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-   -   DPMS Sportical VS. S&W Sport Rifle (http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1396537)

Civilian sheep Dog 01-22-2012 12:00

DPMS Sportical VS. S&W Sport Rifle
 
Hey guys, I have a few extra dollars coming back to me this year, went all of 2011 with no major purchases. Now I'm in the market for a AR. the two I have in mind are the DPMS Sportical rifle (223/5.56) or the S&W M&P Sport which is the same caliber AR. I'm kinda leaning towards the M&P curious if anyone out there has any experience with either of these rifles or would recommend either of them
Thanks

Bimmer1 01-22-2012 13:58

The M&P 15 Sport model get lots of great reviews!!! If you want a bare bones AR the M&P 15 Sport isn't a bad way to go.

Reswob 01-22-2012 15:00

Most would say both are crap, and you could find a much better AR for the money...

Javelin 01-22-2012 15:11

Yeah I wouldn't choose either to be honest. I have better things to spend $600 bones on.

wrx04 01-22-2012 15:20

I recently did all the research for my first AR, and it can get kinda overwhelming for a newbie. My conclusion was the Colt 6920 is the best bang for the buck out there. I got one for $957 shipped from dsgarms.com, which is pretty damn good (no tax either). Save up a couple hundred extra bucks.

The general consensus was colt, DD, or BCM is the only way to go if you plan on putting anything more than a couple hundred rounds through it. Buy once, cry once.

Good luck.

zhix 01-22-2012 16:04

Out of those twoI think pretty much everyone will favor the S&W hands down.

But yes, Colt 6920 for sure.

Delcorbett 01-22-2012 16:09

I got to handle a m&p 15 sport the other day and was impressed. It had a heavy barrel, and a magpul 30rnd mag, it was 629.99, cannot go wrong for the price.


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bug 01-22-2012 16:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Civilian sheep Dog (Post 18470003)
Hey guys, I have a few extra dollars coming back to me this year, went all of 2011 with no major purchases. Now I'm in the market for a AR. the two I have in mind are the DPMS Sportical rifle (223/5.56) or the S&W M&P Sport which is the same caliber AR. I'm kinda leaning towards the M&P curious if anyone out there has any experience with either of these rifles or would recommend either of them
Thanks

I do not Have either, so I don't really KNOW for sure but I have seen a lot of positive stuff about the M&P.

Also my understanding is that S&W is going to be offering a $100 rebate on M&P rifles so that should bring the price if you shop around to about $550 with tax out the door...

collim1 01-22-2012 16:20

I have zero experience with the DPMS, but the M&P sport is hard to beat for the money. I consider it a "range only" gun, but it is a great shooter.

Reliable and accurate.

Its a great choice for someone who doesn't need a rifle fit for the battlefield or patrol.

Civilian sheep Dog 01-22-2012 16:41

Cool thanks for the input

Civilian sheep Dog 01-22-2012 20:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by bug (Post 18471093)
I do not Have either, so I don't really KNOW for sure but I have seen a lot of positive stuff about the M&P.

Also my understanding is that S&W is going to be offering a $100 rebate on M&P rifles so that should bring the price if you shop around to about $550 with tax out the door...

If it's the Jan-June promo it excludes the AR 15 sport. But non the less still a great deal for a reliable AR.

bigcountry31987 01-22-2012 21:32

i am in the market for a ar-15 as well and the s&w sport looked good to me too but it doesn't have forward assist no dust cover...not saying u really need all that but cant hurt right ....from what a lot of guys told me go with either a stag or rock river ...u can get a nicer rifle for only a little more $$$$ ....also hear great things about palmetto state armory and their prices are awesome

emopunker2004 01-22-2012 21:46

I say build your own. Buy an upper. Buy a stripped lower and lower parts kit.
PSA has good prices right now.

JaPes 01-22-2012 21:51

I always love these types of replies. They're just so darn useful aren't they?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reswob (Post 18470812)
Most would say both are crap, and you could find a much better AR for the money...

"Most would say..." Really? If "most" people think it's crap it's got to be true! :rofl:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javelin (Post 18470864)
Yeah I wouldn't choose either to be honest. I have better things to spend $600 bones on.

No elaboration on why you wouldn't choose either? That's helpful.

Several others have asked the OP's question recently. I'll combine the posts I've written as replies:

I'll be honest. I was in the same position as you when deciding what AR to buy on a budget. Do I buy a complete rifle? Do I build a lower & top it off with an upper? When I started doing my initial research, I was overwhelmed with the myriad of AR build options & details.

Even though I'm mechanically inclined & a tinkerer, I erred on the side of caution. I purchased my S&W M&P 15-Sport. I don't delude myself into believing that I'm a "tactical operator". When I put my skills & use into context, the S&W M&P 15-Sport fulfills my needs at the right price.

While I understand the need for a dust cover, the omission of it wouldn't be an issue for my use. I'm at a range. I'm not running & gunning nor competing in any three gun competitions.

While I understand the purpose & function of a forward assist, the omission of it isn't an issue given my skill level. If a round does not fully chamber, I can gently push on the scallop on the bolt to get it into full battery. If the bolt does not go into battery, my inexperience with the AR platform combined with a forward assist could cause a bigger problem. I'd rather eject the round that won't properly chamber & inspect it, than be an idiot jamming on the forward assist making things worse.

While I understand the benefits of chrome lined barrels, the fact is that I'm obsessive about cleaning my firearms after every range visit. A chrome lined barrel isn't a priority for the way I will use an AR.

My lack of knowledge also gave me pause. If it breaks, will I have the tools, resources, & knowledge to fix it on my own? The S&W's limited lifetime factory warranty is a security blanket for this newbie AR owner.

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...IMG_0266-1.jpg

Is it the best? Is it the most tactical? Probably not. The S&W M&P 15-Sport is a good practical, all-round rifle. For this AR newb, it is serving as a great gateway to the AR addiction.

It's barrel is chambered for 5.56, so I can shoot .223 or 5.56. The 1:8 5R rifling is the "Goldilocks" rifling. I can shoot ammo with projectile weights in the middle of the range. I don't shoot projectile weights nearing either end of the range. The Melonite treatment makes cleaning easy.

As others have advised, you can assemble your own lower & top it off with a complete upper for about the same price. This advice & then post purchase reaction was always given with a good-hearted ribbing.

Being mechanically inclined & a tinkerer, I the thought of building a lower stuck with me. Having the S&W M&P 15-Sport allowed me to really look at the lower to see how it's all put together. I decided to give it a try.

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...pedLower-1.jpg

+

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...PartsKit-1.jpg

+

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...ck-Black-1.jpg

=

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...b176be-1-1.jpg

I was a bit apprehensive to build my own lower. I shouldn't have been. If you follow directions step-by-step, assembling a lower is not difficult. I found it to be easy to do. The parts are as plug & play as they get.

Even though I built a budget lower, using standard parts, I take a measure of pride in assembling it. Assembling my own was also a learning experience. I know how a basic AR lower functions.

IMO, you can't go wrong either buying a complete rifle like a S&W M&P 15-Sport, or taking the plunge & assembling a lower + topping it off with a complete upper.

Either way, you'll end up with a good rifle within your budget.

As for me the more I learn about the AR, the more I realize that there's so much more I don't know. I'm always learning something new.

Good luck with your decision, & let us know how it turns out for you.

Cheers!

Javelin 01-22-2012 22:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaPes (Post 18472750)
I always love these types of replies. They're just so darn useful aren't they?



"Most would say..." Really? If "most" people think it's crap it's got to be true!



No elaboration on why you wouldn't choose either? That's helpful.

Several others have asked the OP's question recently. I'll combine the posts I've written as replies:

I'll be honest. I was in the same position as you when deciding what AR to buy on a budget. Do I buy a complete rifle? Do I build a lower & top it off with an upper? When I started doing my initial research, I was overwhelmed with the myriad of AR build options & details.

Even though I'm mechanically inclined & a tinkerer, I erred on the side of caution. I purchased my S&W M&P 15-Sport. I don't delude myself into believing that I'm a "tactical operator". When I put my skills & use into context, the S&W M&P 15-Sport fulfills my needs at the right price.

While I understand the need for a dust cover, the omission of it wouldn't be an issue for my use. I'm at a range. I'm not running & gunning nor competing in any three gun competitions.

While I understand the purpose & function of a forward assist, the omission of it isn't an issue given my skill level. If a round does not fully chamber, I can gently push on the scallop on the bolt to get it into full battery. If the bolt does not go into battery, my inexperience with the AR platform combined with a forward assist could cause a bigger problem. I'd rather eject the round that won't properly chamber & inspect it, than be an idiot jamming on the forward assist making things worse.

While I understand the benefits of chrome lined barrels, the fact is that I'm obsessive about cleaning my firearms after every range visit. A chrome lined barrel isn't a priority for the way I will use an AR.

My lack of knowledge also gave me pause. If it breaks, will I have the tools, resources, & knowledge to fix it on my own? The S&W's limited lifetime factory warranty is a security blanket for this newbie AR owner.

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...IMG_0266-1.jpg

Is it the best? Is it the most tactical? Probably not. The S&W M&P 15-Sport is a good practical, all-round rifle. For this AR newb, it is serving as a great gateway to the AR addiction.

It's barrel is chambered for 5.56, so I can shoot .223 or 5.56. The 1:8 5R rifling is the "Goldilocks" rifling. I can shoot ammo with projectile weights in the middle of the range. I don't shoot projectile weights nearing either end of the range. The Melonite treatment makes cleaning easy.

As others have advised, you can assemble your own lower & top it off with a complete upper for about the same price. This advice & then post purchase reaction was always given with a good-hearted ribbing.

Being mechanically inclined & a tinkerer, I the thought of building a lower stuck with me. Having the S&W M&P 15-Sport allowed me to really look at the lower to see how it's all put together. I decided to give it a try.

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...pedLower-1.jpg

+

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...PartsKit-1.jpg

+

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...ck-Black-1.jpg

=

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f2...b176be-1-1.jpg

I was a bit apprehensive to build my own lower. I shouldn't have been. If you follow directions step-by-step, assembling a lower is not difficult. I found it to be easy to do. The parts are as plug & play as they get.

Even though I built a budget lower, using standard parts, I take a measure of pride in assembling it. Assembling my own was also a learning experience. I know how a basic AR lower functions.

IMO, you can't go wrong either buying a complete rifle like a S&W M&P 15-Sport, or taking the plunge & assembling a lower + topping it off with a complete upper.

Either way, you'll end up with a good rifle within your budget.

As for me the more I learn about the AR, the more I realize that there's so much more I don't know. I'm always learning something new.

Good luck with your decision, & let us know how it turns out for you.

Cheers!

Defend your purchase & methods all you want. Most of us have and have owned the brands. I wouldn't waste my $600 on either of those rifles.

Why even bother saying more? :dunno:

JaPes 01-22-2012 22:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javelin (Post 18472848)
Defend your purchase & methods all you want. Most of us have and have owned the brands. I wouldn't waste my $600 on either of those rifles.

Why even bother saying more? :dunno:

I was relating why, as a new AR owner, I made my choice. Maybe the OP can find something useful in it, and put it into the context of his choice.

I'll reiterate that the S&W M&P Sport may not be the best rifle, but it is a good gateway to the AR addiction.

Why bother saying more? Because the information/experience you have can possibly help those of us that don't have the same level of experience as you.

Javelin 01-22-2012 22:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaPes (Post 18472879)
I was relating why, as a new AR owner, I made my choice. Maybe the OP can find something useful in it, and put it into the context of his choice.

I'll reiterate that the S&W M&P Sport may not be the best rifle, but it is a good gateway to the AR addiction.

Why bother saying more? Because the information/experience you have can possibly help those of us that don't have the same level of experience as you.

There is a search button if the OP is really looking into serious ARs.

Tim151515 01-22-2012 22:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javelin (Post 18472848)
Defend your purchase & methods all you want. Most of us have and have owned the brands. I wouldn't waste my $600 on either of those rifles.

Why even bother saying more? :dunno:

I know right. an ar rifle is only good if it is ready to go to battle in the mountains of afghanistan right now. those people who just want one to have fun with at the range without all the extra features that is the price of a handgun or less are just wasting their money :faint:

JaPes 01-22-2012 22:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaPes (Post 18472879)
Why bother saying more? Because the information/experience you have can possibly help those of us that don't have the same level of experience as you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javelin (Post 18472893)
There is a search button if the OP is really looking into serious ARs.

Ok then.

JaPes 01-22-2012 22:47

I took a look at a picture of the DPMS Sportical. The exterior difference, other than the front sights, that stood out is that the DPMS Sportical does not have a brass deflector by the ejection port whereas the M&P Sport does.

If you're a left-handed shooter, it could be an important difference.

Javelin 01-22-2012 22:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim151515 (Post 18472901)
I know right. an ar rifle is only good if it is ready to go to battle in the mountains of afghanistan right now. those people who just want one to have fun with at the range without all the extra features that is the price of a handgun or less are just wasting their money :faint:

Naw. But I have given up trying to tell people to buy this or buy that. I just try and answer the question they presented. I have an affinity for Noveske Rifles but I am willing to drop $2k+ on a rifle. I understand many cannot. So there are Colts, Daniel Defense, LMT... then there are also BCM, LWRT, Stag... and of course we can't forget PSA, BM, Armalite, Ruger, SIG... it is just a laundry list of guns and everyone has an opinion.

Mine for this thread is that there are many other things I would drop $600 on and a DPMS Sportical or S&W Sportical are not on that list.

Javelin 01-22-2012 23:03

It is also almost midnight here and I am very tired but cannot sleep so .... I guess the long and short of it is this.

CivilianSheepDog I like you (as most on this forum). I wouldn't and don't want to steer someone wrong. I am 100% confident that you will be better served saving up $385 more dollars and buying a Colt 6920. It will serve you well and you will enjoy it for years. And no, just for the record I don't love Colts. I don't consider them to be the end-all-be-all rifle like many parrot every single day on other boards. They are just a very good value for the money and really a solid gun that your grand kids will be able to enjoy.

Or you can easily find uppers & lowers slightly used on sale on many M4 forums that are great value. BCM for instance allows you to build your upper and lower and have them shipped seperately. If you wish (and I recommend should you choose to 'build' yourself) is as stated above by buying a complete upper and then buying a stripped lower of the same brand you found your upper because the hugh of the coloration varies from makers and they can look purplish or grey or black depending so having them match and having a matched rifle will help in resale should you do so later down the road.

Then go ahead and assemble the stripped lower from a DD/PSA/etc parts kit (or whatever parts kit you get a deal on... I would avoid DPMS to be honest but some on here found they have had no issues with so I will leave it at that).

Then you have a decent AR for about $800 total after everything is said and done. Else, just get a Colt. Buying a quality AR is pricey. Buying another AR to replace and upgrade the lesser one you bought is where it gets expensive.

JaPes 01-22-2012 23:34

Thank you sir! I understand how tiring it can be to answer the same question again and again. I do appreciate you taking the time out to give out some advice.

I didn't think to keep a build's stripped lower & upper from the same manufacturer due to finish differences. I'm banging my head against the desk for not thinking about that. I'll have to deal with that bone-headed mistake when I finally decide on a complete upper. I'm taking my time so I can figure things out.

I've held a Colt 6920. The local FFL had one at a recent gun show. The end-customer let me handle it. I had to keep my drool off it. I hear nothing but good things about it. A Colt is definitely on the distant future buy list.

I understand dropping $2K on a Noveseke rifle. Like everything, there's a measure of truth in the saying "you get what you pay for". I put it in context of my former sport bike riding days. While I loved my CBR 600rr, I knew it was not even close to any Italian bike. They're both sport bikes, and both grossly do the same thing. The difference was in the fine details that affected the overall experience.

G30Mike 01-22-2012 23:51

FWIW, I have a DPMS Sportical for a range toy and haven't had any problems with it. Only have about 600 rounds through it, and the only time I had a malfunction was one light primer strike. That was within the first 50 or so rounds fired. All in all, I'm very happy with it.
Planning on ordering the CMMG 300 Blackout upper to use on the lower in a week or so.

joecoastie 01-23-2012 04:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by wrx04 (Post 18470920)

The general consensus was colt, DD, or BCM is the only way to go if you plan on putting anything more than a couple hundred rounds through it. Buy once, cry once.

Good luck.

Well, I have a couple hundred rounds through my S&W Sport, guess I better just throw the POS in the trash since I've exceeded its service life....:dunno:


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