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G-31 01-27-2010 00:07

.357 Sig
 
Hi everyone I'm proud to say I have begun reloading and I fired my first 20 rounds of .40 today that I created! This evening however I started on my .357 Sig brass and I've been having some difficulty with it. The casing does not grip the bullet at all with some rounds and it falls in, I'm using .355 147 gr. Hornady JHP's which I'm pretty sure are the rights bullets so what step am I missing? Any help would be appreciated, thanks.

Tmygun 01-27-2010 00:32

It sounds like you may be flaring the case mouths too much. That will reduce or ruin bullet tension. It's sometimes recommended to not flare the case mouth at all on necked pistol cases, just seat the bullet. Do it gently to make sure you're not crusing the case. It would help to chamfer the case mouths lightly.
I'm sure others will come along with more insight and help you out.

Tmygun:wavey:

G-31 01-27-2010 00:40

Thanks for the input but I'm afraid I don't know what chamfer means. And how might I be flaring the case mouths? Thanks again.

sig357fan 01-27-2010 03:05

G-31,

chamfer means to sightly bevel the inside of the case mouth so the bullet dosn't hang up on it when seating, you can also chamfer the outside of the case mouth which helps with feeding the round into the chamber.

case mouths get flared during charging when using a case activated powder measure like the Lee disc powder measure or a die spacificaly designed to flare the case. Case flaring helps with seating the bullet, pretty common when loading lead bullets.

sig357fan

380Seecamp 01-27-2010 05:25

Are you using new brass? Are you full-length resizing all brass before loading it?

Three-Five-Seven 01-27-2010 09:48

The best thing I learned on this site is to take the expander ball out of the sizing die for 357 sig. You can substitute the decapper from any straight walled set, as they don't have expanders.

You can get a chamfering tool just about anywhere, but an ordinary countersink bit will work just as well. When you take the expander plug out of the sizer, you really must chamfer cases to ease bullet seating.

If you continue to load with the expander ball in place, you are creating a potentially dangerous situation. When your bullets set-back in the case, due to insufficient neck tension, it can cause pressure spikes in your loads. These can actually be serious enough to blow your pistol up. So, clean up your act -- pronto!

jaybirdjtt 01-27-2010 11:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by G-31 (Post 14628905)
Thanks for the input but I'm afraid I don't know what chamfer means. And how might I be flaring the case mouths? Thanks again.


http://www.lewilson.com/home.html

Their inside/outside deburring tool for $20. I've found that it also works for removing the crimp in the primer pocket of military brass.

The information that came with your dies has instructions for adjusting the amount of neck flare. Some dies have an neck expander ball above the deprimer pin. Put a micrometer on the expander ball. Some dies have a separate die for neck flaring. I have so many dies that I cannot remember which brand has which.
Generally speaking, you want to flare just enough to allow the bullet to be seated. With some cartridges, like the Sig, since you're using jacket bullets, I'd try not flaring at all and simply use the deburring tool.
Another thing, pay attention to your minimum overall length...bullet + cartridge case. Seating too deeply can result in dangerously higher pressure. There is a thread about this with a picture of a blown up Glock 31 somewhere on the forum. My manual cautions reloaders to make sure the neck of the case grips the bullet securely.

G-31 01-27-2010 11:59

Okay, thank you for all of your replies, the chamfer is the "rocket shaped thing" that I have that grinds the inside and outside of the case mouth? I am using once fired brass that I have saved, but I don't know what you mean by full length resizing? I am pushing the casing all the way into the die to remove the old primer but I thought that shaped the case so it would work. I'm using RCBS dies but I only could get a green box with a set of 2, do I need the grey box with all three? And Three-Five-Seven I apologize but the only thing I understand from your post is I shouldn't shoot any till I know what's going on. Is the expander ball what goes inside the casing when I punch out the primer? What's a decapper and a straight walled set? I really appreciate you guys helping me, thanks again.

G-31 01-27-2010 12:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaybirdjtt (Post 14630781)
http://www.lewilson.com/home.html

Their inside/outside deburring tool for $20. I've found that it also works for removing the crimp in the primer pocket of military brass.

The information that came with your dies has instructions for adjusting the amount of neck flare. Some dies have an neck expander ball above the deprimer pin. Put a micrometer on the expander ball. Some dies have a separate die for neck flaring. I have so many dies that I cannot remember which brand has which.
Generally speaking, you want to flare just enough to allow the bullet to be seated. With some cartridges, like the Sig, since you're using jacket bullets, I'd try not flaring at all and simply use the deburring tool.
Another thing, pay attention to your minimum overall length...bullet + cartridge case. Seating too deeply can result in dangerously higher pressure. There is a thread about this with a picture of a blown up Glock 31 somewhere on the forum. My manual cautions reloaders to make sure the neck of the case grips the bullet securely.

Thank you, I'll check the dies but I thought the instructions were generalized to all dies. What's a micrometer? Is the deburring tool the chamfer thing? And I have been comparing each round to a factory round, is that okay? Thanks again.

ilgunguygt 01-27-2010 12:53

Do you have a reloading manual to read? It sounds like you need to get up on the basics before you move any farther. You only have one set of fingers and eyes, remember that.

fredj338 01-27-2010 13:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Three-Five-Seven (Post 14630168)
The best thing I learned on this site is to take the expander ball out of the sizing die for 357 sig. You can substitute the decapper from any straight walled set, as they don't have expanders.

You can get a chamfering tool just about anywhere, but an ordinary countersink bit will work just as well. When you take the expander plug out of the sizer, you really must chamfer cases to ease bullet seating.

If you continue to load with the expander ball in place, you are creating a potentially dangerous situation. When your bullets set-back in the case, due to insufficient neck tension, it can cause pressure spikes in your loads. These can actually be serious enough to blow your pistol up. So, clean up your act -- pronto!

This really depends on your dies. RCBS dies have had problems since they were introduced. They assumed it would load like a rifle, hence 2 dies, it really does not. It loads like any straight wall pistol case. I load 357sig on Dillon carbide dies, expander in place, slight flare w/ the powder through expander, good taper crimp. I have no setback isues using proper bullets. Full length sizing is turning the die down all the way until it touches the raised shell holder. You may have an early, poor set of dies from RCBS. They do not sise the case for proper headspace on the small shoulder. I would suggest the Lee dies w/a carbide 40 sizer ordered separate.
The 147grXTP just works, if your die setup is perfect. Measure the expander mandrel, it should be undersized, about 0.350" works. You can chuck it into a drill & polish it down. It sounds like you are pretty new to the reloading thing. I woudl put the 257sig aside until you get some add'l. exp. loading the 40s. You can mess up pretty badly trying to load 357sig w/ no experience. Your questions tell me you have not read a reloading manual or two. Research, there are no internet shortcuts.

PCJim 01-27-2010 13:07

G-31, it would seem from your further line of questions that you have skipped the entire "introduction and basic reloading" section of the reloading manual that you (hopefully) have read. If I'm correct, I'll be the first to bust your cohonas and advise you to go do some reading. If I am wrong, my apologies.

The "rocket shaped think" is a chamfering/deburring tool used to "dress" the case mouth. One end puts a slight angle on the inside of the case mouth to assist in starting a bullet, and the other end will deburr the outside of the case mouth to remove any rough edges left after trimming the case to proper length. Case trimming is not required for straight wall cases. Your 357SIG is a bottlenecked case and trimming may be required to keep the cases at or under SAAMI cartridge specifications.

A micrometer is a caliper, either digital or dial. These are used for measuring your COL which cannot be done accurately by simply comparing to factory rounds. Get one - digital calipers can be had at Harbor Freight on sale for around $10.

There are a bunch of VERY knowledgable reloaders here on this board who enjoy helping others to learn the art of reloading. It is preferred that newbies, at a minimum, do some of their own homework by reading about reloading.

G-31 01-27-2010 14:09

Thanks everyone, I am new but I thought cause I successfully fired some .40 this was all going to be very easy. I'll read the book that came with my press, is there a book that all reloaders have to have that I should get and is there anything else I can do so I don't sound like a complete idiot next time I ask for your help? Thank you.

PCJim 01-27-2010 15:58

G, You need to obtain for reading and future re-reading "The ABC's of Reloading". You should also have on hand one or more reloading data books - Speer, Lyman, Hornady and others publish these books and they ALL devote the first several chapters of their books to the techniques of reloading.

The point that they ALL devote the very beginning of their books to reloading should give you some idea of how important it is to read first, then re-read and understand what you are reading, before practicing any reloading. Otherwise, you are delving into the no man's land of making miniature but highly explosive devices without guidance that could injure, or worse - kill, yourself and innocent bystanders.

Bret 01-27-2010 16:30

G-31, I also agree that you should do a ton of reading before you actually start reloading. In regard to 357Sig, I recommend that you wait until you get more experience loading regular straight walled pistol cases (like 40S&W) and regular bottle necked rifle cases (like 223Rem, 308Win, etc.). Bottle necked pistol cases are typically more difficult to load than either of the above. I load 7.62x25 and 30Luger. They're just more of a challenge, but OK once you know what you're doing.

Colorado4Wheel 01-27-2010 16:44

Just a piece of advice. Considering you loaded .40SW and didn't kill yourself or anyone else you at least have some knowledge (not enough but some). The key to .357 SIG is all about bullet/case tension. It is the one thing people have issues with (who already know what they are doing). I would get a couple reloading Manuals. Read them. What kind of press you using? Maybe someone will know about the instructions you have and how complete they are compared to a real manual.

fredj338 01-27-2010 16:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by PCJim (Post 14632228)
G, You need to obtain for reading and future re-reading "The ABC's of Reloading". You should also have on hand one or more reloading data books - Speer, Lyman, Hornady and others publish these books and they ALL devote the first several chapters of their books to the techniques of reloading.

The point that they ALL devote the very beginning of their books to reloading should give you some idea of how important it is to read first, then re-read and understand what you are reading, before practicing any reloading. Otherwise, you are delving into the no man's land of making miniature but highly explosive devices without guidance that could injure, or worse - kill, yourself and innocent bystanders.

This can't be stressed enough. AS I already statd, there are no shortcuts to reloading only to the hospital. It's not rocket science but it can be learned as you go w/o some basics understood first. At least read the loading manual at a minimum. The ABCs of Reloading is a great book for newbs. If there is an exp. (to me that is someone that loads for at least a rev. a pistol & rifle) reloader near you willing to come & mentor for a couple hours, it will save you tons of time in trial & error. If you are that lucky, take notes. There are many small things, like proper die setup, that will just make things go so much easier, to major things like how to chooes an appropriate powder/bulelt combo. Unfortunately, asking gunshop employees is pretty useless as they often know little to nothing about reloading. Do some serious reading, come back & ask some questions which you may then be able to understand the answers to. Good luck, be very, very careful.:whistling:

dudley 01-29-2010 13:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by G-31 (Post 14628810)
Hi everyone I'm proud to say I have begun reloading and I fired my first 20 rounds of .40 today that I created! This evening however I started on my .357 Sig brass and I've been having some difficulty with it. The casing does not grip the bullet at all with some rounds and it falls in, I'm using .355 147 gr. Hornady JHP's which I'm pretty sure are the rights bullets so what step am I missing? Any help would be appreciated, thanks.

I have loaded and shot about 2000 rounds and I took the advise directly from RCBS.

NO BELL
NO CRIMP
JUST CHAMFER A BIT
I use only jacketed bullets

No issues since I started this, but as always especially with this round, IF YOU CHAMBER THE ROUND either SHOOT IT OUT or EXJECT AND PULL THE BULLET. This is a bit overkill, but help prevent you from bullet setback.

ALSO AA#9 12-13 grains, will prevent bullet setback

fredj338 01-29-2010 13:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by dudley (Post 14644724)
I have loaded and shot about 2000 rounds and I took the advise directly from RCBS.

NO BELL
NO CRIMP
JUST CHAMFER A BIT
I use only jacketed bullets

No issues since I started this, but as always especially with this round, IF YOU CHAMBER THE ROUND either SHOOT IT OUT or EXJECT AND PULL THE BULLET. This is a bit overkill, but help prevent you from bullet setback.

ALSO AA#9 12-13 grains, will prevent bullet setback

You have had success, but since RCBS got the orignal die specs wrong, I can't support their instructions. The round headspaces on the small shoulder, RCBS says on the case mouth, that is wrong. If you shoot plated bullets, a slight bell will help keep them from gouging the bases. I have even collapsed case neck trying to seat w/o some slight bell. I would rather bell than chamfer, chamfer leaves less neck mat'l. for a good crimp. RCBS got it wrong IMO, Dillon dies are perfect, Lee & Redding also got it right, but are not carbide (which baffles me, just put the carbide sizer in from the 40 die).:dunno:

nraman 02-07-2010 00:13

What about bullets? I understand that there are 357Sig specific bullets that have a longer bearing surface for better neck tension.


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