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Bilbo Baggins
02-14-2008, 01:07
What are your opinions on These 1 day all 3 degree conferals some states have started?

I was still in Pa when they had the first of thiers, frankly I just don't think very much of the idea.
My biggest problem with it is the fact the Candidates can't be getting any of it and are missing out on a very profound experience.
What happened to the proficiancies?
In my humble opinion we are becoming lesser by these classes and I feel the Grand Lodges need to look a tad bit beyond the membership numbers and dues.
Just my 2 pennies worth a am curious as to your opinions on this

mmsig229
02-14-2008, 05:51
Ohio started this several years ago. It has been by all accounts successful. The GL tracked the progress of these candidates and discovered that they had no more of a drop out rate than candidates who did it the long way. They also stepped into line at the same rate as the other candidates. It is true that they may not be as profecient in the ritual (AT FIRST)as others, but they can also be an exemplar candidate later on. BTW, at my Lodge my SD, JW,SW, and myself are all one day wonders. We work extremely hard at the ritual, and hold many special meetings to practice. If it weren't for the one day classes, I think many lodges would have an impossible time filling the officers chairs. JMHO.

lethal tupperwa
02-14-2008, 06:40
It is hard to build the kind of friendship I had with my instructor in one day.

MarcoPolo
02-15-2008, 10:24
I can contrast the two a bit, as I took the "long road" in blue lodge, and a one-day festival for York Rite (all the way through KT).

In Blue Lodge we had long form proficiency between each degree and all work was taught mouth to ear. The relationship I built with my instructor, and the time invested into my degrees by the brothers was truly special. I understand the lectures. I understand the degrees.

In York Rite, though I truly enjoyed it, I was never even a candidate in any of the degrees. As I have not been to chapter or council (due to my schedule) I couldn't even tell you any of the "info" of the degrees. I understand that my involvement would bring me up to speed, but had I gone through the degrees, I'm sure they would have made a more lasting impression.

I cannot even imagine not having the third degree performed ON me. What a huge experience.

I don't fault brothers who go "all the way in one day", and I understand why GL's do it.. numbers. But I feel that the brothers are somehow slighted by not getting the full experience. That being said, any "one day" Mason is still a Mason, and my brother.

Slide Lock Satch
02-15-2008, 17:09
I cannot imagine the three degrees in one day. Too much to digest. I enjoyed the anticipation of each degree and the fact that it was not something that was acheived in a quick fashion.

I have been out of the lodge for 10 years. I did not attend due to inactive lodge in the town where I lived. I have since reloacted and have renewed interest in attending the Blue Lodge and the York Rite.

Best wishes,

Satch

Bilbo Baggins
02-15-2008, 20:01
I hope that no one misunderstood me, I think no less of a mason who has gone the 1 day route. I just feel they missed out personally on the experience.
I think the idea is not a good one not the men.

mmsig229
02-15-2008, 20:37
I hope that no one misunderstood me, I think no less of a mason who has gone the 1 day route. I just feel they missed out personally on the experience.
I think the idea is not a good one not the men.

In my lodge we offer to put a one day Mason through the degrees as an exemplar candidate. This way they are able to have the full experience if they wish. If it weren't for the one day class alot of the officer chairs would be filled with Past Masters which in my opinion is far more damaging to the lodge in the long run than the one day class.

ArodJohns
02-15-2008, 20:57
I can contrast the two a bit, as I took the "long road" in blue lodge, and a one-day festival for York Rite (all the way through KT).

In Blue Lodge we had long form proficiency between each degree and all work was taught mouth to ear. The relationship I built with my instructor, and the time invested into my degrees by the brothers was truly special. I understand the lectures. I understand the degrees.

In York Rite, though I truly enjoyed it, I was never even a candidate in any of the degrees. As I have not been to chapter or council (due to my schedule) I couldn't even tell you any of the "info" of the degrees. I understand that my involvement would bring me up to speed, but had I gone through the degrees, I'm sure they would have made a more lasting impression.

I cannot even imagine not having the third degree performed ON me. What a huge experience.

I don't fault brothers who go "all the way in one day", and I understand why GL's do it.. numbers. But I feel that the brothers are somehow slighted by not getting the full experience. That being said, any "one day" Mason is still a Mason, and my brother.

This is the way I did it as well. Long form Blue Lodge and then York Rite Fest. I don't think I got as much from the YRF as I did from Blue Lodge. I mean I'm involved with all of them, but I think I've had a little harder time with the ritual than I would have if I had done it the long way.


I welcome any man that wants to be a Mason and is fit to be one, but the thing that burns my rear is the people who join Blue Lodge just to get into Shrine.

Deputydawg109
02-15-2008, 21:02
membership numbers and fast paced society of today....... :dunno:

machinisttx
02-23-2008, 22:52
I can contrast the two a bit, as I took the "long road" in blue lodge, and a one-day festival for York Rite (all the way through KT).

In Blue Lodge we had long form proficiency between each degree and all work was taught mouth to ear. The relationship I built with my instructor, and the time invested into my degrees by the brothers was truly special. I understand the lectures. I understand the degrees.

In York Rite, though I truly enjoyed it, I was never even a candidate in any of the degrees. As I have not been to chapter or council (due to my schedule) I couldn't even tell you any of the "info" of the degrees. I understand that my involvement would bring me up to speed, but had I gone through the degrees, I'm sure they would have made a more lasting impression.

I cannot even imagine not having the third degree performed ON me. What a huge experience.

I don't fault brothers who go "all the way in one day", and I understand why GL's do it.. numbers. But I feel that the brothers are somehow slighted by not getting the full experience. That being said, any "one day" Mason is still a Mason, and my brother.

This is pretty much how I feel, although I engaged in warfare and did my pennance in the Order of the Temple. I also believe that the one day classes are a major misuse of Mason at Sight.

jetboatdriver
02-24-2008, 10:35
Well I guess I am a little different than any of your experiences so far.

I did long degree Blue Lodge, with shortened prficiency requirements (liberal prompter use)

I did YR (Chapter and Council)one degree at a time and was the candidate in all but one degree (wse do three at a time)

Did SR in one day festival of terminal degrees.

I did Shrine short and long form.

My impressions are that there is no way I would want to do the Blue or York in a festival format (I had the option on Commandry this past weekend for festival - I passed).

On the other hand the SR one degree at a time would be impossible. The one day was too fast, not much retention. I will be working the 21st in our upcoming 3 day festival so I will have a better idea after the middle of March about that.

Shrine - preferred the short form. Ceremonial was much ado about nothing in my view. That said, I love the actual work of helping kids, raising money and supplying blood this group affords.

zoyter2
03-04-2008, 13:30
This is against the Constitution, Resolutions and Edits of Alabama.

I personally think that for Masonry to survive, there will have to be concessions, but I don't know where.

It is up to the Lodge to determine proficiency in the lessons, and some Lodges have reportedly began just teaching the grips and words. I think the Brother cheats himself out of a lot of knowledge by going this route, and as WM, I will NOT approve doing this unless there are extenuating circumstances that prevent a good Brother, not in his dotage, from "memorizing" the lesson.

Remember, once in the SRs you have to do one hell of a lot more than "watch" to have a degree conferred upon you. Does this make our current SR Masons "less"? Nope.

mark996
03-11-2008, 16:36
In my lodge we offer to put a one day Mason through the degrees as an exemplar candidate. This way they are able to have the full experience if they wish. If it weren't for the one day class alot of the officer chairs would be filled with Past Masters which in my opinion is far more damaging to the lodge in the long run than the one day class.

We are suffering from this right now. We have past masters that are having to go through the chairs again because there are no new brothers to occupy them. We get at least 2 candidates a month, and about 1 fully raised brother every 6 months if we're lucky. They get initiated and never seen or heard from again.

deputy tom
03-15-2008, 16:44
Bilbo,I was in attendance at the Pennsylvania one day class a few yrs. ago.I saw our new Brothers taken from Profane to Shriners in a few hours and they got gyped.However they were asked to come back in the ensueing months for further instruction,which I doubt they did go back,henceforth offering up uninformed Brothers by the thousands.Good intentions,bad execution.YMMV.tom.

lethal tupperwa
03-16-2008, 06:30
just an observation

We has several Brothers try for almost an hour to find some way to admit one of the "one day wonders from (in this case Pa.)

The man had NO absolutely No memory of Anything.

He may as well have found his dues card on the sidewalk.

Sadly it was suggested that he take some refresher instruction.

RED64CJ5
03-17-2008, 11:04
As one of the "younger" Masons in Texas, I must admit that I find one-day degrees for Blue Lodge OFFENSIVE. I have taken part in one-day York Rite festivals and SR reunions, but they are a little different. You get what you put into them...and I get a lot out of the York Rite.. (SR....not so much).

What is the value of joining the organization if it's dumbed-down and easy?

It makes us no different than any "club" where you pay dues and are assigned an ID.

This may sound like the ranting of a 70 year old but quite the contrary. I am one of the young people who think that traditions do sometimes have a place in society.

zoyter2
03-17-2008, 11:34
As one of the "younger" Masons in Texas, I must admit that I find one-day degrees for Blue Lodge OFFENSIVE. I have taken part in one-day York Rite festivals and SR reunions, but they are a little different. You get what you put into them...and I get a lot out of the York Rite.. (SR....not so much).

What is the value of joining the organization if it's dumbed-down and easy?

It makes us no different than any "club" where you pay dues and are assigned an ID.

This may sound like the ranting of a 70 year old but quite the contrary. I am one of the young people who think that traditions do sometimes have a place in society.


Good for you Dude. I agree. There must be some changes if Masonry survives, but there has to be something better than this.

Danny Reid
03-17-2008, 16:40
Do they still beat the hell out of people as a prerequisite to join?

RED64CJ5
03-17-2008, 19:48
Do they still beat the hell out of people as a prerequisite to join?

Bruised and battered, I am proud to be a Mason.

:rofl:

zoyter2
03-17-2008, 21:09
Do they still beat the hell out of people as a prerequisite to join?

Actually with the average age of Masons approaching 60 years old, we have little energy to do that anymore.

We now require candidates to put a on mini-skirt, high heel shoes, and a tee shirt proclaiming "Loud Bikes Suck" and go to the local biker bar for a beer.

Those that make it back can be initiated.



PS...Someone did not really tell you that "a beating" is one of the requirements did they?

lethal tupperwa
03-17-2008, 21:14
two of the guys I "met" were 6ft 8

and

7ft tall

DesertMan
03-25-2008, 22:51
At my lodge they dont do the one day wonders, we work through the degrees mouth to ear. But they do give some leanency to guys that are in the military that have rem sleep deprivation schedules like I to learn at their own pace within reason. I think working up the ranks preserves the tradition....

Mr. BJL
05-04-2008, 05:13
I have come into the craft somewhat late in my life so my opinions may be somewhat different than others. I am 53 and wish to do it all long form. I was offered a choice of short form or long, but no one day 1-3 class. I petitioned in December 2007 and I was initiated March 26, 2008, returned my proficiency in open Lodge on April 9, 2008 and was passed on April 23, 2008. I am scheduled to return my FC proficiency on May 14 and if all goes well then, to be Raised on May 17. Please bear in mind, I cast no ill will upon those Brothers who have come into this way of life different than I. For me, personally, I wanted to do it as the old guard did before me. For me, it is the work which draws me closer to the light, not the speed in which I get there.
Wishing all of you well in your journey, no matter how you began!

zoyter2
05-04-2008, 08:15
Good post Mr. BJL, and congrats! I am glad you chose the "long way". I think you will be happy you did.

As we say in Alabama...."On being passed to the second degree of Masonry, we congratulate you on your preferment.....".

Oh, and at 53, your not THAT late. We raised an 82 year old Brother about 3 months ago.

jrr6602
05-04-2008, 11:08
My father was 42 years old when he was raised, due to WW11 and working. I was 27 when I was raised and wish that I had done it sooner. I did not have a reason. The One Day degree is for building up a declining membership. I am not in favor of these One Day degrees for the Blue Lodges.

Big Red
05-04-2008, 15:25
I have 2 kin brothers who went 1 day, as that was the only way they could do it. Some have jobs that make it near impossible to go the traditional route. Pa and I work with them when ever we get together, to help them understand what was missed but...

I understand a need for the 1 day but, I can't say I like it. It does have a use other than to bolster membership.

ArodJohns
05-04-2008, 17:34
Oh, and at 53, your not THAT late. We raised an 82 year old Brother about 3 months ago.

That may actually be a violation of the Ohio obligation.

zoyter2
05-04-2008, 22:51
That may actually be a violation of the Ohio obligation.

Well if Ohio is anything like Bama, I think you may be referring to "dotage". This may occur outside of the constraints of calendar years, and in fact has very little to do with physical age.

This particular 82 year old is retiring this week. Until now, he was a long-haul truck driver for a food company. Scary thought, but he does have a unblemished safety record, 20/18 eyes, above average reactions for a man 25 years his junior, a flawless physical, and often has to prove his age with a photo ID.

RED64CJ5
05-05-2008, 06:47
Well if Ohio is anything like Bama, I think you may be referring to "dotage". This may occur outside of the constraints of calendar years, and in fact has very little to do with physical age.

My thoughts exactly... I have traveled to lodges throughout the US and Canada and have never heard an obligation mention age. Dotage is mentioned, but it is not within the boundaries of calendar years.

Dotage - a state or period of senile decay marked by decline of mental poise and alertness

ArodJohns
05-05-2008, 11:36
Well if Ohio is anything like Bama, I think you may be referring to "dotage". This may occur outside of the constraints of calendar years, and in fact has very little to do with physical age.

This particular 82 year old is retiring this week. Until now, he was a long-haul truck driver for a food company. Scary thought, but he does have a unblemished safety record, 20/18 eyes, above average reactions for a man 25 years his junior, a flawless physical, and often has to prove his age with a photo ID.

Yep, that's what I was talking about and you're right in that the obligation doesn't say anything regarding age. I just figured that most 82 year old folks are slipping a bit. Heck, at my Lodge one of the older past masters walked into the Lodge building and left his car running for a couple hours. He'd completely forgot about it. :crying:

RED64CJ5
05-05-2008, 11:50
My 80 year old grandfather conferred all three of my Blue Lodge degrees. He is far from being in his dotage.

zoyter2
05-05-2008, 11:54
My 80 year old grandfather conferred all three of my Blue Lodge degrees. He is far from being in his dotage.

What a tremendous honor. You must be very proud!

RED64CJ5
05-05-2008, 11:58
Not to hijack the thread from the original topic, but yes, I am extremely proud and my bond with him has grown ten-fold since becoming fraternal brothers. Like my father was throughout my progression to Eagle Scouts in Boy Scouting, my grandfather has been at my side throughout my short Masonic career.

zoyter2
05-05-2008, 15:46
Not to hijack the thread from the original topic, but yes, I am extremely proud and my bond with him has grown ten-fold since becoming fraternal brothers. Like my father was throughout my progression to Eagle Scouts in Boy Scouting, my grandfather has been at my side throughout my short Masonic career.

I am quite sure that the bonding as well as the pride is NOT one sided.

Again, congrats and continued pleasures!