Semi-auto Uzi and HK??

[NLETA]

The thread about a semi-auto Sten got me thinking..

It's been years ago, but I do recall seeing semi-auto Uzis and HKs out there with longer barrels.

Now, if I understand correctly, these were banned from import with a piece of legislation. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Are there still some of these "pre-ban" weapons out there?

And if so, could you purchase one and then get your tax stamp and convert it to a short barrled rifle (semi-auto)?

I am sure that it would be out of my price range, but if I am extra good, maybe Santa will leave one in my X-mas stocking!
;f

[Lonerunner1]

There are still pre-ban semi-auto's out there, but they are rather expensive. You may be able to find some norinco's cheap for around $600 but the IMI's are around $1200 or better. As far as I know, there is no way to legally intstall a short barrel on the semi-auto's, plus the trinion that the barrel sits in is differnt size on most of the semi-auto uzi's so the short barrel would not fit anyway. There are some pre-ban's that the barrels interchange and infact I think some of the very early imports came with a working short barrel for "display purposes only" but those cost upward around $2000 or more if you can find them.

Vector Arms still has some pre-ban full auto uzi's for sale. That is the best way to go about getting on with a short barrel that is legal, and they are full auto. I think they are around $3000 though.

[Geck045]

You can register your Preban Vector, American made semi-auto Uzi as an SBR, and then use a shorter barrel-I have one for sale on the classifieds, FYI.

Geck045

[RenegadeGlocker]

Lonerunner, you are correct in that the barrel that was designed for the full-auto Uzi will not fit the semi-auto. But, there are manufacturers that make the shorter barrel for the semi-auto. They run < $100 at the last gun show I saw them at. Another option would be to get the 16 inch barrel chopped down. You need to do the Form 1 SBR first of course.

Prices for a Semi-Auto Model A vary widely, from a low of $800 up to $1500 from what I have seen. Check the auction boards.

Same story for the HK. Problem is, unlike to Uzi, you need a gunsmith to press in the barrel. And of course, HK-94 run around $3000-$4500.

[NLETA]

Thanks for the replies.

I checked out Vector and GunBroker.com Looks like it would be around $1500 easy for an Uzi before changing the barrel. But that's alot cheaper than HKs in any 9mm configuration.

That's a barrel full of money!

It looks like Colt still offer the 9mm AR15 6450 for us LE folks. Priced around $900 IIRC. And I should be able to have the barrel cut down on it and register it as an SBR. Correct?

Sounds like that would be the cheaper way to go. Anybody know how trustworthy and reliable the AR 9mm is? Plus, Where do you find magazines for it?

[UZIFORME]

Short Barreled rifles can be preban or post ban. Post ban rifles can not have the evil assault weapons features preban can.

So you can do a preban or post ban semi auto UZI or Colt Style Carbine in any barrel length you want.

The Colt carbines work best with Colt magazines. If you are using one for DUTY use don't rely upon anything else.

If you are active LE officer you could do a post ban LEO/Govment use carbine and register as SBR and retain the evil features if you get a Dept. request for USE of DUTY form for the FFL selling you the rifle. You can also get LE/Govment use only magazines. Upon retirement from the dept the dept can assign/give you the rifle and you may retain it even with the evil features in tact.

I happen to have a PreBan Colt 9mm carbine with 2-20rnd preban magazines. I would sell this to you and manuf. as a SBR with say a 11.5" barrel for $1800. You would be responsible for any fees your local C3 dealer might charge to handle the paperwork for you to transfer it to you. You would also be responsible for the $200 transfer tax for the form 4 transfer to you as an individual. There are so many variations of what we can legally do for you. I could build you the SBR and then sell a LE only full auto conversion sear to the Dept. They could issue this conversion to you for use in your personal weapon. Then if you retire just turn the FA conversion back to them and keep your host semi auto gun. Of course I can also do silencers integral or screw on for that quiet effect.

Also PD depts do not pay the $200 NFA transfer tax when they buy and sell weapons. So if I sell the SBR and Silencer to the PD they can issue you the weapon for duty use with no tax involved. Then at a future date if you happen to find a PD with an NFA weapon you would like to buy from them it would transfer to you tax free as an individual. Doing this from the onset could appear to be tax evasion to the ATF and they could prosecute you if it was obvious I sold this to you and marketed it through the PD to avoid the tax. It would be better if you just found the weapon on your own randomly form a PD dept. that just happened to have what you wanted.

I just built up a nice post sample M16-9mm with a 4" barrel with HK 3-lug mount for use with 3-lugged silencer where the silencer fits inside the aluminum free float handguard.

I can do anything you want if you only want it bad enough to go through the paperwork and expense.

Feel free to email me at dchmanuf@cableone.net and let me know what you are thinking I can give you my phone number then and we can talk live or play email tag till you get all your questions answered.

[RenegadeGlocker]

Originally posted by UZIFORME
Then at a future date if you happen to find a PD with an NFA weapon you would like to buy from them it would transfer to you tax free as an individual.

Individuals cannot obtain NFA weapons tax free. If your dept is selling NFA weapons to individuals, that is a big no - no.

[UZIFORME]

Of course Police Departments can sell off thier assets that they have no use for. Ever goto a police auction of confiscated cars/boats/weapons/housed/etc.?

Anyone lucky finding transferable NFA weapons in Police Depts that they have no use for is lucky because they do not have to pay the tax the gun will transfer direct to them on a form 5 tax free instead of the form 4 tax paid transfer. Most of them are getting sucked up and replaced with LE/Govment use only guns.

If your local cops don't sell thier surplus weapons to the public that is thier dept. policy and you live in a sucky jurisdiction. It is not law.

I buy them when every I can find them.

In case you like legaleeeze speak here you go on the regs.Tax exemptions

Law enforcement, states, and local governments are totally exempt
from the making and transfer (either to or from) taxes, but must
comply with the registration requirements. While the NFA only
specifically provides that there is no transfer tax due when the
U.S. government is the transferee, (26 U.S.C. sec. 5852(a)), or a
state governmental entity (26 U.S.C. sec. 5853(a)), ATF has made up
an exemption from the transfer tax where any U.S. or state
governmental entity is the transferor, see ATF Chief Counsel
Opinion numbers 20023 and 20400. Opinion 20023 is on my web page -
ATF refuses to release number 20400, claiming it is privileged
attorney-client work product. Abuses of this tax exemption, as in
transferring guns through governmental entities so as to avoid
transfer taxes, have been successfully prosecuted. See U.S. v.
Fleming, 19 F.3d 1325 (CA10 1994).

[NLETA]

UZIFORME,

Wow! Thanks for the info. That is the most well written explanation of NFA/SBR and LE Only purchases that I have seen to date.

Also thanks for your offer on the Colt 9mm. From what I have seen in recent looking around, $1800 is a very good price for that package plus the barrel work. Thanks for the offer. It is, however, out of the price range of this humble civil servant. (unless you take cofederate dollars... ;f )

I could get the Duty Use letter with no prob which makes the LE Only purchase more affordable to me. From what I have been able to find, it looks like they go for around $900 w/ factory Colt mags at around $30/ea. So this would be more affordable for me.

What I am thinking about doing is selling my LE Only AR-15 Carbine for it to be replaced by the shorty in 9mm.

I'll shoot you an e-mail!

[RenegadeGlocker]

I thought all NFA transfers to individuals had to be on Form 1, Form 4, or Form 5 if it was an inheritance, and had to already be in the registry prior to May 19, 1986.

Seems like a big, unknown loophole if LE Agencies can dump their weapon to individuals on Form 5. I will have to go talk to the Sheriff. Maybe if I offer to buy him new MP5s, he will sell me his old ones tax free.

[UZIFORME]

Of course the PD machineguns must be transferable. No post 86 guns can transfer to civies.

[mado]

I've been thinking about checking LEO auctions lately. I believe the next year or so should be pretty good for finding them as most departments got to buy new MG's and SMG's post 9/11.