to the federal AWB, except it never sunset. So any postban presunset configuration ought to be fine outside the city limits.

The NYS ban also applies to magazines in the way the federal ban did. You'll have to acquire some preban (preferrably datestamped) magazines from before 1994. Not that difficult, just post on the appropriate ar15.com equipment exchange board and people will hook you up. Prices really aren't bad, either, maybe $15-$30 each, depending on condition.

For my move here, I bought a Puma M92 (Rossi version of a 16" Winchester 1892 in .45LC) and a Remington 870 HD, both of which fly under the Rochester law, so I can keep one or both in my vehicle without a problem, provided they're unloaded and locked.

I also brought in my RRA (my only prior long gun), having replaced all of my newer mags with pre-94's from arfcom. I had to transfer my pistols to family members for safe keeping, until I permit up or move. I now keep the lever gun as my nightstand gun, since the AR is too heavy and complicated for me to trust in the first 15 seconds after waking up. I'm still fiddling with where I allocate the other two long guns.

I've also acquired more knives and axes to fill in the pistol gap. My center console now sports a 6" gerber blade in a sheath I custom cut down and bolted in, instead of the old pistol holster. Not much, but better than an empty holster.

Also, I believe NY has a law on the books regarding purchase of pistol ammo. If it's ammo that can only be used in a pistol (??? typical NY nonsense law) you need a pistol permit to purchase it. I believe this may be one of the several reasons that walmart cash registers the world over ask if your ammo is for a pistol or not. So, I'd do some research before buying a pure handgun cartridge carbine, like in 9mm. I asked at Dick's about my .45LC, but they said that's fine.

One last note; I WISH I was wrong about anything in this post. So, please, if any of you guys know better, particularly about that city of rochester AW law, PLEASE correct me.

The resource I've been using, mostly, is:

http://www.nysrpa.org/nygunlaws.htm

DeltaEliteMan
01-24-2008, 08:28
One correction, you do not need to have a pistol permit to buy pistol ammo in NY. Just walk in and buy it. No problems.

Also, you do not need to have your rifle locked while carrying it in your trunk.
As long as the bolt is open and no magazine is in the rifle you're fine.

JBlitzen
01-24-2008, 09:39
Cool.

I think the rifle does need to be locked, but the trunk probably qualifies. Since I drive a pickup, it's not just a semantic difference.

USMCGLOCKER
01-24-2008, 14:24
I'll be leaving the pistols and the AR, and the rest of my awesome stash in my parents' attic while I'm in NY. :crying:

Just to be totally clear though, I can bring a shotty to NY for my apt. and for range use with no problems? All I want is a HD gun that also is fun to shoot at a range once in a while.

-Brett

DeltaEliteMan
01-24-2008, 16:12
Yep, no problems with the shotgun...

USMCGLOCKER
01-24-2008, 19:08
Danke. You guys are the "you know what"!

XD9 4 ME
02-04-2008, 21:57
One correction, you do not need to have a pistol permit to buy pistol ammo in NY. Just walk in and buy it. No problems.

Man, I wouldn't go that far... Everytime I go to buy ammo at Wallyworld I get read the riot act just from the looks of people and have to show them my permit...

StogieStang
02-04-2008, 22:34
I have extra room in my safe :wavey:

DeltaEliteMan
02-05-2008, 09:13
Man, I wouldn't go that far... Everytime I go to buy ammo at Wallyworld I get read the riot act just from the looks of people and have to show them my permit...

That is true at some Wally Worlds and some Dick's sporting goods here too for that matter. It just depends on who is behind the counter at the time.

My point is there is no law in NY that says you have to display a pistol permit to buy pistol ammo.

Spikehorn11
02-12-2008, 03:28
[QUOTE=DeltaEliteMan;9725316]One correction, you do not need to have a pistol permit to buy pistol ammo in NY. Just walk in and buy it. No problems.
QUOTE]

At Walmart they said their policy is not to sell any pistol ammo unless a permit is shown.

At Dicks sporting goods they ask if its for a carbine or pistol. If you answer pistol they ask to see a permit. They do it to try to weed out people who shouldn't have the ammo.

There are some small gun shops who don't. I remmeber one that would see me shotgun ammo because I wasn't 21.
Every place can make their own policys.

Also you have to have a pistol permit to even hold a handgun in NY. But some small shops don't care cause they want your business whn you do get a permit.

FrankRochester
02-20-2008, 15:34
You do not need a permit to handle a pistol in NY.

XD9 4 ME
02-20-2008, 15:46
Frank, where'd you get that info?

FrankRochester
02-22-2008, 10:51
You need a permit to own/possess a handgun. If you are in a store and looking at a gun, you do not own/possess it. It is no different that picking up a rifle off the shelf or looking at a TV at a Best Buy. If you walked out of the store and was caught, then you'd be in trouble for stolen property in your "possession". In the store, then it is still in the possession on the store owner. The bigger chain stores won't let people look at them without a permit because they don't want to have any liability. If you want to keep arguing this point. How about this, if you were right then as a permit holder you shouldn't be allowed to handle a pistol until is is registered on your permit! Because you don't own it and it is not registered to you. It is strictly individual store policies. People like to make up all kinds of crap about NY laws. Most people have no idea, they just heard it from someone, who heard it from someone. And false information just keeps getting passed around.

XD9 4 ME
02-22-2008, 11:18
And false information just keeps getting passed around.

Easy there.... I was just asking..

JBlitzen
02-22-2008, 11:57
Actually, Frank, my reading of the laws is different from yours. Yes, there may be some leeway shown inside gun stores, but in general, outside of limited exceptions, you ARE legally forbidden from touching a pistol until it's on your permit. Whether that's enforced doesn't change it one bit.

In fact, my understanding is that the training courses required for pistol permits in many NY counties cannot legally permit the students to touch or fire handguns.

There does seem to be one exception, for young adults 18-21 years old, while at a range, under direct supervision of an adult with a handgun on that adult's pistol permit.

FrankRochester
02-22-2008, 19:28
Now you are talking about operating a handgun. That is a completely different thing. And still, you are talking about possession. If I am standing there, and watching it is still in my possession. I didn't let said person walk off with it. I didn't give anyone the gun to take. Like I said, you need a permit to own it.

JBlitzen
02-22-2008, 21:50
If a prosecuting attorney asks you on the stand whether the gun was in your hand, and you say yes, he has just proven that you were in possession of it.

I'm not familiar with any interpretation of law that states that "possession" does not require control. If it's in my hands and not in yours, unless you're God, I control it, not you.

Spikehorn11
02-25-2008, 01:11
New York Penal Law Section 10.00
Definitions of terms of general use in this chapter.

8. "Possess" means to have physical possession or otherwise to
exercise dominion or control over tangible property.




Thats the deffiniton but ask 5 different people and get 5 different interpretations.

USMCGLOCKER
02-25-2008, 14:21
OK, basically NY has screwy laws that are vague as hell... That isn't the point of the thread.

JBlitzen
02-25-2008, 14:39
Actually, stuff like this is exactly what a person moving to NY needs to know.

And the laws aren't vague so much as draconian.

SMOKEin
02-25-2008, 19:21
Some of you guys must have some questionable "friends" :) .. I dont know ANYONE who has been turned down for a permit in upstate. Now, I'm not saying they are not people each day, but nobody ive ever met 1st hand.

I suggest the OP takes a good read on the NYS pistol laws.. IE. between the ages of 18-20 you could go to a range and shoot with someone using there gun.. turn 21 and thats a no no.. Find out who issues them in your area and go talk to them.

Also, many counties word there permits different.. IE. hunting and target, sportsman, restricted or restricted, im sure the list goes on..

I was asked for a pistol permit everytime I went to wally world for some WWB, never at a gun store. Maybe becasue they knew me or maybe its not a law and there not stuffy like WW.

When I was 21 I started the process of making calls and stopping by the pistol clerks office for general info and paperwork related stuff.. from the time i took my class and submitted my prints, photo's, etc, it was about 3 weeks before I got my hunting and target permit. When I asked about carry, she told me the judge usually like to issue H&T first. Not saying I agree with the policy, but about a year and a half later I reapplied and got my unrestricted.

USMCGLOCKER
02-25-2008, 19:43
Actually, stuff like this is exactly what a person moving to NY needs to know.

And the laws aren't vague so much as draconian.

Nope, I don't need that. I'm bringing a shotty... thats it.

kenlew
02-26-2008, 20:12
Apply to I.U. - move to Bloomington. Warmer, Girls are much hotter, & you can keep your guns...

USMCGLOCKER
02-26-2008, 21:16
Apply to I.U. - move to Bloomington. Warmer, Girls are much hotter, & you can keep your guns...

I live in Indiana, go to I.U. already.... unfortunately I am about to graduate and leave the state. :crying:

MakeMineaP99
02-26-2008, 21:24
I live in Indiana, go to I.U. already.... unfortunately I am about to graduate and leave the state. :crying:

I still have a SIG waiting for you when you return ;)

Maxx702
03-21-2008, 21:25
OK, I'm a former upstate NY'er browsing this thread out of curiosity.

I'm not trying to start some s**t here, but I must say I find it somewhat amazing and very disturbing that a upstanding citizen with no felony record would have to beg the state to simply own a handgun.

Thank God I don't live there anymore!

Here in Nevada, after clearing a Brady check 1 time, you can legally purchase a hand gun, get a CCW, and buy handguns on the spot afterward.
If it's not a hollow point, it's called a practice round.

What rifle restrictions do you guys face?
Can you buy AR-15's and AK-47's?

I'm not bashing you guys, I'm just curious.
Any criticism is directed at your state government.

Spydermonkey
03-22-2008, 20:41
OK,What rifle restrictions do you guys face?
Can you buy AR-15's and AK-47's?


We have the same restrictions that were introduced with the AWB. NY adopted the AWB and included it into the penal law and left it there after the bans sunset.

JBlitzen
03-22-2008, 20:46
That includes a prohibition on postban high capacity magazines, but there are usually prebans around for anything made before 94.

NYC, by the way, is much stricter. More comparable to DC.

Maxx702
03-23-2008, 09:15
I grew up in the Utica / Rome area.
I understand the irony of the upstaters having to live with the NYC mentality laws.

jlday70
04-14-2008, 10:29
I live in the farthest west county in that state....Granted it took me less than two months to get my permit, the AWB is BS but as with the origional ban you can still buy EBR's and AK's they just have to be ban compliant.

The whole not being able to let someone under 18 handle a Pistol is new to me My 14 year old daughter goes with me to the range everytime I go, and I have to fight her to shoot my 9mm.

I guess being that we are a very rural county and mostly gun owning, teaching ones children guns and gun safety is something that is done every day.

ithaca_deerslayer
04-22-2008, 13:08
I live in the farthest west county in that state....Granted it took me less than two months to get my permit, the AWB is BS but as with the origional ban you can still buy EBR's and AK's they just have to be ban compliant.

The whole not being able to let someone under 18 handle a Pistol is new to me My 14 year old daughter goes with me to the range everytime I go, and I have to fight her to shoot my 9mm.

I guess being that we are a very rural county and mostly gun owning, teaching ones children guns and gun safety is something that is done every day.

Check NYS law. If you have a pistol permit, and you have a hunting license, and your kid is at least 14, and you are at a gunclub, you can legally let your kid shoot your pistol under your direct supervision, until the kid reaches age 21.

Here's the link quote, you'll have to read all of section 265 and paragraph 7 for the particulars.
http://public.leginfo.state.ny.us/menugetf.cgi
265.20
Exemptions
7-e. Possession and use of a pistol or revolver, at an indoor or
outdoor pistol range located in or on premises owned or occupied by a
duly incorporated organization organized for conservation purposes or to
foster proficiency in small arms or at a target pistol shooting
competition under the auspices of or approved by an association or
organization described in paragraph 7-a of this subdivision for the
purpose of loading and firing the same by a person at least fourteen
years of age but under the age of twenty-one who has not been previously
convicted of a felony or serious offense, and who does not appear to be,
or pose a threat to be, a danger to himself or to others; provided
however, that such possession shall be of a pistol or revolver duly
licensed to and shall be used under the immediate supervision, guidance
and instruction of, a person specified in paragraph seven of this
subdivision.

DeltaEliteMan
04-22-2008, 13:21
ithaca_deerslayer is completely correct.

ithaca_deerslayer
04-22-2008, 13:26
Also want to add that generally (aside from the specific exemptions listed in the link above) nobody can handle your pistol unless they have a permit, doesn't matter if they are 18 or not.

pcguy
03-20-2009, 15:59
As someone who used to live in NYS, I can sympathize with the legal situation up there. I have to wonder though, with all the hunting/fishing/outdoors type folks in the upstate areas, how in the heck has the draconian may issue policies been allowed to linger for so long?

It's clearly long since past the matter of discussion. Each citizen of the country has a right to bear arms and to protect their life & liberty. Restricting the ownership/usage of handguns is a clear and illegal breach of that right. A law abiding citizen has the constitutional right, and duty to protect himself and his family from violent crime. Taking that right away with permits and restrictions clearly beyond reasonable methods, the state legislature might as well be pulling the trigger themselves.

Do you think a criminal in the bronx or west side of buffalo gives a rat's patootie whether his gun is legal? I think not. Lot's of luck once you call 911 and find the police arrive just in time to call the coroner.

ithaca_deerslayer
03-23-2009, 07:41
As someone who used to live in NYS, I can sympathize with the legal situation up there. I have to wonder though, with all the hunting/fishing/outdoors type folks in the upstate areas, how in the heck has the draconian may issue policies been allowed to linger for so long?

It's clearly long since past the matter of discussion. Each citizen of the country has a right to bear arms and to protect their life & liberty. Restricting the ownership/usage of handguns is a clear and illegal breach of that right. A law abiding citizen has the constitutional right, and duty to protect himself and his family from violent crime. Taking that right away with permits and restrictions clearly beyond reasonable methods, the state legislature might as well be pulling the trigger themselves.

Do you think a criminal in the bronx or west side of buffalo gives a rat's patootie whether his gun is legal? I think not. Lot's of luck once you call 911 and find the police arrive just in time to call the coroner.

Well, there's always been (long as I can remember) a huge political divide between upstate and downstate NY. Only problem is, downstate (NYC) has a lot a people. And they take the rights away from the rest of the state.

Also worth noting here that Republican and Democrat aren't always where the gun issue is divided. Sometimes, the upstate Democrats (like Kirsten Gilibrand) are pro-gun; and the downstate Republicans like Pataki (who is close to downstate) and Guliani are anti-gun.

DeltaEliteMan
03-23-2009, 08:50
As someone who used to live in NYS, I can sympathize with the legal situation up there. I have to wonder though, with all the hunting/fishing/outdoors type folks in the upstate areas, how in the heck has the draconian may issue policies been allowed to linger for so long?



If we could cut off New York City that would be a good start...