Shotgun HD slugs

[NG VI]

What are some good slugs for HD? I'm assuming ordinary off-the-shelf slugs are probably aimed more at hunting, do they retain their shape when they impact a target? Are there any shotgun slugs out there that are designed to function more like an outsized pistol bullet? Or am I wrong or irrelevant, does it make much of a difference? I think an expanding .73 caliber slug would be a wondrous thing to behold.

Is there anywhere to get the Triton segmented slugs? I doubt I would ever use them in a pistol but in a shotgun it seems like they would be pretty neat.

Thanks,

Max

[method]

Foster-type slugs, being fairly soft and hollow based, tend to flatten out pretty well.

Check out this page, and scroll down, shows gel results from several shotgun loads, including a few slugs.... http://tacticalshotgun.ca/ballistics_shotgun.html

[Texas357]

What are some good slugs for HD? I'm assuming ordinary off-the-shelf slugs are probably aimed more at hunting, do they retain their shape when they impact a target? Are there any shotgun slugs out there that are designed to function more like an outsized pistol bullet? Or am I wrong or irrelevant, does it make much of a difference? I think an expanding .73 caliber slug would be a wondrous thing to behold.

Is there anywhere to get the Triton segmented slugs? I doubt I would ever use them in a pistol but in a shotgun it seems like they would be pretty neat.

Thanks,

Max

I think with a 12ga slug, expansion isn't all that necessary.
Or are you looking for something with sharp points that spread out on impact like the old 'Talons were supposed to?

At HD range, buckshot won't spread all that much.

[NG VI]

I think with a 12ga slug, expansion isn't all that necessary.
Or are you looking for something with sharp points that spread out on impact like the old 'Talons were supposed to?

At HD range, buckshot won't spread all that much.

I'm just thinking that if a .73 caliber 438 grain slug is great, than a .73 caliber 438 grain slug that tends to double in size like current duty pistol loads do is even greater.

I suppose foster type slugs would be fine, I checked Brassfetcher and they had the Federal slugs which flattened out to about 1.10 caliber, are those a good example of a Foster type slug?

I bought my first shotgun on the 4th, so I don't know a whole lot about shotshells.

[Klebanoff]

Ditto to the fellow above. I see no advantage whatsoever to slugs over buckshot at home defense ranges. Anything that keeps coming after taking a load of 12 gauge buckshot point blank in the chest definitely isn't human and probably won't be stopped by a slug either.

Personally I use No. 1 buckshot for HD. Most people seem to prefer 00, but its larger size results in more empty space between pellets in a 00 shotshell than in a No. 1 shotshell. As a result No. 1 actually delivers more lead to the target.

[vafish]

....Most people seem to prefer 00, but its larger size results in more empty space between pellets in a 00 shotshell than in a No. 1 shotshell. As a result No. 1 actually delivers more lead to the target.

Which weighs more?

1. A pound of lead

2. A pound of feathers


Which Shotgun shell has more lead in it?

1. 12 ga 3" OO Buck

2. 12 ga 3" #4 Buck

3. 12 ga 3" OOO Buck

Actually the #4 buck load does have the most lead in it, but only by about 37 grains.

At typical defense ranges there aren't going to be any big holes in a load of OO buck shot's pattern. They'll all stay in the target at 25 yards or less. And I'll take the bigger, heavier, deeper penetrating pellets of OO buck over #4.

[NG VI]

Just a note, I will almost certainly stick with 00 buck like I have in it now, but I would like to get some slugs to try out and keep available.

[USMC06]

Buckshot spread is about 1" per yard so at 10 yards, you normally get a 10" spread from the average HD shotgun w/ a cylinder bore. In most houses, the average shot would probably be closer than 10 yards. Not a big spread which debunks the mythology that you don't have to aim with a shotgun. You do have to aim and plenty of very knowledgeable people will confirm that.

I use low recoil rounds (buck and slugs) in order to get back on target faster.

[NG VI]

My apartment is very small, I doubt any buck loads would spread to much wider than a 1-11/2" cone for any shots I would have to take inside.

[Preußen]

I keep my 1300 Defender stoked with 11 Aguila Mini-Slugs [385gr @ 1250 FPS], and my 870 loaded with Winchester reduced recoil 00 buck, and Remington RR slugs in the sidesaddle.

any reduced recoil slug will do the job, but for the OP's application, RR buckshot would be a [arguably] better choice

[NG VI]

Where can I find Aguila minis? Also, do they have mini buck?

[fredj338]

I backup mu #4 buckshot loads w/ #00 reduced Buck & 1oz reduced recoil slugs. IMO, there is little advantage to using a slug instead of buckshot.

[NG VI]

Ordered some minis from ATG, a box of 1 and 4 buck and four boxes of minislugs, cause they look neat.

[Preußen]

Ordered some minis from ATG, a box of 1 and 4 buck and four boxes of minislugs, cause they look neat.
Be absolutely certain that they will properly function in your sg before putting them to SD use.

They do not function in my 870

[USMC06]

Where can I find Aguila minis? Also, do they have mini buck?

Several people have reported experiencing problems with the Aguila minis feeding in their shotguns - both pump and auto; especially autos. Before you depend on them for self-defense, ensure they work reliably in your shotgun.

[marvin]

I'm just thinking that if a .73 caliber 438 grain slug is great, than a .73 caliber 438 grain slug that tends to double in size like current duty pistol loads do is even greater.

I suppose foster type slugs would be fine, I checked Brassfetcher and they had the Federal slugs which flattened out to about 1.10 caliber, are those a good example of a Foster type slug?

I bought my first shotgun on the 4th, so I don't know a whole lot about shotshells.

i wish i could find that slug i recovered from a deer i shot a couple of years ago. it was a rem. low recoil foster slug 1 oz at 1250 fps. the slug was on the far side after breaking a rib going in and going out at 20 yards.

the darn thing looked like it turned inside out it was way over an inch. but then i missed placed it, i have all the luck in the world when it comes to lossing things.

[Boris Bush]

Ditto to the fellow above. I see no advantage whatsoever to slugs over buckshot at home defense ranges. Anything that keeps coming after taking a load of 12 gauge buckshot point blank in the chest definitely isn't human and probably won't be stopped by a slug either.

Personally I use No. 1 buckshot for HD. Most people seem to prefer 00, but its larger size results in more empty space between pellets in a 00 shotshell than in a No. 1 shotshell. As a result No. 1 actually delivers more lead to the target.


I love a thinking man! I use Remington #1 buckshot with 16 pellets and it gives me very uniform patterns.

If you use buckshot you realy owe yourself to look at #1 buck. I know OO buck is easy to get and I have butt load of OO buck myself, but I have #1 in the shotgun backedup by 5 more #1s........

I read somewhere that #1 gives you 77% more surface area than 9 OO buck pellets. That is HUGE!!

[isp2605]

i wish i could find that slug i recovered from a deer i shot a couple of years ago. it was a rem. low recoil foster slug 1 oz at 1250 fps. the slug was on the far side after breaking a rib going in and going out at 20 yards.
the darn thing looked like it turned inside out it was way over an inch. but then i missed placed it, i have all the luck in the world when it comes to lossing things.
The slug pictured below was taken from a deer I hit at 35 yds going away from me as she jumped a fence. I hit her just below the tail and a bit to the left. The slug traveled the entire length thru her body cavity and came to rest just under the skin in her lower neck. She ran about 50 yds before piling up. This was a W-W 1 oz foster slug.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c125/ispcapt/guns/2002deer-bulletnose.jpg

In 1988 one of our agents shot a subject who had just killed another agent, shot another, and was attempting to shoot a 3rd. The slug was a W-W 1 oz foster fired from about 30 ft. The subject was sideways to the agent firing the shotgun. It hit the subject in the upper left arm hitting the bone and nearly removing the arm. The slug then entered the chest cavity taking out a rib, traveled thru both lungs, clipped the top of the heart and cut the aorta, took out a rib on the way out of the chest cavity, hit the upper right bicept removing all the muscle from the arm, and the slug then continued on to parts unknown never to be recovered.
I've shot a lot of deer using 12 ga and 20 ga slugs over the past 45 yrs of deer hunting since shotgun is only legal for deer in IL (other than muzzleloader and handgun). A foster type slug performs very well and is more than enough for defense work.

[Natty]

I have also killed many deer hunting in shotgun only counties in MD. When I used foster type slugs (mostly Remington sluggers) they were very devastating rounds on deer. They always flatten out and expand. Most broadside shots will pass thru, unless they hit the shoulder. I also have made running away shots aiming for the butt. These shots penetrate all the way to the neck roast.

Now I have switched to a rifled barrel and sabot rounds because they are more accurate at longer range for deer hunting.

For my home defense 870 I have #1 buckshot 2 3/4" Remington express (16 .30 caliber pellets) in the gun and in the buttstock shell holder.

[NG VI]

Sounds great, I just wasn't sure if ordinary shotgun slugs functioned like hardcast handgun hunting rounds or if they did deform. Thanks all!

[USMC06]

Sounds great, I just wasn't sure if ordinary shotgun slugs functioned like hardcast handgun hunting rounds or if they did deform. Thanks all!

Bottom line: Regardless of what Buckshot or slug you use, it will be devastating on any two legged creature.

[Texas357]

I use Rem. Reduced Recoil buckshot.

If 5 hits with that doesn't give me time to catch my breath and reload, I've got problems that 5 more rounds probably won't solve.

The Aguila shells are interesting, but unless your gun is made for them, (and I mean designed intentionally to prevent the short shell from flipping over inside the receiver), I can not recommend them. I do hear they are good for double-barreled shotguns, as the shorter shell makes it quicker to throw into the chamber in a hurry.

[Mwinter]

www.le.atk.com

This link has answers to a LOT of questions on GT, including the OP's.

Even reduced-recoil buckshot and slugs penetrate more than most folks think, esp. on certain barriers....the ATK website has some good photos of their products doing the business on walls, windows, etc.

Federal's newer Precision Buckshot may be of interest to some HD users. I have yet to see it offered outside of LE distributors, but it'll turn up I'm sure. It's basically your standard 00B payload in a plastic sleeve.....flies like a slug but then busts up into pieces/shot on target.

FYI the Mini-Slugs do not work in any of the Mossberg 500/590 series shotguns I've used.

Also, be careful when slug-shopping....most of the slug designs that expand kinda like a handgun JHP (XTP, Partition Gold, etc.) are designed for use only in rifled slug barrels. From a smoothbore/standard 12ga barrel they will often keyhole, exhibit poor accuracy, penetrate without expanding, etc.

[SIGShooter]

I have been using Winchester Ranger RR buckshot and slugs for a while now. I tested out some of the Remington Express buckshot and the Sluggers. I found that the buckshot of the Remington has about the same recoil as the Rangers. The slugs were a little harder but shot recovery was the same amount of time. Shot recovery for the buckshot were also the same.

The patterns of the Rangers and the Rems were almost identical. The Rem slugs were a little tighter on the groups than the Rangers. However, it was really close.

I can't find a better deal than the 15 round packs at wal-mart either. I believe I pay 10.80 for 15 Buckshot and 8.97 for the sluggers for 15.

[marvin]

The slug pictured below was taken from a deer I hit at 35 yds going away from me as she jumped a fence. I hit her just below the tail and a bit to the left. The slug traveled the entire length thru her body cavity and came to rest just under the skin in her lower neck. She ran about 50 yds before piling up. This was a W-W 1 oz foster slug.

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c125/ispcapt/guns/2002deer-bulletnose.jpg

In 1988 one of our agents shot a subject who had just killed another agent, shot another, and was attempting to shoot a 3rd. The slug was a W-W 1 oz foster fired from about 30 ft. The subject was sideways to the agent firing the shotgun. It hit the subject in the upper left arm hitting the bone and nearly removing the arm. The slug then entered the chest cavity taking out a rib, traveled thru both lungs, clipped the top of the heart and cut the aorta, took out a rib on the way out of the chest cavity, hit the upper right bicept removing all the muscle from the arm, and the slug then continued on to parts unknown never to be recovered.
I've shot a lot of deer using 12 ga and 20 ga slugs over the past 45 yrs of deer hunting since shotgun is only legal for deer in IL (other than muzzleloader and handgun). A foster type slug performs very well and is more than enough for defense work.

oh yea, thats what it looked like, but maybe a little flatter. we have the same laws in indiana. few deer go very far when hit in a good spot with a foster slug

[Berto]

I've seen recovered Foster slugs that were over an inch in expanded diameter and shaped like a donut from the center being punched out.
They definately flatten, at least.

[isp2605]

oh yea, thats what it looked like, but maybe a little flatter. we have the same laws in indiana. few deer go very far when hit in a good spot with a foster slug

This one never hit any substantial bone. I've recovered others like you said that flatten out more but I can't find those now. I agree with you about the foster. For being such a simple design it works extremely well. I've gone to shooting sabots, not because they perform any better but because I get a bit more range from sabots. If I know I'm going to be hunting close brush I have no problems putting on the 18" barrel and loading with fosters.
I've also killed quite a few deer with Brennekes and out of my 18" and they work very well too.
The only slugs I haven't liked are Remingtons. They just won't group out of my 870 with 18". W-W or Brennekes shoot like a rifle running 3 shots touching at 50 yds. With Remingtons it won't keep them on an 11"X14" sheet of paper at 50. That gun just doesn't like Remingtons.

[Glock17JHP]

For HD...

Indoors, use 00 Buck 12-pellet Winchester Supreme XX 2 3/4 Magnum...

If the scumbag or his pal manages to get out side and into their getaway car... break out the Brenneke 'Heavy Short Field Magnum' 2 3/4 1 1/4 ounce slugs...

[BrokenArrow]

Info from Winchester, bare gel penetration at 25 yds:

1 oz slug/full power, 12.4 inches
1 oz slug/reduced recoil, 18.6

00 buck/full power, 15.8
00 buck/reduced recoil, 15.7

Info from Doc Roberts, bare gel:

Rem 1 oz slug/full power(1434 fps), 26.4 inches/.85 caliber
Rem 00 buck/full power, 22.8 inches/NA

[NG VI]

1 oz slug/full power, 12.4 inches
1 oz slug/reduced recoil, 18.6

Interesting... I guess lower velocity really can lead to greater penetration.

[Allman]

FWIW and IMO,

The closer the range a shotgun is likely to be used at, the smaller the shot needed. Slugs are not the best choice for indoor defense, particularly in an apartment setting. #4 Buck is great for closer indoor ranges, lead BB will devastate someone at most apartment across the room ranges (as in removing arms, legs or most of the flesh from same in average sized opponents with a direct hit).

Keep in mind what Cheney did to that lawyer with a 28 gauge and some bird shot and how hard it is to get rid of a lawyer as well.

In any event, does anyone recall that SD LE shotgun bullpup thing that had the spreader on it? Can't remember who made it and haven't seen one in years. Wondering if anyone still makes a spreader for shotguns that can be retro'd to a Mossberg?

[method]

I don't think spreader chokes work, which is why they're non-existent. Even if they did work, I personally wouldn't find them desirable for home defense.