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shooter1234 06-19-2012 21:35

High end 1911's...
 
Ok. I know I'm going to get flamed for this, but I gotta get it off of my mind.

2000-4000 dollar 1911 owners. Why.
Please tell me, what you expected to do, with a 14 pound pistol that only holds 7 (yea ok, the new magazines hold one more. thats nice. I dont care.)
rounds, and is twice as big as any modern day polymer auto pistol. Did you think you were going to actually carry this concealed? Where. Oh wait, let me guess, under your IDPA converted tactical fishing vest, in an inside the waistband kydex holster. Right. Right in the middle of August, when it's 92 degrees. Sure. THAT won't be obvious or anything. How's all those sharp edges digging into your side? And for how long were you planning on carrying it? A whole week? How did that work out for you? Lol. Pretty inconvenient after a few days isn't it. Yea, I know, you're strong, and the extra 12 pounds over any other auto pistol on the planet doesn't bother you. Sorry. I carried an M60 machine gun in the Army, and I know about extra weight. Was a radio man after that. That doesn't mean that I'm going to carry an extra ten pounds if I don't really have to. The running phrase in the Infantry was "There's a fine line between hardcore and stupid." You guys must have never been in the Infantry.


Ok, so you can bench 450, and do your 20 kilometer roadmarch in under 2:30 hours. What does your 3000 dollar hand fitted 1911 do that any Sig, S&W, Beretta, Glock, or Springer doesn't? So your groups were 2" at 50 yards off-hand, and your Glock was holding you back? So what did your Caspian, STI or Baer shrink your groups to at the 50 yard line? 1"? Sure... If you were that good, you wouldn't have bought your 1911; it would have been given to you by your sponsor. Ok. So you're rich, AND strong. You chose a caliber that doesn't give you ANY advantage whatsoever in imparted energy, penetration, or external ballistics (trajectory), and only has a hand full of ft./lbs. of energy advantage over .40 in the +p category, but now boxes of your ammunition are about 6 dollars more than other calibers. Nice choice again.
At 2000 dollars, I could have bought 3-4 other typical handguns. I could have bought a KelTec .380 at 220 for deep summer carry, a Glock 26 or S&W M&P compact for around 425 for winter carry, and a used Glock 17 for around 400 for IDPA/home defense/SHTF combat gun, all for around HALF of ONE of your custom 13 pound 1911's.

Alright, so you don't carry it. It's for local shoots and home defense. Nice. 2500 dollars for a safe gun. So a Springfield or used Kimber wouldn't have done it? So everyone around you is outshooting you because your Kimber is holding you back? Not buyin' it...

Don't get me wrong. I love 1911's. I think they're great guns. Truly classic. I've owned one, and 2 Hi Powers. And will eventually own another one of each. But for now, they're just not practical enough to warrant taking up room in the safe. I just can't understand all the guys that try to defend their 3000 dollar pistol purchases, when they're not even serious competitors, or sponsored shooters. It doesn't matter if you have the money in the bank to be able to do it. The amount of money one has, has nothing to do with logical choices. Unless you're a super super serious competitor, and haven't gotten picked up yet by a major company, you could have five million in the bank, and a 3000 dollar 12 pound boat anchor would still be a dumb ass purchase.

(I want to be clear on the expensive 1911's. I mean full size guns over 2000 dollars. There's nothing wrong with a compact or sub-compact 1911 with reasonable prices like a 650 dollar Kimber for example. A lot of them have their edges melted, are relatively light weight, and can be used for a lot of different purposes.)

Wil Ufgood 06-19-2012 21:47

http://alisina.org/wp-content/upload...uslimpeace.jpg

Bodyarmorguy 06-19-2012 23:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
Ok. I know I'm going to get flamed for this, but I gotta get it off of my mind.

No flames. Just simply stating that you are wrong.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
2000-4000 dollar 1911 owners. Why.

Because I have the means to do so. Sorry about your luck.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
Please tell me, what you expected to do, with a 14 pound pistol that only holds 7 (yea ok, the new magazines hold one more. thats nice. I dont care.)
rounds, and is twice as big as any modern day polymer auto pistol.

Check you scales...weighs no where near that. It is slimmer than my issued Glock.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
Did you think you were going to actually carry this concealed? Where. Oh wait, let me guess, under your IDPA converted tactical fishing vest, in an inside the waistband kydex holster. Right. Right in the middle of August, when it's 92 degrees. Sure. THAT won't be obvious or anything.

I reside in east central FL where it is often closer to 100 than 90 during the July and August months. My usual off-duty attire during the summer months is cargo shorts, and an untucked (not oversized) polo shirt. I very comfortably and adequately conceal a 5 inch Government Model in an leather inside the waistband holster from 5 Shot Leather, backed up on the support side by at least 1 additionalmagazine and a C2 Taser.

Oh...BTW...found this quote by you in a thread you started:
Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
"Where do I find the Glock wind breakers at? I can't find them ANYwhere



Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
How's all those sharp edges digging into your side? And for how long were you planning on carrying it? A whole week? How did that work out for you? Lol. Pretty inconvenient after a few days isn't it.

When I spend $2k or more on a custom gun, I expect it to be devoid of sharp edges. Perhaps you allowed some rookie gunsmith to take advantage of you on a dehorning job? I have carried the rig described above during my off-duty hour for years.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
Yea, I know, you're strong, and the extra 12 pounds over any other auto pistol on the planet doesn't bother you. That doesn't mean that I'm going to carry an extra ten pounds if I don't really have to.

Is it 14, 10 or 12 pounds? Damn fad diets....the weight really fluctuates.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
You chose a caliber that doesn't give you ANY advantage whatsoever in imparted energy, penetration, or external ballistics (trajectory), and only has a hand full of ft./lbs. of energy advantage over .40 in the +p category, but now boxes of your ammunition are about 6 dollars more than other calibers. Nice choice again.

I like big bullets, so I carry them. The extra expense of .45 over 9mm or .40 doesn't bother me. AT work, because I have to, I carry a .40 pistol. Off-duty, I may ocassional switch from a 1911 to a Browning Hi-Power stoked with a proven 9mm round. By your logic the whole world shoould be carrying just one caliber.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
At 2000 dollars, I could have bought 3-4 other typical handguns.

And others would describe you as typical......me, not so much.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
Alright, so you don't carry it.

But I think that we already established that I do carry it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
So everyone around you is outshooting you because your Kimber is holding you back? Not buyin' it...

If I am out-shot, I blame the indian, not the arrow.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
Don't get me wrong. I love 1911's.

Based on your rant, that is like Hitler saying "Don't get me wrong, I love the Jews."

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
The amount of money one has, has nothing to do with logical choices.

True, you could afford a computer and yet you post your opinion which is still worth exactly what we have paid for it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
Unless you're a super super serious competitor, and haven't gotten picked up yet by a major company, you could have five million in the bank, and a 3000 dollar 12 pound boat anchor would still be a dumb ass purchase.

So nobody should own a Corvette, or a Ferarri, unless they are a competitive racer picked up by a major sponsor....buying one is a dumb ass purchase?

Quote:

Originally Posted by shooter1234 (Post 19109063)
I gotta get it off of my mind.

Feel better?

countrygun 06-20-2012 00:49

I have een a 1911 since 1977. My wife has become a fan to the point she bought her own kimber Ultra Raptor and recently brough home a Springfield Tropy Match.. The $2,000+ 1911's aren't for me, but then again I have built 1911's and would prefer to DIY a high end one myself. as a matter of fact I carried my Kimber Compact mot of the day. I could just as soon carried a full sized 1911 because our climate makes a "cover garment" normal whether you are carrying or not. I care not about the fact that it isn't High cap. If 7 .45s don't do it I have a spare mag or two which I will swap out as I am evacuating the area with all alacrity. (running like a japed ape is the technical term).

Having said that the REALLY expensive 1911's aren't for me I rhink they are absolutely terrific for those who want one. This is America and a top end 1911 is a great way to celebrate living in a great Country. I am seriously considering a high-end production 1911 .45 or 10mm in stainless to get really carried away with and having it engraved. Now there is really spending bucks on something totally unneccessary. But I can and I want one and that is all the justification it needs, just like a $2,000+ 1911.

clancy 06-20-2012 05:09

The reason I would spend that kind of money of a 1911 is the same reason I would spend it on a Boticelli, a bottle of 25 year old single malt Scotch or a 1956 Duoglide(yes, I am a man of diverse tastes). They are, in their own way, works of art.

I can dream, can't I?

uptomyneck 06-20-2012 07:49

All that time writing that lame post. You fail at rants.

LawScholar 06-20-2012 07:56

OP, this argument could be made about nearly any consumer good. Some people enjoy a more refined class of product, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. Do I love my Honda Accord which has gone 9 years without a wobble? Yes! But few would argue it's a better car than a Mercedes-Benz.

shooter1234 06-21-2012 09:26

Law scholar, this is true. And I have the same opinion about those products too. Like the Ferrari. They can cost 80 thousand dollars more than a nice Buick for example. Is that worth it? Absolutely not. There's comes a point where it's not a quality issue any longer. If you were to compare a Chevy Cavalier to a Mercedes than sure. There's a huge disparity between the two, in every single category. But is a Ferrari 80 grand better than a new Buick? Not at all. You're just shelling out money for the brand, and the fad factor, and NOTHING more.
Past say, a S&W M&P, a 2000 dollar 1911 is about 1575 extra dollars spent, to get a gun that doesn't do anything better than the Smith. It was spent for fad factor only. It's heavier and holds less rounds. If it's for the all steel single action preference only, then what was wrong with a 600 dollar Springfield then? What does a 2000 dollar 1911 do, for the local shoots or personal defense, that a 600 dollar Springfield cant?
Remember, I didn't post this thread because I can't figure out why people think 1911's are cool. There's nothing wrong with a 1911. It was the 2000 dollar plus models, that people use for everyday use. That's what I can't figure out.
All the weight, bulk, sharp edges, lack of magazine capacity, and levers and switches sticking out all over the place is tolerable to some people, for 400-700 dollars. I understand that. But for me, spending 2000 dollars, and still having to put up with all that **** just isn't worth it any longer. I could get spend 398 dollars and get a Glock 26, and not have to contend with ANY of that crap. I get a gun that does all the same things, a still be 1600 dollars ahead as well...

seanmac45 06-21-2012 09:34

Aren't you lucky then, that there are cheap guns for people with lower standards such as yourself.

LiebeGlock 06-21-2012 20:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by seanmac45 (Post 19114287)
Aren't you lucky then, that there are cheap guns for people with lower standards such as yourself.


Cheap guns or expensive guns they do the same thing. They go BANG... shoot someone and if you know what you're doing they're dead and your safe.

Wil Ufgood 06-21-2012 21:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiebeGlock (Post 19116540)
Cheap guns or expensive guns they do the same thing. They go BANG... shoot someone and if you know what you're doing they're dead and your safe.

Expensive guns are cool!:rofl:

Wil Ufgood 06-21-2012 21:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiebeGlock (Post 19116540)
Cheap guns or expensive guns they do the same thing. They go BANG... shoot someone and if you know what you're doing they're dead and your safe.

Yeah but I want to be safe in style! How embarrassing would a good shoot look with a Hi Point. What if the first responders on the scene are either hot female EMTs or officers? No play for mister low pay! :rofl:

attrapereves 06-22-2012 06:56

I view 1911s as more of a work of art than anything. I don't have the money to spend $2000 on a handgun, but if I did, I'd have no problems buying one.

I don't carry a 1911, because they are heavy and the grip safety is a negative for a defensive pistol, but I love the trigger and everything about the gun. IMHO, a Glock is the perfect carry weapon, but I do get bored with them.

I'm sure Hi-Point fans wonder why we spend so much on Glocks when a Hi-Point throws bullets down range too.

Bodyarmorguy 06-22-2012 20:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by LiebeGlock (Post 19116540)
Cheap guns or expensive guns they do the same thing. They go BANG... shoot someone and if you know what you're doing they're dead and your safe.

And a cheap education and an expensive education are all the same. I mean just because that degree says University of Grenada Medical School....I mean still a qualified surgeon....right?

fiveoboy01 06-23-2012 03:34

OP is clearly a broke-ass mofo. Jealousy must be a biznitch.

Rancho_Nirvana 06-28-2012 19:08

Why?

Cause there are few things in life as fine as running a well made 1911!

NH Trucker 06-28-2012 21:32

Um, I'm a broke ass mofo and I don't see an issue with people buying whatever they want. As long as they're paying for it, what's the problem?

Kingarthurhk 07-01-2012 11:01

If people want to drop that kind of money on a 1911, more power to them if they can afford it. 1911's are neat, but I can't justify spending that kind of money on a singular pistol, especially one with such a limited magazine capacity. A lot of these 1911's seems to be botique and it is more about paying for the name than the potential quality.

For that kind of money, I would expect a custom built from the ground up pistol to my specifications. But, that wouldn't happen unless I won the lottery, and probably not even then.

I like my Glock 21C. It goes bang every single time, and has a 13 round magazine capacity, that can be expanded upon as needed. Moreover, I can get a lot of Glock21C's for one botique 1911. So, I say, meh.

crazycathed 08-14-2012 09:30

I have a few high end 1911 (5 nighthawks). i bought them because I can. I also have 2 barrett 50's, HK MR762 with a $2000 scope as well as other high end stuff that I absolutely dont need.who hunts with a british bren MKII 303? the reason I got them is because I like to share shooting with people and most wouldn't get the chance to shoot the things I have. to see the look on their face shooting a rifle with a round the size of a hotdog is priceless. and also I own them because I have the means. if you had the $ would you buy a geo metro or a volvo? both would get you around but the volvo is a much nicer ride.

prez1967 08-14-2012 09:58

Like its been stated before... Seiko vs Rolex, Ford vs Ferrari, projects vs penthouse... Those who can (and wish to).... Will.

Its not my (or your) problem.

HexHead 08-14-2012 10:01

I had two Kimbers before I got my Nighthawk. I honestly didn't think I'd be able to appreciate the difference the extra money spent on a Wilson, NHC, Ed Brown etc would make. When I got my Nighthawk, first mag out of the box, I shot a group half the size I did with my Kimber.

GreenDrake 08-14-2012 11:03

Wilson CQB is on my hit list, for sure. Handled and shot a friend's, it's definitely what I am looking for in a dream gun. And yes, I'd carry it.

seanmac45 08-14-2012 20:00

Posted by shooter1234; "All the weight, bulk, sharp edges, lack of magazine capacity, and levers and switches sticking out all over the place is tolerable to some people, for 400-700 dollars. I understand that. "

All the weight; Glock 19 (stock) w/16 rounds of 124gn - 30.8 oz.
Kimber Custom II w/8 rounds of 230gn - 44.7 oz.

All that bulk; Glock 19 WIDTH 30 mm / 1.18 in
1911 WIDTH 1.312 in

Sharp edges; NONE in a properly dehorned 1911

Levers and switches sticking out; 1911 slide release and thumb safety
Glock slide release and takedown lever

Wow! What a massive difference!

I carried a Glock 19 undercover for 10 years.

I have carried a 1911 for the last 11 since retiring.

I will take the 1911 ANY DAY OF THE WEEK OVER THE GLOCK.

It is much easier to conceal and much more comfortable to carry.

And just to tweak you it's a Wilson Combat CQB Elite.

crazycathed 08-15-2012 12:37

the bottom line is nobody should have to justify why they buy what they do. if a hi point or stallard works for you then get it. no matter what people say about pricey firearms if you take them to the range they will want to shoot it. NOBODY is gonna stand there as you blast an old car from 400 yards away with a barrett loaded with incindeary rounds and say "nah, I don't want to shoot that". I have an SRM 1216 16 round semi auto shotgun that was over 2 grand, a 4 grand .308 (6 grand with scope) , 5 nighthawks, 2 SPAS 12 shotguns, british bren MKII made in 1943, 2 barrett 50's, barrett 338 lapua just to name a few. trijicon acog scopes on most of my rifles. people ask me why I look at them and say why not.

Kingarthurhk 08-15-2012 17:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by seanmac45 (Post 19308430)
Posted by shooter1234; "All the weight, bulk, sharp edges, lack of magazine capacity, and levers and switches sticking out all over the place is tolerable to some people, for 400-700 dollars. I understand that. "

All the weight; Glock 19 (stock) w/16 rounds of 124gn - 30.8 oz.
Kimber Custom II w/8 rounds of 230gn - 44.7 oz.

All that bulk; Glock 19 WIDTH 30 mm / 1.18 in
1911 WIDTH 1.312 in

Sharp edges; NONE in a properly dehorned 1911

Levers and switches sticking out; 1911 slide release and thumb safety
Glock slide release and takedown lever

Wow! What a massive difference!

I carried a Glock 19 undercover for 10 years.

I have carried a 1911 for the last 11 since retiring.

I will take the 1911 ANY DAY OF THE WEEK OVER THE GLOCK.

It is much easier to conceal and much more comfortable to carry.

And just to tweak you it's a Wilson Combat CQB Elite.

I have carred the Beretta 96D, the H&K USP .40, the Glock 19, Glock 26, the Sig 229 .40 DAK, and the Glock 17.

I am not disputing the sleek nature of the 1911 with a light trigger. However, I just can't justify 2,500 for a botique 1911.

For those of you that can, I am sure they are wondeful range/competition toys.

I think when you are madated to carry a weapon not of your choice you develop a dislike of them. I am certain that if I was forced to carry a Glock 19 for 10 years, it might irritate me too, if it weren't my choice to do so.

I fel that way about the Beretta 96D, and the Sig 299 DAK.

I really hated both of them, and still do.

I am fond of the Glock series of pistols, however. They are simple, nearly industructable, and go bang each and every time. I don't care how neat it looks, how shiny it might be, etc. If it doesn't go bang every time, I don't want it. If I can't get dirt and grit in it and still have it go bang every single time I don't want it. In my experience the only thing more reliable than a Glock is a quality revolver.

Kimbers are pretty, but they are expensive and full of consumer complaints of jams.


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