Riding Without Endorsement [Archive] - Glock Talk

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PBCounty
08-29-2008, 15:30
Hello,

What's the nature of the penalty in your area for riding without a motorcycle endorsement? Is it common in your area for many riders to never seek an endorsement?

(this assumes the rider still has a valid, standard driver license)

- Thanks

CBennett
08-29-2008, 19:04
Dont know the fine/punishment and I dont honestly know of a single person that rides regularly that does not actually have at least a license or permit. They are just too easy to get for people to ride without I guess(at least im my area).

Powder
08-29-2008, 19:44
This area is the capital of new/squid riders. Go to any big bike hangout area on Saturday night and I'd guess that easily 50% don't have their permits.

I've personally heard of cops arresting them to not letting them ride the bike home themselves.

PBCounty
08-29-2008, 20:01
This area is the capital of new/squid riders. Go to any big bike hangout area on Saturday night and I'd guess that easily 50% don't have their permits.

I've personally heard of cops arresting them to not letting them ride the bike home themselves.

With the new requirement for a three day long class....I think that trend may continue.

Powder
08-30-2008, 10:36
With the new requirement for a three day long class....I think that trend may continue.


For sure. I got my temp. permit the day I got my first bike and signed up for the MSF class that week.

I think the new laws are good but will definitely discourage poeple from jumping through those hoops to get their license.

tehan2
08-30-2008, 13:30
here, depending on the cop, they can tow your bike and take you away in cuffs for driving without a license.

CBennett
08-31-2008, 20:05
This area is the capital of new/squid riders. Go to any big bike hangout area on Saturday night and I'd guess that easily 50% don't have their permits.

I've personally heard of cops arresting them to not letting them ride the bike home themselves.

thats what Id do if I caught one..and Id try my hardest to make sure he never got the bike back either(cant really do it legally but squids dont need bikes lol)

CBennett
08-31-2008, 20:07
For sure. I got my temp. permit the day I got my first bike and signed up for the MSF class that week.

I think the new laws are good but will definitely discourage poeple from jumping through those hoops to get their license.

Yeah, wouldnt want a person to have to "waste" 3 days learning stuff that they need to know to drive a bike and get LEGAL so that when they smash into you or someone else the insurance(that they wont have since they are illegal) would cover something.

PBCounty
09-01-2008, 13:17
Yeah, wouldnt want a person to have to "waste" 3 days learning stuff that they need to know to drive a bike and get LEGAL so that when they smash into you or someone else the insurance(that they wont have since they are illegal) would cover something.

We don't need insurance around here (FL) anyway....not required.

CBennett
09-01-2008, 14:53
We don't need insurance around here (FL) anyway....not required.

So if you cause a accident or somehow kill someone how does that work without insurance? I guess im missing something or dont understand. Insurance is to protect people you may hurt in case you cause a accident...so if you dont have any and cause me to be able not to ever work again..well I just dont get that how the hell does that work?

PBCounty
09-01-2008, 15:23
So if you cause a accident or somehow kill someone how does that work without insurance? I guess im missing something or dont understand. Insurance is to protect people you may hurt in case you cause a accident...so if you dont have any and cause me to be able not to ever work again..well I just dont get that how the hell does that work?


Law just says that I am personally liable....so it comes out of my pocket if I nail someone. Of course, my pockets aren't that deep so I wouldn't be able to pay that tab. Luckily, my ride weighs less than 300 pounds and the only things I'll be hitting is pine trees and sugar sand.

CBennett
09-01-2008, 15:55
Law just says that I am personally liable....so it comes out of my pocket if I nail someone. Of course, my pockets aren't that deep so I wouldn't be able to pay that tab. Luckily, my ride weighs less than 300 pounds and the only things I'll be hitting is pine trees and sugar sand.

Remind me never to move to where you are..thats absolutely horrid that(and im NOT picking on you personally I mean just the idea of this) if you maim someone for life and you dont have a penny they are totally SCREWED for a acident you created and all I can say is how in hell can that be right...hows that make any sense....Here you HAVE to have at least liability(thats all I have) so if you screw someone/something up you(the insurance) at least pays something($500,000 for my insurance) instead of oops sorry for crippling you for life here is $NOTHING...I think to be honest if that was the case i'd spend the rest of my life in jail unfortunately

Lone Wolff
09-02-2008, 09:59
Not to hijack thread any further, but that's why I always have unisured/underinsured coverage on my policy. Covers my ass in case I get hit by someone without insurance, or insufficient insurance. Costs less that $8.00 per year.

Hope I never have to use it, but for the cost, I couldn't imagine not having it in this state. Too many illegal aliens driving around, let alone poor-ass broke people.

CBennett
09-02-2008, 14:56
Not to hijack thread any further, but that's why I always have unisured/underinsured coverage on my policy. Covers my ass in case I get hit by someone without insurance, or insufficient insurance. Costs less that $8.00 per year.

Hope I never have to use it, but for the cost, I couldn't imagine not having it in this state. Too many illegal aliens driving around, let alone poor-ass broke people.

Agreed ive got that also but just to think a State would be so irresponsible to think its a good idea to basically say its ok if this guy almost kills you and is pennyless so he is "off the hook" for any responsibility is pretty well crappy. like I said I know at least 1 state I wont be riding in lol....its different when a kid/person is uninsured and riding thats just illegal and it happens..but when its almost endorsed by the state as being "ok" WOW I just cant grasp that logic lol.

spdski
09-06-2008, 09:52
In WA these days, they always impound for riders w/o endorsement. No licensed driver is on the scene... not much choice.

Also, the ticket is pricey.

Glockmeister40
09-06-2008, 18:27
With the new requirement for a three day long class....I think that trend may continue.

Also one more thing about that new law is that all the classes are full for the next few months. And If a person has allready used up all of his renewal's on the temp. permit if they want to ride they will be illegal.

D25
09-06-2008, 18:37
Impound it + a good sized ticket, if it's an on duty cop. There are other ways that I've seen it dealt with when some squid starts running his mouth. I'm not real fond of picking up the tab for uninsured/ unlicensed people who are predisposed to wad their bike up with less than 500 miles on the ticker.:steamed:

Dalton Wayne
09-06-2008, 18:46
My son rides on a learners permit the bike is in my name but he owns it, he also has no ins on it which I don't approve of its a 1400 cc big twin I ride it about once a month just for a quick trip to the store but I have an endorsement and 37 years riding experience and yes I've been down once

uzimon
09-07-2008, 07:37
where i lived in galveston, if you were caught w/o endorsement, the cops made you leave the bike for either a wrecker to come pu, or a licensed rider to come get.
get caught on it again and its the grey-bar motel.
they said since there's no mc license, then insurance is invalid (if the rider is insured at all)
and the ins. co's will sell ins. w/o a license here

Rikki
09-08-2008, 06:57
I was hit by a Non-insured operator on a 250cc moped...850$ to the door and front 1/4 panel.
My uninsured/underinsured coverage kicked in and paid...but I guess Karma took over because later (after sitting for months) in front of a grease ball rooming house somebody threw his broken up scooter off the Flat Rock River bridge.
I guess General Finance is chasing him now.
You know what? PL/PD on a 1800cc Honda VTX is 90 bucks a year for me.
If you don't ride with an endorsement/insurance you deserve everything you got coming.

airmotive
09-08-2008, 10:43
So if you cause a accident or somehow kill someone how does that work without insurance? I guess im missing something or dont understand. Insurance is to protect people you may hurt in case you cause a accident...so if you dont have any and cause me to be able not to ever work again..well I just dont get that how the hell does that work?

Sounds like the "undocumented migrant" lobby at work.
Afterall, requiring insurance is just sooo unfair for people with no identification.

Super Trucker
09-08-2008, 17:36
Yeah, wouldn't want a person to have to "waste" 3 days learning stuff that they need to know to drive a bike and get LEGAL so that when they smash into you or someone else the insurance(that they wont have since they are illegal) would cover something.

Now isn't that a little harsh?

If I understood the new law, all riders must take the course. I have had an endorsement for about 20 years, so why would I want to waste 3 days to get a redundant course/license?

If I misunderstood the law, I will apologize in advance.

CBennett
09-09-2008, 10:12
Now isn't that a little harsh?

If I understood the new law, all riders must take the course. I have had an endorsement for about 20 years, so why would I want to waste 3 days to get a redundant course/license?

If I misunderstood the law, I will apologize in advance.

I was talking about NEW riders(who are trying to GET licensed) and people who think that becuase they have been riding for years ILLEGALLY(without endorsement) for years think they are entitled to keep doing so. Im NOT talking about legal riders that have been riding for years.

I have no idea though about the cousre being required it has to be on a state to state basis, I know here in PA you can just go take the test without ever taking the course and thats current as of 2 weeks ago cause a friend that just bought a motorcycle went out never being on a bike b4 in his life rode it around for 3.5 weeks went over and took the test and passed..he never took the motorcycle safety course. I dont think people who have been riding for years should have to take a course I think that each and every state should at LEAST require people who RIDE/DRIVE motorcycles to at least be INSURED so that if they cause injury/death they have the insurance to cover it..not be totaly uninsured(like they can be apparently in Florida) so that they can maim you for life be totaly broke so you get NOTHING for them maiming you ..makes sense doesnt it? So im sure its state by state for the laws regarding classes. I took the class just for the extra practice on someone elses bike(in case i dropped it at least its not my bike) its a good course but needs to be longer and work on more stuff.

Glockmeister40
09-09-2008, 19:44
Yes it is a new law here in Fl. And personally I think the main reason behind it is so that the DMV does not have to give a riden test. Because they feel that if you took the motorcycle safety course and passed that you are OK. The only thing wrong is right now all of the classes are booked up for about the next 3 months

wavetrain75
09-09-2008, 21:38
In Montana you can be fined for riding without an endorsement, but I think it may be a secondary offense.

For example, if you're stopped at a red light and the Suburban behind you plows into you and destroys your bike and puts you in the hospital for six months, you get to pay for the damage to the Suburban and the fine for riding without an endorsment. You shouldn't have been there in the first place.

The test was pretty easy. I got a perfect score on the riding portion, if you practice the course for a few hours it's not difficult.

Super Trucker
09-12-2008, 21:01
CBennett, thanks for clearing up your opinion. I now agree with you.

Glockmeister40
09-29-2008, 10:01
Well I tried to renew my temp. permit today and the lady at the DMV told me that they no longer do that and I would have to take the MSF course.

Now I have no problem doing that and do plan on it But all of the classes are full around here for the next 2 months. So basically as I see it. The DMV is going to force me to break the law if I want to take my bike for a spin. Being as it is my sole piece of transportation besides my Boss's truck. I am stuck.

Those people really need to think things all the way through before they make new laws.

Powder
09-30-2008, 03:43
Well I tried to renew my temp. permit today and the lady at the DMV told me that they no longer do that and I would have to take the MSF course.

Now I have no problem doing that and do plan on it But all of the classes are full around here for the next 2 months. So basically as I see it. The DMV is going to force me to break the law if I want to take my bike for a spin. Being as it is my sole piece of transportation besides my Boss's truck. I am stuck.

Those people really need to think things all the way through before they make new laws.

Tough break there but if you ride it is YOUR choice to break the law. How long have you been riding on temp. permits when you could have just gone and took the class right away instead.

fnfalman
09-30-2008, 06:11
We all gotta do what we gotta do. Just don't get caught.

Smoker
09-30-2008, 06:17
Here in Kansas its $100 and they park the bike until there is a licensed driver to take it.
Sometimes there is nothing more to do so they set-up check points on the way to rallies & rides. A customer of mine got stopped is how I knew all that. I've had mine since 71 or 72.

Delon
10-02-2008, 10:28
If I stopped you I would tow the bike and give you a ticket for no valid op.

Also since it is almost impossible to get insurance for the bike without a valid op, I would cite you for that also if you didn't have it.

I would also cite you for what ever the PC for the stop was since I was impounding the bike.


Since you can't get the bike out of impound without showing proof of insurance and valid op, you risk losing the bike.

So to sum up about $274 dollars for no op, about $274 for no insurance, plus what ever the fine is for PC violation.
Plus you can say about $125 dollar impound fee and about $50 dollars a day the bike sits in impound.

Makes that $100 dollars for that two day class look cheap.

Glockmeister40
10-02-2008, 19:18
Delon I sure am glad that I do not live in your city. As I stated earlier it is not the money or the time that is preventing me from taking the safety class. It is the fact that all of the classes within 100 miles or so from here are full for the next 2 months.

If I could take the class this weekend I would do it in a heartbeat. And as far as Losing my bike to the courts no chance of that. And furthermore insurance is not even required on a motorcycle here in Fl.

When I got my Temp. Permit the girl at the DMV told me that they would renew it at least 4 times. I only renewed it once. And now they are telling me that they will not do it again.

At least we have Great gun laws here in Fl. :)

LatinKraze
10-04-2008, 21:00
What I dont understand is why do people go out and buy a bike without being licensed/prepared first?

Out here in Vegas it depends on the LEO. He can be nice and let your licensed bud show up and tow/ride it home or he can impound, cite, and/or arrest you.

fnfalman
10-06-2008, 08:29
What I dont understand is why do people go out and buy a bike without being licensed/prepared first?



I don't get that myself. I don't know of too many people going into a car dealership and buy a car/truck/van without already having a license. What makes a motorcycle so different?

Glockmeister40
10-06-2008, 09:03
Why is it that I need a special license to drive a 500lb. bike vs my 3000lb. truck?

I can do a lot more damage with the truck than the bike.

Delon
10-06-2008, 15:52
Why is it that I need a special license to drive a 500lb. bike vs my 3000lb. truck?

I can do a lot more damage with the truck than the bike.

A bike takes alot more skill and is a lot less forgiving.

HollowHead
10-07-2008, 01:14
I hope Delon would do the exact same thing with any driver out-of-class and not just motorcyclists. Otherwise: :steamed: HH

Delon
10-07-2008, 10:06
I hope Delon would do the exact same thing with any driver out-of-class and not just motorcyclists. Otherwise: :steamed: HH

HollowHead,

Depends, if there is a valid driver in the vehicle, it is insured, and it is a first time offense, they ussally get a cite and the valid driver can drive the vehicle off. If the above doesn't apply then it gets impounded ussally.

Most motorcyclists don't have a spare valid rider on the back of the bike. But it seems if you take a % of drivers / riders. More riders by % don't have valid endorsements compared to drivers.

There is ZERO excuse to ride without an endorsement in oregon, it is a two day Team Oregon class or a simple DMV test.

I ride, I own a ducati monster and love it. But I didn't ride it until I had the endorsement.