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-   -   Double Tap Ammo for G20 10mm..... (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1166836)

double07gt 01-05-2010 16:05

Double Tap Ammo for G20 10mm.....
 
Okay, I've read on the board about how good the Double Tap is, so I went ahead and bought boxes of various grains. Here's what I bought.....

(50) 155 gr. Bonded Defense JHP / 1475 fps
(50) 180 gr. Bonded Defense JHP / 1305 fps
(50) 200 gr. Controlled Expansion / 1250 fps
(100) 180 gr. Full Metal Jacket Match / 1250 fps (I bought this for range ammo)

Of the choices, which do you think would serve best for:

1. Self Defense
2. Home Defense
3. Hunting Sidearm

Lastly, what would be a cheaper brand "range only" ammo to purchase and not give me headaches at the range?

Special Reserve 01-05-2010 17:31

I'm interested too. I just got my Glock 20SF today and I've also been trying to figure out which double tap ammo to get.

kenzo 01-05-2010 17:38

Make that 3 of us. Got my 20SF today also.

Erich1B 01-05-2010 17:54

For home, self-defense, I went with Double Taps 165gr Golden Saber rounds. Listed on Double Tap's website as 10mm 165gr. Brass Jacketed. I also have Double Tap's 10mm 155gr. Barnes TAC-XP for self-home defense.

I'm not a hunter, so I can't offer an opinion about hunting rounds.

4GLOCKER 01-05-2010 18:15

When I walk in the woods with my G29SF, I carry DT 200 gr. WFNGC Hardcast Flat Nose @ 1300fps for protection from creatures w/4 legs.

.45Super-Man 01-06-2010 03:49

The best round for defense against 4 legged creatures will not likely be the best round for 2 legged. For hunting you want penetration more than anything else. I really like the hot 165's for the 10mm or .40 for protection against 2 legged threats.

DocKWL 01-06-2010 07:37

I have little that is good to say about DT ammunition. My testing has shown that their velocity numbers are skewed, and performance is erratic at best. I have fired rounds from the same box which have showed signs of over pressure as well as squibs.

Hornady's 200gr. XTP will exceed all of your expectations for all three of your requirements. CorBon's 155 DPX will provide all the performance you will ever need for your first two scenarios.

walt cowan 01-06-2010 12:53

dt 200 grain xtp for both 2 and 4 legged problems!

ajstrider 01-06-2010 17:36

I will leave the two legged critter choices out of this response, but I do a lot of handgun hunting with several calibers, unfortunately 10mm is not one of them. But I highly suggest a heavy for caliber cast lead wide noise flat point bullet, which DT loads several of them for 10mm. They punch excellent wound channels through deer. If you really had to have a jacketed hollow point for hunting, I prefer any loading with Hornady XTP bullets. They should be heavy for the caliber also, penetration is the key to successful handgun hunting.

glock2740 01-06-2010 18:30

I like the DT 180gr Gold Dot load in my G20 and G29.

Sierra9 01-07-2010 08:47

[quote=DocKWL;14488505]I have little that is good to say about DT ammunition. My testing has shown that their velocity numbers are skewed, and performance is erratic at best. I have fired rounds from the same box which have showed signs of over pressure as well as squibs.


Do you have any specific data? Have you talked to Mike McNett?

Waffentomas 01-07-2010 11:59

No sense going broke buying more ammuntion. From what you bought, use the 180s for all personal defense contingencies, and use the 200gr load for the woods. Try Georgia Arms for more affordable range ammo. If you have a spot in the house or apt., even if you think you'll never want to do it, (like I did), start making preparations to reload. First step is to start saving all your brass - you can always sell it on gunbroker. If $$ is an issue, go slowly, and just buy a piece here, a piece there.

walt cowan 01-07-2010 11:59

[QUOTE=Sierra9;14495636]
Quote:

Originally Posted by DocKWL (Post 14488505)
I have little that is good to say about DT ammunition. My testing has shown that their velocity numbers are skewed, and performance is erratic at best. I have fired rounds from the same box which have showed signs of over pressure as well as squibs.


Do you have any specific data? Have you talked to Mike McNett?

what do you use?:dunno:

Ak.Hiker 01-08-2010 00:09

For hunting go with the 200 grain XTP load. For self defense or home protection pick either the 155 or 180 grain bonded. Go with the one that you can control the best. Another thought is to go with the 180 grain for everything. Practice with the fmj and carry the bonded.

AK_Stick 01-08-2010 01:13

I use the 135 grain nosler and 155 grain x bullet for my carry ammo, and the 200 grain hardcast for woods.

But be wary of using the 180 grain-200 grain rounds for carry, they'll penetrate like hell.

PATRICE 01-08-2010 04:41

.....

drc767 01-08-2010 06:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by PATRICE (Post 14501735)
I made a conscious decision not to trade with DT anymore, secondary to increasing concerns about the quality/representation of their products, and the absence of customer service.--Patrice

I have shot thousands of rounds of DoubleTap Ammo without any issues whatsoever. I choose the 165g Bonded Defense (Gold Dot) for my carry ammo with my G20, and the 155g Bonded Defense for my G29. I think it is quality ammo loaded up the way the 10mm was intended for.

walt cowan 01-08-2010 14:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by PATRICE (Post 14501735)
I made a conscious decision not to trade with DT anymore, secondary to increasing concerns about the quality/representation of their products, and the absence of customer service.--Patrice

so, what do you use?:dunno:

double07gt 01-08-2010 16:07

Thanks for the info fella's.

Sierra9 01-08-2010 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by PATRICE (Post 14501735)
I made a conscious decision not to trade with DT anymore, secondary to increasing concerns about the quality/representation of their products, and the absence of customer service.--Patrice


Another negative post with no data:yawn:

fsqridah 01-08-2010 21:32

In my G29 I carry 155gr DT Gold Dots. If I had a G20, I'd probably go with 165 grainers for normal use and 180s during the winter. For home defense, get the 230gr Equalizers. It's a 95gr lead ball with a 135gr Nosler sitting on top of it. At normal HD ranges, the difference in impact between the two projectiles is less than an inch. One shot, two holes. Also lightens things up so you're looking at less drywall penetration. The recoil is also very minimal compared to the 155-165gr loads.

For a hunting sidearm, will it be used for finishing shots, or as a backup in case you get charged by a dangerous animal? For finishing shots that are put through the animal's brain at five feet, pretty much anything will work. If you wanna be able to put down a charging animal, probably want 200gr XTPs if you're shooting from a factory barrel. If you can upgrade to a barrel with conventional rifling, the 200gr WFNGC bullets are great, especially if you combine them with a 6" hunting barrel.

mongo356 01-09-2010 00:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by DocKWL (Post 14488505)
My testing has shown that their velocity numbers are skewed, and performance is erratic at best. I have fired rounds from the same box which have showed signs of over pressure as well as squibs.

Ditto-
Some of the fired DT cases were leaving a visable smiley on the case & you could feel the nickle had cracked w/ your finger nail. I don't care to push the edge that close. I have had real good luck with Hornady ammo though. The fired Hornady cases & my re-loads don't leave a bluge. Everyone has their own opinion but the XTP bullet is hard to beat. These are some numbers fired through my stock G20.

06-16-08
Shooting Chrony Chronograph
83 Deg/650 ft above sea level
Glock 20 4.6”bbl

Double Tap 10mm Gold Dot-165gr-
(advertised 1400fps-G20-4.6”bbl)
1390
1343
1333
1390
1355
------- 1362.2 AVG/ 57fps E/S

Double Tap 10mm Gold Dot 180gr
(advertised 1300fps-G20-4.6”bbl)
1226
1250
1220
1205
1253
------1231 AVG/ 47.45 fps E/S

Remington Factory180 TMC
(advertised 1150fps-5”bbl)
1071
1055
1053
1068
1097
-------1069 AVG/ 44.56 fps E/S

Handload 200gr XTP
Win case/WLP primer/12.3gr AA#9
1059
1063
1064
1068
1055
------1068 AVG/ 12.58 fps E/S

02-10-09 Shooting Chrony Chronograph
68 Deg/650 ft above sea level
G20 4.6” Hornady Factory 200gr XTP
(Advertised 1050fps-5”bbl)
1010
1006
1002
1005
990
------1003 AVG/ 20 fps E/S

04-01-09 Shooting Chrony Chronograph
70 Deg/650 ft above sea level
G20 4.6” Hornady Factory 180gr XTP(Advertised 1180fps-5”bbl)
1186
1180
1189
------
------
------1185 AVG/ 9 fps E/S

Sierra9 01-09-2010 12:20

[quote=mongo356;14508388]Ditto-
Some of the fired DT cases were leaving a visable smiley on the case & you could feel the nickle had cracked w/ your finger nail. I don't care to push the edge that close. I have had real good luck with Hornady ammo though. The fired Hornady cases & my re-loads don't leave a bluge. Everyone has their own opinion but the XTP bullet is hard to beat. These are some numbers fired through my stock G20.

According to Mike McNett, he does his chrono testing outside of Cedar City, UT, at an elevation way over 6000 ft. You're nearly at sea level. I don't pretend to know how much of a difference this makes, but it's got to be some diff.
I for one have never seen any signs of over pressure or cracking of the nickle in well over a thousand rounds of 9mm and of 10mm Double Tap, and I do check because I've been reloading the cases. And if I did see such problems, I would sure as heck talk to Mike. Have you?

mongo356 01-09-2010 14:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sierra9 (Post 14510347)
According to Mike McNett, he does his chrono testing outside of Cedar City, UT, at an elevation way over 6000 ft. You're nearly at sea level. I don't pretend to know how much of a difference this makes, but it's got to be some diff.
I for one have never seen any signs of over pressure or cracking of the nickle in well over a thousand rounds of 9mm and of 10mm Double Tap, and I do check because I've been reloading the cases. And if I did see such problems, I would sure as heck talk to Mike. Have you?

Nope. I did try a couple of different lot#'s to see if I maybe got a bad bunch. The nickel cracking was off and on, but the giant bulge was still there, to the point I couldn't re-load them.

In the end I came to the conclusion that anything I shoot won't be able to tell the difference in a 100ft a second or so anyway...if I was cutting it that close I need to either shoot better or get a bigger gun-lol. Also I didn't want one of the bulging rounds to blow apart at the worst possible moment making a reliable gun into a paperweight, I.E. shooting at charging hog, buffalo, elephant, etc.

I believe the elevation may have a lot to do with the chrono numbers, as well as other factors, temp, instruments used etc. Keep in mind this is just my experience with the ammo not necessarily written in stone for everyone.

I decided to just go to the XTP's they have always worked good for me. Most of the time I can roll my own cheaper so I have been doing that.

Iceman cHucK 01-09-2010 15:06

I have consistently chronoed DT at 100-150fps below advertised in many of his 10mm loads. I'm in western PA at approx 1300'.
Does anyone know how to calibrate the fps expected by altitude in say 1000' increments? Could this explain the differences many of us see. I had no idea DT was at this 6000' + altitude!


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