View Full Version : Army approved optics
maybe a stupid question but i did a search, but wasn't able to come up with anything. is there an approved list of optics a soldier can mount on thier army issued m4? if so where can i view this list? and also what would folks recommend?
background.... my sister is in the army, she will be headed back downrange (tour 2) in october. i didn't worry too much last time because she was legistics in transcorp. this time however the woman in combat arms line is a little more gray, and she signed up for a job that is sure to have her kicking in doors, good for her, but.... i would like to get her a nice optic system for her M4, she wants one too. i don't really have a lot of money to spend, so i will either be selling my beloved XD or 10-6 to fund the balance, i don't really want too..... but i love her to death. i was thinking about trying to take up donations to hook her up with some good gear, but none of the local shops want to help much, they all want to sell me the optics though.
idea just came too me too late, and at a bad time for $$.
anyway, any ideas?
i posted this in optics as well but i know there are a few helpful soldier floating around here too..... thanks
I don't know if the rules have changed since I've been there, it's more than likely going to be decided at the unit level. I know that in two different units a few people I knew put what they wanted on their rifles. I knew one guy how bought a monster sized scope for his M-16 and was allowed to use it. I personally feel that optics that are battery powered are crutches more than anything else. Anyone who has had their M68 or whatever fail when you needed it should agree. If you want to get her an optic I'd go with a Aimpoint, EOTech, or if your a big spender an ACOG (The best choice IMO)
ETA - The best thing honestly would be for her to practice reflexive fire over relying on optics. I did plenty of training for it and it helps.
I don't know if the rules have changed since I've been there, it's more than likely going to be decided at the unit level. I know that in two different units a few people I knew put what they wanted on their rifles. I knew one guy how bought a monster sized scope for his M-16 and was allowed to use it. I personally feel that optics that are battery powered are crutches more than anything else. Anyone who has had their M68 or whatever fail when you needed it should agree. If you want to get her an optic I'd go with a Aimpoint, EOTech, or if your a big spender an ACOG (The best choice IMO)
ETA - The best thing honestly would be for her to practice reflexive fire over relying on optics. I did plenty of training for it and it helps.
i would love to get her an acog, but as it sits I'm $500 away from a cheap one. i could easily enough save $100 a month to go with the 300 i have for her, but that would still leave me 200 shy. she's plenty good without the optics, she qualified expert, can't remember her score. high... i just want her to have the best equipment, she mentioned optics and i thought "what a great come home safe gift" maybe i'll just buy her a vest...
If you haven't already consulted with her, I would, as she might either 1) already have been issued optics, or 2) she won't be allowed to mount anything on her rifle.
When my unit went to iraq, we were all issued Aimpoint M68's, but were NEVER allowed to put them on our weapons! (your tax dollars at work, huh?) They (mainly our idiot 1SG) told us that we couldn't use optics that we hadn't zeroed our rifles on. Makes sense, right? We go to the range to zero, and they make us take the dang things off! I can't for the life of me imagine why our unit blew all that money to issue all 100+ of us brand-new Aimpoints, then make us store them in our wall lockers and use iron sights! I PRAY that your sis's unit isn't as ****ed up as mine.
Don't buy her a vest, she'll have one, and even if you buy her a nicer, better one, I know for a FACT that she won't be able to use it unless she's a secret detachment of Delta force stationed at Area 51 to guard the president's secret squirrel.
If you haven't already consulted with her, I would, as she might either 1) already have been issued optics, or 2) she won't be allowed to mount anything on her rifle.
When my unit went to iraq, we were all issued Aimpoint M68's, but were NEVER allowed to put them on our weapons! (your tax dollars at work, huh?) They (mainly our idiot 1SG) told us that we couldn't use optics that we hadn't zeroed our rifles on. Makes sense, right? We go to the range to zero, and they make us take the dang things off! I can't for the life of me imagine why our unit blew all that money to issue all 100+ of us brand-new Aimpoints, then make us store them in our wall lockers and use iron sights! I PRAY that your sis's unit isn't as ****ed up as mine.
Don't buy her a vest, she'll have one, and even if you buy her a nicer, better one, I know for a FACT that she won't be able to use it unless she's a secret detachment of Delta force stationed at Area 51 to guard the president's secret squirrel.
would it make a difference if she was the CO? she's a Captain, but she will be working directly with iraqi troops, you see the iraqi men can't search the woman when they raid, and they have a lack of woman soldiers, so she will be probably one of 2 or 3 American soldiers in her "unit"
would it make a difference if she was the CO?
It still depends on who's over her, chain of command. I've seen Officers get away with alot more than Enlisted but it still depends on who she reports to. If she's an expert with iron sights I personally would leave it at that. I can understand where your coming from on wanting to get here stuff. If she's in a good unit she shouldn't need much of anything. The Army is issuing updated IBAS in most deploying unit, now so there wouldn't be a need to buy her one. If you do decide to get her some type of optic you'll also need to consider a set of backup sights should the optics fail.
If you haven't already consulted with her, I would, as she might either 1) already have been issued optics, or 2) she won't be allowed to mount anything on her rifle.
When my unit went to iraq, we were all issued Aimpoint M68's, but were NEVER allowed to put them on our weapons! (your tax dollars at work, huh?) They (mainly our idiot 1SG) told us that we couldn't use optics that we hadn't zeroed our rifles on. Makes sense, right? We go to the range to zero, and they make us take the dang things off! I can't for the life of me imagine why our unit blew all that money to issue all 100+ of us brand-new Aimpoints, then make us store them in our wall lockers and use iron sights! I PRAY that your sis's unit isn't as ****ed up as mine.
Don't buy her a vest, she'll have one, and even if you buy her a nicer, better one, I know for a FACT that she won't be able to use it unless she's a secret detachment of Delta force stationed at Area 51 to guard the president's secret squirrel.
Ummmmm...not entirely true that she will NOT be able to use it if she has it. It will be a decision that her chain of command will make based on her level of training with it.
If your 1SG chose not to use the M-68's because you had not been trained on the proper use of them (zeroing is not all the training you need) he made a god decision. I'm sure that was the case.
Also it sounds like you were in a unit that did not have the primary mission of going into harms way and looking for Haji. If you WERE in that kind of unit you would have been trained in the proper use of the equipment and actually used it.
I have had optics on every M-4 that I have had since 1999.
We started with the M-68 with a PEQ-2 and now we have MARS sights with an integrated I.R. laser. I am not impressed with the ACOG. The magnification makes it MUCH harder to hit anything when you are moving. The wobble zone is magnified basically.
Generally if she NEEDS any kind of optic it will be issued.
Yes, women are involved in more combat than in any past conflict, but I'm not so sure she will be assigned to a job where she will be kicking in doors on a regular basis. The only job I can think of where females would do anything like that is an M.P. unit. The original poster said her last job was in logistics and transportation, so unless she reclassed it sounds like she is a supply specialist? Possibly now assigned to an MP unit? That does not sound quite right to me, and I do know a thing or two about current combat ops. MP's are about the most heavily armed muldoons in theater and I KNOW they have opitics on their M-4's.
Save your money and send her care packages instead.
would it make a difference if she was the CO? she's a Captain, but she will be working directly with iraqi troops, you see the iraqi men can't search the woman when they raid, and they have a lack of woman soldiers, so she will be probably one of 2 or 3 American soldiers in her "unit"
I get it now. She's on an MTT team.
I'll still go with my original post and say that she will not need the optics, but if you want to get her an EOTEC then she will be able to use it if she is on a team that size.
Typically MTT teams are 7 or 8 U.S. Soldiers.
Uhmm..what job would have a female kicking down doors?
drew
eta- read further....except in SF Teams, the CO s rarely ever out kicking in doors bro..even if she does go on raids to search any females encountered (again, very rare for a CO), she will not be kicking any doors. She will stay with the cordon or at the staging area until the compount/house/whatever has been secured, and will then be brought up to handle her business...
31B would have the highest chances, I knew a few female 31's that had to clear rooms. I don't think they did the kicking but they were stacked in the line.
MiTT teams don't work like normal units, I was in one. The lowest rank beside me was a SSG (P) we had CPT's as gunners and the MAJ even did it when he had to. It wouldn't be out of the normal in a MiTT team for the a CO to go through a room.
Uhmm..what job would have a female kicking down doors?
drew
eta- read further....except in SF Teams, the CO s rarely ever out kicking in doors bro..even if she does go on raids to search any females encountered (again, very rare for a CO), she will not be kicking any doors. She will stay with the cordon or at the staging area until the compount/house/whatever has been secured, and will then be brought up to handle her business...
you know i am sure you're right, but i liked it better when she was in an air conditioned office in balad. i just want her to be safe and well equiped... ya know. i think eotech is gonna be the way to go, and like gj said, she can pack it as back-up. wish i could send her beer.
31B would have the highest chances, I knew a few female 31's that had to clear rooms. I don't think they did the kicking but they were stacked in the line.
what's 31b?
Military Police
ahh thanks. i know all she has been doing is training on clearing rooms, and taking shots to the face in hand to hand training in VA. i was proud, she bloodied the nose of a 275lb 6'4" tall dude:cool:
Things have changed since my time there but most MiTT teams were being trained out of FT Riley. If she's training out of VA she might be in something else? Now that I think of it if she was a 31B she should be in a PiTT team, not that there's much difference.
Things have changed since my time there but most MiTT teams were being trained out of FT Riley. If she's training out of VA she might be in something else? Now that I think of it if she was a 31B she should be in a PiTT team, not that there's much difference.
What is a PiTT team? I haven't heard that...I've heard of MiTT teams, and I was with a PRT, but PiTT:dunno:?
drew
Okay, a CPT in Iraq is pulling down $5-$6k tax free every month. They have nothing to spend it on. If she wants optics, she can afford what she can use.
MTT's don't spend a lot of time kicking in doors. They do spend a lot of time talking. Get her something that helps her with the language.
A PiTT team is Police Transition Team...it's more or less the same as a MiTT.
Okay, a CPT in Iraq is pulling down $5-$6k tax free every month. They have nothing to spend it on. If she wants optics, she can afford what she can use.
MTT's don't spend a lot of time kicking in doors. They do spend a lot of time talking. Get her something that helps her with the language.
3k-4k. i know she can afford it, i wanted to do something nice for her. and blow me
3k-4k. i know she can afford it, i wanted to do something nice for her. and blow me
Well, when I try to do something nice for my family I don't worry about the cost...
As for the pay issue, base pay for a CPT (with only 4 years in) is $4852/mo. Everybody on my last two tours managed to get $2-$3k more a month in entitlements (BAH, etc) on top of that. All tax free.
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