Ok - you Fusion owners - Help me!

[ShipWreck]

There is a Fusion bobtail I saw a pic of and REALLY like. I made some changes to it, and got a price quote from Fusion.

For around $1700, I can get the pistol shown below with the following changes -- serrations on the rear of the slide, flat top slide with serrations, Novak trijicons (instead of the sights shown in the pic) and checkering on the bobtail (instead of it being flat)....

That's a great deal. However, I'm trying to weigh the Fusion, against an Ed Brown bobtail (which does not have the flatop slide or rear slide serrations), a Nighthawk Talon (which I cannot afford to hard chrome, so I wouldn't be getting my first color choice) or a Springfield Pro (which - I really don't want an all black pistol, and there is no flattop slide or rear slide serrations)...

All of the other guns are also $2200-$2500 or so. That makes the Fusion prices VERY nicely (nice enough that I may have cash for another gun sooner). And, the Fusion would have every feature I would want (minus hard chrome - but the stainless finish is close enough)...

However - Fusion is rather new.

You Fusion owners - how do you compare your Fusion 1911s to some of those brands I mentioned above? Do any of you own a Fusion AND an Ed Brown/Springfield Pro/Nighthawk?

http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/1466/jp1cbobssst8.jpg

[bac1023]

There is a Fusion bobtail I saw a pic of and REALLY like. I made some changes to it, and got a price quote from Fusion.

For around $1700, I can get the pistol shown below with the following changes -- serrations on the rear of the slide, flat top slide with serrations, Novak trijicons (instead of the sights shown in the pic) and checkering on the bobtail (instead of it being flat)....

That's a great deal. However, I'm trying to weigh the Fusion, against an Ed Brown bobtail (which does not have the flatop slide or rear slide serrations), a Nighthawk Talon (which I cannot afford to hard chrome, so I wouldn't be getting my first color choice) or a Springfield Pro (which - I really don't want an all black pistol, and there is no flattop slide or rear slide serrations)...

All of the other guns are also $2200-$2500 or so. That makes the Fusion prices VERY nicely (nice enough that I may have cash for another gun sooner). And, the Fusion would have every feature I would want (minus hard chrome - but the stainless finish is close enough)...

However - Fusion is rather new.

You Fusion owners - how do you compare your Fusion 1911s to some of those brands I mentioned above? Do any of you own a Fusion AND an Ed Brown/Springfield Pro/Nighthawk?



Shipwreck,

I love my Fusion. I have the Custom Commander Elite. That I bought new for $1195 last year. The gun actually was $1295, but I won an auction on GB for $100 less. Bob Serva was selling some of his new guns online to promote the then brand new company. Anyway, its not a bobtail, but it does have a nice magwell included. It came with a nice set of exotic spalted maple grips too. ;)

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_1066.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_1064.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_1063.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_1067.jpg

[ShipWreck]

What kinda groups does it get?

[bac1023]

All that said, Fusion is NOT on the level of Ed Brown, Nighthawk, or Springfield Custom. You may be able to get more features for less money with Fusion, but as good as they are, the other three simply out class Fusion with better fit and finish, fitting, nicer triggers, and just overall better quality. Again, that's not taking anything away from Fusion, its just that the others are that good.

Here's my Fusion flanked by an Ed Brwon Kobra Carry and Nighthawk Predator II. The Predator is the same as the Talon, but has the special barrel.

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_1070.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_1069.jpg



Here's my Springfield TGO1, which is Springfield's best 1911. Its basically a Pro, with a better finish and some target shooting upgrades.

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0636.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0634.jpg

All three are really a couple steps above Fusion on the 1911 pecking order.

[ShipWreck]

Man, those are nice...

Yes, this will be my once in a lifetime 1911 - I do not have the funds to develop the collection that you have - wow.

Betwene teh Ed Brown and the Nighthawk - which do you prefer?

I wish Nighthawk did guns in Stainless.... Oh well...

I WISH the Ed Brown Kobra came with a flattop slide...

I eliminated RRA after what I have read.

So, if I cut out Fusion, then its down to a Kobra, a Nighthawk Talon 1 or a Kobra Karry... The Kobra is the cheapest of the 3 and the easiest for me to afford...

[bac1023]

Man, those are nice...

Yes, this will be my once in a lifetime 1911 - I do not have the funds to develop the collection that you have - wow.

Betwene teh Ed Brown and the Nighthawk - which do you prefer?

I wish Nighthawk did guns in Stainless.... Oh well...

I WISH the Ed Brown Kobra came with a flattop slide...

I eliminated RRA after what I have read.

So, if I cut out Fusion, then its down to a Kobra, a Nighthawk Talon 1 or a Kobra Karry... The Kobra is the cheapest of the 3 and the easiest for me to afford...

Thanks.

Shipwreck, since you brought up RRA, why did you cut them out? Believe it or not, I actually like them better than NH or EB. I've got the Limited Match, and its one hell of a full size 1911, with every option you could want and 1.5" accuracy guarentee. I'd put it well above the Kobra or Talon.

If its a once in a lifetime 1911, forget Fusion, and go with one of the elite semi custom manufacturers. This includes, but is not limited to, Les Baer, Ed Brown, Wilson, Springfield Custom, Nighthawk, RRA, etc...

As far as stainless vs carbon steel is concerned, carbon is actually the better of the two for a 1911. Stainless is a softer material and 1911s with the highest degree of guarenteed accuracy, such as RRA's and Baer's 1.5" groups at 50 yards will always be carbon steel. Stainless is simply too soft for that kind of accuracy. Plus, I'll take hard chrome, Black T, or Robar on carbon steel over stainless any day. Of course, finishes like that are more expensive.

If you want a Kobra, you can't go wrong with it. Its an outstanding 1911 and Ed Brown has one of the best fit and finishes in the industry.

As far as Nighthawk vs. Ed Brown, they are different, but I can't say I like one over the other.

If you want a classy, extremely well built 1911 with every feature and an accuracy guarentee that matches the best in the industry, look no further than the RRA Limited Match. Its their flagship 1911, and, IMHO, the BEST 1911 under $3k and also better then most over that. You want a flat, serrated top, it has it, along with an oversized mag release, trigger guard checkering, rear slide checkering, a Kart barrel, magwell, ambi safety, two piece guide rod, an amazing trigger (better than EB or NH), and just an incredible look. Its one of my favorite three 1911s in my entire collection.

The model in the link is hard chromed, but mine has the optional Black T that RRA also offers for the same price as HC.

http://rockriverarms.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_id=345

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0709.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0716.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0707.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0718.jpg

[ShipWreck]

Actually - I was going to go with that model - but ask if they could put fixed novak sights, and slightly loosen the bushing a bit (I heard people claim it was so, super tight - and I'd rather be able to take it off with ust my hands)). I love the hard chromed model in the catelog too - and other than paying for the hard chrome, and $50 more for serrations on the back of the slide (my catelog doesn't show this as included) - The price is great.

But on the 1911 forums, I read so many negatives about their customer service, and the problems people had on getting their guns fixed. Many don't trust them anymore, and some have gotten ri of 1 or 2 RRAs...

I know that it is easier to throw out complaints than happy comments - but after spending a few days combing thru all past posts - I wasn't too happy with what I read....

Monday - I'm gonna go grab a Kobra that is at my local shop, and look at it again... I wanna see if I still like the feeling of a bobtail in my hand...

I already have a MC Operator by Springfield, and have owned several Springfields in the past. While the Pro sounds aweomes - I kinda want to buy something from a custom brand - instead of just saying I have a "Springfield." Ya know...

I had waivered back and forth over the Fusion. I guess I'll eliminate them.

The Nighthawk Dominator is sweet, and has just about everything I would wannt. But that $ amount is really getting too high

[bac1023]

Actually - I was going to go with that model - but ask if they could put fixed novak sights, and slightly loosen the bushing a bit (I heard people claim it was so, super tight - and I'd rather be able to take it off with ust my hands)). I love the hard chromed model in the catelog too - and other than paying for the hard chrome, and $50 more for serrations on the back of the slide (my catelog doesn't show this as included) - The price is great.

But on the 1911 forums, I read so many negatives about their customer service, and the problems people had on getting their guns fixed. Many don't trust them anymore, and some have gotten ri of 1 or 2 RRAs...

I know that it is easier to throw out complaints than happy comments - but after spending a few days combing thru all past posts - I wasn't too happy with what I read....

Monday - I'm gonna go grab a Kobra that is at my local shop, and look at it again... I wanna see if I still like the feeling of a bobtail in my hand...

I already have a MC Operator by Springfield, and have owned several Springfields in the past. While the Pro sounds aweomes - I kinda want to buy something from a custom brand - instead of just saying I have a "Springfield." Ya know...

I had waivered back and forth over the Fusion. I guess I'll eliminate them.

The Nighthawk Dominator is sweet, and has just about everything I would wannt. But that $ amount is really getting too high

I always thought the rear checkering was standard, unless it changed. Mine has it and I didn't add it to the order.

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0708.jpg

[bac1023]

Its a shame RRA got a bad rap from their customer service. I personally never had a problem with them, but then never had a problem with my gun either.

I've handled the Dominator before and its actually on my list of a few 1911s I still want. They do cost a good amount, almost as much as the Predator.

Still, its my opinion that the Limited Match is a nicer pistol than the Dominator at a slightly lesser price. RRA just has an extremely solid feel, similar to Les Baer. Yes, it is extremely tight at first, but parts such as the bushing will loosen up somewhat.

I really recommend RRA, as you can see, I'm a big fan.

[ShipWreck]

I always thought the rear checkering was standard, unless it changed. Mine has it and I didn't add it to the order.

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0708.jpg

Nice - in the current catelog - it doesn't seem to be listed...

My local shop has a Talon, a Kobra and a Dominator - I'm gonna go look tomorrow to see if that helps me make up my mind.

I really wish the Springfield Professional had a flat top and/or rear slide chckering.

Part of the problem is that the 2 191 websites don't have as many RRA owners as compared to the other brands. So, traffic in those sections is lower. But, that also makes the % of complaints much higher... That's what bothers me...

[bac1023]

Part of the problem is that the 2 191 websites don't have as many RRA owners as compared to the other brands. So, traffic in those sections is lower. But, that also makes the % of complaints much higher... That's what bothers me...

Shipwreck, they do not build as many 1911s as Wilson, Baer, and some others. Plus, they pretty much just build them per order. Likewise, they aren't in stores for purchase and not as many have them. I kind of like that, actually. :)

[ShipWreck]

I have still been looking at Fusion recently - but I am undecided.

I priced a 9mm stainless bobtail with exactly what I want... Serations on the top of the slide and back of the slide - It's about $1800 with the caliber conversion (45 switched to 9mm)and ambi safety. I need to ask them if it could be hard chromed - if so, then it would probably be around $2k.

Now, I might get a 9mm NightHawk. However - I have to make some sacrifices. The same gun by Nighthawk (bobtailed, hard chrome 9mm) is $3k!!!

Now, the Nighthawk would be sweet - however, I will probably only be able to get a 5" standard Nighthawk in 9mm. The caliber conversion is an extra $200, and I'm not sure I can swing the extra $300 they charge for hard chroming...

$1k more is a lot. I can't spend $3k on a gun in good conscience.... That's just ridiculous....

So, I'm left with - buy the NH not quite what I would REALLY want - or get a gun that has everything I want. But, the brand could be a bit of an unknown.

I wouldn't compare a Dan Wesson 1911 against a Nighthawk. Fusion is made by the guy who used to own Dan Wesson. Is Fusion a step above a Dan Wesson?

[bac1023]

I have still been looking at Fusion recently - but I am undecided.

I priced a 9mm stainless bobtail with exactly what I want... Serations on the top of the slide and back of the slide - It's about $1800 with the caliber conversion (45 switched to 9mm)and ambi safety. I need to ask them if it could be hard chromed - if so, then it would probably be around $2k.

Now, I might get a 9mm NightHawk. However - I have to make some sacrifices. The same gun by Nighthawk (bobtailed, hard chrome 9mm) is $3k!!!

Now, the Nighthawk would be sweet - however, I will probably only be able to get a 5" standard Nighthawk in 9mm. The caliber conversion is an extra $200, and I'm not sure I can swing the extra $300 they charge for hard chroming...

$1k more is a lot. I can't spend $3k on a gun in good conscience.... That's just ridiculous....

So, I'm left with - buy the NH not quite what I would REALLY want - or get a gun that has everything I want. But, the brand could be a bit of an unknown.

I wouldn't compare a Dan Wesson 1911 against a Nighthawk. Fusion is made by the guy who used to own Dan Wesson. Is Fusion a step above a Dan Wesson?

Fusion is a step above the standard Dan Wesson models, but the new premium DW Valor is on par with Fusion, IMO.

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0581.jpg




As far as Nighthawk is concerned, I plan to buy a second early next year, probably the new Enforcer.

I have a hard chrome bobtail Predator II as my only Nighthawk right now.

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0691-1.jpg

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/000_0230.jpg

[ShipWreck]

Well, I really want a hard chromed Talon 2 bobtail in 9mm. But, that's a small fortune.

I looked at some close up Fusion pics more closely today - one had NO blending of a magwell at all. I compared that with the NH - and obviously the NH is better.

I could see up to $1200 on a Fusion. What I speced out thru Fusion, hard chromed is $2k. I'm not sure a Fusion is work $2k afterall... It's kinda hard too - because its not like I can wonder into a local shop and look at similar Fusions in person. I CAN do that with NHs....

[gconan]

Well, I really want a hard chromed Talon 2 bobtail in 9mm. But, that's a small fortune.

I actualy got to shoot one once and it was really nice. Still, if I ordered one it would be in 45, although the owner reported total reliability with the 9mm.

I CAN do that with NHs....

You are very fortunate for that. I have only seen 2 in person, by the owner and not a shop.

[bac1023]

I plan on getting a new Enforcer next year. I love the look of it and the features it has. Its the old Vickers Tactical.

http://www.nighthawkcustom.com/detail.aspx?ID=161

I'll get the entire gun with the hard chrome option. I don't like NH's Perma Kote black finish. Plus, hard chrome will look awesome on that baby. I may even do away with the front serrations. The Browning cuts look better without front serrations.

For grips, I'm not sure yet, but it will be one of these two. They are different, but both will look great on a hard chromed Enforcer.

Cocobolo with silver inlays

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/nh-cbsi_1_xl.jpg



...or black Nighthawk Alumigrips.

http://i319.photobucket.com/albums/mm479/briancutillo/gr-g-01_1_xl.jpg

[Supercharger]

Have you considered a DW Bobtail? Dan Wesson will build you a custom gun too. In fact, I don't see why you could'nt get them to build you a one off CBOB with the razorback flat top slide in a commander length. It won't have the prestige name, but it is THE most under-rated 1911 on the market and built to VERY tight tolerances. With the money you save you can get it hardchromed, buy a butt load of mags and ammo too!

Here is the slide/frame fit on my CBOB:

http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll198/yannone119/DSCN0150.jpg?t=1217680782

[ShipWreck]

I wasn't aware that they will customize a gun. I don't think they do a caliber conversion , however (to 9mm)

[Supercharger]

Call Keith at DW and he will give you a quote. The can do the hardchrome too. I think having a custom Razorback Cbob would be as exclusive as the other guns...although not in cost. I beleive the DW is an heirloom quality 1911 without the heirloom pricetag.

I have a CBOB in .45 and the fitting is exceptional except for the loose fit of the beavertail. DW is aware of the issue and is correcting it. The gun is capable of far greater accuracy than I am and goes bang every single time. I have had ZERO malfunctions during the first 400rnds. Its always a great sign when a tight 1911 goes through its break-in failure free! The stock hammer had a casting imperfection and broke, but I sent it to DW and they fitted a very nice EGW hammer under warranty. That is the type of rare parts failure every mfg has so I can't hold it against DW. Their service was exellent, turnaround was quick and my gun was returned as scratch free as when it left.

The more I think about it a Razorback slided CBOB sounds very interesting.......I would be the ONLY person around to own one........I could sell my Kahr to help fund the purchase........:rofl: