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-   -   45 Super? (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1382239)

flyandscuba 11-18-2011 06:40

45 Super?
 
Anyone using 45 Super in their G21, G30, or G36? Just wondering how the Glocks perform with it... If it works well, I might consider switching from 10mm Auto to 45 Super.

Glock30Eric 11-18-2011 07:49

I have seen people saying it is doing very well with Glock. I have been considering about it. But first I need to build my experience with the reloading thing before I start working on 45 super.

ArmyDoc 11-27-2011 11:29

Check on the Big Dawgs forum - there's a couple of threads there. Here's the longest: http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=197490

BOOSTED12A 12-01-2011 10:28

hmm, this is interesting. i was gonna get a 20 after the new year but i may just get some super barss and a new spring/rod.

ArmyDoc 12-01-2011 10:37

That's essentially what I decided to do. Several people have reported 45 super loads that exceed 10mm in power.

I'm going to start reloading 45 super brass at +P+ levels. Should provide excellent margin of safety and push 230 JHPs at ~1100 -1200 fps.

RWBlue 12-01-2011 10:50

Yes, I have a G21 setup for 45Super.

What should be understood is there is 45Super and there is 45SUPER. When I started there was very little reloading data for the 45Super so I went off book and made my own. What I ended up with is 45SUPER. Or to put it a different way, I pushed the ends of envelope.

If you are just wanting 45Super or 45ACP++P then it can be done with a standard Glock. If you plan on pushing the ends of the envelope then heavy spring, guiderod, new barrel, comp or suppressor is needed. If you continue to push the ends, it will beat up your Glock.

I am not sure what more to tell you. Oh, wait a minute.
1. If you are not a reloader, the 45 Super is not for you.
2. If you want to load to 454 levels, you will not get there with the 45Super.
3. With the bullets I tested the extra power of the 45Super is not realized because the bullets are designed for 45ACP and 45LC. A 260gr JHP bullet needs to be designed for the correct velocity before a 45SUPER will be a good hunting round.

BOOSTED12A 12-01-2011 11:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArmyDoc (Post 18229121)
That's essentially what I decided to do. Several people have reported 45 super loads that exceed 10mm in power.

I'm going to start reloading 45 super brass at +P+ levels. Should provide excellent margin of safety and push 230 JHPs at ~1100 -1200 fps.

im plannin on flat nose for hunting rnds at around those velosites, mabe a bit more.

ArmyDoc 12-01-2011 12:33

I don't think you'll have any problem doing that.

The biggest problem is, as RWBlue said, there is little published reloading data. Hodgdon only lists up to 20,000 Cup. Not very helpfull when +P is 23,000 Cup, and I've been told Ace Custom who developed the round is loading at 27,000 Cup. There is no published maximum.

One thing that could help would be a 6 inch after market barrel - that would give slower powders a bit more time to act, which is supposed to help with heavier bullets.

It would be nice to have a reloading thread for 45 Super, similar to the threads on the 10mm Reloading forum.

BOOSTED12A 12-01-2011 12:54

i have access to a chrono so after the holidays ill get some brass and the other stuff. the new barrel will be after ive experemented some.

ArmyDoc 12-01-2011 16:32

That would be great! What powder/bullet combination do you think you will start with?

BOOSTED12A 12-02-2011 05:10

probbaly 200grn flat nose FMJ. ive been loading with WSF so ill have to get different powder. ill post the results when i have some thing

RWBlue 12-02-2011 09:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArmyDoc (Post 18230464)
That would be great! What powder/bullet combination do you think you will start with?

There is a good bit more data available online now than when I started. If you make a spreadsheet and add all the data you can find as well as the source, you can easily sort out the data that is not right.

Assuming you are doing the new barrel, compensator, and heavy spring. I would tell you can look at Rowland data also.

As always start a little low and work up. The limits with my setup is not going to get me a Kaboom, it will just beat my glock to death.

I don't have my load data with me, but from memory I think I had the best results from Power Pistol, AA#7 and Bluedot when I was pushing it hard.

As far as what bullet, that is a personal decision. I assume you are not loading for personal protection against people. (There is not much to gain over 45ACP+P) If you are loading for paper there are lots of options. I spent a lot of time working with Rainier PHP bullets in 185gr, 200gr and 230gr. They are cost effective for load development. The really light .451 bullets fly flatter. The 260gr Speer JHP bullets will feed, but will not open unless pushed VERY hard. The 300gr bullets are not recommended. I have some Hungarian 45ACP JHP. The bullets will not open at the factory speed. I always said I was going to pull some and load them to 45Super to see if they may be the ultimate 45Super JHP loads. I would also look at some of the bonded bullets because they should hold together better than the unbonded ones I was trying.

ArmyDoc 12-02-2011 11:03

RWBlue,

I'm primarily interested in 230gr JHP at 1100 fps or so for deer, +/- hogs. This is about 10% faster than a factory loaded +p. Do you know of a JHP that will hold together at this velocity?

RWBlue 12-02-2011 16:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArmyDoc (Post 18233428)
RWBlue,

I'm primarily interested in 230gr JHP at 1100 fps or so for deer, +/- hogs. This is about 10% faster than a factory loaded +p. Do you know of a JHP that will hold together at this velocity?

From what I remember.....
The best rounds were Rainier and Bonded Gold dots. The Rainier would become teardrops of lead and most of the lead would stay together. The Gold dot did a little better.

Gold Saber and other non-bonded rounds lost the jacket very quickly and then the lead continued through the gel like the Rainier.

In a totally different way....I really liked the Triton Quickshock. It dumped all its energy in the first 12 inches breaking the setup I had the gel sitting in. The bullet would break into 3 or 4 sections and head off in unknown directions sometimes exiting the gel. If I were to design an anti-personnel round this would be it. But they no longer make this bullet.

It is really too bad I lost most of these pictures. They were interesting.

RWBlue 12-02-2011 16:14

Picture time
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/n...ssDSC_0001.jpg
From left to right you can see the bulge build. I was using a glock factory barrel, Star 45Super brass, and it wouldn't have take much to end up with a Kaboom. The KKM barrel is much better.

Bad pictures of the Triton ammo.
http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/n...mmo/img074.jpg

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/n...mmo/img075.jpg

ArmyDoc 12-03-2011 07:29

what were you loading that caused the case bulges?

RWBlue 12-03-2011 08:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArmyDoc (Post 18236897)
what were you loading that caused the case bulges?

Use data at own risk.
260gr Speer, AA#7, Standard Glock barrel.
10grs appears safe. Beyond that it gets questionable very fast. Fast enough that I was using a RCBS digital scale loading one round at a time and I wouldn't recommend it with a standard Glock barrel.

BOOSTED12A 12-03-2011 16:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by RWBlue (Post 18237149)
Use data at own risk.
260gr Speer, AA#7, Standard Glock barrel.
10grs appears safe. Beyond that it gets questionable very fast. Fast enough that I was using a RCBS digital scale loading one round at a time and I wouldn't recommend it with a standard Glock barrel.

what velosities were you getting with the 10g?

vaquero aleman 02-12-2012 06:52

I would like to ask the "dumb question". 45 Super can be shot out of a 45 ACP barrel? I don't have to buy a special barrel to put in my G21? Can 45 Super be bought online? It sounds like the people here that are shooting 45 Super are reloading and not buying the ammo from Midway or DT, so I guess that means that I need to find a local gun shop that will reload for me? And, since I will be recieving an LWD 45LTH soon, is the LWD barrel any better than the Glock 45 ACP for shooting 45 Super?

RWBlue 02-12-2012 11:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by BOOSTED12A (Post 18238662)
what velosities were you getting with the 10g?

Sorry, missed this post.
I don't have that information with me. It is in a container with my reloading stuff several thousand miles away.

RWBlue 02-12-2012 11:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by vaquero aleman (Post 18566520)
I would like to ask the "dumb question". 45 Super can be shot out of a 45 ACP barrel? I don't have to buy a special barrel to put in my G21? Can 45 Super be bought online? It sounds like the people here that are shooting 45 Super are reloading and not buying the ammo from Midway or DT, so I guess that means that I need to find a local gun shop that will reload for me? And, since I will be recieving an LWD 45LTH soon, is the LWD barrel any better than the Glock 45 ACP for shooting 45 Super?

IMHO, If you are shooting 45Super out of a standard Glock21 barrel, you are pushing your luck.

I don't know about the LWD barrel. For shooting 45Super it is all about support. If you look at the photo I posted above, I was shooting the 45Super in an unsupported barrel and I got bulge.

IMHO, If you are going to push the 45Super as hard as possible, you need a compensator.

I believe Buffalo Bore is loading the 45Super so you don't have to find a local person who may or may not be competent to load your ammo, but.......

IMHO,
1. If you want to shoot hot and heavy in a Glock.
2. If you don't reload
3. If you don't want to beat your gun into the ground
4. If you don't want a comp.
Get a G20. Most people are happy with the 10mm.

The G21 with special barrel with comp where you have spent a good bit of time slowly working up loads selecting the correct bullet is the most powerful Glock out there.

vaquero aleman 02-13-2012 17:11

This is the beginning of my new-to-me Zombie Gun! I plan on starting off with 45 Super and then we will see what happens. At the moment, the only thing mod about her is the 6.61" LWD-21L45TH, a 22# Wolff recoil spring/guide rod and Wilson Combat recoil buffer. She came with Trijicon novac rear and standard front night sights. Now that I'm 49 and can't focus on the sights anymore, I think I'll be looking for some laser action. Isn't that just life! I trade for a G21, luck up and get an OD with decent sights and I can't see the bamn things anymore!

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...eman/003-1.jpg

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...20Ammo/3-1.jpg

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...0Ammo/11-1.jpg

Got an LWD compensator ordered, from glockparts.com LWD was out of stock. This was one of the few(very few) times that in-my-face advertising was a help. I found glockparts.com at the bottom of these posts.

vaquero aleman 02-26-2012 09:25

Since I enjoy asking these kinds of questions: Has anybody here chronographed Double Tap 45 ACP? I shot some DT 185gn Nosler and Winchester 230gn slowball out of my 6.61" LWD w/22# spring and the DT caused failure to feeds while the Winchester did not, leaving me, as usual, dazed and confused.

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...%20Ammo/31.jpg

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...0Ammo/30-1.jpg
Dunno if this is clear enough or not, but does this show enough to say wether or not the LWD has the proper support?

SDGlock23 02-26-2012 12:38

Yes your LW barrel has lots better support. I have a KKM barrel and 500pcs of Starline 45 Super brass, but haven't worked anything up yet.

vaquero aleman 02-29-2012 09:38

All I need now is ammo!

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...0Ammo/G5-2.jpg

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...0Ammo/G6-2.jpg

http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...0Ammo/G2-1.jpg


http://i1163.photobucket.com/albums/...0Ammo/G8-1.jpg

***I have put this piece together with the knowledge that I have gained from reading the posts here on GlockTalk. Thanks everybody. All of you were a great help!


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