When did it stop being okay to call a CWO Chief? [Archive] - Glock Talk

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deadday
07-23-2008, 14:16
Was walking out of the hospital today (in civies) as a CW3 was walking in...He had a 4/7 Cav DUI on his beret so I said 'Morning Chief, Garry Owen' and he proceeded to rip my ass for calling him Chief....Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over?






drew

matsig
07-23-2008, 14:31
That is odd. My only thoughts are some people are just jerks.

GJ1981
07-23-2008, 15:03
WO's tend to be weird IMO, I remember one addressing himself as Mister. It sounds like he was just being a dick honestly, most soldiers always called WO's Chief. I personally treated them the same as a regular officer when I was in, not to much they could complain about then.

Tennessee Slim
07-23-2008, 15:42
Way back when I was in, Aviation Warrants would bristle at being called "Chief". "You see any feathers on me, Troop??!!" Definitely a no-no with Marine Warrants (wouldn't want to be confused with a lowly Navy chief).

deadday
07-23-2008, 16:12
Way back when I was in, Aviation Warrants would bristle at being called "Chief". "You see any feathers on me, Troop??!!" Definitely a no-no with Marine Warrants (wouldn't want to be confused with a lowly Navy chief).

He was aviation...I ..I've never had any issues before...maybe he was just having a ****ty day...:dunno:






drew

nothing
07-23-2008, 17:51
A friend of mine went from being an MI Warrant to in Infantry LT. I had to laugh when he had his ass torn out of frame by a COW (crusty old warrant) for calling him chief one day. The COW didn't want to hear anything about the LT being a CW2 in his former life. I guess a few of them are just really anal.

slyjackalope
07-23-2008, 18:01
He was aviation...I ..I've never had any issues before...maybe he was just having a ****ty day...:dunno:

drew

In the JAG Corps, we commonly refer to a warrant officer as "chief." However, I had a fellow attorney (and former Army pilot) at JAOBC who told me that Army aviation warrant officers don't like being referred to as "chief."

deadday
07-23-2008, 21:00
In the JAG Corps, we commonly refer to a warrant officer as "chief." However, I had a fellow attorney (and former Army pilot) at JAOBC who told me that Army aviation warrant officers don't like being referred to as "chief."

I've never encountered a CWO that had a problem with until today....Maybe he was just having a ****ty day...:dunno:






drew

MrMurphy
07-24-2008, 00:59
I'm Air Force, but I grew up around the Army and always heard the aviation WOs referred to as chief.

We have some Army aviators here at my base (couple dozen) and I always call the warrants Chief and salute them at the gate.

They've never even given me a hard look about it. Weird.

Sigma40
07-24-2008, 02:12
In the Marines, you just call them Sir and life will be tolerable.

Sam White
07-24-2008, 02:16
Most warrants I've met have been technicans, fwiw. But I've always called them Chief and never had a problem.

Hal9mm
07-25-2008, 08:18
there are too many people in the military who take themselves too damn seriously. Yeah your a CWO, it doesn't make u a god!

OH IIRC, WO's should be referred to as MR. Sir is reserved only for commissioned officers.

norton
07-25-2008, 08:27
Question for you military guys.
What is the point in the Warrant officer ranking?
Is it a higher rank then lieutenant?

rhikdavis
07-25-2008, 08:27
I've heard Navy Warrants called ...drum roll....'warrants'....

Fred Hansen
07-25-2008, 09:24
I've heard Navy Warrants called ...drum roll....'warrants'....In the Naval ordinance rates we called them "Gunner". AFAIK they would have felt disrespected by us had we called them anything else... with perhaps the exception of extremely formal occasions.


:dunno:

MrMurphy
07-25-2008, 10:26
Warrants are technical specialists. Back in the day (pre-60s) they were generally senior NCOs who were extremely good at one particular job, and they were made warrants as sort of a reward. Most officer privileges and pay, without command.

Around the time of Vietnam the Army realized it was going to need a LOT of helo pilots and could not afford that many officers (messed up manning, etc) plus many of them would end up fighting over the same command positions. Yet, they had a lot of guys who wanted to fly (and nothing else) yet not get treated like dirt.

So they made most pilots warrant officers. You get saluted, good pay, officer housing and all that, and all they want you to do is what you want to do (fly). A few officers in the unit to handle command-side stuff (unit commander, exec, etc).

Not sure how the Navy does things but it's probably the more traditional setup (though I've heard, because of a shortage of pilots who want to fly patrol planes, helos, etc and also suffer through the officer BS, they are going to start having warrant pilots).

Air Force no longer has warrant officers. Not sure about the Marines, I think they have Master Gunners ?

slyjackalope
07-25-2008, 18:33
Question for you military guys.
What is the point in the Warrant officer ranking?
Is it a higher rank then lieutenant?

MrMurphy pretty much gave the rundown on the Army aviation warrant officers. There are warrant officers in most of the other Army branches and almost all of them are prior enlisted. You generally have to be squared away with a number of years in the Army before you can even apply to be a warrant officer. Warrant officers are specialists in their field and receive a commission once they reach CW2.

Army chief warrant officers (CW2 - CW5) have almost all of the privileges and responsibilities of regular commissioned officers and may exercise command (though they usually don't). However, even a second lieutenant outranks a CW5.

In the Army JAG Corps, warrant officers are legal administrators, with the closest civilian parallel being a law office manager.

rangerruck
07-27-2008, 01:45
much of the above may be true, but if you have a dude who is cw3 or better, and in some type of materiel, or other critical needs area, he knows he has got a lot of pull. A good cw3 or higher, can make a Colonel cry if he really wants to.

GreenBeret1631
07-27-2008, 17:06
WO's now serve as the XO on SF ODAs. SF no longer uses 1st Lt.'s as XO's on the teams. ;)

SAWMAN
07-27-2008, 17:53
......has no W.O. pilots that I know of. They once had enlisted pilots,usually E-7 thru E-9. They did not rate a salute.....BUT.....a heck of a lot of respect.

E-7's are sometimes offered Warrent Officer for SpecOps(NSW) and EOD. I have also known E-8's and 9's that turned down 2nd Lt. for the W.O program.

Also some E-7's are put into the "Gunner" program. They are given a commission and are in charge of air launched weapons on ships and aircraft squadrons.

A US Navy Warrent Officer is godlike. He is usually a crusty ol' bast*** that wont take crap off anybody.

If he is attached to NSW he is usually far senior to "GOD". He can(and does) walk on water,his stuff doesn't even start to stink,he has eyes in the back of his head,and can very easily read minds. He is somewhat mystical,and it is a given that he can(and does) perform majic.

He can,with ease,make a O-5 wimper like a baby.

If a Navy W.O. is in a somewhat(yeah,right) good mood, it is acceptable to simply call them "Warrent". This, if used in conjunction with "good morning or good evening". Call him "chief" and .......well.......!!

Tennessee Slim
07-27-2008, 20:49
To further confuse the matter, the Navy and the Marines have Limited Duty Officers. LDOs are -- best I can figure -- something like a commissioned warrant officer (yeah, I realize that's an oxymoron). They're former enlisted men who've been commissioned (as opposed to warranted) to serve as a technical expert. Also AFAIK, LDOs are not the same as a "maverick", which is a former enlisted man who took a warrant or a commission but serves as a "line officer" and has to go head-to-head against the ring knockers.

chuckman
08-06-2008, 10:55
Marines have WOs. Called Warrant Officer or Gunner (there is a difference between the two). The Navy's WOs are called Warrant Officer. They are usually a fountain of institutional knowledge and history. Re: Navy pilots, as far as I know no current WO pilots, but there is a program for enlisted folks to become pilots.

RoyG
08-06-2008, 15:37
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warrant_Officer_(United_States)

CJStudent
08-07-2008, 06:06
The few I've run across in the Guard have always just been called "Chief". :dunno:

eisman
08-07-2008, 16:31
"You see any feathers on me, Troop??!!"
My normal reply is, "Nope, looks more like chicken ****." Of course, it's been a while since I had to use it.

(There may be a few Warrant Officers around, but only one CSM.)

the iceman
08-08-2008, 01:10
This is like calling a 1SG "Top." I wouldn't do it!

Bren
08-09-2008, 18:13
OH IIRC, WO's should be referred to as MR. Sir is reserved only for commissioned officers.
Warant officers are addressed as "sir" when spoken to, and saluted, same as officers - when referred to in the third person you would say "Mister Smith" like you would say "Captain Smith."

Tx-G30
08-10-2008, 02:05
Was walking out of the hospital today (in civies) as a CW3 was walking in...He had a 4/7 Cav DUI on his beret so I said 'Morning Chief, Garry Owen' and he proceeded to rip my ass for calling him Chief....Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over?


hmm... in my days, I've dealt with WOs in maint, avaition and in the medical services and never had anyone of them say anything to my addressing them as "chief" as long as I saluted them and did what they told me to do... Being addressed as "chief" is like addressing a platoon leader as "LT" rather then as "lieutenant".

chuckman
08-11-2008, 09:49
Warant officers are addressed as "sir" when spoken to, and saluted, same as officers - when referred to in the third person you would say "Mister Smith" like you would say "Captain Smith."

I know this is an Army forum, and my knowledge of Army etiquette is nil. In the Navy, they used to call officers "Mister," but went away from that, I think, in the 80s. We do call WOs sir, though.

uashooter
08-11-2008, 14:22
Warrants are almost always called Warrant (with some exceptions depending on their job- Gunner, Bos'un, etc).

Navy 'Chiefs' are E7-E9, so you'd never call a Warrant 'Chief.'

Mister is used to refer to junior commissioned officers...O1/O2 usually. I wouldn't be caught dead calling a Warrant 'Mister.'

*For the guy asking about the purpose of Warrants...they are technical experts in their respective fields. The idea is that they know way more about their job than an officer, so it's easier to just make them an officer than it is to train an officer to do their job. An LT still outranks a WO though.

**FYI, the Navy does have Warrant Officer aviators now, I believe the first of them just stated flight school about a year ago.

RONSTAR
08-15-2008, 15:33
Gary owen man those were the days. 4/7 still at Camp Hovey.

deadday
08-15-2008, 15:58
Gary owen man those were the days. 4/7 still at Camp Hovey.

They were 3 years ago when I left, but I'm sure you've heard the Army is dumping everything North of Osan, and eventually, dumping everything in Korea...







drew

RONSTAR
08-15-2008, 16:13
They were 3 years ago when I left, but I'm sure you've heard the Army is dumping everything North of Osan, and eventually, dumping everything in Korea...
I heard rumors about that. Tdc is gonna go out of buisness. those poor juicy girls lol

nursetim
08-15-2008, 16:29
They were 3 years ago when I left, but I'm sure you've heard the Army is dumping everything North of Osan, and eventually, dumping everything in Korea...







drew

Is this a unit rotation, or are we pulling out of Korea? God I hope we pull out.

RONSTAR
08-15-2008, 16:42
Is this a unit rotation, or are we pulling out of Korea? God I hope we pull out.
No not a unit rotation Korea is a duty station you do your year and go unless you AIP what hes saying is permanent.

deadday
08-15-2008, 18:23
Is this a unit rotation, or are we pulling out of Korea? God I hope we pull out.


We are in the process of removing 8th Army from Korea. I'm not sure about the AF, but the Army is closing shop and pulling south, either decommissioning the Camps or turning them over to the Koreans..Last I heard, they wanting nothing North of Osan....




drew

Srben
08-15-2008, 19:19
Was walking out of the hospital today (in civies) as a CW3 was walking in...He had a 4/7 Cav DUI on his beret so I said 'Morning Chief, Garry Owen' and he proceeded to rip my ass for calling him Chief....Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over? drew

Maybe he was a certified Glock armorer and took offense...:wavey:

deadday
08-15-2008, 20:38
Maybe he was a certified Glock armorer and took offense...:wavey:

:dunno:







drew.

xxiv
08-17-2008, 21:25
Salute and say "All the way", crisis averted.

60Pilot
08-22-2008, 08:20
I'm a warrant (153D UH 60 pilot) and actually flew over Gerry Owen the other day. It is closed now, there are no 58s left in Korea.

Now as for why he chewed you *** for calling him Chief. Most of us don't have an issue with it, but a few aviator warrants don't like to be called chief because that is what we call our crew chiefs (15T). Crew chiefs are enlisted soldiers and most are E-4 and below as the NCO 15Ts are the non-rated crew member instructors, so some warrants see it as degrading to be called Chief.

The actual title for a warrant officer is Mr. last name or Miss. last name.

deadday
08-22-2008, 10:15
I'm a warrant (153D UH 60 pilot) and actually flew over Gerry Owen the other day. Is is closed now, there are no 58s left in Korea.

Now as for why he chewed you *** for calling him Chief. Most of us don't have an issue with it, but a few aviator warrants don't like to be called chief because that is what we call our crew chiefs (15T). Crew chiefs are enlisted soldiers and most are E-4 and below as the NCO 15Ts are the non-rated crew member instructors, so some warrants see it as degrading to be called Chief.

The actual title for a warrant officer is Mr. last name or Miss. last name.

GO closed in 05 right after I got there....We moved 4/7 over to Hovey...





drew

AH-1
08-23-2008, 20:43
I'm a warrant (153D UH 60 pilot) and actually flew over Gerry Owen the other day. It is closed now, there are no 58s left in Korea.

Now as for why he chewed you *** for calling him Chief. Most of us don't have an issue with it, but a few aviator warrants don't like to be called chief because that is what we call our crew chiefs (15T). Crew chiefs are enlisted soldiers and most are E-4 and below as the NCO 15Ts are the non-rated crew member instructors, so some warrants see it as degrading to be called Chief.

The actual title for a warrant officer is Mr. last name or Miss. last name.


when I was in it was always yes sir no sir or "mr" baker ect.I had the highest respect for the w.o's and would "let" them fly or borrow my acft just don't bring it back broke:cool:.
pete

RoyG
08-23-2008, 21:59
It's Garry Owen NOT Gerry Owen...

deadday
08-23-2008, 22:39
It's Garry Owen NOT Gerry Owen...

That's what I typed...:dunno:






drew

Avenger069
09-07-2008, 17:04
I am a signal warrant officer. As others have mentioned here warrants are addressed as Mr./Mrs. We can also be addressed as sir/ma'am. Unofficially CW2s and higher can be addressed as Chief. However, I would recommend only using this method with warrants you know or are familiar with (like using top for a 1SG). You can call me Chief anytime and I won't dog you out.

S&WM&PAR15T&G34
09-13-2008, 15:11
ALso you will find CWO in US Army CID. You will not call them Chief. Those tha know them call them Mr. or Special Agent.

HogGlocker
09-15-2008, 13:52
Always call em Cheif.....and I am around a few Army Aviation WO.

Dean
09-15-2008, 16:14
Never wanted to be any kind of a commissioned officer once I saw what it was*. I dropped out of college ROTC right before the big dotted line so I didn't have to.
It's fine to be a Warrant Officer, but I wouldn't care what people called me. I've been called everything from "Attendant" to "Mister PO-leece." I answered to it all and got along just fine. :drillsgt:




*To me, being a Lieutenant looked too much like an ice cream licking contest to suit me, with everybody kissing up just to be able to stay in the service. In the Army I disliked the idea of lying to men and ordering them to their certain death - something an Army officer may have to do. In the Coast Guard I wanted little to do with the office POG paper pushing officers.