Critique needed on these build parts [Archive] - Glock Talk

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Norman
11-13-2008, 12:54
Want to upgrade most of the internals. I could use a new hard drive, but I don't need anything huge. I probably have maybe 2 or 3 gigs in music, and I don't keep a lot of games on the computer. So a smaller, faster harddrive would be best. I don't want overclocking speed, I just want something that is fast in stock mode. Reliable. Will last a good 4 or 5 years.

Here's what I'm thinking:

Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHZ LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80570E8400 ($165)

Motherboard: Asus P5Q Pro LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard ($115)

RAM: G.Skill 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-8500CL5D-2GBPK ($40)

Video Card: EVGA 512-P3-N975-AR GeForce 9800 GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card ($125)

Hard Drive: Western Digital Caviar Blue WD800JD 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s ($37)


So far looking at about $482 for the above. I've built one or two in the past, but it's been at least 6 or 7 years since the last one, and I've forgotten most of it and/or been left behind. Is all of this compatible? Is it a good bang-for-buck setup?


Question on the RAM... my motherboard specs call for DDR2 1200. Will DDR2 1066 screw something up? Is it worthwhile to spend twice as much and get 1200 RAM?

Question on the Hard Drive... what is SATA? I think mine have been IDE in the past. Is it a different connecting system? Is this better than IDE? Will my motherboard support SATA?

Thanks!

havensal
11-13-2008, 13:58
Here's what I'm thinking:

Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHZ LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80570E8400 ($165) THe reviews look good. It looks as if a few bad ones slipped through QC.

Motherboard: Asus P5Q Pro LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard ($115) Reviews don't seem to bad. It's a craps shoot with the cheaper MB's

RAM: G.Skill 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-8500CL5D-2GBPK ($40)

Video Card: EVGA 512-P3-N975-AR GeForce 9800 GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card ($125) May be a bit overkill for a web PC. Not a bad price though.

Hard Drive: Western Digital Caviar Blue WD800JD 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s ($37)


So far looking at about $482 for the above. I've built one or two in the past, but it's been at least 6 or 7 years since the last one, and I've forgotten most of it and/or been left behind. Is all of this compatible? Is it a good bang-for-buck setup?


Question on the RAM... my motherboard specs call for DDR2 1200. Will DDR2 1066 screw something up? Is it worthwhile to spend twice as much and get 1200 RAM? That is the fastest you can go. You can clock it down from there.

Question on the Hard Drive... what is SATA? I think mine have been IDE in the past. Is it a different connecting system? Is this better than IDE? Will my motherboard support SATA? IDE is outdated (also know as PATA) SATA is faster

Thanks!

Just my 2 cents. :wavey:

Norman
11-13-2008, 15:29
'preciate that, Sir. Thank you.

Others also welcome to add their .02

Norman
11-13-2008, 15:32
By the way, Havensal, any idea if my motherboard will play nice with a SATA hard drive?

havensal
11-13-2008, 15:38
By the way, Havensal, any idea if my motherboard will play nice with a SATA hard drive?

Yep, you can even set up a RAID if you want. :cool:


You do realize that there is no VGA on that video card, right. :wavey:

Spend a few more bux and get a bigger HDD, it's a cheap upgrade.

Norman
11-13-2008, 15:47
Yep, you can even set up a RAID if you want. :cool:

Isn't that best left to the Only Ones Professional Enough at the DEA? :supergrin:

Norman
11-13-2008, 15:48
You do realize that there is no VGA on that video card, right. :wavey:

No, but what does that mean for me?

havensal
11-13-2008, 15:50
No, but what does that mean for me?

What inputs does your monitor have? VGA or DVI? If no DVI, you're going to need to upgrade you monitor or pick a different VC.

Norman
11-13-2008, 15:52
I have both "analog" and "digital" on my monitor. It's a Dell Ultrasharp.

havensal
11-13-2008, 15:52
Never mind, it comes with a DVI to VGA/D-sub Adapter. You're all set.

Big Al 24
11-13-2008, 18:31
Seems like a great setup. I would also agree that you should get a larger hard drive just because you can. Smaller is not always faster and this drive is considered small nowadays.

Here is one that is twice as large for $4 more that the one you have listed.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148230

I love EVGA products because of the lifetime warranty and great customer service so bravo on that vid card.

What PSU are you using with this combo? It's the only thing I don't see listed.

Norman
11-13-2008, 18:56
Seems like a great setup. I would also agree that you should get a larger hard drive just because you can. Smaller is not always faster and this drive is considered small nowadays.

Here is one that is twice as large for $4 more that the one you have listed.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148230

I love EVGA products because of the lifetime warranty and great customer service so bravo on that vid card.

What PSU are you using with this combo? It's the only thing I don't see listed.

Power Supply? I have an aluminum Lian-Li case with some mac-daddy PSU from my last build about 7 years ago I haven't used in a little while. I don't remember what it is. If it's no good due to old age, I'll order another PSU. I'm assuming we're talking power supply. The one thing I could use suggestions on are silent fans. I want bloody silence. I don't want a turboprop at takeoff like the fans I use to run. Good lord.

IndyGunFreak
11-13-2008, 19:05
I'll second that it looks halfway decent to me, my question mark comes w/ the brand of memory. I've never heard of GSkill. This isn't to say its bad, but I'm a creature of habit when it comes to my builds, and always use Kingston or Crucial, w/o exception.

Asus motherboards are solid, I don't think you'll have any problems with it.

Definitely take the advice on the larger hard drive... Its just silly to get one that small nowdays.

IGF

Norman
11-13-2008, 20:21
GSkill seems to be highly praised on Newegg. Had the highest marks and the most reviews for memory. I feel confident trusting the Newegg community. As for the hard drive, I just checked what I'm running in my system. It is a 100Gb hard drive, and I've only used 33Gb. I feel safe with an 70-90Gb, I really am not loading a lot of software on my computers, or games. This one is to be kept light and fast. After all, I have a large external hard drive if I need it. And I've never even used it.

RaiderRodney
11-14-2008, 08:44
Get you a nice 500 watt OCZ or Antec power supply and you should be good to go. Corsair, GSkill and OCZ all make good ram...I usually get whatever is on sale at newegg for builds ;)

I'd agree with all here about getting a larger HD...only a few bucks more and will do you oh so longer :)

Good luck, looks like some nice choices on parts...and I love Lian Li cases by the way ;)

tous
11-14-2008, 08:48
Just me, but I'd spend a few more bucks for the Q6600 quad over a fairly plebian Core 2.

:wavey:

Norman
11-14-2008, 09:23
It's a $25 upgrade to go with the Q6600, and I just don't see myself running anything intensive enough to warrant the need for a Quad. I just need to get back to the modern times here with equipment. And I need to do it kind of on the cheap.

powasky
11-14-2008, 10:00
Norman-

What OS are you running? I'd up the RAM as much as you could; get 3 gigs if you only have a 32 bit OS and up it to 4 if you've got 64 bit.

jilverthor
11-14-2008, 11:03
I would suggest 4 GB regardless of the current plans for a 32 bit or 64 bit OS. (Make sure it is 2x2GB sticks). If you hope for the computer to last several years, it is likely that you will at some point need more RAM (the follow-on to Windows 7 will be 64bit only). By starting with 2GB sticks instead of 1GB sticks, you can upgrade without having to replace the memory.

Also, the power supply may be just a bit too old for the motherboard but I am not sure. The two things I would look for are make sure it has all of the required connectors (both for the motherboard and for the drives), and that is rated for a high enough power based on the specs for each component.

Just my 0.02 Cents

Norman
11-14-2008, 11:16
You're right about RAM. I might as well go to 2x2 for 4gigs.

powasky
11-14-2008, 11:16
(threadjack)

You think there's any way that Vista owners will be getting an upgrade to Seven?

Norman
11-14-2008, 12:22
I have no idea. I'm still running Win XP Home. I know of other options, but I don't know really anything more than the fact they exist. I'm not software savvy, but I'd like to see what it's like outside of Windows - I just don't know anything much about those options or if they're user friendly.

Some thoughts on this matter would be beneficial.

Big Al 24
11-14-2008, 20:04
Gskill is excellent stuff. 2 x 2gb sticks is the way to go. Gskill has earned their stripes from a crowd that really tests them out. I know Indy has a preference for brands he is comfortable with, but in the tech industry sitting on your laurels is what these companies do once they figure out they have your loyalty.(No offense Indy, you da man!) And generally, if you walk into Best Buy or many computer stores and look at their ram selection, you'll realize that you probably should've bought online because they only have over priced (exremely overpriced most of the time) middle of the road modules. Also, the PSU (common acronym for Power Supply Unit) will probably need upgrading. If you want COMPLETE SILENCE, you'll need a PSU that is rated to much higher that you initially need so it isn't maxed out and the fans don't have to spin up all the time which will also help the unit to last longer. As far as silent fans go:

San Ace 109R1212H1011
Scythe S-Flex E
Yate Loon d12sl-12

And here is the link to the testing so you can see how this was determined...

http://www.xtremesystems.org/forums/showthread.php?t=193126&highlight=silent+quiet+fans

Another way to quiet the fan noise is to add a fan controller to keep them at minimum voltage so they won't bother you. If that's not silent enough, you might want to investigate watercooling.

P.S. -Indy next time you build yourself a PC, have no fear, there are really a lot of great companies out there now struggling and they will treat you right.

Norman
11-14-2008, 20:10
I'm thinking of swapping the WD harddrive with 8mb cache for the Seagate Barracuda 250Gb with 32mb cache. It's more than twice the price at $80, but hopefully 4x the cache will be worth it.

New list, and rather complete now.

Internals

ASUS P5Q Pro LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard ($115)

Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 Wolfdale 3.0GHz 6MB L2 Cache LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor ($165)

G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 1066 (PC2 8500) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory ($80)

Seagate Barracuda ES.2 ST3250310NS 250GB 7200 RPM 32MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive ($80)

EVGA 512-P3-N975-AR GeForce 9800 GT 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Supported Video Card ($125)


Cooling
ARCTIC COOLING MX-2 Thermal Compound ($7)

ARCTIC COOLING AF8025PWM 80mm Case Fan ($7 each x2)

ARCTIC COOLING ACF8PWM 80mm Case Fan ($8.50 each x2)

Thermalright SI-128 SE CPU Cooling Heatsink ($50)

Panaflo L1B 120mm fan (for the CPU heatsink) ($15)


Total: ~ $667


One thing I'm concerned about is not having enough space underneath the mammoth 120mm Thermalright SI-128 CPU heatsink cooler to later add on some Thermalright HR-07 RAM heatsinks in low profile. Of course, a vertical CPU cooler would solve it all, but I haven't seen any reviews that show the verticals are really that much better in keeping the CPU cooler in a quiet fashion as their equivalent typical parallel-to-CPU coolers. Of course on paper it makes sense to get a vertical and flow that air right out the back of the case, but does it keep the CPU as cool as the other kind, and does it do so as quietly. Performance and silence are equal partners in this one. Hence my choice of SI-128 and Panaflo low flow.

GlocksterPaulie
11-14-2008, 20:22
You lost me when you started talking computer stuff you SOB.

Paulie:dunno:

Norman
11-14-2008, 20:59
You lost me when you started talking computer stuff you SOB.

Paulie:dunno:

Hey Paulie... believe me, I can go a good 5 years without wanting to think about this stuff, but when it comes time to re-up the computer, you gotta know what's going on. It's just stuff, and comparisons exist out on the internet to sort through and find what's good... you just gotta follow compatibility rules.

Your motherboard is the engine block. Most of the stuff will somehow be attached to your motherboard. Mine is designed for LGA775 chips (not sure what the heck they are, but they're relatively new and a lot of people like em), so you gotta get an LGA775 chip in there - Intel makes these. You can't put a Ford chip in a Honda engine. And you can't stick a Ford V8 diesel engine under the hood of a Honda Civic. Just a matter of matching up the parts to all be compliant, and then finding what supercharger is going to give you the most horsepower... that's where cooling comes in on computers. You want to keep that engine (the CPU chip - the brain), as cool as possible for peak performance. You want good intake and exhaust - that's where case fans come in. Fans at the front of the computer bring cold air in, move it through the engine area, and then fans at the side, top, or back, exhaust the air out. The tricky part about computers is that you want to keep air moving to cool things down, but you want to keep noise down, too. And as anyone knows, moving air is noisy air. A smaller fan has to spin faster to move the same amount of air as a larger fan, so a larger fan will mechanically make less RPM's and, thus, less noise, to move the same amount of air. You also want to keep your transmission (the RAM Memory in a computer) as strong as possible and as cool as possible under load.

Your NAV screen is your video card (GPU - graphics processing unit), the more you can afford, the nicer you'll see displayed on your screen. Your PSU (power supply) is your battery. You want more than enough to cover all the electronics you'll have running.

Your hard drive are your cylinders. You've got hard drives that will feed your engine in a hurry, and deliver fuel quickly (but ultimately run out of gas sooner), or you've got hard drives that will deliver fuel a little slower, but will last you longer. 7200 RPM hard drives are the norm, but higher RPM hard drives exist. Yet again, remember movement is heat, and all that heat has to be managed. Unless you're keeping everything in a temperature controlled room at 55 degrees fahrenheit, you're gonna need to think about all of this.

Interesting to note that I own stock in AMD, but I'm building my first Intel computer now. Oh the huge manatee. :supergrin:

Big Al 24
11-15-2008, 19:10
I wouldn't worry about ram heatsinks if there is a way you can get air blowing on them from the side panel of the case or something. That thermalright is a great cooler.
For just 9$ more you could get 750 gb.... If you're going to crank up the hard drive budget on me why not get as much as you can get? Unless it's for the cache alone...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148134

Trust me, you won't regret it. If nothing else you can rip all of your DVD's onto the hard drive to watch while you are on GT...

Norman
11-15-2008, 19:20
That's all the hard drive I want or need. It's 3x as much as I'll ever use, trust me.

Big Al 24
11-16-2008, 17:17
That's all the hard drive I want or need. It's 3x as much as I'll ever use, trust me.

You need to pump it up!!!

http://boozeandbooks.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/hans_franz.jpg

Hear me now, believe me later!!!! :tongueout:

Norman
11-16-2008, 21:06
Honestly, 250gb, when all I've used on my current drive is 33gb, I'm sure it will be more than enough. :winkie:

DukeNukem
11-17-2008, 21:23
If you go with Vista, it will use about 60 gb of drive space. I haven't run into any compatability issues with it except for an old version of roxio and some old programs that ran on dos. I missed the whole xp deal on my own computers...straight from 98se to vista. Also, that video card is gonna need its own connection to the psu. The older ones probably don't have sli power connectors (you might be able to get adapters for the 4 pin power connectors)

Norman
11-17-2008, 21:53
60gb for Vista?! That's ridiculous.

DukeNukem
11-17-2008, 22:31
Actually I goofed. That should say 40gb. Still ridiculous. More ridiculous is the 1gb of ram it uses idle.

Big Al 24
11-17-2008, 23:59
If you go with Vista, it will use about 60 gb of drive space. I haven't run into any compatability issues with it except for an old version of roxio and some old programs that ran on dos. I missed the whole xp deal on my own computers...straight from 98se to vista. Also, that video card is gonna need its own connection to the psu. The older ones probably don't have sli power connectors (you might be able to get adapters for the 4 pin power connectors)

+1 Even if you have adapters, there's no guarantee that your PSU will deliver the necessary power. Modern PCI E vidcards are power-hungry monsters. 800-1000w PSU's are becoming the norm nowadays.