RazobackME = LMT

[RazorbackME]

My original plan was to purchase a Colt LE6920. I could get one from Knesek Guns (http://www.knesekguns.com/) for $1283 OTD... which seemed like a fair price.

After doing some research, I found that most folks agree the quality of LMT is very much on par with Colt... not to mention pricing/availability is better. Rainier Arms (http://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/index) had everything I wanted in stock, so this is what I ordered:

16" LMT Upper w/Handguards & Charging handle, $485
LMT Full Auto BCG, $129
LMT Defender 2000 Complete Lower, LEO Marked, Std. Trigger, $355

Rainier was a pleasure to deal with. They charge a flat shipping rate of $6.95 per order. I split this order up over a couple days to avoid the 11% excise tax when purchasing the upper and lower together. So after shipping, the rifle cost me $982.90. I saved $300 by going with LMT. I didn't get a carry handle or magazines, but I planned on going with an Aimpoint/BUIS anyway. I did order 6 PMags at $14.20ea and two 3-pack Ranger Floor Plates for $14.20ea... and still came in $187 cheaper than the Colt.

I feel like I did well, and didn't have to deal with a waiting list. Pictures to follow... I should have everything by early next week.

[K. Foster]

I just did the same thing except I got my LMT lower from a local dealer. I put an Aimpoint ML2 with a Larue mount on it. I got the aimpoint and mount directly from Larue. They are a pleasure to deal with. The guy I talked to, I think his name was Paul, was eager to help in any way he could. They also sent me free stuff, a hat, Dillo Dust meat seasoning and other stuff.

[RMTactical]

LMT rocks. You will be pleased. Eagerly awaiting pics!!

[RazorbackME]

I just did the same thing except I got my LMT lower from a local dealer. I put an Aimpoint ML2 with a Larue mount on it. I got the aimpoint and mount directly from Larue. They are a pleasure to deal with. The guy I talked to, I think his name was Paul, was eager to help in any way he could. They also sent me free stuff, a hat, Dillo Dust meat seasoning and other stuff.

I plan on going with a LaRue mount... did you get the standard or cantilever mount? Also, I don't know much about them, but is there a particular reason you went with the ML2 instead of the ML3? Is battery life the only difference?

I'm also in the market for a nice soft-sided case... any suggestions?

[WolfiePacker]

I plan on going with a LaRue mount... did you get the standard or cantilever mount? Also, I don't know much about them, but is there a particular reason you went with the ML2 instead of the ML3? Is battery life the only difference?

I'm also in the market for a nice soft-sided case... any suggestions?

The LaRue mount is the way to go. The ML3 can be had with a 2moa dot -or- 4moa, the ML2 is only 4moa. I recommend the cantilever mount because you get greater options in where the aimpoint sits on top of the rifle in terms of distance from your face. However if you want absolute cowitness with the aimpoint then get the shorter standard mount. Since my SBR has front and rear flip ups I am going to be getting the shorter mount.

[RazorbackME]

The LaRue mount is the way to go. The ML3 can be had with a 2moa dot -or- 4moa, the ML2 is only 4moa. I recommend the cantilever mount because you get greater options in where the aimpoint sits on top of the rifle in terms of distance from your face. However if you want absolute cowitness with the aimpoint then get the shorter standard mount. Since my SBR has front and rear flip ups I am going to be getting the shorter mount.

I'm relatively new to all this, so please forgive me... absolute co-witness means the dot overlaps the front and rear sight view? And the cantilever mount would give me "lower 1/3 co-witness"? In that the iron sights can be seen through the optic, but are below the red dot?

[WolfiePacker]

I'm relatively new to all this, so please forgive me... absolute co-witness means the dot overlaps the front and rear sight view? And the cantilever mount would give me "lower 1/3 co-witness"? In that the iron sights can be seen through the optic, but are below the red dot?

Cowitness means that if you were to pull up the iron sights on target, the dot would be just barely above the front sight post, so essentially by aiming down one you are also aiming down the other.

Correct on the cantilever, when looking through the irons with that mount you'll be in the lower 1/3 of the aimpoint. The benefit of the extra height is that the irons don't interfere with the dot, another benefit (or draw back depending on the person) is that you have to adjust your head position to from one to the other, raise it for the aimpoint, lower it for the irons.

[RazorbackME]

Cowitness means that if you were to pull up the iron sights on target, the dot would be just barely above the front sight post, so essentially by aiming down one you are also aiming down the other.

Correct on the cantilever, when looking through the irons with that mount you'll be in the lower 1/3 of the aimpoint. The benefit of the extra height is that the irons don't interfere with the dot, another benefit (or draw back depending on the person) is that you have to adjust your head position to from one to the other, raise it for the aimpoint, lower it for the irons.

I think I would like the extra height, but the Aimpoint appears to hover really high above the rail when doing so. I guess I'm comparing them to the more "streamlined" top profile of a gun with an EOTech. My concern is purely cosmetic, but any suggestions on pairing a BUIS that doesn't make the Aimpoint appear to be so far above the rail? Or am I the only one who notices this?

[WolfiePacker]

I think I would like the extra height, but the Aimpoint appears to hover really high above the rail when doing so. I guess I'm comparing them to the more "streamlined" top profile of a gun with an EOTech. My concern is purely cosmetic, but any suggestions on pairing a BUIS that doesn't make the Aimpoint appear to be so far above the rail? Or am I the only one who notices this?

My personal favorite when it comes to all this is an Aimpoint in a low mount that can cowitness with a front and rear flip-up set of irons. That way no matter if I am using irons or optic the way get on the sights is the same and there is no obstruction when I want to use just the optic because the sights fold out of the way. That would give you the "steamlined" look too.

[K. Foster]

RazorbackMe
I got the standard mount as I prefer to have the optic closer to my eye but it doesn’t make that much difference. If you plan to get a magnifier, get the cantilever so the magnifier can sit behind the dot. I went with the ML2 because I wanted the 4moa dot. The brighter the dot the bigger it appears. What that means is I can dial it down to a pinpoint for shooting at distance and dial it up for speed at CQB ranges.

[K. Foster]

My personal favorite when it comes to all this is an Aimpoint in a low mount that can cowitness with a front and rear flip-up set of irons. That way no matter if I am using irons or optic the way get on the sights is the same and there is no obstruction when I want to use just the optic because the sights fold out of the way. That would give you the "steamlined" look too.

While that would be the way to go with a flip up front sight, if you have a fixed front sight, I prefer the lower 1/3 co-witness because you see less of the front sight through the optic but can still use you BUIS.
Just my opinion

[RazorbackME]

I'm having second thoughts on the 16" upper... I don't think I'll ever want a suppressor, so would I be better off with a 14.5" upper with a permanently attached flash hider? Are there any disadvantages to going that route?

[WolfiePacker]

While that would be the way to go with a flip up front sight, if you have a fixed front sight, I prefer the lower 1/3 co-witness because you see less of the front sight through the optic but can still use you BUIS.
Just my opinion

Very true.

[WolfiePacker]

I'm having second thoughts on the 16" upper... I don't think I'll ever want a suppressor, so would I be better off with a 14.5" upper with a permanently attached flash hider? Are there any disadvantages to going that route?

Not really, just that you cant change the flashhider without a ton of work and because of that wont be able to take off the FSB without cutting it off, and could only put a clamp on gas block should you ever decide to go freefloat. But if you plan on keeping it the way it is then there is no down side.

[RazorbackME]

Not really, just that you cant change the flashhider without a ton of work and because of that wont be able to take off the FSB without cutting it off, and could only put a clamp on gas block should you ever decide to go freefloat. But if you plan on keeping it the way it is then there is no down side.

I think I'll keep the 16" upper because I may want to get a free-float one day. The only thing that really bothers me is if I decide to upgrade the flash hider to one that is longer than the A2 (eg. Vortex). I think I would really start to notice the length.

If I want to keep my existing FSB, what length handguard do I need? Perhaps the LaRue LT15-7 (http://stores.homestead.com/Laruetactical/Detail.bok?no=46)?

Tracking just confirmed the lower has arrived at my FFL... I'll pick it up today and post some pictures this evening...

[RazorbackME]

I put the gun together last night and it looks great... didn't get a chance to snap some pictures, but will do that ASAP...

I know it is probably difficult to explain in words, but how much movement should there be between the upper and lower? It is very noticeable on this gun. My friend has a RRA Varmint A4 and you cannot move the upper at all... and his pins are much harder to remove. So which is better?