View Full Version : Drug addicts are just like you and me.. responsible citizens...
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http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,427021,00.html
FOXNews.com
Student Finds Heroin Needle at Recess, Pokes Herself and 3 Others
Wednesday, September 24, 2008
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Four Texas elementary school students are being tested for HIV and other blood-borne diseases after a student found a heroin needle at recess and poked herself and three other students.
The student at Allison Elementary School in East Austin found the needle Monday afternoon at recess in a park restroom, MyFOXAustin.com reports. Thinking it was fake, she poked herself and three others before school officials found the needle.
Just the thought of someone had a needle in their arm," said Theresa Garcia, the mother of a 6-year-old who was poked. "My daughter got pricked with it, who knows what could be on it."
Officials told MyFOXAustin.com that black tar heroin was found in the needle, and the students are being tested for HIV and other illnesses.
"It does happen across the district on some campuses," school principal Guadalupe Velasquez told MyFOXAustin.com. "It’s not just an isolated incident."
Parents are outraged by the incident, and reporters for the station found other needles in the park while reporting on the story.
Click here for more from MyFOXAustin.com.
Four Texas elementary school students are being tested for HIV and other blood-borne diseases after a student found a heroin needle at recess and poked herself and three other students.
The student at Allison Elementary School in East Austin found the needle Monday afternoon at recess in a park restroom, MyFOXAustin.com reports. Thinking it was fake, she poked herself and three others before school officials found the needle.
Just the thought of someone had a needle in their arm," said Theresa Garcia, the mother of a 6-year-old who was poked. "My daughter got pricked with it, who knows what could be on it."
Officials told MyFOXAustin.com that black tar heroin was found in the needle, and the students are being tested for HIV and other illnesses.
"It does happen across the district on some campuses," school principal Guadalupe Velasquez told MyFOXAustin.com. "It’s not just an isolated incident."
Parents are outraged by the incident, and reporters for the station found other needles in the park while reporting on the story.
From the link, for those who don't like a-clickin' stuff. :)
Good lord.
Homeschooling, anyone?
cowboywannabe
09-24-2008, 13:53
HIV transmittal by sex from a woman to man is a 1 in 10 chance, but via blood transmittal like from a needle it is 9 in 10 chances.....i hope the innocent kids are o.k. and the moron kid who did the poking is out of the public school system for good.
Annoyedgrunt
09-24-2008, 13:55
Good lord.
Homeschooling, anyone?
My thoughts exactly. These days, I shudder at the thought of raising any kids I might have in today's world.
dave_pro2a
09-24-2008, 13:57
Thank God that D.A.R.E. and the WoD kept those kids safe. Tax dollars well spent ;)
HIV transmittal by sex from a woman to man is a 1 in 10 chance, but via blood transmittal like from a needle it is 9 in 10 chances.....i hope the innocent kids are o.k. and the moron kid who did the poking is out of the public school system for good.
Yeah, she's probably out for good, but she was, what- six (6) y/o?
Best of luck to all the kiddos in the story. Even the one who -- innocently, if stupidly -- did the poking.
TacoPower
09-24-2008, 14:08
What is a "heroin needle"?
Just Say No
09-24-2008, 14:11
How can something like this happen after we have banned drugs? Drug bans work just like gun bans do. When America finally wakes up and realizes that drugs are a medical problem and not a criminal one we will be living in a much better world. While I am not going to defend a heroin addict leaving a needle on a playground (dumping medical waste on a playground would cross the line from a medical problem to a criminal problem because of the potential for others to be harmed) I am going to say that if someone like that was in a real lockdown treatment program stuff like this would not happen near as much.
By the way, I already am anticipating the posts asking what about crack heads breaking into homes and cars for money to support their habit. Let me remind you that breaking into cars and homes is already illegal regardless of what you are on.
PilotKitten
09-24-2008, 14:20
I'm not surprised that it's East Austin is all I'll say.
series1811
09-24-2008, 14:50
By the way, I already am anticipating the posts asking what about crack heads breaking into homes and cars for money to support their habit. Let me remind you that breaking into cars and homes is already illegal regardless of what you are on.
Let me remind you that most of the crime gets committed by drug users. We are just trying to head them off at the pass instead of waiting until they have already stolen, broken, shot, raped, embezzled, whatever, etc.
It is not a secret that the drug users don't like it being that way very much.
kahrcarrier
09-24-2008, 14:53
HIV transmittal by sex from a woman to man is a 1 in 10 chance, but via blood transmittal like from a needle it is 9 in 10 chances.....i hope the innocent kids are o.k. and the moron kid who did the poking is out of the public school system for good.
Not sure I buy those figures.
Do you have a source?
Just Say No
09-24-2008, 14:57
Let me remind you that most of the crime gets committed by drug users. We are just trying to head them off at the pass instead of waiting until they have already stolen, broken, shot, raped, embezzled, whatever, etc.
It is not a secret that the drug users don't like it being that way very much.
Care to cite that statistic? I would also like to point out that the second you use something the government considers an "illegal drug" you are already a criminal in their eyes.
Dragoon44
09-24-2008, 15:04
How can something like this happen after we have banned drugs? Drug bans work just like gun bans do.
Yeah, and people keep getting robbed, murdered, raped, burglarized, cheated. etc. etc. even though we have laws against those things, they obviously have not worked. we need to legalize everything and then we can live in a crime free society.
series1811
09-24-2008, 15:05
Care to cite that statistic? I would also like to point out that the second you use something the government considers an "illegal drug" you are already a criminal in their eyes.
No, I don't. Although dopers never get tired of talking about legalizing drugs, I do.
ocjackel
09-24-2008, 15:11
Let me remind you that most of the crime gets committed by drug users. We are just trying to head them off at the pass instead of waiting until they have already stolen, broken, shot, raped, embezzled, whatever, etc.
It is not a secret that the drug users don't like it being that way very much.
I think that most people fail to realize is most crime committed by drug users is committed to support their habit.
It is a basic economic fact that when you artificially restrict supply (such as the outright ban of illegal drugs) the price for that product will be much higher than it would normally be. This means drug users can't support their habit with there normal income (whether that is a low paying job, government assistance, etc).
Alcohol is a great example. There are probably millions of functional alcoholics in this country. These people drink everyday but still manage to get to work the next day, pay their bills, and support their families. Why is this possible? Because the their personal drug of choice, alcohol, is cheap and plentiful. They can support their habit on their income.
The bottom line is drug prohibition causes more crime that it prevents.
Just Say No
09-24-2008, 15:14
No, I don't. Although dopers never get tired of talking about legalizing drugs, I do.
Ok, so instead of having a ration discussion like an adult you have refused to back up what you have claimed and resorted to an ad hominem right out of the gate. Are you really that feeble minded or is your argument just that weak?
Just Say No
09-24-2008, 15:21
Yeah, and people keep getting robbed, murdered, raped, burglarized, cheated. etc. etc. even though we have laws against those things, they obviously have not worked. we need to legalize everything and then we can live in a crime free society.
Well I will start off by giving you the benefit of the doubt because on a daily basis you deal with the worst elements of society (you are in law enforcement correct?) As a rational, sane individual do you really think that the thread of a prison term is going to stop a heroin addict from buying more smack? These are the same people that will sell their bodies and hurt innocent people for money to buy drugs. How often do you arrest someone for their second or 3rd hard drug offense even though some states will give you life for drugs?
I am not advocating the legalization of hard drugs, you will never be able to buy heroin at target. I am saying that treatment is much better for substance abusers than locking them up.
wolfman97
09-24-2008, 15:35
Let me remind you that most of the crime gets committed by drug users. We are just trying to head them off at the pass instead of waiting until they have already stolen, broken, shot, raped, embezzled, whatever, etc.
It is not a secret that the drug users don't like it being that way very much.
By "drug users", if you mean "alcohol users" then you would be right. According to the US DOJ, alcohol is the ONLY drug with any real connection to drug-induced violent crime. See http://druglibrary.org/schaffer/govpubs/psycviol.htm
Alcohol accounts for half of all deaths due to auto accidents, homicides, suicides, fires, and drowning. It accounts for half of all domestic abuse and two-thirds of all sexual assaults on children.
The crime associated with illegal drugs is primarily "systemic". That is, it is caused by the system of prohibition.
Just FYI, prior to 1914, there was no drug-related crime in the US (except for that related to alcohol.) There were no drug gangs getting rich off the drug trade. There were drug-related crimes. There were addicts -- about the same percentage as today -- but they didn't commit crimes to support their habit.
Drug-related crime began in 1915. It was because of the passage of the Harrison Narcotics Tax Act in 1914. You can read a good history of the subject at http://druglibrary.org/schaffer/Library/studies/cu/cumenu.htm
It should also be mentioned that other countries that have tried different approaches have hugely reduced their drug-related crime. One example is Switzerland.
ocjackel
09-24-2008, 15:35
Ok, so instead of having a ration discussion like an adult you have refused to back up what you have claimed and resorted to an ad hominem right out of the gate. Are you really that feeble minded or is your argument just that weak?
This is when you know you have won an argument with a prohibitionist. They cannot refute your arguments with logic and reason so they resort to insults.
wolfman97
09-24-2008, 15:37
Yeah, and people keep getting robbed, murdered, raped, burglarized, cheated. etc. etc. even though we have laws against those things, they obviously have not worked. we need to legalize everything and then we can live in a crime free society.
Did murders, rapes, and burglaries happen before we had laws against them? Yes, they obviously did.
Drug-related crime was nonexistent before we had laws against drugs.
And, in case you missed all the previous times it has been discussed, there is a difference between putting drugs into one's own body and harming someone else. Nobody that I know of (except silly prohibitionists) has ever suggested any change in any law that would allow anyone to harm anyone else.
Just Say No
09-24-2008, 15:37
This is when you know you have won an argument with a prohibitionist. They cannot refute your arguments with logic and reason so they resort to insults.
Kinda like...."the only reason to own a gun is to kill people, you must be a sissy if you have to carry a gun, you can't fight like a man."
Dragoon44
09-24-2008, 15:44
Well I will start off by giving you the benefit of the doubt because on a daily basis you deal with the worst elements of society (you are in law enforcement correct?) As a rational, sane individual do you really think that the thread of a prison term is going to stop a heroin addict from buying more smack? These are the same people that will sell their bodies and hurt innocent people for money to buy drugs. How often do you arrest someone for their second or 3rd hard drug offense even though some states will give you life for drugs?
I am not advocating the legalization of hard drugs, you will never be able to buy heroin at target. I am saying that treatment is much better for substance abusers than locking them up.
So your saying that MJ is not just a harmless weed then, it's addictive enough to drive people to commit crimes to obtain it?
SouthernGal
09-24-2008, 15:47
I'm sorry, but I remember being an elementary school kid well. I used to fight the nurses at the Dr.'s office when THEY tried to give me a shot, so I've just GOT to believe I'd have knocked another kid silly if he/she had tried to stick me with a needle too.
wolfman97
09-24-2008, 15:48
So your saying that MJ is not just a harmless weed then, it's addictive enough to drive people to commit crimes to obtain it?
I haven't a clue how you got that out of what you quoted. But don't let that stop you from just making up some straw man argument.
But, BTW, even the DEA doesn't claim that it is addictive enough to drive people to commit crimes. In terms of addictive qualities, it ranks about equal with caffeine. You can see the NIDA's own rankings of the addictive qualities at http://druglibrary.org/schaffer/Library/basicfax5.htm
Dragoon44
09-24-2008, 15:49
Drug-related crime was nonexistent before we had laws against drugs.
What you are relying on for this bogus claim is that there are no statistics available for crimes that were drug related before drugs were criminalized. The fact that there were no records kept detailing whether or not drugs were involved with crimes before drugs were criminalize does not mean they were not. And I got a pretty good idea your probably smart enough to know that.
ocjackel
09-24-2008, 15:53
I'm sorry, but I remember being an elementary school kid well. I used to fight the nurses at the Dr.'s office when THEY tried to give me a shot, so I've just GOT to believe I'd have knocked another kid silly if he/she had tried to stick me with a needle too.
How dare you try to stay on topic! You are interrupting our rants!
TacoPower
09-24-2008, 15:54
What you are relying on for this bogus claim is that there are no statistics available for crimes that were drug related before drugs were criminalized. The fact that there were no records kept detailing whether or not drugs were involved with crimes before drugs were criminalize does not mean they were not. And I got a pretty good idea your probably smart enough to know that.
I am all for legalization but that statement is totally bogus(not yours Dragoon the one you quoted).. that is like saying that there are no booze related crimes. Of course there were drug related crimes. Just not drug trafficing/dealing crimes. Addicts are addicts and I am sure people are willing to steal to get booze just as much as they are willing to steal to get crack.
SouthernGal
09-24-2008, 15:54
How dare you try to stay on topic! You are interrupting our rants!
I'm sorry...but I recall one story where my mother had to have TWO nurses come in and restrain me. :rofl: I swear that was the first thing that popped into my head.
No way another kid pokes me with a needle. The fight would have been ON!
wolfman97
09-24-2008, 15:56
What you are relying on for this bogus claim is that there are no statistics available for crimes that were drug related before drugs were criminalized. The fact that there were no records kept detailing whether or not drugs were involved with crimes before drugs were criminalize does not mean they were not. And I got a pretty good idea your probably smart enough to know that.
Well, you could start by reading any of the major histories of the subject. I have already linked one, above. I take it you didn't bother to look.
Also, I have had a team of people reviewing old newspapers for historical articles on drugs for more than ten years now. So far, no one has been able to come up with any tales of drug-related crimes prior to 1914. After 1914, there are plenty.
Or, you could try taking any college course in the history of the subject. There really isn't any academic question about when drug crimes started.
See the History Channel special "Hooked: Illegal Drugs and How They Got That Way" if the reading is too much for you. It is a four-hour special on the subject that they keep repeating every so often.
wolfman97
09-24-2008, 16:00
I am all for legalization but that statement is totally bogus(not yours Dragoon the one you quoted).. that is like saying that there are no booze related crimes. Of course there were drug related crimes. Just not drug trafficing/dealing crimes. Addicts are addicts and I am sure people are willing to steal to get booze just as much as they are willing to steal to get crack.
There were booze-related crimes prior to 1914 --plenty of them. That's why there was a major national movement to get alcohol outlawed. There was no such major national movement to get the other drugs outlawed because they weren't considered to be a major problem. There just wasn't any crime related to the other drugs. At the time the drugs were outlawed, the most typical opiate addict as a law-abiding, rural-living, middle-aged white female. They didn't commit crimes to support their habit.
As I said, you can read the history yourself at http://druglibrary.org/schaffer/Library/studies/cu/cumenu.htm
The first several chapters tell the story of how the laws came about.
ocjackel
09-24-2008, 16:05
I am all for legalization but that statement is totally bogus(not yours Dragoon the one you quoted).. that is like saying that there are no booze related crimes. Of course there were drug related crimes. Just not drug trafficing/dealing crimes. Addicts are addicts and I am sure people are willing to steal to get booze just as much as they are willing to steal to get crack.
Of course there is a lot of alcohol related crime. Alcohol causes more destruction of lives and property than all illegal drugs combined. There in lies the hypocrisy. I just can't understand how someone can be against illegal drugs and yet be fine with alcohol.
I try as much as possible to not be a hypocrite. I could never stay to someone that you should not smoke pot while I drink my vodka tonic.
I am sure that many people on this forum would never admit it but we who drink alcohol like the way it tastes AND like the way it makes us feel.
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