AR15 for home defense

[BLau]

I want to use my 9mm AR15 for home defense and wasn't sure if I should keep one in the pipe? Do you guys keep one in the pipe or leave the chamber empty like a shotgun?

[MrMurphy]

I carry one chamber empty on duty. For house defense, a pistol is handier and I think safer to keep ready to go. Cranking a round into the chamber takes a second or so, less time than slinging the rifle and off-safing it.

[RMTactical]

I keep it unloaded but with a loaded mag in the magwell and the safety on at all times. If I need it, I have loaded a round and taken off the safety so many times I can do it quickly and easily with no light so I am not worried.

[RainierArms]

As much as I love the AR, for HD, an 870 or similar shotgun with light is the best bet.

[NITE SITE 53]

I have to agree with RainierArms. Even though I have a Glock 22 with night sights, a shotgun has to be one of the best for home defense use.

[sphillips45]

I keep my Bushmaster ready to go at night, Mag is in the gun but the rifle is empty. Handguns are what you use to fight your way to a real gun ...

[Slateman]

If you're gonna have a long gun for home defense, it really outta be a shotgun. Pistols are better for close quarters stuff.

[RMTactical]

I disagree with the shotgun, personally, although I would say it would be the second best weapon in that role.

One of the common misconceptions about the shotgun is that it is great in CQB because you can just aim in the general direction of the enemy and take them out with ease. The truth is, at CQB ranges, the patterns are still very very tight and you do in fact have to aim every shot.

Also, assuming you didn't have to aim because of the spread you would likely lose quite a bit of that power. A shotguns power doesn't comes from the effectiveness of one single pellet, but from the combined effect of 10+ pellets hitting the target together. Almost like a .32 auto hitting you 12 times all at once.

The AR15 shoots faster, more capacity (both of those help when engaging multiple targets), more accurately. Also, my AR15 carbine is shorter than my HD shotgun.

Not as good of stopping power shot for shot with the shotgun, but plenty more shot for shot than a pistol.

Also can defeat most commonly worn types of body armor better than a shotgun or a pistol.

For many years police agencies stayed away from the AR15 for CQB/Entry, etc... thinking that the collateral damage of the .223/5.56 round was worse than that from a shotgun, pistol, or SMG. Now you have agencies like the FBI who are slowly doing away with the MP5's and going to the AR15 carbines.

FBI studies have indicated that over penetration at CQB ranges have been greatly exaggerated and .223 penetrates less in human tissue than most common pistol rounds (including JHP's) on average.

Another thing for me to consider is the amount of trigger time and training I have with an AR15 compared to a shotgun. I am easily the most proficient with my AR15. You must go with the weapon you have the most training and proficiency with, so consider that on a personal basis first and foremost.

Lastly, if the engagement takes you outside, you are equipped to handle targets at ranges far past typical CQB ranges.

I think a shotgun is a great HD weapon, but I wouldn't trade one for my AR15.

[Dobber]

I keep 2 AR's with a full mag and empty chamber.

[G26man]

I second everything RMTactial said about the AR over the shotgun for HD, however I would keep the 9mm upper. Less power but a whole lot less noise/blast/flash in a confined space (not to mention recoil) makes for faster more accurate shots, and leave your facilities more intact for additional BGs. It's a trade off but thats the way I would go. YMMV.

This is all predicated on the fact that you stay in one room, call 911 and let the BGs come to you. If you are going to clear the house most people can do that more safely with a pistol.

And yes I think a loaded mag inserted with a clear chamber is fine. That's the way I keep any home defense weapon, pistol or carbine. If you have to get out of bed and open a safe or other safety device, the time it takes to rack a round in the chamber is really insignificant, unlike carrying CCW on your person.

[Beer_Forever]

I have a Glock 19 with a loaded mag, just have to rack the slide. I think that even an M4 is a bit bulky to use as a home defense weapon. A pistol is more agile and much lighter, you just have to know how to use it and be a good shot. The shotgun is fool proof!! I use Winchester 00 3'' magnum buck shot in a short barrel pistol grip Mossberg 500. The sound of chambering a round into a 12 ga is a great intimidation factor and lets anyone know you mean business. If I ever feel that the 9mm isn't going to do the job, I know for a fact that 1 round of 3'' Winchester magnum buck shot will decimate any human being.

[Big Mad Dawg]

Shotguns are great but I prefer my ARs chamber empty mag loaded.

What ever pistol I am using for carry or night stand is only unloaded at the end of the mag or for cleaning they are worthless empty. I also am on the pistol is only good for concealed carry or to fight your way to a rifle team.

But over here they make you clear your weapons to eat or shop.

[G26man]

The shotgun is fool proof!! I use Winchester 00 3'' magnum buck shot in a short barrel pistol grip Mossberg 500.
Better hope you don't miss. Something tells me you probably don't train with that combo a lot.

[slathrum]

I don't know how every person fires a shotgun with a PG, but as for myself I have an 18" Rem 870 with a PG and I prefer firing from the hip with my elbow locked to my side. I may not hunt like this, but I can hit a pop can 25 yards away with 00 buck every time. I'm 5'6 150 lbs and find this method to be the most comfortable as well, compared to the same weapon and ammo fired with a stock on the shoulder.

I know it surely is better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6, but in this day and age I really don't think I would want to face a jury of people that don't share my love of black rifles after having shot someone with my evil-looking tacticool M4. Even if you were just defending your family, it looks like you're wanting a reason to go hunting in your own home. I still keep one in the bedroom with a loaded mag and empty chamber too, but only if I need it and it's probably not the first weapon I grab.

[ArmaGlock]

The shotgun is fool proof!!

I used to think so too, right up until I missed the biggest gobbler I've ever seen at around 10-15 yds with a Mossberg 835 Tactical Turkey with 3.5 inch, 4 shot. I had just bought the gun and wasn't efficient with it at all. I thought man this thing can't shoot that tight of a pattern with a 20 inch barrel. Boy was I wrong, now I know why it has rifle sights on it. That overbored barrel and choke tube shoots amazing patterns.

[G23shooter]

I guess it all boils down to each individual as far as what the best HD weapon is. My main home defense is good exterior lighting, a good alarm system, and two dogs that sleep in the house. Since this is a discussion on HD guns I keep a Glock 32 with light attached, round chambered on my nightstand and sleep like a baby.

I would much rather defend the use of a handgun in my home over the use of an "Assault Rifle". Lets not forget a Jury of your peers does not mean they make the selection from the local NRA chapter.

While an AR does carry more rounds than a shotgun, the shotgun is much more forgiving in the aiming catagory, at 20' a few inches off will still keep enough of the shot on the target to do some damage even if it is just slowing them down until you can take a second shot, if you are off by a few inches with a rifle that could be the difference between a hit and miss. At close range 20-30', the shotgun will be much more devestating than the rifle.

The chances of encountering a burglar wearing body armor that would defeat a .357 sig round are pretty slim. Also while overpenetration in human tissue has been overly exagerated in reguards to the .223 round, the overpenetration through most household structures has not. A .223 round will easily go through sheetrock walls and still maintain more than enough energy to kill something on the other side of it. Shotgun loads and HP's from handguns while most will go through, very few still carry enough energy to do serious damage to something on the other side.

As for me having to go outside of my house and engage BG's out to range that would require a rifle, again slim. Once they flea the house they are no longer a threat and any shot I were to take at them while they were running away would easily put me over the line that devides Justifiable Homicide and Second degree murder.

It is also much easier for a BG to keep you from shooting him if by some chance he manages to get close enough to you to get hands on your rifle/shotgun. He can easily get both hands on the weapon and keep the muzzle away from his body. Also something to consider is if the BG does get hands on there is a very real chance of him controlling the muzzle and since your finger is in the vacinity of the trigger an AD happening and who knows where the muzzle would be pointed. If it does get physical with the rifle/shotgun you would need two hands to take a shot as well as being able to get atleast 1-2' distance between you and the BG to bring the weapon up and fire. With a handgun it would be harder for them to get control of the weapon and 100x's easier for you to hold them off with one hand and shoot them effectively with the other.

Most agencies are transitioning over the the AR platform for 3 reasons, initial cost and cost of repair over the MP5 platform, The very high likelyhood of encountering BG's with body armor, or protected by intermediate barriers, and finally it is much easier to train them using 1 gun for all missions than it would be to train with each different weapon platform.

In the end I still believe in a home invasion your best defense would be to dial 911 immediately, secure your family, and hold up in a safe area until the police arive rather than try to play Rambo in your home. As for the old adage "A handgun is only good to fight your way to a rifle" yeah if I was a pilot shotdown behind enemy lines, but in your own home a handgun should more than suffice for ANY situation short of the end of the world.

[halfmoonclip]

I'm drifting away from shotguns for home defense. They look imposing and make one hell of a scary noise being racked, but they are long and unhandy, and the recoil slows down the next shot.
I like the idea of an AR as a housegun, but even a 16" carbine is a little unwieldy. I've drifted to a Beretta Storm carbine, even tho' 9mms aren't as effective as 5.56. With a weapons light and the rear sight folded out of the way, you're good to go.
Moon

[MrMurphy]

A 16" carbine at the shoulder with stock collapsed is the same length as shooting with a pistol with both arms extended, aka Weaver or Mod Iso.

And if you think it's easy to get your hands on someone's rifle and control it from the muzzle end.....
1. What the hell were you doing clearing the house alone?
2. Take a class in rifle fighting. You control 7/8th of the weapon, rip the muzzle in his direction and blow him off the muzzle.

[jem375]

I mainly use a 45ACP in the house by the bedside, and if I used anything else in the house, it would be a shotgun since I am very familiar with it also..

[crazymoose]

I disagree with the shotgun, personally, although I would say it would be the second best weapon in that role.

One of the common misconceptions about the shotgun is that it is great in CQB because you can just aim in the general direction of the enemy and take them out with ease. The truth is, at CQB ranges, the patterns are still very very tight and you do in fact have to aim every shot.

Also, assuming you didn't have to aim because of the spread you would likely lose quite a bit of that power. A shotguns power doesn't comes from the effectiveness of one single pellet, but from the combined effect of 10+ pellets hitting the target together. Almost like a .32 auto hitting you 12 times all at once.

The AR15 shoots faster, more capacity (both of those help when engaging multiple targets), more accurately. Also, my AR15 carbine is shorter than my HD shotgun.

Not as good of stopping power shot for shot with the shotgun, but plenty more shot for shot than a pistol.

Also can defeat most commonly worn types of body armor better than a shotgun or a pistol.

For many years police agencies stayed away from the AR15 for CQB/Entry, etc... thinking that the collateral damage of the .223/5.56 round was worse than that from a shotgun, pistol, or SMG. Now you have agencies like the FBI who are slowly doing away with the MP5's and going to the AR15 carbines.

FBI studies have indicated that over penetration at CQB ranges have been greatly exaggerated and .223 penetrates less in human tissue than most common pistol rounds (including JHP's) on average.

Another thing for me to consider is the amount of trigger time and training I have with an AR15 compared to a shotgun. I am easily the most proficient with my AR15. You must go with the weapon you have the most training and proficiency with, so consider that on a personal basis first and foremost.

Lastly, if the engagement takes you outside, you are equipped to handle targets at ranges far past typical CQB ranges.

I think a shotgun is a great HD weapon, but I wouldn't trade one for my AR15.

+1

My Saiga 12 maybe has the edge in cool factor over my ARs, but I feel that in practical terms the AR has the edge.

[halfmoonclip]

2. Take a class in rifle fighting. You control 7/8th of the weapon, rip the muzzle in his direction and blow him off the muzzle.

A Viet Nam era sergeant of mine had the same theory with a 20" A1; spear 'em on the bayonet, and shoot 'em back off.
I understand the concern tho'; I've read it as an argument for snubguns for defense, with less for the BG to grab.
Moon